Right now, as I type this, there are millions of women out there who have ‘settled’ in a poor or so-so relationship. Many of these love assclowns or emotionally unavailable men and have dug their feet in for the long haul because they believe that they love him, so things will change, or he must change. Even worse, he may continue to minimise his input into the relationship, so she will step up her input, rewarding his 10% effort with a spurt of giving, and pleasing, and willing him to recognise her greatness.
In recent posts such as Shades of Grey – Rationalising your involvement in a poor relationship and Why do we throw ourselves at bad relationships and then wonder why it hurts, I discuss the whole betting on potential, fantasising, and in essence being so optimistic it’s beyond scary.
But the eternal optimism of Fallback Girls and assclown lovers actually masks FEAR.
The denial masks fear too.
But because many of us don’t want to deal with our fears, we chalk it up to being ‘compassionate’, to loving him, to seeing the best in people, to being kind, to being wonderful women who have been dealt a bad card.
The thing is, are you happy living like this?
Are you happy being marginalised by a Mr Unavailable or an assclown?
Does the fact that you keep getting the same results from the same efforts not mean that you need to opt out and do something different?
The fear of being alone, of being wrong about your instincts, and your judgement. The fear that the next woman will suddenly turn him from assclown to prince. The fear that even though he hasn’t left his wife for the last ten years you’ve been with him, he might just do it once you’ve ended it. The fear of confronting your own issues instead of hiding behind his.
Does life work out better because you’re optimistic about a poor relationship?
Or do you end up realising that if you going to cater to fear, you’re going to have to suck it up and settle?
Or do you finally hit the ‘enough’ moment and take a chance on yourself in spite of those fears?
Because you see, the things that we’re afraid of that paralyse us in crappy relationships where we lament his misdoing’s and blame ourselves for him not being different, all end up being far less than the misery of catering to fear.
Unless you really love misery and really just don’t ever want to like and love yourself and want a better positive relationship, you will wake up one day and wonder what the frick you were scared of!
Often, even when we’ve been around a man for years, we’ve been lonely as hell.
You can only be responsible for you. His actions are independent of yours. You didn’t make him into an assclown – he is one, but by sticking around, massaging his ego, breaking him off a piece of sex, and essentially making yourself a sacrificial lamb doormat, you are enabling his behaviour.
Misery does indeed love company and self misery in the form of self hate and blame just LOVES an assclown.
You have no right to demand or expect change from someone just because you deem yourself to be in love with them. The fact that you love an assclown or a habitually emotionally unavailable man suggests the basis of your feelings for him are borne out of negativity.
You can’t force your love on someone or literally down their throat – is that what you want? To make someone love you?
Having ‘feelings’ for someone or having a desperate urge to have them in your lives doesn’t give you an instant IOU to claim on! Loving someone doesn’t make them love you. Really, if you don’t both have both of your feet in the relationship, you’re doing all the loving for the two of you. That’s really exhausting!
And believe me – if he was ‘the one’, if things were so amazing, if you were genuinely happy and not trying to fit a square peg into a round hole, you wouldn’t need so many changes to occur for this to ‘work’ for you.
So if you look at your optimism about your involvement with him, for example, hoping he’s going to come back to you, even though he’s now shacking up with some other woman, or your denial where you tell yourself that that he’s going to change even though he’s been the same for the majority of the relationship; it becomes very clear that you’re afraid.
The relationship has left the building…you’re just sitting there pining at the window….
If you’re stuck in a poor relationship with a Mr Unavailable or an assclown, ask yourself what would happen if you stopped expecting, stopped hoping for change, and stopped fantasising?
Would he change? No. Would you be any happier? Unlikely.
What this says is that at the end of the day, if you apply optimism to poor relationships with no foundation, and a load of denial, the outcome is still going to be the same, it’s just going to be even more painful because you take a long-winded, self-mutilating route to get there when you could get off the path a lot sooner and take the chance on you and feel the fear that will invariably turn out to be less than what you expected.
Pain is not love.
If you’re in limbo and you keep engaging, and refuse to let go even when he continues his life elsewhere – that’s not him causing you pain – that’s YOU!
I know someone out there will go – but what will I do?
You know what makes you happy and it’s certainly not him and if you don’t know you need to find out so that you start living a life you enjoy instead of filling it up with assclownary.
Take responsibility and be accountable for your own life. Make decisions instead of being trapped in indecision and placing the onus on him to change and magically become the man you want. Do something. Cut contact, opt out, stop engaging – just do something and cold turkey it because the initial pain does pass. But you are the solution to your own problem – not him.
Your thoughts?
Get ahead on understanding waste of space men and relationships with my ebook, Mr Unavailable and the Fallback Girl. Find out more and download. If you need personal advice or analysis of your relationship, check out my consultation service.
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When The Clown started to act up, I knew what I had to do but I was really sad that it wasn’t working out. After it became clear that he was who he was – a clown, I cut that relationship loose and I am sooooo glad that I did!
I feel much better now, though I have days when I think about how he treated me and feel badly. I was with him, but he wasn’t with me. I felt lonley although I was in a realtionship . Then it occurred to me that instead of enriching my life, he was hindering it, so he had to go! Although it is the smart thing to do, it still hurts. I’m at the stage where I feel super one day and like crap the others. But the sunshine days are outnumbering the bad days since I cut him loose.
*Yippee*
OMG~ I cannot believe how necessary this article was….
I can’t even point out all the important points (to me) because I’d have to repeat every word you just said =)
The wonderful part is that I’m finally getting it. I think I’ve always suspected all the stuff you said but never really “got it”. Thank God I found this blog
I haven’t posted before but have been reading this site since the night I decided to cut the cord. He had already been detaching for awhile but there was always something that we had planned on the horizon and I suppose I used that excuse to stay involved.
I knew from the very first that he was wrong for me but I think it was loneliness that kept my momentum going. Not quite sure what kept his going.
Now, nearly a month later, I know it is for the best for me, for my sanity and that I should move on. But, as you say Cynnie, I still have up and down days. And I fully realize that I am causing my own pain!! He’s out and about looking for other victims to encourage into his Cult – I believe there is already one Cult Queen that has been recruited.
But alas, as I said after my divorce, I now have a second chance to have a really happy life – and then I added this assclown into my life. Anyway – there are moments of relief that I don’t have to deal with his antics in public (and private) any more. Those times were pretty sordid and I’m happy to see the back of them…….
I am starting the first week of NYears to go into therapy.
“The fear of confronting your own issues instead of hiding behind his…” NML, this statement really hit home with me. In my list of fears about relationships, this is a big one. I always thought that I was this completely emotionally available person who just kept picking the wrong men to love, but what I have figured out, like a lot of us on this site, I am an EUW…and I think it has a lot to do with abandonment issues, and having an EUM for a father. This site has been such a wonderful resource for me in my efforts to heal and move on with my life, and I am amazed at the courage and openness you all have to share your stories. They have helped me tremendously. I wish you all a happy holiday season!
“Often, even when we’ve been around a man for years, we’ve been lonely as hell.”
That’s the one line that really hit me like a ton of bricks. I think this article was written especially for me. I went through this for three years with my current ex-EUM. I was still lonely as hell overworking in a relationship going no where fast. I’m finally relieved to tell everyone that I found a new place and I have all of my stuff out by the end of the month! So then my ex-EUM can start his dating again now that I’ll be gone and I can finally heal and get myself together.
Do these men treat women in this manner b/c of their self-esteem issues? Is it not true, if you don’t respect yourself, you don’t treat others with respect?
Spot on article. Thank you NML.
Like metsgurl, for a long time these articles were like a bell ringing somewhere in the back of my head, but I couldn’t quite accept them.
Now I’ve stepped back from my limbo-filled relationship over the past few weeks, every point NML makes is loud and clear. !
I know in my own case, I was definitely operating out of a fear of being alone. It’s a scary thing to think that your self esteem is so low that the thought of spending your life with you has that kind of effect. Yikes! It feels so much better to actually like hanging out with you!
As for the question you asked, what will I do? You’ll heal, you’ll grow, you might even be happy. Sounds like a hella better alternative to me!
Wow! I’m going to have to print this out and take it with me everywhere I go. I need to read this like a 12 step program as I find myself saying the wrong things at the wrong time and being the one to blame for everything but what this blog did for me was realizing that even if all the nagging on my part ended, even if I was cool calm and relaxed the way my baby daddy always wants me to be, things would still be the same. There would be more peace, granted, but there would not necessarily be more love or more affection or more listening. The truth is that applying optimism to something with no foundation is simply senseless. I’ve been senseless for too long, I’ve been trying to salvage something that never really existed. I’ve long believed his promises that never come true and I’ve been willing to take the miserable crumbs he hands my way once in a while. I do love him, or at least his potential and he’s not a bad guy but he has gone so far as to move far away and only returns once a month or so with not much communication in between.
I can’t say I’m any lonelier now that he’s living away, in fact, I think it’s much better to be on my own but I still fool myself that there’s some real future here. Unfortunately, going cold turkey is not a possibility as we have a daughter together and he still pays for most of the things around here and that’s what enslaves me but I’m looking for alternatives in order to free him from me more and that way he can start resenting me less… Oh that’s right! He’s always going to find something to resent of me.
I think I’ll play the lottery!
It was only when I realized that it WAS up to me to end the pain / change – and not him, that I became free.
I wouldn’t want him now. I see him for who he is based on his actions alone, rather than through the veil of loneliness, denial, hope and fantasy…
Why don’t therapists tell you this stuff? When I was in marriage counseling 8 years ago, I kept trying to get this stuff out in the sessions and the therapist had no clue as to what I was talking about most of the time regarding my now ex and how he treated me. She just kept saying “he’s a good man, with a good heart”. She should have been saying this guy is an assclown cut the cord now and get on with your life.
She just kept taking our money and trying to pursuade me to give him another chance. Whenever I walked out of there I felt like she did not hear one thing I said, and that the problems were my fault not his because I had an affair early on in our marriage which he didn’t know about until counseling.
Looking back how many red flags did I need anyway? The good thing is I kept working on myself and trying to figure out why I was still so unhappy, unfilled and feeling lonely. I kept searching which is how I found this site. And thank goodness I did, none of my girlfriends understand this stuff. I’m now with others on this site who can relate.
I just am left breathless by this post. It’s so true. Why I stayed for so long, and settled for so little; why I made excuses. What do I fear? Being alone? After spending a total of 7 years with two Mr. Unavailables, I decided to NOT date until I dealt with whatever issues that lead to seven years of misery. What have I learned? That I can be happy ALONE!!! That wanting a loving healthy relationship is just fine, but NEEDING a relationship for my happiness is NOT! I am learning to love myself (by dealing with past hurts, and forgiving those who hurt me), and I’ve learned that I indeed can be happy and fulfilled without a significant other. If it happens, then wonderful. If not, I can still smile, AND MEAN IT!
Thank you, NML!
Hello everyone,
I really need some help, as I am unsure whether I am with an EUM or a man who is not ready for a relationship after separation (divorce soon) from his wife of four years. We met online for about one and a half years ago and really hit it off by mail. I went to see him and it all worked out well, he seemed very interested in me, was very loving and we fell in love. (We’re having a long distance relationship currently and have had throughout). We planned then (very prematurely I admit) to move in together in his house, and he was the driving force behind this. I questioned it, as I figured it’d be too soon after him ‘getting his life back’, as he put it. Then the second time I visited he took it back, told me that I was right, after all it was too early for him to take steps to live with someone full time. (He had separated in February and I visited first time in August). I could understand this, and didn’t question it so much even though he had changed and was more distant and less attentive than in August.
Now he claims that ne hever loved his ex wife, that they married on the spur of the moment for he to stay in the country, and got stuck in the marriage because she simply didn’t want to leave. In his country the laws are such that as a married man they favour the woman and he had paid for his house, so had to wait until she found a suitable home (she didn’t want to rent a flat). He just couldn’t throw her and her out even though she and her two daughters had taken over his home and he had been made a stranger in his own home. (His own words). Before marrying he had lived almost all of his adult life as a bachelor, and also had bad experiences from his own family … his father died when he was eight, and his mother then quickly found a new man and then ignored him and his emotional needs. He seems to loathe the concept of cheating … he has been cheated on in the past and said he has never done that to anybody.
I must say he’s been very loving throughout this long distance relationship, escept for that episode the second time I visited. He has never ‘disappeared’, always writes, doesn’t ring much these days but that is mainly to do with his finances. He does ring when I ask him to, and always when he says he would. He doesn’t strike me as the unfaithful kind at all, and I do trust him that way even through the distance. Maybe I’m a fool, but when he says he’s never cheated on anyone, I do believe him – right or wrong.
When I’m with him he takes good care of me, cooks, makes sure I am ok and always cares about how I feel. Buys me presents, and does little caring things for me. He is a bit self absorbed sometimes but I always put that down to all those years he’d been living alone .. He does so much for me anyway, paid for almost all my plane fares to see him and always asks how I am … yes he does seem to really care for me. His actions definately tells me that he loves me.
What do you think about all this? There are times when I feel he is emotionally distant, but I am not sure whether this has to do with the nature of mostly sharing mails and sms’ as they can be tricky to interpret. I am not the most secure person emotionally speaking, my father died when I was very young too, so we share that and so many othetr things on an emotional level.
What really hurts me more than anything, and he’s been honest about this, is that he is not sure if he’ll ever will be able to live with anyone full time ever again. After his traumatic four years with his ex. he seems quite badly burnt and he admits to this as well. He’s seen so much negativity in relationships in his life, everything from his mothers’ to his own past ones. He tells me I’m the love of his life but is still unsure as to whether he will be able to commit to me and us, with regards to living together. This makes me feel that perhaps there’s no future for us, and that waiting would be futile on my part? I have toyed with the idea of leaving many times because of this, and we have discussed breaking up too, but we just can’t seem to do it. If I am not totally mistaken our love seems too strong … well we can’t seem to break free for whatever reason.
I have thought of perhaps move to where he lives, but I worry I’d feel really lost and alone as I’d have to rent a place then and not live with him. I feel rejected actually that he feels he can’t live with someone … but maybe I’m just too hasty, maybe he does need more time to heal? In any case am not moving there in a hurry though, as I need to see where this relationship goes first.
I’d be very grateful for any comments or help on this …
Gabriella
I think you need to listen to his words. He has already admitted that “he can’t live with someone,” if you want to a normal healthy relationship then you should move on.
Sorry, but I think you’re wasting your time on this one.
One last thing.
if you move to his area, he will see this as a desperate move on your part and will retreat even further. Hon, find a guy that’s not damaged but knows what he wants.
Need some advice from my sisters and brothers here. I noticed that I put myself down alot now that I am out of an EU relationship and this is especially around married couples. I say things like “yea, I dance in my bedroom and have a party for one” or “because I am alone….” or “Since I am alone…….” I am thought more highly of when I was married or had a BF by my family. Now I am basically ignored. Would I rather be in an EU relationship and suffer to be included? I don’t know but it hurts.
Gabriella,
It sounds like this man is somewhat full of BS. Even if what he is saying is true, he’s keeping you dangling on a string while he decides if he can take the relationship further…you should move on…you need a partner who is ready for a relationship…a relationship takes time to build and grow, but with a damaged partner, it never grows…you will give up too much. Besides, it’s easy for him to feed you any kind of line of BS…you are so far away from him…and most of your communication is over the computer…he could be living with someone else, have a few gals on the side or a girlfriend and you are just his ego stroke and fallback girl…think about it…if you thought the relationship was going along just fine, you wouldn’t have found this site…trust your gut..it doesn’t lie. We’ve all been through it and we know how you feel…GOOD LUCK
Isabella,
I would rather remain alone than stay in a relationship with an EUM. Why don’t you make an effort to meet new people? This kind of thinking that a man completes us is very disturbing, remember, we complete ourselves!
Hello all,
Thanks girls for the support, I really appreciate it.
Well, I rang him last night and suggested we’d continue as friends, hard as it was. He seemed fine about it, although taken aback. I still love him so very much, and I just can’t believe where I got the strength to do this … perhaps reading your stories here has helped me to finally pluck up the courage to do this. And also .. trying to remember everytime he’ds hurt me … too many to remember really.
I’ve had an awful day though .. withdrawal symptoms, crying …I managed to take a walk but it was just about that I managed it. Truly terrible to be emotionally committed to (what probably is?) an EUM. This is the most painful relationship I’ve ever had by far.
Thanks again … no doubt I’ll be back on these boards.
Gabriella
Does that mean you’re still in contact with this guy??? Honey, you can’t be friends with someone you care for or you will be right back to where you started.
Can I ask a question that I hope is related to this?
I have never been on Facebook before and don’t really get the rules or the etiquette behind it. Anyway, last night I was obsessing about my EUM and looked to see if HE had one. He did and on it was a little photo gallery of his friends. I was nowhere on it, after 8 years of “friendship”-3 platonic, 5 with benefits.
I was so hurt and steamed that I emailed him (we rarely communicate by phone) and told him that I was astonished I was conspicuously absent, after all we had been through and all the support I’d given him, as well as the kinky sex that he was too guilt ridden to ask for from anyone else.
Now I feel like a dumbass. I read this site a lot and know what I need to do but I need an arse-kicking anyway. I really feel that this is the final nail in the coffin (though that should have been hammered in YEARS ago!) and that I’m the kind of person who needs to get feelings out. It’s like If you hurt me I want you to know why.
I was not dramatic or emotional in the email, just more like telling him how incredible I felt it was that he hadn’t respected or valued me enough to include me. Some of the photos of people were those who he’d admitted he’d discarded and some were of his SISTERS friends and one was of a friend who is now dating his EX, who was a total drama queen. So you know he’ll be linking up to her, as part of his Narcissistic Harem!
I since conferred with friends who know more about Facebook and they say the photos are not an indicator of real friends, as others post theirs. So now I feel like even more of an eejit, because I shoulda left it alone and just not expected to hear from him. I feel I went the teeenage route and pouted.
Yet in some ways, this was my goodbye to him (I didn’t say that to him) and it feels liberating. Like I said my piece, let him know that I finally understand and admit to myself how low I am, down on his list and that he only calls me as the Sure Thing when he wants his needs met.
Ugh-I’m confused! If I did the totally wrong thing, can someone help me the next steps I need to take to forgive myself?
Thanks!
Hi Blackgnat I will attempt to answer you …I know nothing about facebook though..
I have looked at the process of getting rid of an EUM as a journey.. some people can read something or hear something about an EUM and they get rid of him straight away and start to look at themselves and why they were with such a guy in the first place.. Other women take things more slowly and it takes a while for them to finally be rid of an EUM.. mainly because its so difficult to realise you deserve better and their is something in an EUM that keeps you involved but its always looking at his behaviour and treatment of you rather than looking at your own and why you (me) put up with it…
I would say don’t be hard on yourself its a journey and you are slowly waking up to how you don’t want to be treated anymore believe me many posts on here are about silly things we have gone and done, I think though there is still emotional investment from you in your EUM and again I say it all takes time and awareness to change yourself so things like photos on facebook don’t matter anymore.
I wish you all the best on your journey to being EUM free and working on yourself because you deserve better than what he offers.
Keep reading this web site I think many lightbulbs will go on ..
Thank you so much, Tulipa! I have been on this road for so long and I really truly feel that I’m getting off it-the Thrill is Gone, so I know I am keeping the drama alive by doing stuff like reaming him a new one for the Facebook thing.
Someone also said that Facebook friends are not necessarily real life friends. So yet again,I was a complete drama queen, UGH. I hate it when I make myself the a-hole and he gets to sit there and most likely shake his head in pity at my instability.
I’m MOST frustrated because of the fact that he went on vacation and I KNEW in my bones that it was the perfect point to stop contact-that I would not be able to contact him while he was gone and that I truly, with my emerging feelings of not caring so much, would be able to maintain a dignified level of maturity. Something happens to me-like, I feel I no longer am infatuated, so I remember the nice things about him and think, “Hell, why not get in touch and see how he’s doing?” and then it starts all over again,
But it’s ME who is the key. ME who keeps it going. How sick!
Thanks for your explanation-it’s very kind and compassionate and makes a lot of sense. But it’s been EIGHT years by now!
Should I email him and apologise for over-reacting? Or just completely leave it alone and let him think what he likes?
Black Gnat,
Please do not contact this guy, you’ve got to move on it’s been eight-years now. You’ve got to stop finding excuses to contact this man.
Honestly, what do you think he thinks when you continue to contact him? You’re holding on to something that doesn’t exist.
If you want to recover you must break contact. FOREVER!!!!
Gaynor, you are so right! It’s beyond humiliating and for the life of me I cannot understand why I continue to do this.
I have never thought of myself as a person with low self esteem, but I swear I have let this man treat me like a piece of sh*t. I first met him when my marriage was in trouble (I am now divorced, just this past July) and I think that I keep subconciously attempting to return to that place when I had overhwelming feelings of being desired . After years of neglect, I soaked it up like a sponge.
I think I needa complete lifestyle change. I work in education, where there are only women and children and most of my wonderfully supportive friends are married and really don’t have an interest in doing what I like to do. I also have 2 sons who are high school dropouts (one has been diagnosed with bipolar disease and has terrible rages and drug addictions) who live with me.
I think I have sometimes returned to my EUM because when he’s receptive, he’s completely delightful company-attractive, intelligent etc. and for those few hours, I escape my reality.
But you’re right, I’m holding on to something that doesn’t exist.It makes me so sad. Why won’t it sink in?
Black Gnat,
Ditto as to what everyone says here, DO NOT contact him, isn’t giving up 8 years of your life enough, have you dated anyone else? Also, as NML says (I do recommend reading her book and often) he will test you, will not believe that you are done or over it because you were the one who generally initiated the contact and that you’ll initiate it again. Contact is Contact (check out the blog on this).
Sit on your hands, call some friends, post on here you will find the support and move on to someone who isn’t going to throw you crumbs, I understand how hard this is to do, I have experienced it and am experiencing it, although over my last EUM, he was the Epiphamy relationship NML talks about. I remember 2 weeks ago in the first week of NC and I received a text and thought I was going into a tailspin, I can’t believe I even wasted my time tailspinning over a text message, that virtually said nothing!
As far as facebook, I am on there, one of the reasons I started my disconnect with my latest EUM and last EUM. I deleted him from my friends list. I didn’t want to be exposed to what was being said on there or who he was interacting with, it was embarassing to me as a woman what was being posted to him by other women, a BIG red flag. It is in your face thus Facebook! Facebook is a good way to network with people that are in your life, old friends, family or Groups that you are interested in but can be abused by a narcissitic EUM. What a great source of supply!!!
Everyone on here has been or was in your position, you are not alone….Gail
P.S. Meant to say or “is in your position!” ….Gail
I have only had a couple of dates with a guy who was great fun, quite attractive and separated from his wife (though her voice was on the answering machine at home-hmmm, first red flag) though I quickly realised that he wasn’t really in it. And neither was I.
I definitely have issues and think I’m an EUW. I can’t imagine being in a relationship with anyone else ever again and I am an attractive intelligent woman. My guard and cynicism are way, way up. SO at times, this ambivalence has totally suited me, though this EUM is the infatuation of my life. Within 5 minutes of meeting him I knew I was in big trouble.
We have been off and on for the eight years, the first 3 not so much, because the sexual attraction had not been realised in a physical form.
The longest we have been out of contact is 10 months after he betrayed and demoralised me in the most blistering of ways. Yet after that he was uber apologetic, pointing out all the ways he had sabotaged and hurt me and telling me I was unforgettable and wanted to resume our relationship-well, I’d have to say “accquaintance” was more accurate. I have been in large groups and gatherings with him, been introduced to his family, included on important family gatherings,-never as a gf, of course. Then, alone on a sexual level with him, but as far as him asking me out on a date, or to the movies,or to dinner-no deal.
Sorry I’m rambling, maybe just trying to process my own behaviours as I write them down. I need to see him as he really is, but that would involve more thinking about him and analysing him, yes??
But I do appreciate your input also, Gail-everyone is so smart and well-directed and firm in their resolve. I want what YOU have!
I noticed that when I dated that one guy, I enjoyed it until I realised that I liked him. Then I began to totally panic and feel vulnerable, waiting for his call, being disappointed when he didn’t and thinking that something was NOW bound to go wrong.
That;s when i knew I was an EUW.When I didn’t care about him, he was fun. WHen I did, I felt I would lose and began to look for faults in him. Is there any hope? He stopped calling when he said he would, a couple of days later and then cancelling dates. However, I then cut him off and told him nicely that I didn’t think he was making me calling me a priority and that was okay with him not doing it again. I felt I’d been strong with a boundary.
About a year later, he called me and said he was going out of town on business but would love to see me again,and would call me on his return. I said “Sure!”, knowing he wouldn’t call and didn’t. Six months later, he asked my friend’s MOTHER out!! (She’s very vivacious and youthful looking and turned him down) My God, I know how to pick’em, don’t I!
My ex-EUM contacted me today …and I responded…he was reaching out and I took the bait. We had a very pleasant conversation for an hour…just catching up…his life hasn’t been great recently and I think he was just looking for an ego stroke from someone who cares…and I obliged. I am not going to beat myself up for it…it felt good to hear from him, but sad at the same time because ultimately I’ll never hear or get from him what I always wanted and I guess it brings up the hurt again. I felt that I couldn’t be so mean and just ignore him…but then I’m left feeling the pain again. The pain of not having him the way I would have wanted it. I guess I can start from this moment on with the NC. It’s easy to dole out the advice to others, but sometimes hard to follow it for myself.
Blackgnat,
Don’t apologize for rambling. It does help to write it down, I am getting writer’s cramp from all of my writing albeit it, mostly in a journal now!
As far as “thinking about him and analizing him” (this won’t achieve anything, you cannot change him), maybe channel that energy and think about yourself and a self analysis.
Keep reading posts from this site, blogs by others going through what you are going through, posts from Natalie and again, if you can, get NML’s book, it was a catalyst to changing my life.
This will help with your resolve and most of all baby steps and patience (not one of my virtues but I am learning it), this doesn’t happen over night!….Gail
It had been 3 months of NC and now I’m back to square one again. It’s not that I thought he would be different, I just missed the friendship and I truly felt for him with what he was going through and then the pain for me, because he won’t let me be there for him…won’t really let me in.
Finally,
You’re not being mean by not responding. You’re protecting yourself!!!
Do you think he considered how he treated you during your “relationship?”
Remember ladies, these guys are not our friends, or they would not have treated us the way they did!
Finally,
One more thing. Why do you want to be there for someone who wasn’t there for you????
Gaynor, you are right, however, he was there for me when I needed him in times of crisis and I know he would be there for me if I needed him for during a crisis, if I was in some type of jam or trouble, and he’s having a crisis now and I just listened. I know he can’t be there for me as in a serious commitment and that’s why I’m not with him anymore…but you are right, I can’t let this lead to anything more…thanks for helping to set me straight! xxxxoooooo……
Sometimes Iget scared that something will happen to him,like he’ll die and then life is so short-I would hate to think that I ignored someone that once meant so much to me.
I guess that I need to think that he doesn’t think similarly or else he wouldn’t ignore me, right? But then I often think that he, with his actions, showed me what he was -though sometimes he’s been very kind and said we’d always be in each other’s lives because I was special to him. SO the mixed messages always gave me false hope.
I generally don’t like to be rude, but I have to see things as they are and most importantly NOT BE THE ONE TO CONTACT. If he DOES contact me, I could be polite but not buy into the idea that it’s anything but a hook-baiting.
Sometimes I think I just am bored and am trying to create excitement for myself. Even though I DON’T get excited when he contacts me or responds, any longer. It used to be the feeling of, “Haha, I win, he still wants me” , but not only do I see from NML and all’s wisdom that it’s NOT that, but also I’m not that bothered about winning any more. What am I winning anyway? That’s why I would give him a bj and expect nothing in return-I liked the feeling of power and seeing him helpless. Knowing he felt too proud to ask me, but was too weak to refuse my sexual advances. But even that isn’t working for me any more-it just makes me feel like an unpaid hooker. Which is basically what I’ve been all along. Whatever guise of going over to his house there was-to help with his website, buy some art from him, have him cook for me-he gives classes sometimes, writing proposals for grants with him, etc…..there was always the unspoken agreement of the sex. If there was shagging, there’d be NO foreplay…
Hope I’m not offending anyone with me graphic recountings, here…
Years of therapy for me, dontcha think?
finially<
Its not like you slept with him. Cut yourself some slack. It isn’t about counting the days, its about recognizing the hurt and continuing on the quest to heal. When you see his call again, remember how you felt after this last call.
blackgnat<
I think it would be good for you to go on a few date. Post a pretty picture on-line, go on some dates and get some attentions. I will give you a lift and make you realize their is another world. Just be honest with the dates that you aren’t ready to jump into something else right away. Also a change in careers might be a good thing. It is hard to meet men when you are bored, and when you work with all women.
Actually not to sound contrary nysharon, I think blackgnat should not attempt dating right now. Honestly she is too primed from everything else with her EUM to be able to fully put her heart into meeting the right guy and recognizing what is healthy and what isn’t healthy, because pain and hurt can cause you have a knee jerk reaction putting yourself into another relationship for things to happen just the same as before. I think now would be a good time to focus on getting yourself together and the dating thing will start happening naturally on it’s own. I feel like if blackgnat starts dating again it will be only to try to avoid dealing with all of the things that she needs to address from this last relationship.
Blacknat, has he ever contacted you or were you the one that only initiated contact and get togethers?
Astelle, yes he would contact me every now and then and in the beginning the emails would be very fast and furious. After one prolonged abstinence, I emailed him briefly (our native countries were playing each other in the World Cup and we both love soccer!) and he replied with a whole torrent of emotion and regret, admitting his wrongs in the behavior, so sorry for distancing himself from something that could have been so good, etc. I was overwhelmed..
Sorry,,rambling. He would call sporadically and he would instigate it,but its mostly been me who is the initiator.
Dating….Thanks for the suggestion-a teensy tiny crumb of that is beginning to take root in my head, but mostly I fear it and fear I will sabotage it, that I have nothing to offer it, that I will find fault with them and they with me, that the other shoe will always hanging and waiting to drop.
This is probably why the EUM is appealing-he doesn’t want reality and neither do I yet. Someone would have to be incredible to spark my interest and let my guard down.
But I DO thank you for the suggestion-somewhere down the line I have to connect with the male species and I am sure there are lots of nice guys around, but right now I have to look into my profound anxiety about trusting someone and having them let me down again.
He just responded to my email and my apology. He said I obviously don’t understand Facebook and how it works, that I need to think things through before I write things like this-that my comments were directed straight to his heart. That was in reference to the first email, when I was hurt about not being included in his friend gallery.
Re: the apology (I DID apologise when I realised that I’d been out of line-sorry, I know I did not follow the advice of the wise on here, but I really did feel that I had gone into an unnecessary amount of almost guilt-tripping, once I realise how nebulous Facebook can be) he said he didn’t know what I was talking about and hoped I had not written anything compromising on the Facebook site. He said he was really worried now and that we needed to talk about this.
I think he WAS right about my overreaction, but the apology reference suggests to me that he is afraid I will reveal my association with him in the past (FWB) to these people I barely know and then his true colors will be revealed.
I get the feeling that if he does bother to pursue the idea of us discussing it (probably not in person-too intimate) then he will be in the role of the stern father and I in the role of errant teenager and will be given my walking papers…WHY didn’t I just leave it alone, per the advice of NML? Let this be a lesson to all of you who want to get a foot in the door again,or do a little snooping!
How shall I handle this? Ignore and see if he wants to come up smelling like a rose? Try to clarify my position, like “I was wrong, but you’ve never treated me more than a few steps up from a booty call”? Wait for him to text, email or, MY GOD, CALL??? Depends how worried he is about his public image. Do I say, look, I apologised for my mistake, just leave it?
Am actually amazed that he replied-is it that he really DOES have a heart in there, or again, that he fears I would reveal his sordid past? I actually have WAY too much integrity to do that!
All advice is welcome!
Blackgnat, I really don’t want to hurt your feelings, but I am somewhat “worn out” reading your last post. Why bother apologizing to him, you need to cut the contact with him!
Before you do anything else, read NML’s book first and hopefully you will stop contacting this guy. You are expecting something from him that he is NOT willing to give. Stop the madness, keep some of your pride!
Astelle, I’m sorry I wore you out.
I understand I’m a crashing bore, but I really wanted to get it all out and I thought this was the place to do it. I recall that you have been in similar place (if I’m not getting my sources wrong and please correct me if am) and were not understanding why you couldn’t stop contacting your EUM. You could neither understand his behaviour and needed guidance.
I have downloaded NML’s book and read it twice. Just becuse I have read it (and enjoyed it immensely) and taken on board the incredible common sense advice doesn’t mean that I”m instantly capable of applying it. I obviously have a LOT of work to do on myself.
I am happy that you are in a secure place but I am not.
I will not post about this again., though I can’t see what I’m doing that’s so different from the rest of the Fallback/YoYo/ girls…
I think it’s really difficult for us women to believe that a man can be intimate with us and yet have no feelings at all about it.
Re; blackgnat – “is it that he really DOES have a heart in there” – we really would like to believe so, huh? They don’t. No matter how many excuses we make for the EUM / clown, the bottom line is that no decent human-being treats another person the way these guys do. They are never going to feel guilty for the treatment because they literally see it that we enjoy / accept it.
To restate what was said to me from a caring friend….”What woman with even an ounce of respect for herself would accept being treated like trash.” I’ve heard reference on this blog to “crumbs” “booty-call” etc but lets face it, they have no respect for us in any regard. I don’t care if any of us believe that we are lower than dirt….none of us deserves to be treated like trash!
Blackgnat, My advice is just to stop. Stop analyzing his motives for what he is doing. Based on your description of your “relationship” with him, it’s safe to assume that whatever he is going to do will be self-serving. Each time you have contact, and explain, apologize, clarify or whatever, you are making yourself look the fool, and sorry to say that, but that is how it is coming across.
You weren’t a friend on his Facebook. You were upset and told him so. Big deal. Don’t get hung up on feeling embarrassed about your initial reaction. There is nothing more to discuss. Don’t be amazed that he replied, it doesn’t mean he has a heart. He knows he treated you as a booty call, you don’t need to point that out to him. Just disengage, and don’t give him the chance to further humiliate you.
I ditto Astelle-read NML’s book before you do anything else. It will really help you see things clearly.
Sorry Black gnat I just read your post that you read the book. Don’t feel like you can’t post about what you are going through on here. We really do understand what you are going through, but are trying to point out the reality of the situation to you, which can sometimes come across harsh, but please realize it comes from a place of compassion and understanding, which sometimes doesn’t come across so well on the internet.
Blackgnat, I should have added a smiley face to my comment, the written word can be interpreted in different ways, I am not trying to discourage you from posting, I am trying to encourage you to stop contacting this guy. Yes, I am talking from experience, except all the drama like the Face book thing and thinking about discussing this BS with him, the mad e-mails and apologizing, but everybody is different. Once you understand that no matter what you do, what actions you take or not, will have no impact on how he reacts or what he will do!
You said in an earlier post that he is ignoring you, what more do you need? Since you read NML’s book twice, what exactly stops you from cutting contact, being a doormat?
This “relationship” will never work, it takes two to Tango and I don’t see him dancing.
metsgurl, we should not lose respect for ourselfs and accept his crumbs.
You’re all so right. I sometimes think I must be an effing lunatic. He said my words “went straight to his heart” and he advised me to think things through before I wrote something like that again.
After all the things he’s said, done, thought to ME-they don’t amount to a hill of beans, unless they are self serving. HE was hurt by my words because it makes him feel bad.
Oh and I DID contact him just now and apologised and said I hadn’t said anything bad-that’s all he’s worried about! I told him our “friendship” had run its course, but it was something I hadn’t picked up on before. ACK. I ASKED HIM IF HE WOULD PREFER THAT I DIDN”T CONTACT HIM. OH MY GOD. I AM MENTAL.
My God, WHY did I start that whole fucking Facebook thing? It was the FIRST time I’d been on it! Maybe this is the best wakeup call I coulda had-New Year, New Start.
I know the “harsh” words come from compassion and empathy and I thank you all-when I read some of these posts, I’m astonished and want to reach through the screen and slap people. How could I be so level headed with others, seeing the obvious, then completely slimy and masochistic with my own?
So, I will read, read, read -it DOES seep through, honestly. It just takes that name or number on my phone or email to send me reeling. GOD HELP ME!
balckgnat, no, the Facebook thing did not change anything, it was scr**ed up way before that.
Why did you ask him if he would prefer that you don’t contact him anymore? What answer are you expecting? Yes, leave me alone or no, keep on chasing me and feeding my ego?
Do you need him to end it?
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