I’ve always known that No Contact works otherwise I wouldn’t spend so much time writing about it and advising people, but it’s painful, a shock to the emotional system, and brings about so many conflicting feelings, not least because the men that you need to do No Contact with tend to be assclowns that won’t let go and chase harder even though they don’t want you.
But Sheila, a reader who spent a hell of a lot of time on this site commenting and on the forum, who suffered so much angst I’m sure people weren’t sure whether she would ever cut the contact, is over him. It’s taken 6 months, many email exchanges between us, on the wagon, off the wagon, pain, misery suffering, self-doubt, a serious lack of self-love and anxiety, but I got an email from Sheila at the weekend that started like this:
“Just thought I’d check in… Haven’t posted in a while, which only means one thing right.. I’m HEALED!!!”
Sing in an your best opera voices, with birds flocking and the seas parting… HA-LLE-FRICKIN-LUJAH!
To give a little background, Sheila and her guy were both separated for the past year or so and going through divorces, or at least she was. She wanted more, he wanted less. It was a heady, passion fueled ‘relationship’ but Sheila was miserable and as she pushed for more from him, he withdrew. She thought they were more than just casual but he just wanted the easy life. Sheila chased more and so it went back and forth till it got to the point where she had become obsessed with him, knew he was an assclown, but couldn’t let go of him.
I managed to find Sheila’s first comment:
“I just ended a relationship with an EUM.. and I have the book on line about EUM, and it’s so so true.. This has been so hard the last month or so, but all the signs are there, and he’s still creeping in thinking we can be friends. I have officially started the NO CONTACT as of today.. I will keep you posted.. it won’t be easy, but it’s time to think about me for once…”
3 weeks later contact was broken:
“NML, I would like to take a page out of your book.. I just broke 3 weeks of NC last night.. I ignored the text, was very proud of myself. Then he called.. after 3 weeks of not speaking to him, just text messages.. I looked at the phone for about 20 seconds and picked up!!! God,it’s so hard. It was a weird convo, def not the same, no idea why he decided to call me after not speaking to him in 3 weeks – I was upbeat, I was not down, I just have to decide what happens next. I cannot have false hope, but I know in a few days, let’s say this w/e, if I do not hear from him, I’ll be down and out. I think at that point I will be pissed off and leave him behind and move on. Seems nothing changes except my hopes from high to low.. I can deal with not contacting him, that is not the hard part, it’s ignoring the texts and not picking up that phone last night.. God, it’s like getting over a drug!!!!”
And what followed was Sheila’s own public struggle with No Contact, with readers trying to help, the two of us emailing, and Sheila veering between being in ok-ish state to being totally distraught. They were sometimes speaking every day, sleeping together, she would feel hopeful, he would disappoint (again), and so the cycle continued. You can see a lot of what was going on here.
In the emails we exchanged, which at one point were every couple of days, I had to be blunt and do tough love. Why? I’m not here to stroke your ego’s or tell you that the self-harm you’re engaging in is right. I’m never cruel but in these situations, I may be the only person who is actually going to be honest with you. I knew that eventually, a combination of factors would start the shift in Sheila’s mentality where No Contact would become less about trying to avoid him but at the same time obsessing about him, and instead become more about seeing No Contact as the beginning and an opportunity for positive growth and change.
The reality is: everything we say about why we can’t cut the contact is an excuse. But at some point, if you’re committed to you, and stick to living in the reality, the truth of these assclowns is unavoidable and suddenly, never seeing them again or not speaking to them is the most natural thing in the world because you realise that what you’ve been doing so far doesn’t benefit you.
I kept reminding Sheila, to stick to facts, stick to reality, and see this guy for what he is.
One of the benefits of No Contact is that during this period, he is likely to show his true colours and you’re likely to find out things about him that should cement your decision.
Absence doesn’t make the heart grow fonder with No Contact; it makes it grow wiser.
And indeed, truth provided freedom for Sheila.
“I’m 3 months NC and am finally feeling like myself again.. I finally put an end to it and am moving on. I recently found out some things about him that were very hurtful, but they made me see the light as to what kind of person he is.. and believe it or not, after the stinging stopped, I woke up!!!!
He is a sad, sad soul and I’m much better off. He will be a scumbag the rest of his life, and I have finally seen it.
Thanks for all your support thru all of this…I will say this was one of the most difficult things I’ve ever gone through, but 6 months later.. I’m feeling fantastic.. I still have the thoughts, but they are few and far between and they don’t hurt anymore.”
That ladies, is progress.
Remember, No Contact is not instant or an ending; it’s a beginning. It requires managing major change in your life and depending on how much emotional damage has been done, it takes time to change your attitudes and mentality, but nowhere near as much time as it would take to convert these assclowns (forever…).
Congratulations Sheila and stay the course.
I will be posting properly about this tomorrow but there are more books from me on the way for readers and the first one (this is the working title) is:
Get Over Him: How to Lose an Assclown & Other Pain in the Arse Men
A guide to living an assclown free life, the No Contact Rule, and becoming a healthier, positive you.
Your thoughts?
If you want to understand why you’re attracted to Mr Unavailable’s, check out my new ebook Mr Unavailable and the Fallback Girl. Find out more and download.
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Sheila, I can’t believe it, you are finally over it!! I am proud of you. No contact is the only way to go, it will give peace of mind. Doesn’t it feel good to finally feel good?
Good thing is, this will never happen to us again, I feel I can smell them a mile away!
NML, I still believe that for some of these EUM, control is more important to them than actually being with you, I think due to the narcisstic tendencies.
Could you post something about it?
Looking back, my clown is a narcissist, I have no doubt and me chasing him was all about control for him and I have no doubt that in his sick twisted mind he still expects to hear from me.
Astelle.. thank you!!!
Yes, mine was a narcissist too.. text book, TEXT BOOK!!!!!
they dont’ know how to love, just satisfy themselves ….they are sad, sad, insecure pathetic souls!!!
Sheila, I’m so proud of you! Your story is so similar to mine and seeing that you weathered that emotional storm is giving me hope that I can too. I fell off the wagon when I responded to his text to give him a piece of mind and explain how he treats me. What a waste!
NML: Love the titles. Re: “How to lose an assclown”, I got rid of mine by trying to define the relationship and talking about babies… lol
Astelle: Yup, I’m learning how to detect these men and their BS.
Well done Sheila.
Sheila – You will never know just how happy I am for you. You have been a great friend & support for me & I hope I have been the same for you. We will look back at t his someday & realize just how strong we really are. I hope I am the 1st one you call when you finally meet that guy who treats you the way you deserve! Here sto “The Secret” & movin’ on! Thx for helping me stay positive!
xxxo-Kim
Sheila, it was interesting to read the thread that NML attached to this post, and see the process you went through in order to heal yourself and move on. You should feel extremely proud of yourself that you weathered the storm and came out on the other side with increased self-esteem, self love, and with the knowledge of making better choices in relationships in the future. I would love to see a post from you sometime soon that tells us that you met a wonderful man who treats you well and gives you the love you so deserve. Good for you!
WOW…..Shella, you did it girl. I had faith you would and you gave me so much support, thank you. Unfortunately for me I fell off the wagon after 5 weeks of NC but I’m back on again and going through withdrawals. I actually broke up with him over the phone and told him it was truly over this time, I’d never done that before, so I hope he gets the message. Congrats to you!!!
NML…these men really are like drug addictions, I’ve never felt such an obsession for any man in my life. It’s so hard to break the habit and that’s what it is,… a really bad habit. So Sheila deserves a BIG HELL YEAH!!!!!!
Cynnie…..I love what you said:
“NML: Love the titles. Re: “How to lose an assclownâ€, I got rid of mine by trying to define the relationship and talking about babies… lol”
How true…same thing happened to me….he just wouldn’t define the relationship in the second year…even though we had planned to get married in the first year…lol. What an assclown!!!
Bravo, Bravo Sheila!!!!!!!!!
:0)
Sheila – wonderful!
Congratulations, Sheila! You are AWESOME!!!!!
Congrats. I know how hard it is.
It took me years sometimes in the past to end things. The struggle is incredible.
What I like about this site is people understand. They dont sit there and judge you and say “why don’t you just move on?”. They know why. .
Congratulations Sheila !!! Good for you for being committed to your own self-esteem
Whoo-hoo 
Fantastic news, Shelia….
You’ve helped through some rough times NML so I know from first hand experience how lucky Sheila, and all of us are, to have you. The No Contact rule works. I also have first hand experience. Stick to it girls. It may save your life!
Thanks everyone for your comments. Astelle, sorry that I forgot to answer your question. I will post the excerpt from the book. Unfortunately control is not a one way street in this relationship – both parties are guilty of it, it’s just that one tends to be more successful than the other.
Thanks NML, I didn’t realize control is not a one way street, something else for you to teach me. Can’t wait for your other books to come out.
You are wonderful, Thank you.
I have been wanting to contact a friend of his and cray on her shoulder. She is very wise and knows him very well, and would be able to understand what I am going through. Also she might be able to help me figure out how to navigate the nightclubs and bands scene – he and I shared a lot of live music in common. But I also know that it is me sneaking around, snooping to see if he’s as miserable as me. (NML “Who cares?”) Or maybe she could broker a reconciliation. (NML “Why on earth would you want to reconcile with an assclown?”)
Also I keep pulling up his MySpace page. He hasn’t logged in since we broke up. (NML “It will get a lot easier when you decide to stop torturing yourself.”)
I’m 14 days into NC and still in a huge amount of grief and loss.
I wanted to bump this topic to the top again.
Regina, why do you want to reconcile with him? What would be different? Stop the snooping, stick with NC and you will feel better, give it time.
Regina, Please resist the urge to contact his friend. A friend of his is not a friend of yours during this time. Also, stop looking on his MySpace page! (I know how hard it is believe me). The less information you have about him right now the better it will be for you, and I think you know that already. It is normal to be in a state of grief right now. Just feel it and go through the grieving. Think of him as being dead to you right now. Any information you get about him will set you back; and any contact you have with him will set you back even further and make things so much worse. Hang in there!
Astelle, because I am not so sure we did the right thing by breaking up. Because we spent six years together and it was mostly really really good. Because we broke up solely on the basis of this book and website and it was very sudden and we didn’t even see a counselor or anything. Because I’m not sure if he is EUM or has just developed stress related depression in the past two years. Because we got along so well and enjoyed each other’s company and did so many really cool things together. He was my best friend. I guess that’s why. Give it time, okay.
Carm and Astelle, how long did it take NC to start working for y’all? I used to be a heavy smoker and I quit, but this is much harder, the love withdrawal/detox.
ReginaToxicodendronDiversilobum, That is a tough one.
Do you respect yourself, that you evaluated your then-situation and your goals, and determined that continuing your relationship with him was harmful for you – or do you doubt?
Two years is a long time to leave a weakness in your relationship unhealed. If you cannot heal within the relationship, you may need to heal yourself, outside the relationship. Neither of you were part of resolving the problems, which implies you each have some healing to do and some choices to make about your lives.
How you spent the last two years, or last six years, doesn’t matter nearly as much as the likelihood you will be unharmed and content and satisfied and joyful tomorrow.
If you can rationally explain him to your parents, or five trusted friends, and they agree that he is of good character, healthy, and a responsible individual, then possibly you made a mistake in leaving. Apologize to him, knowing he may never forgive you, even if you start a new relationship together.
But if you can’t explain to your parents, if you don’t have the trusted friends – consider why you are so isolated, whether you are scrambling for a refuge rather than building a family. If they hesitate to find him a good prospect, consider why you would pick someone less than remarkable.
Second thoughts, desires to keep the comforts we once knew, are all to common. Consider carefully whether he is, today, the man you would want to enrich the rest of your life, before trying to start a new relationship with him.
And keep in mind – you were unhappy enough to leave once. The last thing you want is to resume that unhappy point in your life. He won’t change – so anything that might happen to better things will be what you choose to do. Respect yourself, and honor and respect all others.
Blessed be!
Regina,
I read a post of yours on spotting EU men describing your ex’s early warning signs of EU behavior. Maybe you should re-read it also, because you describe some pretty serious red flags early on in the relationship that he displayed that most definately indicate he is and always has been EU. Don’t doubt yourself that you did the right thing by breaking up. I also doubted myself and thought I made a mistake after breaking up with one of my former EU’s and I had a knee-jerk panic reaction. I felt I had made a terrible mistake by breaking up, and I contacted him and we got back together. It was a huge mistake, because things just went downhill again and I wasted more time, and also lost some pride.
Just feel the pain of NC, and focus on, and even write down, the bad things about the relationship, not the good ones. Relationships with EU’s do have good times, but you can’t let that overshadow what was fundamentally wrong. For me, after about 6 weeks of NC with my last EU, things got easier, I felt better, and I could see things more objectively. I could see it was really a mistake and I was just wasting time in the relationship with someone who could not go foward.
Regina, my pathetic story dragged on for over 3 years. I was just divorced for 2 years after an 18 year marriage (looking back he is also an EUM who controlled and manipulated me). I met this guy and thought wow, what a nice man. We spent a lot of time together, he called me 3-4 times a day (Yes, control) and I started to notice we got together on HIS time and terms. He was sooooo busy! After 2 months I had family here for a visit from Europe, I am originally from Europe but live in the States now. I told my cousin about him and said, not sure, something doesn’t seem right with him. She said, drop him right now, your gut is warning you and I had planned to break it off the next morning and DIDN’T.
So, my own inflicted nightmare started. A few months later he was suppose to meet some of my friends and made excuses not to come. I didn’t call him – he expected me to call – and he didn’t call me. After a while stupid me emailed him and asked if this was his way of breaking up with me by dumping me for the weekend. He wrote me such an arrogant reply and insisted that he had no intention to break up with me (of course not, never did and never will). So, we e-mailed a few months back and forth but it seemed that I had to invite him in order to see him, basically I chased this man! We got back “together†again for a few months and he pulled the next disappearing act, I e-mailed a few more times and then I stopped.
There was no break up, yelling, telling him off or anything like that; I am not the type to do that anyway. I tolerate way too much but when I am done, I am really done.
Shortly after that I found NML’s Website and spent a whole weekend reading and it took me a while to figure out that I can e-mail NML. So I did and she gave me the best advice I have ever received. Of course I had more questions and she answered them all for me.
I wasn’t worried that I would make contact with him again – I was so embarrassed about the whole thing and I could never ever look at this man again.
So, I say, took me about 8 months to feel completely free, one day it will just happen.
I have been on a few dates with men, have not found the right one yet, but I am confident I will. I think that I know enough red flags to avoid these men. I agree with Brad, if you can’t explain him to friends (my parents are not alive anymore) you know something is wrong with him. My friends told me: “You have a user on your hands”
without meeting him.
Where can I read your story? Can you copy and paste it here?
Carm, Brad and Astelle, thanks. Obviously I was having a weak moment.
Carm, thanks for calling me out. Yeah, I was having a strong moment then when I wrote that list.
Brad, actually my friends and family all love the dude. My mom actually said six years is a lot invested, don’t push him! They have also mentioned my age a number of times, as in maybe I shouldn’t be so picky. He wrote them a nice good bye email, about how he’ll miss them and me and how wonderful I am and all, so they still think he is a nice guy, which he is, sigh. I think it is possible to be a nice guy (or a nice gal) and still be EUM. Yeah, nice and oblivious.
Astelle, which story are you asking about?
Again, thanks, and I especially appreciate the folks who have been though this returning here to help those of us who are just now climbing out of the mud pit.
Okay, friends, I have stopped looking at him on MySpace. One question, I will want to unfriend him, right? That way if I post a bulletin or anything, it will not end up in his inbox. I may wait a few more days to do that, just to avoid the temptation to snoop.
Regina, I don’t know what your story is with this guy, besides being with him for 6 years. Did you see him a lot during that time, did he pull disapperaing acts, did you live with him?
Yes, you should unfriend him and stop snooping.
I hate myspace.
Hi Astelle, we did see each other a lot, but never cohabitated. To everyone else, we were great together, and we really did have wonderful times, adventures, lots of love too. His EUM managing-down my expectations began about two/three years ago when I started wanting to move in together. The EUM behaviors were implemented *very* gradually. Gradually emailed and phoned less, gradually wanted more and more “alone time,” gradually stopped coming to see me at work, gradually stopped coming to my house to spend time together, gradually stopped telling me how wonderful I was, gradually stopped asking me out to shows and dinners, gradually began breaking dates and promises. I continued to blow hot, coming up with fun stuff to do, making fabulous dinners, keeping conversation alive, etc. Then he had the audacity to tell me that our relationship seemed to have become routine and there wasn’t much passion in it anymore!
On another posting I compared it to the tale about how if you put a frog into a pot of cold water and gradually start heating it, the frog doesn’t notice the temperature change and soon enough you have boiled the frog and it never jumped out of the pot! Being with the Long-Term Operator EUM, as I call mine, is like that but opposite. You are lucky to get out of the pot before it freezes over!
Although we had a long term relationship that blew hot for the first four of the six years, I had plenty of red flags that were raised in the first 3 months of knowing him. I ignored:
He has been cheated on by a previous woman.
1) Very quiet on first date. First several dates.
2) Leaves after you have sex, won’t stay the night.
3) Disappears for days after the first or second sexual experience.
4) Separated but not divorced.
5) He has been in a number of long term relationships with little time single. (serial monogamist.)
5) Some kind of tragedy in the context of his previous relationships (mine had lost a baby with his ex-wife).
6) His ex is not over him, she’s still in love with him.
7) He has been financially hurt by a woman, or in the context of a relationship (mine lost his pants in the sale of their house).
9) Alcoholism in the family.
10) Father described as being very remote.
11) He says he is not into a serious relationship.
12) He wants to date other women to keep things non-committal.
13) He says he doesn’t believe that love and relationships last.
…and there were other things of course. For like the past year I had been breaking up with him in my head, getting angry about his lack of emotional presence and how lonely I felt. Heh heh, then I would get my period and know I was just hormonal.
The breaking point came when he said he wanted to move out of his apartment (the place we spent most of our time together) and be homeless for awhile, sofa-surf with friends, etc. Then he could save money on rent and eventually afford a down payment on a condo so he would have housing security and an investment to liquidate in his old age. I was like DUDE!!! You just wrote a short term, mid term and long term life story that does not include me!
We broke up by mutual agreement. I had finished “Mr. Unavailable and the Fallback Girl” and he was about halfway through. He admitted that he had many of the EUM signature traits. We even had a parting ritual (see my blog, it was really quite beautiful, tears shed together, and VERY final, intentional and effective.) and I have been NC ever since. Day 17 now and feeling like I have gotten past the worst of it. This site, and counseling have been lifesavers, or at least mindsavers.
Thanks for asking, Astelle. It sounds like you have a much more remote relationship with your EUM, tho they did have a very similar set of emotional wounds.
Again, sorry about the stupid emoticon for the #8. Don’t know why that is happening.
I am not healed. My partner of 10 years broke up with me 2 months ago. We are still talking weekly. Here I am, all the while hoping something will change. Idiot. I just don’t know how to let go of the man I love and have been with for 10 years, how do I not talk to him or see him at all? How do I stop hoping he will change his mind? I suggested we try counselling, but he said he didn’t want to fall back together with counselling without knowing why part of him wanted it. He wants to see if we can be friends. After 10 years, we have a large group of mutual friends. Does he just not want to be the bad guy? Realistically, if he thought there was a chance for us, he would have stayed and tried, correct?
Rahn, every breakup is tough. Our bodies and our hearts and our emotions each bond to those we consider “close” in their own ways. When we lose the regular presence, the pheromones and scents, the communication with someone, we grieve. No matter if we break things off, or fate intervenes – or they are scruffy and unruly and unlovable by others, no matter if we are better off without them – we still grieve. The hurt, the denial, the anger, the loss – we all have to get through this.
When the relationship ends, but you try to forge a non-intimate friendship or working relation – that is tough again.
When the relationship is dysfunctional, when one or both are emotionally unavailable, socially undisciplined or morally challenged, then each contact often re-ignites the turmoil, the hurt, and the drama of the relationship and of the end of the relationship.
After two months, I suspect that there are some issues that you have with relationships, with your self image. I would start there, and try to find a balance and stability. That will likely mean shutting him out of sight and sound, no communication, no chance meetings, no joint events or projects. No contact. If you come to realize there were character issues involved in your relationship, the No Contact may be quite permanent.
When seeing him, talking with him is unsettling for you, you need to take control of your safety and happiness – and protect yourself.
Luck!
Rahn, Brad is right, you need to not have contact with him, at least not for a while, I can’t say forever since I don’t know your story.
10 years is a long time and it will take time for you to heal, but this will be difficult if you stay in touch with him or see him.
Don’t hold on to the “friendship offer”, he may just have said that so he won’t look so bad. Refusing the counselling also tells me that he doesn’t see a chance. So, you have to work on yourself to get over this.
You say that you are talking weekly? May I ask who initiates that weekly call?
He called it a separation, rather than just a ‘break’, because he said there was no guarantee of getting back together. To me, 10 years deserves trying to fix things before separating. But he didn’t. He said part of him wanted to stay together, but he didn’t know why. was it that we belong together, that he didn’t want me to hurt, or that he felt a void – was it me or did he just need that void of not having a partner to be filled.
I cannot imagine not having this man in my life. Well it’s not always weekly. He sends ‘friendly’ emails to me at work. Last time I saw him at our house – he said he was going to work so I went over to keep packing and we talked a little. I asked if he wanted to keep communicating or just leave it and he said keep communicating. If there is any chance for being together again, couldn’t it only come from staying friends? But how do I lose hope and accept that? How do I just see him as a friend who no longer loves me?
After 10 years, you either want to try and repair things or you want out….that should be all I need to know. If he loved me he would have stayed.
A bit of clarification on counselling. We did go, but his intention was to make sure we both had the support we needed, not to see if we could reconcile. He said last night that it did help a little.
Rahn, are you two married? I am asking because you said he called it a separation, not a “break”. Yes, I agree, 10 years is a long time and it should deserve trying to be fixed – but – both of you need to want it and I don’t feel that he wants to try at this time.
No, I don’t agree that the chance to get back together is by staying friends, you can’t see him as a friend, because you have more feelings for him then he does for you.
Don’t want to be rude, could there be another woman involved?
We are not married. We live together. There is not another woman, as far as I know. But I don’t know.
I think it is two things. The relationship as it was, which needed repair. And the future-what he wants from it.
We broke up for two months a long long time ago, but it was clear that it was a break, rather than a break up. We weren’t together, but we hadn’t broken up. This was probably year 3 of the relationship. We remained friends and saw each other weekly, had a good time, and one night I went to him and we reconciled. This is different. We live together, renting. I have moved out.
We have talked way more since the break up about our relationship than we have in a long long time. That’s why I wanted to keep talking about it, but at what point do you stop?
Reason that I asked if there is another woman, because I have seen it over and over that a man leaves one relationship to go to somebody else. What does he want from the future? When you broke up before, you went to him and reconciled, why was he willing to reconcile at that time?
You know, it sounds really harsh and it is tough to accept that a man doesn’t want you anymore, no matter what the reasons are, been there, done that.
I know that you want to keep talking about your relationship with him and good question, when do you stop, I say right now for now!
Actions speak louder than words and if you have to do all the work and talking to keep this relationship going, it may be time to stop right now.
I am still not clear on who initiates these talks? It is hard for me to imagine that he initiates these kind of talks about the relationship or contacts. I understand his “friendly” e-mails, because you asked him if he wanted to keep communicating and he said yes, but what else was he suppose to say to you at that moment face to face?
I say, step back, focus on yourself and see what he does, I am not saying WAIT on him, you can’t force anything, leave him alone for now, I feel he is done and his actions show it.
I know it hurts
The talks have been initiated by both, but mostly me. he said he is happy to keep talking if it is productive. ie, not rehashing stuff we have already talked about. fair enough. the more we talk, the more we are understanding incidences etc, but I think it has to come from him. Do I implement the no contact rule, or do i simply not contact him and make a judgement on seeing/talking to him if he contacts me? This is someone I have loved for 10 years…how do I stop seeing him, talking to him, thinking about him. It’s just so hard.
He didn’t want the relationship we had – he said change had to happen and this was progress. I agree change had to happen, but I didn’t think ending it was the only option. But to him it is. Ending it and being friends and maybe it will happen again for us, maybe not.
10 years is a lot to let go of. I feel like if we are meant to be together, we would stay together. But I have seen one couple I know break up for two years and get back together…very rare, but possible.
Letting go is hard, but I love him, I want him to be happy, so I have to.
He has said he has noticed a lot of changes in me (I’m getting fit, eating well, going out, my attitude is more positive, etc). He said he hasn’t progressed as he thought he would. He thought he would jump at a new job opportunity interstate, but didn’t take it. He’s only just starting to cook meals at home for himself. I think he’s a bit stuck, not knowing how to move forward himself. He said he went somewhere that we would have gone together and felt a void, he said he didn’t enjoy it as much because i wasn’t there. He said sometimes he does miss me, but he’s keeping busy. But that means nothing if he isn’t moving towards me.
Rahn, I really don’t feel that that you should implement the no contact rule on him, but you should step back, be not so available to him, either by phone, e-mail or seeing him. I feel he made his choice of not being with you and actions speak louder than words. Try – I know it is hard after 10 years – to make this about you not him. You need to feel better and I think if you keep distance from him it will help.
Don’t let this man keep you on the back burner until he figures out what he wants. Yeah, I feel it, he is going to places without without you and he feels a void, he may be stuck, but don’t read too much into it, he offers – in my opinion – way too much information about himself, like just now starting to cook for himself, that job interstate that he didn’t take, sounds like a man that doesn’t know what he want?. I don’t believe it and I hope you don’t either.
He misses you but he keeps busy? That should really pi** you off, he is the victim in all of that?
Step back and take care of yourself and don’t be shocked that he is with somebody else, not saying it to hurt you, but my gut says, yeah, how do I get out of this to be with her..
thanks. i know you’re not saying it to hurt. it is of course a possibility. i wonder if i should ask him. it obviously wouldn’t change the situation! but it might help me move on.
Actually I did ask if there was someone else and he said no. What I didn’t ask was if he was ending this relationship to start one with someone he has in mind. And sometimes his answers are ambiguous so…
Either way it doesn’t matter. What’s done is done and right now this is not what he wants. At counselling he said he wouldn’t rule it out of ever happening again. Perhaps he said that just to appear nice.
Rahn, don’t ask him, it will not help you to move on, it will only hurt you more.
Could I hurt more right now?
No he is not the victim. I guess I wanted him to talk, and now that he is starting to, I have to listen to what he says. Perhaps he feels guilty. I feel sick at the thought that it is over. I have avoided moving stuff out of the house ‘just in case’, but that isn’t going to happen. Looking at what we have, most of the furniture and contents are mine. He will be left with an empty house. But it has to be done. This is what he wants after all. I have already moved my clothes, my cat to my parents till I decide where to live.
Will I ever get over it if I don’t say no contact? Do I think there is still a chance for us? Doesn’t everyone at this stage? Especially if there is ambiguity. Maybe down the track, I don’t know. But for now there isn’t. I think he wants to see if we can be friends, as we have a big group of friends and it has already affected things there, because if we can’t, there is no possibility of being more in his eyes. Trouble is, until 2 months before the break up, we were friends. We went o/s for a month and had a great time, but there were some unresolved issues. But he said some days felt like, yes, this is how it is meant to be!
Rahn,
You are in a tough place. What do you want of your life? I realize that what you know has been living with him, and there is comfort in what you know and fear about the unknown.
So, if you accept that what went before is gone, that you will never again enjoy the relationship that you had – what do you want?
Are you able to accept that *you don’t know who this guy is* and learn to make a relationship with him ? See, there is no going back, not now. Any issues that were between you are still there – the old relationship wasn’t working for *both* of you, so it isn’t something to wish for by *either* of you. That means the choice is between the fear of being alone, and maybe finding another partner some day, or the fear of finding a relationship that *might* work with this guy that you now know that you *don’t* know?
Do you know, and like, and respect yourself enough right now to choose?
The Tarot Major Arcana card #13 is the “death” card. It signifies the ending of the old life, to make way for a new life. The Lightning Struck Tower shows a figure blown from the tower, it signifies how devastating change can be in relation to what has gone before – with no understanding or comfort available about what will follow. You may see yourself in this kind of position. Your relationship, your way of life came to an end, kind of, a couple of months ago. And you aren’t ready to relegate the memories and the accomplishments and treasures of that time to the past.
But this is a time of beginnings. If you aren’t ready to begin a relationship, then that lets you know what the right thing is for you, right now. If you are ready, and you, today, respect this guy’s character, his honor and integrity, then start over with him. If you have questions about his suitability, take time and make the effort to answer any questions before deciding.
You still have to grieve the loss of your old relationship. You need to deal with and accept the anger and denial and rage and hurt about it’s ending. Because until you finish grieving, that shadow of past hurt will cloud today and tomorrow. Counseling here, for dealing with the ending, might be very productive for you. An experienced grief counselor can help you deal with painful issues instead of avoiding them, and also help discover underlying issues that might be difficult to uncover.
Peace.
Thanks. I know I have to accept it and move on. I was clinging to anything he said that may indicate there is hope. I am looking at myself, believe me.
Trouble is I am thinking about him and our relationship most of the time. I need to cut that out. To start fresh in any sort of relationship with him means letting go of it all. Whether that leads us back together or not is another thing. I have to focus on myself right now.
We have been talking about the issues. We know what they are. The question is do we both love each other and want to create a new, vibrant relationship together. I do. At the moment, he doesn’t, and may never want to. He said he wouldn’t rule it out never happening again.
Rahn,
Forget for a moment that you know this guy, that you have felt comfortable with him.
Do you respect him as a man? Is he disciplined? Is he good with kids and small animals – do they respond well and behave respectfully, do they improve and grow under his care?
Is he honest, is he slow to accept obligations and quick to meet responsibilities?
Does he enjoy good emotional bonds with his family and friends? Is he respected at work, and does he enjoy the people he works with and works for? (Part of this one is integrity – is he willing to change jobs to find a place and coworkers he is willing and able to support?)
Do you have five trusted friends? Do they respect him?
You should be sure of all of this, when choosing to take a man into your life.
And now, after all of that – Home is a secure place where you can depend on being cared for and secure. Does he want to make a home with you? If the answer isn’t a simple, “yes”, you have to respect his needs – and accept that you are not now in a relationship, and you aren’t just starting a relationship.
Don’t wait to see if something changes. Part of being in a relationship is the physical way our bodies interact – shared breathes, the effects of communication, the way we alter our expectations and actions to accommodate loved ones – that all starts coming apart during absences. If he can’t be in a relationship with you, then you need to focus on healing, on grieving, and moving on with your life.
Peace.
I respect him very much and even more now that he is looking at himself, at his life – that takes courage. He is becoming disciplined with his fitness, he is making small steps in other areas. He is fantastic with children and animals-yes they improve and grow under his care, but we don’t have our own children, but he has had animals in the past and we have a cat.
Obligation? Well he didn’t propose in 10 years! But I wouldn’t see that as an obligation, although he has felt the pressure over the last year or so by others, not me. He is honest. He is respected by friends and peers. He is struggling to change jobs and it is not for lack of talent, lack of direction perhaps. He is very close with his family and makes a big effort to see friends. He doesn’t have the emotional connection with friends. He hasn’t spoken about this to anyone, only recently to one person.
My friends respect him. We did have a home together that we enjoyed being in. He is still living there.
Is he perfect, by no means.
Rahn,
What are the issues???
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