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I was reading one of the first posts that appeared on Baggage Reclaim back in September 2005 about great expectations and I saw a quote I used from my ex fiance that highlighted the vast, cavenous difference between us:
““How can you say that I treated you badly? It’s not as if you caught me in bed with another woman or I use to beat you up?””
This reminds me of another post I wrote a little while back about getting into the heads of Mr Unavailable’s and assclowns where I quoted a bewildered guy accused of using various women to bail on rent and bills as saying “If I was really that bad, sure they wouldn’t be with me!”
This demonstrates the blinkered thinking that prevents these people from not only seeing the bigger picture but the reality of themselves.
Does that mean that if my ex fiance had lied to me (actually he did) and stolen from me that I would have had to turn a blind eye? And actually, the key word in his statement was ‘caught’ because it didn’t mean that he hadn’t actually been playing around! Mind games!
These quotes go to show how people rationalise their behaviour:
By comparing it to something they perceive as what you should consider being treated badly and deciding that whatever they have done is not all that bad.
By seeing if they are losing out somewhere and experiencing consequences.
With the former, my ex and anyone else who chooses to behave in this way, distances themselves from their actual actions and attempts to silence you in some sort of warped ‘glass is half full’ bullsh*t. With no real understanding of the impact of their behaviour and a lack of empathy that fuels the disconnection, they determine that because in their mind, people who do bad things do X,Y,Z, their behaviour isn’t really bad because it’s not in their little rule book.
With the latter, they experience no real negative consequences and in their mind, when people are behaving in an unacceptable manner and are doing ‘bad things’, they don’t get laid, they don’t get people trying to be with them, and they don’t continue to keep landing on their feet…that is unless you have women willing to turn a blind eye to these things in the name of ‘love’.
But it got me thinking, especially when reading through comments, what type of ridiculous hokey cokey bullsh*t has been said to you as their way of abdicating themselves of any responsibility for their actions, for the relationship, or how you may be feeling on the receiving end?
Share your examples and I (and no doubt readers) will decipher them.
Your thoughts?
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“I dont understand why you have to love or hate me”
I think this sums it up… they dont want to have you or not have you.. they dont want you to expect anything or go away.. it keeps you right in the middle with nothing… and no responsibility for your hurt feelings.. so wrong.
Ass clown that i dated said in begning ” I donot want to hurt you ” , ” I try everything that u said will help this relationship but you always yell at me” , we breakup after one year of relationship after me giving everything and sacrificing everytime it was too much for me to handle(though i tried to go back to him later), Later he said he want to be friends I said i donot wnat to be friend and his answer to this was ” OK” and left . Frankly saying i was shocked to see he didnot made any any effort at all, didnot even ask why?, he just left. It kindaa explained me wht happen when you ignore red flags and close your eyes and try to see what is not there.
AJ – Sooooo glad i’m not alone with those excuses and the lips flapping lies (lol)… I really fell for it you know, they kept me lured in (he keeps telling me all these amazing things about how unique I am and that i’m the ONE for him – so maybe he’ll fight for me, i’ll be worth the hassle in the end, he’ll just want this badly enough if i give him just one more week/month/year).
I’d love to erase him from my mind too, I keep getting nostalgic and thinking of the future plans we’d made and that now he’s making them with someone else (his ex, who incidentally he lied to as well she knows nothing about me and our time together he was keeping all his options open and decided to go back to her)… BUT… the aim here is to focus on me and not on EUM anymore… it’s just hard, I keep falling into the habit of thinking about him and all of the fictional future things we had planned and i get nostalgic… help surely there’s medicine out there to cure us from this affliction???
Thank you for the reply. You are right I would only ever have had 10% honesty from him at any time and that would never be enough.
Can’t understand why I clung on to the illusion for three years!! All I know is that without this site It would have gone on for more years and that doesn’t bare thinking about.
People who haven’t experienced this kind of relationship just think you have lost it! You feel like you have nobody to turn to at times
Your advice and the reasons why we accept poor behaviour from EUM’s along with knowing so many others are going through the same thing help to see things as they are. It has taken time but the penny has dropped at last and I know this is it. I’ve had enough from him or anyone like him. I will work on my boundaries and change to keep out any unhealthy relationships in future.
Thank you so much.
My EUM was ‘grieving’ the loss of his wife (married for 10 days before she died, although they were a couple for 8 years) when we met and continued to ‘grieve’ for the 4 years we were together. He was too guilty to do sex, although he could get it up with prostitutes I discovered. He couldn’t live with me as he needed 5 years to get over her death. He couldn’t tell his family, or the family of his late wife, about me, as they might be shocked at his behaviour. I swallowed this, felt his pain and did all I could to be understanding and patient, including moving house and job to be nearer him. I found letters from his wife that showed all these issues we were having were issues for them, too, and they were causing her deep distress – just like they had been for me. His temper (which he said came from guilt over her death) his secrecy, his compartmentalising of the relationship, his witholding sex, the boundaries of his friendships with other women; they were all there and I saw my life flash before my eyes. I decided to check up on some things, as I was increasingly unhappy with and scared by his behaviour, and discovered that the day he took to go away and honour the anniversary of his wifes death he actually met and sh****d another woman. The same woman he had been sh*****g for the time we had been together. He had been blaming all the bad behaviour on his grief and distress when in fact, it meant nothing to him at all. Not only had he been abusing me, he was abusing a dead woman.
3 months after I walked out on him, I agreed to meet him, at his request. I was now in another relationship and very happy. He said he had wanted me to be his wife, that he had been trying to become a better man before he asked me, that I had no integrity and did not understand that relationships needed working on and I had no sense of loyalty! He had no idea that his behaviour was hurtful and felt I was unreasonably upset. He was waiting for me to come back and get the relationship going again. I was the one in the wrong, I had unrealistic expactations and he was prepared to forgive me (forgive me??!!) and have me back.
I just got married. And NOT to that sh*t, either. No, he is now off doing his thing with some other poor unsuspecting woman with bags of sympathy for such a down-trodden and badly-treated man. Who cares? As long as we are prepared to swallow sob stories, as long as we feel we are not worth the love and respect of a genuine person who treats us as a genuine person, too, it will carry on happening. I wish I could warn the Next Victim but I guess she won’t listen, just as I would not have done. She’ll find out in her own good time, sadly.
My relationship with an EUM ended 11 days ago when I caught him cheating. In a later email he said: “I didn’t want to hurt you so I didn’t want to end the relationship (before starting another one)”, all the while going through the motions of maintaining the relationship with me.
I found this website that very day and have since downloaded the ebook. I’m so grateful for the people on this website, and to know that I am not alone.
“I would be a great catch for somebody!”……..said to me whilst I had my arm linked in his after we had spent what I thought was a lovely day together.
Like it was acceptable to say this whilst I was at his side? Yes I was hurt but then again we are singing from different hymn sheets.
Would he be a good catch? He is in debt, continually moans about needing to get his life in order but does absolutely nothing about it, talks of wanting to go to Australia but I have more chance of flying to the moon on fairy wings than he does of following it through!
He is one of the biggest assclowns out there and I so need to break free.
My assclown didn’t get me a birthday card for my birthday (first one since my mom passed away) because he was “too busy.” Although he spent the night prior to my birthday watching football.
On my birthday he saw a pretty young girl at a concert we were attending and suggested that he would like the girl for his birthday. When I objected to the comment he told me to “lighten up” because he was joking.
On the day before Thanksgiving, after I went shopping because he had no food in his house, and made him dinner, he berated me in front of his friends for interrupting his drunken buddy who was rambling on and on about the same thing. He also told me he couldn’t stand to be around my “negative energy” so he was taking me back to his house and I couldn’t go out with on the biggest bar night of the year. He said it was because he doesn’t deal with stress as well as I do, and he couldn’t stand to hear both of us talk at the same time (so he went off on me??).
I left and went home (1 1/2 hours away) to my house. Haven’t talked to him since.
Been together 7 1/2 years. So he ruins every holiday with his temper, incl. his own birthdays. Told our couples counselor just recently that he doesn’t think he ever wants to get married, after telling me that it was “on the table.”
Cheated on me (unprotected) in Feb 2008 and that “was just a mistake” and he’s tired of being “crucified” for a “mistake.” Nevermind that we’ve always had off the hook sex as often as he wants.
I think this no contact since Wed. is a good start and I just hope I can continue it forever.
I could stand to lose 20 lbs… maybe even 30 lbs and I KNOW it and am embarrassed about it. So when my current man makes comments like “If you quit drinking beer you’d lose weight”, “What size pants do you wear?”, “Have you gained weight since we started seeing each other?”, “Somebody needs to work out” and I no longer want to get naked in front of him… his defense is to say he wouldn’t love me any more even if I was nice and skinny. So apparently he thinks I’m fat, and I probably am a little fat. I haven’t gotten bigger but I certainly haven’t gotten smaller. I wear a size 14 pants by the way. I get offended, hurt and embarassed by his comments. Thanksgiving I told him to go home and maybe he can find a nice skinny lady in church that doesn’t drink beer.
Now the saddest part is instead of thinking he’s rude I am just plain embarrassed and hurt. He has some habits I don’t particularly like but I don’t point them out to him because as a whole I like him more than I dislike anything about him. Know what I mean? I haven’t talked to him all weekend but he texted me yesterday he missed me. What does he miss? My fat belly? Why would he even want to have sex with me if he thinks I’m fat? I don’t get it.
I want to add that we have talked about getting married, moving to a different part of the state, taking a trip in the Spring. We’ve spent weekends together, had holidays at each other’s family, met each other’s kids. Most of the time he’s very nice to me but every few months he gets into a funk and says he can’t be in a relationship blah blah blah. Then after a few weeks of that he tells me how lonely he is, how much he misses me, how much he likes doing things together. It’s looking like he doesn’t want me as I am now but doesn’t like being alone either. I’m just for comfort, aren’t I? [Damn it anyway!!]
Ashley–
(Your post is no longer available for viewing–?????–but I remember what you wrote the other day.)
You looked squarely at the facts, and got to the right answer: he was an EUM.
On the one hand, he TOLD YOU SO. Period
Also, as to this b.s. about your phone being disconnected: first, there are other ways to communicate, other than the phone, in this world. An outdoorsy-traveler-free-spirit like him knows this better than anyone! So he TOTALLY could have emailed you, or called you at a later time–your phone being disconnected for a short period of time is NO excuse OR justification for the relationship’s end, or for his decision to move. Second, think of it this way: if he really wanted to be with you, he would not have made a big decision (like moving…to a state…on the other coast!) without talking to you first. A move or change of job is a big decision, calling for a state of transition in one’s life. So he even contradicts himself by saying that it’s because of you and your phone being disconnected that “I decided to move to Seattle”!
I went through something like this. (Your post helped me see my experience more clearly, too.) They like hanging their hat on one of YOUR actions to justify their inaction and unavailability, to thus keep their options open (or otherwise do whatever the hell they want to do!) and avoid responsibility for the relationship and/or being (labelled) an asshole!
Little child behavior. NOT the behavior of a grown up!
Sorry for the repeat posting but I don’t know how to edit my posts.
Last thing — when I say to him “Geez it doesn’t seem that you like me all that much” – he tells me I’m wrong. He tells me he thinks I’m the most real person he’s ever met. He tells me I’m the nicest lady he knows. Calls me sweetie, brings me candy, takes me out to dinner, cooks for me. Then hurts my feelings by grabbing my belly and saying “What is this” and claims he is just teasing me. Maybe he is teasing me… I don’t know.
Miimaa
My ex EUM says things like that to me all the time say god you are putting on weight and hell your a**e is getting big and then calls me sexy bum. Now I just confused or damn right naive does he not like me if so why call me sexy bum? I split up with him at the beginning of the year and lost 20 pounds he wanted me then when I was getting attention offf other guys. But since I go back with him 3 months ago (I know it was stupid getting back with him) I have put on the weight again! I caught him cheating on me on Friday night as I strangely had a dream he was with the woman who obviously he cheats on me with every Friday night (yeah I believe your story that you have gone home) NOT. I rang at 1.30am and a woman answered and said hello then put the phone down obviously only answered so I knew he was with her. Anyway I have changed my number straight away so he can’t get in touch it is the only way to get these guys out of your life! If I had the same number I would have been getting withheld calls off him today saying why arnt I talking to him. I feel sick to my stomach and can’t stop crying but I was crying the whole time I was with him and more so on the iside becasue I had a feeling he was cheating on me all along.
Question is why did he come to my house like 3 or 4 nights during the week then on a Friday and Saturday I didn’t see him for dust. I mean obvs he has been with her but why go and get sex with a woman who is alot older the me, scruffy, unemployed, bar whore. He could come to mine and as sad as its sounds have sex with me so whats so great about her on a Friday and Saturday night?
Any clrity would help me greatly.
Nat xx
“This is assclown Jeopardy. Madeamistake, please make a selection.”
Made: “Alex, I’ll take EUM oldies but goodies for $200 please.”
Alex: “Alright. This EUM line goes…”I am a complete idiot–will you wait for me to get my act together?”
Made: ” Alex, What is “Even though you’ve told me you’re done with me, I really hope I can get you into the sack again by saying these lines to keep you hooked?”
Alex: “Correct, Madeamistake–please select another clue.”
Made: “Alex, let’s go for Assclown Lore for $200.”
Alex: In this famous lore, Adam the Assclown doesn’t call, e-mail or text for weeks, but then reappears through an e-mail or text to say “Really miss talking to you and seeing you.”
Made: “What is my new girlfriend finally dumped me?”
Alex: Correct! You’re on a roll Made–continue.
Made: Alex, let’s go back to EUM oldies but goodies for $1,000.
Alex: Ah…the Daily Double. This oldie, but goodie goes something like this–”I didn’t want to hurt you, but we’ve been together for WAY too long and I just couldn’t lose you either–you know I care about you more than anyone.”
Made: “What is ‘I don’t want you but I certainly don’t want anyone else to want you either?”
Alex: Fantastic Madeamistake!!! You are our new Assclown Jeopardy champion! Congratulations!
@Madeamistake That’s probably one of the best comments I have ever read! Superb! You have captured the essence of the inconsistency of these guys. I’m glad you see him for what he is! Don’t let his word ever drag you into his emotionally vacant cesspool ever again! You may have made a mistake but I doubt you’ll make it again because you see him clearly for the user that he is.
Madeamistake, that was absolutely f**king BRILLIANT!!! Well done and really gets the point across!
Yes, sooooo much fun..had a great laugh, and right on the money!… thanks so much for that!!
My ex cheated on my the entire time I was pregnant, left me at 7 mos, moved in w/the OW, tried to come home to me a week before the baby was born–and thats when the OW called me to inform me he had been cheating on me. I had thought he left me because he was “scared”. He and she stated the he “wasnt in love with me”…so I guess that makes it okay in their minds. he also told me to “get over it” a week after my baby was born so he could spend *more time with our daughter at my house*…they are living happily ever after now while I get no financial support and raise my daughter solo.
Thank you so much NML! He is desperate but I’m not! I need nothing from him. He can play his little headgames with some other poor woman.
Miimaa and Natthecat
I experienced something very much like this behaviour when the AC and I were ‘together’. It was always dressed up as joking behaviour but it hurt me, and I didn’t make the same sort of ‘jokes’ to him.
Then I learned about verbal abuse – and it’s exactly this sort of stuff. It doesn’t have to be screaming name calling abuse, more a subtle drip, drip as your self esteem is slowly eroded. It’s soul destroying and I suggest you Google it (don’t think Natalie has written about this but I coud be wrong)
sadthing´s last blog ..When Mr Unavailable’s and assclowns use ridiculous statements to justify their poor behaviour
Yeah it was the same for me emotional abuse, blackmailing me, calling me names and when I took offense used to say ‘ i was only joking’ ‘why can’t you take a joke’. I have had good solid relationships and none of them made jokes about my weight, clothes, make up, hair style need I go on? At the moment I am just trying to get my self esteem back which is proving very hard! Sad thing is these men must have very little self esteem to do this to a woman.
Thank you sadthing. It sure is strange behavior. Sometimes he can be very sweet… that is what is so confusing. He has his own issues that have nothing to do with me anymore. A close, loving and positive relationship with him is just not in the cards.
6 weeks NC. So anyone have any idea when he’ll move out of my mind? Its highly annoying. This jerk set up a cranium camp and I believe he’s telepathetically trying to communicate with me.
My ex told me he wasn’t ready to be in a committed relationship and had to just “stay friends” for now but insisted I can’t cut out of his life completely because he cares so much for me. He then proceeded to call and email every week for the last 10 weeks; most of which ended with him saying honey I miss you, I’ve been thinking about you etc. which has been very conflicting and painful, and it’s left me very confused. To make things worse, last week he wrote me to tell me, after I told him to be consistent and stop mucking me around, that (to paraphrase) he knew I knew he was a great guy even though he sounds confused or selfish at times! WTF.
My EUM talked the talk like no-one else (never loved anyone like you, want to marry you, move in, have baby etc) but his ACTIONS never matched his words. He limited his time with me to one night every 9 days, kept me a secret from his estranged wife and kids the entire relationship (a year) and made little digs about my weight every time I ate chocolate/some chips. I don’t have a weight problem, I am fairly slim, so when he compared me to an overweight colleague and I pulled him up on it he said: “Oh for god’s sake I am only joking! you are not fat so how can you take me seriously?” Doesn’t matter…still f***d with my head and made me feel paranoid. I finished with him last week because of how little he was seeing me and the fact he kept me a secret. I told him he had treated me like a total mug. His response? a six-page text about how everything was MY fault. How I was EMOTIONALLY DRAINING (we had a lot of ‘discussions’ about his behaviour) and he was going through a divorce, i didn’t support him, blah blah blah. Boo f***king hoo. I am 31 and can’t believe I wasted so much time on this man….but at least I’m now freee……………
I would like your thoughts on this. I had mentioned this one earlier, but it got worse.
I went on three dates with this guy (it had gotten heavy second base physical), and then I did not hear from him for 9 days. When he finally reached out to me, it was with a very casual text asking what was new. Since I could tell he was not really stepping up, I was furious. I calmed myself down and sent a response two days later saying I was having a nice holiday and wishing all was well with him.
10 days later he calls, but does not leave a message. So I do not call him back because this is more of the lukewarm behavior and I figure he will call me back if he is interested. I would have called back had there been a message.
So here comes NYE. My mutual friend tells me he will be at the party we are going to. I look amazing and look forward to catching up with him and clarifying why he called.
Well, what happened was this. From across the room, I smiled and waved. He smiled and gave me a head bob. I then stood in the same area for 25 minutes and you know what, he never came over. The party was then getting broken up. I was devastated and upset because I did not understand why he was still in contact with me when he was clearly lukewarm, and I thought he would at least be civil. We left the party and I thought I would go home and lick my wounds, but our mutual friend saw how upset I was.
He then texted her asking her where she was and who she was with. She then responded with – ” I am with M., who you apparently did not bother talk to at the party.” Then he responded with “I was in the middle of a conversation and then we left” AND he said something about It not needing to be awkward. Or it being awkward, anyhow, he brought in the word awkward.
I have two male friends and they say this is total bull, he had no intention of talking to me and that he felt weird so he acted like a coward.
I did not make it awkward, I tried to open the door for us to at least be civil. Now I am not happy my friend stepped in, but at least she called him on his crap. The fact that he asked who she was with and that he got so defensive shows me that he knew exactly what he was doing. He did not want to talk to me, and instead of manning up, he made a lame excuse.
What does everyone think? Am I out of my mind? I just wanted to go home and lick my wounds. He had proven once again that he was just lukewarm and did not care about how I might be feeling, like his actions had no consequences.
What is worse, is I almost contacted him to apologize for my friend’s stepping in. They guy has shown me over and over that his communication skills are poor, and I almost apologized.
Michelle,
This guy is a jerk and very very probably an abuser, he is coward and if he was feeling awkward and didn’t communicate or try, then cut your losses. He is also plaaying you to get you to the chasing!! eeewww the worst red flag and truly make this a deal breaker!
Oh and just ask yourself… do you want an honorable man or a dishonorable man…which one is he?
Good luck.
I’ve just been down this exact road..only he ws a friend of seven years, I did’nt call him once and he still led me on a merrydance of waiting for his call. As long as you are thinking of him, he wins! sooo sick!
Michelle, better if you add your story in the Forum and have many responses…Thanks God, you had only three dates with this loser, he doesnt deserve you, and he showed his “true colours” straightaway…Even if he calls or texts you, please ignore him!!!
It’s always interesting to seeing how different people rationalize different things. Both genders are guilty of this and find different ways of doing it. It’s apparent when reading through the different perspectives and opinions that the users on our site post. These things are root of why men and women are so different and also the reason why opening up more communication between the two sexes will make it easier for both sides to understand each other. Great post tho!
De-lightedtobefree–
Hi.
Michelle’s guy is DEFINITELY a jerk, a coward, and someone who wants to be chased. But an abuser? On what facts do you base this opinion?
Also, for sure he wanted to meet up with the mutual friend–as long as Michelle wasn’t around. So he is 2-faced: he is one way when Michelle is around, and another way when she is not. Telltale signs of a player and a dishonorable “man”.
BTW, Michelle, you have very good guy friends. They are dead-on in their judgment. AND don’t blame (or get mad at) your friend for what happened. She actually helped you out, in proving that this guy is a coward, a jerk, a Loser, etc.
Also, I think he probably had an ex or two in the room, as well.
Bad that you went to the party (you showed too much interest). Good that you got some info./facts out of it, In any event, this guy is a jerk for leaving you hanging. Good guys don’t do that!
Maybe he called you to see if you were going to that party! To prep himself. All for selfish reasons.
Jerk.
Hi used…
The fact he was intimate with Michelle and didn’t call for 9 day’s is an act of passive aggression… passive aggression is an act of abuse… leaving some-one hanging, calling and not leaving a message, typical AC behaviour to gauge if you are the girl who will put up with shit and do the work in the relationship. This guy is obviously looking for someone to abuse and he is testing Michelle’s waters. CREEP!! Not communicating after closeness… ignoring after being intimate, being ambigious, vague, unavailable in proximity. Devalueing someone and then discarding them is not an act of care, honesty, or good behaviour. Gee whizz, I’d say the guy has been pretty abusive. Emotional abuse is the destroyer here. How’s your self esteem Michelle?? Cowards and jerks are nasty peices of work. They scare me.
How horrid to have him call her friend to hang out only if Michelle wasn’t there, Jaayysuus…Ouch! I think my self esteem would be pretty bruised (as in abused!!) If that aint a punch in the ole solar plexus.. what is!?? If it doesn’t feel good…what is it??
Of course I could be projecting and the guy is an honrable guy and just forgot to call after being intimate, felt embarrassed for not calling when he saw her at the party…OH BOY, the excuses I could make for this guy…cause I’ve been there and made them before. I prefer the other scenario..the realistic one, just so I can keep hold of some pride and sanity.
As I say…just been through this whoooole scenario.. I did not play his game, but watched as the game unfolded, as he tried every trick in the book to keep me as the ‘abused girl’, when he realized I was NOT playing his game it went right down the road to the new girlfriend and the crocodile tears at losing me. And he said through his tears ‘I’ve lost you’ and I said ‘yes, you have’, his reply ‘well you’ve lost me too’. the only thing I lost was someone who abused me.
Michelle, laugh my dear… you have been spared.
Used, am I wrong??? And if I am just projecting my fears onto Michlles scenario it is because I saw the red flags and walked through the rest of the story. The story ends in abuse!
xx to you both
De
Sorry didn’;t get to edit in time..excuse spelling
Thanks for all the responses.
Firstly, I was going to the party before he was, so I do not know how that is too much interest. And when at the party, I smiled and waved, I did not approach him or chase him. I have no idea why he was calling.
Secondly, in all fairness, he is not a player, he is a coward yes, and deeply immature and a jerk, but this is more inexperience than anything else, and being deeply self centered. He is not at a place in his life where he considers that his actions have ramifications.
My mutual friend said he only has dated women for a month or two, and my guess is that this might be why.
Michelle,
you sound like you are taking care of yourself and understand it’s his behaviour that is questionable and has little to do with you.. and thats the best news
NEXT!!
De
When he didn’t show up for general plans to meet up: “I didn’t think you’d actually be there.”
When he asked me out then stood me up: ‘Sorry about yesterday – can I make it up 2 u’ [via text message the next day]
When I called him out on his shennanigans: ‘You’re the one that’s hard to figure out! I’ve never had a girl play as hard to get as you!’
Final straw was after agreeing to ‘be straight’ (his actual words) with one another, three days later he is blowing off my calls & texts like old times. I am officially & totally done with him now. All contact is over. The only thing that sucks is that I have to drive by his house on a daily basis. Damn small town living.
Michelle–
So it sounds like you know as a fact that he knew you were going to this party. (Your image, to him, is better this way, than if you went because you knew he was there. That’s good, of course.)
How old is this guy? Is he in a business (like information technology) where he doesn’t interact with too many people? Sounds like one of those i.t. idiots who is trying to make up for lost time with women! (And/or a gay, or misogynistic, guy. Definitely a guy with issues as to women. Even if they may be minor, as in the case where he is just too immature.) Maybe he still lives at home with his mother–or just left mama!
Whether he wanted this to go further but only if you did all the work/chasing, or whether de did not want to go out with you again at all, this guy is an insensitive idiot. Who thinks everyone will let things roll.
You should not have smiled and waved. This guy deserves to be told off–to be told that he is an asshole and an idiot.
This is where the friend is not so much a friend. She should not even be talking to the guy, after the way he treated you! At least from now on, she shouldn’t!
De–
O.K, you win: there is an element of abuse here.
BUT he is also playing hard to get, too. If it were a woman doing this, a man would call her “hard to get”. (HOWEVER, a woman playing hard to get wouldn’t place a call and not make it/leave a message. Still, this is “feminine”/effeminate behavior this guy is displaying. Woman-influenced. Hence the mama’s boy analogy.) In any case, this guy’s actions/games spell “total turn-off”. Also, yes, a total bruise to a woman’s sense of self-worth. (There lies the abuse.) Better to have seen this early on, as you say!
Used,
It is my understanding that he did not know I would be at the party. He had not asked my friend before, and she had not told him, as far as I know. Besides, our last interaction was him calling and me not calling back, so I was ok from a reputation standpoint.
As to my friend, she knows he behaved like and ass, and I too have male friends who behave like asses, but I do not stop being friends with them. They have a long friendship, and I do not begrudge her that. I think she feels like he is stuck being 20, not the 28 year old man he actually is.
He works in banking on the research side, his friends are all single, and he is surrounded by men whose maturity level is really limited. He moves every year. That seems weird too, but my glass house is not so fantastic!
De,
I do not consider this guy an abuser. We have not been that intimate. Yes, we had been a little intimate, but only tops off etc. I do think he should have cut it off or disappeared completely (not a great option, but better than the fishing expedition).
He is clearly very immature, but he did not abuse me. He treated me with no consideration for consequences or feelings, and was a coward, but it was not abuse.
Besides, what goes around, comes around, and he is loosing out on very cool women with his behavior.
I love your strength Michelle!! Yes he will lose every cool girl with his behaviour and will no doubt get a reputation to go along with it if he doesn’t learn some manners
Sadly he may do more damage if he doesn’t learn how to end something he’s started, especially if he does this with someone who doesnt have the confidence and self esteem you have to see the signs.
De
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