I’ve talked about love many times on this blog and ultimately much of what ties us to someone who we’re in a poor relationship is believing that we love them and trying to convince them that they should love us and give us the relationship and validation that we want from them.
The trouble is, feeling that you want someone and love them doesn’t put them into a contractual obligation to love you back.
Your love doesn’t spread out and get projected onto them.
In essence, loving them doesn’t instigate an IOU – I love you so surely you must love me?
There is a consistent thread of us being caught up in illusions, denial, projection, and potential.
We conjure up this vision of the person which is sometimes based on brief behaviour that they have exhibited or is an out and out fantasy based on how you’d like him to be, or based entirely on what you believe to be the magnitude of your feelings literally clouding your vision.
We deny the reality of their behaviour and often the reality of our own, and opt for the illusion because it stops us from having to accept things and take action.
We project what we think, feel, and do onto them believing that in them being in this relationship that we believe ourselves to be in that they will think, feel, and do the same. We often base much of our expectations on this – If I had someone loving me and accepting me warts and all, I’d love the hell out of them and we do this because we’re trying to get them to make us feel good and validated.
We bet on potential believing that brief behaviour exhibited is indicative of what you could get in the future if you could only just get it out of him.
What this can all lead to is believing the hype of our own feelings and assuming that he sees what you have to offer in the way that you perceive it.
However, often with Mr Unavailable’s and assclowns, this is quite the opposite.
You think you’re showing him your love and giving him the whole kit and kaboodle; he thinks that you must be desperate.
Harsh, but unfortunately all too true. If you keep showing these guys the time of day after they have in more ways than one effectively shown their arses and let you know their true selves, they recognise on some level, that you must be desperate to still be pursuing them and declaring your love.
Classic examples are:
Cutting contact with them and then chasing them for contact.
Cutting contact with them, breaking contact with them when they make some miniscule effort to get in touch with you, for example by email or text, and then taking up the reins of contact and pursuing them even when they have stopped responding because they have already got confirmation that you’re still interested.
Trying to win him back when he’s left you for another woman and he’s still with her.
Trying to win him back when he’s cheated on you, you’ve broken up, and he has no interest in getting back together.
Being the other woman to the other woman.
Telling him that if you can’t have all of him, you’ll take what you can get.
Downgrading yourself from girlfriend to booty call.
Constantly trying to get him to see what you think that your relationship with him could be – He’s thinking “Can’t you see I’m not ‘getting’ it?”
This is just the tip of the iceberg but the saying “Whatever you’re selling, I’m not buying” springs to mind.
Bearing in mind that you often have some level of history with these guys, you’ve got to step into reality and instead of projecting what you think the meaning of things are and how he should see it, start looking at things contextually.
It’s the age old problem of us failing to see the wood for the trees.
You need to start asking yourself, “What, based on my previous experiences of dealing with him, will he interpret X as?”
Suddenly, you will become cautious about being reactive to sudden urges to pursue him or make contact, and you will also consider your actions and words in a bigger context.
“I love you unconditionally and with all my heart” to the same jumped up assclown that has been mucking you about says “I am crazy in love and you can trample all over me because I have no boundaries and very little self-respect”.
“I will be waiting for you when you’re ready” says “Go on with your bad self and screw and chase every woman you can because I’m going to put my life on hold and wait for you, whilst you live it up, in the hope that one day you will recognise my value and come back to me”
Operating from a place of negativity and desperation (even if you may not see it as that) often yields poor choices that impact negatively on you. If you feel desperate, you choose desperate men.
This is not you. Even if you’ve had moments like this, call it a moment of relationship insanity and get wise because you’re letting these guys steal your wind – you’re handing it to them on a plate and then turning around to show them the ‘kick me’ sign on your back.
No guy, especially an assclown or Mr Unavailable is worth you throwing in your self-respect and self-esteem towel so it’s time to pull your head out of the clouds, put your foot in reality, and start considering the bigger picture of your actions and what another interpretation of them may be so that you can cut the drama and ease your way out of the chaos of being with these men.
Your thoughts?
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@I want my brain back
“when I emailed asking what he wanted, he’d give me another reason why we broke upâ€
Sorry, but if he just contacts you to tell you yet again why you broke up, he is not acting like someone who cares about you. And besides, didn’t YOU break up with HIM? He has told you he does not want a serious relationship right now, and just shrugged when you said you were leaving if he didn’t treat you right, so he doesn’t sound like he cares a whole lot about having a relationship with you right now (sorry). You did the right thing by standing up for yourself and letting him know you need to be treated properly. Now you need to follow through on that by leaving him completely unless he can show you he is capable of giving you what YOU need. You deserve better than how he has treated you so far. It’s good you hung up on him when he drunk-dialled you.
“he didn’t want to get back together with me, he stressed, he just missed me.†It may not be you he misses, but the attention you used to give him. And who knows why he put the broken heart on Myspace – maybe trying to appeal to your caring nature so you come back to him and he can treat you poorly again? Sorry if I sound harsh – I may be feeling a little bitter towards these guys because of what has happened to me.
“how could he have pushed me to open up to him like that if he knew in his heart he wasn’t serious about me?†If he is a typical EUM/AC, he is unable to comprehend your feelings, and only has feelings for himself. This is one of the most important points I have learned from NML and others on this site who are helping me on my journey AWAY from my AC. He had selfish intentions when he pushed you to open up, and to have full-on sex with him, even when you told him you were not ready. You gave yourself to him, and he did not give back to you the love you want and need. Maybe you made a mistake in giving in to his pressure, but you can learn from that and react differently next time. Are you glad you are broken up now, or are you still hoping to get back together with him? From where I stand, it seems you are lucky to be away from him after 7 months instead of 6 years. Assuming he continues to treat you this same way for the next 5 and and a half years, is that something that would make you happy?
@I want my brain back
oh, and I agree with Butterfly that you may want to consider getting some support/counselling to help you work through the rape you experienced as a teenager, if you haven’t already.
@Dazedandconfused
” it’s like it’s constant work for these men to stay energized. Has anyone else noticed this? I saw a few of us on here say that our exes expressed feeling really tired or unable to deal with situations.”
Yes! I have noticed it !, My ex barely went out with friends, in fact he didn’t even have close friends?! He was USUALLY LAZY and BORED. I even started to think that it could even be some mental illness such as depression or something else that because they pretend to be strong and macho they won’t ask for help. These EUAC very well could have some deep issue that we are not aware of. They may need a lot of MEDS and Treatment to go through this. But again, we are not their psychologist. If a real MAN wants to change for his own good and the ones closed to him, he would make an effort to seek help or what about starting by Apologizing to the ones they hurt?
They seem to have an innate ability to find the weakness in people, and are ready to use these weaknesses to their own ends through deceit, manipulation, or intimidation, and gain pleasure from doing so.
TJ sounds like my Ex. Very true I am not surprised I was also looking into it months ago and it makes a lot of sense. Just a Not so normal person would behave like an AC.
eyeswideopen
“18 months into my relationship with AC I developed insomnia…why?Agonising over why he never returned my call,why he disappeared and then suddenly returned,what had I done to cause him to do this…you all know what I mean.When I asked him why he ignored texts,calls etc,he would get irritated and say “It’s not always about you!â€.”
A variation of that is: Why does it have to be all about you?!
This is what my AC said and is all about playing with your head, is sick!! I also was lossing my sleep and my mind thinking of the reason why he wouldn’t reply to my messages.
All I can say is I am happier now because my stress went from 100 to 0
TJ described my assclown to a tee plus add narcisissm and that is him exactly. OMG. I really feel for you I WANT MY BRAIN BACK. You trusted everything to him and he violated you with his uncaring, selfish asshole self. Like it was just his goal to have “sex” with you, then he got what he wanted, with no care or concern for your feelings. I can relate to that. I avoided having sex with my AC as long as possible because I was afraid that was all he wanted. He pursued me for 4 years and loved me, so I felt that he must be sincere and caring or me. I wish I had never slept with him. It seems like after we did (and we only did 3 times over 7 months), he really had no need for me anymore. All of a sudden every time I opening my mouth I became a nuisance to him. It was a horrible feeling. I felt so violated and used, and still do. I am having a hard time overcoming this whole ordeal. He made me feel so wanted and special, then we he took that away from me and cold turkey stopped talking to me, it made my self-esteem so much lower than it has ever been. It is daily struggle, plus adding that he is seeing OW (who is married) across the street from me, I have to watch her carrying him coffee to his chair in the garage. She visits him and stand and sits next to him, it just crushes my soul all over again.
I am going to work on not even looking down at his house or at OW’s house to see if they are together. I really believe that I would be much further healed if I didn’t have to see his sorry ass every day. Oh the tangled webs we weave…..
@Miserable
wow 4 years? I sometimes beat myself up for having waited only a month before being physical but your story confirms an AC is AC regardless of how long they wait. I was also pissed at his behaviour after the fact, but obviously will never let him know that, on the contrary I appear as if I got over and I dont really care. What else can I do? Showing an AC you are hurt will only make him feel superior and great. Showing that you are happier could possibly be worse to them. But again what do I know they are twisted up in their head.
I was just kind of wondering…I know, I need to stop – easier said than done! I am getting over my xeum – 3 weeks NC as of yesterday. Woo hoo! But I’m wondering, a lot of NMLs posts and in muatfbg, and the posts of readers on here describe the eum coming on very strong in the beginning and the fbg not really being interested but submitting over time. And that was definitely my situation with my xeum.
Well, my xeum was pursued heavily by an old friend of mine (I feel kind of betrayed yes) and they slept together immediately, and are still, as far as I know, sleeping together and hanging out, although he claims he doesn’t want a relationship with her – for whatever reason – fill in the blank – he’s not ready, I’m sure is his excuse. He doesn’t have a steady job right now. So, I’m just kind of wondering how an eum would react to being pursued by a woman. I am quite certain that she would want a relationship with him, but would probably settle for crumbs as she is seeing a married man, and other booty calls as well. I would just be SO disappointed and hurt if they got together. I know I need to let it go, and I AM. I’m just curious. What does everyone think, about an eum being pursued? Would they submit? And want a relationship with someone who steadily pursued a relationship with them?
He certainly didn’t with me! But with me, it would have been Long Distance (1.5 hours away) and he swore he would never do that again – so WHY did he pursue me? Ok. Done.
Thanks!
JanetPlane,
Cool twist on your Planet Jane name! Is the plane taking off from the EUM airport? Lol. Congrats on getting to 3 weeks NC. I think Fridays are weekly milestones for both of us, except I’m 2 weeks behind you.
Anyway, you asked about EUM’s response to being pursued, and I imagine most would enjoy that as they don’t have to put out much effort. I think that as long as the woman didn’t expect too much from him emotionally, and wanted sex as much as he did, then why not? Sounds like a great set-up for an EUM to me – zero effort for lots of ego massage and sex. But as long as she didn’t expect too much from him, as I said. Maybe your friend is willing to settle for crumbs as she has other partners on the go. She sounds a little confused herself. Maybe they are both confused/messed up and feel comfortable with each other (or deserve each other).
Most men seem to like the chase, and that may be why they usually come on strong, then back off if they are EU to maintain the “status quo†as NML says. My EUM had the same pattern as you – blew hot for 3 months, then slowed right down. But yeah, I can see an EUM liking the attention of being pursued, especially if the pursuer is close by (doesn’t have to drive 1.5 hours to see her like he would for you – too much effort). Just my 2 cents worth. Hang in there!
@ Miserable “I WANT MY BRAIN BACK. You trusted everything to him and he violated you with his uncaring, selfish asshole self. Like it was just his goal to have “sex†with you, then he got what he wanted, with no care or concern for your feelings. I can relate to that. I avoided having sex with my AC as long as possible because I was afraid that was all he wanted. He pursued me for 4 years and loved me, so I felt that he must be sincere and caring or me. I wish I had never slept with him. It seems like after we did (and we only did 3 times over 7 months), he really had no need for me anymore. All of a sudden every time I opening my mouth I became a nuisance to him. It was a horrible feeling. I felt so violated and used, and still do. I am having a hard time overcoming this whole ordeal.”
Wow I completely relate to this. In my case I too suspected he was only after sex and I knew him for a year…let me just say that even when you don’t give them sex they still display this disgusting behaviour. i so nearly ‘gave it up’ but somehow at the last moment backed off and said no, as there were so many red flags i can’t tell you…a live in partner who he’s ‘friends with’ they don’t have sex, he’s misunderstood, doesn’t have many close friends, doesn’t let many people in but ‘the few’ he does ‘let in’ are friends for life, can only show his emotins after ‘the closeness of the ‘ultimate connection’ i.e. sex etc etc the usual. Any way I got sucked in and trusted him with things I’ve never told even my best girlfriends. oh yes he was Mr kind and caring then, and knew how to draw stuff out of me…let’s just say it was not an equal relationship as he was in a position of trust. oh yes and did I mention he said he is only drawn to ‘damaged women so I can fix them’? Yes ladies, pick your mouths up off the floor he actually said those very words to me.
Fast forward a year, I’m reluctant to give him sex and at first it was ‘it’s ok we’ll be friends no matter what’.
Whether he got fed up of waiting for me to give it up or whether he realized I was unlikely to give it up (although I will say that I was VERY tempted to…I was completely emotionally involved and thought I had fallen in love with him…he got into my head and worked a complete number on me) I will never know. But he suddenly stopped talking to me just like that, out of the blue, no warning. It was just after got me to admit how I felt about him ‘you seem to love me, sometimes i think you do but I’m not sure’ he said. And when I told him I thought I did, bam out came Dr Jekyll (is he the evil one, lol? Well whoever the nasty one is…he came out).
In my shock I did all the wrong things as well: texting email, calling, all of it. Managed NC for 3 weeks when I saw how self destructive my behaviour had become, and then broke it, only to have him send a sarcastic text back…yes i too felt he was laughing at me.
So
@Katty Showing an AC you are hurt will only make him feel superior and great.
I can absolutely tell you that I have found this to be true. The behaviour of these people is baffling to me. It really is.
@ Lisa Normal, healthy men don’t leave a trail of sad women behind them. They break up with dignity and they respectfully stay away (which is what a true break up is…) AC’s always leave you wondering, and seldom give you a clean, healthy break.
This is the line that made me sit up and say ‘yep that is soooo true!’ that was the one thing that i asked of him, to explain why he had suddenly cut me off and he just came back with a string of sarky one liners, designed to cut me down ‘put me in my place’ but not answer my very simple and straightforward question.
It was the wondering which led to me breaking NC as I was after ‘clean and healthy’ which i know will never happen.
I must add that even though I did not sleep with this guy and am sooooo glad i didn’t, I still feel violated used and discarded. i invested a lot emotionally but he has been my epiphany ‘relationship which wasn’t quite a relationship’ and all he has done is catapulted me forward towards a happier future without him, he can stay in his sick mess if he so chooses.
I’m pretty sure everyone has done this. Usually once you’ve moved on you start kicking yourself at how pathetic you acted. Eventually the revelation comes and you realize that you’re throwing yourself at someone who isn’t worth the energy.
My assclown pressured me for sex after I told him I was not ready.,.similar past abuse etc…but he made me feel like there was something wrong with me for wanting to wait, for wanting to be sure etc.
Once I asked him what it was he found attractive about me and he listed 7 things, only 1 of which was about my character, the rest were mostly physical.
The creepy bit was he said he liked my ‘innocence and naivety’ and I said, ‘but that’s the very thing you want to take away from me, so if I let you what will happen to your attraction?’ And he pulled some rubbish about how it would be replaced with ‘knowledge’ and I would be ‘healed’ by letting him ‘have’ me! Creepy now that I think about it.
The day I nearly gave in to him I stopped it as I just could not relax, nothing felt right at all and when he finally realised I was not going to ‘let him in’ he got this sad look on his face and said ‘I can’t win. My partner won’t sleep with me and you won’t either!’ And he saw no problem with that statement.
I am gobsmacked writing this out that I’ve actually pined for this excuse for a man for 3 months! And feel gutted that because I broke NC last week he thinks he has me under control…missing him and wanting attention from him. It sucks that he doesn’t know that I now realise what an AC he is but never mind. The important thing is that I DO know.
“he got this sad look on his face and said ‘I can’t win. My partner won’t sleep with me and you won’t either!”
Boo hoo! Don’t y’all ladies just feel SOOO sorry for this guy?! I can’t tell you how many times my xeum pulled some b-sh*t guilt trip on me. They do it with everyone. Gets so tiresome.
Good for you Mel. Let him pull this crap on someone else…and feel sorry for that someone else, and glad you’re not them…anymore
mel
“Once I asked him what it was he found attractive about me and he listed 7 things, only 1 of which was about my character, the rest were mostly physical.” I can soooo relate to this, and actually it was the final straw that made me break up with my AC. He said I was “caring” and “patient” but the rest of the characteristics were physical. *Ugh*, so frustrating and degrading. Good for you for not giving in.
Janet Plane said: “Boo hoo! Don’t y’all ladies just feel SOOO sorry for this guy?! I can’t tell you how many times my xeum pulled some b-sh*t guilt trip on me. They do it with everyone. Gets so tiresome.”
I wish I knew this before I gave it up for my EUM –after we were flirting for only 2 weeks (but after knowing each other for a year). Mine made me feel sorry for him because his wife had been pushing him away for years. Janet Plane – thanks for making me smile about it at least. But, I noticed you didn’t respond to my last couple of messages to you. Are you not agreeing with what I’m writing?
@ Notmeanttobe
My man never said that to me about not deserving me (gee, I wish he had-that would have been a hint!) but what we ladies need to learn is that if someone says that to us, we should believe them-and run away from that person in the opposite direction as fast as you can. If they have acknowledged that they are not good enough for us (and they know themselves better than anyone, right?) we should take their word for it!
Got an email from my guy today-after I violated the NC rule on Monday. Thanks to caller ID, he knew it was me, and did not pick up the phone. Funny, but I was calling him to say stop stressing about what you do or don’t feel, I am going on with my life. I actually think it is kind of tacky to tell someone a relationship is over by email or text, but that seems to be the trend today. Anyway, since he didn’t call back, I resolved to go forward, and not convey any more messages-he will have to do what I did-figure it out on his own!. He says he was sorry for not taking the phone call-he is just not ready to talk to me yet. He is still working things out! Keeps referring to friendship. Now you need to know that this relationship was not some figment of my imagination-we were planning to be married, and I was going to move to where he lives-about 2000 miles from my home (I live in the US.) Then he decides he is not sure. Doubts, I can understand-I would guess everyone has them. What is not acceptable is this email/text message method of conveying something serious as this. As far as I am concerned, email and text messages are tools for UEMs. You had better believe I will make it clear that TMs and emails are not a substitute for genuine communication, and if that is the best you can do, keep moving. Not playing that game again, ever!!
I have not replied to the latest email (I was so tempted, but this time I was tempted to say “Keep it moving, dude.” However, after reading the articles written on this site, I think no response is the best response. Who cares what he thinks? There is no need for me to justify what I do or don’t feel to someone who really is not all that concerned about my feelings. He is telling me how hard it is for him, he doesn’t know how to deal with his emotions, blah, blah, blah. Ladies, this is a trap into which we often fall-trying to justify our rationale for making decisions to end a relationship. Not falling for that any more.
The thing is, I would have been understanding about last minute doubts, cold feet, etc However, if you are an adult, you should have the maturity so face someone and explain to the person who said you care about, that there is a problem, and be willing to try and work it out, together, as adults. The fact that he can’t is an indication of what my life would have been like, had I married that fool.
Now, this still hurts. I have no idea how long it will take to get past this. I still cry randomly (like now) but I will manage to get through this. In addition, I will do everything I can not to pass on this baggage to the next man with whom I enter a relationship.
My friends say I dodged a bullet, and that I should be glad I found this out before I got married. I know they are right, but still….it hurts.
@Penny
Oh my goodness, are you saying he broke your engagement by email? if so, how awful for you!!! How long since you two broke up? and how long were you NC before you called him on Monday? No wonder you are still hurt after he treated you like that – I hope you are taking very good care of yourself to help get over this difficult situation. You are right, he doesn’t deserve you (too bad he didn’t tell you straight out like you said). Hugs to you…
Notmeanttobe,
I’m sorry! Sometimes I lose track of the posts, or where I saw them…or where I posted for that matter…there are so many on here!
But I DO agree with what you said about eums being pursued by women. I am HOPING that is the case with my xeum and my friend.
It’s extra tough though for me, because the night my xeum and the old friend met, she and I spent the whole night talking and we talked for quite a while about him. I told her how I felt about him, and that I really cared for him and want a relationship – and she told me that I wasn’t being assertive enough. She ensured me that I was way too stand-offish with him and that I needed to let him know that I wanted to be with him, and then OF COURSE he would want me! Then, a few days later, SHE got his number and called HIM herself and they started…seeing each other, messing around, whatever they’re doing, and he started blowing very cold with me. I was devastated!
So not only did I lose my eum…but I’m left feeling that somehow it’s MY fault. But you know what, he was in and out on me for 2 years! I’m sorry if I didn’t rush to him, lay my heart on his door and beg for him to commit to me. We’d had plenty of conversations about how he didn’t want a LDR – and yet we seemed to be in a relationship anyway, so it felt good, until he found someone else! But every now and then I wonder if I could have done something more…and I wonder if it’s my eu that is coming into play. But I was so open with him in the beginning and got hurt when he first blew cold…I wasn’t too keen on trusting him after that, and always took it slow. Anyway, I have my little scenarios that I remember when I get to thinking I’m to blame, and they remind me why NC is the only way to go!
Thanks for responding notmeanttobe!
Planet Jane,
No problem re: losing track of posts – you’re right, there are so many! Which is good as I like to read them all.
So, I can’t see how your EUM bailing on you and going with your old friend is YOUR fault. He had 2 years with you, and I don’t think it should be necessary for you to beg for commitment! If he wasn’t so EU, the relationship would have grown, despite the distance (which isn’t that far, really – only 45 mins to meet in the middle). And your friend could have respected the fact that you have feelings for this guy, and maybe waited to get together with him. That must really suck to feel betrayed by both of them.
You are right, NC is the only way to go – for your xeum, and possibly your friend, too, if she has shown herself not to care for you???
Stay strong Planet Jane!!!
Thanks notmeanttobe, It hurt SO much to be betrayed by both of them. I really don’t understand why she felt the need…it is something I would never do, I mean, there are so many other people out there. But I guess everyone has different values. And in a small, but growing way, I’m glad it happened. It gave me a way out. He knows that I know about her. He called once (I didn’t answer), and I think he feels like too much of a sh*t to call again. And for the first time in two years, I get no dirty text jokes from him! It’s really a miracle.
And THANK you for confirming. HE had two years to have a real relationship with me, I told him I was willing to try, but he did not. He’s an eum, and there was never a chance. And I’m a recovering fbg/euf, and I have a chance in the future!
Love this site! It’s a lifesaver!!
“Mine made me feel sorry for him because his wife had been pushing him away for years.”
I guess it’s the classic, I can be better for him, I can love him better that NML talks about. And it’s also making his problem your problem. Any adult person, who is truly not happy in their relationship has the absolute freedom and maybe the responsibility to commit more fully and work on it, or LEAVE it, and not drag someone else in…or down with them. All adults need to be accountable for their own lives and relationships. And we need to expect and reinforce it in each other. Love it!
@ JanetPlane
So true! I said to the AC one day, after an afternoon of him going on about what a great guy he was to his partner but that she didn’t see the point in sex and could happily live without it etc. I said ‘but sex seems to be a massively important part of a relationship to you (he talked about it non stop) so it begs the question why are you still there? If you can only express yourself emotionally after sex and she isn’t giving you any, then where is the substance of your relationship? You are there because at the end of the day, it works for you on some level. So what level is it?’
And he got kinda embarrassed and didn’t really answer the question. This is a characteristic I’ve found. There were several points throughout the year ( I used to see him weekly, he was teaching me to drive) when I would ask him a direct question and you know what he would NEVER give me a straight answer but would always try and turn it back on me or point out a weakness of mine or say to me that all I’m doing is making excuses and trying to justify why I don’t want to move MY life forward.
His agenda all along was sex. But he would phrase it as ‘ I can see how lonley YOU are Mel, I can see how much pain YOU’VE experienced, it’s so obvious what YOU need. I have never met anyone so bound up who NEEDS to be released (via sex of course) than you.’ On and on and on, week in week out and the worst thing about it all was that cos he was teaching me driving I was paying to listen to this shite and seriously doubting my alarm bells along the way.
Maybe he was right. Was he right? No I don’t think he is right? Why is he asking me for sex when he has apartner whom he describes as his ‘best friend’? Etc etc. my mind and thought life went into overdrive as I’m processing all of this bombardment whilst trying to learn how to drive.
He used to say it was important to be able to drive and concentrate while under pressure, so he was helping me be a better driver.
It is really only now that I see how abusive his behaviour was/is, but at the time I thought it was my fault, because I was attracted and I liked the attention (except for the bits where he made me feel like a sex object).
@Notmeanttobe
Well, he did not exactly break the engagement by email, but he did say he wasn’t sure how much of a match we were (we have different political views-which we shared right from the beginning) and he was concerned how this would impact the relationship. He said he had to remain less than responsive until he “figured this stuff out.” What “stuff” I have no idea. I understand that marriage is a huge step (he has been married once before; I have never been married) and that both parties want to be 100% sure that this is what you both want, and that both of you are equally committed to the relationship. However, in my opinion, you do not build a relationship by not communicating directly with each other. Yes, I understand the need for men to have their “space” so initially I tried not to press-even though I was perfectly clear that IF the relationship were to continue (as far as I was concerned, any further marriage plans immediately were put on hold until we worked out the issue of communicating serious issues via email.) I also made it perfectly clear that after pulling a stunt like this, I was now going to have to take that same time and determine if he was going to be the husband for me. What bothered me about the situation was not so much that he needed additional time to contemplate the marriage (and yes, that did bother me-he was the one who asked me to marry him repeatedly; I kept asking for more time, and kept asking him if he were sure) but his reaction to his doubt. His reaction made me wonder if this is how he would handle problems in our marriage; and this problem solving method was really not acceptable to me.
This has been going on for almost 2 months now. My birthday was a few weeks ago, and he sent an e-card saying he was thinking about me and that we would talk soon. Also, this situation was really hard for him. (Cause isn’t this stuff always hard for them??) IMO, the birthday card was the type you would send to a friend, not someone you claimed to love and asked to be your wife.
Again, email and TMs just do not meet my standards of communication. We used these methods (or rather, I adopted my communication style to his) because we don’t live in the same time zone and we both travel for our jobs. Also, I am a day person, he is a night person, so email allowed us to communicate with each other, when it was convenient for both parties. I will never do that again.
In the latest email (which I have not answered-it has been only 24 hours, but hey, I am proud of myself for not responding) he talks about not wanting to offend me by referring to me as a friend. (Yes, I was offended when I got that card, in fact, now, I wish I had not opened the email) but we have a loving friendship, blah, blah, blah. He can’t express his emotions with me at this time. He says I might have lost confidence in men (or maybe just him-Duh!!) but again this “is really hard for him, too.” He says he “can’t be confident in own heart.”
This is not how you treat someone that you were planning to marry, but what I have learned from this is that just because we (as women) would behave in a certain way we can not expect men to behave in that same manner. IMO, very often, they simply do not have the emotional capacity to adequately express emotion. I gather from his messages that I am supposed to be understanding about his dilemma (understanding has left the building) while it is okay for him not to be understanding about the amount of pain this has caused.
When we got involved, we discussed his previous relationships; he said he outgrew his wife mentally, and just pulled away from her so they ended up divorced. (They got married very young.) He said he felt guilty about how he ended things with her, and years later, sent her a letter apologizing for how he treated her. That set off an alarm in my head, but I ignored it. Big mistake-never ignore your gut instinct. Prior to this man, when small things would come up in the beginning of a relationship (or even when first meeting a man) that I didn’t like, I would think they weren’t the person for me and keep going, with no hard feelings on my part. Then someone close to me (a man) told me that I dismissed men too easily, I wanted someone to meet some ideal standard. So, when this relationship began again (we knew each other years ago in school) I made a conscious effort to overlook some minor issues that normally I would have taken as a sign that this was not the person for me. Big mistake. Incorrect or not, I am going back to my prior philosophy of not ignoring little things, because they are an indicator of larger issues that will eventually arise.
Thank you for your support. I am glad for this site-even my girl friends (who have been tremendously supportive during this time) don’t know the whole story of this nightmare. Deep down, I know it will be eventually ok-and the pain will stop. Going to a book fair today that I don’t really want to go to, but being out of the house will force me to talk to people and not focus on this nightmare.
Thank you everyone for listening. Sorry, if I my post was too long, and I rambled.
@Planet jane
“He’s an eum, and there was never a chance. And I’m a recovering fbg/euf, and I have a chance in the future!†So true, and that’s the fantastic part – we know the score now, and we can recover and grow and become happy people. Your friend and the EUM may not be as fortunate at this point.
@Janet Plane
OK, I’m not sure if you are also PlanetJane, or someone else? Sorry, I get confused easily, lol! Anyway, you are so right about me believing I could “love him betterâ€. I really did think I could win him over and make him feel so loved that he couldn’t live without me. How foolish I really was – yes, his marriage is working on some level as he is still with her, as mel said. You wrote “Any adult person, who is truly not happy in their relationship has the absolute freedom and maybe the responsibility to commit more fully and work on it, or LEAVE it, and not drag someone else in…or down with them. All adults need to be accountable for their own lives and relationships. And we need to expect and reinforce it in each other.†Yes, yes, yes, you are soooo right – thank you.
@mel
My EUM told me he could only express his emotions physically – very similar to yours. Although, if mine was not having sex with his wife for years, I’m not sure how he expressed his love for her? Maybe through doing chores – he always said he had “domestic duties†on the weekends so couldn’t communicate with me much then. You said “It is really only now that I see how abusive his behaviour was/is, but at the time I thought it was my fault, because I was attracted and I liked the attention (except for the bits where he made me feel like a sex object).†YES – this is where I’m at now too – it was so disheartening to feel like his “plaything†at times, even though he denied it (no, a plaything wouldn’t know how to push the right buttons like you do – WTF????). We must save ourselves and our energy for those who value us for the complex, amazing whole people that we are!
@penny
“in my opinion, you do not build a relationship by not communicating directly with each other.†– I totally agree. Using email and text to discuss important issues is lazy and ineffective. Even IM is a problem, as things are difficult to interpret (my AC and I had arguments during IM’s, mostly because we misunderstood each other’s messages). You are so right that in any serious relationship (esp. Marriage) you need to have effective ways to solve problems as a couple.
Men may not have the same capacity to express emotion as women, but I think healthy, non-EU men can convey how they feel adequately at least. Your man “outgrew his wife mentally†– wow, that’s kind of pressure to stay intellectually stimulating for him! Did he outgrow her emotionally? I agree with your idea to keep paying attention to red flags – as they can never be considered “little thingsâ€. I think NML has a post with a list of EUM red flags on this website. I hope you had fun at the book fair – yes, it’s great to keep yourself occupied. Good for you that you didn’t respond to his latest email. Best of luck with the NC with your non-communicative ex-fiance. It really sounds like the only way to go with these EUMs!!! I am day 9 and counting…
i think i have been extremely lucky to have found this site after my recent breakup. every time i revisit it, there is a new post that is pretty much geared towards my exact feelings at that stage in the recovery process.
i have done NC, broke it, was strong, was weak, fought with him, slept with him, friendly emailed with him…. done it all when at the beginning i swore to myself “it’ll be different this time. i’ll do it right.”
now i’m in purgatory. in a couple of months i’m moving to an entirely different continent. we don’t see each other much, but when we do it’s on the weekends at parties with mutual friends. we inevitably get too drunk, and either reminisce, kiss, or fight. or all three.
just last weekend i was fooled by his “i’m going to miss you” and literal shedding of tears only to get the sh*t EUM treatment 10 minutes later when we are in a group of people. then comes the inevitable apology from me; professing how important and dear to me he is, and how i will always welcome him into my life. because i hate being on bad terms with people, and want to be the bigger person to resolve the dumb sh*t that just happened.
then i get a brief acknowledgement email that we have to stop fighting, and a “i don’t hate you or anything.”
and then we’re back to limbo again. occasional half-assed IMs and/or texts and not actively making plans to hang out even though he had overhung this whole post-relationship mess months ago with the “you are my best friend. i hope we can still hang out.”
where am i now? confused. i’m reading the self-help books. i’m reading this site. i’m talking to friends. i’m making new ones. all i can gather is that i am self-hating individual who needs to work on her self-esteem and escape this man who i have been so convinced that i love. knowing that i am full of problems with perception of self and of others isn’t giving me the hope that i will change, nor the inspiration to try to. i just feel damaged.
i wish i could be in his place, really. to be an emotionally unavailable person like him. “not obligated to act a certain role” as he put it once. “avoiding relationship politics.” i’d avoid disappointment. i’d avoid getting shit on, and could run and chase whoever i wanted with no consequence. i’d be free, and happier.
starbuck
I could have written your words, because I feel the exact same way you do. I am in a state of limbo, a gray area. I have tried and failed NC a few times, I cannot stay away from this man. I am so sad, depressed, devastated. I have semi good days, but mostly dyas filled with anxiety and sadness. I hate it, but I can’t stop it. I to, have read the books, this site, and other, talked until I’m tired of hearing myself talk…I don’t know what else to do and where to turn. My biggest issue is we work together, and I can be strong and look happy and smile, but inside as soon as I see him I fall apart. He is still flirting with me and I allow it, still making plans with me. He even showed up here last week to tell me he loved me, what a amazing women I am and was willing to get rid of the harem of female “friends” if I WOULD stop running hot and cold?? How crazy is that? I have tried to be friends, because when we are together, we have such great times. But I cannot do this anymore. I want more and I can’t have it with him. We broke up in March, but have been in daily contact since. He gets so upset when I tell him I can’t do this. I am at a loss. I have tried my hardest to do NC and the longest I was able to go for was 4 days. Then at work, I couldn’t stand it and I went and searched him out to talk. I do listen to what everyone tells me and I think I understand what I need to do, it’s the actual doing it that I can’t come to grips with!!
Devasted,
You do understand what you need to do, but it will probably just happen in your own time when you are ready.
I know I tried no contact several times (and broke it) before I found this site, and then it became more clear that I really needed to believe that “no contact” really means no contact.
If you work with the guy, but he isn’t in your department where you have to plan and hang with him all the time, maybe you can find a way to just stay away.
I had to work a few times in the music business with the guy I was trying to stay away from, and I actually (after finding this site) called the two main contractors, told them the truth about the guy and myself, and asked that I never be placed on a gig near or with the man ever again….
I have a few less gigs because of it, but I still have work, and both of the male contractors were very sympathetic and nice to me and apologetic that men are asses sometimes
.
Every situation is different, but if you’re to the point where you know you need to try and stick with “no contact” then you need to find every means to make it work and regain your composure and your normal sanity and centered calmness.
I’m not sure if I read your story here, but if you’re to the point where you’re trying to maintain a no contact situation, then things must be pretty bad and you are ready for a clean break and a new road.
If the guy doesn’t have both feet in the relationship or have your best interest at heart, he isn’t worth contacting. (In my opinion)
Wish you the best with this.
starbuck: your description of being in “purgatory” is something I totally felt when I was in the first couple of months of no contact with my ex EUM. I wrote many times on here describing how I felt. It’s interesting to see that I was not alone in feeling those emotions.
For me – I was fortunate to have him leave my company. We don’t have any common or mutual friends and we don’t attend the same industry events any longer. For a while I would go to the industry events that I had a feeling he would be at. I made the decision to cut that part of my job (networking to a certain propsect base). It wasn’t an essential part of my job and I realized I was holding onto it to hold onto him.
Is there any way you can avoid the social events that he might be at? If so, I would do that for a few months and go to other social events. It’s worth it. It really helps in getting you out of purgatory.
You’ll begin to feel better about yourself the longer you go without contact. You can totally do it. I was hung up on my ex EUM for about three years. It is so great to have him out of my life. Looking back – I know what a pall he cast over my life and my emotions.
Good luck – stay strong!
@starbuck – I have a different perspective for you
“now i’m in purgatory. in a couple of months i’m moving to an entirely different continent.”
Yeah. You are going to a different place. You’ll start making new associations, the song that made you think of him will remind you of something you saw that was unusual to you and made you laugh. Your mind will adapt, making new neural connections and associations.
You will do something new and shiny for you so … NC!! Please please please please PLEASE don’t do what I did, make the break, go somewhere new and then fall for his bullshit again. I wish I’d seen this site before I relocated, because of course then his behaviour and clownery followed me to my shiny new life and tainted it. I was therefore alone in a new land not speaking the language yet, dealing with homesickness and all this crap.
It passes. If you would like someone to talk to about the experiences of expatriation let me know, I have an email address I can list here (if allowed) which is absolutely disposable to me and anonymous where I can give you my actual contact details (or perhaps NML would co-ordinate that?).
K have a theory, it’s kind of scientific and I just wanted to post it cause of course I know we are alwya’s looking for way’s to ‘justify’ the pain and hurt. Well this thought helped me get a bit of objectivity. It is based of scientific fact.
Humans when they fall in love hold onto this feeling for aproximately three – five years..this is so the love hormones in our body work toward procreation. After the child is born, they hang around (th elove hormones) till the child is 3 to 5, this is the time when the child needs both parents to be there to give it the nurturing it needs to see it through life. Well I was thinking most of when we get hard will this love bug ususlly take around three years to go through the motions before we have had enough, it could be these hormones have made the connection to the guy and wants to carry through to the promise of procreation. All this grief could also be our hormones changing and leaving out body cause it knows it ain’t gonna happen, that he isn’t the one!. Or if it does for all those women who have had children and then had to watch the fathers leave, even more pain.
Just a thought to get my mind off him and back onto me
@ Butterfly,
thanks so much for your response… actually to everyone who responded. i appreciate your offer on the wisedom of expatriation… thing is, i’m already an ex-patriot.
we both came here overseas (from separate countries of our own) about a year ago to teach english. we met at a teacher’s conference.
now that the 1 year contract is nearly up, i’m going home for a couple of months then off travelling again with friends. he’s also going to continue travelling and “doing his own thing.” we have not made plans to travel together, though he continuously maintains how much he wants to show me his hometown one day.
it’s stuff like that which makes it hard to completely let go. when i first tried NC, he hounded me down through email, text, IM and in person numerous times. since we are in a foreign country and met when we both arrived, we have the same group of friends, often go to the same places on the weekend, etc.
i’ve been affected by the fact that he cried in front of me a couple times since i always assumed men just didn’t do that…. but then i guess i have to think of the amount of times he made me cry and try to compare the two.
i’ve just two months left here. i’m hoping once i leave it will be easier not to contact each other as often, and have it change into somekind of “long distance friendship” through the occasional IM every few months.
it sounds like crap in a way, but it sounds way crappier just to delete him again and NC right now. we’re going to run into each other again. we both vowed to stop fighting. if i delete him, it’s just going to paint me as dramatic and cause problems, which is not what i want.
he has intonated things to make me seem like one of the most important people in his life, and so have his friends on occasion. and yet for every great tender moment, every rare instance of opening up from him, i have also dealt with loads of instances in which i am *not* a priority, i’m an option, i’m an ego stroke, and so on and so on.
it’s a mess, and i feel i have run out of options except to “ride it out” as one of his friends suggested to me.
butterfly, i know what you mean and i thank you for your advice. i can’t completely rely on a new environment to wash my hands clean of him. but i hope it will help. i don’t have the strength to do NC when i know we only have 2 months left of being in the same place in the whole world, at the same time.
going home will probably feel like going back in time, which may be distracting… might make this seem like a dream. at least at that point, decreasing contact will be easier, and get easier with time when it is physically impossible to see each other.
i know this isn’t convincing anyone, but i don’t know what else i have the strength to do.
Devastated…I understand how hard the no contact is.I am(was) on day 13,the longest yet.I also would do the NC for 2 days and he would be looking for me!Moaning because I was ignoring him.However this time,I just cant look back.The final straw for me was him saying to my face he would be back to find me if his new love did not work out.That was my “epiphany moment”.I say was 13 days-he texted me last night to thank me for something and I replied(my pleaser personality!!)but I will not give up-it didn’t make me happy or anything to hear from him.Just confirmed Im on the right track.And I am proud of myself.
Maybe you need to think of the most awful thing he has done to give you a bucket of ice water over your head to finally stop feeling sorry for yourself.I must admit,albeit a few days only,the perspective I am getting from NC is mind blowing.
But I understand…….xx
Eyes wide open
You said “I understand how hard the no contact is”. Well, at first I didn’t find it too bad. I am on day 10, and haven’t contacted my EUM at all. He did send an email around day 4, but I didn’t reply. My problem is this: I am so used to checking for emails from him, and looking to see if he is online, and even though I know in my head he is not good for me, will never make me happy, I keep looking for emails even though I know it would be so hard for me to maintain NC if he sent me one. And, even though I have blocked him on MSN, I can see when he’s online, and I still have an obsession with knowing if he’s online or not – almost like it’s comforting just seeing he’s online, even though I have no intentions of sending him an IM! I have changed his name to AC on MSN, but I don’t want to delete him completely as he is my brother’s supervisor at work, and I don’t want any bad blood to affect my brother. My EUM was really offended when I deleted him as a friend on Facebook back in December when I first tried NC on my own (didn’t last long).
Does anyone else have these issues in the first couple of weeks of NC? I am also having trouble getting motivated to do anything besides the basics like housework, laundry. I haven’t even done my income tax return, which was due the end of April! I am trying not to think about him, but it’s hard, and I have to keep coming to this site to read all the posts to avoid contacting him.
Why am I experiencing these things when I *know* he is an AC, I *know* he’s not good for me, I *know* I have put off doing important things while I was involved with him, and I have decided on NC so I can get away from this unhealthy relationship? I have re-read my list of “bad things” about my AC to help confirm in my mind that he is indeed an EUM and not good for me. Can anyone else relate to this or have advice?
Thanks
Eyes wide open, don’t beat yourself up for these behaviours you are coming of a very strong drug, bit by bit. Like stopping smoking, the urge is there but you have to fight it, you know it’s toxic and that’s why you have very bavely given it up! but the residue is still lingering, he’s in your DNA, it will take time for all of this to filter through, just keep working on it, it is very hard work but it’s the most important work you can do for yourself! maybe try to monitor how many times you are reaching for the cookie jar (so to speak) we all know too many cookies give you diabetes, one look a day, till you can manage one look every two day’s, bit by bit my dear. don’t stress yourself, it’s very normal!
peace
starbuck, sounds like we have a lot in common! I was meant to be “having an advenure” for a year or two before going to him as far as he was concerned (or at least what he was saying when blowing hot again) and noises were made about “one day”. “One day” is not good enough, shit or get off the pot!
I still would be happy to get in touch if you want since we have things outside EUM stuff which we could share anecdotes about if you like
The small “gene pool” in a foreign place really doesn’t help, and I am already very cautious about getting into a similar situation here. Helps that nearly all the men at work are gay … lol. I still think a new location will help … I hope so anyway x
@ de-lightedtobefree
Thank you for your response (you wrote it to Eyes wide open, but it answered my question, so I think you meant it for me?) You are right – this NC is like quitting smoking! I smoked my last cigarette 10 years ago, and I remember obsessing about lighting up back then, even dreaming about smoking! I will try to cut back on times I look for him online, check for emails, etc – you suggested once per day, but right now I check more than 10 times per day, so I think I’ll have to cut back from there. He IS toxic, I need to get him OUT of my DNA (love that analogy) and if all of you can do this, I can too!
Thanks for helping me to realize this is normal behaviour. Much appreciated!
not meant to be… I check my phone 100 times a day to see if there is something there from him.I don’t want to hear from him,but I do…I know all the theory.He is a typical AC-textbook case.Almost everything on this site sums his behaviour up.But my heart has just not caught up with my head.Because despite the fact that he did not care about or love me,I spent most of mt time and energy the past few years invested in making HIM happy-now there is a vacuum which I need to somehow fill.
I understand about not being motivated to do anything.I am almost paralysed.I have absolutely no interest in any of the things I used to be interested in.If I could hide in a little corner all day I would.I have moments when the pain in my stomach is so severe,and then I hate that I allowed someone like that to have that sort of power over me.And for a while I get strong,pull myself together and get strength through reading this site.And I try not to think past more than one day at a time.To think too far ahead is too painful.And I know that no matter how painful it is now,I WILL NOT look back and ever let him into my life.After his text yesterday I was in such turmoil,the insomnia was back.And I thought to myself..this is exactly how it would be if we ever even established a friendship.I just can’t do that to myself again.
So hang in there,and know that there are many of us in the same boat.NC,as so many posters have said is agony in the beginning,but it’s the only way to go long term!!
de-lighted to be free-thanks for the encouragement.Yes,he was something I was addicted to.I was addicted to the drama of the whole relationship.And I guess I am going “cold turkey”!
eyes wide open,
they are like a drug. I feel EXACTLY the same was you do. I have no motivation to do anything. But sitting around here all day is worse. I have decided that I am going to have to do this myself and for myself, or I will never get on with living my life, as I’m sure he has. Do this for yourself. We broke up in March and haved stayed in constant contact since. This is the hardest thing I have ever had to do. When I start feeling sad, I log on here and start reading. Ittakes my mind off of him and sometimes I even get a laugh out of reading what some people have to say. I am struggling very hard, but this is my life now. I need to take control. I am going to try very hard to stay away from him and avoid him at work at all costs. I am not calling or texting him at all starting today. I have no expectations any more, as I have learned that it is a fantasy of mine that he will come crawling back a changed man. Not going to happen! I journal…alot! It helps. I have written him a million letters, never sent any. I do understand that this is going to take time and be hard, but I was a strong confident women before he came along and I will get that back. There is someone good in this world for all of us…we just need to open up and see that. These men are not what dreams are made of. They are our worst nightmares! Stay strong, do little things each day to improve how you feel. I am so glad that I found this site and for all those who have offered advice…THANKS!
I am so in awe of all of you who are maintaining NC when
A) the ACs concerned are still calling/texting you and
B) you have to see them because of work etc
This isn’t the case for me, but I still find it hard. I started a long email to him just this morning which I ended up just printing off and putting in my journal. I didn’t send it, what’s the point? I still feel completely used by him, and all this despite me not sleeping with him.
I find it hard when I have to drive round the roads we used to go on when I was learning, and even when parking all I hear in my head is the ACs voice in my head making suggestive comments while I steer! It never goes away. It’s like he gets in the car with me every time I do, and we both have the same cars as well, same make and colour (I had mine since before I passed, and part of the reason I stuck with him so long was because we had the same car.)
It’s almost like my competence as a person, skill as a driver, attractiveness as a woman and worth is all tied up in the opinion of this complete shite of a man who was prepared to keep me as a weekly sh*g behind his partner’s back supposedly ‘for my good’. Like he was doing me this huge favour. And because I wouldn’t play ball his way it’s like he’s invited me round to play, waited for me to go round and opened the door for the express purpose of slamming it in my face again.
The logical me sees all of it for what it is. He’s a manipulative user. He only ‘cared’ when it worked for him, when it looked like he might be able convince me to sleep with him. When he tried everything he knew and still I wasn’t giving it up, he couldn’t just walk and wish me well, he had to dig the knife in and twist it first.
So all I’m left with is a knowledge of how angry he is with me because I was unable to give him what he wanted. I do realise that he would have been an assclown to me anyway and that I have dodged a bullet here but it still hurts. I think the hurt is proportional to the heart investment.
And I think I am still invested, not so much in him, but the shock of how long I let him disrespect me, my values, my boundaries before I said ‘enough now’. And I didn’t even say it in the end. He did. And I should have enough dignity to step over him and never look back because he was never even my friend, and could never be.
But I still want him to want me, because the sweet and funny charming person he first presented himself to be…that’s who I still can’t quite believe doesn’t really exist. This callous and cold individual who has presented so much overwhelming evidence to me that ‘this is who I really am’ and I still can’t quite bring myself to accept this as true, although I am getting better and trying to put out of my head what he thinks.
I did 3 weeks NC, broke it and have begun again, it’s 8 days now.
Sorry for the long post, I needed to get this out. It feels like I went to the fair, paid my money for what I thought was going to be an amazing prize and all it is is a cheap bit of tat. The stall owner has disappeared and It’s slowly dawning on me that I’ve been conned and won’t be getting a refund.
Thanks everyone, if not for this site, I would have contacted him today. Thanks so much.
@notmeanttobe on MSN they can’t see if you have deleted them, it’s not like Facebook. He is blocked so he can’t see you are there – delete him too
It REALLY helps after a while … are you sure you really believe it might cause bad blood? I can say from my experience that in the past I wanted to be sure I could see him.
Another gem from the little darling was complaining that I was not around and that it was “easier” when I was. Easier on whom? Not on me, in the middle of the night!
I said that I had been on MSN but he was never there – I know he was online from subsequent bull about this (possibly fictional) woman he had never told me about from 15 years ago who he’d never really lost feelings for and who had contacted him out of the blue (again, bull, or even if she DID then he was scenting fresh Narcissistic Supply). So he was on chatting to her … I had already limited contactability and visibility for him to MSN in order to free associations in other places from him. Know what he said?
“Well, there’s only you and one other person on MSN so I don’t open it”.
Nuff said.
@Eyes wide open – you check your phone 100 times per day – thank you for telling me that, as I actually check for messages from him *way* more than the 10 times per day I wrote about, but felt ashamed to admit it! I think I am like you, and my heart has not caught up with my head, and I know what you mean about that vacuum – that’s why I have been on this site so much in the last couple of weeks! I will do as you suggested and get through one day at a time – you’re right, we shouldn’t let them have this power over us. I hope you are able to get a better sleep tonight.
@devasted – all the best to you as you re-start NC at work. I can’t imagine what that would be like. I agree, they go back to living their lives while we are agonizing over them – ugh!
@mel – “And I think I am still invested, not so much in him, but the shock of how long I let him disrespect me, my values, my boundaries before I said ‘enough now’.†I can fully relate to this. Hey, what year is your car? Maybe time to get a new (completely different) one? Good for you for getting right back on NC – 8 days is a good start! (I am on day 10).
@Butterfly – thanks for the heads-up about MSN. I have never deleted anyone as a contact before, so didn’t know they couldn’t tell. But yes, I think he would be really ticked off if he knew I deleted him. I still don’t feel quite ready to do that – maybe after another week or two, but I’ll still use the “block†function! So did your EUM block you on MSN then, while he was chatting to the OW? Or was he online, and you could see him but he couldn’t see you? I didn’t quite get that part.
Thanks again everyone!! I am going to force myself to do some housework now, instead of obsessing about *him*
hi not meant to be
My car was a gift to me for my birthday. I’ve only had it 8 months. It was as a result of one of those ‘so if you had your own car what would you drive’ conversations and i was like ‘oh I love driving my instructor’s car it’s sooo nice to drive etc’ and so that was the car I was given as a present which at the time was so lovely (and the thought still is) but now kinda feels a bit weird. The colour thing was total fluke, but again, it’s the memory of him that has tainted what would otherwise be an amazing gift. I feel I’ll have to let a decent amount of time go by before I trade her in, so as not to offend the givers!
And I love driving and having my license feels amazing but I feel like he has forever tainted the experience for me and it hurts all teh more because he knew how much it meant to me to get my licence (long story but I had not been well before and had been unable to drive for a long time for medical reasons).
I know it will get better. Just venting really. Thanks for listening and to everyone for offering advice.
“I have no expectations any more, as I have learned that it is a fantasy of mine that he will come crawling back a changed man.”
Oh lord sister, time after time I have wished, hoped and prayed for this very thing, and a few times it has actually happened (or so I thought) – but as expected it did not last long before he was subtly emotionally abusing me so that I would comply with his needs and be afraid to ever leave him. I STILL, after fully accepting that this man is INCAPABLE of giving me, or any woman for that matter, the basic requirements for a mutually supportive and caring relationship, have some fantasy that triggers when my mind shuts off or gets lazy that he will, at the very least, come crawling back, realizing what a gem I am. It is such a deeply satisfying fantasy, maybe it is helpful in healing and building my feelings of worth – as that is one of the functions of fantasy. Maybe I’ll choose to believe that he is pining over me this very moment, what a good person I am, how stupid he is and how much he misses me! Because the motha should be!
But he knows what a sh*t he’s been and therefore can’t make contact, and knows that I wouldn’t answer his f*ing call or text anyway! I don’t know what he’s doing (NC), might as well decide that he’s doing something that benefits me. Cuz whatever I choose to believe, that’s reality. One of these days, whether it’s in 5 minutes or 5 years, that guy will look back and wonder, and wish you were still around. Cuz honey, when it comes down to it, YOU left HIM! You did!
Planet Jane
The hard thing now for me is that last Thursday night he showed up at my home to talk. He explained that I was the most phenominal women he had ever met, he loved me and that he was willing to let go of all the women “friends” that he has. That I was way too good for him, that he didn’t deserve me, and that he had nothing to offer me (all of which are 100% true). I wanted to hear those words from him for so long, and the funny thing is, I wasn’t sure I caould believe any of it. While he was even crying at one point because I accidentially sent him an email about him that was supposed to go to someone else. he said he never knew that I felt that way about him, and that the raw emotion was unreal…of course it was it was meant for someone else. I want to believe him more then anything, but I need to ignore it all, and get on with my life. I don’t think that a few kind words could be enough to erase all the hurt, tears, lies and mis trust over the past 5 months since we broke up. I loved this man with everything I had in me. Did nothing to wrong him and he chose to walk away to “do him” for awhile. Whatever! I did feel a little validated, but it seems that its just not enough. Actions do speak louder then words. You are right because I do think that he will look back someday and realize what he left. I will guarantee, he will NEVER find another women as amazing as me who was willing to put up with his bullsh**.
@notmeanttobe: I have no idea. I personally doubt that there was another woman in the classic sense, I don’t trust him an inch – he is a classic narcissist of the somatic variety and there have been so many other issues at the time that who the hell knows – more than likely it was NOT at the same time as me due to time zones. I’m finding myself disinclined to talk about him much here really (what a great feeling) – I’ve said before about him, he owns 14 guitars and can’t play a whole song. So girls, if you are involved with an ugly guy (I am admitting he is!!!) with a great sense of humour but terrible boundary issues and 14 guitars RUN!!!!!!
LOL
@devastated – time for some tough love here for your last sentence. I went through this stage too, heavily. Truth is that he might well find someone as amazing as you and you know what? He’ll do the same to them. He’ll turn them from a beautiful giving loving equal into someone desperate even for the crumbs. “Actions speak louder than words” is the very phrase of my last text to him which I wished I had not sent because I felt guilty that I was “being horrible” … heed your own words and remember that the sun does not revolve around this man – he is delusional and thinks that it does and YOU have had a lucky escape even if it hurts like hell now. x
butterfly
yes, you are correct. but I like to think that I am too good for him. My last text to him was pretty much the same as yours. I ended it with time for me to let go. I feel so hurt and I ache inside, but honestly, the one thing I have learned to do in the past few days is when I feel like sitting and just thinking about us…I hurry up and think of a terrible time or a time that he made me cry….this helps. I do admit that my word revolved around him and I ignored everyone and everything else. I have slowly begun the process of getting MY life back. He is very delusional with a huge ego. I’m sure my not talking to him will not effect him, but I sure hope in some small way it does.
It’s still investment sweetheart, but that too will pass. I am left wishing I’d said explicitly that anything from him would be deleted unread, then I’d not be wondering what he said in those two mails which were deleted as per the mail rule I set up but left a trace in the spam filter. What if they were the magic words, what if he had come to his senses?
They would have been smoke and mirrors, flimflam or something else designed to keep me sweet and docile. Well I am not docile, never was, and it bothers me that it BOTHERS me, but compared to the past this is nada
Mel, Not Meant to Be, Butterfly, Eyes Wide Open – all of you:
Reading your posts is like me writing how I feel. The purgatory statement really hits it!!! All I could think is that my soul was destroyed, shattered into a million pieces. I am 6 months NC! My friends are proud of me and I can’t believe I actually have made it. But, I did it for the sake of my shattered self esteem and dignity. My AC did send me two lame texts after he was horrible to me (see above), but they were so uncaring, unapologetic, etc., I was insulted, and didn’t even respond to him. Now, I know he is mad at ME!!!!! And probably a bit surprised that I didn’t come crawling trying to get him back again… I have had serious issues and problems that have resulted from my AC breakup: I was and sometimes still am a walking zombie, the day can go by and I have done laundry or some menial tasks, but was unable to pay bills, work, or do anything else. This has gone on for pretty much the whole 6 months. I lost weight, didn’t eat, didn’t sleep, cried all the time, stared out my window watching my AC walk to OW’s house or see if OW was walking to his house (since my AC lives two doors down and I have to see him on a daily basis which is ungodly torture no one should have to endure), crying, obsessing, checking his daughter’s myspace page for any info, trying to check his cell phone bill online to see who he was texting, hiding my car around the street to see if I could catch him with OW, following OW to see if she was meeting my AC, etc. I lost a major work contract because I couldn’t concentrate to do my work. I don ‘t even know who I am anymore. I am totally opposite of this person I have become. I have a higher education, am a professional, had average self-esteem, outgoing, didn’t take people’s shit, funny, sensible, etc. I am trying to get ME back right now. So, yes, it is “normal” to paralyzed and incapacitated. My story is a bit complicated, and is posted in full on other blogs and some up above, but I feel I was completely violated, devastated, destroyed, and it is hard to believe that someone else felt paralyzed and like they were in purgatory. I felt so alone and still feel a sense of hopelessness. After the first month, my best friend (who has been my literal life line), helped me decide to get on an anti-depressant, which I am still unsure if it is really working, but it did help me stop crying all the time….
To MEL: I feel that our situations were VERY similar, because your posts sound like what I have been going through. Somehow everything I was was tied up in the asshole’s opinion of ME or his response to me and my request to be treated and valued like I deserved. Thank GOD you didn’t give him what he wanted, you would have to live with that too and for me, that is the most unbearable thing to live with because I trusted him and he took everything that is sacred to me. My AC was all about him, his needs, his desires, his moods period. If he was having a bad day or a problem, he would literally “cut off communication with me” when he felt like for weeks at a time, no explanation, no care for my feelings and needs, nothing. The fake person I fell in love with is not the REAL person, same as your case. And unfortunately that is what is so hard to accept, because we KNOW they are IN THERE. But that is not who they really are. They are not left with the aftermath of destruction, we are. And I have been hoping and praying that he would contact me and tell me he still wanted ME, because I thought that only HE could restore the dignity I felt he took away from me. DO NOT CONTACT HIM. HE IS A TERRIBLE VILE PERSON TOO.
NOT MEANT TO BE: I really feel for you too. I wish I had only been paralyzed for the first couple weeks and not months. I truly believe that like it was said wonderfully, it is part of your DNA. I loved this man, he was the air that I breathed. I fully believe that if I didn’t have to see him every day, and with his new OW, I would be worlds better. I too believe that he is incapable of loving me, OW, or anyone else but himself. Any human that can treat someone else so terribly and sleep well at night is the devil himself.
Oh and by the way, this assclown only wanted to have a relationship by text. He saw me in person for a few times but only in small time increments, plans never materialized, promises were never kept. He was hard to communicate with any way and throw in that I had to do it by text, no calls, in person communications, etc., really killed us. I griped about the lack of in person contact, but he always had an excuse. I told him we can’t build a relationship by texting. I realize now that I was just a fun supplement to his life in progress. I am the one that was left in the wake and he never looked back, leaving me unable to look forward. I am getting better day by day thanks to this site and good friends. My “habit” should I say has been keeping tabs on his house, if he is home, sitting outside, if OW is home, if she is down at his house, etc. And I am tired of being the one watching his life keep going like he doesn’t have a care in the world, so thanks to all the great advice, I am trying to stop myself from looking period. He has seen me almost every day for the last 6 months and he has still not felt “the need, the guilt, or the desire” to contact me (which has been completely devastating to me), if even to offer an apology for his behavior towards to me the last time we talked. It is time to stop hoping.
Miserable love, I certainly know where you are coming from…you are going through pure grief, it’s as if someone so dear to you has died and you have to watch their ghost walking through your life..you can’t and are not allowed to touch them, they don’t see you. My heart goes out to you. There is an old ritual, not sure where it comes from (I like to visual stuff to help me move things around). It sais something like…hang you ghost of your past on a nail above your door, as a remembrance of the a part of your life that was and see the lessons in them that you take into the future. I think it’s time for you to try to see the lessons this man has given you. you like so many of us have abandonment issues, this is very deep father stuff. Are you seeing a therapist?? Don’t for one second be hard on yourself, you need love and caring from yourself to help you get to the next level. I’m glad to hear you say it’s time to give up the hope. This man does not deserve your hope he is garbage, and yes he is the evil one. Stay clear, heal and get strong. Feel sorry for this ow, she is either the same make as him (no emotions) or she will be living in her own private hell soon.
take care
Miserable Love de-lightedtobefree Butterfly, Eyes Wide Open et al
I can relate to the grief process. I too for 6 weeks could barely function beyond the basics. I lost work as well as I could not concentrate and could not make new calls to market myself to new clients. I was so down on myself I lost all confidence. I’ve only just started to catch up now to be honest.
The father stuff. Yes you are spot on with that. The big part of my attraction to the AC was formed listening to him TALK about how much he adored his daughter, and about what an amazing guy he was to his partner. How he was there for her and relieved her stress etc etc.
when he spoke about his daughter i used to tear up because I had not had that closeness and feeling of safety in my relationship with my father. So I was attracted to that I guess. Maybe I wanted him to fix the damage my father had inflicted on me, at some level.
You know what,I can’t believe that for 3 years most of our relationship was also through emails and later just texts.And that I accepted that as “normal”.When we did get together it was great,but we lived so far from each other.Whenever it took effort for him to see me,often it didn’t happen.He would say he never liked “to committ himself too far in advance” to his plans (RED FLAG..missed by me) or account for his whereabouts.What interests me is how the OW will fit in here?Will she not ever ask him where he is/was etc(even out of interest)because she won’t want to upset him,or maybe she won’t care,or now that she has her grip firmly on him,will she be checking up on him constantly,and how will he respond to that…?
One day I found out purely by accident(a few months after the event) he had been in my area and hadn’t let me know.When I asked him about this,he blew a fuse,going on that I was trying to control him,he doesn’t have to account to me where he is etc etc.I was so shocked at his reaction,I of course did the only thing I knew how to do…apologise for my behaviour(I’m cringing as I write this!!).Of course,my punishment was a lengthy silence from him.
The texting relationship really puts the AC in control,and reduces us to jibbering idiots.Like many of you,I am a competent professional,respected by my colleagues and “normal” friends.Yet he managed to stamp on me and make me doubt myself..and all because I gave him the power to do it.
When he initially told me about the OW and her being the one he is going to marry,it was through text.When I tried to call him to talk,he rejected my call,and sent me a text saying we would talk sometime,but he felt uncomfortable,so let’s just talk though texts till another time.We did talk eventually,but the final “goodbye for good” was through text.Not even email where atleast a bit more could be said..
It’s good to write this and read what I’ve written.Just empowers me a bit more to realise that I’m now on a path of no return-how could I look back now?And I don’t want to.
@ eyesewideopen
yikes!!! all of that sounds so familiar with my EUM! jesus crackers…how many of this type of guy are out there? :S
i know what you mean about cringing when looking back too… i actually kept a couple of IM chats when we were going out… still under the delusions at the time, i marked them to myself as “little reminders” of what i guess i suspected was d-bag behaviour but i didn’t want to acknowledge…… NOW i read them and go “whoa whoa whoa, what the!? arghhh look at me jibber on there! ughhhhhh LAME”
it’s absolutely maddening to be caught in the simultaneity of knowing how much of a waste-of-space a$$ somebody is, and also still being emotionally obsessed/devoted/submitted to that same person.
just maddening!!
though…. i shudder to think where i would be if i didn’t have that knowingness that space, objectivity and this website have given me…..
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