When people tell me stories that are basically the equivalent of heavyweight dramas, I realise that many of us mistake “suffering” in our relationships for “love”. We think that it’s ‘normal’ to have to forcefeed someone our affections, to campaign like a telemarketer battling objection after objection, to feel like we’re being ‘abandoned’ even if we haven’t been an actual child for a very long time, to see the potential in someone who we believe doesn’t ‘know’ how they feel or has ‘difficulty’ showing it, and to accept what can come down to quite frankly very assholic or at the very least neglectful behaviour in our lives.
Now there will be times in a relationship where you’ll experience conflict, where each of you may feel hurt due to something the other has done and where you basically have to work harder at your commitment to one another, but this isn’t the same as being in regular, ongoing pain. In a mutual relationship, you’ll come together to weather the rough seas and you’re not going to have to shut down your feelings and suppress your identity to anaesthetise you so that you can remain in the relationship.
I’ve got no problem exchanging a cross word with a partner but I do have a problem in being treated in a manner that’s basically the equivalent of slow torture with me writhing in pain and them throwing salt on it, and maybe even jabbing me with a stick periodically to see if I’m still going.
Pain is not love; it’s pain.
When you mix up the two and think you’re suffering in your crusade for love and that only ‘real’, ‘passionate’ love is painful and hard to come by, it’s important to realise that there are many people who would pass on putting themselves through this kind of pain and opt for ‘loving love’ instead.
There are times in my life where I’ve experienced an intolerable level of pain. So intolerable that my health plummeted. The more that I hurt, the harder I fought for the relationship because I thought that there would be a tipping point and I’d go from being in some sort of personal hell to skipping through meadows. I wanted this person who I’d banked what little self-esteem I had on to come through, because the alternative was being left to pick up the pieces. I felt so dejected and rejected so of course when I garnered their limited attentions and affections, it was like that six months starving in the desert – the crumb now looked like a golden loaf.
Really, if you don’t regard and treat you well, it won’t take much to impress you.
Any ‘ole person can come along and put on their emperor’s new clothes and give you superficial affection during an intense period laden with promises, and it will feel like all of your Christmases have come together in one go.
Much of the pain stems from fear and drama and we mistake our feelings of fear and sometimes seeking or creating drama, as ‘love’, and this is because we have poor relationship habits honed over an extended period of time, likely from childhood. Some of these very painful relationships feel like ‘home’ which is why standing on the spot, jumping through hoops, feeling like nothing is good enough and being wounded by criticism or withdrawal of affection may have a powerful draw for you. You’ll want to right the wrongs of the past and if you can win them over, you believe that it will correct or cancel out whatever happened with a parent or previous partner, even though it won’t.
We convince ourselves that love is what lies on the other side of approval and the drama and pain comes with all of the trying to get it from the reluctant or defunct sources who will make use of your need for approval.
The pain of this pursuit seems more valuable, than say, a person who matches their actions and words and wants to treat you with love, care, trust, and respect. You’ll probably feel suspicious of that. What? No pain? What’s the catch? you wonder.
What you learn though as you become aware of your relationship habits and harness your pattern is that if you don’t address your self-esteem and your beliefs about love and relationships, your perception of what love encompasses becomes very destructive.
It becomes the acceptance of crumbs.
- You convince yourself that you’re in what you deserve and that if it wasn’t what you deserved, you wouldn’t be in it in the first place or you could leave, as if you have no power or options.
- You believe that the magnitude of pain that you experience is in direct correlation to the amount of love you have, hence the more pain you feel, the more in love you believe yourself to be.
- You convince yourself that you’re not good enough to expect or get more and that a better relationship will elude you.
- You believe that because you have such poor experiences and that time is passing that you must ‘settle’.
- You become obsessed with getting attention from these ‘special’ people and aren’t concerned with the quality of attention so you end up with drama, either sought out or thrown in your direction. Not all attention is created equal!
- You become codependent. The very person who is on one hand the very source of your pain also appears to be the sole source of your happiness. You can’t seem to function without them and you believe it’s because of your love when in actual fact it’s because of fear.
- You think that familiar ‘butterfly’ feeling that you get around these people is excitement and passion when in actual fact, when you have a habit of being with the same poor partners, it’s familiar fear.
- You expend so much mental energy thinking about him/her, what you think they feel and do, what you think you do and feel, the coulda, woulda, shoulda’s and betting on potential that you lose sight of the reality of them and become obsessed and infatuated with an illusion.
Many of the dysfunctional things that happen in poor relationships are easy to bag and tag as ‘love’ and ‘passion’ but it’s important to remember that reality becomes distorted in poor relationships because it’s far harder to stick around when your feet are in reality – people in poor relationships often end up on a whole other planet from their partners!
If you don’t reconcile who you think you love with the reality of who they are and the relationship you have, you’ll fail to process those feelings of drama and fear for what they are – fear and drama – and as long as you are doing this, you will continue to fall into a cycle of poor relationships that result in similar experiences.
Fear and drama make you dependent on surrounding yourselves in experiences and factors that make it more comfortable for you to believe that this is how things are.
Fear causes inaction and we end up being comfortable with the pattern of the very uncomfortable, because it seems far more uncomfortable to make positive changes that will not only make us accountable for our own happiness (or misery), but will throw the spotlight on where we are expending our emotional energy and reveal some uncomfortable truths.
At the end of the day, only you know your experience but if you have been involved with the type of person who yields poor experiences on a habitual basis, there will be many familiar things about what you’re experiencing and that’s a sign in itself that not only is something very wrong, but you’re actually gravitating to patterns that you can recreate over and over again, and that’s not love when it ends up causing you so much pain, fear, and drama.
The litmus test of all this, is if you develop a healthier relationship with you, which will result in healthier beliefs about love and relationships, will you still want this person? Will you still love him/her? Or, will you finally realise that you haven’t experienced mutual, nourishing, love yet and have in fact been mistaking pain for love?
If loving this person means that you can’t love you, it’s not worth it. Always choose you.
Your thoughts?
About the Author:
Natalie Lue is the founder and writer of Baggage Reclaim and author of the books Mr Unavailable and the Fallback Girl, The Dreamer and the Fantasy Relationship and more. Learn more about her here and you can also follow her on Facebook and Twitter - @baggagereclaim .
Natalie (NML) – who has written 1082 posts on Baggage Reclaim by Natalie Lue.
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Thanks all for your strong words. I do and will have to see this dude many times a week due to our jobs, teaching in one similar area. Those times when he chooses to sit next to or when he asked me why I was so down were all public settings where I cannot tell him to eff off. Folks at work already know there’s something radically wrong; they just don’t know what the problem is. I look haggard, tired, and really sad. I still put in 150% on the job, help other colleagues, and am well regarded by students and most colleagues. Part of the issue is that outside of work I am 100% alone all the time. Theres no family ties to fall back on and most local older women friends have left or turned out to be toxic and had to be let go. Most of the few progressives here are 20-25 years younger than I and they are busy doing the family thing. I really want to be married again to someone like my ex whom I was very attracted to and we shared many values as to lifestyle, personal commitment to the envirinment and social justice and had a great intellectual relationship as well. I do well alone in many ways, probably far more self sufficient than most men but yeah, I don’t want to spend the rest of my life alone or have to “settle” for someone I really do not want which some colleagues think I ought to do. Most of us single women in our college system are in much the same boat; very sucessful, intelligent, caring in a region where the men are basically ski bums, old druggies, marginally employed by choice and often anti education. Welcome to the wild west. This is why AC has gotten away with his actions for so long. If there were actual healthy choices out there, most of us would have avoided him like a disease. Yep, I have been reading everything I can get my hands on about NPD, it does explain why I really feel almost traumatized by the situation and felt soo unwanted, ugly, a fu@#$% up misfit even though many have told me I am beautiful. There may also be an element of racism here based on some things he said about affirmative action. Most of the time if a relationship does not work out, I have no problem walking if not running away. This is weird, different. I will be talking to a counselor come January, dealing with dying dad was kind of a pricey adventure and I will be eating ramen noodles for a while. I am grateful that he probably did say something negative about me to his current victim as she is no longer wanting to get together. Talk about being in the middle of something. I will not risk financial ruin due to this guy but if a really good offer comes in for the house Im outta here. I will not engage him because you all are probably right, he would enjoy knowing how much hurt he has caused. I also, while accepting full blame for responding to his advances must also understand that he is very very good at what he does and has been getting away with this sort of behavior here for over 15 years even while he was married. Thanks for your tough love, eh?
Thanks all for your strong words. I do and will have to see this dude many times a week due to our jobs. Those times when he chooses to sit next to or when he asked me why I was so down were all public settings where I cannot tell him to eff off. Folks at work already know there’s something radically wrong; they just don’t know what the problem is. I look haggard, tired, and really sad. I still put in 150% on the job, help other colleagues, and am well regarded by students and most colleagues. Part of the issue is that outside of work I am 100% alone all the time. Theres no family ties to fall back on and most local older women friends have left. The few progressives here are 20-25 years younger than I and they are busy doing the family thing. I really want to be married again to someone like my ex whom I was very attracted to and we shared many values as to lifestyle, personal commitment to the envirinment and social justice and had a great intellectual relationship. I do well alone in many ways, far more self sufficient than most men but yeah, I don’t want to spend the rest of my life alone or have to “settle” for someone I really do not want which some colleagues think I ought to do. Most of us single women in our college system are in much the same boat; very sucessful, intelligent, caring in a region where the men are basically ski bums.Welcome to the wild west. This is why AC has gotten away with his actions for so long. If there were actual healthy choices out there, most of us would have avoided him like a disease. Yep, I have been reading everything I can get my hands on about NPD, it does explain why I really feel traumatized by the situation an unwanted, ugly, a fu@#$% up misfit though many have told me I am beautiful. There may also be an element of racism here based on things he said about affirmative action. Usually if a relationship does not work out, I have no problem walking if not running away. This is weird, different. I will be talking to a counselor come January, dealing with dying dad was kind of a pricey adventure. I am grateful that he probably did say something negative about me to his current victim as she is no longer wanting to get together. Talk about being in the middle of something. I will not risk financial ruin due to this guy but if a really good offer comes in for the house Im outta here. I will not engage him because you all are probably right, he would enjoy knowing how much hurt he has caused. I also, while accepting full blame for responding to his advances must also understand that he is very very good at what he does and has been getting away with this sort of behavior here for over 15 years even while he was married. Thanks for your tough love, eh?
Miskwa and BR friends,
I see my ex once a week. NC has been the challenge of my life. For a year now I realize I have kidded myself, I’d say to myself I was NC because I would only answer one word to his weekly validations, (“you look good”..thanks,”how’ve you been?”…fine
etc). I realized I was grieving for a
year, when I thought after 6 months I was near “acceptance and release” I now
know I had just spent that time in denial and bargaining. I spend so much mental energy thinking about the day I see him. What will I wear that day, will I be able to maintain no eye contact, will I successfully avoid, ignore him. And I continued to analyze
our Noncontact from our weekly noncontact contact. Exhausting! I now get Nat’s point, NC is something you do for you, to move on, you’re not making any statement to him, you are making it to yourself. And here’s the kicker, No Contact is a MENTAL state.
As Griz pointed out so eloquently, he
can be sitting on your lap, you can gaze in his eyes, say “hi ex-Narc how’s life with you? read any good books lately?” and be in total No Contact. No contact is in the heart.
I had been in a many yeared relationship with him in my youth. I broke it off because as I kindly told him, “I can’t take it any more”. No contact then was a piece of cake (ok it took 6 months of living in another country and have no contact for 6 months before seeing him and breaking it off permanently.) Over the years I looked back on all my old beaus and have positive thoughts about all that didn’t work out. But I always thought of him and referred to him as “The agony and the ecstasy” relationship.
I’d have dreams about him through the years. I would wake up and wonder if he was still alive, if we’d ever cross paths again. And then one day I went to this place and there he was. I thought, wonder how his adult life has been, how has his love life been over the years etc. I thought about him in a friendly dispassionate indifferent way, I thought, what did I ever see in him? I was crazy in my youth. I thought perhaps we could be friends.
Nope. You’d think I was 22 again. Chatted him up one night and felt a visceral response to him. Broke no contact after 32 years! NEVER recontact. As Nat says, the relationship was broken, it wasn’t meant to be. Well, I won’t sit on his lap
again thanks to BR. But I still struggle with getting back to No Contact. The mental state that is. I may see him once a week until death we do part.
Hi Everyone,
Lately these posts from Natalie and responses from the newly awakened have somewhat shaken me out of my stupor. I thought yesterday that if our ACs had put out an ad on who they really were, we’d never have come near them. So, what I’m trying to do is focus on the facts that my AC so kindly revealed and use them as reasons to escape. My AC was a friend who was turning into more and then when I reciprocated, he turned into hurtfully way less- leaving me dazed and confused. So, allow me to share the ad my AC would have written about himself if he had half a brain and an ounce of self-awareness…
Superficial, Coward, Mind-Game Player Seeking Kind, Understanding Gullible Girl
If you’re looking for a one-of-a-kind relationship that will leave you breathless, your mind spinning, your heart aching, look no further. I can offer you all this and more- I’ll share just enough about me to get you hooked and I’ll get you to reveal who you are so you feel that I care. I’ll find unique little ways to intrigue you, I’ll show you I can be funny, clever, upstanding, sexy, a real catch. There’s no way you can’t be attracted to the gift that I am. Then when you are, I’ll have to pull away. I’ll be sullen. I’ll distance myself. I’ll be hurtful. I’ll abruptly stop whatever intimacy we’ve developed- so, remember those long introspective email dialogues, well, you’ll soon discover they become one-sided and you’ll be talking to yourself because I won’t even respond when I see that you are hurting. I’ll avoid you. I won’t call you. I won’t make myself available any more because what I needed from you I got. I won’t even wish you a Merry Christmas, even though I labeled myself your good friend and I supposedly understand the real reason for the season; I just don’t live it. My gift to you is that I can be the best mind-game partner you’ve ever had. At the end of our interaction, you’ll feel like there must have been something wrong with you; your self-esteem will be eroded; you won’t be able to get me out of your system, even though I’ve been the cause of all this turmoil you never suspected; you’ll be a mess and you won’t know why since I’m really the kind of “catch” that should have been thrown back. So, whadaya say? If you’re interested, give me a call and for a while I’ll respond
“Love”,AC
Absolutely BRILLIANT!!! I may print this out and post it in the local paper with his name and phone number! JK…thought I’d momentarily indulge a revenge fantasy. Hee hee.
Actually LPB I really will do that! Ok, no I won’t but wouldn’t it be HILARIOUS!!! I don’t think I would stop laughing for a month.
Wonderful! Truth in advertising. And like they really do place ads, they take on ALL respondents. ALL of ‘em, at once. But we’re not supposed to realise that.
Amen WildFlower.
539
SbW.
What you told Miskwa was absolutely spot on. I did not say all that but I certainly agree and would have. I got thrown off because in my first response I had not realized she was having all this communication with him, but you read it all and did not miss a beat.
Miskwa? Do you feel you owe him something? YOU DON’T. You owe it to yourself to be free of him. He’s a leech so it’ll take maximum effort. And, puleeze DO NOT give him the sob story about how much he has hurt you. HE DOES NOT CARE. If he did, he’d leave you alone.
I don’t think my problem in the past was mistaking pain for love…directly, at least. My father was physically and verbally abusive while my mother made every excuse in the world for him and, basically, blamed me for his abusiveness, even though I was the child and he was the adult.
Yet, the night before my father’s major surgery, my car broke down on the freeway. I immediately called my parents and my dad immediately came to my aid in the middle of the night while being expected at the hospital around 6:00 AM. Thus, I had (sometimes still do) have no discriminatory sense as I grew up with both extremes in the same person. My problem hasn’t been trying to control or change someone. My problem has been the opposite–being too accepting of someone (Didn’t Natalie write a post about this not that long ago??). Thus, I indirectly associated pain with love in that I was raised to accept the bad with the good. Nobody’s perfect, right? Isn’t “real love” supposed to be unconditional?
Through therapy and boundary-work I’ve become more discriminatory. In fact, I’ve come to see that treating anyone as an “object of use” is abusive behavior. Whether someone’s trying to use me for sex, a physical punching bag, a verbal and/or spiritual punching bag, a therapist’s armchair, or whatever, I’m being abused because I’m being viewed and treated as less than, as different from, what I am–a living being, a unique part of magnificent creation. It doesn’t matter that this person has “good points” (Yes! That was the post that Natalie wrote!). If I’m being abused, this person needs to go. I’m not an “object of use.
Hi Natalie and all,i haven’t posted in a while.I still would visit the site and read and I felt happy as I had met someone who was not displaying code red behaviour. However the first 3 months, there was a background of anxiety, we met with online dating. He was quick (4 weeks in) to asking for an exclusive relationship with me, then a week later, clarified he wanted to me to be his GF. I felt he was charming (maybe too much), sexy and we got on but he was psychologically very clever, even early on. Very in tune to how people’s minds work and knowing how to use that. I knew it had been sometime since I had felt attracted to someone and although a part of me felt it was too soon to commit, I said yes. I was worried when I saw he continued to log on to the website we met on daily. I would check externally. I have been cheated on in the past and I know my guard was up and I thought it was a bad sign. I told myself I would give him a few weeks and if he was still doing it, i’d bring it up. I know I don’t trust easily at all, like many; been let down, suspected I’ve been cheated on, met EU men before. He was different. Well I brought it up and he agreed to to delete his account but denied he had contacted girls or been on dates. He made sure he saw my account had not been used since we agreed we were in a relationship but he refused to let me look at his. I dropped it as he agreed to delete. Then I had a niggle. I remember him saying he was on another website, so I decided to check and made a fake account using an email add I only used for online dating in the last few years(yes this may seem a step too far) and indeed I found him there, and it said he was active within 24 hours. I checked daily for a week and he was on it very often so I decided to bring it up as we were now 2 months in and whilst we were seeing more of each other and I was falling for him, i had these anxieties in the background that he was not that serious about me and might still be meeting girls whilst I had really started to like him and would not consider meeting anyone as I had committed. My flatmate said, bring it up and say she had seen him online, so I did and he said he just had not got round to deleting the account but really had no time/ interest in meeting anyone and it was no big deal. I decided to give him the benefit of the doubt. I told myself I would not check again. My older sister is very protective and was suspicious and said she would check for me as she thought it would be silly not to and I needed to know if he could be trusted. I was so relieved when she said a month later, she could not find his profile there. By 3 months, he started acting more consistent and in short, we fell in love. In months 4-5,i really had few doubts although at times he was a bit controlling. We went away on holiday, met each others parents (first time I have introduced anyone), and i lost my virginity to him (he knew I only wanted to do this if i was in love and with one person only). We had one argument and his reaction scared me as i didn’t do something the way he liked and even though I apologised he went cold and harsh. In the last few months, I forgot about my old email add and the profiles. Then last week out of the blue, I was cooking and was using his phone for timer. Without thinking, I walked off with his phone and he was ‘where are you going with my phone’. I said for timing and he followed me and took it from me. The next thing I know he turns in to ‘i think you still have an online profile somewhere’ and i suddenly felt guilty remembering the ones i didnt delete even if they werent used so I said maybe (as i had joined some sites a while ago but no details in order just to browse) but nothing identifiable to me. He got angry as he said I had made a big deal of his in the start of our relationship. I said he was right but i did not use it and could not remember the password, had not used in months. Then one thing led to another and he demanded I show him my dating email account. I panicked thinking how bad it would look if saw emails from the website which he was on. I thought i am going to to look so bad and wish I had deleted everything ages ago after my doubt had gone. I had not actually used any dating sites to speak to or meet anyone since I was committed to him. I lied as I was scared of me as i couldnt bear to show him as he would see the fake account on the email. In the end I ended up confessing and he looked and saw the emails (a bunch of unread match emails) and he threw me out of his flat. I was hysterical, saying how sorry I was but it was not how it looked. I couldn’t believe what had happened. He said i was a liar and could not be trusted. I have since explained how i panicked, my sister can verify i was not using, and he said he loves me but has been extremely harsh, now treating me badly even though I have apologised. My friends thnk I made a mistake but his reaction is so harsh. This is so painful and i don’t know how much of his punishment I can take….
Hi Maya, not only do we have the same name – my story is just like yours. I left my NPD EUM 4 years go, and even after all this time, he is still a recurring nightmare. But I’m hoping one day, I’ll be truly rid of him. I know I’ll get there somehow.
Hang in there, and get out quick.
There were red flags from the beginnig. Please stop feeeling guilty for everything that happens (he manipulated you into feeling guilty, although he was the one who had been spending time at those online dating sites). IT’S NOT YOUR DUTY TO GIVE ANYONE ACCESS TO YOUR PRIVATE STUFF! You were acting like a child caught doing some naughty stuff. He’s not your father, you don’t have to explain yourself to him. In this case, your email – if someone does ask for it, tell him to back off, and leave.
He removed his ACTIVE online dating profiles only after you caught him. He exhibited some controlling behavior, and he generally behaves like an ass. What a gem, unique, one of his shitty kind.
On the other side, you just fail to notice your own gut: you didn’t believe him from the start (and it was not only in your imagination, he did something that made you very uncomfortable). You cannot be in a healthy relationship if you don’t trust someone (and he sure doesn’t seem like a trustworthy person). You’re overrationalizing and overthinking it: you didn’t feel good in that relationship, and that’s all you need to know (no, honey, formal stuff, like meeting his parents, going on a vacation together etc. isn’t something that will fill the actual void of not having genuine intimacy with that person).
I don’t know your relationship history, but since you’re on BR, I assume you have a history of being involved with jackasses, like we all do. Please do understand that this guy is one of those jackasses too. It has been only 4 months, cut the loses, it will hurt a bit, but you will be fine, trust me.
Take the two following sentences as my yelling: YOU DON’T DESERVE TO BE PUNISHED, FOR GOD’S SAKE!!! THIS KIND OF BEHAVIOR IS EXTREMELY PATHOLOGICAL! Compare this shitty pattern of behavior with your parents’ behavior. Did they punish you often, did you feel you deserved to be punished? And do yourself a favor and distance from those people who you consider friends, and who obviously don’t support you.
I agree with Titi!
This guys is bad news! He has shown you he is not trustworthy!
The fact that he was still active after you you were exclusive is a big problem. Hon, I think you should of bailed after you found that he was still active online, the first time. Huge red flag!
This man has shown you who he is: lier, manipulative, controlling and untrustworthy. It is time for you to see this, and save yourself a future of deceit and mistrust.
Time to take care of you, and get away from this creep! Don’t waste another precious 4 months of your life!
maya, this guy is a manipulating AC. i want to bet that he actually still has online profiles still on the go. what he is giving you is PAIN. this isn’t love. i’m sorry this happened to you.
you don’t need to take his punishment. EVER. block him from everything, go NC and give yourself time to heal.
Maya he sounds like a narcissist (google it) This is absolute projection. You are lucky to have escaped this man. Please whatever you do, do not go back for more abuse. He will be counting on the fact that you are in what Nat calls The justifying zone, because you lost your virginity to him. He will be waiting for your tearful apologies and he will suck you back in and be even MORE CRUEL than before. Please run screaming from this horrible man. Trust in your gut feelings. He is not who you thought he was. Flush, and move on. It sounds like you have a good support network so rely on them and stay NC from him.
Maya you say you walked off with his phone? I’m thinking he had some texts or emails he didn’t want you to see and it escalated into this argument where you end up being the ‘guilty’ one. These other people are right, he was bad news from the beginning. I know it’s difficult but please see him for what he is and stop blaming yourself, you shouldn’t have had to be sneakily investigating him. And your suspicions were correct, he was still online. Your only mistake was staying with him after you discovered this.
Hey Maya,
Be glad he is gone. This guy sounds seriously dangerous. I don’t think what you did was that bad; yes, it revealed a lack of trust on your part, but I think most people would have done the same thing if they knew their partner was on a dating website. As women, most of us are quick to blame ourselves when a relationship ends, no matter *what* the reason. Here, this guy is exploiting that natural predilection to make you feel even worse. I suspect he will probably want to get back together with you, but *do* not take him back, as you will be in a very dangerous relationship, where you know if you make any mistakes, there will be this sort of heavy-handed retribution. I consider this sort of extreme severity a serious red flag.
Allison he is 31 and I’m convinced he lives with a woman although he says he doesn’t. He continues to call and text me everyday 2 or call and come around 1 or 2 a week.I need all the prayer I can get to go thru with no contact.
Lacy,
It’s a bad situation, which will only get worse.
You know there is no future with this man, as it sounds like he has nothing to offer in any area of his life. He is a loser!
The thing that allowed me to go NC, was to to examine what I was getting from my ex. When I was honest with myself, and recognized it was mainly drama and pain, I knew I had to move on. I had to be honest with myself. There was no future!
It’s time to remove yourself from this cycle of drama, and cut this guy loose. The payoff is tremendous, and will positively impact all areas of your life.
It’s up to you! There was life before this man!
Tinkerbell
I don’t feel I owe him jack @#$%. If anything he owes me, a huge apology. Apart from avoiding making a scene during a meeting trying to get away from him, I avoid him entirely including a complete ban on entering the building he works in. The one time he showed up at my house this fall, it was unannounced, I was completely floored. I understand, he doesn’t give a flying for me and may well be glad if he knew seeing/talking to him ruins the rest of my day. I was something to use for attention.
Nat, if you don’t get yourself a talk show so I can get healed at least 5 times a week! This very topic has been on my mind nonstop for the past 5 days when not 1, but 2 men have entered my romantic life: one, an EUM who disappeared without warning last January and the other, a co-worker who suddenly decided after a year of knowing each other that I had passed his many tests and I was worthy of attention. Red flags from both from Day 1. I had already suffered pain with one; weeks of wondering what I had said and/or done to make him leave me. The other had already let me know his standards in the woman he wanted to date, showing me the mountain of self-doubt in front of me that I would have to climb. After days of thinking and after reading this, I’ve made my decision: the sexy, exciting rogue who stole my heart and dumped me or the successful, mature older man who so wants to help me fix myself? And the winner is: me, Tina. The smart, sometime goofy girl that’s Getting Better. Thanks, Nat.
Maya
You don,t trust each other and without trust there can be no relationship. He is manipulative and controlling. you have been lying and playing games. This is not retrievable. It,s also not a long relationship. I think it best to walk away and not subject yourself to any more drama.
My boyfriend has a lot of female friends. At first I was uncomfortable with it and he would, of his own accord and not because of me, refer to them as “they” rather than “she”. My baggage is a playa ex, his a jealous ex (she would get mad about him playing music with women in the church band ) Now, though, I don,t mind his female friends and he refers to them freely. We grew to trust each other. We were open and honest. We didnt sneak about, gossip or insult each other.
Every relationship has etuff that need overcoming and always will. How you overcome that as a couple says more about the relationship,s survivabilty than sex, drama and pain. You don,t have a viable relationship. It,s not down to your mistake or his mistake particularly. It all sounds like a big screw up which you don,t need.
@Tinkerbell, @Allison, @Grizelda, @tired :
Thank you for reading my story and for your comments. It helps enormously to hear from people who have been through a similar thing and actually UNDERSTAND what it is like.
You are SO right – he is just not that special and this guy IS NOT MY FRIEND! Unfortunately I have been involved in this for so long that it is incredibly difficult to change my thought patterns and of always putting him first.
I am now 9 days into NC and I am doing ok – better than I would be if I had not found this site and if I had not received your support. I know that if I can get through the Christmas holidays and maintain NC, I think I will be over the worst. I have already returned the gift that I had bought him for Christmas and I have deleted all texts, emails, instant messages. I have made a point of accepting every invitation from friends to socialize and to make sure that I am not alone and moping because that is when I find myself tempted to break NC.
What is bugging me the most right now is why do I care so much what he thinks of me? Why does it matter so much whether or not he misses me? It really kills me and I hate that I still feel I need this validation and I am confused as to why this is so important to me.
Maya,
You walked off with his phone…..and that made him accuse YOU of having online accounts??? WTF? Sounds like he may have something to hide, like an online profile or women he met there.
Seeing that you had to practically force him to come off the dating website, and then found him on another…where he had no interest or time for it but was active often….checked that you were not active on your account but wouldn`t let you see his…this man is full of BS, he is a liar, possibly cheater, is controlling and has an anger problem. First listen to your gut and FLUSH him, and then stop feeling guilty for mistrusting him, because he cannot be trusted. Don`t let him mess with your head.
Maya, he is punishing you like this to divert your attention from him and what he is doing. My ex put me through this mill so many times, you end up so confused you don`t even know what it is you are thinking. They behave badly, you pay for it. I need to add “a manipulator” to his list of “qualities”.
Stop looking at your mistakes Maya and concentrate on his.
Agreed, Sushi — textbook ‘projection’, his reaction to her having his phone in her hands. He projected his still being on dating sites and/or cheating onto her. Ugly stuff. And sadly pointing towards personality-disorderish behaviour.
Thanks Lilly
I have forgiven many people in my life but I do believe there are some that can never be forgiven and my grad advisor is one. I wasn’t the first life he almost destroyed; one of the huge failings of the tenure system is that it is nearly impossible to fire such people. The car thing just shows how much emotional attachment there is to an industry that doesn’t even exist there anymore. I see the same thing here; adulation of mining and acid producing mine waste by folks that never mined themselves. I am very careful about who I share opinions with around here. I do wish I could have my “real” life back.
Hey Miskwa,
Just hang in there. I totally understand what it is like being the only progressive in the middle of nowhere; I once lived in a foreign country for two years in the mountains. I had no ability to drive, there was only 6000 people there, they regarded Americans as fat, stupid, ultra-religious Republicans, and even though I was a slim, atheist, vegetarian, Democrat I was suspect for having been born in the States. I had very few dating prospects and all the married men hit on me thinking that, because I was American, I was an easy target; it honestly sucked and moreso because I actually liked the country’s culture and enjoyed how beautiful and quaint the town was….it will get better. Hand in there, sell that house, and get back to civilization!:)
Dear Natalie – Thank you so much for this site – it has helped restore my balance on a number of occasions. This post really resonates with me as I sit here tonight typing this after my AC/EUM has told me he is “sort of seeing someone else”. Our relationship started 2 years ago after a long period of crushing on my part. He said at the start that he did not want a relationship (big red flag) but of course I thought that would change. Initially we were good as he was blowing hot and I was totally loved up, but doing the distance thing (we lived 8 hrs apart), seeing each other around twice a month and talking on the phone every night. The relationship then became a cycle of fear and drama as I looked forward to talking to him every night and also being supportive (and taking a backseat) in relation to his family (he is divorced but referred to his ex as his wife, even in front of other people when I was with him) and work issues. At times I compromised my values and suppressed my feelings to please him and in order to not rock the boat. I also helped him with various tasks in order to be the “good girlfriend” but once when I voiced my feelings regarding him actually doing this, was made to feel bad. Basically it was all about him and what he wanted to do on his terms –plans we discussed never eventuated (future faking) and if I indicated that I felt neglected then he apologized and always promised to pay me more attention – this was never sustained. Basically if I had needs then I was made to feel bad, more so if I acted on these – I was told that we were not emotionally “in sync” but physically we were well matched. He even admitted that he wanted a secretary, helper and someone to sleep with him and I fitted the bill. He did not do the small stuff and forgot my birthday – some people may not think it is important but it was to me. This year I moved to where he was living to be with him but after an initial period of happiness he felt that I hovered around him and became uncomfortable (I was not working and it was a small apartment)– the more I tried, the worse I felt and I eventually moved back to the city and got my old job back. This upset me greatly as I had come back to be with him and now he did not want me around. But we still kept in touch but after a particularly cool response to a proposed visit I called time. I did NC for around 4 days before I caved and called to try and get some answers (which of course you never really do) and I eventually went and spent a weekend with him before I left to return to my home country (we have been apart for most of this year). I am about to take up another job in a different country as I could see the futility in the relationship and which prevents me from falling back into the same old pattern with him. But I never completely lost my feelings for him and stayed in touch –recently he said he missed me and spoke in intimate terms of us being together. Previously I had told him that it was not good for me to sleep with him and also that I need to look for someone who wanted to be with me (in the hope that he would put his hand up) – this annoyed him and he said he would find someone else as well – not thinking he would do this so quickly. He continued to say he was not the right person for me and apologized for this but still wanted to sleep with me. I was prepared to settle for this and today was discussing when I would visit as I need to book the ticket when he came out with the news that he was going out to meet with other people and had to move on – this was 2 weeks after he was telling me that he missed me and wanted me. When questioned he said he said that he did not mean for it to happen and then started going on about how he could not sleep with me because he had to respect this new person. I then lost it and started demanding that he see me and that I would come and see him if he didn’t – he then started to panic and said that he would see me but could not sleep with me. When I asked him if he had every had any feelings for me he said that he initially felt that I was the one but emotionally we were not right and that he was still attracted to me physically. He then implied if the other person did not work out then we may get back together – I felt humiliated but then made it worse by demanding that he sleep with me. Having someone that wants you can be very intoxicating and when that goes then the fear is overwhelming. I suppose that I became an EUF in the process as I looked at jobs away from him or said I would go travelling for 6 months – it was like “I can survive without you” but in reality I was just hoping that he would say the words I wanted to hear but he would never say– the illusion if you like.
It has been hard work with a lot of pain and anxiety and I feel sad when I see other couples enjoying being together. I am also fearful of being on my own again in a new place, with no support network. The biggest fear is not having the connection with him (he wants to stay friends but this is really not possible now) and that he will find happiness with this person and want to change for them. I know that this is unlikely but it still is hard to overcome thinking these thoughts. I am just so tired of thinking, waiting and analyzing every little thing and hope I can finally leave this toxic situation , stop beating myself up, and meet someone who cares, respects and loves me.
Oh Meerkat,
First, a giant hug. You sound like you are in the throws of the worst kind of hurt and pain. My thoughts are with you. He is “sort of seeing someone else” sounds a bit like “sort of being pregnant” or “sort of being married”. It sounds like he’s got the classic AC lines down. Try really hard not to beat yourself up. I’ve done some pretty humiliating things in my desperation to get a crumb from that ‘special person’. I can’t imagine what it would be like to get a job in another country with no support network. It may be just the ticket out of the pain you are experiencing and you have BR…I’ve found Natalie and the BR community to be the best support network.
BTW, I was out last night and couldn’t help but notice all the folks who seemed to be enjoying one another. I caught myself wishing I was out with him and felt sad because it will never be.
“The biggest fear is not having the connection with him…” In Natalie’s books she talks about the fear of abandonment which has helped me. He can’t abandon you. You CAN leave the toxic situation. You abandon yourself by staying in the pain-drama-cycle. Hope you will continue to post as you move into a wonderful new phase, new job, and new country.
Hi runnergirl – thank you so much for your kind words of support. Yes, the hurt and pain is awful but I am seeing someone to talk through things as well. I have been reading BR for while to try and make sense of what was going on with this man and why. For my own health and sanity I need to walk on and leave him behind to continue on his selfish and ultimately destructive ways. It won’t be easy but there is no other way. I will continue to post when I can.
Wow Meerkat he sounds just lovely! Keepreading all of Nats posts, there is so much great information on them. In particular, you need to read the ones about why you CANNOT be his friend. No, really, you can’t. Sorry. Also the ones about how they DO NOT change and the “new” victim is just going to get the same old same old. Go no contact with him. Do not answer his calls or texts. The only reason he wants to keep you on the back burner is because it is nice for him to think you still want him. He still doesn’t want you though.I know it sucks but you are worth more than this treatment. You have taught him he can give you any old crumbs and you will stick around. Time to show him your tail and disappear. Good Luck.
Hi Victorious – my friend who is also a BR reader has also said what you are saying. Unfortunately he can be a lovely guy but also has this not so lovely side to him. I know I have enabled his behaviour by not following through when I tried to end it before I know now it is not possible to be his friend. Yes, he does not want me, never has – only for sex and helping him out. As he said in one of his messages – I am a friend that he wants to keep but then friends don’t treat each other they way he has treated me.
Meerkat:
I’m so glad you found BR. This place is going to do wonders for you. You’ll feel supported and understood and learn everything you need to never be involved with or treated like trash by people like your ex ever again.
“He even admitted that he wanted a secretary, helper and someone to sleep with him and I fitted the bill.”
I read this line in your comments and just about died. It all just boils down to this doesn’t it? If this statement doesn’t show us that THIS is the true, hateful thinking these ACs possess, I don’t know what will!
Meerkat, I’m truly grateful to your ex AC. His uttering the truth of his feelings about women and relationships just blew away any and all fantasy thinking I’ll ever engage in again. I’m printing that statement out and will definitely be using it as a litmus test of any future suitor’s views.
Thank you La Pintura Bella for your support, however I am not grateful to him – he has really messed with my mind with his misogynistic ways. The pain and negativity he has instilled in me will take a while to work through.
Totally understand. I wouldn’t be grateful either if I was the person this statement was directed towards. I also was not implying YOU should be grateful to the SOB in any way.
For ME, the fact that he actually said what he said to you truly summed up the AC’s real thinking about women and relationships. It is a HUGE thing to keep in mind when finding out about a man’s character and values. I was really astonished to read that statement…since it really did cut right to the heart of the matter.
Yes, the only thing I am grateful for was the close physical relationship which I miss very much.I thought what we had was special but obviously not that special for him. Even though he laughed when he said the maid, helper, bedmate thing he meant it as this what would give him the greatest advantage and comfort.
Oh Meerkat, how my heart bleeds for your situation, as I recognise it so well. I promise you will do just fine on your own, and thank God you got out.
I have had the same “im not the right person”. I still feel to this day that I have lost something valuable, although it was just an impression.
I have had the same dragging me along in a toxic so called friendship while sleeping together (getting worse every time…he ended up even stating that the sex is not even so good anymore…)
I have also done the obsessing. Reread your post. Its truly chaotic and I remember exactly posting here on BR in the exact same way. HOWEVER, you are now in the worst place, and the only way is up. It will get better!!
I have had the same lack of support from friends. All my friends there were also his and there was noone I could go out with and get my mind off the situation. HOWEVER I also moved out of that country in 3 weeks and that was the best thing that could have ever happened to me even though I felt extremely lonely. New setting means new start. Makes the process shorter than staying in the same city with common friends and histoy.
Hold your head up high. Whatever humiliation you think you have put yourself through, you must accept and forgive yourself. Make sure you dont blame yourself anymore. The simple fact that you are out should give you back at least 5 points of self esteem to build it all back!! Be proud cause you have done yourself the biggest favor and stay in NO CONTACT. There is a certain strenght that comes across from a woman who simply wont even talk to you anymore, it speaks volumes and it will sting him, while allowing you to recover from this confusion and pain. Keep posting, stay with us
Hi deedee – thank you for your support. I also had the “it’s not you, it’s me” thing as well. I think I ended up so confused in the end that I did not know fiction from reality. Yes, you are right, I am now in the worst place but am getting my appetite back but bouts of nausea continue. I also took steps to see a professional as I was evaluated as being significantly depressed with moderate stress. Luckily I am at home and have good support from a few friends which really helps. I also find writing to be really helpful – I actually kept some notes when things were tough previously and saw that I was very negative about myself and really beat myself up. Yes, I do need to be more forgiving of myself and also put strategies in place the will better protect me in the future. The only blame I place on myself is that I did not have the guts to stay away when I called time a few months back. The humiliation I feel is that he reeled me back in and then when he had lined up another option gave me the moving on speech. When we were together he did not like going out so that bites too. I have a number of insecurities that have been added to through my time with him.
The nausea! Incredible thing you mention it. I had it for weeks. Not actually vomiting but the stomach feeling that im about to. Its also what addicts in withdrawal experience. Thats how bad we fall for these ACs and situations and its incredibly difficult to survive it. I remember having images in my head of myself crawling or on my knees, unable to move, just wynting to collapse. It wasnt the reality though, it was just in my head, how I fel emotionally. On the outside though, I put on the best show of my life. Wore the prettiest things, went to work, attended the parties and events I was supposed to be at with a huge smile (fake, but hey, they dont know). I truly believe that while you are recovering, nursing your heart with your closes friends and crying daily as it is the case for many of us at that stage, its important also to remember that some things cannot be neglected. You must show up and perform, and not let your boss or random strangers witness your tragedy. Its yours only, and it heals easier and faster when you dont have to face an angry boss, neglected kids or just strangers who feel sorry for you. It doesnt help. One day you will thank yourself and your body for this ability to disimulate a bit. Strangers dont really get how serious the problem is, or dont care or worse, subconciously enjoy the the little soap opera on show. Dont give it to them
) I did initially, until I realised it hurts just to have the guy mentioned and its sending out the wrong image about me. I am not a WEAK, CRYING, DESPERATE woman all the time, it was only that particular terrible time, but it passed and its not ME.
I just realised theres a lot of “”musts there. I apologise for them, there is nothing that ^you must do
it was just me sharing a thought thats all 
Hi deedee, I am lucky in that I am in between jobs at the moment so can choose if I want to socialise or not. I am just keeping to myself and have the support of a very good friend which is a great help. I am feeling better now but still have sleep issues. Yes, I find it hard to even say or hear his name and generally just feel very sad and down.He actually came on line the other day to “just say hello” – how ignorant or stupid does a person have to be? I was annoyed that he would think that I would be over what he did and life would carry on as normal. I have now blocked him so he cannot just drop in when he feels like it – he gave up that right a week ago.
Natalie after changing my phone number, I do not have any drama in my life. Finally, your words of wisdom started to sink in… I didn’t want to drag my two ACs to 2013, I rather be happy by myself than miserable with one of them:) I love you Natalie, I love BR!
Well done Little Star!!
Little Star – Me, too! Maybe the holidays are a time for us to re-evaluate, or a key turning point, or a sense of a line being drawn in the sand. Who knows? When the MM called yet again, after weeks of me being NC, to convince me what paradise it would be if only he could get away from his abusive wife, if only his teenage daughter was settled, if only, if only. Before, I could sit quietly and listen to this juvenalia, letting it sail by me, Yesterday? No. Never again. It wouldn’t be paradise. It would be decades of pain. He is a one-man breeding ground for negativity. I am never putting my head on that sick pillow again. Little Star–we did it! Where did all that grieving go?! Love you Nat.
Well done Swiss Miss. However, to truly be NC you cannot answer their calls so block his number for calls and texts. Block his email, his facebook, everything you can think of. Then you can get on with your happy lovely life without the fool.
Tx, Victorious, Thanks for your support. I agree. I blocked everything two weeks ago and felt real empowerment for the very first time. Let’s (not) do this on MY TERMS, buddy boy! No more rescuer, no more victim, no more persecutor. I am off the merry-go-round. Unfortunately, he can access hundreds of phones at work, all with different numbers. I didn’t even think before picking up. I am now far more vigilant, for sure!
@Victorious thank you, your support means a lot to me:)
@Swissmiss, glad that you decided to rid off your MM, yes these men always find excuses!!! We cannot wait any longer! At least your AC is married, but mine is divorced! The last straw was when he announced that he is going to celebrate Christmas and New Year abroad:) SO I was good enough for f”"” but not good enough to be taken to holiday!!! HE didn’t mentioned anything about it before, not a word BUT he arranged everything in ADVANCE!!! When I asked him who is going with him, he said his nephew! Not only he ignored me on his Birthday, he also didn’t give a shit about spending Christmas/New Year with me…I was crying for a day, and after reading Natalie’s posts/comments here, I realised I cant be his DUSTBIN anymore, I am a PERSON, who needs love and care…IF I am not going to love myself, who will???
Little Star- So sorry you are experiencing this, but we both know it’s for the best! I have followed your story, and there have been plenty of ‘less than’ moments. Now you are ‘less than’ the nephew. I noticed, on my own journey, that whenever I became hypnotized by the MM, the universe would make something really painful happen, that would practically light up the sky with fireworks and illuminate who he really was. I remember the day we spent hours in bed, then drove down the coast to dance in the moonlite–where he told me he and his wife were going to counseling to save their marriage!! This is exactly what has happened to you. The universe has just given you an amazing gift, practically a neon sign that says HALT! You now see how selfish and thoughtless this man is. Stay NC!!
Thank you so much for your words of encouragement!!! Both ACs cant reach me, I changed my number:) I hope NC will a bit easy for me, no way I will contact them from my new number, this time I will stay stong! You too, Swissmiss stay strong we can do it:) Lets have a free of ACs life?! xxx
I love you all!!! Thank you for the words of advice, empathy, support and encouragement. Pain has made you all much wiser. I am so proud of myself- I did not return his call today. I am getting myself a nice cup of tea and heading for bed.
God Bless. I am praying for all of you!
Pandora
“You think that familiar ‘butterfly’ feeling that you get around these people is excitement and passion when in actual fact, when you have a habit of being with the same poor partners, it’s familiar fear.”
BINGO!!!!!
I have been thinking about this particular point for several days now. THIS is my biggest problem. I have realized that every guy I’ve had a relationship with has on one level or another reminded me of my narc father. Daddy issues? Oh yeah. I have also had this exact feeling in the past two relationships very early on. Literally thinking to myself, “This is feeling all too familiar.”
For me, I am now consciously taking this feeling NOT as excitement and passion, but as an early warning signal screaming “Danger, Will Robinson, Danger!” I’m convinced it is my sub-conscious recognizing the particular person as the same guy, different package. THIS is the first and biggest red flag I need to heed ASAP.
I’m not afraid of being alone or of never meeting anyone else. I AM VERY afraid of these repetitive bad, destructive, damaging one-sided relationshit’s that do not really exist. And I really do believe now my gut has been trying to warn me the entire time.
So from now on, if I get that “butterflies in the stomach” feeling, I will be stepping waaay back and taking a really hard look. I will slow my roll a lot in order to make sure this isn’t another EUM/AC…cuz I WILL NOT ENGAGE IN THESE CRAP SCENARIOS EVER AGAIN!
I get it that I’ve literally been conditioned to confuse pain with love. Being raised by a narc does that to you…its all you’ve ever known, it’s my normal. Not anymore.
I now see the truth behind the illusion. I now see that my love has been unconditional while daddy’s has been nothing BUT conditional. And I’ve replicated that pattern with the man-boys in my life…thinking this was how it is. I’ve never had a relationship that wasn’t like this, so I didn’t have anything tangible to compare it to. I finally got wise. Never again!!!
I finally get it that I’m the strong one. I’m NOT the one who has to play games with people. I’m not the one who has to make someone else feel like crap about themselves in order for me to feel good about myself. I’m not the one who lies and cheats and has to have a string of admirers to prove I’m desirable. However, I have been making these guys more important than myself; I have been trying to be perfect in order to prove my worth. I have been allowing these weak-willed grown children to convince me that I’m the problem. WRONG!
It is MY turn to find the healthy, peaceful, contented, fulfilling love I deserve. I refuse to settle for anything less and I refuse to let another person on this planet convince me I am less than!
So while I plan for my healthier life in 2013, I want to thank you ladies and gents for sharing your experiences, your wisdom and your inspiring discoveries in self-growth. I’m honored to be walking with you all and I know we are all going to be beyond amazing when we’re done!
Natalie, I hope you realize what an absolute angel on earth you truly are. Your blog has helped me sort out and make sense of things I was very close to understanding but just couldn’t seem to connect with correctly. The past few months reading this blog and the comments of my fellow readers has done more for me than the last few years on soul-searching, introspection and counseling combined. I, for one, am forever grateful!
Hear hear LPB – love this comment, and totally relate, especially to this bit: ‘I have been making these guys more important than myself; I have been trying to be perfect in order to prove my worth. I have been allowing these weak-willed grown children to convince me that I’m the problem. WRONG!’ Onwards and upwards in 2013 eh! x
Bravo LPB… you actually made me just feel better reading you new found power!!
Everyone on here deserves better than what they had before – you I know you all will find it or let it come to you if you just use the tools you learned here.
Everyone has hurt, I would say most have gotten over it somehow some way… but so many poor souls are destined to repeat it over and over and over
.. Me too, I see that now. This is a chance for change, to finally find our individual strengths and wake up… seems like you all are. Gives me alot of heart even when Im not feeling good about things, thanks 
Hey Ladies,
I have a pain story that relates to the “ability” to tolerate intolerable levels of pain. While in the deep throws of the suffering OW, I cracked a tooth which became severely infected by the time I made it to the dentist. The dentist described the infection and the pain I should have felt as a 10 plus on a scale of 10. I actually felt a twinge and described it a little uncomfortable, maybe a 2. This wasn’t the first time I had teeth issues. There was a long history of having big dental problems I didn’t feel. Apparently, physically, I’m “asymptomatic”. The worst kind of patients to treat, according to my dentist. Once she pointed it out, I started noticing little things like DYI projects where I’d fall or get scraped and not feel a thing. One summer, putting BBQ together, I scraped my elbow against the stucco and didn’t notice until I was in the shower and half my elbow was missing. I also started noticing, I also grab hot things off the BBQ or out of the oven without a mitt.
My dentist told me that if I feel the slightest twinge, I am to call her immediately. She even gave me her cell number. I’ve been applying my dentist’s advice to my dental issues as well as any physical aliments. Of course, since the mind and the body are inextricably connected, Natalie’s advice with regards to emotional pain fits perfectly in my case. I didn’t even realize what I was experiencing was severe emotional pain. Now, if I feel the slightest twinge, I know to run.
I’ve become much more conscious of physical pain (or twinges) as well as discomfort in general. It’s no wonder I kept putting my hand back into the fire. I didn’t realize I was getting burned.
PS. I’ve stopped grabbing things off the BBQ or out of the oven without a mitt, although it takes a conscious thought.
PPS. This is NOT an excuse for intolerable lame behavior on my part. It takes a conscious thought.
Wow, being asymptomatic seems very dangerous!!! You don’t have the internal monitor of pain to alert you when there is a problem. Be careful, runnergirl.
I really appreciate the analogy though, to we who have had our emotional boundaries torn down, and thus don’t register a ‘violation’ when someone intrudes on us.
I can say this has been a very disappointing year for me with men. I have just fallen into a lot of terrible habits I thought I left behind me. In the spring, there was AC#3.
Now, there is the guy I NC-ed over the summer, who I have started hanging out with again on a regular basis (just as “friends”), and I’m now 100% sure is an EUM jerk, toying with a whole string of different girls. And yet I’m dealing with an intense love/hate obsession with him that is beginning to look a lot like how I used to obsess about guys in the past. I also ended up passively going along with that guy who forced me to kiss him earlier in the semester spending the night at my house over the weekend. I’m feeling just incredibly tired, and hopeless about the situation. It’s tiring to feel like you have made a lot of progress, and then find yourself backstepping.
I bought a notebook, and am now going to be tracking my behavior. I have two main goals:
(1) No alcohol for 3 months.
(2) No going out with people in my department on Friday or Saturday nights. (That is where I always see the guy.)
Hey Snowboard,
The upside to what you are feeling is that you are feeling. You are correct when you said being asymptomatic is dangerous. It is. Keep paying attention to what you are feeling. I’m not sure it is “backstepping”, although I know that tired feeling. Maybe the universe is giving you another opportunity? Make a conscious effort to put your oven mitts on and don’t grab anything out of the fire bare handed. It’s not hopeless. I find in my case, it is time consuming to to have to think about things that seem to be second nature for some folks and that can be tiring. However, I’m starting to automatically grab the oven mitt, mostly.
Stick to your goals. Natalie’s analogy of the exMM being like a cockroach after a nuclear bomb helps me. Think of them like cockroaches. That will make you run screaming into the night.
Or you can think of them like a sticky buger!
Thanks for the optimistic POV, Runnergirl! My New Year’s Resolution is to turn this situation around. I keep thinking how lucky I am to have access to Natalie’s brilliant mind and thus *understand* the problem, but then it’s up to me to do the difficult legwork, and I’ve been unfortunately slacking off on the job. My friends/family keep saying I shouldn’t be so hard on myself, that I should go out with the people in my department if I want to, etc. But I know myself, and this isn’t what I really want for myself, at all. Plus, I now have plenty of friends in another department, and they are genuinely wonderful (reliable, honest, supportive, etc.), so I should be using my time to get closer to them anyway.
Runner,
I love your physical/emotional tolerating usually-intolerable pain story. It seems to apply to our ability to be involved with these EUM’s for years on end! Our hearts and brains become anesthetized by the AC’s special cocktail of “Lie – docaine” (lies and deceit) with a sizable dose of “Morph-ine” (morphing into different forms as he sees fit to manipulate us). We need to develop a healthy allergy to “Code-eine” (code red and amber behaviour) STAT!!!
hahaha agreed!
Brilliant
Hi ladies
Wanted to just air my reaction to this post, as what I’m wondering is whether I’m finding it hard atm exactly because my current possible romantic situation is very low on drama- which is in contrast for both of us to our last relationships.
He is a good friend whom I even shared a house with for a bit, and lives now with one of my best female friends. We kissed a couple of times but decided not to go any further and just remain friends, as he is still fairly recently out of his relationship (mine is way past now, tho it continues to affect me in certain ways). I suppose this is a red flag though isn’t it!
After this, we ended up kissing again, and I’m now feeling a bit confused as I feel unexpectedly very attracted to him plus I know through my friend that he is interested/ likes me, and yet both of us seem to be holding back a bit. Partly I don’t know if I’m just going for him as a ‘safe’ option, as I know him and his history well, or if I should just give it a try and see where it goes- but I feel like I wouldn’t want to mess him around and of course there’s no way of knowing in advance if it will work out.
Also despite well over a year of being single and having a fantastic time of it, I haven’t got into anything with anyone and guess on some level I’m still scared that relationships mean hassle, entrapment and worse. But in many other ways I feel ready to have someone in my life and he is a kind, thoughtful and caring person.
Or maybe I am actually making this all into a minor drama when the truth is it’s looking like a FWB benefits situation without any of the supposed benefits- as there is no way I’m jumping in the sack! But if one of us doesn’t take the leap and suggest we try for it to further then I suppose for whatever reason, there isn’t enough desire from either of us for it to actually develop. In which case i should just opt out from now and spare myself the hassle!
Sorry, I guess I’m just rambling! Just having a ‘confused’ moment
thanks for bearing with me.
he’s just out of a relationship? red flag as he’s most likely EU.
Hi all.. still reading here almost daily and thought I would check in with a post since this was a good article for me too. I really can identify with the butterflies being fear thing – I just took inventory this morning and all of the really excruciating relationships (the ones I did not end but were ended by the other party), were all pretty much the same “type” of person. Almost to a T with the last two big ones. and I had the butterflies for all of them.
My latest broken relationship was with a “party girl” of sorts who decided she wanted to try to settle down. I get that now. She genuinely thought she was in love with me and I was it for her, but she was also very emotionally unavailable and when it came down to having to have intimacy (not sex, we were doing that from the get go pretty much, closeness on a different non honeymoon stage level) she freaked out and pushed me away then said she “couldn’t do this anymore.” I felt the butterflies for her, and thought I was in love too and jumped in with both feet – ignoring or rationalizing all the things that made me uncomfortable about her and us. My relationship before this one that ended badly for me – also with a “party girl.” She was totally not ready for anything but a casual relationship and I tried to go into saviour mode, but she didn’t want to be saved or settle down. She ended up going back to her husband (they were separated at the time), but not after ripping me to shreds and having sex with alot of different guys while feeding me crumbs. I let it tear me down until I couldn’t take anymore and left her alone and found someone else… who was also a party girl lol.
I know from stories about my mom that she was a party girl too… had me when she was 16, and had no time for me or my sister which is why my dad took us and tried to raise us alone. I met me mom again when I was 16 and she got in contact with me and talked me into coming to live with her. I then got to see for myself that she was more concerned about herself and her life and doing what she wanted to do than taking care of kids. I don’t hate her at all, and have forgiven her for anything she may have done to me, and honestly I have no feelings towards her good or bad… but apparently I am trying to correct the wrongs of my past by picking people who “feel” to me like my mom. I don’t do it conciously mind you, and I actually do feel an attraction and butterflies for these people, but it has to be more than coincedence that all these relationships with all these different people end up in one of two ways… either I try to get closer to them and they break up with me, or we do get closer then I cut and run. Ive really only had one relationship that didnt go this way, and it lasted 12 years and she was not the type of person to fit this description. It seems Ive fallen into this pattern now, because every single woman after I can say more or less they are this type of person. Carefree, social, likes to go out and have fun, not very good with plans or long term goals outside of planning a social calendar, married at least once or multiple times, seem to have a other side to them in which they want to be more stable for their kids or own lives, My last girlfriend, the one I thought was it for me and the reason I found this site, fits this same description too. I didn’t know much about her initially, but I did know she was very outgoing and social and had alot of friends/acquaintances, but the rest of the things came out as we got closer, and although I was so uncomfortable and eventually unhappy I kept going, and went into full saviour mode to try to give her what I thought she was looking for – a family and stable life, and she couldn’t see herself there once it got close and cut and ran… and really broke my heart because unfortunately she was also a fast forwarder and future faker and I thought subconciously I was finally going to redeem myself I guess. She made me think she wanted all of these things, and she probably actually did for a time because she was swept up too as much as she could be – but she went cold so completely and pushed me out that I was left shocked, hurt, and utterly spent. I couldnt have done anymore for her or her kids – and she still tossed me aside. I know I allowed it to happen to myself though and it was bound to happen. and honestly if I look deep down I think I would have left eventually if I had “won her,” because of the cost that had made me resentful underneath from feeling like she could take me or leave me after I became so committed. I need to go against my butterflies from now on and pick people that I don’t get an urge to save – at least see what happens.
Anyway, kind of a revelation even though people who know me have been telling me for years lol sigh. As far as where I am at, I havent had any contact with her for 35 days now, not a peep of any kind electronic or otherwise. I am still fighting the urge to try to see what she is up to, but I know if I do see anything it just makes me want to get in touch with her, and nothing good can come of that, so I try my best to redirect myself. I have enough self respect not to be greeted with the anger and disdain again that she responded with the last time we had contact – when I asked her if she was seeing other people and she told me she had moved on and for me to please move on too, even while denying she was seeing anyone else but in the same breath saying she wanted to have fun and not be involved in anything f***ing serious. It still hurts that she told me the whole time up until then that she was just getting herseld together and needed this time to herself, and maybe we could try again someday… but like I said self respect will take me where self esteem didnt and she wont hear from me ever again. It still hurts though, I wish it would stop soon. I wish I didnt miss her and want to get a hold of her so bad and get validation from her. That is the type of person she is though, she is done with me so threw me away completely – which tells me that her feelings arent really what either one of us thought they were. If they were I would not be so easy to dispose of. I know I cant.
I did hear today that she has been partying up quite a bit at some work Christmas parties and with her friends. I didn’t really want to know but was talking to someone who was telling me about seeing her over the weekend – and it made my gut wrench again
. She even asked me if my ex was ever involved with married men – and once she explained it a little bit I am now worried about what she is doing and the path she is going down. She is apparently being way too friendly to men who are in positions at work higher than her and are also married, and typically significantly older. I dont know that she would ever take that step, and even when she was with me I know she was very socialable with alot of these guys and trusted her completely even though they talked alot, because she was with me all the time anyway. I know she was in a relationship once with a married man, but as soon as it came out he was married (she received a letter from his wife) she broke it off and never contacted him again. I know she has a deep drive to be appreciated and liked though, its an issue for her from her life growing up without it, and she tries so hard to be everything to everyone and to have these people in authority positions “like” her and give her the pat on the back she needs so bad – but I am afraid that at the very least she is getting a questionable reputation (like I heard about today) and at worst she may be getting sucked into doing something she will regret which will cost her even more of her self worth. I dont think she is thinking of how it looks even if its harmless – but other people are noticing, and its not my place to defend her anymore or explain away her actions even though I started to. She threw me away too, shes going to have to live her own life as she sees fit. I dont want to see her fall or her or her kids suffer though – I hope its just a phase for her since we broke up and she gets herself back together 
.
I still am no contact, and will continue to be… even though my heart tells me to get a hold of her and at least tell her people are starting to talk about her. I know I will just get yelled at though and called a stalker and she’ll keep doing whatever it is she’s doing. And I still have feelngs for her, so I will be looking for crumbs from her that maybe she misses me, loves me, etc… its a fools game and I am not going to play. I can pray for her, and her kids… and that is all I can do. If she wanted to be with me she would be = I need to break my pattern and find someone healthy and good for me.
I have been dating someone new for about a month how (I know I should be waiting but I think I can handle it). I have my eyes and heart wide open and am not taking any myths or fantasies into this… and she feels so different. I am not feeling butterflies, the attraction was not instant at all and we are slowly getting to know eachother and growing closer, and most of all she has no need to be saved – and she likes to have fun on the same level that I do. She is also a social worker by trade and has a masters in pshycology lol, and I have been open with her about my past and my last relationship and one of the first things she told me is she doesnt need to be saved from anything. She said I am nice, kind, thoughtful, and as far as she can see my biggest fault is I am too nice to the wrong type of people… and I told her if she ever sees anything from me shes concerned about to please let me know and wed talk about it. There havent been any promises made and were just dating, but so far it feels so different for me that I am getting a feeling that maybe this is how a relationship is supposed to be and I need to follow it and see what happens. I miss the instant attraction and the butterflies I wont lie – but where have those got me? Alot of hurt….
I just wanted to tell you that your ex sounds like my ex TO A T. Though I am a woman and he is a man – so similar, it’s scary. I miss the butterflies too. Just feeling them at all with anyone. I am not really dating anyone – too scared. I think that they really do believe that it work out someday – they just don’t which day that is and if they are wrong (and they often are) they will not expect you to show up at their door looking for “relationship change”. it’s like spending money, not getting all that was promised from the product and expecting change. Sadly you just don’t get change
hang in there
Bob finding out and hearing from friends is not no contact if a friend or people discuss her cut them off and say oh and change the topic.
If hearing about your ex is gut wrenching then I don’t think you should be dating anybody.
Bob:
I concur with Tulipa. You have a pattern here that you need to break. I hear you STILL wanting to save your ex. She doesn’t want it. And even if she did, it’s a bad, bad idea because then the “saved” person gets resentful, feels one-down to the savior…unhealthy every which way. If she’s getting a “rep,” that’s her business. Stay out of it.
Um, as for the dating…STOP IT! It’s been 35 freaking days since you got your heart ripped out of your chest and thrown in your face! You think you can handle it??? Try handling being on your own, getting to the point that you don’t feel the need to save anyone but yourself and have really healed from the assclownettes!
Sorry if this sounds harsh, but dating this soon after what you’ve been through is AVOIDANCE of looking at and working on YOURSELF. And frankly, it’s NOT fair to the new woman. I’m kinda surprised with her background in psychology that she’d even consider dating someone this fresh out of a bad breakup. If it were me, I’d be telling you to come back in a year. There isn’t a fire that you have to rush to put out. Stay platonic with this woman. You are sooooo not ready to be with anyone new and SHE is going to get hurt.
I am sorry if this sounds like I’m beating you up. I’m very concerned because I still see lots of fantasy going on here and you looking for quick fixes. 35 days is nothing when it comes to moving on…even if it had been a great, healthy relationship. What’s the hurry???
oh bob! i agree with la pintura. why on earth are you dating if you’re still obsessing about your ex? why not take the time and once and for all deal with YOU?
i see it time and time again that people rush into another relationship only to get the same lesson again and again.
when i started my ‘relationship’ with the EUM in spring, i thought i was ready. i was in many ways, but the break up showed me i still had things to learn. i am working hard to learn these lessons so i can be fully available for a healthy relationship should the opportunity present itself.
you are EU yourself right now, still being concerned with your ex. even if the woman you are dating knows you’re fresh out of a relationship, it’s still not fair to her. and yes, i do think we have a responsibility to take care of the other.
i’ve been avoidant all my life and what did it get me? an EUM i would have loved to spend the rest of my life with, if it wasn’t for the fact that his heart is (and possibly always will be) tied to his ex wife. if he had told me he was still dealing with that, i would have STILL gotten involved with him. my rose tinted glasses would have filtered that out oh so conveniently.
there’s no short cuts: do the work and become a better, healthier you. i firmly believe that the only way out is through.
Yes I guess I am still caught in fantasy a little, and yes I still think about her entirely too much, both of the realities and the fantasies and the coulda woulda shouldas. And some thoughts still hurt, but honestly not as much, and I guess I am being more reflective than anything. I have learned the less I know about her the better now – when I was trying to keep tabs on what she was doing even though I wasnt in direct contact with her it initially felt good or I would get a sigh of relief that I didn’t find out anything earth shattering, but then I noticed I would feel even worse once that initial relief wore off to the point it would drive me mad or I would feel like crying I wanted to get in touch with her so bad. I know now I was just keeping her “alive” and right at the front of my thoughts by doing this even though I wasn’t in contact with her. I am having a relationship with someone who isn’t even there
. That is not fair to her, me, or anyone else. Regardless of how crappy I think I was treated then or now, she told me it was over and I need to get over thinking I have any say or power to change that whatsoever – the only person I can control is me, and I am trying harder than I ever have.
I think if I would’ve left her alone the night we said goodbye to eachother instead of hanging on words or feelings and false glimmers of hope, I would probably be totally over it now (almost 3 months instead of just over 1) and not regretting some of the things I did that I feel chased her out of reach for good. I do know I didnt do anything terrible regardless of what she thinks based on her accusing me of stalking her – I didnt show up at her door, at her desk at work, try to catch her on lunch or in the parking lot, follow her around on her free days/weekends, call/text/email her incessantly, stalk her electronically too much – but still no contact at all would’ve left things right where they were at when we said goodbye – the last thing I wouldve remembered is her saying “I will always love you Bob” instead of her swearing at me in a text and not answering my call, and telling me to move on because she has already. And who knows – maybe I would’ve been honorable even in her eyes instead of some pathetic guy who cant get over her like I am sure she feels now. If it ever happens again (and God I hope it never does), immediate no contact and walking away is the only honorable way to go for everyone involved.
I’m sure alot of that feeling of me being annoying she probably has is from her picking up with someone else too though… its easy to forget about someone when you have fallen for someone else – I’ve been there too. I do know it comes back around though when things don’t work out and you remember that maybe the grass wasn’t any greener, you just didn’t water the old lawn. She is still unavailable anyway, how could she not be when nothing has changed for her whatsoever? She will either do the same thing she did to me to the next guy, or get herself involved with someone who will jerk her around because he will be just as unavailable and she will be attracted to that. I don’t want any part of it anymore, no matter how much I hurt sometimes.
As for me dating, I know its not the best idea I really do… but man just to be able to talk to someone, share thoughts, laugh a little, smile, see a movie or have dinner… things to let me remember that life has a good side as well even going through this mess… thats why I am doing it. Im not on fast forward, not being sucked into anything because theres nothing to be sucked into. Im not trying to run away from dealing with my issues – I honestly think I can use what I am learning and apply it right now with what I am doing. Get used to the feeling of something “different” that isnt an instant attraction or butterflies all over the place. Sample what a normal slow progression feels like. I made a friend, thats all so far. I know she will ask me or let me know when and if she may be looking for more. I still have alot of stuff to work through and still need to lose my hurt over my breakup, I am not fooling anyone about this, me or her. Im trying to make my circle of friends and family bigger and reconnect to people I let go while I was making my life smaller and all about one person and her kids. And from now on I will leave it “big” and find someone who adds to it naturally and not takes away from it. I won’t steer anyone wrong, just as I never want to be steered wrong again.
Please be very, very, very careful. Having a friend is good. Just be careful that she isn’t thinking it’s more. We gals do tend to do that when we like a guy.
Exactly. The next thing that will happen is that this woman will be posting here what we’ve heard time and time again: “I’ve fallen for this guy who keeps telling me he’s not ready for a relationship right now. I don’t think he’s over his ex – but he keeps coming around. That means he really likes me, right?”
Allison thanks for the advice.I am at the point where my feelings are going away.He calls and text everyday then my mind goes back to what if he is changing,and I miss out on the man I suppose to be with, then next day or so its the same old bs.This story is long and dramatical.In the summer he came to me begging said he was in the pricess of working on a relationship with me and I set it back by nagging him.Things went okay for a week then one day he left after he asked to borrow my rent money he came back the next morn at 7am which caused me to miss work.At that point I was done but he.kept coming by sitting on my front or to my job.I gave UN and of course got burned again.Now I am focusing on me The desire to be with him is fading.I just have to get it out of my head that he won’t make me an exception and give me the relationship I want and need.I
Lacy…
Let me be blunt. He was a jerk before you met him, while you were with him and he’ll be a jerk long after you are gone. These people need a bank safe to fall on their head before they ever decide to change…IF they ever decide to change.
Stop letting him control your life. Kick his sorry butt to the curb, get healthy and go find a man…not a little boy pretending to be a man. You’ll be so much happier!
LPB I LOVE the idea of the bank safe falling on their head. Very Wiley Coyote. Thanks for the visual!
LOL Victorious! I apparently was on a rather colorful roll last night. Glad I made you giggle.
Ladies, after several months of going upwards, out of the pit the ex EUM left me in, I´m not sure if I´m still on the right track. Last weekend, after much thought, I went to a dinner party this guy was also invited to. I wasn´t planning on going but then I thought Why must I interrupt my social life for his sake?
I even looked forward to face him at last with my BR schooling, to show him I wasn´t his FBG anymore. But he didn´t go! Even though he had confirmed he would (as I found out when I was there).
It was actually a disappointment and this left me confused because before going there, I didn´t want to see him. But the fact that he blatantly ignored this party he knew I was attending made me feel like I was an object thrown in the dustbin after he had found out he had no use for me.
Perhaps I was secretly hoping he´d go to try to mend things with me?
These NPD guys can really wreck your self esteem, reminds me so much of my father.
Today I found myself composing a letter to him in my mind, telling him I was looking forward to seeing him – while in truth, I wasn´t. I am certain now that this relationship has only given me pain and more pain. I have never felt discarded like this before, whenever I´ve had a breakup my ex boyfriend would at least face me afterwards and show some kind of emotion towards me! But with this narc it´s terrible because I feel like he treats me like dirt. I know I should let it go but suddenly I´m finding that very hard. It very bad for your ego when an AC maintains NC, even if you initiated it.
Hi Lilia,
What you just said..”it is very bad for your ego when an AC maintains NC even if you initiated it”. I am totally relating to this right now. I did the NC thing, told him to finally take a flying leap, get out of my life, and he’s actually listening this time. And I’m happy and yet..I’m sad as hell. Maybe I’m realizing that he’s finally over it as well. Maybe I’m wishing he would fight for me. And why the EFF would I want that anyways, he’s not a nice person at all. What is it with these AC’s that have this hold over us!
lilia and andrea,
be grateful they are holding up their part of the deal and that you are not confronted with them. they have nothing to offer you but turmoil and distress. your ego will get over itself
cheers to recovery!
Yes I guess you´re right. I´m now trying to rewire my brain into thinking I´m the one who got away and that the EUM is deeply ashamed of his unhonorable behaviour.
It may not be the truth (which I won´t ever find out anyway with this lying manipulative sob), but it makes me feel better about myself and makes me admire the decision I took of going NC.
This is my AC’s “WANT AD”. I’d like to thank Wildflower for her brilliant idea on her posting from Dec 15th. I have to admit, even I had a good laugh writing this.
Are you naïve? Do you have a lack of self-esteem and respect? Do you accept words at face value and never questions ambiguous statements and actions?
If this has caught your attention, then please look no further. I’m your guy. I am the one for you. I love to play mind games. I will come into your life and turn it upside down. I’m charming, funny, sexy, a very alpha-type male and I know all the right things to say. I will have you believing that you can fly, that’s how much I can manipulate you into anything. You may have a few boundaries at first, but have no fear; I will make you forget these in a pretty short period of time. I know what to say to you to make you believe I care about you. I will take you out on a few measly dates, make you feel special; tell you that I’m thinking of you, that I miss you. I will show up unannounced at your door. You won’t know what hit you. I will text you night and day and just when you start to show you are really interested, I will back off. I will stop texting. I will avoid you. I will say something mean or just basically ignore you. You will be very confused and hurt but I will be back! I like to blow hot and cold, it’s one of my best assets. On top of everything you have read so far, I also have a girlfriend that you will come to understand is actually okay with you. You won’t ever question my relationship with her because you will now be too smitten with me. Oh, and I will usually let you down, I’m very adept at not being responsible or doing what I say I’m going to do. I’ll string you along because it’s what is best for me…but you’ll never know that because I’ll twist it so you believe I’m all about you. And wait the sex? I will tell you how awesome YOU are, how you are the best I’ve ever had. I will compliment your “skills” and your body to no end. I will brag to you about how much I am going to do to you, what I am going to do to you, and then when we actually meet up and have sex? I won’t do any of those things that I said I was going to do because basically, I just need to get off. You see my girlfriend isn’t giving me sex at present so I am a really horny guy and need a lot of attention. Don’t worry, once she starts having sex with me, I’ll disappear as I’ll be taken care of. In the meantime though, you will have someone who desires you fully.
You will trust me, I will do whatever it takes to win you over, for only a short time.
I have just re-read this article, and lots of other posts as I am having the most awful day, and so tempted to break NC which I have maintained for two months now. Having found this website in 2010 when I encountered a severely disordered individual who covered the whole gamut of control and manipulation, from mind-games to temper tantrums, and having successfully rid myself of him, I met a man who could not have been a more polar opposite. This time last year, I was on cloud nine. He was everything that was different. Kind, loving, generous, affectionate, blah blah blah. But how thick was I? He told me he loved me after three weeks, asked me to move in with him after just a few weeks more … And despite my natural wariness, I was totally convinced that this.was.it. I admit to my own foolishness, because underneath it all he was just the same as the man who led me here initially, but I didn’t see it until it was too late. He positively encouraged me to dispose of my possessions because he had everything we would need, I rented my house out long term, and turned down the best job opportunity I will ever have because he didn’t want us to be long distance, didn’t want us to spend a night apart. Bliss. He kept saying that I should never worry, that I would be safe with him …NOT. This article really made me realise just how ludicrous it all was. On the one hand, he would tell me to make myself at home, but then would criticise everything I did around the house, which turned into him criticising my appearance but ever so covertly. I honestly thought I was going mad, and then there was a butterfly-filled period of months where he just withdrew emotionally a little bit more every day. Stopped sending texts (which had been relentless at the start), stopped replying to my messages … Or I would get one word. BUSY! (No x ), he stopped taking an interest in anything I did, was sullen with my friends and family, and I realised I was having to organise even talking to my friends on the phone around whether he was in or out. I was trying harder and harder to be 1950s housewife whilst holding down a seriously disruptive responsible confrontational job. The harder I tried,the more he resented me, and his face was set in an emotionless mask. That set off the fear and the anxiety. Fear of being rejected, fear of being homeless, fear of being alone. So I tried harder again. Remembering at least some of my schooling from here before, after two days of silent treatment, I tried to talk to him, to tell him about my needs and my boundaries. Result … He drew himself up to his full height, stared at me with cold eyes and said “you have just verbally assaulted me. You are bullying me, and I won’t be bullied”. Had we not been on holiday in a remote location, I would have run away there and then. That was fear of HIM. But then came an apology … Followed by yet another lecture on my many domestic crimes. Stupidly I agreed to try and improve in that area ..but would he please not be so withdrawn ? Result? Knowing that I was starting to feel anxious, he racked it up a bit more. Silent treatment deluxe, coming in late and not telling me why, more rigid rules to follow, on and on. I felt as if the sword if Damocles was hanging above my head. I KNEW I was getting crumbs by then, so was it arrogance or fear that made me twist and turn, adapt and accommodate even more. Walking on bloody eggshells. And when the end came, it was brutal. We woke up, had sex, then he said he didn’t think it was working. When I asked him how he could have just had sex with me? He said he felt loving towards me then!!! What sort of person says that? So my fear of the fear of all the things I feared were founded. And I did think I deserved it because I had become anxious and lost my sparkle, but he seemed to know which buttons to push to turn down the sparkle further. Was it love? I no longer know. I thought it was, but the sick gut-wrenching feeling of not knowing where I stood was definitely worse than leaving for my friend’s house with my belongings in bin bags. I will never understand how I could not have been more careful or less reckless with this man, but it was such a gradual process of control that I hardly noticed until I had put all my eggs in one basket. After all his criticism, and his callous disregard for my immediate situation following the break up (he wanted it to happen ina controlled manner!), I am still struggling to think it was not my fault because I was not good enough. This was a highly intelligent man, well respected professionally but with no male friends (though lots of exes who were friends. He offered me that privilege and I declined). So much work to do now, but I do feel liberated from his watchful eye now I have my own place. A small pleasure, but my friends and family say they recognise me again. I put on the bravest face I can, but am raging at myself for not paying more attention and being utterly fooled by Prince Charming who underneath it all was as cold and manipulative as EUM no 1.
Alibi…
I’m not a qualified professional, HOWEVER, this guy is NOT EU. I would bet my own life he is a full blown malignant Narcissist. That means he’s right up there with sociopaths. HE IS PSYCHOLOGICALLY DEFECTIVE.
You have been very traumatized, which is why you continue to blame yourself and feel responsible. It was NOT love, it WAS ABUSE. Nothing more.
Please seek help with a therapist. This is a lot of trauma to overcome. HUGE HUG!!!!
Thank you LPB, I have an appointment with a therapist but not for ages so am trying to help myself. I was thinking of signing up for a course here, if I can stretch the finances that far (trying to start from scratch with a new place). I suddenly remembered a day of huge pain, when he said I needed to do more in the garden because he was busy working. I spent all bloody day pulling out weeds, but whenever I went in, he was on Facebook! I asked him if he wanted a coffee (as he was obviously so busy -left unsaid of course), and when I took it to him, he said “goodness me, you are all creased and crumpled and mucky. Not a bit like The woman in The Good Life, she always looked lovely in Wellies!” Inside, screaming I have just done the bloody garden. Response? Fear: I am losing him, I must do garden and be glamorous. I am worthless. He can’t see me any more. And he is playing games, because Facebook is not work.
It has taken this period of NC to realise that a lot of it was about subtle control, but control all the same. And although I was unhappy, the deep issue is why I was prepared to wind my neck in (mainly because that one time I challenged him, he said I was a bully ). He had told me in the past that he had left his wife years ago because she was a control freak! I wonder ……?
Dear Alibi,
I, too have been where you are now. Its natural to feel angry, but dont feel angry with yourself. These type of people are master manipulators, they make themselves the knight in shining armour in the beginning and slowly unfold till they are just a big jerk wrapped in tin foil. Read, read and re read all of Nat’s blogs, they are empowering and a special one for you to read is, ‘Is he a chopper’. My ex AC also called his wife a control freak, she was unemotional, stubborn, heartless and over time as he unfolded he was describing himself and not his ex wife. He still kept her as a friend, took her out every year for her birthday (I was unaware of this till just before the relationship ended.) The last Christmas we spent together he gave me my Xmas gift..a deluxe pamper package from a select beauty salon…..how wonderful you say…it would have been, had the ex wife’s NAME not been written on the gift card package!!!! He wanted it back so that he could give me my PROPER present..he DEMANDED it back….I said NO…I kept it, went for the most beautiful pampering of my life, enjoyed every minute! (did feel a bit strange being called Clare for the whole experience but what the heck)!!! BAZINGA! Hope Clare enjoyed the mini pedi!!!!
I went NC after this, huge eye opener, am wide awake now, of course had a couple of slip ups where I met for coffee and allowed him to yank my chain but totally NC now, absolutely no regrets.
You will get through this, hugs.
P.S As far as his reference to Felicity Kendals role in the Good Life in her wellies. Tell your AC it was TV you douch, she is an actress playing a role…..time for you Alibi to say lights, camera, action FLUSH!!!!
Ha ha yes, I just wish I could switch him off so easily in my head. He has been there lots today. Somebody who did not know we broke up asked what we were doing for Christmas and it suddenly brought on bout of sadness. Euurgh. Must not give in!! x
Wanted to ask if anyone ever experienced an Achilles heal person. By that I mean, someone that seems to breeze right past your alarm bells. I know what pain is and drama is and I worked all my life and finally got a place where I was in really good relationships with men. Then I dated the sociopath (well at least that was the armchair diagnosis my therapist gave). My entire world was flipped upside down once I left as I realized I hadn’t gotten as far as I thought – I was shocked and bewildered I HAD NOT HEALED! WHAT WAS GOING ON???? I took my time, went NC (even had to issue a do not contact order through a lawyer) and he proceeded to date my best friend (obviously things between us fell out). I felt I was on the mend and I could reasonably see myself returning to normal – simply a blip, right? Followed the sociopath with the AC. Now, being realistic, I have to admit I was probably not healed after 6 mos of intense therapy/NC – the evidence shows it. But for whatever reason, I really really thought I was! Given everything I had gotten myself out of and everything I was so raw from… WHY did an AC get past my radar? And if I could leave an sociopath and AC, why is getting them out of my head so hard. I feel like a toy that was roughly used and is now broken forever.:/
(experiencing a moment of self doubt as my friend ran into said ex-best friend and she is still with the sociopath – am I the crazy messed up one?)
Um no. Your friend is certainly crazy. 6 months of therapy is really not much. And if you’ve been dealing with a sociopath, it’s gonna take more. They are PROFESSIONAL assclowns when it comes to manipulation and hurting people…just because they can and they get a thrill out of it.
Quit beating yourself up. Don’t put time limits on yourself. It will take as long as it takes. And BTW, these guys are drawn to you/us because WE have what they lack. Do you blame the person who is mugged??? No! So stop blaming yourself. These guys, EUs, ACs, Narcs, Sociopaths…they are emotional and psychological muggers!
There’s one flashing sign that I wish I could take out of the shop window! And yes, I realize now, I was not healed. Mildly frustrated but I suppose what will be, will be :/
“Nat said “Can’t a man even talk to you?” and I thought, ‘evidently not’.”
…pain isn’t fantasy…”
A ‘nice guy’ at work just talked to me, and yes the fantasies started spinning in my head, simply because I found him attractive–what is that? Oh, and he made me feel safe.
My feelings for him have since expired, as he unfolded (didn’t like what I discovered about him), and I deemed it not in my best interest to get involved with someone at work. The intensity is gone; the declarations of “he is the one” seem so silly now; yet, I remember how it felt to want him after only knowing him for two seconds, and I am grateful to have overcome another pattern, or so I thought, until the next handsome bloke talked to me, and although he did not make me feel “safe,” I still managed to run off in my head with fantasies because he talked to me every day at work.
WTH? I dunno why a handsome man just talking to me sends me so…. I think I just want that feeling of ‘connection’ because it feels so good to really be able to talk to someone who you think…whatever…
It sort of felt like intimacy.
I still talk to the handsome bloke, but now I try to stay in reality, and believe you me, it isn’t easy because I can’t find anything wrong with his face, and I just get lost in it.
And of course, he has a girlfriend, and of course he keeps approaching me, and I keep trying to play it cool, as if he isn’t turning me on…and I changed my schedule, and I have distanced myself from him.
I really saved myself from crossing the line in my head, and I say this because nothing is really going on between us in reality–I pretty much flushed my own AC behavior by reminding myself that he has a girl friend and asking myself some important questions, and I concluded that if he were to get involved with me, that would make him a cheat, and if I were to get involved with him that would be a violation of my values.
I wish I could say that him having a girlfriend immediately caused me to back off, but it didn’t.
It was more like a struggle: me flirting, him flirting, me changing my perfume, and dressing nicer, and then saying wth am I doing, and doing a 180. I suppose that is alright…progress not perfection.
I have found so much comfort in fantasies, and I know it. However, I just decided to give them up yesterday. It hurts because I am–once again–experiencing the familiar pain of knowing that I am ‘alone’, and I really do want a man in my life. I want a companion; I want a relationship, and I wanted a ‘normal’, happy family as a child, and…BUT I’ve decided that I will walk through this pain again…as hard as it is…. And, I am trying to let go of it once and for ALL…can I?
It feels really weird and sad to sit with the reality…and the feelings of “you don’t have anyone in your life–man-wise–nope, you really don’t, stop pretending, stop fantasizing and face it–you cannot fix the past with the affections of a man–you will never have the dad you always wanted….”
I used to think that God was going to send me a ‘good’ man, and I would have a story book family, and God would do this to make up for the lousy family that I grew up in…. Yes, I’ve been looking to make up for the past, to make sense of it.
Coming to terms with why God would put me in such of a miserable place is difficult sometimes, but it subsides when I feel grateful for what I do have; yes, I am starting to close the door now on the “wanting a storybook family thing.”
I never thought that I would close this door–but I am ready to release the pain, and accept that it is, and I don’t know why God …, but I want to find acceptance…damn, didn’t I say that last year?
…starting to find things in my life that I really enjoy.
I want to relax and stop creating drama in my life; I’m continue to take more action to find more peace and happiness for me and my family.
And, as far as men go, I’ve decided to stop looking, especially at work! WTH?
Yes, pain is not love, and pain can lead to growth, but you know what, I’m thinking, I’m ready to find some other way to grow.
Thank you all–I think I’m finally, really, on my way to heading out of Sugarland.
P.S. I think integrity in a man is one key…not looks…success, education, etc…yep, pffffffttt– they unfold….
Good for you, Leaving SugarLand.
Can I offer a different way of looking at being “alone” and why God would DO this to you???
I believe everything happens for a reason and it’s 99.9999999% of the time for a reason other than what we think it is. Maybe God put you into your family because your parents needed to learn something and YOU are the messenger??? Or perhaps YOU are the one who needs to learn something????
God didn’t DO this to you to punish you. And He WILL send you a “good man” when you are ready to deal with that good man in reality.
So pat yourself on the back! Your decision today just brought you one step closer to getting YOUR good man!
OLS,
Just want to say that I can really relate to where you are just now, catching yourself in the fantasizing and dealing with those expectations of finding love as a kind of prize for surviving childhood. Yep, yep, and yep.
For what it’s worth, the amount of self-awareness and self-acceptance in your post that shines through suggests wonderful things for you in the future. It’s not like you’re going to forget how to see reality now that you know you want to live happily ever after in it. What I mean is, some of the lessons you learned will never leave you, some you’ll have to practice until you get even more insight that will never leave you …
Here’s to staying in reality and to acceptance of non-storybook stories that can still be pretty darn cool, exciting, and full of love.
I am having a hard time right now because I am going back over the sadness, pain and exhaustion from all the things that have happened to me in the past year+ instead of celebrating the courage I have shown. I ended a long term marriage that was like an emotional desert to me and that I had stayed in too long because I was afraid that it was wrong to reject a man with “good points” and that I had no right to accept and to meet my own deeper needs for communication, emotional engagement and an adult to adult relationship (rather than a parent/child relationship where I made most of the decisions). I was doing really well initially until my ex, who said his priority was to work on himself and build the very best relationship he could with me, very quickly started an intense emotional committment with a woman he happened to meet on a plane (????) The timing of this was horrific as I had agreed to meet him for a hiking holiday with my daughter a few days after his plane trip. He completely denied the emotional engagement part even though reading his emails (sent though our business account) had all the subtlety of a 12 year old boy. Why was I traumatized so much when I initiated the breakup and don’t want to be married to him anymore?
I think the event finally forced me to see so clearly that the man hasn’t a clue either about me or about his own needs, motives or how he comes across and so being around him is and has been dangerous to me emotionally. It took me 5 months to get over this and whatever it meant it really really traumatized me. I guess I had never seen it all so clearly before. Oh, and then after this I got into a friendship with a man I helped on a support site i run…I don’t usually become friends with people but he was funny, smart, interesting and emotionally communicative…not intimate but expressed opinions which was refreshing to me. Of course he was the BR definition of ac and as soon as I saw his future faking and MY making a relationship out of nothing (because I was so vulnerable) I checked him off and out.
I have made a lot of changes in my life, I feel stronger and much more aware but I still get confused, anxious and afraid that I am stuck. I am heavily invested in work projects, other interests, my kids (although they are adults, friends, I love working out and running. But the concept of having another relationship…just exhausts me….I AM exhausted and would rather sit in a corner with a good book and a latte. This Christmas I will be spending more time with my ex and this was my hope- that we could be close and supportive friends in the areas we share (kids, politics, property and business – a lot). But honestly spending a lot of time with him makes me feel very edgy -like I used to feel…it IS a form of pain…I realize that he just does not have the capacity to connect emotionally so weird feelings between us are NEVER even experienced by him but I feel his lack of emotional awareness intensely..still. I really do NOT think I want/need/anything from him anymore but I would like to protect myself from him in a better way. How can I do this if strict NC isn’t an option?
I would like to be able right now to give myself validation in terms of how I have handled this year and the strength and insight I have shown but today at least-it’s hard.
espresso, i have read your posts before. you are brave and courageous. that doesn’t mean you can’t feel sad about what happened. embrace these feelings, you are still healing.
i have started to read a book by pema chodron: ‘when things fall apart’. it is beautiful and has been giving me a lot of strength.
hang in there, one day at a time ((hugs))
My daughter has been going through a break up/make up cycle with her boyfriend for the last ear. Her aunt gave a great analogy….it’s like quitting smoking, the pain and desire is overwhelming but the longer you go without the better you will feel.
THANK YOU! THANK YOU! THANK YOU!!!
Hi Natalie , i saw your blog advertised and i am amazed … i so needed to hear this right now .. Thank you .
I think I also will be treating myself this Christmas to your book/s
Merry Christmas
Love & light
Natalie
Thank you for the hugs and support Natashyia! I actually have that book in my bookshelf and will pull it out. It was a down day yesterday…but I feel much stronger today.Healing really IS so up and down…..
Hugs back!!
This reminds me of the relationship I just got out of 4 months ago. If you grew up in a chaotic household like myself, all you know is drama. Pain is the normal way of life. It becomes an oxymoron because when a relationship is going normal, to someone like myself it doesn’t feel right. Something must be wrong if there is no fighting or tense emotion. It’s truly an addiction.
My last boyfriend had a slew of short term relationships with nut jobs. The last before me lasted 4 months, she tried to commit suicide twice. Once while he was with me in order to get his attention. It did the job… He went back to her not even a month after our 2 year relationship ended. Let alone our 5 year friendship prior. He was the emotionally unavailable, shows no emotions kind of dude. It was very push pull; he would open up, push me away. Just when I would get a bread crumb of hope that he is feeling comfortable to be open, he closes.. Withdraws from me. He was the type where when we would have an argument instead of speaking about it like adults he would become silent and telling me “I’ll never be good enough for you.” It was honestly one of the most addicting relationships I’ve ever been in. Because I thought I was the exception. Just like my alcoholic parents I thought, well if I just do this a little differently then my mom will stop drinking. Like with my ex, I always blamed myself. Thinking if I approached him differently or said it in a different light he would have spoke about it with me. Not the case. He would tell me I was acting like his mother, which was a jab at my heart because his mother was very critical of him and I walked on eggshells to not be anything remotely close to that. I’m not sure if any of you have been through this… He always had a sort of intimacy issue. We were 22 when we started dating. He had no sex drive, no desire to have sex. When your 22 that all you really want to do when you first start dating. It was a red flag I chose to ignore. It was like this for our whole relationship. He would give me an excuse such as I live in my parents house, I promised my dad I wouldn’t or he would use the fact that his sister had an abortion 7 years ago as an excuse that hes scared to have sex. He would of course always give me a glimmer of hope and we would have great sex and then he would take it away, and I would have to beg or ask if we or when are we going to have sex next. He blamed me, that if I hadn’t acted in a certain way maybe he would want to have sex with me. Once we went 3 months, no sex. Red flag 23453. I literally got to the point of begging. Then we would have an adult conversation he said he would try and work on it… he didnt, and if he did it was for a day. Then at the end, he just imploded. Verbal abuse flew out the window left and right. I stayed because I was addicted to the pain. The pain felt like passion. It was not passion. It was pain. It took a long time to look at it and see that it was a toxic relationship. I couldnt fix him. At the end of our hellish break up. Not even a month later he went back to his “crazy” ex of 4 months. I am baffled. Yet happy that I dont have to deal with it anymore. Thank God I saw the light.
I find that I’m attracted to socially awkward, shy guys…that don’t reciprocate on the same level as I do. The thing is, the guy I like now (who is shy, and with whom I was very close a couple of months back) is avoiding me, but I’m not sure if it’s because he’s shy and likes me or because he’s not interested. I am afraid of moving on because of the possibility that he may have been interested and that I let the opportunity slide… Honestly, I think that otherwise, I’ve done all I could to get him on board, perhaps he’s just slow to respond… I don’t know, but he hasn’t really shown any signs of affection for 3 months now: after we got really close, he just tells me “I have to go” every time I am near him. I think I will let it go, but there is still that slight fear that he might like me…
This is very late in coming because I’ve been soooo busy having less time to be attentive to the posts. But I’ve just gotta say in response to the poster who said No Contact is a mental state. It absolutely is. However, if you are in the position where you must see that person each day or once a week, month, etc, I don’t see how you can be NC if you are responding to his attempts to engage you. NC is NOT ONLY MENTAL. That’s a cop out. It has got to be physical as well. When he opens his mouth he is talking to the air because you have vanished. You don’t stick around to give him an opportunity, an then give one word responses. i don’t feel that is really trying to discourage communication. We too often are afraid of appearing angry. So what! Where did playing nicey-nicey get us? If you cannot physically remove yourself then you IGNORE. You gotta send the strongest message possible so he gets it unmistakeably. And you don’t give it another thought. End of story.
Natalie could also add obsession to that list. OBSESSION IS NOT LOVE.
As someone who lives very much inside their head I realize I have a tendency to over-analyze and obsess over situations This is a pattern not only with romantic partners but with social interaction in general. I think it all comes down to having no self-worth, so I live and die by OTHER people’s validation of me. It’s an incredibly unhealthy and self-destructive way to live.
My day could be ruined if I think someone at work is mad at me, or if I said something “dumb” at a meeting. I’d go home and ruminate and obsess for hours and possibly days after the fact. So imagine how crazy obsessed I get in a romantic relationship? I’m giving not only my mind but my body to this person, so I’m going to be that much more vulnerable and invested in what they think of me. Once I’m hooked it’s like I can’t let go until I have their approval. It’s not because I love them, it’s because I want THEM to love ME.
I remember reading another post on BR a while ago that said basically: If it feels bad, then that’s all you need to know. From now on whenever I get that gut feeling that something is wrong, I’m going to stay with it and trust that feeling instead of always trying to rationalize and talk myself out of my own instincts.
Lilly,
There are PLENTY of ppl around who are stats boffins! This twat ISNT the only one! If ALL he’s done is help to crunch yr numbers & tidy up the edges of the reporting on YR research then, I’m sorry, it’s not even HIS research! It’s YOURS! Please, see this more clearly…
I just broke up with my narcissist boyfriend for the second time in the 6 months that we’ve known each other. He finally pushed me beyond my limits. You can’t imagine how patient I have been, how “nice” I tried to be, just to fix the problems that arose with the latest drama that he created out of nothing. We are in a long-distance relationship, though he comes to my country often for business. He had been telling me that he was going to book vacation with his company and come visit me over Christmas. Since the beginning of December, he kept promising me that he was going to book his flight very soon. Every day it was the same story — one excuse or another as to why he couldn’t book it. First it was the fact that he was working insane shifts (19 hours a day, 7 days a week), then it was the fact that his laptop monitor died.. I bought both excuses, because I had seen his monitor acting weird before, and it’s not unreasonable that it may have “died” on him. OK, fine. But he could’ve borrowed a laptop from a friend and bought the ticket that way. Or, gotten the ticket when he got his laptop back (a week ago). But even then, he took about a week to get down to actually searching for tickets. By then, ticket prices had skyrocketed, and he told me there’s no way he’s willing to put in 1000 British pounds to come visit me. I had even been willing to buy the ticket from here, and get reimbursed for it later on when he came here, but he had rejected that possibility. OK, fair enough, maybe he was being chivalrous and respecting me by not wanting me to put in the money, but combined with his behaviour, his pickiness every time I found a flight (he would complain about the departure time being too early, etc.), all made me wonder if he really wanted to come visit me or if he was just playing a mind game to make it look like he had done his best and *wanted* to see me, but it unfortunately did not work out. Anyway, he then sent me a text message, saying that his trip to Thailand for work in mid-January had been cancelled, and so he could come visit me then, when ticket prices were cheaper, but that he’d keep checking for last minute cheap tickets for Christmas anyway. I was pretty pissed at that: I had put my Christmas travel plans on hold (I usually go visit my sister, and I don’t go for a few days, I usually spend both Christmas and New Year’s with her, which means that if I had booked my flight to go see my sister, my bf would not have been able to come anyway). He just blew me off last minute, without even so much as an apology. Not only that, but he ASSUMED that I’d be able to accommodate him in January. Of course. Given that the universe revolves around his narcissistic self, I’d have to conform to his schedule all the time. Anyway, I was upset, so I didn’t reply to that text, because I didn’t want to say anything that would make him throw another one of his tantrums (I always walk on eggshells around him). I guess it was a mistake. I should’ve been overjoyed that he blew me off last minute like that, apparently. THe fact that I did not, got to him and his ego. He then accused me of ignoring him for a full day. Sent me an email, saying that it was over between us. I called him, and he yelled at me, saying he doesn’t need this sort of drama in his life, that he just wants to have a good, relaxing, fun time. And he hung up on me without even letting me explain my point of view (of course, I am not supposed to have an opinion). I then showered him with texts literally groveling and begging his forgiveness, telling him I was sorry, that I didn’t mean to upset him, etc. I asked him if we could talk the next morning. He ignored that. Sent him another text while he was at work, saying I hoped we could talk tonight, and he replied “yeah ok.” Called him at night (he didn’t even text me to let me know he was home), and he picked up the phone (to my surprise). Icy cold conversation, and we just ended it without a fight. He asked me if I wanted to talk later on tonight, and I said, yeah, sure, but it’s up to you, if you want to… He then said, fine, never mind, speak later… What the hell? I was bewildered. I then wondered if I hadn’t seemed interested enough in talking to him, so I texted him that I was on Skype if he wanted to talk. He texted me back saying he wasn’t in a good mood, too much pressure at work, etc., and said “speak later ok?” I said, sure, keep me posted on how work goes. I was pretty upset, but didn’t want to push my luck. An hour after that, he texts me and we have a casual conversation via text. He tells me he’s still taking a vacation (but spending it at home, watching tv). I was disappointed because he’s taking 16 days of holiday and we’re not even spending time together. Anyway, I told him, good for you. I then asked him if he had any plans to come visit me over the next year. He said “No. What a question.” I was baffled by his reaction. WHAT? He then accused me of being moody, impossible to talk to, etc. – the way I phrased my questions were apparently not to his liking. Suggested that we take a break from talking to each other for a few days. Said that I never talk about his concerns with his job (which is bullshit, because before this whole drama, I called him and we talked every day for 1 hour, and most of it was him talking about his job, his frustrations with what was going on at his workplace, etc.). When I told him that we had always talked about his job, etc., he said, “yeah that’s just smalltalk — like how’s work, what’s the weather like, etc.” WHAT? OH MY GOD. I was this close to losing it then and there. I didn’t, though. I kept my cool. He then said he was going for a cigarette, and said “speak later, ok? x.” I said ok and then I remembered that I had asked a ticket agency about the prices of tickets, and she had told me that it was about 860 pounds (not 1000 pounds as he claimed). And then I said I was going out for dinner and beer, and that I hoped he’d enjoy the rest of his evening. The next morning, I sent him a few cute pictures of animals, before he left for work. Said good morning, etc. No reply. Sent another text, asking if he was awake, and realized that while the first messages were marked as “delivered”, the latest one was marked as “sent” only, not “delivered.” Which meant that he had seen the first few messages, and turned off his phone and left for work (he is not allowed to take his personal phone into the base where he works). I was fuming. He was giving me the silent treatment. After all the groveling and begging I had done in the past few days to set things right, I was expecting a bit less of a cold treatment. But apparently that was too much to ask for. I sent him a text, telling him I had had enough of his shitty treatment after I had groveled and begged to set things right even though I had a good reason to be upset about the flight situation. I told him not to talk about chivalry (he always talked about that) until he learns how to respect women and treat them properly. I asked him not to contact me until he found it in himself to apologize. I told him that stress is no excuse to make me walk on eggshells all the time, and to force me to beg for his forgiveness for days. He got the message when he got back from work in the evening. Shortly thereafter, he deleted me from Skype. Did not reply to my text. I am assuming it’s over. I was so scared of sending that message. I had thought of doing it 3 days ago, after the first round of groveling produced a mere ice-cold treatment on his part.. but I was too scared. Too scared that things would REALLY end. Even now, I still have hope that he will come back to me and will probably accept a semblance of an apology if that means we can go back to having what we used to have. This relationship (if you can call it that) has been such a rollercoaster. Maybe it’s not good for me and my health and my career, but there are times when he’s so sweet and attentive, and loving, and it just makes me think that it’s all worth it. Most of the time, I feel guilty, though. I feel sorry for him, because I know he can be a good, caring person. I also feel incredibly guilty about that last text I sent him. It must be so hard to come home after a long day at work and find a break-up text on your phone.
I wouldn’t want anyone to do that to me, but I had to do it for my own sanity. Did I overreact? Did he have good reason to be upset when I didn’t reply to his text mssg about the flight? I don’t know. I constantly question my own behaviour. I never used to do that. 
Just read this and no, although it is a bit rich coming from me just now, I would not question what you did. I absolutely hate control and manipulation by phone…and this is what the asshole has done. It made my blood boil because it triggered memories of the bastard that led me here in 2010, and latterly the reason I am back (to get it right I hope). The phone can be an instrument of torture, and coupled with you twisting yourself up in knots, arranging your plans around only for him to act like an arse, expecting you to grovel and ignore you when you do …aaaarggh! Still thinking you overreacted? I say good for you. Like many of these jerks, the hook is that he can be sweet etc etc. CAN be. But chooses not to be when he is not calling the shots. I can’t say too much about questioning behaviour, because I am wearing that hat with AC 2 at the moment, but lots of wise folk here who would say that is part of their game plan. You are well rid. Honestly.
Thanks, Alibi. I just coincidentally discovered today that his ex is returning to his country over the holidays (the same day that he was so desperate to return home from his job abroad). She is apparently is meeting up with a few old friends and acquaintainces there. I am now wondering if the fact that he bailed on visiting me is due to the fact that he got a message or an email from her to meet up? That could explain a lot, because even after I found tickets that cost only $100 more than the cheapest one (the one he had said he would be willing to get), he declined. If she was the reason for it, I would be doubly-pissed because he put me on the back burner in order to explore the possibility of getting back with his ex. Disgusting.
Think about it, if you treated an assclown like he treats you..He would never stay around for bad treatment so why should you???
An extremely powerfull post..It made me teary eyed.
ShockandAwe:
I’m going to use excerpts from your post in my reply. I don’t now how to bold, so my replies will be in Caps…I’m not shouting.
“I just broke up with my narcissist boyfriend for the second time in the 6 months that we’ve known each other.” TWO BREAKUPS IN 6 MONTHS…BECAUSE HE’S A NARCISSIST! DO YOURSELF A FAVOR. RUN, RUN, RUN AS FAST AND AS FAR AS YOU CAN. YOU WILL BE SAVING YOUR SNITY, YOUR DIGNITY, YOUR SENSE OF SELF. IN SHORT, YOUR EMOTIONAL LIFE.
“…just to fix the problems that arose with the latest drama that he created out of nothing.” HE CREATED THE DRAMA FOR ONE PURPOSE AND ONE PURPOSE ONLY. HE TRULY THINKS HE’S THE CENTER OF THE UNIVERSE AND HE WAS DOING WHAT HE WANTED TO DO. BTW, IT’S NT YOUR JOB TO BE “NICE.” OR TO “FIX” THINGS FOR HIM. YOU’RE NOT HIS MOMMY. HE’S A GROWN MAN. FIXING THINGS HE CREATES IS HIS JOB. AND BEING ‘NICE’ IN THIS CONTEXT IS VERY UNHEALTHY.
“…he took about a week to get down to actually searching for tickets. By then, ticket prices had skyrocketed, and he told me there’s no way he’s willing to put in 1000 British pounds to come visit me. EXCUSES, EXCUSES, EXCUSES. IT’S A GAME. HE’S “SHOWING” YOU THAT HE CARES BY MAKING THE PROMISE. IT’S ALL DESIGNED TO KEEP YOU UNDER CONTROL WHILE HE DOES WHATEVER THE HELL HE WANTS TO DO ANYWAY. HE REALLY NEVER HAD ANY INTENTION OF COMING TO SEE YOU OVER THE HOLIDAYS. HENCE THE EXCUSES AND THE DRAGGING HIS HEELS TO GET ONLINE AND BOOK A DARN TICKET. IT TAKES, WHAT, THIRTY MINUTES TOPS TO DO THIS. HE’S VERY PASSIVE AGGRESSIVE… WHICH IS NOT ONLY ABUSIVE, BUT JUST SO FRIGGING CHILDISH. ICK!!!
“I had even been willing to buy the ticket from here, and get reimbursed for it later on when he came here, but he had rejected that possibility.” NO, NO, NO! NEVER DO THAT! HE HAS MONEY. HE KNOWS HOW TO BOOK A FLIGHT. MY GOD, YOU REALIZE THAT OFFERING TO PAY FOR HIM TO COME SEE YOU (WHICH HE SHOULD BE THRILLED AND EXCITED TO BE DOING IF HE WERE A NORMAL, HEALTHY MAN) LOOKS LIKE YOU’RE SO DESPERATE TO SEE HIM THAT YOU’LL BUY HIM??? TALK ABOUT UNKNOWINGLY FEEDING AND STROKING HIS EGO.
“…combined with his behaviour, his pickiness every time I found a flight (he would complain about the departure time being too early, etc.), all made me wonder if he really wanted to come visit me or if he was just playing a mind game to make it look like he had done his best and *wanted* to see me, but it unfortunately did not work out.” BINGO!!! NO NEED TO WORRY, ANALYZE, ETC. YOU JUST SPOKE THE 100% TRUTH. YOU’VE NAILED HIS M.O.
“Anyway, he then sent me a text message, saying that his trip to Thailand for work in mid-January had been cancelled, and so he could come visit me then, when ticket prices were cheaper, but that he’d keep checking for last minute cheap tickets for Christmas anyway.” THROWING YOU A BONE TO KEEP YOU QUIET AND TO NOT QUESTION HIM. NARCS ABHOR BEING QUESTIONED BY LESSER MORTALS…MEANING BY ANYONE ELSE ON THE ENTIRE PLANET.
“He just blew me off last minute, without even so much as an apology.” DON’T EVEN EXPECT ONE. YOU’LL BE WAITING UNTIL THE END OF TIME. THEY DON’T APOLOGIZE.
“Not only that, but he ASSUMED that I’d be able to accommodate him in January. Of course. Given that the universe revolves around his narcissistic self, I’d have to conform to his schedule all the time.” YOU ARE SEEING HIM CLEARLY. IS THIS REALLY WHAT LOVE LOOKS LIKE??? IS THIS WHAT YOU WANT FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE??? TRUST ME, IT WILL ONLY GET WORSE. HE IS SHOWING YOUU WHO HE REALLY IS AND WHO HE WILL ALWAYS BE.
“I was upset, so I didn’t reply to that text, because I didn’t want to say anything that would make him throw another one of his tantrums (I always walk on eggshells around him). THIS IS NOT ONLY TYPICAL WITH NARCS…YOU WALKING ON EGGSHELLS…BUT IT IS A HUGE, GIGANYIC, ENORMOUS RED FLAG!!! HE IS PERSONALITY DISORDERED. IT’S NOT CURABLE. GET OUT BEFORE HE LITERALLY DESTROYS YOU…WHICH IS HIS MAIN OBJECTIVE. COUNT ON IT!
“I should’ve been overjoyed that he blew me off last minute like that, apparently. The fact that I did not, got to him and his ego.”
NO, THE FACT YOU HAD THE GALL, THE TEMERITY TO ACTUALLY CALL HIM OUT ON HIS BEHAVIOR IS WHAT HE CANNOT ABIDE.
i can’t continue to go through thi line by line. It’s triggering me. I will say this however:
He is a Narcissist. It is a disorder. It IS NOT curable. He does not see you as a person, a separate being with needs, wants, desires, thoughts, opinions of your own. You are, TO HIM, a possession, an object and extension of him. In his mind, you are to think as he thinks; feel what he feels; believe what he believes; want what he wants. His goal iis to literally insinuate himself into every single facet of your life until you have no life of your own, no will of your own. If you deviate in ANY way, YOU will be punished.
I can’t state this any clearer. I am not being dramatic or overstating the seriousness of being involved with a narcissist. Narcs, sociopaths, borderline personalities ARE assclowns on steroids. You CANNOT fix this. You CANNOT “handle” it. You CANNOT change it and you CANNOT love him into loving you. They are incapable of giving and receiving love. Period.
My father is a narcissist. He actually has said to my face, “Don’t you know your ONLY reason for existing is to serve me?” He said it and he meant it with every fiber of his being. THIS PERFECTLY STATES HOW THEY THINK. THIS IS THEIR TRUE WORLD VIEW.
I am begging you, please get out NOW. You have a choice. This is your chance. Go 100% NC, block him, change your number. Leave and NEVER look back. You have a chance to escape. Should you stay, or go back, you quite literally are volunteering to have your soul destroyed, one day at a time, inch by inch. And he WILL do that. It is how his brain is wired.
You will be in my thoughts. Please, give yourself the best Christmas present EVER and do not engage any further with this guy. (hugs)
I have 50 years experience with this. It took me 40 years to realize that this was not normal and 10 years of therapy to finally understand and believe that I have a God-given right to exist and to be.