Why you’ll always be a Yo-Yo Girl if you don’t maintain the No Contact Rule
July 24, 2008 by NML
In another excerpt from new ebook, Mr Unavailable and the Fallback Girl, I explain the assuming that keeps a Yo-Yo Girl (YYG) in her boomerang relationship with her ‘bad penny’ Mr Unavailable. This excerpt is from the chapter on The Yo-Yo Girl, from the section, You’re thinking ‘We’re back together!’, he’s thinking ‘We’re hooking up…’
The biggest question that YYG’s ask themselves is ‘Why does he keep coming back?’ and it’s simply because he can. That…and he’s the original Dog In a Manger – He don’t want you but he doesn’t want you to move onto someone else who might actually want you and prevent him from being able to have the easy access that he currently has back into your life. In order for Mr Unavailable’s to indulge in this boomerang behaviour, there has to be a facilitating YYG. In fact, Mr Unavailable’s would not be able to exist and continue with their behaviour if there weren’t Fallback Girl’s ready and waiting to co-manage this dysfunctional partnering.
But as a YYG a particular problem presents itself because other Fallback Girl’s meet a Mr Unavailable, have the usual roll call of issues, break up, and move onto a new Mr Unavailable. With you, you keep bouncing back and forth between the same Mr Unavailable’s because they keep turning up and you keep letting them back in.
You start believing that the reason why he keeps returning is because he recognises that there is more to you and this relationship than he realised.
In your mind you think “Bingo! I knew he’d come round to my way of thinking!” and in his mind he thinks “Ah..that Susan’s good fun. We had some good times together. I wonder how she is… We should meet up. I’m sure she realises now that I’m not the settling down kind so it’ll be easier this time.”
Much like with all interactions with Mr Unavailable’s, whilst they are very good at controlling the pace of things and what you get out of the relationship, you set the tone. He can only get away with as much as you’re prepared to let him get away with.
Mr Unavailable could call you up and suggest you meet up and you could turn him down. You just don’t.
Mr Unavailable could start blowing hot, offer to take you out and end up in your bed, but you don’t actually have to let him.
All it actually takes is for you to repeatedly turn down his offers of ‘reconnecting’, stop slipping him the sex, and basically cut the contact…but you don’t. After a while he learns the pattern with you and behaves accordingly.
My Mr Unavailable drives me insane. It’s like he only really wants me when he thinks that being with me again is in serious jeopardy. He’s so intense and full on then and showers me with attention. It took a long time to realise though that there was a pattern to us getting back together. I’ll tell him to get lost, he’d beg and plead, I’d stand firm, he’d leave, I wouldn’t hear from him for a day or two, then he’d call to see how I am, soon it wasn’t long before he’d turn up on my doorstep for a ‘chat’, he’d give it the big talk and say he wanted things to work, I’d take him back, and so it would start all over again till next time. I feel like I’m wasting the best years of my life and it’s bloody exhausting. Yes, I’m still doing it…
Karen, 36, via email counselling
It often feels like these guys have an in-built homing device that senses when it’s just the right moment to call and whilst I don’t disagree that men do seem to have a nose for these things, there are some things that send the signal….
You respond when he makes contact with you – This sends the sign that even though you might be a little pissed off with him, you’re not so pissed off that you’re ignoring him, which he also reads as your potential interest in him. He will either blow hot to draw you back in so that you reconnect…albeit temporarily or for some of the colder bastard variety, just responding is enough to make them feel better and they disappear again.
You don’t respond when he makes contact with you – He reads this a sign that you may be getting over him or heaven forbid, you’ve met someone else. This is an indicator to up the contact and start blowing hot to win your attention.
You drop whatever or whomever you’re doing to meet up with him or get back together – This sends the sign that you’re still hooked and that he can have you. You tend to read his reconnecting with you as a sign that you’re getting back together whereas he sees it as the two of you being a bit nostalgic and hooking up.
You tell him that you’re over him, you’re not taken in by him any longer, and that you’re just with him for fun – He reads this as a challenge to prove you wrong after all his ego can’t cope with the possibility of you not being interested. From the moment you’re entertaining him, he reads this as a signal that you are actually interested.
You tell him you’re fine with being friends – He reads this as an open invitation to keep in contact, nose around in your business, and keep an eye on whether you’re moving on. When you treat him like a friend, he challenges the boundaries to see if it’s really the case because being platonic would mean you were over him, hence it’s time to strike.
You’ve improved your appearance, appear busy, and are independent – Another sign that you may be moving on and seeking out pastures new.
You’re an ego massage for him. If they haven’t got in touch with you because their homing device senses that you may have moved on, they can also get in touch because they may have experienced something that has put a dent in their ego and returning to you makes them feel better and inadvertently reinvigorates their confidence that they’re still as great as they think they are. Maybe they’re being rebuffed by other women. Maybe it’s taking longer to pull his new target. Maybe he’s not so busy at work or with his social life and suddenly feels at a loose end. Maybe he sees that yet another friend has got a girlfriend or has taken the plunge and got married and it challenges his fear of getting close to a woman and being committed. Whatever it is, it’s enough to galvanise him into making contact and you read this as his welcome return. They stick around till they’ve got their narcissistic fill or they suddenly realise that they don’t actually want to be anything more than they’ve ever been with you.
By you reading his reconnection as a sign that things are stepping up a notch between the two of you, the expectations that result of this whether they are communicated or not, put things back in perspective for him.
When he steps back and disappears again, it’s because he is redressing the balance and bringing your expectations back down to a manageable level, i.e. just enough to ensure that should he choose to come back, you’ll let him back into your life. He is maintaining the status quo, again.
I cannot emphasise it enough that when he’s retreating it’s because he doesn’t want to be around so much that you might need or expect something, and he doesn’t want to be responsible.
He really is that Dog in a Manger, toying with you like a Yo-Yo, stringing you along, hogging the manger to keep other men at bay and stop you from making a move, but sniffing around outside the manger because he doesn’t really want you. But he does need to ensure that should he ever decide that he wants you, albeit temporarily, you will take him.
Your thoughts?
This excerpt is taken from the chapter The Other Woman from my new eBook Mr Unavailable and the Fallback Girl. Find out more and download.
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talk about reality smacking me in the face. this sounds so much like my so called luv life that it’s beyond depressing. i really don’t know how to stop the cycles and it hurts really bad that i have to keep going thru this.
NML, I think one of the most profound lines I recall in a Hollywood Movie, was Harrison Ford in ‘Six Days, Seven Nights.’ “You want to know how a woman turns a guy on? She shows up. We’re guys, we’re easy.”
When a lady shows up at a party or bar or any where, the only important thing to a guy is - she is there. What is said doesn’t matter, what happened doesn’t matter. A screaming fight really doesn’t matter, because: 1) She is there; and 2) All that emotion means that she cares.
No Contact really does mean no contact, and is the loudest, clearest way a woman can communicate to a man.
Brad, when you say “show up at a bar” what do you mean? A few months back i ran into my EUM at a bar.. I was there first, and immediately wanted to leave. My friend, however, would not let me. I avoided him, as he rubber necked all night to see where i was. He finally passed where i was and stopped as i was talking and i said, “hi, how are you” and then turned back to my conversation.. I truly doubt he thought i cared at that point.. i avoided him for the next hour or so, and then left. I went home and changed and went to another bar and him and his friends were there!!! This is Rhode Island… LOL.. i completely ignored him, was with a guy, and went to the inside bar where I stayed all night as not to see him….
What will happen next time? Hopefully there won’t be a next time…. too much stress, but it was a little empowering.. I think your point is when a girl will go someplace b/c she knows her ex guy is there.. is that correct?
What is so empowering is seeing through their b.s./ceasing to make our own erroneous assumptions - and getting rid of the EUM - because I am not interested in being fooled/jerked around/really offered nothing when it comes down to it. NO CONTACT gives ME the power to do that.
NO CONTACT means I deserve better and I’m not willing to lie to myself anymore that he has any genuine intentions.
ANNIE.. WELL PUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This is a reality post for me. This has been my situation for 4 years and Im still there. We are on the non talking phase…and he did exactly as was decribed last week, one simple text to see if I would respond and I did and havent heard from him since. I dont know what to do, Im growing tired of this charade but I cant seem to pull myself out of it. I did the no contact for a lil more than a year and I still went back…I know I have to move on if I want more and to be happy.
Sheila, Do you see a pattern here? I do *not* think much of your ‘friend’ that wouldn’t let you leave. You might want to examine that relationship - not your friend, but how you interact with her/him.
No Contact with a ex-EUM is a big deal. This is life-changing stuff. Your friend may not have understood, you might have wanted to keep the reasoning and details private. But if you wanted to leave (which I think would have been the right thing to do), you should have left. Immediately. Why your friend would put her needs ahead of your crisis bothers me.
Your relationship with your friend sounds too much like wanting to drop the EUM, but not making a complete break. Hanging on, letting others rule your choices. You had a chance to balance what you needed - not to encourage the EUM, protect yourself from him and from your own turnmoil - against pleasing your friend. And you gave responsibility for your actions away, this time to your friend.
Your evening was then spent keeping an eye on the EUM. Your verbal response to the EUM should have been much briefer. Something like, “Hello, now go.” (Skip the casual chitchat, keep it formal, avoid intimate smiles, forget the put-the-guy-at-his-ease stuff. Practice the ’steely eyed b****’ look from My Chauffeur.) This doesn’t sound like you made the right choice, to stay with your friend. “I want to go home now” should be sufficient for any friend or date - or be cause to leave on your own.
As for the EUM? What he knows is that 1) you stayed all evening; 2) you kept track of him (not just present, but engaged with him); and 3) you spoke to him in a casual (ie. intimate, inviting manner, “Hi”). The signals you sent him were not mixed at all, for him. And he stayed around. His signals to you weren’t really mixed, either - you got the full message. And he knows you know. Nope. Showing up (or staying, that night) is a loud and clear message.
Wow, did I need this “kick in the pants” today! My ex-EUM has been “sniffing around” and sending me e-mails, etc. in the past couple of weeks, and I, being the classic fallback girl, responded to them and was dumb enough to ask him to lunch last week, which he willingly agreed to. How stupid is that? We had a “talk” back in March that we would be “friends”, but he has been sitting back and not making any efforts to hang out outside of work, etc. So, today, at this moment I will get back on the NC, and I will not fall off the NC wagon. Lately I have been feeling like I am losing my mind over this stupid man! Anyway, thanks again NML for putting it so clearly that NO CONTACT is the only way in these situations. I learned my lesson the hard way…..
Brad K, don’t you think if one were to follow your advice, she would look bitter and not over the situation???
And perhaps saying hello would be mature and just get on with her night???
Brad.. i agree with unknowndiva.. i was not going to look bitter, i was not going to engage in conversation, which i didn’t at all.. I said, ‘hi, how are you” and immediately dismissed him.. I stayed out of his range, ignored him when he passed to go to the bathroom, and left thru another door as not to pass him.. I respect your opinion, especially about my friend who is selfish by the way, that i wanted to leave and she said “no”.. I am not out to prove to anyone that I can handle myself while he’s there in a social scene drinking.. it never never works out… but in my opinion, i did handle it, and very well…
One of our mutual friends noticed i was there and told him, to which he responded.. ‘ I saw her she doesn’ want to talk to me, she even blocked my cell number:”…. I don’t want to leave witht he upper hand but I did leave with my pride and he by no means thought i was still blogging about his sorry ass, althuogh I am… LOL …
I did not “engage him”.. .. i was mature, brief, and short, almost as if i did not know him that well.. i then turned and he had no choice but to keep walking…
and no i did not stay all evening.. i left an hour later and he was still there.. AS far as the 2nd place, i picked a spot for the night and never saw him again..
again, i respect your opinion, esp since you’re a guy, but i thihk i handled the situation great under the circumstances… If i run into him again, i may leave, that was overall the best choice.. i won’t deny that…
Sheila/Brad, I would not have left the 1st bar, but saying: “Hi, how are you” that gave him attention. I would not have acknowledged him. Sheila, he knows you are in Love with him. Now, going to the 2nd bar where he was with his friends, that gave him the impression you are looking for him.
I don’t think this has anything to do with being mature, but talking to him may encourage him to make contact in the future - and that would not be good for you Sheila, you are not over him yet and he will reel you back in.
Once you feel indifferent about him, then you can talk to him should you run into him
I agree with Astelle–there is a fine line between our brain telling us that we need to have no contact and need to move on, and our heart telling us that we still have feelings for them, and maybe they will eventually love us. So, we try to maintain NC but if our EUM comes slithering around in any way, our heart convinces us to respond and let them in. But as we know, the end result is ALWAYS the same. We expect a different result and then are crushed when it doesn’t happen. We have all done this, and we always end up hurt and disappointed. So, we MUST keep the NO CONTACT rule with our EUMs in order to heal and move on. I know it isn’t easy and it just plain sucks sometimes, but the temporary pain it causes isn’t as bad as being on the emotional rollercoaster and never having the strength and courage to get off of it.
Finalyoverit… agreed 100% i have broken it lots of times, twice really breaking it.. I cannot tell you how rock bottom I was.. it is not worth it.. nothing changes…
I am now on one month of nothing.. he is blocked in every which way possible as I cannot call him either…. yesterday i get a pix messge from him.. i guess those cannot be blocked via cell b/c they go thru a different system…..ignore, then delete… He can’t have the best of both worlds, don’t bother me.. I have come too far as of this point and i’m not wasting anymore time on his sorry self-absorbd, lying, deceitful, narcissistic ass…!!!!
NC… only way to go…
unknowndiva, I am not concerned that Sheila might have looked bitter - although I don’t think that would have needed to be the impression. If she had just left or left looking hurt, though, that might have been appropriate. And I think most adults would assume, if Sheila picked up and left when she first spotted the guy, that she was either hurt or avoiding trouble.
Sheila, unknowndiva, that was my recommendation. The No Contact Rule and common sense say that avoiding contact, regardless of how you feel or appear to others, is a shield, the only way you have to protect yourself from further hurt.
And if it looked like Sheila wasn’t over him, that is only the truth. It isn’t over. Where he was, when he passed near, he had her attentions - which was what I meant by ‘engaged’ as in interlocking gears being ‘engaged’ so that one turns the other at a measured pace.
Sheila, the word ‘Hi’ is a casual form of greeting, and implies an intimacy between greeter and the one being greeted. Most people use more formal terms of address when meeting strangers, or those they fear may hurt them (as you fear that getting involved with this guy again will hurt you again). “Hello” would have lacked the assumption that you accept him as a casual acquaintance, or a friend.
And the phrase ‘How are you” is not a throwaway statement. It was intended at first, and still expresses, an interest in the well-being of one person for another. It is a question. You don’t ask questions if you don’t want an answer, so ‘Hi, how are you” establishes that you are friends with the guy, and you have an interest in how he is - his health, his feelings, his attitude, his self-image. However you really feel, how ever much you really want to know that he is OK (or maybe that he is hurting), this kind of intimate conversation is not appropriate when you are breaking up.
As NML points out in the title of this post, No Contact is No Contact. That means you don’t let him manipulate you, or your family, or your email or phone provider, to continue to affect you and your life. No Contact is no contact. While you are still healing, your first need is to protect yourself, not to win a reputation for ‘being better’ than the guy or the circumstances or whatever. Please take care of yourself, first.
Brad K., I appreciate getting a male perspective, but sometimes I think you are purposefully trying to “rattle the cage” and get fired up responses from those who post on this website, rather than giving input that is compassionate and supportive. I think we have “analyzed” Sheila’s post adequately, and I think she knows how to handle her relationship challenges without judgment or condemnation.
FinallyOverit, I don’t always agree with Brad, but today I do. Keep in mind, he is looking at this as a “normal” man, he doesn’t have that twisted thinking that our EU’s have. Nobody is judging Sheila, we give our opinions. Should I run into my ex EU, I will not acknowledge him, why should I? He has lied and deceived me, he doesn’t deserve a “Hi” or “Hallo”. Brad is right, these guys are manipulators and I would not go thru the trouble of changing phone numbers or blocking, I am in charge of my phone. The No Contact is for us, not him, he doesn’t know (yet) that you cut the contact, but eventually he will get it.
On being compassionate and supporting, we are all supporting here, but eventually we have to take responsibility for our actions.
I am grateful that I got tough love from NML when she answered all my questions when I found this website, I needed somebody to really open my eyes.
I took that knowledge and applied it and I think a lot of women here did that as well. Compassion, hmm, a few months ago, if I would have even mention his name to any of my friends I would hear, don’t start again, are you still pining over that loser, is it so much fun being his doormat?
I say, there are only 2 options: cut him out of your life or keep playing his game over and over. I don’t want that for Sheila or any woman out there.
Point taken, Astelle, and I agree 100%. Maybe it’s just his way of writing that seems a little “judgy” but I understand what he is trying to say.
Do all EUMs send mixed messages? Mine has said all kinds of things that keep me hanging on, like how much he cares, what a good wife I’d be, how he’s going to find me in a few years and marry me, etc. All words of course and his actions contradict this, he frequently stands me up, in fact the only time we go out is after I practice NC for a week or so and he begins to panic. I’m actually wondering if he even knows what he wants. I keep holding on to the fact that in a few years, he could be a great guy…if I can just hold on longer or keep him in my life in some capacity. Does NC mean NC forever?
I think that Sheila did the absolute right thing. Honestly.
She showed that not only can she be civil, but, she is not going to stop doing whatever the heck she wants, regardless of whether or not he is there.
It’s a small town, it’s going to happen.
If anything, it showed him that she is the bigger person. And if I am not mistaken, that is exactly what the friend was thinking by not letting her leave.
You can’t let them continue to have that kind of power over you, especially leaving a public place. That screams drama and that you can’t handle it.
Who cares what he thinks, or his impression of the situation.
Sheila should be concerned with herself.
Good girl Sheila
i appreciate Brad’s perspective, but to be honest with you, i cannot be bothered analyzing Hello, hi, how are you, are any other greeting.. I can guarantee that my EUM did not put that much thought into what i said.. he is too self consumed… I was not going to look bitter, and i have know him for 5 years, so i was mature about it.. trust me he got the hint.. I did not engage after that, an immediately turned away from him and continued my conversation… Yes, i probably should have left so i could have peace of mind, but i know people who play the “i won’t acknowledge you game” and i think they look like spiteful immmature losers..
Yes, he hurt me, but he will not break me and by me ignoring him and leading on to him that i am that hurt by him. Should i care? probably not, but i still have some pride, and i’m trying to salvage it and i think i did very well that night under the circumstances.. To say that my EUM analyzed what i did, i feel, is totally ridiculous. He got the message…. loud and clear and looked as if I have moved on from him and could give a shit.. But, yes, i would have left….
I understand what NC is, trust me, and i’m over a month of it right now, but i’m not hibernating in this small state, nor am I going to the places he goes either.
I guess we can agree to disagree…
I just didn’t think the purpose of this website is to critique and analyze how we are choosing to handle our relationships with EUMs or anyone for that matter. Women who are involved with EUMs, and who are trying to gain a more positive outlook in their lives need to be able to have a safe place to vent, process, understand, learn and grow. That’s what I thought this website was all about…..?
Sheila - Sorry.
Brad, of course, I’m not Sheila but I don’t think you or anyone else here owes anyone any apologies. We all come to this forum with different experiences to gain new perspectives. I believe it’s okay to give your opinion. You were not rude or disrespectful. You spoke your truth and that’s what this forum is all about. I think that we should all encourage each other to speak honestly as long as it is respectful. We are adults and can agree to disagree. I learned alot from your comments and from everyone else’s and I would hate for anyone to stop giving honest opinions. Something in NML’s article or perhaps even in the comments will click and give me and others what we need to move past this stage in our lives on to bigger and better things. (I don’t want to sound preachy but I like open discussion alot.)
agreed.. no hard feelings at all..
OK at this point I think I should intervene as I feel that the ‘tone’ of the comments is nosediving and I don’t want 1) people to feel that they are being attacked and 2) for it to appear like any one person is being ganged upon.
The trouble with comments, forums, and form of place where you have the opportunity to put something out there is that you invite commentary from others and it may not always be your point of view. Remove Brad and it could be anyone, male or female, who could say worse or less.
I am not here to censor anyone and usually the comments have a way of ironing themselves out because this site has been very good at self moderating, but at the same time, I don’t want to feel that my site is becoming a hostile environment. To anyone.
I have been conversing with Sheila for a few months now. I don’t mollycoddle her and I do deal in cold, hard facts, simply because if people were looking for someone to tiptoe around them, they wouldn’t be at this site. It is about learning and processing and growth, but I don’t deal in BS, and sometimes readers follow suit. The difference is that if I say something or even certain other regular commenters, it is expected from me. Brad doesn’t get the same reaction from all readers; quite the opposite, but this is not the first time we have been down this road between you both hence why I felt the need to intervene.
And actually, many readers do critique and analyse their relationships and their actions on here and privately via email. It’s a habit of women, and especially of Fallback Girls to want to understand something so they can find a solution, and they usually want a solution that involves them not having to leave the guy.
My very brief take on the situation - You could look the situ in two different ways; ignore him or don’t, and actually neither one of these things matter in the grander scheme of things. It’s what happens *afterwards* that matters. If the person is analysing it, still heavily emotionally invested, obsessing about what to do next, then the effort into either one of these actions could be detrimental. I am obviously saying this in a general sense and if Sheila doesn’t give a monkey’s about him and the experience is done and dusted with, who cares?
But if the amount of thought during and after the action is disproportionate to the action (as in much bigger), then there are problems. Only Sheila knows and at the end of the day, part of the growth process is learning what feels right and what feels wrong. Sometimes we’ll make mistakes and often we get it right if we are trusting ourselves that we are doing the right thing at that time.
This site means something different to every reader and it is up to them to determine their experience. If they want to critique or be critiqued, then so be it, but all I ask is that even though you can have opposing views, let’s keep things in the nature of the site - empowerment, self-love, and knowledge, however you choose to get there.
If this issue cannot be resolved, I will close the comments on this post. It’s not what I like to do but if it makes things easier, so be it.
I just saw after commenting that a few more comments have come through since Brad’s.
Well, I’m a little late to the conversation but I do want to say to Sheila that I completely get the whole RI/small town reference. In Map Dot, if i throw a stone there’s a damn fine chance it’ll hit the ex EUM. The last time I ran into him at the bar, I felt a hand on my a$$ and, of course, there he was. I snapped “Oh no you didn’t!” and he tried to explain. I walked away. My point is, in a small environment, it’s going to happen and how you deal with it is how you deal with it.
I certainly don’t think anyone here means disrespect…ever. It’s emotional stuff we’re discussing and there are bound to be differences of opinions. But I think we all feel as if it’s a place we can come for help, love and support and know that we are understood. More importantly for fallback girls, we know we, and our opinions/feelings, are important and are valued. That’s so huge!
NML, there’s no one on the planet whose opinions and ideals I respect more than yours. You have helped give me my life back and everyone here, whether they agree or disagree with me, has had a hand in that.
Hello All….First off this is my first time to this site and can I just say Thank You for all of this Information…I have been an emotional mess for almost 6 months due an Emotionally Unavailable man and it is Ironic that he has done everything that is posted here. We have been dating for almost a year but the last 6 months has been total Hell….So any advise here…My emotionally unavailable man lives 4 town houses down..we have to constantly see each other which is extremely hard on me…He tells me his reason for his actions is that he was hurt terribly by an old relationship and he has put up walls…I wish he could let them down and move on but feel that will never happen…I will take any and all advise…as this is ripping me apart..Emotionally.
I am on day 4 of no contact and this article was really helpful. The part about him retreating so that I don’t expect him to be around really hit home. My EUM of 2 years really let me down this week. I had vacation plans an hour or so away from where we live this week, my 40th birthday was Wednesday. He was supposed to come down the shore and take me out. Other people were coming and going all week, but I didn’t have anyone coming on Wednesday because we were going to spend the day together just the two of us. He texted me Tuesday morning to say he couldn’t get out of work and that he would be there on Thursday. What a lame excuse! We had been planning this for months. After I got really pissed, he said he would get out half day and be there by Wed evening. I told him not to bother, if I have to throw a hissy fit to get him to show up when he says he is going to its not worth it. After many nasty texts back and forth I stopped answering him. The last text I sent was Wed morning thanking him for ruining my vacation and my 40th birthday all in one shot. It almost seems like he did this on purpose to sabatoge the relationship. It feels like he wanted me to break up with him so he did the meanest thing he could think of. I was so humiliated in front of my friends and relatives when they asked me how my Bday went and I had to tell them that I was stood up.
Anyway this article and many others on this website are helping me to answer the questions I have about my EUM. Thanks NML.
STAY STRONG..SUZIE…Mine does not even know that I am walking away for good…Guess he will find out when he actually takes the time to call me on Monday or Tuesday…then I will begin my counts….so feel free to keep us posted so we can help each other get through this together and regain our Lives .
Hi Lizzie, that is going to be tough with your EUM living so close. Mine lives in the same town but we rarely run into eachother when we are out and about. We do have some connections as his sister in law used to date my brother and they are still really good friends. I worked with an ex boyfriend and at first it was really tough, but it does get easier, when you are truly over someone and have moved on and are happy it doesn’t matter whether you see them every day or never.
Your EUM sounds like he could benefit from seeing a therapist to get over the past relationship. If he has built up walls he really shouldn’t even be dating at all until he learns to trust again. We have all been hurt by someone at one time or another but each new person we date deserves to be judged by their own behavior not by the behaviors of our past partners.
I have not implemented the no contact rule because I know I would break it, for me to say it to him I would have to mean it and stick to it so I haven’t said it because it would weaken my position when I eventually get to that spot. I have reached this point in past relationships so I know I can do it. But what I would really like to know is even when you are faced with all the truth how do you make that final break and break the addiction ?? Thats where I’m stuck I see the truth know the truth yet a small part of me is hanging on but for what I don’t know..
Tulipa, How about this? What you pretend, comes true.
If you pretend to be asleep, and lay in bed and close your eyes, if you try to relax as if you were asleep, and slow your breathing as if you were asleep, and try to lay quietly as if asleep - more than likely you will next be waking up.
If you don’t want him to know you slipped on the No Contact Rule, then just begin without saying anything to anyone (besides the hundreds of us here, hoping for the best for you!). Then imagine that someone that understood what needs to be done were there instead of you. Pretend that person that knows better answers the phone but won’t talk to *him*. Pretend that person with hurt and hope and dreams finds a reason, every time, to let the next call, next email, next trip to ‘but he might be there’ - just let the need to make that contact go. Pretend that the lady that wants to heal so very badly guides your hands and your head to make the right choice, each time an opportunity to ask, “but does he care for me now?” Just pretend that someone would see the truth - and choose to make the right call (that is, *not* to call!) that next time. And keep pretending that someone that doesn’t hurt so badly let’s their head guide them through this time of grieving. What can it hurt? At the most, your imagination could fail.
Does pretending mean you are deliberately creating a new dream, one where the dream is about surviving the changes and loss of the No Contact Rule? Maybe.
Most big changes that people make are done when trauma interrupts their life, and continuing on isn’t a choice any longer. An alcoholic has to ‘hit bottom’ before real recovery happens.
The tactic of making a list of the good times that you want to remember about you and your time with him is important. You have invested part of your life in this past relationship, and there are always things you learned, moments of joy, and accomplishments that garnish that time of your life. We need to cherish the brightness of our days, to keep their memories alive for tomorrow.
Except that right now you need an objective list of the hurts that you have suffered, because of his presence in your life. You need to list each disappointment, each hurt, each deceit, each moment of his disrespect, your fear and anger. You need an emotional firebreak. You need the anger, and the hurt, and the rage that someone hurt you carelessly. You need to tape that list onto your phone. You need to make another list of the same hurts, and post it next to the computer. You need to build an anger shield, that puts strength into *why* you are following the rules for No Contact. And you should keep that anger and hurt and determination to avoid more pain from an unworthy EUM handy. Keep the anger where it will do some good - by reminding you that you have an alternative to calling or talking to him or emailing - you can keep to yourself, and heal.
And remind yourself every morning, that you don’t have to invent a ‘great enemy’ to make you ready to change. *He* chose to be your Great Enemy. *He* chose to hurt and deceive, and to disrespect your affections. You don’t have to create a Great Enemy, *he* made himself an enemy to you.
Luck.
Having been a Fallback girl that has experienced yo-yo behavior with my ex-EUM, I agree with this post. One thing I would like to add is that sometimes people have ex-EUMs that they have to or choose to engage with. It could be due to having a child together, working together, having friends in common.
In my opinion, if you choose to remain engaged with the ex-EUM - whatever the level of connection, you must accept that the romantic relationship is over and there is no future with your ex-EUM. Even when they are sniffing around, even when they are texting you, emailing you or begging you to spend time with them in a “romantic” or even “friendship” type manner.
If you can’t accept that it’s over, if you are still trying to “understand” why he is the way he is - then you shouldn’t be engaging.
If you can accept the situation, then go ahead and engage in a professional or personal yet somewhat detached manner.
My thought here is, we probably will find that engaging in this manner is very blase and we will just leave it behind (either mentally or both literally and mentally) and be free to focus on other people and things.
What if he turns it up and says he’ll change and say he wants you in his life and can’t live without you? I have to admit - I told my friend the other day that is still a secret wish of mine - to hear my ex-EUM say that. And her comment to me was that I should just say “I’m sorry, I’m just not interested any longer.” And after thinking it over - I know she is right. My situation - he won’t do that anyway. But I just have to let go of that fantasy and accept that it was not meant to be.
I’m 80% there. I’ve been meeting quality men lately and at this stage, I am just getting to know them and getting used to not chasing after someone that is not available. At first it was very uncomfortable. But - I am learning so much. And it really feels good to just live in the moment and accept things the way they are. The other day a guy asked for my phone number and called and he wants to take me out to dinner. I didn’t have to chase him at all. I was just receptive. He’s been a gentleman. I have no idea where this may go - but - I am just over the moon that I finally have a smile on my face about someone new that I am not chasing. And about whom I am not making any assumptions until I get to know him and see how things progress.
Hi Suzie…So tell me when your EUM started displaying signs of his emotionally unavailability….Has it been the entire relationship ?
Mine started acting up about 6 months ago when I ask what we were…I guess if you hang out 3-4 times a week and have sex 3-4 times a week…in my book I consider that a relationship. He said I cannt give you a full blown relationship…Said he just cannot give me what I need so took what I could get from him because I enjoyed spending time with him…He says and all of the people that know him tell me how badly he was hurt in an old relationship…and that the minute he starts feeling for me he walks away and gets distant for fear of falling for me…which leaves me feeling like What the Hell did I do to turn him off…?? We have broken up and then he aways regrets it and we get back together but then he pulls the same disappearing act for a few days…Its making me Crazy but am Finally feeling strong enough to walk away…with a lot of support from my friends. Do you think their is any hope for this type of eum??
In the mean time I am dating and doing my thing …He needs to see that I have a life outside of him…as he does with me. Maybe in 6 months he will finally wake up but I will no longer be around and he can live with the What If Factor.
Lizzie, my EUM came on really strong in the beginning. He was also hurt very badly by his wife of 18 years. She cheated on him and eventually left him for another man. I started seeing him as soon as she moved out. I told him it was too soon and he should take time for himself but he disagreed. After a few months he started backing off. We have broken up many times. The longest we went without talking was 5 months. It is the same with him, whenever we start getting really close he backs off. Then we breakup because i pressure him for more and then we don’t talk for a few weeks and then he comes back telling me it will be different this time. Same old cycle.
I personally do not feel these men ever change. I think if a man really wants you nothing will stop him from making time to be with you. I am a single mom of a 3 year old and was content for the past 2 years just seeing my bf once a week. I reallly didn’t want to ever get married or even live with someone. Now I have decided that I am ready for more. I have seen many women on here who have spent many years with these EUMs and they never change. When another man was calling me my EUM briefly was very jealous and seemed to have changed but it was only temporary. Once he knew the other guy wasn’t a threat he went back to his old ways.
I am glad that you are dating others and not just waiting around for him. Maybe you will meet someone who will make you forget all about him. I was with my EUM for over 2 years and need to wait a few months before I get back out there.
Thank you again Brad don’t have time on my side to type more. I always have to go through this obsessive stage but Im better at it this time. more later and thanks all helps to know you aren’t alone
Brad K., thanks for your post, you are correct in what you say about moving on from hurtful relationships. Over the weekend I did a lot of thinking about my ex-EUM and where we are now. I remembered the good times and the times at the beginning when we were getting to know each other and spending time together. I don’t have feelings of anger toward him anymore, I guess I mainly have sorrow for him that he is so disconnected from his true feelings and true self. I don’t blame him, and I also don’t blame myself. I just know that our “relationship” was meant to fail for all kinds of different reasons, and I am part of that equation, but I am not going to beat myself up about it. It is what it is….
Dear SuzieQ,
Sounds like we are dating the same man. Two days before my 40th bday this year, my man initiated a fight on purpose.
He moved to Panama City, FL and now we are 10 hrs away from one another. I finally decided to let go because I realize that I can never trust him.
Its time for me to have faith and belive that better is in store.
Happy Belated 40th Birthday! You deserve someone treasuring you.
namaste
my eum is still in my picture. i can’t shake him. i do adore him but really he gets me so upset. here is the big picture - he and connect mentally and physically - but he is indian and his family would “prefer” that he marry someone of his own ‘type”…. rich indian family. he is way influenced. that said, i respect that but still he messes in my yard knowing he can’t be with me. recently i got my yoga teacher certification. (it helps me cope with life and such) and he was so excited for me. he went and got a tattoo on his wrist (the om symbol), a yoga symbol) i saw it, i said wow gorgeous tattoo. he said oh yea this.. it is just something i felt like doing. he was happy i loved it but still what the heck is that man… nothing. still i sit home alone and he rings me late, late and then early morning to see why i didn’t answer his call. because he makes me cry… and then i try to say well go get yourself another babe to play with and he says he doesn’t play with me. it is circumstance and it is what it is and i need to respect it….
recently he told me his assistant checks his phone messages when he is away on business. she apparently had something to say about a message i left him. and he said please don’t do that. i am saying this out of respect for you… ok, lovely but why the he… is the assistant commenting on me. i don’t know man, i am having such trouble breaking this. i don’t get the eum thing. he is my first and only. i dump other assclowns fast and furious. but this one wrecks me… first for not standing up to his family and second for getting that darn tattoo… any thoughts, ladies and gents.. peace.
Brad K,
Update…So I left the office last nite around 6:30 and as Im on the escalator I hear his voice behind me on his phone (like always!!!!)
I don’t turn around and I continue reading the NY Times newspaper-he comes up behind me and taps my shoulder and says “oh I didn’t know
You knew how to read” (while on the phone). I turn around and give him a look but I don’t say anything. How messed up is that for him to say??
Talk about trying to lower ones self esteem.
Anyway I get off the escalator and he then says “can I get a hug, how are you”???? I don’t hug him but I do answer him and say “Im fine”. At the
same time Im walking in to my bank to go to the ATM…he then says “ Im practically following you, can you just stop walking for a second and
talk to me???” I stop and say “what is it???” He then says “hows your summer, how are you, wow you look so good” and as hes staring @ me
up and down he repeats “you look real good” Wtf is that supposed to mean???? Was I supposed to look broken and worn out??? Anyway when he said
that I kindve laughed and I said “thanks but listen I gotta go”. I turned around and left him standing there-he gave me this shocked, I know you’re not
leaving me here standing look. It felt sooooooooooooooooo good to do that to him but @ the same time why did I feel so guilty for being mean to him???
I almost wanted to txt him and apologize for being rude!!! I didn’t!!!! But im left confused…..did I look bitter, did I do the right thing??? Wtf does he want from me??
Healthiernow, thanks for the kind words! There are so many of the EUM’s out there. I broke it off with him but I am terrified of being alone. I am so afraid I will never find someone to love again. I guess like you said I have to have faith that God will put someone in my path. I really have to restrain myself from texting him and making up. He has been trying and I have been really mean to him to try to get him to go away because I know I will weaken.
Kendra, I don’t know your whole story but what you did to your EUM was great! You don’t look bitter and don’t apologize for being rude. You spoke to him but cut the conversation first. Good for you!
Hi Kendra, this is a classic “EUM Sniff Out” where they come sniffing around to check “the temperature” of your life. It’s almost funny to me that almost all of us who post here have had our EUMs come sniffing around occasionally to see what we are up to, and they all pretty much follow the same pattern. And then, of course, we read WAY too much into it, and think that they must want us back, etc. etc. because they made the HUGE effort to “contact us”, which is usually an effort that happens totally by accident, i.e., running into us at the elevator, by the coffee machine at work, etc. I truly don’t know why these EUMs feel the need to have to “check up” on us like that because we know that they aren’t interested in having a relationship with us so WHY DO THEY BOTHER????. Every now and then my ex-EUM will send me a stupid e-mail at work like “What did you do this weekend…blah blah blah” and I can’t figure out why he even bothers at this point.
I wouldn’t read anything into it–I would keep the NC going and stay strong. You work with him, right? I work with my ex-EUM also, and I know it sucks to have to keep running into them, etc., but still keep the NC….it’s the only way….
Finallyover it-you’re so right. I looked @ what happened last nite and I let it take over my nite and my sleep.
All over guilt for walking away from him and leaving him standing there. How many times had he left me standing
by myself confused? How many times was I left alone waiting for him or waiting for his response to my text that never came??
I needed to snap out of it. Hes a jerk and he can keep sniffing all he wants-hes going to get treated the same way!!!
Unfortunatley yes we work in the same company….but im so glad the powers have shifted and I don’t look pathetic and needy.
If anything its him who looks pathetic!! Thanks ladies!
Kendra, also your comment about feeling guilty because you left him standing there–a couple of weeks ago, my ex-EUM and I ran into each other while getting the train to work, and were walking together talking as we approached the train, and when I got to the ticket machine, I said to him, “I need to get a ticket.” thinking that he might wait with me so we could sit together…..well, he just left me standing there and got on the train without me! What a jerk! So, I was dumb enough to feel bad that we couldn’t sit together and talk, so at lunch that day I asked him to go to lunch with me….he consented to grace me with his presence, and we had a nice time at lunch, but that was it….he never reciprocated and has done nothing to make contact with me since then. This is another example of how brain dead they are–we worry about hurting their feelings, and they turn around and treat us disrespectfully and don’t give it a second thought…..
Oh wow-thx for sharing Finallyoverit-what a jerk!!! I hope yesterday my EUM thought the same of me. I rather be thought of as a b*tch than as a spineless, eager to please, desperate woman!!!
Kendra, I was feeling really guilty about ending it with my EUM. He kept texting me trying to get me to respond. Af first I ignored him and then I sent a mean reply hoping he would go away. His reply to that made me feel like a monster. I was so upset over it. So today I sent an apology e mail. I got no response. So then I sent a text saying that I would like to talk and see if we could make up. I got no response again. It was all a power struggle. When I was ignoring him he couldn’t stand it! He did whatever he could to get me to respond and when I did he ignored me. Such childish games. I am not going to let it bother me that I was the last one to respond. I am just going to learn a lesson from the experience and not do it again. Don’t let guilt get to you. They deserve the silent treatment and it doesn’t mean you are a bad or bitter person if you ignore them.
Kendra, On the escalator you were teetering between social conventions. On the one hand you were trying to be polite and courteous in public, on the other hand you were trying to protect yourself from an affair of the heart gone bad.
From a self-defense point of view, walking away, giving curt answers helped enforce an emotional distance, and took you one step closer to living past the relationship.
From a courtesy perspective, though, short answers to one you knew well is a social gaffe. It is rude to not put the other person at his ease. You know better - and that is where the guilt comes from. Courtesy is a wonderful habit, we strive to avoid conflict, to be gracious to those around us.
But.
This guy isn’t safe for you. He causes you emotional distress, even today. Your need to protect your emotions and your life from his influence has to come first. Yes, you feel guilty for the social abrasions and for the discourtesy. But understand that is just a consequence of the No Contact Rule. A certain amount of discourtesy to him is an important part of winning yourself a safe place and safe time for healing, for setting reasonable goals, for getting to know yourself once again. Amongst all the dreams and broken dreams, the expectations and plans and accomplishments of your life, your needs have changed. It will take time and emotional distance to discover who this new you is. You *have* to have that safe distance from him and his disturbance in your life.
There were several conversations going on during that incident. While he was on the phone, his lame joke (didn’t know you could read) was distracted and meant to be an ice breaker. He took you for granted. And he was a bit alarmed that his casual relationship with you wasn’t going as he expected.
When you walked away, he started to understand that he lost not only an intimate relationship, but a casual ‘friendship’ as well. In addition, he felt your hostility. He was astonished that you reacted as if he hurt you, he had not considered himself to be a hazard, someone that you needed to defend yourself against.
That was likely quite a bit of social intercourse for an escalator encounter.
About the guilt. You will need to be consistent in defending you, your space, and your emotions from his shenanigans. But the guilt is real, and you do have to be careful not to over-react to others. It would be too easy, right now, to withdraw from every guy, or every person, to fall into habits of discourtesy. So just be clear in your mind that he is the only one you are defending yourself against, that you are defending yourself and that he is not part of a social engagement. And do please continue to snub him, out of self-defense.
As I read these post…I continue to shake my head at how many EUM their are…I thought I was alone in this but see that you are all going through the same emotional abuse as I am….I keep thinking he will change and wake up to what he is doing to me or even realize what a great person he has right in front of him…But he never does…
We had broke up in mid june and did not talk for three weeks….and was finally feeling good…and dating…I had forgotten how nice it feels to be appriciated with someone who wants to spend time with me….But then 2 weeks ago…He followed me to the neighborhood bar that we used to hang out at and sat in his truck for 15 minutes before he had the nerve to come inside and he ask if he could buy me a beer and then proceeeds to tell me how much he has missed me….and of course stupid me I melted…We had a wonderful evening…he was so attentive and was so happy…..But by the following weekend he was back to his old selfish self…Oh yes he misses me but not enough to give up his fun weekends at the Islands….when he party’s with his friends but never invites me…while I sit home alone….and to be honest….He is not all that…I am not a shallow person however my EUM is 6′ 1″ and weighs about 280 pounds…I am 5′8″ and weigh 130…All of my friends tell me what do you see in him…and guess now I am asking myself the same thing…Is it simply because I want what I cannot have…or is it because the Sex is so powerful that it is addicting…..sorry for getting personal…Sometimes I think if he could just break down those walls we would be sooo good together…but it is what it is…..and he is so affraid of getting hurt again that he refuses to let me in…..IT IS MAKING ME SO DEPRESSED!!!! We are both older…He is 43 and I am 44…I guess I am just more Mature and do not party my life away.
\ So the last time I actually called him was last Friday evening ask him what he was doing and he acted as if I was bothering him by calling which I seldom do…And he says I am having dinner with my daughter I will call you later…and of course never heard from him. Then found out he went to the islands again to party.
While we were broke up I met a couple of great guys but was very honest with them about where I was at in my life….and they were totally cool and so we just hung out…And then when he screwed me over again the last couple of weekends I went out with one of the guys I had met while we were broke up….This man is Awsome…………..He text ’s me just to say hi and we have gone out 3 or 4 times now…he has tried nothing but just wants to get to know me….and says he totally understands my situation…so what is wrong with me why do I want the asshole…
So this past Monday after not talking to my EUM since last Friday when I intereupted his dinner he has the nerve to show up at the bar and rub my back and say hi……I WAS SO STRONG…..I looked at him and said Hi and then continued my conversation with my friends…I DID IT….I acted like he did not even exsist….and it felt so good…and he went home alone….but so did I but at least I did not give in….The only reason he showed up was because he saw my car…and now he is asking all of my friends what is wrong with me…They simply tell him…FIGURE IT OUT!!
So I am trying to stay strong….God help me because I cannot go through this pain again…I have another date tomarrow with this great guy and am going to do my best to just have fun and forget about the Idiot….so wish me luck.
I am so glad I found this post…It has helped so much to see that I am not alone….My heart goes out to all of you that are going through what I am going through…and together WE WILL ALL GET STRONGER!!!
Dear Lizzie,
Its amazing how similar they all are. I too am older-40 and my EUM is 45. We have always had an incredible sexual relationship, wherein I truly believe that we are addicted to one another in that area. However, I do realize that this is the one area in his life that he is super sure of himself in. He is the ultimate charmer, pleaser and man of my dreams until there is someone else that turns his head. I have been on this rollercoaster so long, that my self esteem is wrapped up with him. As soon as he found out that I was even thinking of being with another, he acted jealous. I never cheated on him, and still pray that one day he will see too. I know mine has used alcohol in the past to forget his problems and now that he moved 10 hrs away, I dont know what hes doing and Im trying to not focus on him. But I still wake up and go to bed with him on my mind. I would stay with any of the new guys because insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting different results. I know Im insane, as I still want my EUM. I truly believed he was the love of my life, he knows EVERYTHING about me, and I feel like a fool when he uses what ive told him against me.
These men/women know how to manipulate. I know Im sick, because I do see how self destructive it is to want someone who can have so much influence on my daily sanity. Unfortunately, There were so many good years, I have a hard time letting go.
I think part of it had to do with my own insecurity as he has 22 yr olds -and all ages of women hitting on him. He is extremely good looking and he knows how to play women.
PLEASE-get out if you can!!! You derserve to be with a man who wants you and makes you feel your best and loved all the time. Your EUM no he has you wrapped around your finger, and you proved him wrong!!!! CONGRATS!!!
Doesnt it seem that they have a radar when you are finally cutting the chords to them and taking care of yourself?
The hardest part is trying to decipher what was real and what wasnt.
Wish there was a suport group for this here. I joined Codependents anonymous and Al Anon. Its helping me a bit with why i react the way i do with him.
Stay Strong. Hope you have great dates! We all deserve to be happy
DEAR HEALTHIERNOW,
Thanks for taking the time to respond to my post…It helps so much…to hear I am not alone..The hardest part for me is that he lives 4 houses away…so we run into each other often…But he is in Michigan for two weeks visiting his family…So I think I will take these two weeks and regain my sanity..Out of Site Out of mind.
I also have to regain my self esteam…as it is no where to be found…at this point except when I am with this new guy..I wish you the best and if you ever need someone to chat with or vent feel free to drop me a line…We can get through this together.
Have a great day !
In my case his words are “I don’t want a relationship”, yet he was calling/emailing/hanging out every day and then disappearing for weeks. It has become completely platonic over the course of the year and a half - he doesn’t even look for sex anymore.
And I have analyzed it to death like everyone here has. I’ve read all the articles, looked at all the issues from different angles and hoped that this was different than others’ situations. But then I flip flop between analyzing and getting to the point of realization where it doesn’t matter - it doesn’t matter what his issues/problems are. They are not my problems so why am I dealing with them?
I admit that I do, in fact, have fears of a relationship taking over my life and me losing who I am stemming from a previous relationship with a cheater. So perhaps this is my “emotional unavailability” that is contributing to my situation. However, I would love NOTHING more right now than for someone to come along who is fun and makes me laugh and feel attractive. I envision it. I create the vision in my head of someone consistent - getting up in the morning, eating breakfast, travelling, having fun… consistently with no question of why he’s doing something or why he’s not doing something. You need to focus on what YOU want, not what he wants/don’t want/is doing/not doing.
You have to eventually get tired of feeling dragged down by this negativity. I know I am. Just let go.
anonymous.. i could not agree with you more.. tired of being dragged down and tired of the negatiivity.. i have about 7 books trying to help myself and explain his actions, and I am so sick of it..
I truly believe that you see the light when you just decide you are done feeling down, and tired of not being happy…
then.. let goooooooooooooooooooooooo
Get this ladies HE WANTS US TO GET BACK TOGETHER!!!!-you read it right!!! This morning we had a company meeting on another floor…I go to it and guess whos sitting in the crowd???? So I by pass him to get to my seat and I say “Hi” and keep walking to the front to grab a seat. Sure enough 5minutes later he comes and sits across from me in the front as well. So he literally got up from his old seat to move closer to me. The whole time hes staring @ me on and off..I ignored him..Meeting ends and I come back downstairs to my office-I get a call from a number I do not recognize I pick up-its him!!!! He asks me if the sparkle in my eye that he saw was bc of him. I said “No the sparkle you see has been there all along ever since I left you” He then says”Wow that hurts”..anyway he asks me if he still has a chance with me and that he misses me and wants me back. Said that hes a different man now and the 4months away from me has showed him he cant be w/o me. Hes changed, blah,blah and that he wants to see me. I then asked him why couldnt he be the man i wanted him to be when he had me….He then says “That was the past, Ive changed and I want you. I will prove it to you.” I then asked about his GF-he gets upset and says that was in the past and says he will do anything to prove to me he doesnt have one. He even said if i wanted to move in w him for a month to prove he doesnt have one then I can….My boss then walked in my office so i couldnt talk further and he was heading into a meeting as well…He then said he will call me later so we can continue the conversation and for me not to give up on him……………………………………………. I CANT go back to him…I finally feel whole again…..hes put me thru too much….Any advice??? I know i cant go back to that
hi kendra.i feel what you saying ,i am going thrugh it like you,but you know ,if he really want it you ,he wait four months ,ammmm,think ,he stayed four months with out you ,what makes you think ,he will stay,no way ,this is a yo yo ,keep going round and round ,keep moveing on ,couse you will fall in the same ols story ,dont you think ,i think you do ,i know what i am talking abouth ,so keep going ,there is more fish in the sea ,if we stay with these men ,they keeo hurting us ,we wasteing time with these men ,i know its hard ,but we must be strong ,wish you luck ,but i think the only luck you have if you keep moceing on ,couse you will get hurt again ,,,,ok tc ,its hurtssssssssss
Oh Kendra I hope you stay far far far away from him because you know as soon as he has you again he will revert back to type its a game on his part. you have done so well please don’t go back ! for your sanitys sake etc. he is just messing with you because he knows your weak points. you are so right he had you and discarded you so now hes feeling left out of your life. good luck
kendra, Wow. I mean “oops!” You talked to him. He called, and you had a conversation beyond, “Oh, its you. Bye”
I mean this guy has rejoined the ranks of billions of guys that you aren’t interested in dating, and don’t have time to talk to. In fact, he is a known pest. He past performance has won him how much consideration and politeness from you? None. He is stalking you. Complain to your supervisor about his harassing you at work - explain that his attempts to contact you are upsetting, that he is making it difficult for you to work, that you are uninterested in talking to him, his behavior - shifting around in the meeting - is upsetting and distracting. There are protections from guys using company time to harass and intimidate and bully people. The way he is bullying and harassing you.
This is serious stuff. You need your supervisor to step in, the topic is sexual harassment, explain you want assistance getting the guy to behave in a professional manner, and not a slavering pervert in the back room of a seedy bar!
You and he have proved, time and again, that he is unable and unwilling to hear what you have to say. This means that you *have* to be *direct* and clear. No contact means no contact. He does *not* get an explanation. Keep anything that you say direct and impersonal, and refuse to utter one word about the past, about dating, about your time, or anything else you wouldn’t discuss with your garbage collector - which is about the social cache this schmuck has earned for himself.
Complaining about harassment to your supervisor should earn him a warning from his boss. If he is bright enough to shut up and straighten out his act, great. If he contacts you on company time again, you *have* to follow up, and report the contact to your supervisor. That would be unsuitable and illegal behavior. The company deserves notice of his improper behavior, and you would be betraying your company to withhold information about his abuse of company time and resources for his sordid personal life.
He has created a ‘hostile work environment’ for you. You are not relaxing and preparing for another day of work - you are panicked about dealing with his shenanigans. One reason your reaction is so strong is that he ambushed you, bullied you, took advantage of you at a place that had been ’safe’ from dating turmoil - your workplace. You owe it to yourself and to your company to identify this wart as a sexual harasser.
For him? You *dare* not give him anything like an explanation. Whatever else he has changed, he does *not* respect you, does *not* respect your choices, and does *not* care about anything but what he wants .. for the moment. *Do* limit what you say to him, to as precious few words as possible. Keep to statements. Avoid social phrases like, “How are you?” and “Okay?” Avoid all questions not *requred* by work. When speaking with him, always count off 10 seconds before every reply or statement to him. Be *sure* you avoid explanations. Never explain your choices, or your thinking, when the best answer would be, “No.” You might state, once, that you don’t care to speak with him, to hear from him, or to see him again. Never repeat anything, instead just keep silent.
Expect him to manipulate, to ’sell’ you, to twist anything you say about you, about him, about dating, or relationships, or values, or history, or mutual friends - count out those 10 seconds every time, and speak only what is needed - “No.” If you use three (3) words together, I promise, promise, promise he will not hear the words, he will be thinking, “Great! I won! She’s talking to me, I can get anything I want now!” Watch the word count, be very careful of any word except “No”, don’t repeat things.
And my reasoning? Like all the other men you aren’t dating, you just don’t have anything to say that you want him to hear. So don’t say anything.
That would be my advice. Protect yourself from him, and stop rewarding him with your time, your attention, and with your conversation. You are just encouraging him. No Contact, dear, No Contact. It is safer that way.
Brad K and all,
Thanks for your input and advice. You all are absolutely 100pct correct. I have no intentions of entertaining going back to him.
Is it any surprise I DIDN’T hear from him last nite-NO!!! There wasn’t a follow up call or anything nor was I expecting it. Reason being is bc I didn’t jump at his declaration of undying love.
Also don’t think for a second that I don’t know what hes doing-which is trying to plant seeds in my head so that I can now be
the chaser and pursue him. He knows and notices that im very standoffish with him so now he wants to get on my good side to win what crappy of a relationship we had then he’s going to throw it back away.
That would’ve worked 2months ago not now. Im on the verge of complete healing & words like that cant phase me. My God 2months ago I would’ve been the one to follow up on the call with a txt or smthng saying
“can we talk?? How are you??” I would chop my fingers off before I attempt smthng so stupid. Not to mention since I now realize that the son and the moon does NOT set on him Im no longer blinded by the glare. I see him for what he is…With the upcoming wknd I may hear from him and continuous rejection is what he will get.
Brad K you’re right, it seems like ambushing me @ work is his way of operating bc truthfully I have no way of rejecting him here..I don’t think taking this to HR is the route I want to take. I don’t
Want my personal life known to the company..the truth is we had a relationship for close to 2yrs and would hate for HR to know we were lovers and now Im crying ‘rape’..I rather deal with him
in short doses..Rest assured Im not going back to this twisted, mental man!!!
Relief to find this site. My eum is in a sick situation
I have been with this guy for one and a half years. A week ago he broke up with me after an argument we had the night before and he did it over the phone. He was very cruel saying he never wanted to see me again that i am at fault for everything and that i should live with the consequences. This is the 4th time its happened (each time over the phone) over the last 8 or so months and we’ve been together for 1 1/2 years.
he has always had serious issues and he’s always been secretive. I know he is still hung up on his ex who is 20 years older than he is (she is 60 by the way) and they were together for 15 years. Many of our previous arguments were about him dissapearing or lying about where he was - when the evidence showed he was lying. He always denied any wrong doing. Yet he always said that he would never tell her - the ex he has a girlfriend and he was always very controlling of when he would and would not see me.
So a few days or so after every argument - apart from one of them where i was fed up i would call him and ask to talk - we would meet up and get back together nothing resolved though.
I love him very much but he was always evasive about any future commitment. He was always controlling moody and miserable - saying that he feels trapped and pressured but would never explain why. Anything i had at his place was always kept tucked away in draws when i left. sometimes the phone would ring when i was at his place and he would get all nervy.
The last argument was actually started by me. After he took my to the doctore about a gynaelogical problem i was having at night I started to cry and i said - maybe i wouldn’t be having these problems if i had a child by now. he said you’re in your 30’s you should know - i said i was confused and maybe i need a partner to re assure me. He said well i know what i want and i will always be alone right up into my 70’s. So i said to him then why do you get into relationships his answer was he likes companionship. I told him he was contradicting himself and all hell broke loose. He called me selfish he said i was pressuiring him for the next step and that i wanted my own way at any cost. he was really angry. The next morning i called him to see if he was ok and that the night before was not so pleasant etc. he screamed at me an hung up.
So he dissapears for a couple of days and when i call him he breaks up with me over the phone as per each other time. he said he didn’t love me and when i asked him well 2 days ago you were saying you did he said i was lying. He said its all my fault and that he would call me in a week to bring over my stuff. A few days before we were together all weekend and he said that i was the type he had been looking for and he loved me very much i am heart broken.
I called him a few days later asking to talk face to face again he refused and he said the cruelest things again - one of the worst was ‘I have Nicole (his ex) on my back - i dont need to have you too now’ he also said ‘you’re good looking young you will suffer like i am and you will meet someone else to give you a baby’ I said i dont want a baby what the hell is wrong with you stop being silly - he hung up on me i was devastated i sent a couple pleading texts nothing.
We have holidays booked in a week he hasn’t called. I can’t eat and i cant sleep i am crying all the time. How could he throw away what we have like that over a phone call.
Its like i am waiting for him to come back into my life - at least i want us to go away together
Am i wrong in thinking this guy can change?
I have to move on this guy has taken away all of my dignity
PS
He is still involved with the 60 year old in the past when he has dissapeared i have found out they were both on vacation leave from work.
he avoids places near here house for dinner shopping etc. Many times when he is at home he gets nervous when the phone rings or doesn’t answer. Once she called his mobile 9:30 on a sunday i looked at it it was her he lied to me and told me it was his best friend.
There are many many examples. he would set the tone of when we would and would nt meet and he would pick fights out of nothing to distance himself
he has left me a dishevelled wreck. I can’t understand this I am more educated and sucessful than he, but he has made me feel like a trophy - the official girlfriend he shows off while he dilly dances with the older woman who could be his mother…and she is not even attractive
I just dont get it
@Kendra, you have to know your own company. OSHA calls this sexual harassment, and hostile work environment. Federal courts call it harassment and assault, civil courts have awarded damages against companies and against guys ‘just being guys’. If this guy keeps stalking you, there is no limit