Beth asks “I ended things in mid-November after two months of dating an emotionally unavailable man. He pursued me ardently throughout the whole time we were together, lavished me with romance, talked about marriage, kids, moving in together, and couldn’t peel himself off of me each time we met. He finally told me he was in love with me, and I told him I felt the same, so I decided to see if he wanted to get a little more serious.
He said he couldn’t possibly be in a relationship right now because “I would hurt him first”. I soon came to realise I had a commitment-phobe on my hands. He then told me he had been dumped by his fiance 10 months earlier, and had very little faith in relationships.
I cut off all contact several weeks after we broke up, but since then, he has emailed me repeatedly and gone against my wishes. I read the first few emails, and he goes on and on about how madly in love with me he is, etc., tries to get me to be “just friends” with him, says his life sucks without me and needs to have me in his life in any way he possibly can. He’s basically obsessing and refuses to let go.
I continue deleting his messages and have blocked his email. Do you have any other suggestions for me? I don’t understand much about commitment phobia, but I did a little reading and it seems like it’s a very serious fear–I know it’s not my problem, but it could help me move on if I understood more about the nature of this phobia and what I can expect from someone in this mindset (so I can arm myself!). I thought he would leave me alone, but obviously I was wrong so any insight is appreciated.”
The thing you need to understand here is the commitment-phobe doesn’t commit to anything - so none of his behaviour is unusual in that context because he doesn’t stake himself on an outcome either way. Instead, he flip flaps and messes with other people’s lives and emotions…like yours.
Until the moment that you commit to what they’ve been suggesting, they’re happy because in their mind they haven’t committed to anything at that point. But if you actually believe what they’re asking and commit to their suggestions, this is where the problem arises because when you do this, it suggests that you expect, need, or want something from them which sets off their panic button. Suddenly you start hearing ridiculous excuses that weren’t around when they were wooing you…
Don’t get me wrong – being dumped by his fiance and feeling a bit ambivalent about relationships for a while is understandable – However, the entire two months you were both together, he had been dumped by his fiance then too and he wasn’t so devastated or off relationships that he didn’t pursue you or blow smoke up your bum telling you feelings and intentions that he had no intentions of delivering on.
You’re trapped in a game that you will lose at if you engage. Yes his commitment is a very real fear but to be solely focused on that issue would miss the point and having you seeing the trees instead of the wood – Obviously I can’t say how long he has had commitment issues and whether they have specifically arisen out of his breakup but the core problem here, aside from his lack of commitment is that he is not over his previous relationship, he has excess emotional baggage, doesn’t have both feet in the relationship, and may even still be emotionally attached to his ex.
Fundamental foundations for a relationship to progress is that whilst we all have a little baggage (of the hand baggage variety), you don’t start relationships when you’re emotionally unavailable, unwilling to commit, clearly have issues with relationships, and may still be emotionally tied to your ex. A sign that you’re ready to be in a new relationship is when you’re not emotionally tied to your ex in either a romantic or negative way – you need to be over them, the relationship, and ready to move on.
To continue to engage with him would be like chucking your energy into the abyss. It would also be a sign if you try to fix, heal, and help him that you may have your own issues to deal with.
He’s not obsessed with you – he’s obsessed with the idea of not ‘losing’ again plus if anyone is going to do the rejecting here, it’s got to be him because his ego is too ‘fragile’ to accept that someone isn’t prepared to put up with his BS.
You let him back in your life on his terms and you’re essentially being demoted and he’s pulling a classic move where he blows hot, cries wolf, manages down your expectations and starts chasing you again to rebalance things, only this time you end up on lesser terms.
You can’t just slip slide from talking about marriage, kids, moving in together (maybe a little quick 2 months in although it is different strokes for different folks) to ‘let’s be friends’ territory – talk about a frickin’ anti climax!
A big sign of a man with poor intentions is one that talks big but proves to be all big talk and no action. Dodgy men do tend to be very quick out the gate to pursue and talk out their backsides and the OTTness is actually a red flag that no doubt gets proven when they pull the rug out for under your feet. Also these men don’t have any regard for anyone but themselves, so they disregard your wishes and make contact because their needs and desires always take precedence.
His problem existed before you, it exists now, and it is not your responsibility to solve his problems – it’s your responsibility to recognise the myriad of red flags here, enforce your boundaries and opt out, because you won’t be making a silk purse out of a pigs ear here…
You sound like you have good inner strength and the key here is to accept the truth of his actions, not of his words. The guy doesn’t know his arse from his elbow but like in a lot of these relationships, you don’t need him to explain anything now because you need to trust your instincts, process what he has done, and act upon it.
These men do run out of steam, especially when it becomes clear that 1) you have boundaries and 2) that to be involved with you they have to commit and that it can’t be on their terms. Where they don’t run out of steam is if you give any indication that you’re willing to let them marginalise you into a different position. Stick to your guns, don’t second guess yourself, and remind yourself that it’s better that you know now, and have the option to run.
Really, short of getting legal on him (which becomes necessary if it crosses into harassment), the key things here are to stick to no contact because that means you don’t engage, which means they run out of steam.
Your thoughts?
Get ahead on understanding waste of space men and relationships with my ebook, Mr Unavailable and the Fallback Girl. Find out more and download. Also find out more about my No Contact Rule web seminar, or if you need personal advice or analysis of your relationship, check out my consultation service.
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Perhaps I’m a bit slow but why is it necessary to tell the woman he loves her and wants a relationship if he doesn’t want a commitment in the long run. If he’s getting sex and having a good time why can’t it remain status quo w/o the lies? I have never quite understood the big rush and proclamation of ‘feelings???’
“He’s not obsessed with you – he’s obsessed with the idea of not ‘losing’ again plus if anyone is going to do the rejecting here, it’s got to be him because his ego is too ‘fragile’ to accept that someone isn’t prepared to put up with his BS.”
NML is right on the button here. NO CONTACT. Continue NO CONTACT. Keep continuing No Contact unless you need to get a restaraining order- and have THEM deliver it, not you.
You’re being ‘nice’ to want to understand, but it is his problem, and not yours to solve. If he can get you to engage, then he will just feel victiroious and play more head games.
When you wanted to get more serious, he showed his true colors, so let him live with the consequences of his choice.
Loving Annie
Right girls I need some help here. KatyB has moved onto the Christian Carter thing in that its all her fault, Ive had auick look cant really get anything from it as you have to pay, NML or any girls please can you give me the low down on this. As KatyB is saying that the reason he cant commit is because it was her, because thats whats she’s read. Im a bit confused as what to say??
Rules,
Maybe it’s easier for her to blame herself than to accept the fact that this guy is a creep. Perhaps, to accept that it is her fault is a way to continue to hold on.
I looked at the site and didn’t think he was blaming the woman for the failure of the relationship. Just my interpretation.
Gaynor – I always wondered about the “feelings” bs myself. I asked my EUM why he brought all that crap into it when it would have been just fine as a FB situation – no feelings. He looked panicked and said that he was never really “selling” what he meant – that he was confused, yadda frickin yadda. I think they in some way have “feelings,” in the beginning, but not real feelings with intentions. They think they do, but they are babies and have no way of backing up what they said or even intend to back up what they say. Just like we have misconceptions, so do they – that they will meet the perfect woman and everything will just work out on it’s own…happliy ever after….then once things start getting to real they decide that you aren’t “the one” and start backpedaling from and searching for the next “perfect girl.” The grass is always greener with these guys, even if they planted the lawn in the first place.
Being with these types of men is an emotional merry go around. I know, because I’m still trying to get off. Spare yourself the pain and misery of being with this man, from someone who wishes that she’d done the same thing herself early in the relationship.
They don’t change, but you most likely will – and not for the better.
hey girls. any suggestions on how to have NC with a guy you truly love and want to be with. Yes I have learned through expierence that he is a EUM, that seems to only have “feelings” for his self at the moment. Anyhow for me to get over him, I need space time and distance. period….the dillema for me here is that, the moment he realizes he’s giving me that, he sends me an email….can’t block him, can’t ignore his calls……….we have a 15 month old little girl together!!!!!!
Beth, just keep ignoring him, he will stop eventually.
Jennifer – I’ve been divorced from a EUM for 2 years. We have a 7yo and a 3 yo together. When he comes to take your daughter for his custody time, you are either (1) not there (he picks her up from a relative’s house), or, (2)you are polite/businesslike do not engage in small talk, discuss what is absolutely necessary for taking care of her, and out the door they go. “No contact” in this manner can be done. It is about your little girl, not you as a couple anymore. This really helps emotionally distance yourself from him. He is the father of your little girl – not your partner…it is a whole new mindset…it is hard, but you can do it…If you don’t have a custody schedule – then get an attorney/mediator and set one up…
Rules~ The carter book does not blame the female but he certainly makes it clear that “healthy men” do not want women who haven’t dealt with their issues. (Something you could expect to hear on this site also)
The difference is that Carter is referencing healthy men not a$$clowns. So KatyB needs to see that the jerk she’s getting over is an a$$ before she can gleen anything from what Carter says….and even then Carter tells you to love yourself, deal with your issues, etc….everything that NML says here
Hello,
once I came across the Christian Carter stuff. Inscribed for his newsletter and can’t really figure out what exactly he might have to tell us women in his products, which are 1) very expensive and 2) for me “unavailable” as I’m from Germany. It’s very complicated. He is unknown here, so there are no forums to get a deeper look.
I’m really interested in understanding men – healthy men of course – and I also appreciate the stuff from Alison Armstrong. Well, men bashing is nothing that takes me further, but of course you/I have to get smart about assclowns, rough diamonds and healthy men
And I’d like to learn about the things I can realistically do to a so called “quality man”.
So, in addition to this site, is there anything about C.C. that is here not covered? What are these mysterious secrets of communication? What is happening in the mind of men? Does anybody want to share?
Or do you know other sites covering this subject?
I’d really appreciate your answers. Thanks — Arlena
Thanks for the feedback, Natalie and everyone.
I ran into some of his closest friends today and they were really sweet to me–they said they thought he was making a huge mistake about me and were furious with how he was handling things. I was shocked at how supportive they were toward me. But they also told me that I would have been miserable dating him right now–they just said that he tends to go for very low self-esteem types and even admitted to his friends that I was too great for him.
So, I am sticking with NCR indefinitely. Now, it’s onto the rest of my grieving…or really, trying to reconcile that the person I loved wasn’t really him all along. Any suggestions on how to expedite this process? Yeah, yeah–I’ve done the whole “write down all the crappy things he’s said and done”, remember that he’s a creep, etc., etc. But it’s not really making a huge difference. I guess I just have to be patient, give it time. But hopefully he won’t come back around wanting a commitment in the middle of my healing! Rrghh..
Arlena, thanks for your comment but this site has nothing to do with Christian Carter, we’re not affiliated. I know very little about Christian Carter, don’t endorse his products/service, and from what I know he comes from a different perspective. I don’t do any ‘secrets’ stuff and probably the best place to find out this is on a related forum. I am trying to discourage this discussion from going on in the comments because as the site owner, I do need to moderate what is said about someone else’s business as I don’t want any comeback.
Babssoft.. I’m where you are but him and I share a child which makes it harder to cut out all contact….. but things that i’ve been doing to HELP HEAL MYSELF in the mean time…focus on the negative things he has said and done..if a positive pops in there block it, by focusing back on the negative…get your sexy back, yep buy a new outfit, vibrater whatever makes you feel sexy. make yourself a priority, need to loose 20 lbs start on that now, not tomarrow, need a education enroll in school, want a better job, start applying…make peace with your self, forgive yourself for allowing an a$$ clown, bring you down…I’ve learned I can’t be in a healthy loving relationship if I don’t first love myself !! If you don’t love yourself and respect yourself how can you expect anyone else to?? To love yourself. is to value, cherish and take care of yourself..you see i realized i didn’t love myself, when my babies dad left me on the day of her blessing when she was only 5 weeks old to be with another women.. that day i didn’t know that he left to be with someone else, all i knew is he was calling me a whore and more, for no reason he had never ever spoke to me like that before, and when i found out about this other women i excepted it appoligized to him, for letting him down (got pregnant out of wed lock, which he didn’t approve of) and wanted to take him back and work things out..yes i still love him and yes i still would love to work things out, but not on his timing or terms!!! I have learned that my happiness matters that I matter & that if i am a faithful, loving, committed, caring person, that treats my man well, then i deserve that from him, nothing less!!! why should ( I ) settle for someone who gives me scraps of his time, love, affection, calls me names cheats, and lies to me..I’m sorry but I deserve to have what I give……and if I have to live the rest of my life alone, then thats better then sharing a life with someone who doesn’t value me at all…the best thing you can do for yourself is learn to love your self, accept yourself, look in the mirror everyday, tell your self that you are beautiful, that you are smart and that you matter….you need to love yourself before you allow a man to love you. you see when someone loves you and then leaves you when you are still in love with them and want to be with them…it makes you feel worthless, fearful, and abanoneded…but girl if you love yourself when this person or any other leaves you, its going to hurt alot lot less, because your self, respect, self esteem and abandonment fears won’t be there.. you will always have someone that loves you, and that someone should be U..and if you have self love thats what matters…also look outside of your world right now, would this man, be someone you would want your daughter, friend or sister date????? would this man be someone that you would want your son to grow up to be like??? Just because he’s an arse now, and because you are like i was and seem to have self love doesn”t mean that it will always be over between the 2 of you, change how you think and feel about yourself, impower yourself, love yourself find good in yourself and share that, cut off all contact with him and as much as you can with his family and friends, then when you feel good, sexy, loved, educated whatever and if he contacts you, briefly talk whatever, never call a guy first, email or anything if you have or are STOP..doing that letrs him know you care and that you still want him..focus on you and change yourself, and then maybe things in your world may change to, let this situation inspire you!!!! but do go out and date, if you 2 end up back together one day great, if not, thats cool to because hunny the reality of life is, that once you change you may not even want his sorry arse!!!!!! really!!! I haven’t bought NML’s book yet, because I’m trying to raise my 6 kids alone, and supporting this many means I wait till the 1st to splurge…but I think with a title like this it has to have some great info in it, that you should get and put into effect.. I wish you the best of luck…
NML ou are behaving like the thoughtpolice.The problemwe are having with CC versus you is basically we cant figure out the healthy men from the asses
Suzy, I’m going to pretend you weren’t just rude to me. I’m going to repeat myself for the 3rd time tonight and state that I don’t read Christian Carter – this is the 2nd thread with the same thing. Why do I have to comment on someone I know nothing about?
BBP,
Loved the comment “the grass is always greener, even if they planted the lawn in the first place.”
One thing that I just realized is that I need to get in touch with my anger regarding the a**clown…I was blaming myself for a lot of things when I should really get in touch with my anger. The bad side of him: He’s a manipulator, a user, a liar and knew how to find my soft spot. I think if I can find the anger and focus on the real him, I won’t focus as much on what drew me to him. I have to forgive and love myself and not judge myself so harshly. I’m onto Day 2 for the new year’s NC which I am committing to keeping to.
BBP,
I think there is a big confusion here about the difference between feelings at the moment – what Beth’s clown gave her at the beginning – and general “health of the relationship” that Beth (and the rest of us) want to assume it means.
Is a feeling the flash of discomfort when you momentarily touch a hot stove – or the ache you bear for a week or more if the touch isn’t quick enough to avoid injury? Does “I feel affection for you, and feel comfort and happiness to be with you at this moment” mean the same thing as “I treasure having known you, I hope to enjoy your affection now and for the rest of my life?” What I am suggesting is that he can say “I love you”, you can hear “I love you”, and when he means he is happy with everything, you (want to) hear that he is devoted to being your partner forever.
In this case it didn’t happen.
Beth,
This guy sounds scary. A normal, balanced, healthy individual with respect for himself and others will accept and respect a “no”. This guy is stalking you. The No Contact approach may be enough, but you may need some outside help to warn/scare/have him arrested. Seriously. This dude hasn’t quit yet – and that bothers me, a lot. Take this seriously, there have already been enough people hurt.
There has been a lot written on Baggage Reclaim about No Contact, that you just start it, that the point is not avoid replying – but to prevent his attempt to call/email/IM/text from getting to you. Your email should take any message with his sender ID and trash it before it hits your inbox – you can’t get past his antics if every week you see that he is still emailing. Just the fact his email arrived, let alone showing the subject – is more than you need. It delays your own recovery and keeps your attention diverting back to him – and reinvesting your attention and emotions in that failed relationship.
I would not use him as an example of ‘commitment phobe’. Instead, I would focus on his morbid obsession with rejection, his gross disrespect to you by ignoring the end of your relationship, and his inexcusable behavior when you believed the words he was saying, about enjoying a relationship with you.
He seems to want to contact you, yet he apparently considers you demented or incapable of answering for yourself – because he sure didn’t believe your “it is over” to apply to him. His arrogance and disregard make whatever issues he has about commitment seem pretty trivial.
Really. Talk to a lawyer, or your local police. You may need to sign a criminal complaint of stalking and sexual harassment, or have a lawyer send a registered “cease and desist” letter. But you need a paper trail for the legal system in case he doesn’t back off.
Address the stalking thing now, read up on commitment phobes with what NML says above and elsewhere here at Baggage Reclaim or in Cosmo with some (girl) friends some sunny afternoon.
And as I mentioned to BBP, when you hear “I love you”, be sure to check whether that means dinner was great, or whether he wants to make a home with children and a life mate.
These responses are all really helpful–thanks again.
Jennifer–you are totally on point. Luckily for me, I am not worried about disrespecting myself because I have quite a high opinion of myself. I think my real problem is with having patience for someone decent to come along. So, I’ll be ok, just frustrated!!!!!! But I will get NML’s book. Best to you and yours.
Brad, I really appreciate what you had to say and I will talk to the police. I am not sure what the laws are in NYC, but I will find out. I can see that he is mentally unstable right now in more ways than one, and I do take that seriously. It’s been at least 4 or 5 emails that he’s completely ignored my wishes for no contact. So,, it’s been shocking to find out that not only is he an EUM and commitment-phobe, but also has severe issues with arrogance and domination (I should have known–he’s a politician…). Gosh, you think you know someone…
But honestly, it has been creepy and totally uncool. Why do there have to be so many psychos out there?!!
Also–
This is somewhat off-topic, but I am beginning to wonder whether I, myself am a commitment-phobe and therefore attracting EUMs. Any advice here? I am willing to do whatever it takes to find out, I am serious about getting clear on this and taking any necessary action.
Babe,
Google: Emotionally unavailable women. I’m certain you will be able to access numerous sites which list the traits.
Men aren’t mysterious creatures we have to read volumes about to understand. Sure there are male and female differences, especially in their range of emotions but figuring men out isn’ t that hard. Here is the single biggest truth I’ve learned from this site.
1. Pay attention to a man’s actions, not what they say. ie: If a man tells you he loves you and then disappears for days on end with no explanation, he doesn’t love you or even respect you.
Unfortunately with assclowns we usually live in a fanstasy world where we ignore their bad behavior and only pay exteme attention to some tiny crumb of normal decent behavior that you would expect for any normal man. We just have to dig back into our pasts and remember what it was like when a man really loved us. Then compare that to how we’re treated by an assclown. I guarentee we can recognize the difference if we put our minds to it.
I’m actually embarrassed by the BS behavior that I put up with from my xEUM. The truth was right in front of me the whole time. Just as NML says:
“You let him back in your life on his terms and you’re essentially being demoted and he’s pulling a classic move where he blows hot, cries wolf, manages down your expectations and starts chasing you again to rebalance things, only this time you end up on lesser terms”
So completely true. Once we cross our boundries and allow them to disrespect us, there is no limit to the self esteem bashing we’re in for. I’ll never let that happen to me again, even if that means staying single.
Now Now ladies, Lets not get into a ruck. Sorted out the CC thing and gaynor you hit the nail on the head, Ive told katyb to back to looking here, as she has a whole lot of her own issues to deal with before she can even think about dating healthy men, cos in my experience they will run for the hills if you aint in control of your own thought patterns and unresolved issues of loving to much to get what you want in the end. This site is about the two a penny idiots she keeps investing her heart in, and beliving the wanton lies to get what they want, sex on tap and an ego boost. Lets get back to talking about the real issue. Sorry NML didnt expect to get a whirlwind going!
“He pursued me ardently throughout the whole time we were together, lavished me with romance, talked about marriage, kids, moving in together, and couldn’t peel himself off of me each time we met……told me he was in love with me…”
“He said he couldn’t possibly be in a relationship right now because “I would hurt him firstâ€.”
I personally don’t believe in commitment phobia as a real condition. Here’s a guy who promises the sun, moon and stars because he wants all the convenience of a woman (sex, her availability) and no responsibility. Some call it a phobia, I call it a lazy little boy.
Stick with NO Communication. Don’t answer one call or text. He’s hoping to get you on the line so he can begin to promise you the world again and start this all over. Ignore, Ignore and he will get it eventually.
Seductress
“the grass is always greener, even if they planted the lawn in the first place.†The problem is, he used plastic turf grass instead of Argentine. The grass is greener where you tend it, but there is no tending needed for fake grass.
The fact that he couldn’t peel himself off of you, and was talking, marriage, moving in together and having kids within the first two month should have been your major big red flag number one.
This man was dumped by his fiance, and he is clearly on the rebound, hunting for validation and confirmation that he is still good enough, not a failure, and desirable. All his crap has nothing to do with you at all, and everything to do with him licking his wounds. He more than likely has been through several of you, between being dumped by his fiance, and discovering you as his next victim.
He looks for low self-esteem woman, because he knows he can easily fool them with words, and nothing more.
Rules,
Glad she’s back. I’m hoping recognition of this using creep will become apparent soon.
Hi everyone. I am new to this site and I had a chance to read this post and all comments. Everyone here seems to have a handle on recognizing unavailable men so I’m hoping you can all give me some advice. How do you handle a man you’ve been with for 5 years who “dumps” you in such a way as to say that all it was for 5 years was just “sex.” For me, it’s very hurtful and I have no idea how to recover from this. As I sit here typing this, I realize there were some big red flags that I should have noticed, but didn’t. I’m crushed but even more upset by the fact he still contacts me asking me if I want to “hook up.” I’ve honestly never been in this type of relationship before and hearing this from him and re-thinking everything, I’m not sure I will ever be able to have a relationship. What makes some women more worthy of respect than others? I’ve read that men like women who are “bitchy” but I’m really not like that (and I thought I wasn’t a dorrmat either). How do you strike a balance? I don’t want to be just a “survivor” from this – I’d like to come out ahead. Thanks for ANY advice.
Chloe,
Please don’t let this creep keep you from finding love again.
It has nothing to with being “bitchy” it has to do with setting boundaries-red NML’s previous post. Are you still talking to this guy, if so you must go no contact immediately (block e-mail and phone number) and never speak to him again. This man is a selfish, cruel and emotionally abusive who doesn’t deserve to have anyone in his life.
What were some of the red flags?
Lastly, read the post How to Spot an Emotionally Unavailable Man (see top right of this page).
Oh, Chloe, you dear thing, I am so sorry for your heart. Your assclown wants to demote you from girlfriend to booty call, yuck!
Read the post on How to Spot Emotionally Unavailable Men (in the Most Popular Posts sidebar) and all the comments where quite a few of us have added to the list of red flags.
Also, go ahead and get Natalie’s book, Mr. Unavailable and the Fallback Girl.” Now I think, as do some of the ladies here, that some of us don’t start out as Fallback Girls looking for a man to ruin our self-esteem, but we are not taught how to recognize them and there are so many, sometimes it is just a bad choice that ends up with us wasting time on these jerks, some of whom are “nice guys” but just emotionally retarded or injured. I think you might be in this category of First Time FBG. But one such experience, especially a long-term one like yours, will groom you into being a repeater Fallback Girl. Five years? Ouch. Mine was six, and I have been NC since October 25th. Fortunately, my EUM has had the decency to stay NC, and I got him to read “Mr. Unavailable” so he knows that I am not going to fall for any more bullshit like “friends” or “booty call” requests. After both of us reading that, he knew the jig was up.
Stay with us and read, ask for support, I have been here every day since Oct. 15th, don’t know how I would have made it otherwise.
It seems I have ALOT of reading to keep me busy. I just downloaded the Mr Unavailable /FB Girl from the site. Honestly, I didn’t think it would be that much to read. God, I really hope I’m not one of them, but since reading th posts that appeared after mine, I’m afraid that I am. I realize that it’s me allowing him to remain in contact by answering calls, texts, etc., and I’m sure he knows how vulnerable I am to him.
Some of the red flags (keep in mind this is all in retrospect) that I should have been more receptive too were 1) texting, which I noticed there is an article on this site about that. 2) Taking “breaks” at his convenience. I just figured all relationships need some space and I didn’t want to make that big of deal out of it. 3) He would promise to try and change, and would for awhile but then go back to being the way he was. There’s a long list – now that I think about it. I was thinking all relationships have their ups and downs so I didn’t really read THAT MUCH into it – at least until the last year when the breaks became more frequent. Does it come down to the simple fact that he just got tired of ME?
I think I’m at the stage where if I answer his texts or see him, that he might just come around and realize that he was wrong. Or maybe I’ve been in that stage for the past 4 years. I feel extremely empty right now – never quite experienced this before and I’ve been through breakups before. For some reason, losing this person hurts the most – possibly because I put all my hopes on him. What I don’t get is that he knew for a very very long time how I felt about him so to say that after 5 years it was nothing but “sex†just knocked me to the floor. If I really thought about it, I lost 5 years of my life, or me, of forgetting what I was like before meeting him. It’s VERY scary and it’s changed me in a way that I do not like. I’m starting to have very real fears about my future and ending up bitter and cynical.
Chloe,
If he just got tired of you he would have ended the relationship like a normal man, an EUM will just continue to string you along with no concern for your feelings or needs. It’s all about him and his needs.! These men are selfish and emotionally dangerous, as we have seen they have caused much destruction and pain for many women on this site. They are incapable of committing to a normal relationship, as that would mean that they would have to be responsible human beings. Not happening!!! If there is a question about NC and its benefits, go to a recent posting about No Contact.
He will not realize he was wrong ! If he hadn’t realized it in five-years he will not realize it now! Remember his words “it was nothing but sex.” Someone that can say something so cruel is not going to come around and see the error of their ways
@Regina, Where is his thinking now since the reading of the book? Didn’t you also say he getting therapy?
I’m glad I found this site. Thanks for being very direct. I have alot of work ahead of me.
Tired shmired. If he was unhappy he should have ended it once and for all, not lead you along and definitely not demoted/insulted you! He sounds like a baby calf who’s been sniffing too much fertilizer! Healthy people figure out what they want and if something’s not what they want, they cut ties in a healthy, grown-up manner. Relationships do have ups and downs, but they shouldn’t be “bi-polar.”
Chloe, another reading project would be “He’s Just Not That Into You.” Greg Behrendt, the co-author, has a little different take. He would say that the *reason* men are EU is that they are just not that into you. He says that men just have this ability to be in relationships where convenience and sex are involved, without being really into the woman, at least not enough to commit to them and be emotionally available, and want to spend time and a life with them.
How old are y’all? Getting “tired” of your partner sounds immature to me, it is what I might have felt in my 20′s, and I’d say “We just grew apart” or “I outgrew him.” If y’all are older I would suspect that you just made it too easy for him, made yourself too convenient, “low maintenance” and did not demand any sort of commitment from him earlier on. So then why shouldn’t he slurp up all your true love as long as the offer is on for free? That is exactly what mine did.
Greg Behrendt would say that if a man says thing like “I wouldn’t ever want to get married,” (which they will tell you within the first few dates) what he really means is “I would never get married to *you* because you are not “the one” and I’m not that into you. Can we have sex now?”
“Bi-polar” is a good term for this type of relationships.
Chloe, the one thing that helped me move on was the kick in the ass I got from my friends. At the time I thought they must not understand my ‘relationship’ but they did and knew that this guy was no good for me. I thank my friends who cared enough to get tough, it certainly made me see the light.
Amen Veronica~ Bi-polar is a great way to decribe the relationship with the a$$clown!! Ups and downs are normal. And as women (who keep the a$$clown sick) we do not realize that the extremes of an a$$ relationship is not normal.
I read the He’s Just Not That Into You’ book. I would have thought he would have figured that out well before 5 Years. Like I said, looking back now there were signs that he wasn’t right. But you know, when you tell someone after that amount of time that all it was, was just “sex” – there’s really no way to just let that roll off your back and say “fine whatever.” To hear that he’s moved on already is quite painful.
I read the He’s Just Not That Into You’ book. I would have thought he would have figured that out well before 5 Years. To think that I wa nothing more than that is very hard to get out from under. But it’s even worse that he thinks so little of me that he can’t leave me alone but continues to keep calling me.
Sorry – doubled up on that last comment, Damn computer.
I should clarify that he said he wanted nothing more to do with me and that he needed to move on and that I would look back on this and laugh. So, ok, I assume he’s going to leave me alone. But he’s not. Like I said, this is the first time I’ve experienced this type of treatment. I am 5 years older than him but we are not in our 20’s.
Look back and laugh???? Is this guy for real??? I think his comments allow him to believe his behavior is OK. Have these narcissistic traits been so apparent in the past???
Beth, I think we (in this type of situation – can’t even call it a relationship) worry and think waaay too much about what is going on with the guy who just dumped us. I’ve wasted many days of my life trying to figure him out. Sometimes, there is no figuring it out – ever.
Now comes the time to look at ourselves. Since being involved with my ex-EUM I have lost all trust in my own feelings and instincts. I am constantly questioning myself and what I believe to be true. Because everything I thought and felt has now been turned upside down on it’s head.
I think NML said this a while back – if we spent half as much time figuring out ourselves and what we want, and will and will not accept, we’d all be better for it. It is very hard to get untangled. I wish you all the best. I am right there with you!
Chloe, they can be not that into you for a very long time, like I said if you made yourself too convenient and low maintenance and had no demands for commitment. It is not them who needs to figure out that they are not into us, it is we who need to correctly interpret the behavior.
I bet yours and my long term EUMs felt bad at times, knowing that their partner was falling more and more deeply in love with him in a way he’d never want to return. But hey, she is coming over to fix dinner and watch TV and a blowjob is probably in the offing, so no time to mention that he’s not that in love with you just right now. He will probably excuse himself on the basis of way back in the beginning he told you he wasn’t the marrying kind.
Way back when we got together I was not the marrying kind or the living-together kind. But my emotions and attachment and love tend to develop, increase and grow with time, I bet yours did too. With a long-term operator EUM, they get to a certain point and then they just won’t move the relationship forward anymore. But they will try to keep you around, girl on tap, a toy on the shelf to take down and play with on *their* schedule.
Did y’all live together? Did y’all ever strike up a deal about what sort of relationship you were going to have?
I am so sorry for the cruelty he has done to you. Take care dear.
Gaynor- hubby gonna reply err dont know where he can, as he dont want to interupt this thread. Katy been on here today, didnt feel like typing. She has’nt got a pc she only comes on this site when at mine. All in all she’s in a mess. Ive dug out a very famous book for her to start her re-hab, and maybe she will start obsessing about herself instead of that freak of a joke she has been. The book in question is based on the 12 steps used in AA and its a great place to start, Im thinking of getting her to an Al-anon meeting as this is an ideal place as she will start to identify her traits and they will kick start a recovery process, if she’s up for the slog I’ll be a sponsor for her but that will have to come later as Im a task master!!! its the only way she’s gonna get herself outta the bad cycle of men choosing she has, we all have or had. I’ve conficasted said mobile deleted all his freaking messages that’she is clinging onto, Im trying to get her to go back to work or go Dr. She’s very needy at the mo, gonna have her and daughter here for the weekend cos she needs a smile. He aint contacted her, ‘SUPRISE’ and thats good she needs to grieve and thats good too. She aint angry yet as she is still blaming herself awfully. God what prick he is.
Regina
No we didn’t live together. Looking back, there were many times he bad-mouthed other people we knew or formed his opinions of others based on what his friends thought. I did see him grow out of that a little bit, though. I knew he had most things handed to him by his parents, but really, I know people that grew up that way and they are TOTALLY different than this guy. I think it’s a simple case of wanting to find the “perfect” girl (in his mind). I used to stand up for myself quite a lot in the beginning and gave specific things that I wanted to see change. But after many times of “Ok, I will try” and then nothing, you kind of just give up thinking that you don’t want to be this demanding, nagging b**tch. But in reality, I was only asking for what any normal relationship would require. I know I allowed him to skirt by with minimal effort, but I don’t excuse his shitty comments or treatment of me at the end or of late. It’s hard for me to accept that he has no trouble treating me this way…
Iliked what NML said about a commitment phobe not commiting to anything, that struck a chord in that, as she says we attract those that mirror ourselves. I in my early staes of getting better realised the awful truthfulness of this about myself, at the time of doing my degree, I literally had to drag my arse through it, it to prove to myself I could commit to something, all the time I was doing it was hard work. I also think this reflects us trying to prove to ourselves how we can commit to anything no matter how hard it is ie relationships. Sometimes though its good to give up and not struggle with the idea that we’ve failed somehow by given up on a man who just doesnt cut it. Thats ok girls, really!!!
Rules,
There are no rules here
I don’t think the other ladies would mind if he give his input on his mindset at the time. I would also be interested if he was conscious of his hot/cold periods??
The AA program sounds like a terrific start, I hope she is open to it. Is she receptive to therapy?
I’m glad the sleaze bag hasn’t contacted her. What would she do if he did? Were you friendly with this guy??
chloe- why bother honey hanging around telling a prick of a man to change, the best love you can give a man, to him and most importantly to yourself is tough love. its not for you to tell him, just turn your pretty, tail around and walk. You say he had everything handed to him by his parents, you noticed it, it registered errrrr HELLO RED FLAG!!!!!! this is a classic sighn of an emotionally unavailable man. And you should be a nagging demanding bitch, err what where you asking for a Yacht? no just common decency, Jesus what a total tosser, babe you are worth more, and anyway, any emotionally available man would see someone who is asking for a bit of respect and deliver and pick up the slack, cos he knows your worth it and dont wanna lose it. No relationship is perfect, we are all complacent at times even this, re-habed arse kicking rules girl. I to get a withering look from hubby if I aint being the best wife, and maybe a few terse words, but I dont see this man as nagging me or controlling, I see him caring about us, and visa vers, an emotianlly avaible men, have usually been unavailble at some point, and see us who try and fix things as not a cloying attribute, but look at us and thank fuck a women who freaking loves me, and yeah needines can be a bit suffocating, but most of the real men I know acknowledge that woman at times need a bit of recuing and do not see it as aweakness but step up to the plate to be a man and rescue a damsel in distress.
I knew him, I saw through him within, oh about 5 mins of meeting him. I had to refrain from telling her, ie to fix it, I hoped she’d see it. Then she came back and back asking me how I handled my addict, many years ago, oh the memory, and I told her, that it would only get worse, oh and it did horridly. but I knew I she had to runwith it. Let me tall you all, when I did start my real recovery, I came across a book of meditations and there was one that always stayed with me, we learn from our teachers, but in truth, when we recover those teachers fade out of our lives. Its so true, we use these men to teach us, our stepping stones, but when we take recovery into our own hands we never meet these men again and also ladies that applies to these men, when they recover girls like katyb fade out of their lives to, because they to are truthfully emotionally unavailble.thats what I want for her, but she’s gotta be on her knees. before she will get help.
NML: Maybe you can post more topics on self esteem and how to improve it? Doesn’t all of this stem from Self Esteem? Is there a way to ever overcome it? I am 33 years old and have been in therapy since I was 17! I have read tons of books on self esteem– and while it has improved…. I can’t say that i have completely conquered it. Is this something we can ever conquer?
Hey Gaynor, did I know in my hot and cold moments. I did, it was a game, getting what I wanted, not caring, but in truth, not realising the pain I was causing, in my mind she didnt like it she could go. Awful and shamful.
Hey John,
Did you tell her you loved her and that you were working towards relationship? Mine said he didn’t want me to get hurt. Did you say the same w/o meaning it? Did you know that she was in love with you, or did you think she was at the same place as you?
Big thank you for answering the questions!!!
It was her tears, that one moment, when she just vented how she felt, it was like a waterfall, I couldnt get a word in, in the end I just looked at this women and I knew, the truth, it was me, I’d treated her horrifically. Total emotionall retard. I knew all along in the relationship that I was covering up the fact I cldnt commit, afraid, so I hid it, let her walk if she wanted, hey Im a man what do I care if a women dont like me, plenty more in the sea, I did care underneath it all, but I was to scared to go against what is percieved to be what a real man is. NO EMOTION. DENIAL. Seeing her pain crushed me. But thats me. It was at the right time, right place, BANG. Other girls had screamed and cryed, but you know what even if it hurt I walked, I was a man what did I care. She did something to me, thankgod I found it again. But it was a close one!!!!! lol.
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