It’s over thirteen years since I started writing about emotional unavailability. Back then I identified key signs that someone was emotionally unavailable and these went on to form the backbone of my first book, Mr Unavailable and the Fallback Girl. In this week’s episode of The Baggage Reclaim Sessions, I revisit the ten key signs that someone is emotionally unavailable.
- They blow hot and cold.
- It’s all on their terms.
- They keep it casual.
- They seek perfection.
- Actions don’t match words.
- You’re subsisting on crumbs.
- They bang on about “timing”.
- There’s a sob story that keeps being rolled out.
- They fast-forward.
- They keep a foothold in your life.
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Some nuggets from the episode:
- It’s exhausting to be with somebody who blows hot and cold because you don’t know where you are with them.
- We often focus on trying to make it ‘hot’ all the time because we think that we have proof that they can do it. It invariably becomes about blaming ourselves for some error on our part that caused them to turn the temperature down.
- When it’s all on one person’s terms, it’s because they need to be in control so that they don’t feel too vulnerable or intimate. And when someone is avoiding vulnerability and intimacy, guess what? They’re emotionally unavailable.
Once it becomes clear that you’re really into Mr/Miss Unavailable and they start to feel in control due to the lack of uncertainty, they begin to blow cold. They discover that they don’t have to do as much to get what you’re giving.
- They didn’t change; you just got to know them.
- When we treat something or someone casually, we don’t feel invested. We know that we don’t have to make as much effort.
- One of the reasons why someone who’s super intense at the beginning bails out is because they don’t want you to see their humanness. They’d rather exit with you believing that they’re the best thing since sliced bread and that you must have effed it up!
- We run into problems when we choose to focus on the words while ignoring the actions or vice versa.
If actions and words aren’t matching, you’ve got problems.
- If we’re habitually involved with emotionally unavailable people or we think that crumbs are enough, we have to examine our own emotional availability.
- A big motivator for lingering in your life, even if it’s just to pop up and be disruptive before they vamoose again, is fear of missing out. Yep, FOMO. Mr/Miss Unavailable is afraid that someone else has snapped up what they couldn’t commit to. That you’re now crazy in love with someone else and giving them what they themselves had felt so assured of. So they re-enter your life to prove that they’re not missing out, that they can still ‘get’ you. Don’t fall for it!
Links mentioned
- Code amber and red problems
- Mr Unavailable and the Fallback Girl
- Love, Care, Trust & Respect
- The 5 Stages of Relationships
- Intensity Isn’t The Same As Intimacy (blog post)
- Intensity Isn’t The Same As Intimacy (nailing down intimacy) (podcast)
- The four qualities we need for a mutually fulfilling relationship where our emotional needs can and will be met
- When I discovered that a friend was dating my ex
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Listener questions can be emailed to podcast AT baggagereclaim DOT com and if there’s a topic you’d love me to talk about, let me know!
Nat xxx
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Another great podcast. The part about how we will only accept shoddy treatment when we are already treating ourselves poorly really struck me, and made my heart sink, to be honest.
I have definitely accepted terrible behaviour, and I have always been so angry about it afterwards. At the guys for their actions/treatment, but I suspect I have also been angry at myself for putting up with it.
I imagine I learned this at home, as my parents were physically present, but were never really that involved or interested. I must have learned to have low expectations.
Natalie, how do we change this? How do I start treating myself better? And how do I forgive myself for sticking around for such bad treatment for so long?
Right on time Nat!
You’re welcome.
Hi Natalie,
Thank you so much for the wisdom you share in your book, “Mr. Unavailable and the Fallback Girl. My therapist and I are using it because there is so much of ME reflected in the pages of that book!
I am unavailable and working on that. I was married to my “Soul Mate” for 28 years when one evening in 2009 he disclosed to me that he was having an affair. I asked him if it was over and he said it was “negotiable”! I asked him how long this had gone on and he said, “Fifteen years!” Yup…fifteen years with the same woman!
He said he wanted to tell me this before he died and he proposed that I share him with her and he kept that position until I divorced him.
I did not ever suspect this was going on and I’ve often mocked women who said they didn’t know. But, the truth is that he was an amazing actor/liar and a great husband. He had to be a good husband because he was screwing around since day ONE of our marriage.
Question. Why didn’t I realize that I was married to a liar when after we got divorced a few people told me that they suspected that he was screwing around? One “friend” told me that I just didn’t want to know. Perhaps…but the thought that he was unfaithful never occurred to me.
What’s your take on this?
Hi Amelia. Thank you for your note. It’s absolutely vital to acknowledge that you are indeed angry at yourself, but then being honest about where that passivity in those situations comes from so that you can break the cycle and allow you to take actions that will lead to you feeling happier and secure.
https://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/48-ideas-for-increasing-emotional-availability-breaking-harmful-relationship-patterns/
https://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/why-you-havent-moved-on-self-criticism-expresses-an-unmet-need/
It’s crucial to remember that you can’t know what you don’t know. It took being in this situation to help you confront the reality of where you were shortchanging yourself so that you could raise your standards. These were *habits* so it felt normal and familiar. Probably, on some level, you hoped that you would change him if you just said or did the right thing, and that goes back to a desire to right the wrongs of the past. To get what you didn’t get before.
It’s undoubtedly painful when you realise that someone isn’t treating you well. You not treating you with love, care, trust and respect, though, doesn’t mean that you created their behaviour. They’re in their own cycle of habits and will go through experiences that will hopefully make them see their own habits.
Hi Nat,
Your work seems to be tailored for the Anxious Preoccupied insecure attachment type.
The other end of the insecure attachment spectrum is Dismissive Avoidant, and there is also Fearful Avoidant which is a combination of those two types.
The avoidant individuals are what you call EUM, although I know you are aware that your audience is also emotionally unavailable.
I’m writing because I observe your own lack of empathy toward the other insecurely attached people, and your blame/shame approach toward avoidant individuals who have developed insecure attachment due to trauma and neglect. It’s a shame that you have such a powerful voice and don’t use it to share more wisdom and balance.
There is a way to support anxious preoccupied individuals without slamming their avoidant counterparts and making it all out to be so evil and intentional.
I guess you have to do what resonates the most with you and your cabal. But as a woman on the other side, I think you should step back and do some research and maybe approach this with more humility and grace toward others who experienced such trauma that their attachment systems have shut down and isolated them.
Diane Poole Heller has a compassionate and wise approach, and there is much research now about the neuroscience of attachment that might open your eyes and bring you to a higher (yet perhaps less lucrative) level of understanding of attachment injury.
Best of luck to you, and maybe it’s time to see if you are able to do even higher good. Open to a kinder perspective, one that isn’t limited and biased by past hurt and personal experience perhaps. We are all in this together and you don’t have all the pieces of the puzzle. I hope you can receive this input and really consider the power of your words, and whether you are wielding that power appropriately or for the truly highest good. I think you can do better than you have. I really think you’re better than this.
Thanks for your feedback, Stella. It is not my intention to be unempathetic or any of the things that you have accused me of. You make a lot of assumptions and assertions. I have never at any point in over thirteen years so much as suggested that I have all the answers and that won’t be the case at any point in my life. Why you would even think that what I do is “lucrative” is beyond me. It isn’t. You clearly have not listened or read very much about me at all. I have never referred to anyone as “evil” or anything close to it.
Bearing in mind that anything I say is always about looking straight back at what that reflects about what *we* need to do, so, for example, when we are around narcissistic folk, to examine that part of us that is inadvertently catering to narcissistic attitudes and behaviour. Or when we are complaining of avoidance, ambiguity and ambivalence, what part of us is avoidant, ambiguous and ambivalent ourselves. Or when we complain of future faking and fast-forwarding, what part of us is deceiving ourselves and fast-forwarding us. Or when we say that we are being used, what is it that we were hoping to get that we were prepared to allow the situation to continue if we thought that we would get it, this idea that I’m suggesting that it’s one-sided and “evil” is unfair. But you are entitled to your opinion and I will take note of your criticism, disapproval and shaming because there is always a reason why someone chooses at this precise moment to say or do something in the way that they do it.
That’s all I am asking, stand back and consider your statements about the intentions and internal mechanisms of wanting “control”, when you post about avoidants.
I have been diagnosed as having Fearful Avoidant attachment style, and your posts read very differently from the FA point of view.
You consistently speak to the internal motivations of an avoidant partner and make this about power and control, and selfishness.
In reality, there is much fear, confusion, anxiety, and sadness.
The internal world of a hot/cold, push/pull Fearful Avoidant is frightening and very painful. And no, I don’t think you show empathy for that. It really sounds like you make them the selfish villain. That’s my opinion. Lots of people here share their opinions and this is one from the other side.
Thanks for taking this into consideration. That’s all I am asking you to do. Yours is a powerful voice and I think you could encourage compassion while also fostering personal growth in your target audience.
If your Anxious Preoccipied audience members grew up with attachment trauma, it’s likely their siblings did too, and their own flesh and blood can adopt different coping mechanisms and attachment styles. It’s sad when one is identified as a victim and the others identified as emotionally unavailable people just looking for control in their adult relationships.
That feeds the misunderstanding and bias against other insecurely attached individuals and it’s destructive.
The “bias” is the predictable consequences of ambivalence in a relationship often coupled with a lack of candor. Being healthy means admitting when your functional relationship preferences or performance are a problem for yourself or others(goes for every person).Then you can like the list says use excuses or do work to make a change.
Control can be selfish, about power, and a result of trauma. Please consider those are not mutually exclusive. Please consider the consequences and result of actions or statements is what is mostly of concern to the people affected by it. Asking or expecting empathy out of people harmed by things is a tough sell to be kind. It’s not about why you punch someone ( extreme example) it’s that you did.
The only difference is whether person can possibly change their “attachment style”. If it’s a place of fear motivation more likely than from a place of domination/sadistic to be something not hopeless. False hope of things getting better is what keeps people in abusive or just miserable relationships. Most of the people here have too much empathy and consideration for others and not enough for themselves.
In defense of Natalie she mostly redirects the audience to examine and self reflect on their own behavior, values, self nurture, and such instead of ruminating on wondering internal complicated sometimes unknowable motivation or issues of others.
Lastly I am sure being one of these a$$clowns is miserable because we can get away they are stuck with themselves.
For clarity, I want to explain that my attachment type includes Anxious Preoccupation (the group that your blog seems to address primarily).
So I identify with a lot of what you describe in terms of clinging, low self esteem, seeing through rose colored glasses. I long for love, also. I find myself mistreated and confused, also.
But on top of that, I experience what is called deactivation, withdrawing, avoidant behavior.
It’s as unstoppable it seems, as the preoccupation and anxiety. It’s confusing, painful, and dramatic.
I am one person who exhibits both traits and I can tell you, it’s very different on the inside that how you describe. And, what you describe in Mr./Ms. Unavailables is very much like an FA pattern.
I don’t expect you to understand it, I’m just asking you to look into it, maybe you could help a broader audience, although that may not be your intention.
Anyway, I will let that go and don’t expect anything, I just thought I would speak up from another point of view. I know you mostly receive praise, and criticism can be triggering, I’ve experienced that a lot in what I have read from you. This isn’t a parting shot. It really is painful being insecurely attached, and criticism can trigger all of us. Of course, not engaging is an option for all of us and I don’t wish harm so I will move on along. Thank you for at least engaging the discussion.
I barely post and was hesitant to but I just wanted to weigh in as an avoidant myself and state that this site has helped me so much. It helped me to stop demonising myself and to understand that emotional unavailability = emotional unavailability, full stop. Nat stresses that if you’re chasing EU’s you’re are most likely EU yourself, regardless of how you attach. I also learned elsewhere (psych today I think) that the only good attachment style is a healthy one and that’s what we should all be working towards wherever we’re starting from. Please don’t beat yourself up, Stella. That’s what I’ve had to work on personally because my biggest enemy to my peace and happiness is me and it starts with accepting that we’re all just as flawed as eachother, regardless of attachment style and just trying to do the work. 90-95% of what’s on here as helped me so please do stick with it xxx
Nat, thank you so much for this site. I still struggle in myself at times but it has been a literal life saver. Please keep up the good work!!!
It’s kind of you to post, LilyO2011, and please don’t feel that you have to be cautious about posting (or come to my defence)! But thank you for sharing your experience. Everyone, as you say, has their own personal struggle, and part of our journey, ultimately, is about working out how we want to proceed, what we want to be. And it’s not easy, obviously! I come from two families of avoidants. Actually, make it three when you include my stepfather’s family. And we get on way better now than we ever have despite the fact that most haven’t addressed their stuff. But even me having addressed mine has been enough for a shift. Emotional unavailability, whoever is experiencing it, is emotional unavailability. I’m glad that you’re supporting you to make changes. Take care of you.
Thanks, Nat:)
I barely post and was hesitant to but I just wanted to weigh in as an avoidant myself and state that this site has helped me so much. It helped me to stop demonising myself and to understand that emotional unavailability = emotional unavailability, full stop. Nat stresses that if you’re chasing EU’s you’re are most likely EU yourself, regardless of how you attach. I also learned elsewhere (psych today I think) that the only good attachment style is a healthy one and that’s what we should all be working towards wherever we’re starting from. Please don’t beat yourself up, Stella. That’s what I’ve had to work on personally because my biggest enemy to my peace and happiness is me and it starts with accepting that we’re all just as flawed as eachother, regardless of attachment style and just trying to do the work. 90-95% of what’s on here has helped me so please do stick with it xxx
Nat, thank you so much for this site. I still struggle in myself at times but it has been a literal life saver. Please keep up the good work!!!
I have not posted in a while… I came here in February-March 2014 going through what I thought was an epiphany relationship breakup. I had been chasing an EU man. I have learned from this site that I am an EU myself. However, the interesting thing is that I have turned from anxious attachment EU to avoidant attachment. I chose to pick wrong men again in the last 2 years, and I built the walls, so that these people will not get close to me. Talking about being ready for a healthy relationship…
I have read a lot of Nat’s posts about breaking the cycle. I think there is a point when the knowledge of my behavior, consciousness, and painful experiences of enough is enough come together finally. What I realize is that I have to break the cycle of unavailability myself. Self-awareness is the key. The desire should be there. This really is a conscious choice. Break the pattern, the cycle now. I personally have come to the realization that I am fully prepared to do so. It has taken me few years to get there.
Thank you, Nat, for your blog. I have been a reader for 5 years and it has helped me tremendously. The funny thing is in my last relationship that ended on Christmas, although I was fully aware of all the red flags and my own unavailability because of the red flags, I kept sticking to the relationship (exception, investment, fix the wrongs of the past).
What brilliant about this epiphany relationship is that now I don’t even question much what he did wrong. It doesn’t matter. I see clearly (just one month after breakup) everything I did wrong. From picking and staying with this person to behaving in an unhealthy way. Avoiding the relationship while staying in it, exactly because I knew from the start he was not a person to grow old together.
It’s painful nevertheless, but the amazing thing is I feel it in my gut and heart that I have finally understood it. I have broken the pattern for good! So yes, even EU people, avoidant or anxious, can do this. It takes honesty, self-introspection, self-awareness, growth, self-love, and the sincere desire to be vulnerable, to open up to a person, and be ready for a loving relationship. It can happen this quickly! I have been preparing for this for several years though. But it’s possible, so please do not give up and read , read this blog. Remember to look at yourself. Not at he/she did/does. Look at your actions, fears, motivations. It starts with us!
Totally get this, Sofia, and that’s really the gift of the relationship. It’s brought you face to face with what you’ve needed to confront in a way that’s going to make it hard for you to un-see it. And, yes, it is painful, because we see, not just so much of ourselves and where we need to have more self-compassion, to not be stubborn, to be open up, to be more discerning, but also where we’ve misjudged certain things. And you’re so right about how it can feel like a big shift has happened really quickly but that, actually, you’ve been building up to this for some time. Onwards! And thank you, Sofia.
Thank you, Nat! Yes, this is how this relationship feels. Awakening to both loving myself and being available in addition to realizing that the cycle of choosing unavailable men is broken. Even though it hurts because we do get attached to a person although they were not right for us, still it hurts less knowing that I had known all along that he was not a long-term perspective for me. It just baffles me now why I decided to stay in this relationship for so long. Maybe that’s why – to learn my lesson and move on to a healthier, available relationship for the first time in my life!
This podcast feels like it was written just for me. I have had a few LTR relationships with EUMs in my lifetime. After the last one I have taken about three years off dating and worked on myself and making my life better; exploring other non-dating options that bring joy and fulfillment. Also did therapy for many years. I just recently decided to give dating a try again. I had about 8 dates that were a mismatch, 1 person who was actually a good person and sweet but for number of reason not a good match.
Finally I met someone who seemed like a solid person to date. We had some really good dates. We talked about values and had deep conversations about families and what it was growing up like etc…The other day he had a rough week at work and I invited him over for dinner on the weekend. It took him a very long time to respond and said he was going to see his family depending on the weather but will get back to me as soon as he knows. His non-commital response made me anxious immediately. Well, he never got back to me about dinner. I spent the weekend wondering. On Monday morning he sent me a non-chalant text about the weather Needless to say I was pissed off at this post. Over the weekend I went through all kinds of emotions, the possibility of ghosting to who knows what. So I confronted him (in a civil tone) and asked him what the hell has happened and he gave me some tap dance about being busy and driving up to see his family. My gut has been sending something has been off for a week. The last date we had, I asked him out he didn’t seem to want to plan anything. That was already amber alert to me. We did have a great date though, so that anxiety quieted.
So when he gave me this whole spiel about being busy I told him that I noticed that his interest levels seemed to wane and I felt like I was doing most of the work and if he could clarify if dating was something he wanted to do or not. I explained that I enjoyed his company, but I needed more enthusiasm and momentum. Also that if we were dating I had some hope to see him once a week and not have a text only communication. 12 hours later he send me this 500 word text novels about how he feels really conflicted because he has so many things on his hand, a house he is rehabbing, work and “other issues” that he thinks maybe he is not available to put more time in dating. He even told me he had a relationship last summer and he had to end it because he couldn’t focus on his things blah blah skippy.
EJECT! Was my instant reaction.
I don’t know if I would have had the clarity without Natalie’s advise to boot his ass. I basically told him that he can do himself a favor and just let people know heads up if he just hooking up with them. Because it’s either dating or hooking up, she shades of grey in between is cruel and unfair.
To pretend to date is pretty shitty. If he knew last summer after his relationship ended that he is too busy, why go on dating website and say he wants a relationship? This was my shortest dance with a EUM, only a month long but unfortunately still stung. I have gotten much better at eliminating them after a quick discovery phase; but it still bothers me that I even attract these types. I am taking another break from dating. I need to expand my IRL social network I think. How do I not attract these types? I feel like I have done so much work on myself but apparently I need to do more since I still attract them. Any ideas?
Hi Alma. This is one of those situations that felt nice on the surface but that left you feeling surprisingly hungry. You felt like something was missing. Something felt off because it was. And the thing is, at this stage in the proceedings, we *have* to trust ourselves even if we’re not 100% sure what all of the ‘data’ means. All things will become clear, as it did in your case. There is a short-term mindset that prevents someone from considering consequences, especially around things that they are aware are going to pose an issue… because they already have. Trust is a gamble where we effectively hope that the person will value the benefit of building a long-term relationship over letting us down or even screwing us over in the short term. In dating, people do a lot of things that don’t make sense because of what they’re trying to get and avoid, and they often kid themselves that it’s OK because everyone’s having a good time. From your side, this is about being unambiguous. You say that you have more work to do but the work is in living and having a go at dating and then tweaking and refining as you go. First you start by declining the same type of people that you would have been sucked in by before. Gradually, you become attuned to these and it becomes easier to spot them or opt out very quickly. It’s too much to expect to do work and never have the wrong person approach you. Just get good at discerning who’s right from who’s not-so-right for you.
Alma,
This exact same thing happened to me. I tend to attract EUs, and the ones that are crazy about me, of course I have no interest. I am working on this, but it’s very difficult.
When I was reading your story- the first thing I thought was that I would have told him to get lost after he hemmed and hawed about your weekend dinner. BUT this is only because I had just experienced this same sort of behaviour. I did exactly what you did before this all exploded on me, and accepted a lame excuse / shady behaviour. And I am also proud to say that I told him his behaviour was unacceptable, and he needed to think of the consequences of his actions.
Now that I have experienced this sort of treatment, I know exactly what the outcome will be, and I am not putting up with it. I do believe we have to keep trying and remember what we have learned from all of these experiences.
When I read Nat’s response, I was so relieved. This means I am truly learning. So chin up girlfriend, try again and pay attention to your feelings.
So many thanks to Nat for this blog, podcast and feedback for all of us. So sad I missed you when you were in San Francisco!
Another superb Podcast, Natalie – thank you. Listened to it several times! Whilst I can acknowledge that the guy I dated several years ago now but really liked was definitely emotionally unavailable (a resounding yes to numbers 1-6!) as was I, what I’m really struggling with is knowing he’s now emotionally available with someone else – apparently in a very happy relationship, living together & expecting a baby. We work in the same place so it’s hard to get away from! It’s like I had glimpses & she’s got the real deal! Hearing about it has led to much rumination over the regret (of what I did/didn’t do – particularly terrible communication) & the disappointment of it all. Whilst trying to avoid bumping into them in the supermarket! (we live near each other). Any advice? Could you do a Podcast on this topic? Thanks, as always!
I’m sure that there were at least a couple of my exes who saw/heard that I was happier, that I’m clearly in a very different emotional, mental, etc., place to where I was before, and felt a bit off about things. It’s our ego. We see it as a statement about us that someone wasn’t at their best *with* us. But our relationships reflect where each of us was at at the time. They also reflect what we need to heal, learn and grow. The fact that he’s, for instance, expecting a baby and living with someone doesn’t mean that he’s had come-to-Jesus moment and, Shazam!, his whole life has been dramatically solved and he’s a different person. It’s possible that he’s worked through some stuff in the time between your relationship and this one. He most definitely will have to continue to work through stuff. The fact that he’s living with someone and having a baby doesn’t mean that he’s emotionally available. It just means that he’s living with someone and having a baby and that maybe, hopefully, he’s grown. You also can’t know from glimpses that she’s the real deal, plus who she is has nothing to do with your involvement with him. Communication is two-way. The two of you didn’t communicate well in the relationship and hopefully, that experience and others has or is forcing each of you to address that. He wasn’t the person you were supposed to be with, and this is OK. You just have to stop convincing you that he would have been “If only”. Humans have a habit of rewriting the past once they know how things have turned out. You probably didn’t believe he was Mr Perfect or The One, but now that he’s living with someone else, you’ve rewritten the past to cast you as the masterful architect of your demise and him as The One Who Got Away. Really? Maybe the hint from this situation is that things move on and you can too.
Thanks so much, Natalie. Wise words, as always. Definitely had more than my fair share of ‘if only’ & ‘woulda, shoulda, coulda’ moments with this one! I was hoping that after a run of bad experiences this was indeed going to be ‘the one’ but in reality neither of us were ready/in the right place at that moment in time. That’s the reality of the situation. Letting go of the illusion of what I hoped it would be (& certainly felt like at times) is absolutely necessary but hard! As is keeping faith that it might just one day happen for me! Thanks again – love your work so much & have learned heaps!
I would like to talk about men. Men wonderfully manage to encrypt from us women. Obviously not expressing their emotions, they often put us in a dead end. After all, we are accustomed to reading information from the face. And here our “reading program” gives an error message with something like “could not read the information, try again”. And we repeat. And we get the same result … Meanwhile, if you clearly understand the causes of emotional closeness, fewer conflicts would be in a relationship. Speaking about the sphere of emotions, it is necessary to immediately note that this is still a women’s territory. A woman can easily afford to openly express her emotions, and in most cases no one will blame her for it. Moreover, society expects an expression of emotionality from a woman. After all, our female energy is in the emotions. And an energetic woman is always attractive.
For a man, the rules are exactly the opposite. As a child, the boy was explained that he is
“future man” and therefore should be able to endure the pain and various kinds of deprivation, without expressing their feelings. Having matured, the young man begins to try on the roles protector. Each of these roles requires him to make different decisions, where the inclusion of the emotional sphere will only interfere. Therefore, is it any wonder that a man does not want to manifest his emotions?
Well Natalie, just like most of the commenters here, I am GRATEFUL for your blog and podcast! Reading it since college (or right after? Idk, it’s been so long!). Thank you!
I’m almost embarrassed to post this, but I’d like to hear The Good, The Bad, & The Ugly opinions/analysis of this guy’s behavior. He has not contacted me in over 2 weeks (not uncommon), and I don’t plan to respond anymore if he does later on. So here it goes:
– After our first amazing kiss, since we both failed at exchanging phone numbers that night, I guess I later assumed that he’d be The Man and contact me via the mutual friends that we were with (he works with them) on that night = not. Instead, he waited slightly over a MONTH to contact me through one of those friends using the excuse that he remembered that I shared a birthday with that person’s child. My ‘bad’ for taking it where it later went…
– …He intentionally didn’t call me to confirm our first date like I’d asked him to do (to piss me off enough to cancel hopefully?!) so that he wouldn’t have to go through with it? When we finally did meet up much later in that night, I asked him if he really felt like doing this right now – was he too tired? – and he said nothing = he later on would always use silence to avoid saying the wrong (honest?) thing.
(He had too much time before the date to think it over – how’d he’d weasel out of what had the potential to later become a relationship?)
– The first time we had sex he offered me condoms WHILE suddenly just ramming his penis into my body – again to piss me off?!
– He then proceeded to prematurely ‘finish’ not once, but TWICE – again to piss me off?!
– And yes, he tried using the ‘polite fade thing’ on me afterwards – even going as far as to send the “Oh jeez, I thought I’d sent my response to your email…” kind of thing = B.S.!! He was just ‘too polite’ to be honest about it!
– He told me that he “almost forgot” about coming over to see me one pre-planned Sunday afternoon (to piss me off?!) and technically, he was one hour late.
– He ?tried? to ruin our pre-planned time alone by telling our other friends at an after work meet-up in a bar that he had more hard cider/booze “up at the house” thereby implying to all of the others present that the invitation was open to party at his house afterwards – after all of the trouble he’d claimed he’d went through explaining beforehand to his best friend not to encourage that….
– He foolishly saved/held an email response for three days before actually sending it which is game-y but hahaha – it still had the original time stamp on when it was actually written/saved, but showed-up in my inbox three days later!!
– Most recently, he proceeded to string me along for weeks with sweet nothings and attentive affectionate emails; then another time calls while driving around to try to show-up last-minute at my house when I wasn’t home, then later emails me to say he’s decided out-of-the-blue that the next several weeks he’ll be renovating his basement bathroom – to ‘busy’ himself up with future excuses to avoid seeing me?!
– Then when I call him after almost a week of silence and two ignored emails, he behaves cool-ish telling me that he’ll call me later on = not.
I’m so confused because he’s so lovey-dovey then he just disappears for weeks – by phone, by email, by everything….
Ladies & Gentleman: WTF?!?! I feel like his Personal Punching Bag!! Why, why, WHY & what causes this nasty behavior and why do I hang on his every stupid move?!?! Thanks, Renata1967
Renata,
This man is a self-centered assclown. The reason his behavior is so confusing to you is because you are trying to convince yourself that lovey-dovey is his normal state and that some hidden issue is causing him to sometimes act like a jerk. If only you could figure out what that hidden thing was, you could help or fix him or at least understand him better. This is not going to happen!
His behavior makes perfect sense if you look at it from the opposite perspective: the selfish, inconsiderate behavior is his normal state and he sometimes acts lovey-dovey because he wants something and he has figured out that this is the best way to get what he wants from you. In other words, the reason he so often acts like an assclown is because he IS an assclown.
Your guy sounds almost exactly like the guy I was dating when I came to Baggage Reclaim. This site is by far the best resource I’ve found for understanding my thoughts and feelings around that relationship. I hope you are able to find what you need here so that you can forgive yourself for this relationship and move on.
Thank you Stephanie for such a spot-on response! It’s been so hard to think straight or I should say, think past his hot/cold behaviors. My feeling is that he got very ‘burnt’ in his last relationship and I got to pay the ‘price’. On some level, it truly felt like he enjoyed doing this crap to me. I have not contacted him and will not be contacting him ever again. And YES – I really love this website! Very helpful & healing….
“the selfish, inconsiderate behavior is his normal state and he sometimes acts lovey-dovey because he wants something and he has figured out that this is the best way to get what he wants from you.” I feel like dong one of those preach dances like you see in church. Tell it, Stephanie!
Renata,
I’m sorry, I’ve also put up with terrible behaviour in the past. But there are so many things you’ve listed that in their own are enough to say bye to this ass forever. Notably, him just deciding to “go ahead” without a condom, without your consent? That is such a huge violation.
This guy acts this way because this is who he is. An otherwise good guy who is just not up for a relationship would not do these things. And someone being terrible even some of the time is not acceptable.
I think for myself, because I have a parent who is lacking in empathy, and basically an erratic jerk most of the time, I sometimes just freeze when someone demonstrates terrible behaviour. I learned as a child to just…put up with things because that was the messaging I received: this is how this person is, if you call them out on something, they will just explode and won’t take responsibility, so there’s no point.
We waste time trying to figure them out rather than turning the focus to asking “wait, am I ok with any of this?”, to which the resounding answer is NO. Stop trying to figure him out and resolve to be done with him.
For me, reminding myself of some of the worst things a person has done, or finding one of Natalie’s articles that resounds with me to re-read has been helping in staying firm in keeping away from these people.
Isla – Thanks for your response! Too totally funny: He actually emailed me out-of-the-blue a couple of days ago pretty much like nothing should be wrong about contacting me after a MONTH of NOTHING?! He was yammering on about the whole busy thing, having to shovel snow every other day, etc. He ends the email with one of his “I hope to see you very SOON/I miss your lips.” Umm, SERIOUSLY?! And what the hell does “soon” even mean anyway?! He’s said “soon” in previous emails too. I guess once his other “options” get boring then I can be taken down from the shelf, lol?! He’s absolutely maddening! I haven’t responded & won’t….
I’ve decided to work on my family-of-origin/abandonment issues because I think I’m picking these types because I still haven’t done enough work on them. I also do the “freeze” thing too, especially with grief/loss. I’ve learned to suspend feelings; it really messes me up later.
‘Suspect you’re being used’ Natalie, you’re brilliant. It took me a while to realize he was emotionally unavailable until i noticed plans were always at his mercy/terms. It’s freeing not having to be in that dynamic anymore.
I’ve been dating a guy for 5 1/2 years. He has great qualities in that he takes really good care of his elderly parents and also his brothers often financially. He claimed to be in love with his ex GF and that she was horrible to him. They dated for 1 1/2 years and he took her to Hawaii right after they first started dating and they went on a lot of trips together. He took care of her daughters (the husband died in an accident). Well, he has never asked me to be his GF; never taken me on a trip; never remembered my birthday (didn’t even celebrate with me but once); never has given me flowers; always gets on the phone and talks endlessly about his life. He doesn’t even really know what I do for a living and when I recently tried to open up about it, he told me that he doesn’t care about my work/company. After, I told him that I was really done, he said that he wanted to have me over and to give me flowers because I deserved them. He then sent me a picture of the dozen red roses that he had bought. When I came over and the night had ended, I came out of the restroom and he had put one of the roses in my tote. I took it out and he replied and said well, I could wrap the others for you if you like. I thought seriously, is this for real?? I left without a single flower. It felt like a total mind-fuck. I said thanks for buying me flowers and then keeping them for yourself. He claimed that they were simply a few days old and he felt they weren’t fresh enough to give to me. It’s always an excuse and now when I call him out on these long-term issues/patterns, he claims that I just don’t get/appreciate the pressure he is under with work and his parents. He claims that he loves me and treats me really well. In my view, he hasn’t met just baseline level of care and showing me that he truly values me. He also very rarely stays the night and all of our plans are at most made a day in advance. If it’s more than that, it always gets moved. HELP! I want to get off this dark and twisty ride! I’ve told him so many times to go and meet someone he’s in love with and let me be and he tells me that he cares about me so much and loves me. He also binge drinks once or twice a week where he literally stays up all night and sometimes into the next day. And funny thing, as I’m sitting here putting it all down on paper, I feel like such a fool like what am I doing with my life!??
I dated a guy that for five months that displayed 9 out of these 10 signs to the T. Plus, he was passive aggressive during conflict, resented his mom, tried to maintain the status quo, etc. He never future faked though. We both live abroad and were leaving within the next year so he was always clear that he wouldn’t do that whole get serious with a girl before he left, again because last time it backfired and he got his heart broken.
Yet he still acted like he was in a relationship and gave me some ‘hallmarks’, but also frequently withheld, moved the post around, etc. His incongruence was exhausting and I finally said enough is enough when he said ‘Well I just want something in between a friendship and a relationship.’ I told him to give me some space and see if we could salvage a friendship, but that clearly this wasn’t working and I would never be able to feel secure with his idea of intimacy.
He said ‘Yeah, no prob’ / ‘It is what is’/ ‘I told you we’d just how it goes’. He proceeded to act like we were still dating- he started blowing up my phone and gave me no room to breathe.
I met up with him one night because I was high off the chemicals, in denial about the his unavailability at the time and was like ‘Hmm, maybe he actually wants to try.’ (holding on to the positives instead of the negatives) He bought me drinks one night, started going on about how great I am, and dropped a comment about how much his mother liked me when she met me a month earlier. I thought he was trying to win me back. So I asked “Well, why didn’t you try harder when we were dating?” He said “Well, it’s love….” “What?” “I just don’t feel enough of a spark to be with you.”
Needless, to say I told him off, cut him off, and haven’t seen him after that. He still texts me every now and then and just says vague things at me. I don’t respond.
Hello Nat. and everyone on the blog. I finally decided to share my story after years of reading the site and trying to get out of my own relationship insanity.
First of all, I don’t intend to make my EUA guy seem like a bad person. He’s an amazing person and that’s why I fell for him in the first place. This situation is about me, not about him.
Our ‘thing’ started about four years ago. I was just getting into the university and he’s 8 years older than me. I was very excited because he had all the traits that I was looking for: book lover, witty, the type of guy who wants to get away on weekends, very understanding and patient. The most important is that I felt like I could learn from him and become a better person with him in my life. Flirting was intense and sex was the best I ever had so after a couple months I would like this to evolve.
Since then we had countless conversations why ‘this relationship is not right for us’. It was the age difference, issues at work, issues with his family, long distance, he wants to have a family but I’m way too young for that, he isn’t in love with me, he considers getting back with his ex and invited her to move in with him. And after each long intense conversation we would end up having sex saying this would be the last time so we’ve been in this back and forth for almost four years. I had so many ending conversations and periods of mourning I have lost count. All of my friends are sick and tired of listening about one more “critical moment” of my non-relationship. Our “relationship” adds up on amazing nights in bed and long periods of ending it.
Okay now, anyone can say ‘HEY WHAT’, Mr. Obvious. This is not a relationship. But you know, since I’m on this site all the hallmarks were there. Amazing sex and strong attraction, staying up talking all night, making plans (that never happened), asking me out on dates only to stand me up, saying he will come over for the weekend, saying how much he likes me but he *must* resist me because this is not right, apologising over and over again, asking for time to sort things out only to come up with the same result and repeat.
He was always 100% honest about everything. I knew he didn’t want to be with me, that he had other priorities, that he wants to have a family and tries to get back with his ex, that he’s terrible with plans and always lets people down (okay, this is where the BS start) and yet we couldn’t keep our hands off each other.
What did I do? Thank you Natalie for pointing all these out to me and help me grow through this. I was always available. Holding my phone in case he wants to come over, cancelling all my plans because he mentioned he might be in town, saying that this was not right for me and I couldn’t put up with it anymore but still negotiating my boundaries, giving chances, creating fantasies. I even spent periods obsessing about him and why I wasn’t enough for him and why did he choose his ex over me. I spent periods obessing over every detail of what he said and done even though the message was loud and clear, he just didn’t want to be with me. The biggest mistake: after each time I felt like he screw me up I would tell him that I was okay with how things roll. I would cry my eyes out and then I’d tell him that I don’t mind being casual because I understand what he’s going through. I was dishonest, I wanted to be brave, I wanted to look secure, sophisticated even.
After four years he’s still stuck with the same old problems and dilemmas he had the first time I met him. Neverending problems with work and family and losing himself, always asking for time to sort things out and always having conversations with his ex about their plans to live together. He still fails to be there for my as a lover and as a friend (e.g. he didn’t make it on my graduation day and he’s that sort of person who gets out of his way to do something if he really wants to). But are all these about me? No. Did he have the choice not to get involved with me or let me go at an earlier stage of this mess? Yes. Did I also have the choice to let him go since this made me feel 10% amazing and 90% shitty and anxious? Yes. Why would he say no to such amazing sex and zero commitment?
I take full responsibility for my choices. We always have the choice to leave. Thank you Natalie for all the great work you put out there and thank you everyone for taking time to read my post.
P.S. I might not be 100% there yet but writing things and deconstructing what seems like a complicated situation, really helps to spot the BS and state the obvious. Highly recommended.