Welcome to another episode of The Baggage Reclaim Sessions.
In episode 79, I cover:
Do we really need ‘space’ in the form of a casual relationship? Following on from my post about pop-up relationships, it got me thinking about how some people see these as a way of meeting their needs. But what if this isn’t the need? Referencing Karen McCall’s Financial Recovery book, I explain how distinguishing between needs and wants plays a big factor in ensuring that we don’t opt for something like a pop-up relationship without having a strong awareness of our needs.
Sometimes we’re too nice for our own bloody good!: Several months after being unceremoniously dumped by her fiance, an acquaintance has effectively become his armchair therapist despite her now being in a relationship with someone else. Topics covered including looking for a retraction, including a rejection retraction, thinking that we’re being ‘nice’ when we’re neglecting our needs to take care of everyone else’s, why we need to ask the question, ‘Why us?’ from two angles, why we mustn’t rob from our healthy relationships to prop up an unhealthy one, and knowing when to draw the line.
Tricky texts: I explain why short but loaded texts and super long texts, sometimes cause the recipient to delay in responding.
Listener Question: How do I handle my imposing co-worker?
What I Learned This Week: I’m on the move and it’s had me thinking about my ‘road of trials’.
How to leave a review
The Pop-Up Relationship
The book list which includes Karen McCall’s Financial Recovery
Rejection Retraction
How important is it for you to be The Good Girl?
If You’re Being What You Think Is a ‘Good’ Girlfriend/Boyfriend, Are You Actually Being You?
Podcast about tricky co-workers
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Listener questions can be emailed to podcast AT baggagereclaim DOT com and if there’s a topic you’d love me to talk about, let me know!
Nat xxx
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NML,
I have really started to internalize your posts and podcasts since the beginning of the year. I think because I’ve really started to heal. This podcast was so insightful for me. I found the phrase I was looking for, “rejection retraction.” It defines my previous desire for validation from the toxic relationship I ended a little over a year ago. When I ended the relationship, something inside of me knew I had to go “no contact” even before I knew what that meant (before I found your book and blog). I had watched him remain “friends” with his previous ex’s and I vowed I would not be “one of those” ego strokers. I have maintained no contact since then. He attempted to gain attention from me by posting on Facebook (he is definitely an attention whore who LOVES Facebook) how thankful he was for all the support I provided caring for his kids and mom who had Alzheimer’s. He never thanked in person or during the 2 years I spent with him. His post infuriated me. He was using me to gain attention from his harem and superficial relationships. I did not take the bait. I received a letter from him in December that his mother had passed away. He also sent the program from her funeral, which again he mentioned me in the program. Talk about emotional blackmail. I did not respond, I did not write him a letter of sympathy. And you know what, I never once felt guilty for not reaching out to him. I mourned the loss of his mother alone. I did mail a sympathy card to his children specifically addressed to them. I had become a mom to his children for 2 years and loved and treated them like my own. I later found out his children did not receive the card. I imagine he was loathing in self pity that I did not contact him and threw away the card. He has not changed and that is the reason I did not contact him. I would have only hurt myself looking for his validation (as you stated, reaching out from not an authentic place). I would have played arm chair psychologist until his needs were met. I value myself too much to be used by him anymore.
The other podcast that really resonated with me was regarding being the “common denominator.” When I ended the toxic relationship last year, it hit me that I was the common denominator in all my failed relationship but I didn’t know why. It was a matter of weeks after the relationship ended I found your book and your blog. The part in the podcast where you mentioned having several relationships where the partner has cheated was me!! (And I’m sure many other listeners). But you made me realize it wasn’t that I made my partner’s cheat, it was the partners I was choosing. Ding, Ding, Ding……..cue the Angel’s signing!!!
I loved how you equated finishing a book you don’t like to remaining in bad relationships. Again, that’s me! It has sometimes taken me years to finish a book that I don’t really enjoy because I’m not a quitter and I don’t like to give up……..like the book is going to magically improve…………like my partner is suddenly going to morp into an emotionally available partner if I stay long enough and don’t quit.
Your podcasts are my therapy during my longer runs. I will listen to them over and over. Thank you.
(Sorry for the emotional vomit, sometimes I get nervous to post).
CLR,
You are doing so good!! (I remember commenting on one of your comments.) Glad you didn’t take the bait.
SC,
Thank you. And thank you for your continued words of encouragement.
I have to say, when I received his letter, it never once occurred to me to respond. I knew he hadn’t changed and we never resolved anything from the toxic relationship. I am one of the only ex’s he has not maintained contact with. It was a control move on his part. Besides, what would I have said, “I’m so sorry to hear about the passing of your mom. You are a complete assclown, douche bag. Now leave me alone”????? I still have some work to do as I have not come to a place of indifference yet. But, I am getting better.
Thanks
CLR,
You handled all of this extremely well. I really cannot think of a better way to have done it! Excellent no contact skills for sure.
You sound like you are in such a better place from being a caretaker to this man’s responsibilities to putting yourself first (which is the way it needs to be).
Not so long ago, I was in an extreme caretaker position, and while I don’t think I regret it, I know I can never return to that extreme while taking care of me. So I choose me. Every time.
SC,
I don’t regret providing support for his children or his mother. I provided a “maternal” presence for his children for those 2 years and I provided care for his ailing mother. I grew to love them. I work in healthcare, so I tend to have a care taking disposition. What I wish I would have done differently is made my voice heard and not silenced my needs. I think I only said, “no,” twice during our relationship. The one time I asked for some appreciation, he became angry at me and ignored me for about a week. I learned to silence my voice. But of course the resentment just built. What I have realized in retrospect was my ex husband taking me to court for child support was a favor in disguise. I refused to allow my ex husband to treat me that way and I stood up to him and his lawyers. In standing up for myself to my ex husband, I started standing up for myself to the toxic ex. The ex husband and the toxic ex are one in the same, just a different package. Neither one of them liked me standing up for myself. I won in court against my ex husband and I ended the toxic relationship.
Sorry these responses become long. I’ve quit talking about my these events in my life with friends and family, so when I write about it, it all just comes out. I appreciate your words of encouragement and “listening.”
CLR,
I have really gotten a lot out of our dialogue. I hate standing up for myself, it feels awful in the moment, but after things are so much better. But of course sometimes there can be retaliation on the other person’s part, but I guess being an adult is standing up for what’s right anyway.
I also negate my needs. In one attempted recent friendship, I told the woman it was okay to ignore me. I really said that. Anyhow, I ended up becoming resentful and cutting off the relationship as she mostly sat back and picked and choosed which interactions befitted her, while I gave and gave emotionally. Nope. Not happening again. Still working on the boundaries thing.
SC,
I too have gained some valuable insight from our “conversation.” Having boundaries and standing up for myself have been very difficult to implement. It’s still all very foreign to me. But I when I do stand up for myself, I feel so much better. Baby steps, right??
Hi Natalie,
I just wanted to tell you how sorry I am to hear about your father’s death. I know this ‘Comments’ section isn’t exactly the place to put this message, but I just wanted to reach out to you and share my thoughts for you. You don’t even have to publish this comment if you don’t feel like it.
I won’t pretend to know how you’re feeling, but from what you’ve shared, it seems we have similar relationships with our fathers and I know if I lost mine, it would be a mixed bag of contradictory emotions. Anyway, it’s not about me, it’s about YOU: and I just want you to know that there’s a cup of tea and a warm, handmade quilt waiting for you here in California, should you ever need it. Here’s a hug from me.
Love,
Revs
Hi Revolution, thank you for your lovely message. I’m touched by the outpouring of kindness that I’ve received over these past few days and it’s good to hear from you. He was so gloriously happy in that final moment that although I have understandable waves of sadness, I am OK because I know that he is OK and we were so very much at peace over this last 9 months. See you in California some day. Love and hugs, Nat xxx
Miss Natalie,
I’m so glad to hear that you are at peace and taking some quiet time to spend with supportive loved ones. Take care, my dear.
xoxo,
Revolution
Natalie,
I’m so sorry for your loss and big hugs from Australia xxxxoooo
Being too nice can actually be a gateway to danger. Basically, I have been sexually harassed by a neighbor for years now. Because I was afraid of retaliation, I did not report him. I had my breaking moment when my physical safety was threatened and I was forced to get law enforcement involved. Now I am in the process of moving to a safer unit.
Being conditioned to be nice and polite versus assertive was probably one of the toughest things I have had to get over.
I also find myself acting overly aggressive in situations that do not require that and then being overly nice when I really am scared. It sickens me to realize that.
SC,
I am so glad you are removing yourself from that environment. How scary that must have been for you? Sometimes I wonder if we, as women, are conditioned to by “nice” even in uncomfortable, harassing situations so we don’t appear as mean or rude. It sounds like this person took advantage your niceness and continued to push your boundaries. Some people have no limit as to see how much they can get away with.
I am glad you finally reached your limit and made this person realize you were serious in protecting yourself. It sounds like maybe the aggressiveness in situations that don’t require it may be a defense a mechanism or the sitation is activating something inside of you. Is being nice in a fearful situation something that was conditioned in you in childhood? It can be difficult to work through engrained behaviors and figuring out which ones are patterns and which ones are those that are true to ourselves. After I ended my toxic relationship, I spent months being hyper vigilant to other people’s behavior and somewhat suspicious of their intentions. I’ve gotten much better at being relaxed, listening to my gut, and being authentic. Natalie has stated when you regress back to old behaviors and thought patterns, it becomes very uncomfortable and almost foreign. It is true.
Take care of yourself and be safe.
Hugs
CLR,
I grew up in a family where physical violence was the norm toward children, and I was not permitted to ever stand up for myself, so naturally I have a lot of pent up rage at being made so defenseless. Also, I lived with a sadistic, enraged child molester who threatened children with their lives if they told. (Yes, thanks to me and other courageous children, he was finally caught and charged.) Typically I am mum to bring up such charged info about myself, but I am to the point where I realized predators (like my neighbor) and the man I grew up with win unless we all start talking about this.
Anyhow, in order to survive my family, I had to keep quiet in the face of ongoing violence and sexual assault within the home. I guess any inclination of discomfort from myself to them threatened the abusers to the point of retaliation.
And so I find myself in a similar situation in adulthood: a terrifying sexual predator turning my life into a nightmare where I have to deal with the horrid (leaving my rightful home) fallout once again because of someone else’s heinousness.
I will say that the police officers were extremely helpful when I was finally forced to call them or continue living in terror. That was and is hopeful. They basically told me what my power was within the law as an adult, amongst other insights as to what’s going on and what to do. Also, they were and continue to be available until I can move to a new location.
And, yes, part of the problem (huge) on a covert, subtle but extremely impactful level is that we as a society ridiculously condition women to suffer, deal with insurmountable pains and assaults on their bodies, emotions, and spirit. We condition women to be good girl princesses, taking nothing and giving all. The conditioning can be subtle, but it’s there. It’s everywhere.
SC,
Thank you so much for sharing your story and sharing such painful details of your life. I can’t even begin to imagine growing up in such a terrifying environment. I commend you on your bravery for reporting the child molester you lived with. What a courageous act that must have made you scared for your life. Have your neighbor terrorize you must have brought up all those of wounds from your childhood. But you found the courage again to confront the abuse.
I am so glad the police are being helpful in providing assistance to you. And that law enforcement continues to be a point of resource for you. I hope once you are able to relocate yourself, the nightmare will discontinue.
Please continue to be safe.
Hugs
CLR,
Thank you for your support and listening to my story. It was terrifying and I am terrified, but I was able to reach out and call police this time, whereas unfortunately I didn’t have the same options as a child.
I hope I can move on from this. It makes it especially tricky that I have my 15-yr-old spaniel mix with me. I hate moving her again, but it is better than this.
Thank you and take care.
xx
I do wish people would communicate in real life more often. I have so much to say to my current interest (I’ve been on hold for a few months because of his mental health) and I edit my texts down to very short loaded baiting texts and then leave the subject alone for a bit as to not make him feel worse.
Now if he’d let me talk to him in real time, preferably face to face or even the phone, it would be so much easier and real. Less circumspect. Less time to edit my words into something that sounds less ‘crazy’. Texting makes these situations linger.
I just want to let it out.
I am working on the nice thing too, the bane of my life. I know all about boundaries and all that, but then my empathy kicks in and I end up showing the other person more consideration than myself. I am a very confident outgoing person and I do have self esteem. My mind reframes this situation by saying if I can get on with life feeling so bad secretly inside and pretend to be happy, these people who are outwardly hurting others because they are hurt, need more understanding because they are not able to handle these feelings as well as I.
I can argue myself into anything apparently.
If only we all lived by the golden rule! This setting myself on fire to keep others warm is a right pain in the arse.
@Disposable – I recently found out that a close friend has not been texting me because of mental health issues. He has been sorting through the issues for over a year, and sadly with his job and things in his life he cannot control , the mental issue gets worse. He assures me that I am never an issue and he loves my friendship and me of course. It’s very tough to back off knowing he is struggling, and different but he doesn’t want help. The unanswered or very short texts cut deep. When I see him in person I boost myself up by hugging him and reassuring him that he can text me at any time if he needs something or an ear. I’ll listen. But it’s up to him. I have tried to ask him if he wants to go for trips or even to the city for dinner but it’s too much. I respect him and will wait and always care for him.
Good day all and my symphathies to you Natalie. Hugs
I had posted this in another topic but felt this actually covered it a bit better. I’m hoping for some insight.
I work with a FF, EU friend who has feelings for me. I admit I have feelings for him as well but he is taken. We have had this flirtatious fun friendship for years. Over the past 2 years things have changed because his Gf found texts from me on his phone. They were harmless but she still got upset. He backed way off. Understandable . Our friendship has suffered greatly though because he is very guarded around me at times. Other times he is his “normal” flirty self. He doesn’t text me when I text him. It hurts badly. We work in a place where we cannot talk about personal things because we are both so busy and usually are never in the same place at the same time for very long. Tough to explain. When I do see him, I feel like I have so much to say that it’s like a damn opening up. His radio silence upsets me to the point where I have quit social media because I don’t want to see if he is online interacting with others and ignoring me. We have been through a lot together and helped eachother out with some things… I’ve never been that close to a male friend before or fell for a guy that quickly. He openly admits his feelings for me and does care for me and my family but why hurt me by icing me out ? Depression? Issues with work? Etc? Do I just wait until I hear from him ? Ice him? I see him and my stomache turns. Sometimes I think “I shouldn’t have texted him that long winded statement about this or that.” Maybe I am shooting myself in the foot by doing that. Bottom line, it’s confusing to have someone not reply to you when you occasionally see them within an arm reach away and they speak to you as nothing’s wrong. It is exhausting.
NC. The man is taken. That’s all you need to know. He doesn’t owe you anything. He’s not your bf or your parent. He provides you some flirty fun while disrespecting his gf. You go along with this. In your mind your love is true so you’re allowed to disrespect his relationship and your own needs. I don’t see how this is a healthy relationship or good for you at any level. It makes you feel abandoned, rejected, unloved. You prefer to get off social media altogether and cut yourself from Everyone else than just unfriend this buffoon. You must ask yourself: why do I go out of my way to find people that will reject me?
Thank u Suki. I think I struggle with this because he is the only friend who has treated me in this manner. It’s confusing and I feel like I need closure. I’ve given so much and been so caring but he has gradually started fading away. Silvercloud mentioned how she ended up being friends — just friends. That’s what I would ultimately like to happen, but the more I step back and really look at how he treats me, the less I want to be around him. I’ve got other male friends with GF’s who stop by and hang out, or help me with mechanical projects etc … this guy was different. I really fell for him and trusted him but I can see that it was not meant to be. I deserve better and if that means cutting all ties I need to. Thank u ladies.
Unfriend AND block the loser.
Excellent, succint analysis, Suki!
* succinct.
Archis,
I have been in a similar situation, except that we both blocked each other’s numbers for a bit, then reconnected through text I think. I might have texted him when I was ready and by then he unblocked me. (I don’t remember exactly.) By the time we connected again, he had a girlfriend. I was and am actually happy for him and glad it’s not me because we share different values. Interestingly enough, he’s been a good supportive friend even though he’s quite a bit younger (21 and I’m 32). Anyhow, now we are friends without anything being supercharged or awkward and I make sure to include his gf to coffee. It’s always okay to take some time away and take care of you if you find yourself slipping in an unhealthy situation.
There is an age gap between us as well. He is older actually. I just want him to be happy– according to this blog I am a Florence nightingale with him. I need to start putting me first. Thank u for replying.
Hi Nat thinking of you. Take your time coming back and heal first.
Great podcast , I think people forget with the technology today that people need space. It’s also important to be on the same page with what kind of relationship or FWB situation you have going on. Most importantly , take care of yourself and look out for YOU!:)
Nat, anything one says at the loss of a parent seems like too little. I can only hope that you found some peace with him before he left. I hope you are able to take the time to grieve and take care of yourself.
It’s amazing how we will go out of our way to be so nice and caring for a man. Practically cut our arms off if we need to help them but what do they do? I recall how I had fallen for this guy who was exceptionally handsome and charming. He worked as a fireman so his hours were always misaligned with mine. We would see eachother when we could but mostly we texted. He future faked a lot, and never made that next step to actually ask me to be his girl. Well he finally came clean after months of stringing me along. He had a GF that was away at training to be a fireman as well. I was gob smacked! I was also so hurt because I had given him so much of my time when he needed me, and given him things (free pass to a local baseball game that I could have given to someone, gas card for his truck) etc.. in my mind we were really going to work out. We had gotten so close, but the dynamic changed real quick. He would never be able to give me back what I had given him. He did break my heart, and he tries to keep me in his back pocket still for when he is lonely. I remained friends but never instigate texts (mainly because he only texts when it’s on his terms), and because I am off living my life. It was very difficult and still is to not think about him and how I had no real closure after all of that we shared (we did see eachother in person not only via mobile ). But… I am looking out for myself. I cringe when I see him, because there is that attraction still- to him , not his cheating ways. I won’t ever trust him again.
I loved this post, and the comments as well. It’s good to read that we all have similar experiences and that we are not an island. I have been reading The Untethered Relationship by Christopher Moon, and it has taught me to learn to accept, and to become an adult in my emotional status. It has helped me learn that there are true partnerships and once we see how to separate them from the ones that hurt us, we can achieve that level of unconditional love. It’s amazing.
This blog is amazing – thank u Nat and all! I’ve been dealing with a male best friend who has some lingering mental issues from a bad upbringing. He likes to do the hot and cold alllll of the time. He loves control. He asks for help with something and then disappears (doesn’t reply to texts), for a week or more. The kicker – he works in the building next to me. Sometimes I breathe a sigh of relief seeing his car because he does disappear so easily. When I talk to him in person, he assures me it’s him not me and always flirts. We have had a very blurred line friendship since we met. Never dated eachother because we were both taken – it never worked out that we were single at the same time. At this moment I’m single and he is in a semi happy relationship (per him). I find his vanishing acts and his lack of communication for simple things are upsetting me more and more. He says he loves me — well where is the proof ? Where is the guy I met and became friends with years ago? Knowing his issues from his past I try to give him space, and have told him how I don’t want to bother him with texts (invites , jokes etc..) he says I’m not bothering him at all. Well damnit answer me.. he just leaves me hanging on some things that are actually important. I needed a ride home from a bar one night and since he lives about 3 blocks away I texted him. Nope. Nothing. The next day I asked if he got my text – no answer. The day after he saw me in person and ignored all of that and flirted , turned it on me asking me things … it’s getting tough to have a normal friendship with him now. None of my other guy friends act like this, but this one, this one I am sure I have fallen for and that scares me.
People change over time. It is unfair to expect him to remain the same person he was when you first met him, particularly as you have always had a “blurred line” friendship. For as long has you have known this man part of your mind has always been in relationship mode. Your thoughts, feelings, behaviors and expectations have been influenced by the possibility of a future relationship. His too. This can only go on for so long before the newness and excitement wears off.
Your other guy friends don’t treat you this way because you don’t treat them this way. The reason he disappoints you so often is because your hopes and expectations are out of line with reality. The guy is in a relationship and you can’t expect him to prove his love for you. You are playing the role of fallback girl and you need to stop. Take a step back from him and your blurred-line friendship. Quit hanging around waiting for his attention. Stop rewarding him for jerking you around.
Thank you Stephanie – you always have wonderful replies and understand exactly what others are trying to communicate. I feel like I am either Adeles song “Hello” or Lady Gagas “million reasons” right now! I have decided to do NC with this guy until he comes over and is actually in front of me. He will not listen to me otherwise. Deep down I know he truly does love me but he can’t keep stringing me along– you were right I expect so much more of him and from him. He has disappointmented many times when I thought he would be there for me. In my head I see this all ending between us because I don’t think we can even be friends at this juncture. It’s sad and it’s seriously going to be like withdrawal which is going to hurt like hell but I need to do it. He’s been a huge part of my life but he has changed and I don’t want to take anymore of his stress on. What do you want to bet that he will act shocked and saddened when I do tell him how I feel? Sorry – time for me to take back control ! I don’t want to be controlled anymore.
You will feel pain. But this pain is like surgery to correct a broken bone. It is temporary and you will heal as long as you don’t go “skateboarding” with this negligent “friend” again. People who love you do not ghost you. Love yourself more. You’re a jewel. I hope you know that.
This guy is not your friend love. Friendship for him is just a word. And usually with Houdini type guys, “friend” is a BS catch-all word. You need to be brutal and cut this like he does you all the time by completely ignoring you. Would you or do you allow your actual friends (guys and girls) to treat you this way? I am ONLY speaking from personal experience. I have been here, bought the ticket, got the keychain. Move on and never look back. Check out “The No Contact Rule”.
@Tiffany – ohhh u hit the nail on the head with your comments! I actually have asked myself the same thing : would I get so upset and tolerate another friend if they ghosted me like this? Nope. Not at all. I think with him, it’s been such a long road, and he’s familiar to me so it’s scary to let that go. I had to text him today to ask him some info, and he didn’t reply. Not a big surprise. This new game where he wants to see me so badly, but won’t communicate via phone is driving me bonkers. How the heck does he think this is fair to treat me like this? I want to call him out on it but done think it will do any good. Good luck to the next person who falls for his bull… I really don’t want to deal with him anymore, and am going to focus on pushing him out of my life. I’ve deleted photos, thrown things away, and burned his house key. very therapeutic ! So, I’m back to NC – we will see what happens. I gave and gave and he just took….
“I can be who I am without being walked over by people…”!!!
Needed that!!
I don’t know if this is the place to post this, but I have a male best friend and he talks to me in person, laughs, flirts, and says we will get together. We used to text constantly … allll throughout college , but now he rarely texts back. I could ask him if he has the latest sports scores, or if the sky was blue where he is and he won’t say a word. He and I have had a very interesting friendship because he has a GF who lives 5 states away. I love him, but he has started to drift away. I don’t want to be with him, I don’t want to be his GF I just want communication and a text back like the old days. Men r frustrating .
These guys who blow hit and cold drive me insane. I have a good male friend who I used to text constantly with. He has some anxiety and ptsd issues and he says it’s been getting worse. Because of that, he shuts his cell off and doesn’t see texts for days at a time. BUt he also doesn’t reply to the people who texted him either. In person he is great- comfortable around me, tells me how he has been working hard but dealing with issues I have known about. Today he reminded me that he doesn’t text anyone back and then as we walked to his car he said hold on I have to text someone … what the heck ? Most likely his GF, but wow man. Men are just a mystery. With this guy I give him space and have really worked on the fact that he has changed a lot and he has been vocal about how he has as well. I don’t like it, and I have offered to help but I guess just being around when he wants to talk is enuff. It doesn’t feel like enuff for me as a friend, but I have to take what I can.
Ladybug,
You absolutely don’t have to ‘take what you can.’ Your time could be much better spent finding a true friend who reciprocates what you want.
And him being vocal about changing is hollow. You’re not his therapist, so why act like it?
You make a valid point Crystal. I have offered so many times to help him. We have been best friends for ages, and over the past few years he has become distant because of his mental health. He says he wants to meet up and spend time with me like the old days, but it never happens. I feel like I am spinning my tires hoping to get out of this rut. Maybe he will suddenly show up! Maybe he will text me a funny joke like he used to. I send him texts once in awhile with a laugh or just a good morning and he does see them and likes to hear from me, but I get nothing back. At one point years ago, I thought he and I were going to be a couple. That fizzled out when we both met someone but deep down I know there is a mutual love of eachother. That’s the kicker. How do I push forward? I don’t want to hurt him if I go Nc but fee like he needs to see that I’m not always going to be there and drop things to run to him unless he can be there for me as well. 🙁
Ladybug, I’m curious about how you ‘know’ he loves you. Precisely how. Because his actions towards you aren’t loving in any way. Love is shown by a man in how he treats the woman he loves. You’ve described nothing to show love, or even like in how he is with you.
Frankly, it sounds like he’s using you for an ego boost. You might have been friends at one time, but it seems like there’s nothing there now. Not love, or even friendship.
How to push forward? Spend your time finding some great girlfriends to hang out with. NC with him. If he is hurt–and there’s no guarantee he will be–that’s on him. It’s his actions that caused the consequence of losing you. Don’t let him reel you back in with false promises, because he won’t change. He has no reason to.
Crystal – I suppose the award for the worst answer goes to me! He tells me he loves me when he says goodbye to me. Part of me feels like we have been in some sort of relationship all of these years even tho we haven’t. The things we have shared, done together, ups and downs, fun times… well now it’s all become lop sided. He asked if I would help him out with some paperwork that he has. Absolutely. I’m always there for him, and asked when he wanted to work on it? It was crickets. He said he’s been so busy working long hours that he just doesn’t know. I’m supposed to text him tomorrow and see if he wil be around this weekend so we can get together. This isn’t the first time in the past few months that he’s said we will get together , or he will come over to help me with something and he avoids it. It’s extrmely frustrating , and I questioned what I had done. Very quickly after reading a lot of posts on here I saw that it was not me!
I can see where he wants an ego boost from me, but wow… why act like this? After everything ? I’ve wanted to sit down and talk with him for ages and that’s challenging in itself. Each time he sees me he assures me he cares and loves me but it’s his life that has him all scattered right now. Soooooo… I just go about mine and do my own thing. It’s very tough to suddenly get a text and he acts the way he used to , but disappears for weeks on end. Exhausted . That’s what I feel. I wish I could fix him, but heck – would he fix me ? Probably not.
Ladybug,
You will only keep spinning your wheels if you try to figure out what he is thinking/feeling. You will never know. It is also possible that HE doesn’t know why he acts the way he does. It doesn’t matter what he thinks/feels. All that matters is you are not happy. I kept going back to a guy because I kept finding little signs that he really did care about me even though he treated me badly and I was miserable. He won’t change and, more importantly, the relationship will not get better.
Once you start NC you will be amazed to discover just how much time you have spent thinking about him, waiting for him to respond, and stressing about the relationship. You deserve to have your life back. You will be so much happier once you have redirected all the mental and emotional energy you have spent on him.
@Stephanie hi!:) what you said is completely accurate. I get bits and pieces of him treating me like he used to or should!! In person he acts “normal” and leads me to think that everything is fine.
My question is , do I bother to tell him how miserable I am, or just do NC and walk away? It shouldn’t be this much work for any sort of friendship / relationship. 🙁
How did you manage to keep up the NC, Stephanie ? Didn’t you go through stages where you felt you could contact him because “maybe he had changed”?
@Stephanie my previous reply disappeared . Thank you and I can absolutely relate. In person he acts just fine and it gives me hope. Once we are miles away, all bets are off for hearing from him. I have tried NC before and he has started texting me but disappears again. Perhaps I’m just too nice with this guy? I really don’t want to keep working this hard for a friendship but also dread the thought of losing him. How did you maintain NC, Stephanie ? With his bizarre work hours (new job), I told him he could swing by my place for a coffee to go since it’s literally 5 minutes from his office. He’s never taken me up on that and instead goes to the fast food place. To me it makes no sense. I’m so nice, and caring , and he won’t let his guard down. Mind you he USed to be okay with doing things like this. NC is going to be a process … I don’t know if my heart can take much more.
@Stephanie- I don’t know where my replies to you went (the cloud!) haha I will try again and apologize if they suddenly show up.
He has disappointed me a lot lately, and he doesn’t seem to see what he does to me. I’ve asked him before to text me and let me know if we are indeed going to meet up for things. I special ordered something to help HIM with a project at one point. I texted him that, he never responded with a thank you or said “my schedule is busy I can’t do it this weekend let’s try for another time.” Just radio silence. It really pissed me off. He doesn’t get it! In person he future fakes about those sort of things . “Sure text me we will get together.” This is a guy who has shared so much, and has quite a few health issues that make him withdraw at times. I feel like I’m using that as an excuse but honestly because he won’t even make time to talk to me anymore I feel like I don’t want to waste my time helping him. All I have ever done is be there for him and help him through issues. We wear a matching ring which symbolizes our friendship. I’ve thought of tucking that away in the jewelry box and just forgetting about it but the guilt I feel. That’s why Nc is so tough for me. I feel guilt if I don’t act “okay” with him and forgive him. People have told me he’s selfish and a total Narcassist. I’ve always defended him but I don’t know if I can anymore. As of now he has ignored my texts for me helping him out again. I will see him in passing next week because of a work related function. I plan on being cold — if he couldn’t even have the courtesy to answer me why should I take that? He will claim his phone was off but really? U can’t answer me when u turn it on? Years of this.. I’m tired.
Hi Ladybug,
My reply to you disappeared too. You might want to look at why you expect to feel guilty about going NC. There’s no reason to. You don’t owe him anything at all.
And even if you do feel guilty, it would be best for you to do it anyway. I don’t see any love in the way he treats you. His words don’t matter, only his actions do. His behaviour sounds pretty pathetic, and he won’t change. He has no reason to, and you can’t make him.
Hey Crystal – glad I wasn’t the only one that had vanishing posts 🙂
I have asked myself why in the world I would feel so guilty about going NC with this guy. A lot of it I feel hinges on the fact that I am so comfortable around him (I don’t have the perfect figure and he does not judge me). He boosted my self esteem immensely after I had a few failed relationships. Well lately I have been working out and dropping inches off my waste and others have been noticing besides him. Woo! Anyways, when I am with him I feel like the belle of the ball. He’s a very outgoing , handsome, and charming man. He makes me feel good about myself. On the other hand we have the issue of him just giving me crumbs to get by and the balance of this entire thing is wayyyy off. It’s gotten frustrating to think that he knows he can get away with ignoring my texts because he realiEs that I’ll just always be there when he does show up again. I’m going to start NC today, but I’ll most likely see him in passing next week. How do I handle seeing him in person if I’m doing NC? He blows hot and turns on the charm when in person… then he future fakes… rinse and repeat… yeah I’ve talked myself into NC real quick.
You can treat him as if you’re sitting beside him on the bus. Polite and that’s it.
It doesn’t sound like you feel guilty, but more that you’d miss an ego boost. Better to find ways to boost yourself by yourself.
That’s a good way to look at it Crystal. I can absolutely look at it as being on a public bus with him. You are correct, I would miss the ego boost from him, and the attention. Crumbs. It’s not enough anymore though. Years ago I had friends that told me he was no good, and to watch out for him. One still works in the same location as him and she doesn’t know that I even give him the time of day. I don’t tell her, and she doesn’t ask. She still thinks he is a selfish man. If I could go back I never would have met him for that first meeting/coffee. He sucked me right into his web and now I’m trying to find my way out. It’s not easy 🙁
I texted my very hot and cold AC EU Narcassist this morning. I felt guilt because I actually spoke up and said when he doesn’t reply and give me a yes or no (if we are going to spend time together), that it crushes me. I just want a yes or no. Betcha he won’t write back. I shouldn’t have said a word .