Every day I hear tales of people who are completely overwhelmed by rejection or repeatedly throwing themselves under the same rejection bus because they don’t want to deal with the pain of accepting someone’s choice in another person or their treatment of them. They think they can make one or a number of rejections right by trying to get this person to validate them, and unfortunately they end up experiencing even more pain.
Next thing you know, they’re chasing them down with a text (like lazy chasing though…), turning up on their doorstep, patrolling Facebook to monitor for any vague reference to them on their ex’s profile, trying to orchestrate opportunities to tell them all about themselves, questioning mutual friends and acquaintances to find out what has been said and then losing their minds over it, or even staying home all the time because they fear that ‘everyone’ knows ‘about them’.
I’m sure you’ve witnessed an incident of a celebrity, individual or business seeking a correction from a newspaper or other media outlet. They do this because they believe that something that was factually incorrect or that created an image that creates a false and possibly negative perception of them, has been published into the public domain. While of course there are a portion of people who won’t believe what was published or even hold the false perception, they seek the retraction and even sue for damages because they believe that there has been tangible damage for any people who do believe. It may cost them credibility, cause problems with their family and friends, affect the brand, or even company profits.
When you participate in unavailable relationships, it’s like you’re seeking validation in order to gain an overall retraction that would right the wrongs of the past. Or if you keep going back in no matter how crappy a capacity, to a poor or even non-existent relationship, you’re trying to get them to retract the rejection.
It’s you who needs to retract your own rejection.
The universe or even a great deal all of people, are not aware of any perceptions you have about you, or that your exes, family etc have about you. Even when you think you’re putting across certain things about yourself, this can be interpreted as something else entirely, which only further cements the reality that you cannot control the uncontrollable.
You seeking a retraction from one person is like anointing them as the validation messiah.
The fact that this person is neither influential (they cannot make you into who you think you should be) nor important, nor that special that you should anoint them with this special status, seems to have passed you by.
This retraction you’re seeking is not going to cause the heavens to open, angels to sing, and for the presses around the world to whir into emergency action as they notify ‘everyone’ of the ‘correction’.
No announcement will go out, no billboards, no nothing. On top of this, if it’s anything like your typical correction in a newspaper, it will be the equivalent of a postage stamp sized space wedged in between a whole load of other stuff. Yes you’ll know it’s there, yes you will have achieved your aim, but it’s really all for your own ego and if your purpose is to assuage your ego, you’ll actually be better off doing it yourself. At least a newspaper might pay you some damages. As many people can attest to, often after getting the holy grail of apologies, or telling them about themselves, or even ‘winning’ them back– it’s a major anticlimax.
I sought a ‘retraction’ from my ex-fiance. I’d phone him up and ask him why he hadn’t been in touch with me, tie myself up in knots about the lies he might be thinking and even worse, the lies I knew he was spreading – he told people that we’d broken up because I wanted to move away to America. Obviously it was embarrassing for him when I kept bumping into these people in the street…in London…
What are you going to do? Jedi mind tricks? Perform a lobotomy on them? Hold them hostage and force them to change their version of events? Bombard them with your wonderfulness? Take out an ad? Stalk Facebook and their friends? Hang on in there being nice while they engage in open and shut cases of assholery just so you can prove that you’re the bigger person?
Just like I know that I hadn’t moved away to another country and that while I had my own issues, I was certainly not to blame for the entire failure of the relationship, hence I couldn’t take the end of the relationship as a rejection of me, you are more than capable of figuring out what’s what and telling yourself the truth. That and half the time, all of these other people who we worry are going to be affected, don’t even matter. These people will soon figure out the truth when your ex keeps claiming that Yet Another Ex is a “psycho” or “too demanding”, or they keep trotting out the same reason for each breakup.
They’re going to think what they want to think no matter what you do, so the best thing that you can do is not give away all of your power and make their lies into a reality, even if it’s by the sheer impact of giving so much energy to their lies, that you internalise them and change how you feel about you.
Don’t use ‘rejection’ to make judgements about you, not least because if you’d go to the trouble of taking on the entire blame for something, you’ve already distorted it and thrown away all of your power in that moment.
You have better things to do than crawl inside their mind. You could focus on trying to force them to change their mind, but really, if you’re that bothered, you’ve already made a judgement about yourself and it’s actually your own mind that you need to change.
You don’t need to wait for them to change their mind, for you to change your mind.
You’re not Siamese twins or linked on an influence index.
You managed to survive on this planet for however many years before they came along– there’s no way in hell that you should hand over the rights to your identity.
Unlike people who court the media, you have way more control over your image than you give yourself credit for. You cannot control everyone else’s minds– people like thinking about themselves! Also, often, what you’re trying to get them to retract is your own perception of you – I know I’m not the only person who has corrected an ex, only to get the blank stare or the ‘What the fricking what now?’ reaction.
Stop giving away all of your power and putting it all on Mr/Miss Unavailable (or whoever it is) to ‘retract’ the rejection.
I’ve retracted the hell out of all of my rejections through action in my own life and ultimately, they were blessings in disguise, with them often doing what I wasn’t able to do for myself – get the hell out of dodge and admit my mistakes. Leave them to their own devices and close the door on anyone who doesn’t want to add to your life so that you can open the door to someone that does.
Your thoughts?
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“close the door on anyone who doesn’t want to add to your life so that you can open the door to someone that does.”
Exactly! That is so true and you have said it before many times in other ways. That makes NC easier when you think of the opportunities you are loosing when still stuck on a bad relationship or almost relationship.
Sometimes guys show interest and then change their mind, I am learning to not take it as a rejection and even if it is a rejection then it’s ok, it is not necessary about me.
I know this is true for me. The whole time I was involved with him I always needed constant reassurance from him when he rejected me, that he still at least cared, then I would jump if he threw me some crumbs and then he would reject me again. I dont know why I always needed some reassurance that he cared or that he did not hate me. I would do the texting thing and bug him until I got some sort of response. Whenever he rejected me I felt so broken until I crashed it was a horrible time… but now I “have” moved away and little by little I am working on my own self love and trying to understand how I let it all happen.
lJ give it some time and some distance. At some point his magical crumbs aren’t magical anymore. It is just crumbs. It’s been a long road to hoe for me realizing that his crumbs are simply crumbs. He wanted to magic the crumbs into a loaf. I wanted to magic the crumbs into a loaf. No matter how we both tried, he only had crumbs to offer. Try not to use the fact that he is only offering crumbs to make it about you. It’s been the hardest lesson for me. His crumbs isn’t about me unless I settle. We never have to settle for crumbs unless we do. Retract all of the crumbs and close the door.
runnergirlno1,
At some point his magical crumbs aren’t magical anymore. It is just crumbs. It’s been a long road to hoe for me realizing that his crumbs are simply crumbs.
So true!
The AC just sent texts, all the time
The AC just did IM and FB chat all the time
The AC and I rarely saw eachother
Whole heap of non-delivery excuses
No title
Just “like friends”
When you compare it to what other people have, it was intolerably anorexic, the contribution was so little, there is good reason why it broke, and I have to keep reminding myself that these were the fundamental reasons it broke, and that it breaking is a good thing.
Even the friendship aspects were wanting and seriously deficient.
When I think about it this person really shouldn’t be in a LTR with anyone, and it explains a lot.
A new term!
relationship anorexia
A relationship starved of love, care, trust, respect and basic communication and contact to make if wholesome, filling and satisfying.
“it was intolerably anorexic, the contribution was so little, there is good reason why it broke,”
Tatoo this to my forehead please.
I read this somewhere maybe even here but I think it says alot. “Life is really too short to constantly try to convince anyone you’re worthy to be in their world”.
Mary C,
The flipside is, which I personally like better: “Don’t make him a priority in your life if he is not doing the same for you.” Also, “If you have to chase someone they’re problem not worthy of your attention.” There’s so many of them. I’m a slogan hound and love the ones that indicate YOU are stronger than you think you are, and you can get over his arse!
Oh Natalie, I think you must have been reading my mind from the other side of the world. I am a married woman, a Sex and Love Addict in Recovery and just last night, I felt I wanted to announce to the world that I must be the sickest “Crazy” woman on the planet. A few months ago, a friend introduced me to a man, her ex-lover of many years back, letting me know how passionate he was, etc, how he was the best lover she had ever had, etc, and he came when his girlfriend was away.
I acted out, for various reasons, because my friend and her partner had bribed me with promises of him turning up to see me, so that I would do them favours. I was jealous at my friend, as he still held a torch for her, and even tried to have a fling with her again, but he ignored all my gifts, and he was in love with his girlfriend despite their on-again/off-again fights. I did the craziest thing possible – I vandalised the outside of his bedsit flat with messages of love, stating that “I never stopped loving you”, I want to be a family” in hearts, in texta and in chalk, using my girlfriend’s name, instead of mine.
O.K., so my friend and her “partner” weren’t reallly being friends to me, and I know that what I did in retaliation was alot worse that what they did, but I felt I had been tortured and deceived with mind games for at least one week, and combined with my love addiction, I was a walking time bomb.
I have made amends by paying some sort of “damage” money to them both, apologied, distanced myself, sought help for my love addiction, but I have been told by my friend (who has forgiven me) that he just considers me to be a madwoman and crazy and not even worthy of acknowledgment for taking responsiblity for my behaviour. I have thought of going to the paper with my story of sickness, but I know that no matter what amends I make, no matter what money I pay to him and to my friend for damages, suffering, humiliation, I will be forever the scorned, crazy madwoman in his eyes.
It is a cruel and harsh lesson.
When my AC unavailable relationship ended (thank heavens it ended) and they returned my stuff one day at my workplace, it felt like I had been hit with a big full stop.
There was a massive urge to intervene, to do something, to make it better, go back and erase mistakes, talk things out blah blah blah… but I held. It was so painful to sit tight through all this and force oneself to DO NOTHING while proverbial Rome burned.
Hold ON just one minute, ella. Who is telling you you’re crazy? Some “friend” who wants, or accepts, money from you as “amends” for your inappropriate behaviour? Some other “friend” who dangles the possibility of a hook-up with an attached guy in front of you?
There are so many boundaries being busted in your story, it’s no wonder you’re at loose ends. I’m willing to bet you’re not crazy, but you’re surrounded by people who like to let you think you are and are profiting (whether by teasing you, or collecting “dues” when you react aggressively to provocation, then feel bad about it) by making sure you don’t know which way is up.
This male friend of yours sounds abusive. Stick around here on BR, read some of the back posts, and you will see many women with stories of men who extorted money and sex from them, telling them they were crazy and “not worthy of acknowledgment” one minute, then saying they were “forgiven” the next.
Your behaviour is pretty out of control, yes, but you do have the power, the ability and enough shreds of sanity to bring yourself back under control (or, if you’ve never been tranquil, to finally find peace). First order of business: stop any dating, get away from these so-called friends, stop contact all contact with them.
Then find a counsellor who doesn’t allow you to use “love addiction” as license to call yourself “crazy” and begin to set boundaries.
Good post Magnolia,
I almost got caught in that whole ‘sex and love addicts thing’ . So glad I didn’t – that is a major head trip on oneself. I am just a person who has done things. My actions might be rateable, but I am not as a human being. I am inherently of value, and I do not need to prostrate myself to some (patriarchal) deity from the 30’s….. Ella try ‘smart recovery’ for a more rational approach to dealing with so called addictions…
Excellent post! Enlightening for me, as well.
God bless you!
Blaming other ppl for playing mind games is admitting denial within yourself, as Nat has pointed out, when you start being real yourself, it makes it v difficult for ppl to be anything but real with you. You need to be accountable for how you let yourself to be taken in by your so-called friends. I understand that he was an ex of your friends’ & came when his girlfriend was away? Then you say he still held a torch for your friend even though he was in love with his girlfriend. Hello??? This guy sounds like a total prick. Why have anything to do with this AC? What is your friend doing going on about how great in bed he was and trying to set you up when you are married??? – all very confusing.
In ignoring your gifts clearly the thing here was for you to recognise when a woman finds herself trying to entice a man with gifts it’s like she’s saying: I am not enough, and, I am desperate.
After vandalising his property, rather than take full responsibility you blame it on a so-called ill “love-addiction” distancing yourself from your actions and preventing from actually dealing with the real issues here. You’re intelligent enough to recognise your jealousy but it would benefit you to sit alone with that pain as then you might get to the root cause of your fury. Clrly you are trying to recognise that some undealt with emotions are indeed making you feel sick but acting out is the crazy part here, you are not crazy.
Atonement is then sought by sharing this online, with the additional suggestion of maybe going to the papers which just smacks of attention-seeking – the root cause of this whole problem in the first place – seeking validation. When we are seeking validation for the error of our ways it’s like we are asking the world to forgive us when really what we need to do is forgive ourselves.
It is a humiliating experience – yes, you are better than that, which is why you feel pained now. The money was a gesture of apology and was accepted & that’s as far as it goes. Who cares how you seem to that guy? We all make mistakes. When you acted out you must have known on some level that you were going to cut yourself off from this guy.You are setting boundaries in a backwards way – by self sabotage. You need to define what your guiding principles are so that you can act on those, rather than the strength of your emotions.
I came across your post and had to reply as I too did work with saa, and slaa. I am divorced now but have slept with several people while married and even now as many as 4 in 24 hours. I don’t go to meetings anymore and I am not suggesting that you don’t , but I am skeptical of all premises of 12 steps. They seem to keep you blaming yourself and year after year, revisiting how you fucked up and who you hurt and nothing ever seems to evolve. Its like a constant state of pain. I couldn’t take it anymore and decided I would try on my own for a few years to recover but am also careful of labels as addicts. I have been branded crazy for rapid fire texting for any sort of attention I could get from the men I slept with. I was the girl who just wouldn’t go away. Please forgive yourself. So you messed up, don’t let it define you. So he thinks you are crazy, you can change. I haven’t done all this yet, but I am working hard on it. I just wanted to give my support
This is why we hang around hoping to prove ourselves – we hope they’ll realise they made a ‘mistake’ and then reverse their decision based on our greatness. That IS looking to make us the exception to the rule. On average, the rule is that when someone makes a decision, they tend to stick to it.
In general, most people don’t really care or only have a passing interest in who, what, when, where, how and why about why someone’s relationship blew up, and even LESS interest in why someone’s NON-relationship blew up.
There were certain things I didn’t like and I wanted to go back and ‘correct’ them. Until I realised that nobody else needed to know or care anyway and there were many more cases of pure assholery that were orders of magnitude worse than in my case.
Tired, “On average, the rule is that when someone makes a decision, they tend to stick to it.” You are so right. And when my fallback girl tendencies start kicking in, I’m going to remember this. I usually will not chase after an ac/eu that breaks up with me, but for some reason this ‘nonchasing’ seems to trigger a need to redo on their part. Then I get a phone call or text saying how wrong they were and they want to try again. I fall for it only to have them end it again for the same reason. Next time, I wont go back. I realize I dont need to ‘prove’ anything to anyone, or fix the parts I perceive I did wrong.
I know!
My mind was racked trying to find ‘solutions’ and other fallback options – pure insanity. Was there a solution where I could hang around but also comply with the Terms and Conditions that we would never be anything but they got to keep seeing me? They were never going to commit and not only that I was the Fallback too, so even if they did commit, I would likely have stuffed it up anyway.
Pfft! The whole time they were chasing other people. They didn’t even hang out with me properly as friend either. What is the point? FLUSH!
Two weeks after I went NC, I told a friend about what happened and how I had sent a grovelling apology by text, totally and utterly devaluing myself yet again! She told me ‘ha, what an asshole, you should text a retraction for that apology!’ And to be honest, I almost did but I had found BR by then!
This post couldn’t have come at a better time. Especially after reconnecting with a guy that has been hurting me on and off for two years after seeing him and giving him my number again. At first it was just so he could call me to make me feel wanted. This idiot even went as far to tell me he loved me and wanted a relationship with me and insisted that I say it back. (Thank God, I didn’t no matter how much he asked!) He called me the day before V-Day, didn’t call the day of, but called me the day after to see if I had any “secret admirers” on V-Day. I was too hurt to even lie and say that I did, so of course I said no. And I know that this gave him satisfaction. And he gave me some half-azz reason for not calling. I do the NC thing with him, then after a month or two has passed, I start wondering if he still “wants me.” In seeking to get a rejection retraction, I end up feeling worse. I don’t love him and I don’t even really want him. I just feel that I can’t do any better right now. I’m 26 years old and feel that I have missed my chance at finding “the one.”
Bgirl.
oh 26! I wish I’d had a site like this one around at 26… give yourself time to heal from whatever it is that is compulsively driving you to bad relationships. My urgency to find ‘the one’ at 26 only yielded pain and heartbreak. I never looked at each guy as an individual person – only as a potential “one”. Now, at 41, I’ve been single for 2 years and finally learning things about myself I should learned back then. Like how to comfort myself, entertain myself, inspire myself. There is nobody who will do that for you, there’s no short cut to loving yourself.
Love this one! I know after my last go-around with my ex-AC, I was mortified at what he must have told his friends about me. Mind you, I met these people once. ONCE. First of all, they had no idea who I was. Second of all, he walked me to the bathroom at his friend’s house and called me “baby” and I overheard his friend say, completely incredulous, “BABY?!” In a tone that said, “I thought you were just shtupping this random chick?” Awkward, yes. But enough to want to crawl under the covers and hide? Clearly not. Always keep things in perspective!
Tomorrow I have a second date with someone that I have quite a few mutual acquaintances and one mutual friend with. I’ve finally come to a point where, should I get dissed, I don’t care. I highly doubt anyone will sit around saying, “DID YOU HEAR?! Natasha got dissed. Let’s get something ready for the evening news.” Even if he turns out to be a jerkoff and says something negative about me….I don’t care. You have to have enough faith in yourself to know that who you are speaks for itself and people who know and respect you are not going to decide you suck based upon the ramblings of an EU/AC idiot. Even if they do, as my Dad is fond of saying, “Everything comes out in the wash.” Meaning, “Morons reveal themselves.”
have fun, Natasha! and remember, it’s a discovery phase and he’s lucky to have the chance to learn more about you!
Sounds all very healthy, Natasha. And don’t forget, if he’s an AC, he’s an AC, and that’s there before you came along. Then there’s the chance you just don’t work. That doesn’t have to be any more than a little awkward, and certainly not worthy of any attention from the peanut gallery!
@Izzybell – I agree, he is tres lucky haha! So far it’s been fun and we had a nice time again on Saturday – as strange as it sounds (but I’m sure many former FBGs will feel me on this one) it’s a very positive sign that I’m not all, “Y’all, I’m in looooooove.” He hasn’t said anything stupid and we’ve been enjoying eachother’s company = so far, so good 😉
@Elle – Amen lady! If it turns out that he sucks, he sucked before I showed up haha! I totally agree that if things don’t work out, especially if it only lasts a few dates, no one is going to care.
I still have the EUM in my life because of our son, which is a mixed blessing. On the one hand I’ve found myself desperate wishing that NC was a halfway-moral option, especially after he met his girlfriend and I finally made the link that Any Remotely Emotional Conversation With Him (eventually)= Me Feeling Bad.
On the other hand it’s given me the chance to find out that the things I thought that I wanted, I didn’t really want at all.
A month or so ago he went through a phase of apologies – drunken messages and texts about how he feels really bad about how awful he was when I was pregnant, how he feels bad that I’m bringing up our son on my own, how he wishes that I would meet someone and be happy, how he wants to be my friend. How he wished that we could’ve been together ‘properly’. How he doesn’t want me to think that I’m not attractive when I am and so on and so forth.
I have a policy of Not Talking About His Feelings (I’m not his frickin therapist! Although it has got to the point where he says something like “Ooo, I’ve got a bit of a sore neck” and I tie myself in knots trying to think of something to say that’s appropriate but not remotely sympathetic) so we didn’t actually discuss it at all, but it annoyed me. Why is HE feeling bad about MY life? It’s mine. I like it and I’m proud of it. And I was entitled to feel sad about the situation – it was sad. I’m entitled to be single if that’s what I feel like, and I do. Why is he trying to land *me* with the responsibility for *his* feelings of guilt? And if I’d been happy or I hadn’t cared how he treated me, would that make his past behaviour okay?
So I got my rejection retraction – which at one point was ALL I wanted. But you know what? It doesn’t make much difference, in fact it’s just annoying. I don’t need him to tell me that I’m great or that he was wrong – I already KNOW that and his opinion isn’t so important that I’m going to pick up the phone at 1am when he’s drunk to hear it. Nobody’s is.
If he feels bad about his own behaviour, that’s for him to sit down and sort out. But now that I’ve stopped seeing myself as one of life’s natural rejects then it doesn’t really matter whether he does or not. He’s allowed to be wrong about that if he wants 😀
I should add that I don’t think I would’ve got to this point – and it’s nice here and I’m much much happier – without Baggage Reclaim forcing me to stop putting my fingers in my ears and saying “lalala”. Thank you.
Yoghurt
I thing what strikes me most of all is that these are ‘”drunken messages” (which tend to come at you in the wee small hours of the morning). Speaking for myself (as I have extensive ‘family’ experience of drunken phone calls), I would not tolerate anyone phoning me up in the middle of the night offloading their drunken crap on me. Why discuss anything with a drunk person; why listen to their inane drivel – why give it air space in your home and your life. You need to enforce a boundary with this.
I raised a daughter completely on my own. Her father never put himself ‘in the way’ of us barely at all. I would suggest to you though, that this man may be the father of your son (if he assumes that role), but he is nothing to you. And he will become even more of nothing to you as your life goes on. This is the man who got you pregnant and left you to deal with it on your own – and it’s a very hard road to be a single parent – hard enough without the assclown spraying his drunken crap all over your life whenever he feels like it. You don’t need his drunken ‘retractions’; it’s worth nothing – worse than nothing. He is all but useless and you need to (r)eject him. For what it’s worth coming from someone who has done 22 years of (so far successful) single parenting – get in control of this man’s interference in *your* life. He is just an irritating noise in the background preventing you from moving along with what is now *your life* as a single mother. This guy is just confusing things for you – practically and emotionally. You will see all of this nonsensical alcohol induced crap for what it is in time (it’s just another selfish, attention seeking ‘look at me, listen to me, I am full of crap and I want you to have it’ story ) – best sooner rather than later.
Nah, I didn’t talk to him. I read the texts and listened to one of the answerphone messages, then just deleted the rest. He rang up the next day to apologise (and also to do the usual “I was drunk and emotional” disclaimer) and I just said “no worries, cool, see you tomorrow when you pick up our son”. Given that the last time I DID speak to him in the middle of the night he told me about a suicide attempt that he made when I was eight months pregnant, tried it on and then left me having anxiety attacks and seeking counselling, I’m not especially keen to hear what he has to say when he’s in his cups!
I’ve just edited this right down from a big long justifyjustify post – the situation is that he’s actually a very good dad and puts himself out to spend a lot of time with Son and to give me a break – without this consistent effort I’d have no qualms about cutting him out of our lives but as it is it seems a bit mean to stop Son seeing a dad who loves him dearly and wants to spend time with him. I’m now ’emotionally’ NC with him – I’ll be friendly and polite and I’ll discuss Son, the weather and work but I won’t talk about his feelings in any capacity.
It’s not a situation that I’d recommend to someone else in my position and tbh I don’t think I would’ve set it up like this if I hadn’t been on a massive Florence kick in the first six month’s of Son’s life, but this is the way that it is and it seems to be working.
The big problem that I was dealing with was the liquidised self-esteem and feelings of rejection and worthlessness – and since I’ve realised that these were more to do with being a Big Crisis waiting to happen and have stopped beating myself up for being me – then they aren’t a problem any more.
Anyroad, the point of my original post is that a Rejection Retraction means nothing – he still made me miserable whilst I was pregnant and he was still absolutely no emotional support in the first year of my son’s life. Nothing he can say or do will change those experiences or get that time back. BUT, now that I’ve stopped beating myself up for being rubbish, it matters a whole lot less what he thinks of me, good or bad.
It’s just occured to me as well…
…seeking validation and a rejection retraction from someone who’s EU is NEVER going to be satisfying anyway, because even if they really truly believe one minute that you’re a halfway decent person and that all they ever wanted was to ‘be’ with you, it’s only what they feel like at that one time. Same as they sometimes feel like chips for tea.
This is a man who couldn’t even decide what he wanted to order from the menu when we went out for a meal. How can he possibly firmly decide and commit to believing that I was or wasn’t right for him? And if he did, how could I ever know that he was going to stick to that and not change his mind next time he had indigestion?
Like I said, doesn’t mean anything.
All so true, Natalie. I spent years seeking the retraction, as you know. The trouble is that after every rejection you need to go back to them to get the retraction and all you end up with is another rejection, so you need to go back again for the retraction… and lather, rinse, repeat. I spent the entire relationshit with the ex EUM on that self-defeating cycle.
You have to do your own retracting because (you are so right) it is what we think of ourselves that is at the root of all the retraction seeking. I needed to stop rejecting myself – I needed to retract my own erroneous belief that I didn’t really deserve more than this man’s scraps. Though I don’t always feel it, I must have come a long way since I first arrived at BR because I cannot now imagine what on earth I thought I was doing handing over all my power to someone I now see as a seriously wanting man-child and I cannot now fathom why I tolerated (sometimes more than gladly!) all his crapola behaviour as if he was God’s gift, if only I could be deemed good enough to receive it. Ugh.
I needed to retract my own erroneous belief that I didn’t really deserve more than this man’s scraps.
I agree! Who was I kidding talking myself into and feeling bad for rejecting the AC’s crap – no sex, next to no in person contact, no proper title, not included in their life – what the hell.
Hey Fearless, google Whitney Houston, a major American Icon who just passed away at 48. I was about ready to tear my hair out if I heard her melodic, truly amazing voice sing “I will always love you” one more time. Tonight, I replaced I will always love YOU with I will always love ME. If you follow this courageous woman’s story, I really think she meant, she will always love me. Her passing and the circumstances are bringing up total FBG stuff for me. She was a brilliant woman. We are brilliant talented women, although I can’t sing worth a hoot. If you google Whitney, you’ll see her “husband” was a major detractor. She left an 18 year old daughter.
Nobody deserves a man’s scraps or scraps from anybody. I was on the lather, rinse, repeat rejection validation cycle. You’ve come a long, long way Fearless and thank you for sharing your struggles along the way. We gotta get that bottle of vino some day.
The manner of her passing suggests that she definitely did not love herself. I see her story as an awful warning of what can happen if you don’t take care of yourself, no matter how beautiful and talented you are. Also what a load of crap the ROMANCE myth she peddled is.
Mymble, I agree with you.
I watched one episode of Being Bobby Brown and was astounded by how Whitney was so passive-aggressive and unable to ask for what she really wanted. On Mother’s Day, Bobby made plans for her to be with her children, and instead of saying she wanted something different, Whitney fumed and muttered and complained about it the *entire day*, but never once said, “Wow, you know, Bobby I appreciate you planned this out, but I’d rather _____.” I came away from watching that understanding she had a very deep sense of unworthiness.
Thanks Runner No1
Yes, I know who Whitney Houston is – she is well known in the UK.
I was thinking the other day about her OW fantasy relationship national anthem – ‘Saving All My Love For You’ – remember that one?! Argh.
Poor woman – never quite loved herself enough to get her shit together. May she rest in peace.
Sometimes I fall into “if only I had” thinking. If only I had a partner. If only I had a child. If only I were more attractive, or talented… If only I had this, that, or the other, I’d be happy. And yet Whitney Houston had all of that — beauty, talent, success, a daughter, a husband…and she was deeply troubled and miserable. I’ll think of her the next time I find myself envying what some other woman has, and thinking, “if only.”
Want to hear the massive helices I was circulating last Friday? Some TV show played Whitney’s epic, I will Always Love You, and lack of sleep + fears that I do not have the adequate ability or skills to successfully carry out my job (and related fears about being somehow different in my likely mediocrity!) + annoyance-envy that new man is unfazed by such worries in himself (not a status-seeker) + old family of origin crap (triggered by me hosting a family event) + the fact that the AC looks like Kevin Costner in that god-forsaken (90s!) music video = me in endless spirals of drama, even crying about the sodding song and, like this post, feeling (not thinking!) somehow that if somehow there was some official final something between the AC and me, I would feel recalibrated.
Had to start again, ladies (and gents), not from scratch, but just that small building process: sleep well, speak well to myself, get exercise, reflect on what I can control (career goals etc), admit that maybe I am not as excellent as I would like to be (in what I do ; )), talk respectfully to others, fill the house with flowers, be patient, see that aggression does not always need immediate resolution.
This stuff doesn’t end. It just gets less serious and less interesting over time. To think that most of us won’t have bursts of anxiety about who we are and how our outside world does or does not reflect this, is simply not realistic. I don’t mean that in a hopeless way, I just think that it’s better to recognise the trick for what it is. It is not a sign to ring up an ex or have it out with a parent. It’s about, I think, pulling the energy back in, toning it down, being patient, having a look around, and then stepping out again.
I’ve made things confusing for myself by choosing men who don’t know how to reject directly, or how to say what they don’t want. I have chosen guys who say all the right things when their actions are already rejecting me (catering to the deep down belief that only this half-heartedness is what is on offer for me). Then what feels like devastation afterward is not their rejection, but that I couldn’t get what I wanted by looking the other way.
I started the quest to find out “why are you rejecting me” as a child, when I was surrounded by the children of racist parents, and I used to try to take them aside and ask why they hated me, and why their parents hated me. It continued until undergrad, where I pursued a guy who actually assaulted me (woke up from drunken pass-out and look who has me naked?) for over a year, trying to get him to love me.
Since then I have been doing all the rejecting.
Have you ever met people who declare: “I can take rejection”? I remember some guy saying that once, about dating lots of people, and it really stuck with me. I can take rejection if I haven’t opened my heart up to someone, but have had to really examine whether I can take rejection once I have opened up and trusted.
I believe I can. In fact, I know I can.
I can take someone trustworthy telling me I’m not for them. It could hurt like heck, but I’d survive. It’s the ones who won’t reject outright, whom we don’t reject outright, with whom we allow a mutual-stringing along that I never want to experience again. As NML says, the devastation in that situation comes from the humiliation of feeling that we have rejected, disrespected and thrown away ourselves.
>>Have you ever met people who declare: “I can take rejection”? I remember some guy saying that once, about dating lots of people, and it really stuck with me. I can take rejection if I haven’t opened my heart up to someone, but have had to really examine whether I can take rejection once I have opened up and trusted.
I believe I can. In fact, I know I can.<<
I learned I can…I recently opened myself wide open to someone after a few months of slow getting-to-know each other. It wasn't mutual. I was okay in the moment, then something that slightly irritated me later set off a cascade of tears and I breathed through the whole thing. My mind talk was something along the lines of,
Little girl voice: "I thought he was really it, I thought he was the one…
Gentle mother voice: "Sweetheart that's alright, we're just learning about what's true and what isn't."
Little girl voice: "But I really thought…I mean, I knew I was fantasizing and I still really thought he was That Guy…"
Gentle mother voice: "Yes, yes, and there's nothing wrong with that, we're just learning about life is all, honey. It's no the Last Chance Saloon (thanks Natalie!). Let those tears fall and keep breathing, you haven't done anything wrong, you took a risk, you followed your heart and learned more about yourself. What more could you ask from life? Cry it out, this is good stuff."
The Gentle Mother Voice, by the way, is one I made up myself, and isn't anything like my actual mother (though she's very kind in her older years, she is also EU and clueless.)
Later I reminded myself a few times, "I can accept this. I can accept he is Not That Guy and I can accept that this is over." In the past, not being willing to accept reality, coupled with cruel, harsh and abusive self-talk would prolong what could have been a few hours of sorrow into years of grieving and misery.
Sunshine-
Thank you for sharing this. That narration of your “mind talk” was lovely and I can 100% relate. I thought I was the only one who would simultaneously role play the parts of sad, confused little girl and gentle mother in my mind whenever I was dealing with these kinds of things and needed to soothe myself and turn the negative thoughts to something more hopeful and empowering. I nearly cried reading what you wrote because I have been in that exact frame of mind so many times…speaking to myself with the wisdom and tenderness my mother never really knew how to when I was growing up.
It sounds like you are getting stronger each day! And I’m happy to say I am too – due in large part to reading the wisdom that Natalie and all of you ladies share on this site. Stumbling upon this site has truly been a lifesaver for me during the past couple of months after the end of my absolutely crazy-making “epiphany relationship.” I only wish I had found it sooner!
Yeah, thanks Mags and Sunshine. I agree – being rejected when there is shady-to-abusive relationship hurts because you have to (and, later, think you have to) spend so long working out how you got there. Man. But I broke up with a guy after a few months recently. Some bits about the way it was handled stung, and I did have a few tears about missing him as a friend, but, overall, more awkward and then relieving than anything else. Now my goal is to remain on two feet during a relationship, sometimes leaning one way or the other, but never losing my ground.
This is too funny or not! And it is totally ironic. After 8 months total NC, exMM turned up (a work related funeral for a beloved colleague) and attempted to hit the total reset button at a funeral service no less. These guys have no shame, no boundaries cos it’s all about them no matter who passed away. Only this time, it was like he was seeking a retraction from me as to what a lying, cheating scum-bucket he is. It was perfectly like he was appointing me the validation messiah. If only I would forgive him for cheating on his wife and forgive him for using me as a blow-up toy, he could move on. I did neither. I’m not the boss of him. As he attempted to woo me in with his magical memories down memory road, I asked if he was still married. “Yup, a sad and wistful yup.” His magical memories were NOT the same as my dark, sad, humiliating memories. I did not respond. He’s married, topline. That’s it. Oh, how sad and wistful he must be! OW’s their marriages work for them, despite what shite they feed the OW. Sad and wistful my arse.
runner – so the universe gave you a post-NC glimpse, too, huh? What dudbuckets they show themselves to be when we are not wearing the coke-bottle glasses of denial. (Can I say starfucker glasses? Those were what I was wearing. I speak for myself, but were yours that colour of rose?)
I feel the clarity in your post. And I totally get that feeling of how. the. planets. have. aligned. That he should show his ass so completely, during the occasion of a friend’s funeral … well, you can’t make that shit up. And you think: how could I not have seen this?
But we didn’t then. And we do now. And we laugh. Oh, and we puke a little at “sad and wistful yup.”
And then, we dance!
So glad the universe has thrown you some validation for all the hard work you’ve done this past year, runner!
So glad the universe has thrown you some validation for all the hard work you’ve done this past year, runner!
Yes! Last night I went out on the town and guess who I saw? Another AC of years past with their new partner. This was the AC that stood me up for a date not once but twice . Years later I’d occasionally wonder if I had missed out on a good deal – oh hell no, what WAS I thinking, they are totally wrong for me, blergh! I actually feel glad that I’m single and not their partner.
This is not the first time either. I found the phone number of another EUM blocked out as ‘Do not answer’ in someone I was seeing’s phone when they went to add my number. Ha!
Quit seeking a rejection retraction from these assanovas or trying to be right on every go – they’re just not that special AND you can afford to rack up a few mistakes anyway. Time will show the truth! Being afraid to accidentally flush a decent guy is not a reason to refuse to flush ACs and EUMs!
Runnergilrlno1 and Magnolia,
this is now like watching a bad episode of “The Assclown Returns”, isn`t it? The sequels never have the same punch as the “originals” thank God, and we know what happens next. I`m still bothered by occasional texts ( he definitely thinks text is loaf) and it`s a year after breaking up , which is now longer than the relationshit itself. The one before Christmas sent me reeling ( he said he loved me and wanted me in his life, I checked and he was on a dating site) , the last one a few days ago of the same ilk was followed with a nasty, hurtful one, he was stunned that I didn`t respond to his two sentence text offering. I know he wanted a reaction- I laughed. Then thought that I would be seriously afraid for me to be with him. I think it`s not too far from here to complete indifference.
Aaargh, I actually met the EUM from years ago tonight and they tried to complement me and then dance with me.
FLUSH!
Runner No. 1
So funny. So true. Wistful ‘yup’. Poor guy. They are so full of their own shit. I recall meeting by chance my daughter’s father in a local pub. It was my fortieth birthday and, if I say it myself, I was looking fabulous. He tried to take me on a trip down magical memory road. It wasn’t magical for me! He did the wistful look. He said “I was really in love with you that night”. I said back “You could have fooled me”. I cared not one jot for this half-arsed rejection retraction from a man who had abandoned me, at that point for twelve years, to struggle with sole responsibility of raising his child for him. I didn’t give a shit what he thought of me – or anything else – by that point. I wouldn’t have asked him for the steam off his pee (as Nat would say). I knew who was the better person. Me. Hands down. He knew it too. But I didn’t need his approval. He knew that too. There is something very empowering in being the boss of who you are and not letting anyone dictate your sense of identity and worth to you.
Hey Fearless, you’ve done a great job with your daughter. I’ve had much the same experience with my daughter’s father. He stayed in her life and still is but he has contributed squat financially. He is going through some pretty serious health issues right now so it’s hard but the bottom line is I raised and supported “our” daughter. He would never play the trip down memory lane with me because it was too long ago for either of us to remember! I can’t even fathom needing a rejection retraction from him even though he occasionally owns up to the fact he’s been a deadbeat dad and needs one from me. He’s there for her emotionally. But we both know I’ve shouldered the responsibility of raising our daughter. I knew it going in.
Regarding the exMM, it’s the denial on his part that makes me want to tell him all about himself AGAIN. Wistful? He really used that word as though there is this poetic, romantic obstacle preventing us from being together. Yeah, it’s called a WIFE! Not within the realm of the meaning of “wistful”. That’s what’s always pissed me off about this guy. He’s just in a bad 27 year marriage and it’s not his fault cos he’s wistful. Rejection retraction retracted. He’s rejected.
Runner2
“He’s just in a bad 27 year marriage and it’s not his fault cos he’s wistful.”
Ha. I know the thing. ‘Wistful’ is just another version of the sob story: ‘I want your sympathy vote for some nonsense I am spouting out so you will allow me to go on treating you like a second rate human being, so here’s a wee wistful look as a starter for ten. Now, any chance of a BJ?’
Yup Fearless that’s precisely what “wistful” meant to me. I’m wistful I can’t get a shag and/or a blow job cos I’m married. Poor, wistful, cowardly, user, me.
Unfortunately, my anger took over and I sent a nasty email telling him what a lying cheating scumbucket he is. He will never be able to trip happily down memory road with me hoping for a shag and a BJ at the end. I knew better but the sheer audacity left me seeking a retraction of my retraction. I’m so done seeking a retraction of my retraction. I got totally sucked up. Done now. Moving on. The brass balls of these guys makes me want to scream. Who in the hell do they think they are??
Only an assclown would go to someone else’s funeral and start moaning that he’s so sad that you won’t have extracurricular sex with him. For serious. I love how you handled this Runner – like, “Errrrrr, you’re not part of my life. Keep it moving, Cheater McGee.” I totally agree with Mag that the universe often gives us these, “Aren’t you so glad you flushed this loser?” moments!
natasha
I hope I never see any of the EUMs or ACs again. I’d just be embarrassed that I had sex with them.
And, yes, I believed they were the One, destiny brought us together, I fought for our “love”, I thought I’d never get over it, I wept over the tragedy of my doomed, unrequited love.
Benefit is 20:20 – I was only bothered because they rejected me and for some jacked up reason I had to prove them wrong.
Wish I’d just let it go.
“I hope I never see any of the EUMs or ACs again. I’d just be embarrassed that I had sex with them.”
Same here Grace! Ohmygod, do I know what you mean. I’m very lucky in that my last (and arguably worst) AC is in a neighboring state and that when I’ve gone there to visit friends, I’ve never run into him. I thought that fool was The One and was somehow a Cosmic Test of Destiny. Totally agree that there were better things I could have attempted to manifest during that five year period! It did occur to me when I was wailing over him last year that, if I’d realised what I was dealing with and just let it go at 24, I wouldn’t have been STILL getting rejected by the SAME jerk at 29. At the end of the day, we’ve lived and learned…and we’d never put up with bullsh*t again.
Oy vey. When I joined BR I was wearing the most expensive pair of starf***ker glasses. They weren’t rose tinted. They were solid black. It, apparently, is like the Return of the Assclowns. And you are right Sushi, the sequel is never as good because the original was already bad. Thanks to Natalie, we recognize the AC script. Can you block your exAC?
The exMM simply resumed where we left off after he got caught by his wife as though nothing had happened. He was really searching for my rejection retraction and my validation that he wasn’t a lying cheating creep. There was just no way in hell I could begin conjure up anything of the sort cos, well, he is a lying cheating creep. Hopping back in the sack with him was so not on my radar. And he tripped up a really bad memory for me as he attempted his magical trip down memory lane. Opps for him. It really was a keep it moving Cheater McGee moment. I’m not getting on his option block again. I don’t think he expected a closed door. I don’t think he expected that I’m not that woman anymore. Wistful my arse. That really ticked me off.
Maybe it’s time for “Revenge of the Fallback girls”? (In the US the movie Revenge of the Nerds was a hit a while back.)
Runner, I love your “Oy vey!” When Nat had the post about elevator pitching old relationships, I thought, “I could sum that sh*t up in two words if pressed. Those two words would be: Oy. Vey.” 😉
I’m not sure “IF” I have been Rejected – OR – the email got lost? (I have had several emails go missing over the past couple of weeks). I have been emailing this guy for a couple of Months & I sent him a Funny/Cute “Happy Valentine” card, nothing serious & it didn’t even have a heart on it. No response at all. Should I assume he got it? Should I even question him if he received my email b/c I had some email problems? I keep thinking if he did not get it then he’s still waiting for me to reply – BUT then on the other hand if he did get it, I don’t want to seem crazy by asking. Is it wrong to ask? Stuck in Limbo or Rejected???
You’ve been emailing someone for a couple months? That seems a long time to go without meeting – I’m assuming this is through a dating site? Emailing isn’t a relationship. I would assume he could drop you at any time without really having to explain.
But IF you feel the connection was quite good between you, and it feels like it was just a miscommunication (a la NML’s boyf falling asleep and not calling) why not drop him a note that says: “Hey, haven’t heard from you – did you get my last email?”
Why not phone him?
Blank spaces often confuse, but I’ve now realised to register them as meaning ‘it means whatever is safest for you’ which usually means rejection.
You should not be using crumb communication anyway. You can be sure if you are doing this, other things are not well.
Does your relationship/date pass the touch test? Can you physically touch them on three different days of the week?
ElleJae
This is the problem with this kind of avoidance communication – it’s avoidant. If you want to connect with him, phone him, talk to him. If you feel that would be inappropriate/not appreciated/too close for comfort then forget the whole thing.
Yep, they say: texting is fine. I was e-mailing with someone for a few days, now we “progressed” to a (rather lame) texting. And I was thinking, at first, OK, maybe he is just shy. 24 hours later, no call, no date (after e-mailing me about my availability), I am thinking: flush. I don’t feel like I am “allowed” to call, he did not call either, no date set – what am I waiting for? For him to go down his “list” till it’s my turn? That’s what it feels like to me… How long to wait till NC?
Hi Natalie/ladies
This took me back a couple of years.
What was the reason I ended it with the emotionally unavailable man/assclown ? Was it the fact I have never been treated so badly by a man in my whole life ?
No .
It was because I was worried what he might be thinking, or what he was saying about me to other people.Was he saying I was chasing him ? Was he saying it was me that couldn’t let go ? Was he having a laugh with all his mates about how much of a mug I was ? ( which I was ).Was he even admitting I existed ?
He consistently lied to me whilst we were in the ( so called) relationship so I will assume he lied when it was over.
” They’re going to think what they think no matter what you do”
The opinion you have of yourself is the only one that really matters.
It took me a long time to get here but I don’t feel rejected anymore I rejected his values ,so if any of you are reading this in silent despair thats exactly where I was about 2 years ago.
Now, on the odd occasion when I think of the AC, I sometimes smile and laugh at the stupid excuses he gave.
Once you get it,you really get it !
Thanks to Natalie and all you ladies for sharing your stories. x
Couldn’t have come at a better time. I actually broke down into tears just recently, reflecting on every little detail, text and the overall humiliation I put myself through and how I devalued myself all because I thought I was fighting for love, for someone who has rejected me over and over, and once more. Aside from the pain and reality check of rejection, the fact that I made myself so vulnerable, the most vulnerable I’d ever been, to only be treated as if I was disposable and not worth it, makes it a lot more difficult to put myself back out there, even though I know that’s what I have to do.
While I wallowed in self-pity, crying my heart out, obsessing, I can’t help, but realize the guy I was so persistent to have in my life, never actually wanted anything to do with me. Its only now that I piece together the events. Even though, his rejection may have been a blessing in disguise, it doesn’t ease the pain. I think we all have that one person who we don’t truly ever forget, simply for the emotional investment we chose to attach to this one person. I think its the idea of forever, that perhaps you could’ve been a right fit, but at two different stages in life, circumstances, but the fact remains there’s the strong chance you’ll never know that lingers. A true case of unrequited love. Though, I never understood unrequited love because how can it be, if you never actually had this person, but the process of getting over them feels just as it would if you’d been in a long term relationship.
I’m sorry to read this. I’ve been where you’ve been.
There is a tendency to think that fantasy relationships are 100% illusions or hallucinations/dreams. Usually they’re not. They may include texting, phoning every day, sex, occasional visits, going out like friends etc.
Fantasies require fuel sent via crumb communications (FB/IM/Texting/Skype/Letters/Phoning every day), distance and a moderating barrier/obstacle/excuse in the form of ‘if only X then Y’ which restricts the flow of contact. (i.e. if only I lived closer I could see you more / if only we weren’t both busy we could spend more time / if only we weren’t going to have different careers).
Fantasies almost always fail the touch test
(this means touching them – not just seeing them across the office at work)
You may also hear a lot of referencing and hints about more time/less time being dropped when you’re around – like a subliminal ‘don’t expect too much from me’ warning.
Tired, I love your concept of the touch test – it feels pretty fool-proof. My fantasy relationship involved lots and lots of talking time together as well as lots of lazy email communication. However it always failed the touch test. Touching was strictly limited by him to specific occasions only – which were then further restricted / avoided / rearranged. You get to feel like a child who never gets what they want if they ask so they stop asking. Eurrrgh. I physically shudder at the thought of it now.
“Fantasies require fuel sent via crumb communications (FB/IM/Texting/Skype/Letters/Phoning every day), distance and a moderating barrier/obstacle/excuse in the form of ‘if only X then Y’ which restricts the flow of contact. (i.e. if only I lived closer I could see you more / if only we weren’t both busy we could spend more time / if only we weren’t going to have different careers).”
Brilliant!
I also asked when will (insert the obstacle here) be resolved. The answer was 2 years. So, I said, let me know in 2 years, OK? he flipped out: “What’s in it for me in the meantime?”
Aha! WHAT AN ASSCLOWN!
Good one. What an fabulous comeback. I will definitely remember that one!
Janine
You were dreaming, time to wake up.
I keep hearing women say “fight for love” as if it’s a noble cause. What it actually boils down to is desperately trying to get a man to send a text, pick up the phone, respond to an email, basically stop ignoring you. That’s not fighting for love. It’s desperation and we all need to stop it.
The only fighting for love we should be doing is if he’s unjustly imprisoned or suchlike and we fight to get justice for him. We shouldn’t be fighting his indifference.
You think you won’t forget him, you think he’s the one.
You WILL forget him, and he’s not the one.
He’s a flipflapping twerp and one day you’ll be glad you got shot of him.
Circumstances? The circumstance you need to wake up to is the fact that he’s not interested in a genuine relationship with you and probably not anyone for a very long time, if ever. And in the meantime he will get his needs met thanks very much.
Watch out that he doesn’t come back to jerk you around and reject you some more.
Lose the illusion that he’s a poor helpless soul who is a good guy underneath it all and doesn’t know what he’s doing. He is playing you.
And do not put yourself back out there yet. You need to get real with yourself and get your head out of fantasy la la land first. I fear for you girls. It’s like lambs to the slaughter.
The men barely have to do anything but send a few crappy texts, screw us and ignore us, and we’re all over them like they’re God’s gift.
Raise your standards. Expect more from ourselves and surely we’ll expect more from others. I sure do hope so cos that’s my new modus operandi.
Three years ago the AC from long ago met me. To this day they are STILL single and having mega dramas. I almost feel sorry for them – they are stuck in their own insanity .
I realised today that I compare myself to others far too much – and the comparisons I’m making may well be invalid too because other people are not me and we don’t even value the same things. It’s like comparing apples and oranges – which one is ‘better’? They’re both fruits, your answer will be different to someone elses because you have different preferences and values.
Love and happiness comes internally – by making changes within, we make changes externally to validate ourselves.
Janine
Grace has given you good advice, in fact she said something similar to me a few months ago and at the time I thought it was a little harsh. But its what I needed to hear. When you have a short term intense “relationship” with someone and you assume they are “the one” before knowing who they really are, it hurts. Badly. But trust me you will forget him, sometimes we get hung up on “fighting” for something that does not even exist. I know how you feel, I’ve been there. You’ll be fine. 🙂
Wow, this is so me. I was losing my mind over this assclown. I realised it is me that was emotionally unavailable. When I went over his house I would act unintersted and only talked about me me me. Men can take hints much faster then we can. So he recognised i was sending him mixed messages so he quickly moved on. But we still hooked up once in while, and kept in touch. I also realised we were not compatible. He did things i dont like, smoke, drink, party, party, party. I guess i wanted him to chase me. In my mind he would have chased me if I didnt have this minor health situation. I feel because of the situation he rejected me. Thats in my mind. Reality is he rejected me a long time ago. We were just hooking up. I was just convenient. So now i m just using my health as a reason to make me feel better. When in reality I never had a chance. So now Im forced to look at myself and take better care of myself and be there for me instead of making myself better for somebody who doesnt care about me.
Katie
I hope you’re not saying what I think you’re saying. That he used you because you went over to his house and spoke about yourself. You were in his house. He knew you were interested. He let you talk about yourself because you were giving him ammunition. He didn’t talk about himself because he was keeping you at a distance.
I do understand the need/temptation to go over a past relationship for how you can improve for next time but the only lesson to be learned in these situations is – flush quicker. I say “only” lesson, it’s actually very valuable and will save you a ton of heartache and a lot of time.
The bad seed was sown when you lowered your standards and let him treat you poorly. From then on it’s just an endurance test of how much you’ll put up with before you can’t stand it anymore. And don’t go off thinking “I should have demanded better treatment and he would respect me”. If you had demanded better treatment, he wouldn’t have wanted to know you simple as that (mind you, that would have been the best outcome), or he’d have pursued you harder to drop you from a greater height.
He didn’t want a proper relationship. We mustn’t fall into the trap of thinking these men are just waiting for the right person to come along. Because aren’t we all?
Er, NO.
Exactly!
The only true-blue AC I ever dated did marry his longtime off-again, on-again gf (they “dated” or “had a relationship” of about 3 years before marrying), and though he treated her “better” than me and everyone else he dated:
1. they saw each other only every few weeks (2 weeks++ b/w dates);
2. she kept dating him even when one of her best friends saw him with another woman;
3. he always has had a wandering eye;
4. he dropped her like a hot potato (saying “I don’t know. I need time/a break. Just for a while.”) when he saw the chance of other opportunities (but, to be “fair” to him, he wouldn’t technically “cheat” on his then-gf, now wife b/c he only pursued the other opportunities when the woman involved made the first move on him);
5. she had nasty nicknames for him when they were in their “off-again” times (how lovely!);
6. he flirts with an ex (me);
7. he would tell her & her friends (including her good friend, above mentioned) about the women he dated–specifically, who he dated, that he dated many women, etc.; and talked about how far they went with him. (Which is too too funny, b/c his wife did have sex with him, from the get-go! Not later than the 3-4 month mark!)
Though she always spoke up, from the get-go–from/at the first sign of boundary-busting, would you want a guy like this?
And, btw, wifey and I have mutual friends, who all are on her side; and who always praise her, etc. They try to make me envious.
I, meanwhile, think: “Thank you for the info–the fact that you all want to make me feel jealous shows how jealous/malevolent YOU are as to ME.”
grace, I am framing this comment of yours. yes, yes, and yes!
LOL at “patrolling Facebook.” God, that’s embarrassing.
I never understood the Facebook phenomenon, but it has to be setting back dating and relationships about 50 years.
I went to a pub quiz last night and one of the questions that was asked was “What’s the no. 1 killer of marriages?” The answer was facebook!! I wish I was joking, the no. 2 killer was communication! Unbelievable that facebook trumped that
Interesting and not surprising!
I suspect Internet interactions in general don’t bode well for monogamous relationships.
It’s just another form of disconnection from your partner. In the past the attachment disordered could work too much, drink too much, watch sports too much, play around too much, whatever. Now they can disengage from their partners psychologically using interactions on social media that seem real but engage the people in what is for all intents and purposes a fantasy interaction.
It’s about disengagement from emotional connection, no matter what form it takes.
That’s not to wholly denigrate the Facebook phenomenon. I myself don’t “do” Facebook but I’m certainly in the minority there. I guess it’s got its good points but for an emotionally disconnected person, Facebook has got to be the Holy Grail on the ability to check out.
Facebook can be a very horrible tool when your trying to move on from a toxic relationship. I indulged in a lot of Facebook patrolling (which I’m slightly ashamed to admit) when I just couldn’t accept the rejection. I wanted a further glimpse into his life because I wasn’t getting any answers from him. All this does is encourage any fantasy you have built up in your head and delay your healing process.
I agree Stephanie, Facebook is the worst thing in the aftermath of a relationship.. It’s so unhelpful when it comes to this. You might as well just sit outside their house and watch who’s coming and going in and out. It really really has delayed my healing process. I could blame Facebook but really who am I kidding? The sad thing is that what’s put on Facebook is usually a projection of ones idealized identity…therefore no matter what you are probably going to find images or comments or statuses or whatever that will make you unhappy “happiest ex AC alive”…they certainly aren’t going to put something like “really regretting today having hurt my ex Emma and I will be miserable all my life now she has decided to have nothing to do with me”. Also many of these ACs have narcisstic harems of women liking and commenting under their statuses constantly…that’s not pleasant either. Just best stay of their page. The types that we are in NC with are probably not worthy of any further attention anyway.
HA no lie about that. A friend of mine’s coworker struck up a relationship with a guy on ‘Second Life’, had him move from another state to live with her, they’ve been together 3 years now but guess what? On all their spare time they sit in the computer room together back to back conducting ‘business’ with other people online but not with each other. Now that is the ultimate form of avoiding real life. I personally like FB, it helps me keep up with all my family and real friends who are long distance. I also use it for business along with twitter, linkedin etc…. Social media is good but should never take the place of real live interaction. Even in business, I eventually have to physically interact with the people I meet online.
For the past 3 years my ex-AC has gave me mega doses of rejection, shoved it down my throat. I always swallowed and came back for more. Until last summer, when I grew some balls and finally had enough after being rocked to the core. He is now contacting me – in fact he recently wished me a “Happy Valentine’s Day”. You have got to be kidding! NO WAY – IT’S CALLED “PAY BACK” TIME.
I call it ‘validation crack’ along with ‘relationship crack’ and ‘fantasy crack’.
I have been on all three kinds of crack. How crazy is that?
Yes, FinallyDidIt, it sounds like a case of ‘hit the rejection pinata’ rejection is fun until the pinata busts open and then suddenly there is nothing to whack. This guy is baiting you for an ego stroke – surely there are better things to do in their life than mess people around who are long gone!
Finally I get it! For the past 4 months I had been re- playing every conversation and text message in my head that I had with that AC, to try and figure out what went wrong. When I found BR I was secretly hoping that someone would advise me on how I could contact him to try and work things out. When I think back to how I felt in say November-December last year, I cringe. I hit rock bottom all because I had been seeing someone who I fantasied about living the rest of my life with,who future faked with me then cowardly dumped me! Well I can confidently say I’m over it! Because on reflection I can see now it was NEVER going to be. After he disappeared I was seeking his validation so badly, I didn’t want to be rejected and I would have done anything to stop that rejected feeling.
I think when something this devastating happens to you, you just have to go through the motions and emotions until you see the light.
Last Sunday I met a guy in the supermarket (yes! it happens) I noticed him looking at me but ignored him until we both got to the cashier. Cut a long story short, we started talking and exchanged numbers in the car park. He asked me out on a date for V day but I declined because I already had plans to stay in with my 19 year old daughter, cook dinner and eat chocolate! However, I have agreed to a date tonight! So far, he has called nearly every evening to ask about my day and seems nice. He is not the type of guy that I would normally go for but to be honest that was half my problem! This time around I am armed with BR, so there will be no future faking or busting boundaries! I’ll keep you posted.
Do you know what, I started to write out this big long message about the ex EUM being my first love, six months of back and forth seeking some sort of rejection retraction, feeling guilty because I left him and was seeking more validity on whether it was the right thing to do, when deep down my gut knew it was. It took the last time we got in contact (Last week) for me to see him for what he truly was. He wasnt even that bad he was trying to dictate and ‘tell me’ when we would see eachother to talk and it just clicked for me. I’m 22 and wasted six months of my youth fretting and worrying over my decision. The absolute worst thing you could do to yourself is stay with the wrong guy and potentially let the right one pass you by. That fear is enough in itself to make me reject any man who disrespects and mistreats me in the future. We all need a little faith, so I thought I would include these quotes by Eleanor Roosevelt which I find brilliant ” No one can make you feel inferior without your consent” and “Never allow a person to tell you no who does not have the power to say yes”. Do not let these idiots dictate and run our lives.
My concern isn’t that the ex EU is spreading lies, he would be spreading the truth. I ended it with him because he wasn’t giving me what I needed,and was not being so nice at times ,but we would get back together (at my insistence to change) and would happen again. When he wasn’t exactly fighting to get me back or accept friendship, I would react and bombard him with texts to try to to make ammends. I guess he would have a right to assume I was “crazy” and I know for a fact has told people about my behavior. I have cut contact but feel humiliated. I have acted like this before and am working to address my insecurity and abandonment issues, but I can’t say that I am not bothered about how others see me and don’t know how to over come caring .
Yet another cracking article Nat cant tell you how much your advice has helped me can see things more clearly now than I have for a long time.
Went on a couple of dates with a guy could tell the tell tale signs of a AU straight away – Texting main way of contact, trying his best at trying get me to go back to his place, Trying to bring me down, talking of his ex and how much of a bitch she was, seemed not to have a nice word about anyone, its seemed as if he was trying his hardest to put me off him rather than trying to impress me lol!
Knew after the 2nd he wasnt for me without a doubt, Now been a week now and not heard a peep out of him and I am so glad! were as before I would be racking my brain why he hasnt text even if I knew I didn’t want to see him again I would still think there was something wrong with me how could he not having a good girl like me what wrong with me :-/ Then I would be texting asking why they hadnt contact me. But now I have a new out look on dating its not about them chosing you is you knowing if there worthy of you! I would never retract if they pestered the life out of me once you keep your head up move on the stronger you become and in doing so hope I can now at last attract a healthy type of person.
This was a huge thing for me in my last serious relationship with the AC years and years ago…
I was so worried what he would tell all of our mutual acquaintances about me, because by the end I was so crazy with all that he had put me through. The whole situations with our-now-my dog was so intense and uncomfortable, and the hardest part was accepting that some people were going to think I was the evil one for what I felt I had to do. The truth was, I was just getting something back from all that he had taken from me, and I honestly know at this point that I had every right to do this. At the time though, it mattered so much what other people though, how they perceived me after this. He definitely played into that fear, telling me how so-and-so said I was nuts, and “everyone” would hate me, blah blah. What a jerk!
Now, with some reflection, I know that yeah– some people will think I am crazy. But if they judge me without knowing my side, then they are not really worth my time. In retrospect, my friends who truly hated him and judged him were the people that had seen me go through the whole ordeal from a-to-z, whereas most people where like “ok, yeah, he’s a jerk” but honestly didn’t give a crap because they didn’t know him or what happened. Which is normal!
The point is, this was one of the hardest things for me to come to grips about the end of our relationship. What would other people think of me for taking the dog after I suffered an emotionally, financially and physically abusive relationship? Truth is, it doesn’t matter. Most people are too busy to ruminate on that years after the fact. And the ones who might, would probably have tried to hurt me in any way they could have. In a way, someone who would bring that up now to try and shame me would be doing me a HUGE favor, basically saying “hey, I’m a bad person to hang out with! Give me a withering glare and walk away please.”
The point I am trying to make is: What other people think of your breakup really REALLY doesn’t matter. No matter how horrible it gets, no matter how crazy you act, these things happen. And people, good people, will forget or sympathize, but nothing more really because THEY HAVE THEIR OWN LIVES TO LIVE. It’s a liberating feeling.
It has suddenly struck me that the upside to having been the invisible woman of an MM is that now it is all over he has no-one to call me crazy to apart from maybe his new FBG…. So he has to stew on it all by himself. Happy Days!
I’m with you Polly and your comment made me laugh. Yup, what’s a MM do to with a “pyscho” mistress! Who is he gonna tell. Signed: Former “Pyscho” Mistress.
Jen, years back when I hooked up with a seemingly supportive colleague and discovered shortly thereafter he was verbally abusive, I had to get out. I’m summing up about a year or so of magic to abuse. Of course since we were colleagues, everyone in my work environment had an opinion on which one of us was crazy. He made sure to get his side of the story known and shame me. I dug my heels in demanded a retraction, and forwarded his lunatic, threatening emails (thank god he was so stupid to put things in print) in order to make my case in the court of public opinion. I did want it up on the marque: Mr. Colleague is a Verbally Abusive Mess. What a mess and total waste time.
After a decade or so, he actually revealed himself to be the crazy one. I didn’t have to “do” anything. Now he’s just regarded as an old lefty nut case who most people ignore, including me. Most of the folks who had weighed in on which one of us was the crazy one, retired. Now, there’s just a few left who even remember we were together (I hope), let alone why we broke up. As Grace pointed out in a previous comment, this is one ex I’m embarrassed to admit I had sex with. Fortunately in my experience, folks are busy living their own lives, eventually.
Another brilliant posting. They keep coming! The advice given here can also be applied to rejection within families (not just personal relationships) and in lots of areas of life, such as job interviews or interactions with not so good friends or jealous colleagues in the office! It helps you value yourself and I keep learning each time I read these articles, they are so deep!!!! Fantastically great for someone who has struggled with relationships
Lyz
That’s really interesting.
I am really good with facts,so if a man said to me-
” I don’t love you any more,or i’m sorry it’s not working out ”
I would be gone faster than my legs could carry me,and as much as it would hurt,at least it’s the truth.I can cope with rejection like that.After years of being fed lies rejection cuts you to the bone.You can end a relationship respectfully if you want to but most of us ladies/gents on here have been sh*t on from a great height.
Rejection issues are usually deep rooted in childhood but I don’t feel rejected if I fail to get a job.I usually go away thinking- it was probably an internal vacancy anyway,it wasn’t for me ,perhaps she/he was looking for someone more flexible,there are more jobs out there, but I never take it personally.
When there are intense feelings of love and attachment that’s when rejection hits hard.
What does everyone else think ?
tanzanite
Yes, it does hit hard when it’s love and emotions but FBGs take it to a whole new level. Months and even years of agonising over relationships that usually have very little substance. If we subtract our fantasy and wishful thinking there’s not much left.
And while we may THINK that if we heard those words outright, we’d accept it, I’m not 100% sure that we would because, hasn’t he already told us in his flip flapping actions he’s not on board? Why do you need the actual words (that you alone have decided are acceptable, he knows nothing about it) to come out of his mouth?
If he’s shagging around, or ignoring you, or blowing hot and cold, or cutting you out of his life, and lying to you – why does he have to spell it out? At that point – WE should be doing something, not waiting for him (yet again) to come up with the goods.
And do bear in mind that for the EUM, he’s probably very happy with the status quo. Don’t expect him to end what suits him. We have to end what doesn’t suit US.
Rejection does hit hard but it hits us harder because we won’t accept reality. We keep dragging the thing out for ages because we won’t let it go. Deal with the reality. It’s not nice but it’s EFFECTIVE.
Tanzanite, I kept reading Grace’s response to you. Wow Grace, I always love your comments but this one really sums up everything in a nutshell for me at this moment. As a FBG, I took things to a whole new level, a dynasty level. Sometimes I have to hear the same message stated 57 ways but it is always the same message. His actions were way, way more important than his words. I can testify that even though I knew he was married and it would be two years until a divorce, I signed up anyway. It wasn’t until the two years ran out that I got a clue that he liked the status quo, a wife and a mistress. Like you say, I still waited for him to come up with the goods and end what suited him. I wouldn’t accept reality and played fabulously into his denial and my denial. It was an amazing dance of denial. Rejection hit hard. He chose his wife, not me no matter how many “memories” we had in the last two years. He’s got 27 years of memories with his wife. That’s reality. This is a really fabulous post Grace. I’m “dragging the thing out for ages because we won’t let it go. Deal with the reality. It’s not nice but it’s EFFECTIVE”. I’ll be on the tread mill tomorrow with this running through my head. Thank you Grace. I hope the guy from church is a good guy. You deserve the very best. Hope you can stand still…I know the jitters.
thanks runner
I did speak to him today because I ignored him last week and felt awful. I asked him if I should visit my mother this afternoon and he said ” I am sure she would be very glad of it”. As if I was a NORMAL PERSON with a normal mother.
I’ve been crying this evening because I feel rejected. Not by him – we haven’t even been on a date but I feel the Universe is playing tricks on me. Putting his man in front of me who I can’t have, after five plus years of singledom. I wasn’t even looking.
I fear he’s too young and I don’t want to find out for sure because I just don’t want to deal with it. But I keep saying on this blog that reality is better than limbo so I’m going to have to walk the walk. Only I want to hold the possibility in my hands for a little bit longer.
Agh, the ambivalence – am I EU?!!
Grace,
The guy asked you out somewhere and you ran away (I think you said – could have got that wrong – if so ignore me). The ball is now in your court. Stop stalling. Do something about your internal stalemate – make your move – ask him for lunch or something – anything. If he doesn’t jump at the chance, then there is your answer. Now there. That’s you told from dating and relationship expert in residence, fearless, aka fearful. blah.
Grace,
You haven’t tested the waters to know whether you are still eu or not.
Personally I think you have all the knowledge you didnt have in other relationships to make decisions in your favour.
I notice you go to church and sometimes leave Bible verses here is one for you
“So do not fear for I am with you and do not be dismayed, for I am you God.” Isaiah 41 vs 10
Hope you are okay, Grace.
Hey there Grace, I totally hear you. Please hear me…YOU ARE A TOTALLY NORMAL PERSON. You are good enough and better than most. Mom’s are mom’s. Your mom is just a mom. I’m a mom and trying so hard to be a normal mom, whatever that could be.
Your mind is doing jeddi mind tricks. You don’t know this guy or whether or not you can have a relationship. That’s okay. You haven’t been on a date. That’s okay too. He may be too young, I totally hear that. However, I’d suggest standing still. Be quiet. Still the doubtful voices and be Grace.
BTW, I’m in the same boat with a guy at the gym. I simply won’t stand still. We did 1000’s sit ups this morning. He looks too young too. If this keeps up, I’ll have abs of steel. I don’t want to find out either. Let’s be still and feel the fact a decent guy (assuming they are) may be interested, even if they are too young.
Nope I don’t think you are EU, just scared. That may be a good thing?
grace – i want to say this gently – i’m surprised at the way you are handling your attraction. do you want drama?
i say this as one who herself was crying after a couple kisses on a second date … over many of the feelings you’ve described
maybe i don’t have enough detail about what’s going on for you, but … if this is your first attraction after five years, maybe the importance you’re placing on it is what’s got you unstable and erratic in your interaction with him? i’m personally excited for you because of how i’ve come to know your posts … it sounds like you’re starting to let yourself be interested. but i don’t care so much if you land this guy or not, if what’s happening is good for you, and you’re coming into a new phase with yourself.
but ignoring him, feeling bad about it, worrying about an age difference you could verify with a light, simple question … i don’t know. either you like the story of the woman-who-runs-from-love, or … just because he is, interest-wise, The One For Whom You Have Come Out Of Hibernation, you are hoping he’s god’s gift.
What do you think, Grace? I have every faith that you’ll walk the walk and handle the situation with … grace 🙂 (befittingly!)
“Putting this man in front of me who I can’t have, after five plus years of singledom.” It’s this statement, and all the feelings that must be underneath it, old and new, that jumps out at me.
thanks magnolia
I actually hate drama. I’d go so far as to say I despise it, so this is a wake up call.
I feel better today. I’m going to enjoy it and not question it.
I’ve never been a huge fan of Sunday evenings and spending them stewing over this doesn’t help me. So I guess I … stop doing that. It’s an avoidance tactic – if I can make myself feel really really bad and helpless then it’s an excuse for me not to extend myself. “I can’t do x,y,z – I feel too weak/helpless/vulnerable/”.
I’m finishing this comment right now before I start catastrophizing again!
I know it wouldn’t be like me at all but I completely agree with Grace!
Tanzanite, I know these EU men give ambiguous messages cos they both seek us and then run from us, often in equal measure. But in doing that they do provide one message which is actually perfectly clear, consistent and unambiguous: That they are riddled with ambivalence.
These are people (as Yoghurt mentioned above) who have difficulty making a decision when faced with the lunch menu!
Actions speak louder than words. They do communicate the facts and everything else we need to know – we just aren’t listening. In fact we use their so called lack of clarity as an excuse to stick around (turning his crumbs into loaves and fishes that would feed the thousands) while we wait for him to do what we want him to do (retract his ambivalence and stop rejecting us) rather than hearing the message and getting the hell out of there.
But in doing that they do provide one message which is actually perfectly clear, consistent and unambiguous: That they are riddled with ambivalence.
Yes! Drove me nuts that ambivalence did.
I actually think these guys get off on the fact that at any one point in time half their harem is chasing them down.
They do get off on it. Now that I am dating a guy who doesnt text, Facebook, chat on the internet and has guy friends he hangs out with regularly and is not friends with ex’s, I realize all the need for a harem really is a symptom of low self esteem. Think about it, they dont feel good or worthy unless they have women chasing them, even women they’ve never gone out with or intend to. My last ac regularly had girls telling him how sexy he was all the time, on FB, hobby websites etc… and when I wouldn’t do it he acted like I was a prude. I just feel sorry for him now.
Grace
I don’t know if you are speaking to me personally or to fall back girls generally,but if I heard those words I would be off like a shot.
I have had 2 experiences with men just recently,one asked outright if we could be f*ck buddies,
I said-” No thanks.”
An ex from years ago suggested we could sleep together even though he was living with his girlfriend.
I declined.
I definately act on facts.There is a big difference between someone who lets you know what’s on offer and someone who is lieing about what’s on offer.It can take a while for you to notice they are not who they say they are and by that time it can be too late. I was manipulated and in the end I thought it was my fault.I didn’t trust my own judgement.I suffered depression and other illnesses.How can you make a good call when your not in a good place ? Its too easy to say you should have known and in some cases ( mine included ) it’s about more than just being a fall back girl.
It’s good to look at what caused you to make such a bad decision but the men don’t.I ended it a few times but it was always him that got in touch again.I seccumbed because of what I had become whilst being with him.
I was reading a book called- ” who’s pulling your strings” and the woman who wrote it said something like this-in all the years she has been a therapist she has treated 100’s of woman for the effects of manipulation but has never treated a man because he wants to stop manipulating women and that’s because they don’t think they have a problem.
I ended it 2 years ago by changing my number .
I would agree with tanzanite.
If there’s one common theme here it’s that the ACs did NOT say, sorry but this isn’t working, it’s over, and leave. I’ve been dumped like that in the past, it hurts but you get over it and it isnt soul destroying in the way this was.
Hindsight gives you 20/20 vision.
At the time it isn’t always immediately obvious what they’re up to. They don’t mean what they say, and they aren’t saying what they mean. Some people end up stuck for years, and it isn’t because they’re stupid or self-deceiving fantasists. The technology of email & text etc is a great facilitator too.
I hope never to make the same mistake again.
Me too !
I hope you are ok Mymble.
Grace and fearless-I think we are all here because we have made a fool of ourselves at some point.
It’s not as clear cut as you suggest or this site wouldn’t exist.There is a point where you are in Limboland.When you are in limboland/stuck/not sure, your self esteem goes and you are filled with self doubt.The damage that can be done at that time is huge.I can only speak for myself, but it’s a self esteem issue/old wounds issue/childhood trauma issue/ temporary insanity due to the fact you are under the influence of an AC issue, but it does exist and is a dangerous time.
Having said that,there is a point behond that, and that’s when you become a willing participant.You know exactly what’s going on but choose to ignore.I think that’s what you are talking about.
It alright for people like us that have moved forward but what about the people who are reading this who are stuck ? Saying you should have read the signs doesn’t help.Especially when most of us didn’t read the signs at the time ourselves.
tanzanite. mymble
I’m being clear cut because I know exactly that when you are in it, you don’t see it.
If people can’t see the signs, we can leave em to work it out for themselves, sympathise, or point out the signs via a megaphone. (There’s counselling, but that’s outside the scope of a blog). All three have their place but I’m veering more towards the third option these days.
Might be different next week or next year, but that’s what I’m feeling right now.
I wish someone had told me this ten years ago. Even five years ago. For the first time in my life I’m feeling that my age is restricting my options. We don’t have all the time in the world.
I’m not talking about whose fault it is, or who’s to blame. I didn’t say anything about foolishness or stupidity cos sadly I’ve got you all beat on that score.
Save yourselves. And now. Now is a good time to do it. Those days sure go quick when you’re living in a dream/nightmare. I can’t get them back.
Here’s a bible verse for me:
“I will restore to you the years that the locusts have eaten”.
Hope so.
Pfft. Damn locusts! Give me back what you ate – you scoundrels!
Grace
We all get there eventually, and we have to find the best way that suits our personalities.
I only issue I have is you metioning your age.There are enough people in the world that will tell you that your too old when you pass 40.I can say this because I am past 40.
Don’t you believe it !
Tanzanite
I too have had exactly the experiences you describe.
“It alright for people like us that have moved forward but what about the people who are reading this who are stuck ?”
Hopefully, the benefits of other BR commentators’ hindsight will help them. It sure helped me. It still does.
“Saying you should have read the signs doesn’t help.Especially when most of us didn’t read the signs at the time ourselves.”
The discussion was not about who should have or should not have read the signs. That would be pointless and, yes, unhelpful. The discussion (at least as far as I am concerned) was about whether or not the signs (amber or red flags) are there at all or exist at all. They are there/ they do exist. That is my view. It is also my belief that they actually come to the fore pretty quickly.
It was immensely helpful to me when I first came to BR to read others’ comments about this, as I didn’t fully appreciate how much of what had been staring me in the face I choose to ignore, deny, avoid – or just failed to ‘get’.
Fearless
I think we will have to agree to disagree on this.
I was reading baggage reclaim along time before I came on.The reason I didn’t come on was because I was in limboland and in intense emotional pain.I wasn’t ready for a curt response then, even though I agreed with everything that was being said.
I came on on here when the pain became manageable.I am one of the lucky ones who has grown through this experience ( Thanks to BR and everyones different experiences ) and now with my self esteem back, I don’t mind what I read.
If you got knocked down by a bus and was in physical agony would you want someone to call 999, hold your hand and console you, or someone to tell you to look both ways before you cross the road ? Your are more likely to listen to someone when it isn’t so painfull.
Emotional pain is just a different kind of pain.
This post rings particularly true for me. I’ve desperately seeked a “correction” throughout my life, because my mother bad-mouthed and slandered me in the worst possible way, and as I was a child and she was my mother, almost everyone in our family and in the neighborhood believed her. Plus, my bullies spread very similar lies about me at school. Among other things, they all claimed I was crazy/mentally ill and unable to relate to other people properly. Sadly enough, this was enough to almost make me crazy.
The solution was to move away from all of this (which I did) and have a fresh start. But the self-doubt persisted. Whenever someone rejected me or didn’t invite me to a party, I wondered: Maybe momster was right after all? Sometimes, I desperately tried to find reasons for the rejection and/or make those people change their mind.
The self-doubt is still present. Something in me still believes everything I do, everything I say and everything I think is “crazy”. This is something I need to overcome on my own. I can’t expect all people in the world to agree that I’m not a madwoman, because there will always be someone who says otherwise (maybe because that other person has a hidden agenda or mental health issues himself/herself).
Great article again!
I’m NC w/ my MM/AC by my own choosing this time, not his, and part of what kept me contacting him is the sense of control I had when we were pseudo-friends. If I could keep him happy, I didn’t have to worry about him spreading lies, truth, and all in between at work because he was pissed off because of MY rejection of him.
I’m still afraid of that. He has plenty of stuff on me that could humiliate me at work and possibly get me in trouble, and right now he’s going through charges of sexual harassment from two different women and could possibly still be dismissed and I feel like he might not have anything to lose… I don’t want to lose my job because I got effed up in the head over some AC… but I have plenty of evidence that nothing was not mutual between us… I hope he wouldn’t go down that road…
My therapist says I am stuck in victim-hood land, where I see relationships as a power struggle. Going NC has made me feel powerless over the situation w/ him but it’s helped me develop healthier beliefs. I just have this huge sense of panic… then I think he couldn’t put the effort in to be a friend or anything more despite what he said, why would he put the effort in to destroy my career? I hope he wouldn’t, and hope he can just find something else to occupy his ego.
Hi limerence,
It’s sobering, isn’t it, when you realise your job may be at risk?
It kind of puts the whole thing into perspective. Hes disposable, ACs are 10 a penny, but good jobs aren’t
. You do have control, over yourself, and to protect yourself. Put as much distance between you and him as possible, stay out of the harassment allegations, avoid the office gossip, (which will be probably be rife) avoid ever discussing it with him or using work time
or work email systems to communicate (better if you don’t ever communicate).
I don’t think he’ll be likely to land you in it, because it would be unlikely to help him any, but if his activities are being investigated things may come out in the wash.
Good luck, hopefully he’ll get the boot, and you’ll be able to forget about him!
Thanks! Never used company resources for the affair so that’s a plus. I’m sure he’ll get bored of me and move on to the next woman soon. Right now though, he’s having a hard time w/ me being NC and keeps trying to open the line of communication. I don’t want to piss him off, but I realize he doesn’t really have much on me other than I engaged in an affair with him which he wouldn’t want revealed ANYWAY in case his wife found out and I’ve realized he’s a HUGE coward.
I’m proud of the women who stood up and turned him in. I was not able to see my worth at the time and when he first came sniffing around, harassing me, I thought “OH BOY, male attention!!! I don’t care if my red flags are waving and this guy gives off major creep vibes and is married!!! I’ll latch on to him, be a Florence, blow smoke up his bum and validate the hell out of him and in turn validate myself!!! I’ll future fake with him, think I can be the exception to the rule, live in lalaland, and act out all the horrible beliefs I have about myself!” In reality all that happened was I let myself be used and lost a lot of dignity and pride and let myself slip into a very bad, very dark place.
Wahoo Limerence sounds like you’ve turned the corner. Do NOT worry whether he is having a hard time because you’ve gone NC. He’s probably worried whether you are going to blow the whistle too and is hoping you will provide a shoulder to lean on during his tough times fending off sexual harassment claims. And if you could provide a shag, so much the better for him. Don’t validate this jackass. Let him sink. (Oh and keep every email and text but don’t respond to him, particularly in print which includes cyberspace).
OH BOY do I know the OH BOY the male attention phenomenon, red flags, a wife a family be damned. I did it too. I was so hell bent on being the exception, I sold myself down the river and acted out every horrible belief I had about myself too.
Here’s the thing though, we’ve discovered Natalie, BR, and a bit of self-respect. Head up, move forward, and don’t look back, other than to process and feel the grief. Keep your work environment and interaction with him squeaky clean. In some circumstances in the US, home email and text messages are subject to discovery in court so you’ve got to be careful there too. Now is the time for total NC for you and for your job. I went through nine yards of legal shit while being involved with the exMM while he was trying to fire a senior administrator and the senior administrator alleged we were having an affair, which we were. Because I work in the public sector and have tenure, my job was not in jeopardy and he was elected so his position wasn’t threatened either. Thinking back, it was just total mind f***kery as to what I was thinking.
One day Limerence, we may be like the others and feel embarrassed that we were involved with these cheating, lying scumbags. For me, I can hardly wait.
Protect you and protect your job. Don’t give Mr. Sexual Harasser the time of day or the steam off your pee…!
Limerence,
I don’t recall all the details of your situation, but if this man is on the verge of losing his job because of multiple sexual harassment complaints, it doesn’t put him in a very powerful position. Would those higher up really put much stock in what someone with this kind of character has to say?
I am so glad I found this website…as I have been engaging with a man who throws me a few text crumbs…along with some pretty graphic pix…and keeps me around for his ego. I have pretty much beat myself up all along this journey…telling myself that he is just being a guy…doing what guys do…and I am letting him…so I have not been complaining. What I have been doing is fueling my fantasy of him and giving him way more credit than he deserves…we really only had a brief physical relationship and he moved. I for some reason, could not get over myself and accept the fact that I had given the physical part of myself to someone without building an emotional/stable relationship first…it was a classic hookup…so I kept backpedaling and trying to build a connection to make myself not feel so crappity about myself and feeling slutty…I guess! I thought I suffered alone in this type of behavior…I thought I was way too smart and accomplished to behave this way…I knew that he was being straight with me in the beginning..telling me he was moving and this was strictly a hookup…I underestimated the bonding that went on when you have sex with someone more than a few times…I began to like him…and he rocked my world…and before I knew it…his texts or calls were like crack!!! I am reading through other people’s posts and realizing I made some mistakes…but that he has too…by sending me mixed messages about his intentions…I am so thankful to find out that he doesn’t need to tell me anything…he doesn’t owe me anything…I need to accept that the validation is not forthcoming and never will be…I have got to use the no contact rule…delete him…block him…whatever I have to do to get back to living my real life not wondering if and when he will ever contact me again!! This has been the longest 10 months of my life and I have learned alot about myself…I fall hard…and fast…and abandon is my middle name…romantic thoughts are just thoughts…and although is seems like a person should be able to handle knowing real from fantasy…it’s harder to seperate after all of the hormones and bonding that goes on with good sex. I found out that people are people…and everyone wants to be loved…even him…ESPECIALLY him…and believing when a person shows you who they are the first time…believe them!!! I could write a book…or so I…
No Contact
FLUSH
You can bet that there are other people he’s shagging with and running around with.
Time to get off validation crack!
Veronica, it sounds like you have a really good level of self-awareness in the aftermath of this relationship, and that you’ve learned a ton from it. If you get behind the decision to go NC and stick with it, even when it feels awful, you’ll gain even more clarity…and free yourself up to take those valuable lessons you learned, and meet someone who is truly into you.
Dumping my chump, and going NC right away, turned out to be the best way for me to validate myself. My silence is my “Eff you!” to him — and moreso, my “Yay, me!” to myself — every day, all day. It felt weird and uncomfortable and gut-churning at first, but it’s made me strong over time.
Hang in there…it gets better with time and with distance from these silly twit-boys.
“You seeking a retraction from one person is like anointing them as the validation messiah”
Well said Natalie. I’m purchasing your book this week. I often wonder if the truth from EU’s and AC’s could set you free, then there would be no reason for us to be validated. If they had a set and came clean with all their dishonesty, future faking, cheating in the end there would be less of a need to feel validated by them. I think the recovery time would be cut in half. Does the truth set you free?
Nat and ladies..
Today was not so great a day,well actually last 2 days…I have been having some health issues and have been generally feeling rather shitty.
Today at work I started getting chest pains and a numbing in my arm,so off to the hospital I went,turned out to be a straned muscle..whew..I have a host of tests that need to be done as well..
Anyway Mom and I are talking and she says”Your not over him yet”….
I said Mom I am over him,just not the way in which he dissapeared and dumped me…
So I come home have a nap,and woke up in a cold sweat just having a dream in which he did it all over again.
I am still seeking that apology,It will never come..
I looked around in the hosp today,and saw a family greiving the loss of there loved ones,children so sickly,the aged just lying there waiting to be taken,and here I am sitting crying over some Asshole who did not deserve me.I have given him way to much power,enough is enough!!
Ach, Brenda. To not even be able to escape and get relief from this guy in your sleep, and instead to be haunted by him in a dream…I know how awful that feels. I console myself by thinking of it as my psyche trying to disgorge the guy — like a cat horking up a hairball or something.
Disappearing acts are so hard to bounce back from. Years ago, I made myself very sick after being on the receiving end of one. In hindsight, it confounds me that this dopey guy — who was a big pile of nothing special, really — got so under my skin that I abandoned myself to the point of illness.
Like your experience in the hospital, I was able to recognize at the time that there are whole other magnitudes of human suffering out there. Stuff that life doles out to us, beyond our control (accidents, death, illness)…and there I was gutting myself over some foolish male creature. And that realization became another tool to torture myself with. Ugh!
I hope you’ll be gentle yet strong with yourself. Gentle in taking good care of yourself as you work through the pain, and strong in choosing yourself every day (every hour, every minute) despite the confusion and sadness and anger.
Tea cozy
“like a cat horking up a hairball”.
Read that before I went to bed and laughed myself to sleep!
I’ve been tormented for weeks by dreams of the AC too, looking at it like that makes it much less tragic.
Thanks!
I too laughed at the Hoarking Cat..!!!
I am still giggling!
I think as women we are really in serious need of learning to be strong within ourselves. Stop sleeping with guys you don’t know!! It’s so important to take the time to get to know someone before you allow your heart and emotions to get involved. For women we get really stupid after sex, wheras guys are stupid before it and gain clarity after it.
Girls we need to MAKE THEM WAIT and prove to us who they are before we allow ourselves to get involved. Women do not work the same way men do. Unfortunately for us, sex brings on a barrage of emotional attachments for us and then we make really bad and desperate decisions, find ourselves chasing after AC’s we would have never given the time of day to validate us.
I for one, have learned to move very slow with each guy I meet. The ones who are pressuring me to move faster can move right on along. I am not interested in being a casualty of war anymore. Guys have become so sexually obsessed with just having their way, and have stopped treated us with respect BECAUSE THERE ARE WOMEN OUT THERE GIVING THEM WHAT THEY WANT WHEN THEY WANT IT.
If we women would collectively set our standards higher, and not allow guys to use us as booty calls, and play toys, and side dishes… then they would actually have to come up with a plan to get us to give them the time of day. Actually pick up the phone and think of some things to ask us and talk about. If we stopped accepting text and IM and FB messages as valid forms of communication then the ones who surive off it will be forced to change their tunes.
Hate to say it ladies but guys have become the product of us women pandering way too much to their way of doing things. We need to respect ourselves again and demand respect back if we are ever going to stop this AC epidemic from overtaking even the few good men left out there.
AMEN! Preach it, Reality.
“Guys have become so sexually obsessed with just having their way, and have stopped treated us with respect BECAUSE THERE ARE WOMEN OUT THERE GIVING THEM WHAT THEY WANT WHEN THEY WANT IT. ” I agree most are acting like this. I would say all but I know some decent men, but they few and far between.
“If we women would collectively set our standards higher, and not allow guys to use us as booty calls, and play toys, and side dishes… then they would actually have to come up with a plan to get us to give them the time of day. ” I agree! As a group we’ve let them off the hook, let them get away with crap. And many women’s mags,some “scientific” studies, etc encourage us to do so, say that “boys will be boys,” and all the junk. My foot! They have control of their choices, just like we do, biology doesn’t change that. If I see one more article telling women we should do this or that to impress a man I’ll puke. How many articles do you see telling men that they should work to impress us? Next to nothing.
“Hate to say it ladies but guys have become the product of us women pandering way too much to their way of doing things. We need to respect ourselves again and demand respect back if we are ever going to stop this AC epidemic from overtaking even the few good men left out there.” “Girls we need to MAKE THEM WAIT and prove to us who they are before we allow ourselves to get involved. ” I agree! I drop those who pressure me, I decided long ago that those types of men do not really care about me, they just want my body. Now I automatically identify the AC/EUM’s thanks to Natalie’s blog. I wish I had known of it years ago that knowledge would have saved me some suffering. AC, EUM, and horn dogs, these types of men I do not care for. Next!
Today is my birthday and earlier this week I asked my friend to come out and get a bite to eat and catch up. He is a guy, but I only like him platonically. We’ve known each other years . There is no romance at all. He said that he couldn’t coz he was broke. I was pissed off, couldn’t we atlases get a coffee? It’s my birthday and we’ve been friends a long time! He’s used this excuse before. I don’t believe him, he begged me to go out a couple I’d weeks ago. He works full time and has no one but himself to spend his money on. What do I do? I’m friendly and easy going. Yet other women always see me as a threat. I don’t know why Ive never slept with someone bf or husband. And never want too. Yet always find it difficult to make friends with women. What do I do, throw this friendship away?
Fedup “Happy Belated Birthday”
I too have always had a hard time being friends with women, they also take me as a threat to them even though they have no reason to think so. Yes I’ve been blessed in the gene pool of looks but obviously I have no control over how I look so its always interested me why other women think its something I’ve done and therefore need to be punished for. Jealousy/Envy isn’t pretty no matter how you look.
As for your friend, I wouldn’t call him again and if he calls say you’re busy. I wouldn’t throw the friendship away but I wouldn’t put much effort into it unless he does. And if he asks why you’re distant I’d tell him then see what he says/does, you’ll have your answer.
FedUp, MaryC
Trust me, I’ve not been hit with the Ugly stick and I don’t have a problem making female friends at all. How you look is not the issue. I don’t know what the issues is as I’ve never experienced it myself, but it’s not that. Maybe, if you think they won’t like you, you’re putting out the wrong vibe?
If you are pretty, you may have to make a bit more effort to show that you’re not stuck up. By a bit more effort I mean smiling and saying “I like your shoes”. If that doesn’t work, I’m stumped.
Grace, if it was only that simple as “I like your shoes”. And with all due respect if you’ve never exprienced it then how do you know that’s not it? No I’m not just pretty I’m beautiful and I make no apologies for it since I had nothing to do with it. It does boil down to insecurity, theirs, and no amount of smiling or doling out compliments is going to change that.
And why would anyone assume I was stuck up just because of how I look. She’s pretty so she has to be and if you’re not you’re automatically someone who can be a great friend. Actually I think I’m better without them, if I have to alter myself to make anyone feel better about themselves in order for them to want to be my friend I’ll pass.
Besides being beautiful, I’m smart, educated, well traveled, I have a great job, love dogs and can cook. I volunteer every other week for a couple of hours at the local VA center reading to those who can’t anymore. I teach a Sunday school class every week, I drive my grandfather every Saturday morning in the summer so he can meet up with his friends for golf. I make the desert every time for my mom and her bridge club, I’m involved in my community, I’m there when ever someone needs me. In other words I am a good person with alot to offer in a friendship but if someone only see the exterior and makes a judgement solely based on that without getting to know me then I don’t want them as my friend.
MaryC
I wasnt blessed with great beauty, just ordinary looking, however my good friend ever since day one of Uni is very, very bonny! She has always had loads of guys in hot pursuit, she is a legend for it, (their absurd behaviour in their attempts to win her and chase other men off was actually a source of great comedy!) but we her friends do not feel jealous because she is so warm and fun to be around. She is such a great person to have a gossip and a laugh with. She has loads of male and female friends!
All I’m saying is, in a girlfriend or a lover, the first thing that attracts (me) is warmth and a sense of humour.
Ditto here. Very hard to make women friends. Even though they KNOW that I am nice–it’s very obvious that I am a very nice person, from a very nice family.
What do my “friends” do? Well, they won’t invite my family to their kids’ parties, even though my kid and their kids have playdates together, at least every few months! They hang out in public with less pretty women. Though they value education, and greatly, they will praise women who aren’t as educated as us if it means hurting me (making me feel badly about myself, the weight I gained with my pregnancy, for example). Etc., etc., etc.
It’s all o.k. I actually gather strength from it all now, as I used to.
I have more peace having no/fewer women friends than having negative friends in my life!
Fedup: Seeing as you’re old pals, why can’t you simply express that you were a little hurt that he couldn’t make any effort for you for your birthday, and ask him gently but directly whether he feels uncomfortable being friends with you? Then you know, and you can act on that information, instead of doing the passive aggressive route that may or may not be a valid response. As for what other women think of you, I think there is some amount of bending that needs to be done to maintain female friendships, especially new ones (ie not our childhood/school/uni pals, where it’s all been sorted out over a long time). But even my new female friends are pretty straightforward with me. If there’s persistent misunderstanding or drama now, after I know I have been fairly warm and chatty, then I simply don’t prioritise that friendship. I don’t cut people off, just don’t give active time or thought to it. But this should be a natural thing.
“No I’m not just pretty I’m beautiful and I make no apologies for it since I had nothing to do with it.”
MaryC, I have no doubt you are good-looking, but this statement does give me the impression that you are quite proud of your looks.
I mean, I’m sure there are people who don’t want to hang with me because I’m doing a PhD and could be intimidated by that, but it’s not something I worry about. There are as many different ways to react to the blessings I’ve received as people I meet.
But if I said, “Actually, I’m not just smart I’m a genius and I don’t apologize for it, because I was just born like this and if people can’t handle it I don’t need them anyway …” What would your reaction be?
MaryC
Sorry to offend – I’m not talking about altering yourself but being more approachable. Whenyou are beautiful people assume that you have got it all, you have enough friends already, you don’t need anyone else.
If you’ve been stung in the past , maybe you avoid future rejection by being reserved. If you’re beautiful, people don’t see that reservation as shyness or hesitation. And that’s just a hard fact of life. I guess you either expect them to get over themselves or you meet them halfway, maybe a little more than halfway. All those qualities you have, people can’t see that straightaway (unless you carry a placard, which would be odd).
Breaking the ice is hard for everyone. At church one of the elders said to me “You need to go talk to people. People are shy”. And my immediate reaction was – Aren’t I shy? I was bullied and ignored by my parents, bullied at school, I get racially abused. I’m shy! But people don’t see that. They just see someone who – isn’t talking to them. As I’ve let my guard down I’ve been surprised by the warmth and kindness that has come back to me.
And you don’t need that many friends. One or two or three really good friends is plenty.
If you don’t feel you need female friends, then none of this matters but if you feel it’s something that’s missing in your life there are ways to overcome it. There must always be ways to overcome, otherwise we’re stuffed.
Today I am also wondering why an ex of mine dumped me coz he didn’t want to be in a relationship. Yet he’s dating someone else. And changed for her. Why does this happen to me for?
Hello again Fedup… I think all you can say is he didn’t want to be in a relationship with you and you’re better off without him. Wish him well and move on to the better life you deserve. You say he changed for her but that doesn’t mean he won’t change again. Wish her well with him, she just might need it.
Watch your thinking Fedup. I just replied to your comment above, then read this: looks like you’re getting into the trap of victim, trying-to-control-the-uncontrollable thinking. His changing for another person isn’t something that happened TO you. The only thing that it has to do with you is that he might have been more determined after things didn’t work out with you to make a choice that was good for him and maybe work harder on a relationship (as we should all do – learn from our past etc). But that’s just a matter of ordering in life. You happened to come before a relationship that is working better for him. Themore important things that happened was he decided he wanted to change for his own health and happiness and/or he met someone whose certain blend of characteristics seemed to make him feel more like he could do this. I don’t mean to say that it is the woman’s role to inspire her man to greatness. But it would be highly naive to think that there isn’t such a thing as compatibility. My first boyfriend was all of these things: charming, funny, energetic, generous, sociable, a cheater, self-absorbed, aggressive and mean. He is now happily married, genuinely happy. Do I think he changed in spite of me? NO! The facts are (as I can tell): he grew up, he chose someone whose qualities balanced out some of his less-than-healthy ones, and he attached himself to her family. That’s OK. That’s a good thing. I am happy for him. But his qualities don’t work as well with mine. I am too challenging, analytical, ambitious and opinionated for him. Seeing as I left him, if we followed this thinking, he could have concluded that I wouldn’t change for him, and that I didn’t like him enough to change. Why go through that? A lot of these things are structural. It all feels less personal, though, when you feel autonomous and committed to self-love.
Fedup, Happy Belated Birthday. I’ve always followed your comments and never knew how to respond, not that I know now. So I’m out on a limb here. My 22 year old daughter just returned home from college after breaking up with her 22 year old boyfriend of three years. She’s out exploring her options now, apparently. If I could get you and my daughter in the same room, I’d say slow down with the guy thing. Hooking up with a guy is just hooking up. At 20-something, you’ve got to focus on you, your future, and how you will provide for yourself. 2o-something turns quickly into 30-something, which turns into 40-50-something. Hopefully, you and my daughter won’t pin your hopes on a male? I know you are Fed Up now. But you can turn it around NOW. I wish my daughter was on BR. You are fortunate Fed Up. Hugs to you. You don’t need a random male who just wants a shag. God, I wish I could talk to my daughter. Focus on YOU, my dear.
through my dealings with AC they really do know how to push it.and there;s something in their brains that keeps on trying to manipulate women and get away with it because they know that we like them…i think they are complete psychos… and i do think its ‘the nice guys’ that are the sneakiest. the recent thing that happened to me with a mr nice AC was that i had dinner plans on saturday, but AC decides to text me friday , the day before to see if im free. i went along coz my plans had been cancelled, anyway, we didnt have dinner, just a chat and some kissing, so,, so on friday after i saw him i text him to let me know about dinner, and he said he would let me know….so come saturday, mr AC didnt text me all about dinner so by 10pm i sent a text saying, that the nice to have done would be to let me know you couldnt make dinner, so no reply and now its sunday, and no reply.
what pisses me off is the rudeness of people and the fact that i would never treat someone like this….these AC are dominating the earth and i swear i feel like going on a mission to rid the world of these assclowns,
I know, they are frickn’ EVERYWHERE
Jasmine
That sort of behavior is just shit! He’s rude, something similar happened to me, the AC actually confirmed we were meeting up as agreed the day before but on the day just disappeared and later sent a text saying he had a family issue! And your right, a lot of them are time wasters and psycho!
that the nice to have done would be to let me know you couldnt make dinner, so no reply and now its sunday, and no reply.
The first date I ever went on for online dating stood me up. When I phoned them they didn’t answer and didn’t reply. I texted an hour beforehand as well. Another time someone ‘forgot’ so I rescheduled and they ‘forgot’ again. Farce! Another one was drunk and subsequently flaked out – what an asshole! Then there was one that I wanted to meet but like an hour before suddenly had an emotional family meltdown and wanted to reschedule two weeks later (WTF?) another one chatted me up then ‘had something pop up at work’ an hour before meeting so asked ‘for a raincheck’ which I did, and then they flaked out and didn’t reply, another one I went out with but they had no interest in going over to my place, kept stalling, then went back to their ex, another one flaked out on the same day ‘I’m just getting over my ex and not ready yet blah blah’ (hmm… why are you on that site then?) and I could just go on and on and on these assclowns cannot even make it to the first date!
There would be many times where I’d be chatting and suddenly they would just terminate the IM conversation with no notice, warning or they would just stop responding. Lame ass excuses would come trotting out when I wanted to meet them. Some of them were actually scammers peddling gym products / supplements / adult videos and possibly even phishing for personal information so they all failed the touch test when I tried to get them to meet up.
Watch out for people who are walking and talking Facebook and Twitter feeds This is pure intimacy avoidance.
I’ve learned my lesson! *FLUSH*
Online dating – FLUSH!
Tired, I havent had this experience with online dating and I’ve done quite a bit of it. I do however agree that there is a higher propensity for this to happen in the online world because a. there are more people/prospects, b. its easier to hide behind a computer and c. a lot of people who aren’t really ready to date use the internet to stick their toe in the water but don’t want to get all the way in. I was watching the Patty Stanger/Millionaire Matchmaker and she gave some red flags to look out for when online dating, 1-the person should ask for your number and for a meeting after only one or two emails, 2-if they get sexual right away-flush. I’d say these are good rules to start with, especially number 1 because it weeds out the toe dippers. Anyway, not trying to talk you into going back online but for anyone else who’s thinking about it, just some tips. I also never contact any men, I only respond to the one’s that have shown interest in me first.
I agree….that people think what they want to think. I can say this because there have been people in my life who’ve done or said something, tried to “fix it” and I still think what I want! Still many people in my life are unavailable….so I guess that means I still am. This is a powerful post for me. Resonated deeply. I do know that anyone who believes the BS that someone might say about me, or the lies, that the person doesn’t need to be in my life anyway, they don’t matter. But the people/person that sees it for what it is and still wants to be my friend, that is the one I must pay attention to. My problem is I want to keep people on a leash because I am so scared they’ll leave me since I have been left so many times. Are there people who stick around for a long time or do they all just leave? I try and avoid close relationships for this very thing but end up hurting anyway.
Relationships are 100:100
I daresay proper dating is 100:100 effort too.
If you are at anything below 100, then it doesn’t matter if you meet someone who is at 100% capacity. You’re not and so when you sum together you don’t get a whole.
I would suggest take yourself off the market and go into repairs. I won’t let people hang around in any capacity anymore and I will not sign up to the friends package ever again. FLUSH.
This is like me, through and through!
I just got fast forwarded BIG STYLE! i cant believe i didnt even notice, i’ve even read nats book and i still didnt spot it, such a numpty! but even when things got low, after he’d insisted we were together and i starry eyed agreed thinking this guy means business, i still hung about waited for a rejection retraction!
i thought something id done had put him off, rather than the fact he just couldn’t deliver on the expectations he’d forced into my mind.
i blamed myself, tried to act nice and answer and call at just the right times and say just the right things and then he would realise how fab i was and revert back to being mr perfect, and then i wouldnt feel so rejected.
yeah, that didnt happen, after reading articles again i decided to go NC, its been a week, its like he hasnt even noticed! probably busy fast forwarding someone else….
Great Post as Always Natalie.
Magnolia and Millan, thank you for replying!. I agree with what you both have said, however, I am not sure I agree that I didn’t take responsibility for my crazy behaviour by blaming it on “love addiction” when this is pattern I have had for many, many years and that I am finally getting sober.
Millan to answer your question, in fairness to my friend, I was the one who told her that I “wanted to experience passion, not just sex”. She said he was the most passionate lover she had ever had, that is why she introduced me to this man, and I can see why.
To me, taking responsibility meant resisting the URGE to blame my friend and/or her on-again/off-again partner, DESPITE one or both of them bribing me and having a bit of fun at my expense and exploiting my vulnerability, instead of blaming MYSELF, because I had the option of NOT doing the vandalism.
Admitting that I am a love and sex addict, is not an excuse. It is a bitter and painful truth, that when I am rejected my men who I fall in love with WAY too quickly, that my core abandonment wounds and low self-esteem is triggered, and my borderline personality traits surface.
Later I decided that words are cheap, so I sent the money taking a substantial overdraft as “damages” for the hurt, suffering and humiliation I caused them both, without any expectation (even though I hoped for some kind of admission on their part they had hurt me and some kind of reconciliation). She and I are friends, however he doesn’t even want my name mentioned (according to when he last visited my friend) and the fact that he got and spent the money was not even acknowledged, (except when she asked).
Les, I am not sure what “smart recovery” means.
IAgree… this is so true, If I see one more article telling women we should do this or that to impress a man I’ll puke. How many articles do you see telling men that they should work to impress us? Next to nothing.
Women have become obsessed with getting men’s approval. And it does start with the marketing campaign out there that constantly tells us women on a daily basis that we are not pretty enough, skinny enough, stylish enough etc etc. The end result is ALWAYS… if you do these things… men will like you. UGH!
Gaining validation from men has been put in our heads since we were babies. Consider Cinderella who was “saved” by Prince Charming… then on to Snow White, and so on and so forth. At the end of the story, they were in some mans arms and “they lived happily ever ever.” I guess we are all still little girls trying to figure out how the hell to get our EVER AFTER.
We need a paradym shift in our brains and in our mentality that tells ourselves, these mofo’s better start living up to the kind of man that deserves women such as ourselves. I’m ready to turn the tables on these self centered manchildren and let them know we won’t be smoking their relationship drama/crack no more. And make no mistake these men BRING the drama… they know exactly what buttons to push and then blame it on us.
Here is the list Mr.’s of what WE require. Let us know if you can handle it. If not… NEXT! And movies, music and magazines are the WORST culprits out there filling our minds with what love should/would/could look like. It’s all a bunch of BS! Stop supporting them!! Real love is work and it is focus and it’s a decision daily to try and to give and to be. The fairytales need to be put aside, so that we can start building some healthy, honest and real relationships.
I have been such a validation seeker. However, there is no gold at the end of that rainbow. And through the journey I found out that I am a pretty rockin’ chic… and I have NOT been acting like it. It starts with us ladies, not them… US!
Peace
I realised after reading this that I had felt great about myself until I met my current 3 1/2 yr casual relationship man, early on when he rejected a committed relationship with me I downgraded my opinion of myself to unworthy of a relationship. And I have tried everything to get him to retract his rejection ever since – no surprise seeing I had made him the decider or whether I was lovable or not! However today I realised that his actions had nothing to do with me, this is what he always does with women. He likes to be in a situation with a woman where the woman (or women) think he wants a relationship but he doesn’t and he never gets there. This is the situation he actively creates and maintains through “I wish I had children” etc comments right when you are about to give up on him. Or he feels down when you distance so you run back – to find nothing has changed except you havn’t left yet….
When you participate in unavailable relationships, it’s like you’re seeking validation in order to gain an overall retraction that would right the wrongs of the past, or if you keep going back in no matter how crappy a capacity to a poor or even non-existent relationship, you’re trying to get them to retract the rejection.
Surprise the ex eum wants me back in a limited capacity because I have been out seeking a rejection retraction so he came up with the terms and conditions in which I could have him and no longer be rejected by him.
He has emailed these to me like a contract I choose if I want to sign or not.
He spoke about how he would like to have a girlfriend, but I could still see him. He would be up front with his girl friend about seeing me and would even orchestrate a meeting between all three of us. These terms are not on the above mentioned contract they are what he has spoken about.
Don’t use ‘rejection’ to make judgements about you, not least because if you’d go to the trouble of taking on the entire blame for something, you’ve already distorted it and thrown away all of your power in that moment.
I have been completely unaware I have done this I have made many a harsh judgement about myself but it not just related to the latest rejection it would be because of the rejection that came before it.
I am so familiar with rejection I often wonder if that is what I enjoy experiencing and seek it out.
Also, often, what you’re trying to get them to retract is your own perception of you
Agreed.
“He spoke about how he would like to have a girlfriend, but I could still see him. He would be up front with his girl friend about seeing me and would even orchestrate a meeting between all three of us. ”
Oh lawd, you had one of those guys too? Mine pulled that bait-and-switch after I’d known him for almost a year, and had been intimate with him for 4-ish months. During all that time, he conveniently neglected to let me know that he is polyamorous. It sure as hell wasn’t in the original Terms and Conditions we’d discussed.
When I finally pulled the truth out of him, after feeling like something just wasn’t right, it was Insta-Flush time. He tried to float back to the surface with the “Let’s be friends” schtick. Oh helllll no! Full NC all the way. Double-flush.
Thank Zeus I’d been a student of BR for about six months, and knew to get the heck outta there rather than stay in and hope he’d change (or that I’d grow to be OK with being one of a harem). Yuck!
Surprise the ex eum wants me back in a limited capacity because I have been out seeking a rejection retraction so he came up with the terms and conditions in which I could have him and no longer be rejected by him. He has emailed these to me like a contract I choose if I want to sign or not.
Where the hell do these guys come from? Made a contract? I’ll bet it was all on his terms too. You can bet there were other people in the picture – there always is.
You got the harem membership package!
Thank you, Tea Cozy
I have been looking into polymorous relationships not that I want one no way just out of curiousity as to what makes a man think he can do this and keep all parties happy.
Tierd, you are so correct the contract is all on his terms of course it is and it is a contract to the harem.
I wrote my post to say to others if you are looking for that rejection retraction you really do end up with less and thats saying something considering there wasn’t really anything there to begin with.
Tulipa
This is like death by a thousand cuts .
Who is this man? He’s shagging around and now you want to find out why as though it’s a fascinating and enlightening exploration of the human psyche. He just wants to stick it in lots of girls. He’s not that special, it’s not that interesting. You made a mistake. Stop trying to rewrite that. When are you going to give it up?
This goes way beyond being rejected. People get rejected all the time and don’t put themselves throught his protracted and fruitless torment.
Cut him off or one day he’ll be married with babies and you’ll be wondering why a married man is contacting you, and wondering, what does it all mean and why didn’t he pick you and what could you have done, and what is his wife like.
This is endless until YOU end it. I’m surprised he hasn’t ended it himself. You must be weaving some kind of magic zhu-zhu to keep him engaged. Redirect those efforts to finding out what your underlying issue is (it’s not him), what you want out of life (it’s not him) and going for it (not him).
But to answer your question – what makes him think he can keep all parties happy?
a) he doesn’t care about all parties, he only cares about himself
b) he thinks so much of himself that all parties are properly grateful and happy to share him
c) he thinks b) because of … all the women like you who are chasing him
Stop stoking his ego. He’s so puffed up I keep looking out of the window expecting him to float by like some chauvinist flying pig.
I actually snorted on my Creme Egg at that last line.
Tulipa, I’m glad this is an old story (although a tad concerned that you went to the trouble of researching polygamy) but you need to cut the cord. When you let go entirely, then you’re free. History has taught you that keeping this man in your life even in a limited capacity does not fizzle it out and is representative of hope, no matter how remote. I cannot say this enough – this man is not going to spontaneously combust into a better man in a better relationship so fear not about cutting him off. He would stick it in a bowl of soup if it was warm and quite frankly, you are waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay better than this. You don’t need the croutons in your life and you don’t need to push yourself as being a potential soup option on the menu.
Tulipa! Don’t tell me this is news and from the same guy from all your posts dating back years! I thought that in the new year you had sworn off this lameness and that you weren’t accepting any contact!
This relates to last year when he blew hotter than the Sahara Desert and as dumb as I have been about this guy even I know I am worth more than some poloyamorous relationship.
Iam going on with my life this year I am not hung up on him so far so good, communication is not completely cut off Im sure it will just fizzle.
As I said this post was more to point out that if you seek that rejection retraction you end up with far less.
Wow i have just recently discovered nat and am glad i did when i stop taking men so seriously like they are the one they need to love me forgetting that if i don’t love me first am wasting my time. This recent guy i was seeing possibly not anymore,well it started with me asking if he was seeing anyone else and what was going on after three months of see each other no sex at this time as i really prefer to know men better , i asked but he denied however later found out he was as i know the person he was seeing not during or ever seen them together but she is someone i see
around i saw a picture of her and so i asked her and she confirmed that they were so i stopped seeing him as am no body’s option. He kept calling and saying it me that he want that that girl is just someone he was seeing the same time as me and he sees nothing wrong with that so i asked can i see other people he said no but he is allowed to the cheek of it made me think this guy really thinks he is that special.i just let the whole thing be and put it down to another waste of time,and move on from it.
Not sure about making them wait long periods (months) of time before sex. If a period of time is going to be taken for sex, then it needs to be only for our benefit not theirs.
You see, if a dating deal has not been signed, it’s very likely that Mr Unavailable is going off and shagging around or progressing other offers on other people. The mistake I think us FBGs make is that we have a telescope on Mr Unavailable and can’t see the wider field- that we are not the only one in the equation and that they’re fielding other offers/opportunities all the time. They’re off shagging other people, passing time, waiting for their moment we open up.
If an assclown is an assclown, or EUM/EUW is an EUM/EUW then whether we make them wait isn’t going to change their fundamental character – it only gives us the chance to detect their EUMness before we sleep with them. I knew the AC in a friends/acquaintance capacity for almost a year. Did that stop them being an AC – no, it didn’t.
tired_of_assanova I know what you mean but I used to think that i should be chosen but reading nat’s article am thinking why should i not be the one choosing who said they are good enough anyway to let them choose me instead of me choosing, and i used to put too much emphasis on the sex but am learning that holding out does not always equal potential for a relationship what if i stop liking them after the sex and all the emotional investment. I think women should start dating like men with more then one potential at a time i think it call hot stove dating or something like that. I like dating one man at a time instead of more then one but i seem to find men that want to date other people as well as me but i only date them.
Been in NC now for a while. Ended a very ill advised relationship after being very publically humiliated and rejected. While I made a few attempts to retract his rejections of me eventually I gave up entirely. He’s no longer a part of my life except for the ruminating that I do and discussing with my friends. I wish I had of stopped flogging the dead horse of our relationship long before I did it would have saved me a lot of time, tears and sleepless nights. It’s so frustrating because if I had’ve listened to me and finished with him when I first felt the urge I’d have avoided so much additional pain. The only thing was was that I was Future Faked so when he did start distancing I found it almost so unbelievable that his attitide towards me had changed so much that it didn’t make sense to end it: “the man of my dreams is in there somewhere, I saw him!” kind of mentality.
It upsets me that some other girl might be now getting the man that I wanted. I felt awful yesterday when a friend (although not too close) commented that he “seemed nice”. It makes me wonder was it all just me.
I have to learn how to trust myself and to just stop. Stop at the first signs of disinterest, stop at the first instances of disrespect, stop when it’s apparent that they don’t care about my feelings. Instead I just go on thinking that I can somehow reverse this.
Not a good day today.
Sarah, I can so relate! “I wish I had of stopped flogging the dead horse of our relationship long before I did it would have saved me a lot of time, tears and sleepless nights. It’s so frustrating because if I had’ve listened to me and finished with him when I first felt the urge I’d have avoided so much additional pain.” And, ” I have to learn how to trust myself and to just stop. Stop at the first signs of disinterest, stop at the first instances of disrespect, stop when it’s apparent that they don’t care about my feelings. Instead I just go on thinking that I can somehow reverse this.”
I can’t even believe what I put myself through – AGAIN! And, the worst part is I know I am the one who behaved badly this last go round and do seem like the crazy one. He actually was very recently showing up in ways I thought I wanted. I just shouldn’t have been there anymore. I had too much upset and anger from the past and too much anxiety waiting for the next act of rejection to restrain myself from acting out at the slightest provocation. I am cringing that I disempowered myself so much by engaging again to get the validation and acting like a crazy person.. I think I may have finally put the final nail in the coffin of this dysfunctional relationship. I am not saying that isn’t a good thing. I just wish I had done things very differently so he couldn’t use it to justify his behavior toward me. There’s an earlier comment on this post – something about how we act the way we do because by the end the situation we’ve stayed in too long really has made us feel crazy. Yep. That’s why going back for the validation crack can’t end well…
Not having a good day thinking about MY bad behavior… At least I have an appt. with my therapist today. Although, I’ll be embarrassed there, too, because last time I was there I was going to go NC from a position of strength. Ugh.
Don’t beat yourself up, Sarah. We all have made the same mistake at one time or another to give someone else the benefit of the doubt. It’s okay; next time, you’ll give yourself the benefit of the doubt instead.
“It upsets me that some other girl might be now getting the man that I wanted.” The man you wanted doesn’t exist. If he did, you’d be together and things wouldn’t have been (reading between the lines) such an emotional roller-coaster.
Have a look back at Nat’s earlier articles, specifically “He’s with someone else – Why her and not me?” and “Do You Have a ‘Not Allowed To Fail’ Mentality To Dating & Relationships?”
Today is a good day. It’s the first day of the rest of your life and you are no longer with someone who wouldn’t know how to value you if their own life depended on it. Be kind to yourself and move on.
“You have better things to do than crawl inside their mind. ”
Man, how often have I spent time trying to do just that. And hard as you try, you never can.
I agree that history tends to repeat itself with a man. BUT – here I am “guardedly” giving a second chance to a man who abruptly dumped me, as I’d discussed here on this site, after his mom passed away and he was bereft. He did invite me over to talk about it (actually making me a decent dinner, and he’s not really a cook, so that was sweet), and indeed seemed a pale version of himself – very sad, etc. – surprisingly sad, for a death that was not a surprise. Said he didn’t really want to break up, but not sure if he were emotionally strong again to be as tight as we’d been. I agreed to “hang on” for a bit. Over the last week +, he’s made some improvements towards his old, recognizable self. Took me out for Valentine’s dinner, wrote me a nice card, is checking in each day by phone, etc. – behaving as he did before the death. For this reason….I think I’ll hang in and watch for the next month or so, and then reassess. Maybe that’s wise, maybe it is dumb. Time will tell. My last boyfriend abruptly disappeared – did not meet with me to discuss – then came back and I took him back and reinvested my emotions – and got burned again. This time, I have not re-invested my emotions – he fell off the soul-mate status I’d put him on, and now is like someone I’m getting to know. I feel I’m in the driver’s seat on behalf of myself. I wrote a brief thing for him on Valentine’s Day indicating that however short or long this is, I hope we both experience the practice of a good relationship, and be utterly open and honest with each other about what’s going on inside of us, both good and bad. He said he liked it, it was wise, and he’d try. If he behaves the same way – abruptly dumping me again, without something to blame it on, then no more will I give second chances – to anyone. I am a slow learner. However – if that were an anomaly, which he can articulate over time (he had tears in his eyes when I told him how much that had hurt me) maybe it is okay. Life is messy and I seem to bungle through it. Some people are emotionally unavailable – I’m probably emotionally overavailable! The good thing is I don’t think I’d be hurt again – I was hurt once, now I’m in a stronger…
Broadsided, sometimes empathy is something that can be hard without the personal experience of a situation, but death of a loved one, surprising or not is very painful and brings with it a myriad of emotions. I’ve often found that people who had some preparation are caught off guard by their grief. My friend has just buried his 26 year old brother. That was a ‘surprise’. Another acquaintance, her mother died on Saturday. It wasn’t a surprise because she had a stroke last year and had been very ill, but it’s her mother and she’s understandably upset.
Compassion is something that is very pivotal at this time – not to excuse anything shady, but to understand why he may not be able for the relationship you have in mind. His mind and his emotions will likely prioritise his grief or try to dodge it – there will be direct repercussions. I appreciate that you have to look out for you but if you choose to continue being with him, you will need to turn up your empathy dial a notch.
It might seem out of place, but this post makes me thing of unavailable relationships in general, and in my case reminds me of a very fragile friendship. That’s bizarre, but I guess that whne we are used to give ina and take from a validation game, the habit can spread to other parts of life as well.
I am so incredibly happy to have found Baggage Reclaim! I have just ended a 4 year relationship. A friend of mine is on Match.com and told me that my boyfriend – who I thought was a serious relationship – had viewed her online profile almost a week earlier and was active within 24 hours. I was incredibly angry, called him and ended it then and there. He responded by saying he “really messed up”, followed by a mushy card, asking me for dinner and emails. The emails were hard to take as there were things like “I didn’t know how you felt about me” (I was the one who said I love you first and he would only do it in response) and was very affectionate with him. He also said that there was a day 6 months ago (6 MONTHS!) that I disappeared for 2 days cleaning my house. Wow. This came out AFTER the incident and I had told him it was over. I am still really confused about the whole thing as I was completely blindsided – in fact I thought we had been getting along better than we had in a while. I don’t even know what to think as I do love him. However, I always had some little niggling in the back of my brain that some things were not right with the relationship and I had seen that he had logged on to Match on his email when we were about 1 1/2 yrs in. He came up with some excuse that they keep sending him emails and it was a stupid thing to do. I so want closure, but would I ever trust anything he would have to say? Would I ever trust him? Arghh!!!!!
Orion
Closure you get for yourself, when you decide enough is enough and step out into your future. Wanting a man to give it to you is an excuse to stay engaged and avoid the loss. You can get stuck for literally years. I don’t know how long this breakup has been but at some point you have to stop returning to the scene of the crime.
Loving someone doesn’t get you a mutual relationship. You can love him as much as you like but they have to love you back. And love isn’t emails or looking for other women.
And, no, you can’t trust him.
Four years, Orion, what more do you need to know?
NML – thank you very much for your response. I do not have much experience with that level of grieving but his was/is profound, as you describe. I have been empathetic and yet have found his behavior hard to interpret – a late night surprise breakup by phone without much explanation etc. Therefore I will just stick to the plan of being supportive, not expecting much emotionally, spending some time with him, and just seeing how it unfolds. I’ve given him countless hugs which seems to be the main thing he needs right
now.
This blog entry came literally right after I ran into a pic of my ex with a new girlfriend. I have been keeping no contact and have had nothing to do with him. Good ol Facebook; what pops up in my news feed? Pictures of an event that I totally did not expect a pic of him to be in! I was just looking through pics and boom! And there she is- standing in my place. In the pic, where she was/what she was doing- that was me! He took her along! It was like a big truck hit me. I was doing fine! Why????? Then, all these feelings come up, like about contacting him, etc. What the hell is wrong with me? My brain knows the horrible way he treated me and the things he did, yet I can romanticize other things about him. I tell myself the truth- which is that he was not that person I met- that wonderful, sweet, gentle person with morals and treated me with so much respect. That was like 20% and only the beginning. The other 80% of our relationship he was cruel, immature, disrespectful, treated me like garbage, lied to me and about me and was a pig of a man. I did the whole potential thing, stayed way too long and screwed my esteem up and all that.
I have learned a lot since then, which I am grateful for – and a lot thanks to this site, but it is still a struggle to build myself back up. I haven’t contacted him. I have now learned enough to recognize I am seeking validation, but this post came at an amazing time. I tell myself to not act impulsively because in the midst of the feelings, it’s hard to not want to act. I ask myself what validation from him would give me? Nothing- because I likely won’t get it, first of all and even if I did, he’s still that assclown and it would be like a temporary selfish thing he would be doing in giving any validation to me.
However, I am freaking out that she is going to get it all. Then I tell myself that a person of his character, that is so selfish, cannot self reflect and thinks it’s everyone else, etc., etc., does not change that fast, if at all. Yet, the fear is still there. Why can’t telling myself this information, that I know, make this feeling go away? I feel very weak right now with this validation issue. How do I validate myself? Just keep telling and repeating to myself the truth about him, tell myself I made the right choice and to be proud that I have no contact with him? Get…
Grace –
“Loving someone doesn’t get you a mutual relationship. You can love him as much as you like but they have to love you back. And love isn’t emails or looking for other women.”
Thank you for the above. I has been almost 6 weeks and he had tried to talk to me but I told him we were done and to not contact me anymore. I am trying to let it go. The hurt is almost levelling me on some days, and I am working on pulling myself out of the hole. I don’t know why this has hit me as hard as it has except that it happened so fast. I liked the analogy of “returning to the crime” – that’s the truth, isn’t it? My heart is a mess, but my head still says no. I am mourning the loss of what could have been and not actually what was.
If I e er saw my ex ever again, I would love to insult him in public. Like he used to do to me. Then maybe everyone won’t think the sun shines out of his ass. As much as I want karma, it never seems to actually happen no matter what.
I can relate!
You’re so right with this. I’m going through it right now. Was dating this guy for a month and he pursued the crap out of me. We talked everyday (though mostly through text…first sign ignored). Then out of the blue he just stopped contacting me. I went crazy trying to figure out what I’d done or said to make him reject me so swiftly as if knowing why he left, or finding a way to talk to him about it and rekindle his desire, would fix things. Well some things don’t need fixing. I have to learn to let them go when they leave. After all, I only want to be with somebody who wants to be with me. Chasing these guys really is about trying to erase the rejection I’m feeling, but when it comes down to it, I just end up giving them more opportunities to reject me. I need to focus on learning how to accept rejection and realize that when jerks like this move on without a word, it’s really a blessing in disguise.
Back in the dating pool again after many years, it’s been so hard for me to deal with the fact that while you may start to invest emotionally in someone, that even after a good amount of time and intimacy between 2 people, it just may not work out and the other person can lose interest, or decide they do not want to go further. I’ve definitely thrown myself under the rejection bus with the same person in attempt to change the outcome-it never worked! I just experienced more pain until I said no more-and cut off contact entirely with the person. Changing one’s mind does not make you a jerk, but it hurts like hell when it’s happening to you and just dropping off instead of giving a decent ending is disrespectful and immature behavior. I’ve been the rejector at times, but experiencing repeated accounts of relationship rejection can make a person go crazy and start wanting to get to the root of the problem, or start chasing after a rejection-retraction as if to help figure it all out.
I am so happy that I found Baggage Reclaim so great for reading when you are feeling low. I as a lot of these women had that rejection from Mr Unavailable and the most difficult part was seeing how he quickly moved on to someone else we both work with doing everything out in the open with her to emphasis that I was everything he was telling everyone. He promised so much and delivered so little then said that he couldnt see a future. Its hard getting that rejection and you find yourself chasing them to retract, change their mind etc but the reality is you are now the woman that he used to complain to you about – the warning signs were there.
I am now really trying to build my life and focus on myself and have found myself really excelling and work and in other areas of my life because of this , with him in the picture I would have just been emotionally and mentally drained.
It is hard to take rejection but sometimes you have to take a step back and ask what exactly am I not getting a liar, a cheat, manipulator. Do you really want that? Its hard and I am struggling myself but these posts really help me so I want to say thank you NML.
Liz
I understand the concept of closing the door to those who don’t add anything to your life so that you may open the door to someone who does–but what happens when the men who keep showing up at your door reject you too?! How much rejection can a woman’s self esteem take before it begins to chip away at you?
This (unfortunately) really reasonated for me, urrgh. Great food for much needed thought!