Every once in a while, I like to revisit the subject of lazy communication because I hear and read about so many people making excuses for why they’re reliant on texting (or emailing/instant messenger/Facebook) instead of picking up the phone and having face-to-face interaction. If I’m to believe everyone that engages in lazy or should I say crumb communication, they (or the people they’re getting it from) are The Busiest People in the Universe.
Now while the telephone has undergone many transformations since it was originally invented in 1876 and we no longer have to go through a convoluted operator process or use a rotary dial (well unless you have one of those very cool ‘retro’ phones) plus you can ‘carry’ them with you wherever you go, in essence, the telephone is still the telephone. After face-to-face communication, it’s still a great and next best form of connected contact with another person.
Now just in case anyone has any doubts as to the ease of making a call, you pick up your phone, either key in your number, navigate to your phonebook and search for the name, select from recently dialled numbers, or even from your favourites. You then press on the green button with a telephone on it, it rings, the other person picks up and says hello, you respond, and hey presto you’ve made a telephone call and you have the beginnings of a conversation. This could all happen in about 5-30 seconds unless you’re really labouring over it. It may come as surprise to some of you but your phone (and theirs) has a call function on it.
Millions, in fact billions of people are still making calls every day, so why are we making so many excuses for the commitment dodging, intimacy afraid, no telephone call making, text messaging lovers of this world?
How have so many people managed to convince themselves that there’s a revolution in communication taking place that means that you can actually believe you’re in a relationship with someone who lives in the same postcode/area code as you and slips you dinner, drinks, and a shag periodically but they rarely, if ever pick up the phone? Yes really. I’ve heard from far too many readers that are struggling to get over someone that they were with for anything from a few weeks to several years who they only spoke with on the phone occasionally. What the what now?
Text messages are for quick, no frills communications and greetings that sandwich around actual calls and face-to-face.
I’m thinking reminders to get milk, letting one another know that you’re on the way, you’re running five minutes late, that you’re home, that you had a great time, that you tried to call and to call you back when you’re free, you’re going into a meeting but looking forward to catching up later, goodnight, good morning and yes, even the odd dirty text if that’s what floats your boat.
They are quite frankly a crap substitute for human interaction where you see facial expression, body language, tone etc. If you’re happy with text messages it’s like saying “I’m a teenager with hardly any minutes on my phone” or “I like crumbs of pseudo attention”. Text messages should be your minority form of communication – if it’s the majority, you can be assured that there are other signs that all is not well.
Now some of you may think I’m harsh because you’ve either been 1) making copious excuses for why someone only texts you and won’t pick up the damn phone or is only texting when they want a shag/ego stroke/shoulder to lean on/money etc or 2) because you’ve convinced yourself that you are busier than everyone else and too busy to make phone calls.
The truth is, they’re just not that special and you’re not that busy. Really. Whether you’re making excuses for them or you, it’s time to ask yourself how you ever really expect to have a relationship that can grow?
If you’re too busy to pick up the phone, you’re too busy for a relationship. As in a real, healthy, connected, intimate, mutually fulfilling relationship with all the landmarks.
You like it surface. If you’re the one who loves the texting, you’re trying to have it on your terms and put out a little to get a lot. If you’re the one that’s being managed by text, you’re getting sold on words while building a sandcastle in the sky. This is a fantasy.
It actually often takes more time to write a text than it does to make a phone call. I’ve often found myself rereading, shortening etc and that’s just with friends! Romantic relationships involve analysing their texts and analysing and rewriting your own responses. Do I sound too desperate?Do I sound too excitable?
Ever been stuck in a long drawn out ping pong of texts/emails/IM? Jaysus! A phone call would have done and dusted the conversation in minutes!
Texting is too ambiguous, non committal, and yes, sometimes a tad juvenile. It is the mainstay of the unavailables of this world – beware! Distant communication from people that like to be emotionally distant.
How to deal with lazy communication? Be up front – “I’m not a texting person so it’s best to catch me on this number during the day and this number in the evening” or when they send that first text, reply and add “OK and give me a call later and we can catch up then”. If they text and you don’t respond, they then know why – because you said to call or you said that you’re not a texting person. You can also call them when they text.
In olden times, which is barely a decade ago, people picked up the phone to make a first date and beyond. One word: E.F.F.O.R.T. You are not textforbooty.com or textalastminutedate.com or instantegostroketextservice.com or even moneyinminutesbytext.com.
Start as you mean to go on – don’t let your relationship be managed by text because you’ll end up all on their distant and very shady terms and there is no point trying to close the door after the horse has bolted as you’ve already shown you’re OK with crumb communications.
If they refuse to call, don’t try to waste your time teaching them – they haven’t just come out of the womb into 2011. They’re saying “I don’t have time to call you for even one minute but I have time to tap out some piddling text”. Buh-bye.
When someone wants to call, they call.
Some will chance their arm because they’re used to getting away with it in other relationships – they don’t with you – You’re not that woman or that guy which means they have to step or, or ship the hell out. It’s up to you to uphold your standards and not pander to standards that they’re used to from others who may have less.
You want a relationship, not a permanent date or repetitive strain injury from tippy tapping all the time. You want to be able to pick up the phone, to get a call, to not be waiting around and to feel like your contact is building and of course, hear their voice. Always remember: crumb communications equals crumbs of attentions equals you being left ‘hungry’ in the relationship. Go and get ‘fed’ by someone that wants to engage with you.
Your thoughts?
Check out my ebooks the No Contact Rule and Mr Unavailable & The Fallback Girl and more in my bookshop.
Image Source: David Biase SXC
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Its like two cans and a string…
lol June
Does that really work? I wondered if it did.
Only if you wrap the string firmly enough around his neck …
That picture just made me choke on my Diet Coke. Hilarious! I think the term “managed by text” is incredibly apt too – interesting how some of these guys are stomping over our boundary lines left, right and center and yet…try stepping over theirs and you can just picture them doing the Whitney Houston, “Awww, hell to the no.” I felt very “managed” at the end (aka, when the hot tap turned off) in my last debacle with the ex-AC and I learned that in no healthy relationship is it like one of those History Channel war documentaries where you’re an army troop strategizing and, in some cases, fighting tooth and nail to gain 3 square feet of territory. Ladies, quit the spy games, lay down your arms and find somewhere wide open, free and far away from the Assclown Desert!
Hi-larious and brilliantly put. I had to tell a reader over the weekend – this isn’t dog training! It’s not that they can’t call it’s that don’t want to. Put down our arms indeed! You could never feel comfortable with someone you have to force to call/shag/marry you etc. Forcing/convincing ain’t sexy!
That is precisely why General Natasha is reeeeeeeeetired! If my stubborn bulldog puppy could figure out within a week of training that if he pees on the floor, he doesn’t get a treat…a man who’s past 30 does not need to be told that if he doesn’t use the phone in it’s purest form, he doesn’t get laid.
Natasha – I love it.
Yes, the War doco imagery made me have a good giggle. Thanks Natasha! (I also cringe when I think of how I didn’t just drop the weapons and walk off the poppy field when I sensed that there was a war going on, and that there were actually weapons strapped to me! Oh well, at least I didn’t go back!)
Glad you enjoyed ladies 🙂 Elle, I cringe when I think of how I’d sit around thinking deep thoughts and strategizing whether or not I should even be involved/what he was going to do next/how to keep the “hot” tap on/how to minimize the collateral damage should it go wrong yet again. I mean, all of that for…A DUDE. Mind you, we are talking a dude who had actled like an ass on numerous previous occassions. CRINGE. Good for you for not going back my dear! Leave the jackasses to throw their bombs and then dive into their foxholes to dodge the responsibility…we are out of the damn bunker and in a much better place haha!
Yep. This is definitely a post worth making NML. I am of the generation where using a mobile phone is still a little unfamiliar. The 21st century is riddled with information pollution. I remember the days in my teens and twenties when my boyfriend would call me up and talk for hours – my mother would scream at me to get off that blinkin’ phone and that she hoped I hadn’t made the call cos – wait till you see the phone bill!
My EUM did phone me, sometimes – when he had something HE wanted to chat about. It was his conversation1 Other than that he texted. Always. And I hated it. I knew what it meant. It made me sooo mad. Funny, when I met him neither of us had a mobile phone, so he’d come by or he’d use a phone call… didn’t last long – he started with the emails. It was email all the way. Until he got a mobile phone. He always said he’d never get a mobile phone cos he hated them and would hate to be ‘available’ to all and sundry all the time. I remember telling him that you can just turn them off – he liked that idea. He did get one, as everyone did… and he quickly realised he was in EU heaven!! Total control of the level and nature of engagement. It was the bain of my life – his bloody texting.
One of the last times I heard from him, my landline phone rang. It was him. Big surprise. I’m thinking somebody must’ve declared world war three. Then he said he’d tried to text but he couldn’t get a signal so he had to call… what an insult! And I felt it. Arse.
You are soo right NML; he was the busiest man in the universe… too busy to be bothered engaging with me… too busy for a relationship… too sick.. too busy.. have a meeting… am swamped with work. Pah! I knew it. I knew everything you say here in this post. I didn’t want to do anything about it though. I do NOW!!
Fearless, my ex-AC was the same way, i.e. he found the time to pick up the phone when he wanted me to listen to his vast litany of (entirely self-created) problems. One night he got spectacularly intoxicated and called me repeatedly at 4am until I woke up and answered. Naturally, I was worried beyond belief thinking something terrible happened! What was this terrible crisis, you ask? He missed his old job. I kid you not. His. Old. Job. That he left voluntarily at least four years ago. Why did he miss it so? It was a much bigger ego boost than his current one. I would have LOVED to have seen what would have happened if I drunk dialed him repeatedly in the middle of the night to talk about that haha! Then, I’m sure, I would have been told….that I’m needy 😉
Fearless, does “too busy” equal “EUM”? Loved the pic EUM/AC Phone Home. That pic said it all for me. Nice play Nat, but your younger readers may not know the analogy with ET. Shoot many of my students don’t know “Leave it to Beaver” when there was one phone with a curly cord and a TV with an actual off/on button and a channel changer with 3 stations. And males either had to call on the one phone with a curly cord or show up at the doorstep. Don’t mean to sound like a fuddy duddy here.
I think you nailed it there Fearless – all on his terms. When *he* had something to talk about, when *he* wanted something. That’s not communication – that’s using. Or he’s communicating that he has a solo agenda.
You know the best part of coming here to read this site and more so the comments is… I could have written it myself. I just recently wrote about something similar happening in my life with a man I met online dating, he only texted me – even when I explained I would like a phone call instead! I dropped that situation right fast.
But reading the comments above, I could have written them.
My ex-EUM was the same. Always drunk calling me at 2-4 am to talk about his life crisis after a night at the bar. When we were together and even after we were not, the only time he called was to complain about his life and how hard done by he thinks he is.
Thank goodness we no longer speak at all. We have a kid together, the only communication we have is email to firm up agreements to do with the kid, that’s it. Thank goodness.
In fact, the last time he dared call me drunk at 4 am, was earlier this year in January. He had the nerve to wake up me and my 1 year old daughter, to inform me that his latest conquest had called the cops on him for something (which he said he didn’t do anything of course) and he was calling me to do damage control because he was so fearful of what it would do to his access to my daughter!!!!!
I put him in his place and he no longer calls me for any thing at all. I am not his friend and if he is still the type of moron that goes out gets loaded with his girlfriend and does something that makes her call the cops on him… I don’t give a toss.
Funny enough, he is the only one I really have a text only relationship with, and that is merely to text to say, ‘we are leaving’ (to drop off my daughter on his visit days) or ‘are you on your way’ to pick her up. Or my favorite ‘did she poop today when she was with you?’ LOL I actually am glad we have only this little contact!
Barabara, I feel you! The crazy part of it is if you ask them for advice on anything/want to talk…*crickets*. A few weeks after that incident, I asked mine for some advice (It was 2pm. I was completely sober.) on a work issue and his response was, “Hmm. Yeah.” If it wasn’t so insulting, I would have been rolling on the ground laughing, it was that ridiculous! This is why people afflicted with I Have My Head Wedged Up My Own Ass Syndrome (IHMHWUMOAS, for short) are just not good partners…especially if they are inebriated as well. On a happier note, your daughter is beautiful 🙂
Of course Nat, the entire relationship was ONE-SIDED. On every level – not just communication. He had and still has nothing to offer me that I need – everything is always all about him him him.
Thank you I think my daughter is amazing.
Accidentally getting pregnant was the best remedy for that bad relationship too, as the day I told him I was pregnant, was the day the relationship ended.
It was the first and only time he was ever honest with me about his true feelings, he asked me to get an abortion because, and I quote, “He only wanted to have a child with a woman he was married to, and he only wanted to marry a woman he was in love with and that was NOT me.”
OUCH eh? Believe me it took me a long time to heal from that blow! But my daughter is a miracle as I was not supposed to be able to conceive, and I feel blessed by her. If I have to deal with that douchebag the rest of her life, so be it. I have developed the strengths to deal with his behaviours and the best part is I truly don’t give a toss about him. I treat him all business, and that is that. I wish I could be no contact completely but it is not possible, I just don’t let him treat me the way he did. Whenever he tried I’d just say don’t you have a girlfriend to lay your bullshit on now instead of me? LOL
Dig your IHMHWUMOAS note, that is so him.
Barbara, I am so happy for you that you’ve found a way to coparent with him – seriously, I can imagine the work it took on your part to get there! I love how these AC’s display such blatant jerk-off-ish-ness and yet, bless their hearts, they have it in their heads that when the Perfect Woman/Love comes along…they’ll be pefect partners. Something tells me they will all be in for a long wait! I totally agree, let them drunk dial whoever they are currently sleeping with/driving to distraction. In some ways, it’s a blessing that they act as badly as they do, otherwise we might all be taking longer to see the light. Congratulations again on that gorgeous girl of yours 🙂
Runner: “Fearless, does “too busy” equal “EUM”?
I think so. They are always too something, that’s all know! Mine was always too “busy” or ” feeling sick”. He always prepared the way for himself not to have to contribute much by talking on and on about how much work he had on right now – how he’d need to work all summer, all over Christmas, all over Easter (all over everything really) on such and such a project or publication if he was to meet his deadlines… and how it was terrible and how he didn’t know how he’d manage to complete it all, but what could he do, he’d just need to knuckle down and get it done and all how he’s going to stop taking on all these projects… blah blah (he never did stop). My heart would sink when he told me all this because I knew not to expect to see of hear much from him for the next x number of weeks or months – I used to wonder if he was telling me it all deliberately so he could stay away if he felt like it and also manage my expectations – I could never be sure if I was being cynical or suspicious in thinking that or if he just didn’t know how it was making me feel; but anyway, as bad as I felt I also got to feel sorry for him cos he’d be exhausted trying to meet all those (self-imposed, btw) effin deadlines!
I must have been clean off my head. WTF was I thinking.
Fearless, we must have been thinking the same thing, whatever that was! Actually, I’m kinda glad the ex and were talking on the phone or email when he started the monologue about how busy he was going to be this week, weekend, month, year, or whatever as I’d roll my eyes and think blah, blah, blah. Same story different day. I had the same experience of wondering if I was being too cynical and then feeling badly because he was sooo busy. By the end, my favorite response was “yeah you work and then you die. Hopefully, there is something in between.”
I had the same filller Tesco (we call it Costco)/walking down the street phone calls you refered to in your previous post. Even though he did call frequently, it was always on his way to something else. Made me feel like shite too. Like I was filler. Good for you not waiting around for his call and walking away. Seeing is believing.
In any event when I did my boundaries and Unsent Letter to Daddy, “too busy” came up for me as a red flag. Growing up, my father was always “too busy” for me too. Thus, I know I’m still trying to right that childhood injury. I’m thinking that if a guy starts telling me how busy he is…I’ll run. He can just work and then die.
“…I used to wonder if he was telling me it all deliberately so he could stay away if he felt like it and also manage my expectations…” I thought the same thing. I guess we have our answer now. They were doing just that.
I am reminded of a book, What Men Want. It is written by professional men, for women. A tell all so to speak. Here is what they say about “communication crumbs”
“No matter what, if we like a woman, we will call her within a week and most likely in th next two or three days. If you don’t get a call within a week, forget him!”
“If he calls after a week or a month later, he’s most likely looking to get laid. Beware”
“If he calls just to chat and he doesn’t ask you out, he’s either changed his mind about you for some reason or he’s stringing you along until he’s board and looking for a quick fix.”
Good advise if you ask me. SoCalSingleGal
“If he calls just to chat and he doesn’t ask you out, he’s either changed his mind about you for some reason or he’s stringing you along until he’s board and looking for a quick fix.”
—- So true! I allowed this to carry on with my last EUM for several months. Part of me realized that this was the case. No one on earth is that busy, especially after several months, where all they can do is call or text but never make any solid plans. I knew this rationally, but persisted with this man, time and again allowing him to reject me directly and indirectly over and over. I am so upset at myself for this! It seems so obvious, apparent and easy looking at it now, but at the time I was grasping at straws, steeped in denial, seeing the truth and talking myself out of it so that I could continue in a hopeless situation.
Now I’m getting angry all over…not at him but myself for being desperate and ridiculous. I wish I could go back, oh well, I no longer speak to him and that makes me feel good. He occasionally reaches out and tries to act hurt that I no longer speak to him but IDGAF! I should have done it long ago and I feel good that I am now and will NEVER allow myself to be fed crumbs again.
texting is lazy but a thoughtful email is lovely. I like emailing personally and don’t think there’s anything lazy about it. I think the crux of the matter is whether or not you feel comfortably picking up the phone and calling him. If you don’t, then there’s something wrong. I use the phone to make arrangements, not for long chats. Those I prefer to do face to face. Emails are different – and I have found that if a man takes the time to share his thoughts properly on ‘paper’ you learn a lot and then there is more to talk about when you meet face to face. I don’t like trivial conversation – I have always found that men who like to phone tend to whitter on about nothing in particular and that bores me.
Maybe the writing thing is to do with my age – 55. When I was young writing was the most romantic thing you could do.
Yes, Raven, there’s nothing wrong with emails and texts. But these have to be *as well as* being there not *instead of* being there. The EU person uses texts and emails as a relationship avoidance tactic.
I’d be happy with no phone call, no text, no email – just bloody well BE there! Be around. Be available.
I’ve had wonderful, long interchanges via E mail with good friends, and informative and romantic e mails with guys I’m seeing. I think what is being talked about here are very brief E mails that have no substance and are a replacement for interaction. The EUM I was dating rarely wrote more than a sentence at a time. In fact, the first time he broke up with me was by E mail. (After our last date, he said he’d call the next day, as usual, but did not. Three days later he E mailed, “I’m too busy to see you any more.” Just like that. I then called him to say, huh?, and he did not answer the phone.)
I agree Fearless lol!
My last EUM texted me often and called…but he was still essentially UNAVAILABLE! In the 6 months or so of us “talking”….that’s all it was, just talking. I can count the times I saw him face to face and we never actually went on a real date! He was always too busy or some misfortune always befell him why we couldn’t actually hang out in person but he had the time for texting and calls. I think he mostly called to pass the time when he was at work and then texted in between smh. I was not happy with it, but kept making excuses for him ,although it was suspicious and my gut was telling me it was off, until overtime it became painfully obvious that he was a lazy communicator and was not interested in building a real relationship. I thankfully found this site that helped me to cut it off with him, as when I saw in black and white what was happening it was hard to ignore.
I love reading emails and writing them, love waking up to a text or getting a nice one throughout the day from the man I am with, but as you said, that should not be the main mode of communication and especially if there are no consistent actions showing you’re invested, then even phone calls make no difference.
MissE, same here, mine lived less than 45 minutes away and often made the trip on errands, but only a few times in a over an entire year to see me! I am embarrassed to admit the number. Okay, here it is, three times. Twice was to get laid. He did make a few other dates that he cancelled last minute because of some current misfortune, like you say. With detailed convoluted explanations and extra time on the phone. The phone calls? Oh, sure, he called almost nightly and would spend hours on the phone. Time he could have used to drive over and actually be with me. Talking about controlling, managing, and a colossal intimacy phobia. Once he started the ‘friends foremost’ talk, fine, I get it; but back when according to him we were ‘lovers’ starting on a ‘romantic affair’ — really?!
I’m so embarrassed that it took me a year to get that it wasn’t EVER going to progress. And it’s taken another year to stop feeling angry, humiliated, foolish, naive, not to mention friggin’ gypped! Argh.
grace — re: a way with words, my EUA (remember? A is for academic) read to me of course over the phone, his favorite passage by Proust that never failed to get a woman into his bed at grad school. By the way, I can see why — it was a choice paragraph. I would have been glad to comply too at the time, but he was intent on keeping me at a comfortable distance in the next area code. He couldn’t have women over at mom’s house, you see.
sigh.
what was I thinking.
Cavewoman, I will share in your embarrassment. Thanks for sharing as I too have been in the almost EXACT scenario, but was too ashamed to admit it myself. Mr.EUM and I were “talking” for 6/7 months, he lives about 20 mins away and I saw him 5 times, 2 of which were to get laid as well. I felt great that I didn’t sleep with him until after 3 months ; however, I was under the delusional that that would help our relationship, but we had no real relationship, so regardless of if I waited 3 months or 3 years, I was still having sex with a man who was not making any type of commitment to me!
Like yours he called often and we had brilliant conversations that were mind-sex but that’s about as far as his efforts went and like yours, everytime we were to go out, even on my birthday when he promised, mysteriously he “fell asleep” (wtf HOW LAME!), his car was at the shop, he got stuck somewhere, he left his phone locked in his car, he has a migraine and the list goes on. I got mad on several occasions and realized that these were lame and lies, and if not lies, they showed extreme disinterest…but I would always cry wolf. I would be upset, he would suck up or pay me a visit and then all would be forgiven. SMH….I am nauseated at this. I can’t even imagine what he thinks of me, although I don’t really care but it does irk me to think that I allowed myself to be played for a fool. What’s done is done though and the realization strengthens my resolve to NEVER allow that to occur again.
I love that – EUA (for academic). That was mine! Knew everything about books and nothing about life – nothing. He does “words” for a living, but I couldn’t get one sensible word out of him when it came to our “relationship” – it was like talking to a child or to a wall (child was as good as it got!). Weird.
I’m with Fearless, Kay and MissE. A well thought out letter that communicates something is one thing. But that’s not what this post is about, it’s about the trend for these EU’s who use their texty/chatty devices to avoid engaging us on a personal level.
Maybe next year they can just roll out a new robot to set up the date, take us out, wine and dine us, and bring us back to the EU’s house so he can have sex with us.
*choking with laughter* – now entering as one of my favourite comments of all time!
lol awesome! Yes I really think that arrangement would work out just fine for some of these EU’s.
Oh yes, the brush with the MM was completely text-based. At first I felt sorry for him (ha ha) that he had to settle for texts rather than seeing me in person. Then I realised it was EXACTLY how he wanted it. And, to be fair, it was how I wanted it too, because I didn’t want him to leave his wife and I didn’t have sex with him. It’s ridiculous to me that he (and me if I’m to be honest) was willing to jeopardise his marriage over texts. And to those who would describe it is an “emotional” affair, that would be over-egging it. It wasn’t emotional it was juvenile and silly. Still dangerous mind, I had anxiety and depression over it. And if his wife had seen his texts she would not have been happy.
Years ago, when mobile phones were just starting to become popular (and I didn’t have one), a friend of mine was being texted by some bloke. I finally yelled “Why he doesn’t he just ask you out?” Ah, it’s so clear when it’s happening to someone else.
I find myself heavily reliant on texting now because everyone else is. I used to spend hours chatting on the phone to friends and family but alas no more. But at least I actually see my friends and family, and they don’t use me. With an EUM, you can literally go days/weeks/months on nothing but texts while he pops up every now and then for sex. Hell, even years.
As for emails, that can be slightly dangerous too. If you can’t say it to their face, is it really worth saying? It’s a useful adjunct but dont’ be reliant on it. Same with letters, years ago a MM seduced me by letter. He was a writer. If it wasn’t for those damn letters he wouldn’t have stood a chance!
Nothing beats face to face. Otherwise we wouldn’t have an airline industry.
“Maybe next year they can just roll out a new robot to set up the date, take us out, wine and dine us, and bring us back to the EU’s house so he can have sex with us.”
—- LMAO! Could you imagine…rotflmao.
haha I know 🙂 Sad thing is it isn’t very far at all from how I felt with the texter-dude.
MissE – up thread- I wasted a lot of time trying to recreate his justifications in his mind… maybe they don’t know how to say no, the real truthful big No instead of the stupid little fabrications. (He was a bullshitter anyway he couldn’t help himself, he actually uttered the following: “I practice a sort of Foucaultian veridiction” only an over-educated expert-rationalizing bullshitter would be moved to say something so pretentious. Even quoting him makes *me* feel pretentious. Don’t laugh at me please.) They don’t know how to extricate themselves out of the situation. They were procrastinating because they couldn’t think of anything so horrendous about us that would warrant dumping us… shirking commitment goes hand in hand with shirking responsibility… boundary busting aside though, he laid out all the information an adult woman needs to draw her own conclusions. I wasn’t able to take responsibility for myself either. He was vaguely concerned about what he and the arrangement he got me into was doing to me in my somewhat fragile state (this was during my divorcing year) but cutting me off might have created a worse scene, right?
Thinking for someone else instead of ourselves is dumb. We are responsible for our own well being. No one will come right out and say “Look, at the end of the day I’m simply doing this because I can and I enjoy using you for the ego boost (plus phone sex) and evidently you don’t mind that much, ’cause you’re going along with it”. He did call me ‘nice’ and even naive a few times and I knew that’s what he had in mind but still I stayed, because let’s face it — I thought I was that desperate. Thinking so makes it so. Only thinking so makes it so.
raven, I too remember love letters. Miss them.
I couldnt agree more. I remember going on years ago, how I accepted crap text messaging when the guy said he wasnt a phone person, I should have hung him up right there but my naiveness and self esteem weren’t empowered at that time. Recently, a few months ago after I specifically spelled out a guy to call me, he sent a text, then I told him to call, he called and left a msg, I called him back and left him a message, then the next day on a weekday, around two I get a text “what are you up to?”… I mean, I don’t know maybe working… Lol needless to say I never responded. I will NEVER subject myself to poor coomunication like that, I know my value now I’m older, wiser, have been on your site,and focusing on being my best self.
Gina it’s craziness! I also had an ex like that. What happened to the time when conversations were the norm?
But this type of behavior may really be a blessing for us, they don’t want to ‘talk’ with us, in other words, they don’t want to get to know us! Good info to have, bye!
I guess we can give them a chance, like you did, but then if they won’t pick up the bat and play all we can do is walk away, and wait for a better man who actually wants to get to know us.
Perhaps you were hasty to ‘what are you up to’ – rigid standards intially may not get you a man for long. You cannot hasten intimacy. Never say never. Texting can go hand in hand with other forms of communication.
Tina, “Perhaps you were hasty to ‘what are you up to’”
I don’t understand that sentence, but as far as being too rigid, I disagree. My ex-texter and I dated two months and in that time he never phoned me once. Then during dates he barely talked at all. I did try to make conversation. He used to text me mid week with, “what are you up to” Actually I was up to a whole lot, and it would’ve been nice to have HIM to *TALK* to about it. But he made sure that was impossible by texting the question. If he really wanted to know ‘What are you up to?” then he would have phoned me so I could actually answer the question.
Him, “what are u up to” or “hows ur week been”
me “good and u”
him,”so can i see u this wknd?”
me, “sure hows sat?”
him, “ok just let me no what time”
Then he’d pick me up Saturday, we’d go out somewhere, not talk much, though I tried to make conversation. Then the date would be over and that was it. No conversation. And I wouldn’t hear from him Til Wednesday when he would text ‘what are u up to”. oooh feel the romance.
He’s the one who started calling us boyfriend and girlfriend, he’s the one who brought me to meet his family, his friends. Yet after two months he knew my name, address, and phone number. That’s it.
Everything that had been happening in my life was completely unknown to him, he didn’t care to find out at all. All my likes and dislikes, accomplishments, struggles, hobbies, the things I wanted to do. He doesn’t know anything about me at all. He never made the effort.
In contrast, he was more than willing to spend time and effort ‘getting to know’ women (taken women, or women who are otherwise not a match for him) he actually respects and is interested in, such as his married, ugly, loudmouth ‘best friend’.
I’ve never heard before that expecting a man to phone you is ‘rushing intimacy’. It’s called a conversation. Since when do couples go out for months or years, rarely have a conversation, and if one member wishes one would participate in conversations, they’re ‘rushing intimacy’?
I have to admit to snorting with laughter reading your comment Mel. It’s a bang on assessment of things. Fact is that men are not pets or children, nor does the sun shine out of their arses.
E.F.F.O.R.T
Let me say again – the telephone had been around for well over 200 years. Nothing wrong with texting in addition to phone effort but the fact is, if that lazy mofo was dating you about 13 years ago, he’d have had to pick up the damn phone.
You’re not basil that needs to be watered just as you’re drying out.
You’re a person with feelings and needs who is valuable and worthwhile and as women in particular, we need to stop bowing to the species with a penis.
“Oh no! I asked him to call me instead of texting – maybe I scared him off!” purlease!
“… nor does the sun shine out of their arses.”
I. LOVE. IT. Seriously, I was just having a convo with one of my girlfriends last night about how somehow things have gotten so twisted that a lot of us have it in our heads that we’re supposed to be kowtowing to men, because GOD FORBID one of them gets away. It’s not doing anything for the men out there that are already prone to Gross Ego Inflation, best believe. Not to go off topic, but that’s why I never really felt that He’s Just Not That Into You was very empowering. THIS blog is empowering, because it’s about finding your self esteem, your power, your value and, as a result, better relationships – not about reading an entire book (and seeing a MOVIE. Oh. My. God. a freakin’ movie) that’s all “He doesn’t like you.” I get that part of the message was “If he doesn’t call, he doesn’t like you, but you can do better anyway.”, but I think for ladies with boundary/self esteem issues, it’s digging the hole deeper…and I hate to say this, but I kind of cringe at the idea that men are now well aware that zilllllllllions of women made this a bestseller/blockbuster. I think I wouldn’t have cringed so hard if it was called, “He’s Not Worth Your Time, Therefor You Are No Longer Into Him And You Also Have Better Shit To Do With Your Precious Time Than Worry About Why He Sucks.”
(Natalie)
“You’re not basil that needs to be watered just as you’re drying out. You’re a person with feelings and needs who is valuable and worthwhile and as women in particular, we need to stop bowing to the species with a penis.”
I f***ing LIVE. Truth & comedy.
Natasha, I have a different take on the He’s Just Not That Into You series. I think it is empowering to women, and it’s a definite big step in the right direction sending the message that we shouldn’t be chasing after men who aren’t that interested in us, shouldn’t be chasing after men at all.
It just doesn’t go into the level of detail that Natalie’s blog and books go into. Nonetheless the concept is an empowering message to women. The movie was empowering too. It showed a lot of women who found themselves with sub-par men but in the end, the women got wise and didn’t settle for it. That’s a good message to women in my book. The movie even showed a man who had his hopes on a woman who wasn’t that into him, in the end he realized it, and found someone who was into him.
I’d say Greg Behrendt’s HJNTIY shines a candle on the issues, whereas Natalie shines the power of the sun. That doesn’t make what he has to say less true or empowering. And honestly not everyone is prepared to analyze issues very deeply and for those, simplifying things is a helpful first step.
Mel, I love your take on it – definitely much more reasonable than mine haha! I think I just really disliked the title 😉
Oh my hell! I hate texting – quick “k” or running late fine but screw that. I don’t text mega long message nor do I read them – hell I don’t even listen to voice mail. I have a flip phone = thats right enough technology already. It rings I answer it – if someone leaves a message I just check missed calls and call back or texts – unless its “running late” I call.
Once told a guy ” I will not come lay down my heart for a asshole who won’t even pick up a phone – Alfys doesn’t magically know you want a pizza and show up ya know – ya gotta call” Not surprising that turd got flushed!
Thank you so much Nat! I haven’t been on here as much lately but guess what…I met the twin of the EUM I dated for most of last year! (a woman – I’m bi). I knew that she was like him in a few ways and yup, relied on texting.
The kicker is, even when I was telling her I didn’t want to see her anymore – after only a month and a half – it was all by text on her end! I managed to leave her a phone message but she didn’t *call* back, she just pelted me with questions and ??? by phone. Arrgh.
I’ve learned my lesson Nat and this fantastic post drives it home – I promise to never engage in this type of crap communication again!
With my ex-Narc AC, he actually kept a tally of how many times he called me vs. I called him…I’ll admit I didn’t call as much as he did, but it felt like he was just keeping score and I grew to resent it. I am pretty old school, so in the beginning, I like to be “courted” and let the guy “chase”, as it were. Sad thing is, as soon as I stopped running, he sucked the life out of me.
I think that this post probably applies equally to both romantic relationships and platonic friendships. I received an email recently from a chick friend of mine explaining that she was too busy to call me or accept my calls, but yet still has the time to send me texts. Its amazing how little time I have for her in my life after being on the receiving end of that kind of communication.
Cheers.
Magdalene yes I just posted about that too. I know seems like it’s not just our ‘would-be-suitors’ who are falling apart our friends too. Now I haven’t had my friends come out and say what your friend said!! (Can’t BELIEVE she said that!!) I think your response is correct!
But yes I’ve had them be shockingly rude to me lately in their newfound ‘UtraImportant-Busyness’ and I do think that these new forms of communication are at the root of it.
One of my friends when I asked her for a scrap of empathy after my breakup, retorted back with a curt “Me, Me, Me I’m So Busy My Problems Are More Important Than Yours I Don’t Have Time For Your Problems..” text. And STILL did not acknowledge my feelings regarding my breakup. Crazy. And this was someone I thought was very sweet and nice. Only on the surface level I guess. I’d known her over 20 years!
Anyway my reaction to that was delete her off my facebook and forget about her because she showed me clearly she wasn’t a friend at all.
Same thing happened to me. Went home for Xmas for over 3 weeks. Was friends with this woman since college. She’d done/said so many shady things throughout the so-called friendship, but with my no-self-esteem & negative expectations, guess who stayed friends with her? 😐 Anyway, went home for 3 weeks and she KNEW I was home. She sent me a message on Facebook asking me to call her. Mind you, I’M the one who moved very far away. Wrote back for her to call ME. She never called. Blocked her for good & filtered her e-mail address such that anything from her e-mail address is automatically deleted.
(Unfortunately, LinkedIn won’t allow me to block/delete anyone, so she’s still connected to me on there, but it’s extremely rare that I even sign into that account so oh well.)
Since right prior to my move, I can’t be bothered with fairweather friends anymore. Moving definitely shows one how people can truly be. The good thing is that it gives room for the possibility of real friendships.
I have to admit I never thought about texting as a lazy way to communicate not until I found this web site, texting suits me and when I look at why it is because you feel protected by a screen you don’t have to risk rejection via the phone. I can see now it is lazy and a way to be emotionally distant and I am working on changing this.
The last EUM and he was EU used to tell me off for texting and tell me it was a lazy way to communicate and he would call and usually only text to tell me he would get back to me when he could. Now it seems texting me is the way to go not many texts but personal things that he would normally never text so I see it as fishing texts since we have been out of communication for a while. A little hypocritical on his part really.
Another ex would always have an argument via text, I hated that I do think that is cowardly and if I have something to say that isn’t nice or may lead to an argument I always say it to their face, so he would send the nasty text and I would call and call and he would never pick up and I used to be fuming thinking what a coward to say nasty things via text but not to me in person so I could defend myself.
My ex was the opposite of this.. he absolutely LOVES to talk on the phone.. but it’s because he has to have an audience. He just loves to talk.. and talk.. and talk.. and never sees the clues that other people would like to participate.. or leave the room lol. I’m pretty sure it’s the only reason he went to therapy was to have a new audience member.
Yes my previous boyfriend before the texter regularly phoned me up but he was otherwise emotionally unavailable and had real issues.
I guess we must be careful not to be so grateful for a guy who will finally have a phone call with us, that we fail to look at their other qualities or lack thereof 🙂
It’s an all round mix Carrie and Mel – textaholics come with plenty of other stuff to query so it’s not a case of ditching someone for texting. They’re not ‘present’ – they’re distracted and distant. Incidentally, just looking for someone to call you doesn’t mean anything either. Landmarks!
Carrie: The on-and-off man from high school (I’ll just call him The Snake from now on) LOVES to talk, ever since we met in high school. Couple that with his high intelligence & fake emotions (he even cried in front of me once, for the love of god), and there you have it: an Ass-Wipe Extraordinaire. 😐
Now that you mentioned it, I think he just likes to have an audience too. While all the talking annoyed the hell out of me sometimes (I’m the exact opposite), I figured that it was the sign of being a decent man, especially since I didn’t think/believe that men had feelings back then. But it’s not; as Natalie said, it’s all about landmarks, not hallmarks.
This is brilliant! That last guy I broke up with had a lot of issues but the last straw for me was when I called him once an hour for 3 hours (which I shouldn’t have done either) to talk to him and he never answered. Finally 3 1/2 hours later he messages me on instant messenger. I asked where he’d been. He said “right here in the livingroom”. I said “did you hear the phone ring for 3 hours?” and he said “yea, but I didn’t feel like getting up to answer it”.
Buh-bye! Turn the page!
One thing that comes to mind is my anxiety and if that is indicative of me being unavailable. I have social anxiety and when around most people I tend to shy away or am blank on what to say or keep the convo going. Does this make me unavailable? I have noticed, which I literally only do this once every few months, when I drink a beer or some wine it is *easier* for me to talk to others. The anxiety is gone and I can talk about anything. Now, I do not rely on booze to loosen me up. Frankly, I’m too lazy to keep alcohol in stock and drink it on the rare occasion a friend has it.
I’ve also noticed most the people I am in contact with is usually over text, with an occasional call but more *conversation* on text. That makes me wonder if I’m the unavailable one or they or we are? I realize I’m even anxious to call most people and I am more at ease texting. It feels stupid though. I agree a quick note about whatever is good to use for texting but when it’s something longer or drawn out, a phone call is essential.
I long to have more intimate, closer relationships…friendships…what have you but (I know why) my anxiety and fear send me the other way sometimes. One thing I’m doing soon is meeting someone (a girl that may be a potential friend) from a common interest group and we’re doing a potluck. My body is like omg, freak out, I don’t know this chick and I’m scared she won’t like me or she might like me. She might end up getting close to me and holy cow…need boundaries…need to be myself……. At least that is what my insides do.
No wonder it’s “easier” to be unavailable lol!
Hi Colorrange
We humans are complex beings – the same behaviour can mean lots of different things. You mostly relying on texts with friends – or almost everyone as you say – might have a different motivation than a emotionally or otherwise unavailable/disengaged man.
That said, I feel inspired by your post – we spend so much time analysing what HIS behaviour means and indicates, and much less time doing this for our own behaviour – might be just as useful
Are we related? 😐
Texting,wow! I could write a book about that.I’m a BIG texter,much prefer it to the phone and wouldn’t you know,all my little dramas have played out by text.And as I was around long before the great textual revolution,what does that say about me!!! But,thanks to this site,I’m learning.I now make myself pick up the phone. My epiphany EUM would only text, he would never,ever phone and wouldn’t answer if I tried.In fact,looking back, it was the earliest red flag, one I wouldn’t ignore nowadays.
But, it never ceases to amaze me the quantity of guys out there who sweep women off their feet in cyber land.Great emails,marathon texts,back again to emails,you’re in lurve and you’ve never even spoken to the guy,let alone met him. I honestly think more and more EUs are getting their needs met that way,all surface,all fantasy,no effort.
Relationships take place in the real world.So if it’s not out there in the real world,it’s not a relationship.
Thank goodness for this post! Finally somebody cuts through the b.s. and lays it on the line.
Nat, I cannot tell you how many men – and even women – act like I am from the dark ages to dislike texts and to want a phone call. To think a PHONE CALL is part of a healthy relationship and texting instead is not.
You are right. Nobody is that busy or that special to use this as an excuse not to really spend the time to make face to face or telephone ciommunicating – it is really just a way to avoid intimacy and/or committment.
I am currently eight days no contact, for the very reasons mentoned in this blog. Of all the painful experiences I encountered with the EUM jerk I got caught up with, text messg and emails would have to be top of the list. He mostly relied on sending text messgs or emails , even though on many occassions I voiced my dislike of them ,and asked him not to do text.
I agree with NAT a quick how are ,running late etc is fine. However there are many cowardly EUM out there who use this mode of communication as if they were born without a mouth and voice, as a personal avoidance tactic when it suits them.. I received an email yes a f…king email !!!! containing a re-set button messg, nine hours after the jerk slept the night at my house.The bed hadn’t even had enough time to become cold, the content was all bout HIM,HIM,HIM and how he could see, that he needs time out to find himself and what he really needs.
Of course at the same time,writing he was doing what he was doing, because we had agreed the night before, prior to sleeping together , to put in a joint effort not do anything to hurt each other. BTW , what makes it worse is we have slept together on many previous occassions, and we met many years ago, so this is not a man I had only recently met… .I haven’t any desire to communicate via text or email or speak on the phone .. with him ever again..Of course that’s if, he even ever realises at some stage in the future , that I didn’t respond to his re-set button email.
Just brilliant as ever Natalie. As the mother of a 20 something and a teacher, I thought I needed to “keep up” with modernity. Thus, I had to adopt a cell phone and text messages in order to communicate with my daughter before she left for the East Coast to school, and adopt email to communicate with my students. Presently, my daughter lives on the opposite end of the continent and we talk on the phone almost everyday. She even calls me now! Give me one phone in the entire house with a curly cord anyday. It is amazing how EUM’s use text and emails as a form of control. Fabulous observation. I’ll be on the alert in the future. If my 20 something daughter can hit speed dial, a 50 some male can certainly do the same. They call it “speed dial” for a reason. Absolutely love the “Buisest People in the Universe”. The next male that claims he is “busy” is going to get an automatic flush. Frig “busy”. Who isn’t? And I love how ambigous text messages can be and how much they result in sore thumbs. Simply, not good. You are amazing Natalie.
Listening to a reggae song: “Got to be true to myself, I’m moving on”.
My ex was the busiest man in the world. I let the text messaging continue for a couple of years because I knew that he owned 3 companies and managed them on a daily basis.
I have since gone NC because I finally realized that I was not a priority in his life and was not going to be prioritized anytime soon, if ever. He used the fact that he owned these businesses to distance himself from me and any potential relationship.
I still don’t know why he wasn’t honest with me and just break up with me (after he realized that we couldn’t be a couple) so that I could move on instead of his playing these games, taking advantage and generally being a pissy person. Oh, I get it now–he wasn’t through using me. Hmmm.
We are both well over 45 and he is several years older than I. He was definitely my epiphany relationship. I will never look at text messaging or dating quite the same after being in a “relationship” with this man.
I just discovered this site today and can’t stop reading the incredibly insightful articles. It is like this was written for me!!! “If someone wants to call, they will CALL!” After a crazy love long distance love of 3 months (we met on vacation in Mexico) and one visit to see him (I paid of course) and promisesof love, marriage, moving, children…I find myself with Mr. Unavailable, hot and cold, etc…. Since the end of my abusive (of course) marriage, I am starting to see a pattern, not so alone anymore! My friends are sick of hearing it I am sure, but incredibly supportive.
Natalie, I am truly convinced you are bugging my house (or phone perhaps? lol)!!! Because your articles coincide incredibly with what’s going on in my life. I was recently trying to start something up with yet another Mr. Emotionally Unavailable (but to be fair, I didn’t know it at the time!). We had mutual friends on Facebook and started talking– or I should say, TEXTING. And ALL he wanted to do is text. He wouldn’t talk on the phone or stick to plans on even meeting (MAJOR RED FLAGS FOLKS!). So after texting for quite a while I told him, “Pick up the phone and make a date with me or I’m done.” So I did nearly two weeks of no contact. Then I made the mistake of wishing him a “Happy Birthday.” We started texting again, and then last night was the worst. He actually had the nerve to ask for my address and he wanted to come over in the middle of the night! I gave him absolutely ZERO impression that I was ever going to be a “booty call” for him. He texted me 9 times and tried calling me for the first time at 2:30 in the morning!!! Worst of all, this guy is in his 30’s!!!! I just wouldn’t even believe it if I didn’t see his behavior with my own eyes. I AM DONE and I truly mean it! It is easy to “end it” with him because it never even began, and I have nothing invested in him. I wish that were the case with my other Mr. EUM that I have YEARS invested in and go back from childhood. 🙁
I met two guys last month whom I exchanged numbers with. They both seemed very interested and talked my ear off to get my number. But both pulled the same dummy stunt of texting instead of calling and whenever they did call they would get off the phone quickly and go back to texting.
*
Come on!! I know I have a baby face but do I really look like I just fell off the turnip truck?!?! So, I extended the same courtesy, I told both of them to get lost- BY TEXT. All of sudden that’s when they started calling over and over again desperate to talk.. Voicemails, pages and texts asking me to speak to them about this. It was bananas. Why do men try this push pull game with me? They lose everytime. SMH However, I refuse to give them the satisfaction of hearing my voice or discussing my decision to kick them to the curb. Their calls will continue to go straight to voicemail. Maybe they will treat the next chick a little better.
i love this post.
excellent.
I think we all can tell whether someone is being thoughtful or not. This isn’t entirely a case of The Medium is the Message, so it’s not about saying – hey, if you text me, you’re history. When I first started seeing the AC, he sent a short poem via text, from a train he was on. It had obviously taken him some time to think through, and I was touched. Sometimes a text to say “I’m thinking of you” can be lovely, an action in itself.
What I believe Nat is talking about is using these media to distance yourself, or to not have to deal with your partner in the flesh (or in-the-voice). Have you ever pounded the pavement looking for a job, and had to approach people cold? I quickly learned that people have a much harder time saying no to my showing up in person to their office to drop off a resume, than they do to a phone call, and have a harder time saying no if you get them on the phone than if you send an email. EU folks use this reality the opposite way, to avoid dealing with you: hard for you to get mad, or ask for something, or need them, if they have “shown up” for the day through an email or text rather than in person.
All I know is when I really like someone, friends included, I want to be in their company, and I only use email/phone to catch up if I can’t be physically with them. When it’s a boyfriend, there is even more reason to want to hear their voice / touch them. I can’t believe I spent time trying to explain that to my ex!
The first time I tried to dump my ex, he got up the energy to write a long, ‘heartfelt’ email that was the kind of thing I had hoped he might write when things were ‘good’ between us. I saw why he never said too much of what was on his mind: there wasn’t a lot of thought there, and when he tried to put it on paper, it showed.
It is just hard to admit when someone is using text or email to “throw you a bone,” ie. to placate you for a few hours/days.
Amen! You’re on the mark– I just love your site it gives me such strength. Crumbs—365 days of being in so ones life—28 actual days of phone contact! Yes, I’m the nut who kept track. Why is it so hard to move on from crumbs? Perhaps I need to work more on me- I know it’s crumbs yet I’m pining for I guess ahem validation in the form of contact during my NC from Mr. stale crumbman. Pathetic.
Hear! Hear! Thank you so much Natalie! I wish I had known of your blog before I encountered that EUM/texter/harem dude last year. I would have been better prepared (though I doubt that would have fixed things). But had I better understood what was going on I think I could’ve dealt with it sooner and been less confused. I had never had a boyfriend before him who didn’t phone me up. Then again I had only just added texting to my phone plan!! Before that people would occasionally send me a text but I never replied, because I couldn’t!
I didn’t know what to think of it except that when he texted me to set up dates I felt, “Wow, that’s sooo romantic” NOT! I didn’t like it and asked him a couple times to call but he basically said no. He said he didn’t really like to talk on the phone. (But I do! Shouldn’t he want to put that little effort into something that would make me happy?) And I’m not even much of a talker. Just would like to have a small conversation or two during the week. Not too much to ask. It made me feel I was quite unimportant to him, and that he was supremely uninterested in getting to know me, or forming any real connection with me.
Since he failed to put any effort into establishing an emotional connection with me, he was rewarded for his lack of effort by being refused the sex he wanted (which actually he was kind of lazy in his efforts for that too!) Sorry I don’t have sex with men who don’t care enough about me to want to make me happy and who have no desire to connect with me on an emotional level.
I guess in truth, I should thank him for that. At least I was tipped off, if in a ’roundabout way’ that he wasn’t worth investing myself in. Next time I’ll be that much more forewarned.
Natalie I’d like to add something. Up until a few years ago I had girlfriends that I had conversations with on the phone, as they started turning to text messaging that’s dried up too. Now if I want to ‘talk’ to them, it’s just a text, rarely a conversation. It sucks.
NML, what do you think about video calling/chat?
Hi June, video phone can be handy when you’re apart and is certainly better than texting like mad although it’s still not a substitute for *actually* physically meeting up. Too little human interaction in a relationship gives way to too much fantasy.
Texting isn’t just about crumbs or keeping distance, although that is certainly a huge part of it. It’s about control. With texts, there is no fear of being ambushed into an uncomfortable or unexpected conversation. The EUM is able to say exactly what he wants – with just enough ambiguity for you to read into it way more than is actually there – without havng to worry about you calling them on bad behavior or asking a question they don’t want to answer.
Despite being in the exact same office, steps away from my assclown, he did 90% of the relationship by text and email. I didn’t see it at the time – I was too busy reading and rereading every email, trying to find the crumbs contained in them. I wish I had seen it earlier. With him, the reason he did it was because, if he actually tried to say anything even vaguely emotional, it was blatantly obvious (even to me, in my desperate love addled state) that it was hollow and fake. You could literally hear that he didn’t care. He had learned from past experience that if he wrote it, the girl would believe it. If he said it, even chimps could hear that he didn’t mean it. Crap like “I feel closer to you than anyone” and “you understand me” or even calling me “baby” – it means nothing when he said it and even less when he texted it. I kick myself constantly for falling for it.
As Natalie says, no one is so busy, so important or so isolated that text and email are their only communication. If he can text, he can phone. He just doesn’t want to. I will never ignore that sign again.
I can understand why ACs and EUs love texting, but i don’t agree with it. It’s because they don’t want to be put on the spot, they want to control how and when they respond. They can read a text and answer it when it’s convenient for them. Horror of horrors, that they should get a call from us when they’re with another woman (ghasp!).
The ex EUM was a huge coward. He used text to say things (sexual, graphic, rude, insulting things) that he would never have the balls to say in person. I would feel nervous about calling him – what if he didn’t answer? 9 times out of 10 it would go to voicemail anyway. I hated text conversations with him because it was impossible to tell his tone and he was one of those ‘funny’ (not) guys who, when i’d get offended at some moronic thing he’d text me, would claim to be ‘joking’ and state that i didn’t understand him (*violins*). We once had a massive argument by text because he text me, in the middle of the night, the day before we were due to meet up, asking me to send him dirty texts to ‘convince’ him to come over because he had plenty of other options. I went ballistic. He then claimed he was joking. Pig!
I could tell the current boyfriend was different from day one because, although we text a lot, we also saw each other a lot. When we wouldn’t see each other for more than a couple of days, he would call me. I never feel nervous about calling him – i would feel comfortable picking up the phone at any time without thinking twice about it. If he doesn’t answer, i don’t feel paranoid about it. When he does text or email, i can imagine his voice saying whatever he’s written and there’s no misunderstanding, because he’s always respectful.
My ex flatmate always ended up having huge arguments by text, because of her disrespectful tone. That’s why she’s an ex-flatmate!
I don’t really have any problems with communication via text messages etc. I really don’t like talking on the phone at all! I do so much talking on the phone with my job that a quick text is all I need as I’m generally sick of the sound of my own voice by the end of the day! However, I don’t conduct substantial conversations via text (or email); generally I use these methods to touch base with people and to organise face to face meetings. Also, being a busy person myself, I appreciate that sometimes it is actually quite difficult to find a suitable time to call (for instance, if I’m working until 11pm the it isn’t the best time to make or receive calls!). I feel that the best rule of thumb is to go with your gut: if there are other issues, the texting on top of that could be indicative of a real problem. I’ve known good men who texted and all I’ve done is tell them that important messages should be relayed telephone calls instead and, for the most part, these men have done exactly as requested.
If you are dating an EUM, he could be hiring planes to write in the sky how much he loves you or he could be sitting right next to you and it doesn’t change the fact that he is an EUM.
Thaaaaaaaaaaank you!!!!!
This made me laugh so much – thanks Natalie. When I was the OW I honestly used to feel I was having a relationship with my iphone. Crumbs ultimately – I know that NOW! Another extremely insightful article…
*lol* lily, that’s what i called my relationship w the EUM last year…a relationship with my cell phone. it was so pathetic and i repeated it again this year but smartened up after 6 weeks. now it’s zero tolerance. i don’t care if it’s the modern way of communicating, like any technology is has good and bad aspects and the bad of texting is that it cheapens contact…it’s transaction not interaction.
@Raven I think it’s important not to get carried away and deviate from what the true context of this post is – using text (or anything else) as a substitute for real, meaningful, human interaction and as way of keeping safe and distant and avoiding intimacy. I have all the emails that the boyf and I exchanged when we first met but funny enough, even though he was travelling with work a lot then, we still spoke regularly. You have to judge your situation Raven and I think letters from wonderful, emotionally engaged people are great. But in the context of this discussion, I’ve had thousands of emails from people who get lengthy emails and texts but no relationship, intimacy, commitment and if you can’t stump up the goods in reality, I’m not interested in playing pen pal.
@gina Texting at 2am – beyond inappropriate. Unless you’re calling to say it’s an emergency, I don’t want to hear from you in the middle of the night. Same happened to a friend – she responded as she was up working and then he assumed she was up for being a night texter, so she’s blanking him.
@Movedup Hilarious! I just find it amazing what some of these people actually think they’re entitled to from a text!
@Charla It’s a blankety blank cheque book and pen for your textaholic ex. Ignore. I mean how ridiculous is that ‘Oooh, I’m so bothered by you ending it that I’m going to query it, by text’ -FLUSH!
@yankeebelle That’s very weird behaviour. You could never have a relationship with a scorekeeping narc nevermind a narc alone. FLUSH!
@Magdalena Yeah your friend is out of order there and I’d keep her on the fringes. It’s fine if she wants to be Super Busy and More Busy Than a World Leader, but she’s proving actually that she’s not *that* busy because she’s texting you. You have better, more available friends.
@Tulipa I think you only cement my point about texting even more. It’s important for us (and you) to get out of our comfort zones of avoiding intimacy because we can’t avoid it and then feel bad about not getting it either. Arguments by text is a passive aggressive way of being aggressive. I have no time for people that do that. Pick up the phone! Glad you flushed him!
@Carrie He loves the sound of his own voice – empty vessels make most noise.
@Ivy What a twit! Of course he heard the phone ringing. One of the things I always suggest is not to chase with texts and calls – one is enough. They haven’t been run down, there phoneline isn’t broken.
@colororange I think by nature of having a thing for Mr Unavailables then you already are unavailable anyway. You have a fear of intimacy. If you can be comfortable enough with a Mr Unavailable to hang around him for a while but be nervous of a new acquaintance, it’s because with his distant self he doesn’t trigger the anxiety to the same extent. I would look at going on a confidence building class. I’d also basically ‘feel the fear but do it anyway’ instead of being in your comfort zone. What’s the worst that can happen? That she likes you? That you don’t like her? You have to make an effort to get effort although make the effort with appropriate people instead of panning for gold in puddles.
@Kay “Relationships take place in the real world.So if it’s not out there in the real world,it’s not a relationship.” AAAAAAAAAMMMMMMMEEEEENNNN!
@Cinderella Thank you! From now on you’re too busy for someone that’s too busy for you!
@Pam That sounds like a painful experience and it’s like being jacked. The fact that it’s done by someone you’ve known for a long time is all the more painful. If you have to explain that kind of stuff to someone, it’s a sign that you don’t feel that they’re capable of stumping up with the basics off their own back.
@Runnergirl Exactly! If your 20something daughter can do it, so can everyone else. E.F.F.O.R.T.
@Tammy Well he was honest with you via his actions and people like this aren’t going to go “Okaleedokalee. Now, I’m a very busy man so even though I am getting a shag, an ego stroke and a shoulder to lean on, I’m going to bade farewell to your good self because you deserve more”. He’ll just sandwich you around him and show you that he’s busy and hope you take the hint and enjoy the fringe benefits on the way. I used to work for one of the richest men in the UK and Ireland – he runs a lot of companies and he has time to be talking to his wife (then girlfriend) and kids.
@isla_gurl Flush, flush, flush! What went on tour has clearly stayed on tour. Don’t let this man suck you dry for another minute and embrace the support from your friends and get any help you can to kick your pattern.
@Miss E If you can count the times in 6 months, that’s too little time together. I’ve seen it so many times. One woman told me she’d only spoken to her guy twice in one year via phone. The rest was text and 5 hookups.
@Marina Tape your fingers to your side and don’t send anymore texts. Unfortunately when you said happy birthday to someone that had blanked your request for two weeks, you were sending the message that you were likely up for something casual.
@Rachael Hilarious and well done. Keep blanking them. The most ridiculous thing is that if you respond to guys like them, their desire loses its erection immediately. FLUSH!
@Magnolia Great comment and this line “I saw why he never said too much of what was on his mind: there wasn’t a lot of thought there, and when he tried to put it on paper, it showed. ” made me snort with laughter while drinking my tea. Hollowman!
@Anari I worked that out – you’re looking for a man who gave you 8% attention for the entire year. Now there is a simple reason why you’re looking for validation – it’s like in realising how fricking crummy it is, you’re trying to get some validation to make you feel better about the fact that you’ve sold yourself out to this man for such a small amount of attention. But here’s the catch – the more you invest in this tit, the more those crumbs shrink. If you put 3 more months in and get back, let’s say a day or 2 of attention, you’ll actually be at slightly less crumbs of 7%. Stop the madness. He’s just not that special.
@Mel Hilarious – crumb communication and crumb sex. Ugh! But you’re right about the friend thing and it happened with a few of mine but we’ve all made a concerted effort to pick up the phone when we’re about to send a text. It’s made a world of difference.
@Debra Ah I do love your comments. Your ex was really a complete jockstrap and yet I cringed a bit because I realised that with the ex that had the girlfriend, he sat a few desks away and was constantly texting and emailing me. Honestly, the things we put ourselves through when we’re in LaLa Land. I’m glad we’ve both woken up!
@Elle Haha – yes, we must lay down the weapons ladies. Maybe I should start saying to some readers “Step out of the relationship car, put your hands where I can see them, throw me the weapon, give me your phone, and I’m sentencing you to 6 months of self-esteem rehab”
And yet you’re right.. even though he would love to call people and talk and talk and talk.. ANY time I tried to get a hold of him, he was never available. But when he couldn’t get a hold of me, he would call over and over again until he did. When he got upset that he wasn’t my “emergency contact” I told him it was because I couldn’t rely on him. And of course he was soooo hurt by that. I can’t tell you how many eye openers I’ve had the past couple of days reading this blog.
Me UEM loved to talk with me on the phone.
We sometimes talked up to 4 or 5 times.
He texted too and mailed.
But more and more i got more and more scared and anxious cause he loved
cutting me out of his life by texts or lovely heartbreaking e mails.
Or an IM….like I cant do this. Have a good life.
He made me crazy. Sometimes my heart was beating so hard when i didnt find an IM or i was sacred he would leave again.
Again and again.
I was fantasaizing so invredibly much about him. Sometimes i feel ashamed how stupid i was.
But he touched me so deeply and he knew he HAD me.
So he played.
I call you at 6.
Nothing.
Instead an IM: No i cant call :(( i am so sorry.
He played tricky mind games and i believed any word he said cause i was so afraid he would not even give me crumbs anymore.
The crumbs never were enough but at least i had those.
Funny……..
Nat your blog helps me a lot.
I thank you very much.
I am glad he is out of my life altough deep inside sometimes it still hurts but i know he was just an imagination. He was something i longed for but that he never was in reality.
Simone
I broke NO Contact a few weeks ago when I sent my ex MM a link by text to Nats article ‘There’s No Such Thing as a Honest Cheat’. I told him that I just wanted him to read it and not reply. He answered and said ‘Im sorry you think it was like that with us’. We’d seen each other for 7 years and for the last year had only been in touch by text. I still hadn’t faced the reality that he’d moved on in fact I’m still struggling. One text led to another and finally I experienced overwhelming text rage and told him not to answer my texts as he only gave me hope. But then last week I sent ‘friendly’ texts and totally fell apart when he didn’t reply.Ive been getting help coming off tranquillisers after years of use, doing counselling for childhood issues, grieving my mothers recent death , coming to terms with empty nest – so yes i know I need to focus on me and let go off him.
I m sad to say I had to ask for support though so my friend has had my mobile since saturday as I cant get his number out my head. He had been a rock for years so its been hard to let go at a time when so many other changes were going on. She texted him and asked him to change his mobile number and he’s agreed. Im actually considering cancelling my mobile contract as my daughter is a self reliant adult now and i’d originally got it to keep contact with her when I returned to work. I’m thinking I don’t really ‘need’ a mobile’
I actually feel I have a distance from him now and feel calmer and more in charge. I’m going to focus on building my self esteem and confidence and when I’m clearer about my boundaries with men and even female friends I may get a mobile again. Maybe I’m making excuses for my own weakness but I do feel generally we are over relying /abusing even mobiles and text communication. I actually am not that busy, prefer talking face to face and at the same time am increasingly finding I am at ease with solitude. Are we scared to feel out of touch and on our own and is all this technology heightening insecurities ? I want to establish authentic relationships and until I’m stronger and feel less pressure it seems clearer if for the time being I simply don’t have a mobile.
NAt you probably didn’t mean to establish a NO TEXTING RULE (NTR) ! but right now I feel its what I need
I have to tell you my experinece: when l met this guy, lets call him X, he sent me very short emails and texts, telling me he hates that and he likes to rather meet in person and talk.
Having previous experience with AC-super-Shakespeare-in-email-and-text´s, my first reaction was disapointment (as how could you be so short and so un-romantic), but see, how twisted i was and this guy was super in real life, so my point is that there ARE other forms of com´s and great guys out there! Dont hang in there too much to meditate on those AC´s, save your time.
I have noticed that most of them who *do not know that phone was invented in 1876*, have the latest models of Iphones and Android phones and Smart phones in their hands to play with, l am telling you:))
The first time after we had made love ( actually let’s downgrade that to sex ). I expected a phone call the next morning to see how I was , thanks for a nice evening etc.
What I got was a text saying ” don’t expect that every time I see you ”
Oh dear …ha ha ha ….wish I’d had BR education then !!!
You should’ve texted back with, “God I can only hope not. Life’s too short to live through it disappointed”
🙂 Ladies, it definitely helps to read others’ situations/reactions! All these little bits of info help put my own situations into perspective. Wish we could all *phone* (not text lol) each other up and get opinions/advice before reacting to AC/EUM behavior.
O
M
G
!
That’s awful!
@Mel – hahah!! You are hilarious. I am going to use that line if necessary (hope not!)
Hey At least your’s called you the next morning. The piece of crappola that I am dealing with doesn’t even bother to text to see if I got home safe. I always hear from him 7 days later… I mean he is just a shag but you would think that he would show a little care.
That’s terrible Clara! Sounds like he has a personality defect.
Still laughing @Mel’s quote. 🙂
Lavender
Good to hear you laughing (virtually). Stick with the NC.
Lavender,
Very good to hear you virtually laughing. That’s a good sign. Cute flats and comfy, fashionable clothes are next right?
Fitness, I would say that that is the worst text ever but I know better.
And Mel, that IS the best text come back I’ve ever heard. I am still laughing. Perfect.
On the note of texting, I broke my thumbnail this morning and can’t text worth a darn….just texting my daughter about school. That may the way to stay NC folks. Break your thumbnails!
Spot on Nat.
I am actually phone-phobic, however with the right person that can change, I used to spend hours on the phone quite easily.
Don’t let anyone tease you if you want to call your significant other, it’s not a sign of weakness, insecurity or trust especially when you are miles apart.
Here’s a reason not to text so much: my ex-Narc-EUM-AC-Team mate was sooooo vain he refused to buy reading glasses and a bigger screen for reading his txts/emails on his phone which resulted in him mis-reading some of my messages and getting into a terrible rage at me.
The narcissist thought I wrote he was an inconvenience [in my life].
What I actually wrote was “sorry for the inconvenience”! [to a situation]
That’s the moment I realised I couldn’t be bothered to correct him anymore, so I went NC.
Naturally we ‘bumped’ into one another 8 months later amongst mutual ‘friends’ and he was still fuming at me causing friction for the whole group. What a plonker.
The few times he did use the phone he was pathetic. It’s easier for liars to communicate via text/email than live phone calls/MSN etc
Never again will I let someone like that into my life.
What I do miss are hand written love letters, does anyone still write/send those ? <3
It’s possible he was just looking for excuses to rage at you. I had a particular boyfriend many years before cell phones, and he excused himself to take another call on call waiting. I waited a reasonable time, thought I’d maybe he’d accidentally dropped my call and was trying to get back to me. So I hung up and immediately called him, he just started screaming, why did I hang up on him ….. I kept trying to explain myself, but he kept interrupting saying I hung up.. then he hung up on me. Wow can’t believe all the stuff I put up with from him (he started out so nice).
Anyway when a person often ‘seems’ to misinterpret what you said or did, and won’t listen to reason, it’s not a coincidence and not an accident. They’re doing it on purpose.
I used to believe I had no right to blame guys for not wanting to talk to me over the phone. After all, I hated every phone call with my abusive mother too! I basically contemplated suicide for several days after every contact with my momster. She always scolded me for not calling frequently enough.
Phone calls with my grandmomster (the person who probably turned my mother into the horrible person she was) were just as bad. Grandmomster scolded me for almost everything… and she always told me how much my own abusive mother “spoiled” me, how grateful I had to be for that, because everyone else would treat me much, much worse (because according to her, I was so “bad” that I “deserved” the worst kinds of torture).
I blamed myself for those “wrong” feelings towards my mother and grandmother, and I projected them onto others. I was convinced there was something fundamentally wrong with me. Whenever a guy treated me badly, I just assumed I gave him the same awful feeling in his stomach my family gave me. How could I blame the guy for his behavior? I was the “toxic” one, right?
I think that was almost a pattern in all my interactions with myself and other people. I used to treat myself the same way my family had treated me (by constantly scolding, ridiculing and depriving myself). At the same time, I projected my bad feelings towards my family onto others. I believed I didn’t have those horrible feelings, but others had them about me. I believed I was abusing everyone else and therefore they all felt very bad about me.
Sigh.
This post couldn’t come at a better time for me, thank you! I am in a good place with myself and think I am about ready to start dating, slowly. I have been emailing with a guy (a few weeks), haven’t ever talked on the phone, and he regularly expresses interest in getting together but doesn’t want to “rush me” or “scare me off”. Based upon what I’ve been learning, I think this is a “red flag” and I should bail, but want to make sure I’m not overreacting.
Did you meet him from online dating? Maybe you could find a way to casually tell him that you guys should either meet to determine whether you even like each other in real life, before going on further by email, or if not that then you should stop emailing and say goodbye.
I’ve experienced similar issues with online dating. A lot of them seem to want to ask me a lot of questions and ‘get to know me’ before we’ve even met. I don’t want to tell a lot about myself to someone I’ve never met and have no idea whether I ever will meet, and if we do meet, we may not even like each other.
What I don’t like is that the ball feels like it’s in MY court. In other words it feels like I’m pressured to suggest that we actually meet. Which is almost like me asking him for our first date. Then I don’t feel special because he never actually suggested meeting. Then I wonder then do I have to pay for the coffee too? Ugh.
I think maybe one approach is to say in your profile something like, “I think of this as a way to be introduced to people I may want to meet in real life and possibly start dating. I’m not looking for a pen pal” But then again most of the guys probably don’t read our profiles anyway.
I agree with Mel, Almost Ready. It sounds like the person he doesn’t want to rush is himself! I am sick and tired of these guys not doing the right thing under the guise of consideration for us! It’s bollocks. It’s not like your first meeting will take place at the alter! It’s a coffee, a drink, a lunch for God’s sake. Tell him you’re not on a dating site to look for a penpal, thanks and goodbye.
May sound harsh, but who wants to give all the shit the benefit of the doubt anymore? Not me, anyway. If he was interested or actually available to meet you he would have asked by now. Simple. Be careful he’s not taking his time to ‘groom’ you first – getting you all hooked in and trusting so that when he drop the bomb, like he’s married… or has numerous pen-pals…
Alternatively, tell him to email you again when he wants to meet for a coffee, then don’t answer any other emails from him that are not making that arrangement.
Thank you for your replies, ladies, very helpful, and I agree. It is online dating. I did casually mention about 2 weeks ago that a phone call would be required prior to a face-to-face meeting, and he didn’t address it at all. I don’t want to be the one encouraging a phone call or a get-together, it’s not my style. I think I’m going to go with my instincts on this one, something doesn’t add up, so he’s out.
Everyone on this site is so great, so helpful and encouraging. I really appreciate it. I’ve really grown since I found this site, coming off a series of ex-EUM’s and ex-AC’s. The latest posts about getting back out there and trying things out makes me pause and think and make sure I’m not repeating past mistakes, on my side of things.
Thank you all!!
For online dating, don’t waste to much time emailing. No instant messaging. After 2 weeks max, possible to exchange cell phone #’s, during the phone conversation if there is a ‘click’ he should suggest meeting.
I suggest meeting at a public place. If a coffee shop, get there first, you bought your own coffee and you learn a lot by watching him walk in and observing him.
Good luck!
Fearless “I am sick and tired of these guys not doing the right thing under the guise of consideration for us!”
That’s a good way to put it! Sometimes I think this is what they’re doing when they ask us to call them instead of ask us our phone number, under the guise of being considerate. I’d certainly prefer a man to ask for my number and give me the option of saying no, and if I want to, I can tell him I’d prefer to call him.
Back to online guys who want to chat with us endlessly, I don’t want to tell a complete stranger I’ve never met and don’t even know if I like, much about myself. They are complete strangers and this info could be in the wrong hands. I don’t want a PenPal, if I’m open to it, I’d rather just meet in a public place, decide whether we like each other, and go from there.
What’s up with all these chatty men looking for multiple female PenPals to text and ‘IM’ with all day long? They’re like Chatty Cathy’s! I thought being a chatty, wordy, type was associated with femininity, a stereotypical annoying female trait, now it’s a masculine trait? confused..
I it gives the EUM the Illusion that they are some type of ‘Stud’ able to talk to multiple women all day long. But a real man would man up and make a woman happy. These chumps don’t have what it takes to make one woman happy, so they have to compensate, by stringing along several with crumbs because that’s all they have. Ok, I finally made that connection and I’m pretty sure Natalie has been saying it all along!
Mel,you just said it girl! “These chumps don’t have what it takes to make one woman happy”. And there are just loads of them playing the stud with their on line harem.I once met this idiot on line.At my insistence we met quite quickly as like you,I’ve no intention of too and frooing with this virtual getting to know one another crap.He then expertly manouvered it back on line and he stlll,to this day sends silly jokes via email. What I always notice is the string of womens names on the recipients list! His harem.
A few mails to get the measure of each other,a phone call and then out into the real world.Otherwise,as Fearless says,it’s bollox!
Nat:
I read your post repeatedly last night, because literally, that’s all my ex EUM did, either texting or emailing me. We had phone conversations really only the beginning. After the first few months, texts or emails were the only way he really wanted to communicate. Whether it was just an answer to my text, he would see me later or he was too busy to see me. No phone calls. And he hardly ever answered his phone when I called. If he did, he would say, “why are you calling, text/email me what you want”. I literally protected my cell phone as if it was a pacemaker! My lifeline to him. I was afraid to miss any texts from him, because if I answered too late (in his opinion) for a reply, then I wouldn’t hear from him again for days. I would cry over the lost dates and opportunities to see him because I didn’t text back right away.
Nat, you are so right-“Too little human interaction in a relationship gives way to too much fantasy”. Without physical contact, your fantasies complete the missing personal and time involvement. In my fantasies, he became the most intelligent, sexiest, artistic, etc. You name it, he was that and more. Like a romance novel of the troubled handsome young man. I fell in love with my own created story thinking at the end of the story; he would turn into the loving grateful man. It’s just amazing how you can self-delude!
Vanja,
Wow! Talk about manipulation!!! 🙁
thanks NML for confirming what I already knew. Said “I’ll call you later” on a text 3 days ago…ummm, how much later exactly. This guy is a classic…Future Faker, Very visisble “ex” and mother of his children (not so sure she is actually an EX), came on strong and went out with a wimpy whimper. Going into NC for those 3 days and feel like I actually have some of my power back. Gotta find the article on flushing! Thanks for all of these articles that are helping me feel like I am not going insane. I have shared this site with many friends – we are all 40 something divorcees with these issues!
And if you ignore BR’s advice let me tell you how it ends…after three months of texting, meeting up once a week and a phonecall once a week, he dumped me by text….I was shocked, but why expect him to put more effort into ending it than he put into the relationship? He’s 45, btw.
This post is spot-on. I once began seeing a man and told him upfront that I didn’t like text as a form of communication. So, what was the first thing he did after our first date? Text me! Of course, I responded (silly me) and then there was no going back until I had to break up with him because he was so non-committal. Go figure.
I removed texting from my phone plan when my x texted me this: “Sometimes I want to wine and dine you. Sometimes I want to see your head on a stick.”
Scary & sick huh? So I got rid of texting and of him. I am very happy to be text-free and prefer telephone and face-to-face communication with real friends with solid and healthy emotional/mental health. What has this world come to? Why do we Good Women tolerate abuse in any form? …loneliness and lack of human touch is better than being used and robbed of our souls. Thanks Natalie and Good Readers….
AngelFace, “I removed texting from my phone plan when my x texted me this: “Sometimes I want to wine and dine you. Sometimes I want to see your head on a stick.”
WTF??!!!!! That one is way past the line, WAY! I’d almost consider a police involvement in that! Some of the crazy things these men have the nerve to text. Boyfriends, even! I’ve got some ridiculous stuff from online dating sites, I don’t excuse it, but they are strangers.
And this, “What has this world come to? Why do we Good Women tolerate abuse in any form? …loneliness and lack of human touch is better than being used and robbed of our souls.”
I completely agree. Sadly, if we are in a situation where these are our choices, we should choose the lesser of two evils, for our own sake.
SO glad you got rid of that guy. I agree with Mel. That borders on a death threat, ie. criminal behaviour. Yuck.
Normally I think you are right on the money–but this one, I disagree with.
I HATE the phone. Hate it. Hate calling people, hate answering phones. I will gladly focus the great part of my time and energy on a relationship or a friend–but not by phone. I will write long emails (that can take hours), send short notes, make plans to see someone face to face, and if I am in a relationship they will get 90% of my free time (which as a single mom with a full-time job and a part-time job, is not a lot, but it’s all I can do), but I will talk on the phone as little as I possibly can.
Not because I’m emotionally unavailable and not because I’m “lazy” but because I hate the freaking phone. By the way, this is common among introverts, so you are essentially advising your readers to avoid a significant part of the dating pool on account of a wild misinterpretation of a perfectly innocent personality trait.
Honestly, I think the phone/email/text thing is irrelevant. If someone is spending a ton of time with you, introducing you to friends and family, sharing and being present with you when you’re with them, making plans to see you by whatever method, etc., why on earth would it matter if they chose to communicate with you between times by phone or email or text?
Maeve, you can hate it all you want but fact is, I know a *lot* of introverts that have healthy relationships so I’m not buying what you’re saying. Being an introvert is not an excuse for only texting someone for a shag, an ego stroke or a shoulder to lean on (or even money) which if you really were reading what I’m saying, you’ll note that I did say where someone is being a lazy communicator there are other signs with it. If someone has time, commitment, intimacy, progression, balance and consistency, clearly they’re not with a lazy communicator. This is not about a “perfectly innocent personality trait” and if you even read *one* comment on this post or the comments on Facebook, you’d know being an introvert is not equal to treating someone badly or being emotionally unavailable. To reduce what I’ve written or these people’s experiences to “a wild misinterpretation of a perfectly innocent personality trait” is not only to seek to invalidate very real experiences that so many men and women have, but it’s also unnecessarily making being an introvert look bad when it’s *not*. This is not about shyness or people who prefer more of their own company. Many shy people or those who are not social butterflies make fantastic partners so please don’t sell them so short.
Yes, I totally get what you’re saying, Natalie. I don’t have any problem with introverted people (I used to be one, believe it or not!) or those who just prefer not to be chatting on the phone for hours – I am probably one of those people too. But Maeve, I can tell you through bitter and very real experience that there is a big difference between not liking to talk on the phone very much and using texting, email and the like as a method to create distance, to control the flow and quality of engagement and to avoid contributing properly to or engaging with the relationship he is having with a woman is sleeping with and purporting to be serious about. As I said; I don’t care much about phone calls per se – but I cared about the reason he was not making those calls and using texting instead and it had nothing to do with introvertedness; it was do with control, distance and avoidance.
Maeve,I can see your point because I,too,hate the phone and I would also be quite introverted and very much a free spirit,preferring my own company and to do my own thing.But this blog is not about the pros and cons of phoning.It is, as Fearless so aptly summed up, the link between lazy communication and control,distance,avoidance.
If there’s a REAL relationship going on, then the type of communication between meets is up to the couple in question.And like everything in a relationship it must be mutual and consensual. Unfortunately,many EU people love to hide behind screens, often engaging in a fantasy bubble instead of a real relationship.Like all bubbles, it’s not pretty when it bursts.
Whenever I meet somebody new I really have to make a concerted effort to phone and sometimes even to meet up because that’s the only route to a real relationship.
Well, but that’s just my point. In my reading of your post, all of these issues are quite badly confused. Like:
-A relationship needs the landmarks of commitment etc., and someone should treat you decently.
-This includes healthy, respectful and regular communication that progresses in intimacy.
-Such communication cannot happen by email or text, and if someone relies on such, they are an asshole who ought to be turfed. A proper boyfriend will pick up the phone and call you, no excuses.
The first two I agree with. It’s the third I am taking issue with. What ought to matter is whether someone is treating you decently, and whether the communication is good, not whether it happens over the phone or by email. There’s nothing in my comment that said that introverts have a license for treating people badly or don’t have healthy relationships, quite the opposite, so I’m not sure where you got that from. I said that introverts often HATE THE PHONE. And that’s true, and has nothing to do with emotional unavailability, which you conflate in your post.
eg: “Now while the telephone has undergone many transformations since it was originally invented in 1876 and we no longer have to go through a convoluted operator process or use a rotary dial (well unless you have one of those very cool ‘retro’ phones) plus you can ‘carry’ them with you wherever you go, in essence, the telephone is still the telephone. After face-to-face communication, it’s still a great and next best form of connected contact with another person.”
I could have quoted almost the whole thing–it’s all about how real relationships=phonecalls. You repeat over and over that anyone who really cares about you will pick up the phone. That’s not true. And frankly, your reading of my comment is insulting. I’m hoping you can treat the readers who disagree with you with a bit more respect than you’ve shown here.
Let me get this right Maeve – you’re quoting me as saying something that I didn’t say (for the second time) and you’re having a go at me for saying that being an introvert doesn’t equate to being unavailable or an asshole and in fact, that being an introvert has nothing to do with the issue that is being discussed. Now either I’ve been at the crack pipe without knowing it or I’m missing something here?
You see the guidelines above the comments box? Right well I ask that when you make a comment, that they’re on topic. Now last I checked Maeve, this is a post about lazy communication within relationships in the context of not only a subject around unavailability and boundary busting behaviour, but on a site where looking at things contextually and not jumping on one thing is one of the key messages. I’m assuming that you are commenting on the topic of the post.
If you’re not talking about the subject at hand in the context of the subject at hand, it begs the question of why are we having this conversation? Or better still, why are you trying to have an argument with me about something I’m not talking about? That’s what gets on my tits Maeve – people saying I said something I didn’t or doing crazymaking. I actually don’t think that’s what you intended but you have latched on to something and run with it. This post isn’t about you and it’s not about introverts. Just like you ask me to respect you for disagreeing with you, at least have the decency to afford the same respect. I’m not the one that bought being an introvert into this – you did.
And I should add, someone that picks up the phone and is unavailable is the same as someone that texts you and is unavailable….
Brilliant brilliant brilliant – such a lesson – for me too! I will know when I really want a relationship because I will WANT them to call me. I know I’m not ready because at this time I wouldn’t want anyone to contact me – only my friends. I think I would feel like someone was hasselling me if they phoned and that’s not fair on anyone trying to show me they’re interested and wants to take things further – although beware the ‘Fast forwarder’ I had one of those and my personal barrier alarm was ringing BIG TIME! xxx
That was my relationship, mostly through Black berry messenger and text message, it DOES give alot of space for fantasy & illusions and it allows them to play you, ignore you, not reply.. etc. It’s perfect for them to keep you hanging, if they didn’t like a text you sent or didn’t want to be confronted, they just ignore it.
Rawan:
“it allows them to play you, ignore you, not reply.. etc. It’s perfect for them to keep you hanging, if they didn’t like a text you sent or didn’t want to be confronted, they just ignore it.”
I couldn’t agree more with that. It’s not even just about having control of the flow and level of communication – it’s about *Total Information Control*
Try asking him any question that he doesn’t want to answer – and having to do it through texting him – he doesn’t respond. Try phoning him – he doesn’t answer. They don’t like face to face communication (in person or on the phone) when they know you are wanting to “discuss” a few things… they must always have a way out – they need to be close to the exit door and texting/emails IS that door.
I love this post is soo funny but true at the same time. This was my favorite part of it. “It actually often takes more time to write a text than it does to make a phone call. I’ve often found myself rereading, shortening etc and that’s just with friends! Romantic relationships involve analysing their texts and analysing and rewriting your own responses. Do I sound too desperate?Do I sound too excitable?”
I can relate to this going over my text in order not sound that I care or was bother by the response I was getting from the other person. I am against texting a person that you are in a relationship with or that you are dating or seeing. I mean text can be misunderstood. The only person that I only comunicate through text with is this guy that shag once in a blue. I feel texting keeps things from getting too personal. Also when we have tried to have a phone convo in the past we ran out of things to say. there wasn’t much to say. At first I was mad because he always texted me never called. But after a while I fell into the same pattern as him. I dont like talking to him on the phone. I find him boring… We understand each other better through text. I feel texting is your alter ego or that other personality that you have. I am able to say a lot of things through text that I won’t ever be able to say over a phone conversation. Through text I can be naughty, slutty say whats on my mind or pretend. When you having a conversation you can’t do these things as well.
Crumb communications equals crumb relationships. I was briefly involved with a guy that had this turn-off behavior but he didn’t hesitate to pick up the phone to call in the beginning where we would talk for hours on end, sometimes be in total silence just to hear one another’s breathing. The issue that I had wasn’t the texting/emailing; it became the sole replacement of phone conversations once the novelty wore off.
I admit, I was impressed by his charm – mistake #1
Trusted blindly because he knew what to say – mistake #2
Frightened by the fact that I was a newly single, divorced woman at the time – mistake #3
Didn’t give myself a chance to regroup from my pending divorce, spend some time with me and just make new friends without any expectations -mistake #4
Rushing -didn’t give a chance to get to know him and give him time to prove himself before I prejudged him – mistake #5
I don’t blame myself for his character flaws, I blamed myself for failing to see game (red flags). He was very attentive, engaging, pretended to hang on to every word I said during phone conversations and face to face meetings over drinks and hot wings. After we were intimate, I saw someone else. The infatuation was replaced with avoidness, distance and emotionally unavailability.
Call backs from him were in form of text messages ‘ got ur call, in bar watchn game, will call u later’, calls that were never returned. He became a no-show on dates or just reneged altogether. I felt like an after-thought to him. I also admit that I was battling my own insecurities as a result of my divorce so it was the perfect opportunity for him to take advantage of a situation. Of course, karma forgets no one. I had the chance to repay him for his s#@?%* treatment that he showed me and FLUSHED his a$$ once I was done with him. Rather he came back for an ego stroke, shag or because of limited options didn’t matter, I wanted to show him that his behavior was unacceptable, intolerable and that I wanted better, deserved better and more. His “renewed” interest came too little and much too late.
@ R.C ….cripes !!! I could have posted that myself…maybe I was with his crappy twin brother ?
“,after intimacy ….infatuation replaced with avoidance, distance and EU ” SNAP !
” also I admit I was battling my own insecurities as a result of my divorce so it was the perfect opportunity for him to take advantage of the situation ” SNAP !
Posts like yours make me feel not so alone in what happened..because altho I have all the BR info ….I sometimes find it hard to make sense of something that has NO sense …what starts out so good and seemingly intimate…overnight becomes a heap of steaming dog shit .
Left still so confused often. Altho NC helps the clarity in many ways , but thanks for your post again…it wasn’t just me that walked that exact walk ..and heard that exact talk !! Helped me tonight when I was stewing over the good times !!
Stay strong R C x
Thanks x
Thanks fitnessfreak, you as well. This should serve a lesson to all the women who have experienced or is going through this crap from men. ” What you see is what you get”. Remember that! If more women start recognizing these manaipulative mind game tactics early on before they bed these ass clowns, alot of men would stop this b.s. and come correct with us but alot of us want to be loved and wanted by someone so bad, we don’t see or recognize that nonsense until they left behind hurt feelings and broken hearts, NEVER AGAIN! and the most mind boggling about this is that alot of these are fully grown adults (30-55)!!!!! Thanks Natalie for putting these ACs on blast.
What about the other side of the coin, I know there have been times when I have preferred text for two reasons. 1 I’m a bit shy and it helps me to get to know someone, just at the beginning though.
2. I started to prefer text’s from the last BF because at least I had it in dam writing. He would swap and change and swirl and blurt out any old crap then say he never said it or didn’t mean it. When I had it in writing at least I new I wasn’t going crazy!!!
trinity
i think a relationship is on the way out when it has to be put in writing.
Could not agree more with you 🙂
@Nat, I have often remarked that the text message, when attempting NC (and I mean like FOR REAL this time…I’m REALLY GONNA DO IT and then outta nowhere, the sweet bs text comes in), whether they know it for sure or merely FEEL it, is like a microchip that gets implanted into pets, or like a leash–the text tethers us and locates us, emotionally and literally. and it’s really really mind numbing. a little tug on that leash=the quick ‘i miss you, i love you, i adore you’ after the cold phase of the hot and cold and WHOOP there it is, we are ‘back.’ I will NEVER get involved with an AC/EUM again. And I will never build a pretend relationship via texts, ever.
It’s so easy to misunderstand text messages. You can say something jokingly and it gets interpreted as being nasty. At least with my good friends we all understand each other and know when it’s a joke, but you can’t have that with an AC or EU because you don’t know them well enough to know the difference. And lets face it, they don’t know you either.
This is so very true! I remember dating a guy that I really wasn’t into, but tried to be because he seemed to like me so much. He called me out for only sending text messages when he tried to call me. I could have easily picked up the phone and talked to him, but I just wasn’t feeling it, so I didn’t. I made excuses, but they were just that…excuses.
I tried very hard to avoid the texting trap with my last ex. He would be on the road for almost a week at a time. I would often get a “What are you up to?” text, but it wouldn’t go anywhere. I kind of got the feeling that it was his way of keeping tabs on me, not trying to engange in an actual conversation. Phone calls didn’t produce much more conversation than that. Which means we really didn’t have much to talk about, period.
I’m a true introvert as well. But what that means for me is that I prefer smaller, more intimate settings to large, impersonal ones, and need a bit of down time after being around a lot of people. If anything, it makes me more adept at one on one interaction. My ex did his best to convince me that he was some kind of loner who didn’t like talking on the phone, and was anti-crowds with anxiety, but it was just a cover. He had no problem talking to tons of other people, and would gladly hang out at bars with his friends to watch sporting events, etc. He just had no interest in getting to know people who were important to me or attending crowded events that I wanted to go to.
@ Fitnessfreak,
I can’t believe the morning after message you got. The ego on that guy! I’m so glad for you that you’re nc.
@Vanja and Lavender,
Seems both your men, kept you on edge and “penalised” you, by withdrawing contact, if you weren’t glued to the phone. That’s so controlling. The power balance in the relationship sounds way off, it’s a bit parent child.
My ex used to text me all the time. When I saw him, he would always accept other calls and not think anything of walking out for 20 minutes and leaving me in a cafe on my own. Always stressing how important the call was and how he had to take it. It really bothered me, like a red flag to a bull. One time, I was ready to leave him there, but he saw me on my way out and confronted me, holding onto my handbag. I ended up just saying I had to put more money in the ticket machine and having to promise that I’ll come back. It’s funny that these days, I’m more mad at myself than him. I keep wishing I just walked out and left him there. Mad that I didn’t listen to my gut instincts. Mad that I gave someone the time of day, so that they could slowly but surely “brainwash” me. Mad that it was my ego that loved the admiration, so I put up with things that were against my values. As it was a returning ex after several years, I thought I had him all figured out and that knowing that he was a snake meant I couldn’t fall for it again. I opened the door because he wanted to be friends and I thought I could handle it. Mistake! I think he could’ve won an academy award for some of his poor me, ‘you’re the only one that knows everything about me’, ‘i love you’, ‘don’t give up on me’ and the way he said ‘please’ with his voice breaking off performances. So convincing that he loved me with words…not actions. My gut was always suspicious. Anyway, now I’m a bit wiser, my ego’s a bit dented, but my eyes are wide open and nc is the only way to go, it has given me myself back and I know I can’t open the door an inch
with this brainwashing ‘chameleon’.
i had his blocked. you can do that.
problem solved.
when i caved and wondered if he had texted me, i was too technically illiterate to reverse it and too lazy to find out.
tehe!
Vanja— you are so strong you will get through this! When you talked about holding your phone like a lifeline you reminded me of what I felt six months ago! What an awful feeling! Continue with NC you’re awesome…. Keep reading this sitefor support!
Hi Natalie,
you are making me RICH :)…the more I read your blogs , the more pennies drop! And my break up and NC becomes easier to bear. Thank you, from the bottom of my heart!
I was so managed by text. He asked me out by text. He asked me in the beginning what I would think if he sent me ten texts a day….I thought- how sweet. I got most of those when he knew I was out with my friends, followed by grilling in person, I thought- interested in my life- now I know- a control freak . He texted during the day…asking for details of what I was up to, knowing full well what I was doing, because I told him ( in text) the day before, as he also asked the day before. Said he had bad memory. The texts always stopped in the evening, kinda on the dot, and I would not get the answer to mine ( which was a reply to his) till late at night or next morning. He mostly fell asleep, or didn`t hear the text, or there was no reception. There were other problems ( red flags ) from the beginning of a relationship, and I often said we should try to catch up on the phone when we couldn`t see each other… but that never materialised. We progressed to having texted arguments and sorting of arguments…I ended up feeling I just wasn`t “allowed” to call and it`s an intrusion on his time and that he was hiding something- duh….. I had to wait…for him to decide when and how often we will communicate ( that extended to seeing each other too ) and months after, when I finally Sherlock Holm`ed his pattern and seen enough “evidence” there it was in full glory; He was hiding the fact that he had a drink problem and his time in the pub was sacred and I ceased to exist when beer was on the horizon. I spent all this time being so confused, not being able to work out this guy who offered commitment and this wonderful relationship and future plans- on part time basis…he had a mistress to keep happy too- his addiction. If only I knew then what I know now from your posts! Anyway- I broke up with him ( by text) and he wanted to get back together ( by text) …didn`t work….he wanted to see me to talk things out ( step up the effort according to need) . Too little, too late. Never again. Ps…..please could we have a post on addictions…they can be such available “looking” men….such good liars,so confusing and heartbreaking
@ Runnergirl @ aura
thanks ….at least I can look back on it and laugh now ! The sad thing is at the time my expectations had been so managed down I didn’t even flinch at the text …I pro ably excused it as him trying to be cute.
the sweet irony to the text ” don’t expect that every time you see me ” is that actually he was right ..as he had a slight problem getting hard a lot of the time !! 🙂 🙂 🙂
As for facebook, I hope that very soon BR facebook gains 100000000000 fans, which means that more and more peope are getting aware of this, so even if some AC might call it “A site that no assclowns wants you to read,” they have less and less damaging power to put into our lives out there.
Very thought-provoking post…I’m in a 1-year old long distance relationship. Whenever we meet up, we talk non-stop. However, when we’re apart (most of the time), we pretty much only communicate by text, and neither of us really likes talking on the phone. I’d never really thought of it as being a huge problem, but maybe it is?? Hmm…
Remember the context of what is being said here Laela – if your relationship has the landmarks – shared values, commitment, progression, intimacy, balance, consistency and no other code amber or red stuff exists, and you are both happy with your level of communication, what is the issue?
Very good point. Perhaps the issue, if there is one, is complacency on both sides and a feeling of having reached a “plateau”? I think I might give myself a challenge to pick up the phone more often, even if it is not my first instinct, just to see what happens!
Come on … There is a minority that finds it awkward filling up the spaces between umm’s and err’s … I prefer texts, use them to get my point across quickly (especially with friends who want the low down on how i spent my day ) but most of all prefer face to face conversation … maybe cos i’m an introvert … Not that i don’t like the phone calls – i’l call if i need to
“finds it awkward filling up the spaces between umm’s and err’s”
If that’s what a conversation is about for you then I honestly can’t imagine how you’d be able to hold a meaningful romantic relationship anyway, so I’m not sure really understand your point. And we’re not talking about *already-established friendships* like you are. We are talking about *new*, *romantic* relationships. With people whom we haven’t gotten to know yet.
“most of all prefer face to face conversation”
Most people probably do, but that’s not the point, and that’s often not possible. When a guy I just started dating works *out of town* Monday through Friday, and I work Sunday through Friday, and have to do home chores on Saturday mornings, that leaves us Saturday evening available to see him, face to face. Pretty tough to talk face to face during the week. One would hope he would at the very least be willing to phone me up during the evenings to get to know me, otherwise it’s going to be a loong drawn out process to get that accomplished.
By the way, I’m an introvert too, but I have no idea what that has to do with preferring texting over phone to phone communication. In fact as an introvert, I prefer to have a real conversation, over texting something out into the ether.
Mel
Regarding this introvert business, I’m extremely introverted to the point that it’s a handicap. However, I completely shine in one-to-one conversation with someone who is actually LISTENING and who I know cares. I wouldn’t trade that for texting. The core issue is when there is no option EXCEPT text. Either we don’t want to engage fully or he doesn’t. Neither is good.
A preference for texting is a preference for holding someone at a distance and not taking any risk. Even the teeny tiny one of phoning. What can I say in x characters that actually MEANS anything? Texting can be good fun, a quick comment on the weather (atrocious right now in the uk) or a tv programme. But to rely on it to propel a relationship forward is a foolish dream. We don’t text our boss (at least I hope not) or our counsellors or the bank. It would be a stupid waste of time.
Texting has only been popular for about ten years (?) or so. There was a time when we couldn’t text and there was no internet!! In my lifetime. And it was fine. In some ways it was better because we had to make an effort. I used to phone people and they phoned me. Now it’s a text every now and then and we’re supposed to still be friends?
All these comments have made me think it’s about time I called up some people. Thanks for the reminder Nat.
You’re very welcome Grace and yes the weather is shite! I totally agree – being an introvert has nothing to do with the penchant for managing a relationship by text. I love the contradiction “I’m such an introvert that I don’t like speaking by phone and prefer text and writing long emails but funny enough they’re all timed around when I next need to hook up with you plus *miraculously*, I manage to say so much without really meaning very much *and* I get to keep at a distance and avoid commitment and do everything on my terms! In fact, I’m such an introvert, that it would be really great if you could give me a shag, an ego stroke and some attention without you expecting anything from me” Absolutely nothing to do with being an introvert and everything to do with being unavailable which is an entirely different thing.
The introvert stuff is a red herring. We all know when he is taking the mick with all the avoidance, controlling text messaging instead of delivering an actual conversation. If you’ve been on the other end of it, it’s dead obvious – and very frustrating; if you’re not sure if you’re in that position try “losing” your mobile phone and your internet connection and see how he copes with that hurdle.
I like it when you put it in their words Natalie! 😀
Grace, “A preference for texting is a preference for holding someone at a distance and not taking any risk.” Yes!!!
Natalie, I love your summation of the ‘I call myself ‘Introvert’ so that’s why I behave in ways that make me unavailable’ excuse 🙂
Grace and Nat, yes I’m quite suspect of this “I’m an ‘Introvert’ therefore I’m emotionally unavailable'” business.
Come on indeed. Really I don’t even believe ‘Introvert’ and ‘EU’ have a correlation. Or if they do it would probably be a negative correlation. The EU’s I’ve known have all been far more the ‘spread themselves around’ type than I am.
Even the last EU texter-dude, I was initially attracted to him in part because he was soo quiet, I figured, ‘Well there’s a guy I could have a one to one relationship with, not the type to be flirting with other girls’… Until I found out he texts with and hangs out with other women, has a whole herd of female “buddies”, and a female he calls his “Best Friend” [*cough cough* to hide behind]. I was right that he didn’t ‘speak’ very often. But yeah he’s not really my definition of an introvert.
I have a male friend who upon hearing what I described about my ex EU above, said he thinks my ex was only pretending to be ‘shy’, as a ‘shtick’ or a ‘persona’. He wasn’t being authentic, just being lazy, and trying to use sympathy to pick up chicks, lol..
Funny though his game worked on me at first, his true self shone through before long. He’d wanted sex, I wanted a relationship. Because of his EU, neither of us got what we wanted. FLUSH!
@ kirsten
made me think…….
i was afraid how my AC would react sometimes.
there were days he could take jokes as jokes and laughs so much with me and there were other days when he was in a mood change ( this could be just the next day) where he reacted like a crazy person……like i would not take him seriously……then he maybe would shout at me or blame me for him feeling bad lol or makiing me little cause i thought i WAS to blame 😐
funny manipulators they are
and YES you are right kirsten, they didnt know us because they didnt want to get to know us the way we are…….the ACs just wanted to have us aside to get some ego boost and a shoulder to cry on
hard to face the truth but i am glad at the same time
stay strong ladies 🙂
Allison,
Yes, he is very manipulative. I didn’t even know it at the time. 🙁
Anari,
Thank you, I am trying very hard. It’s amazing how much these EUMs have in common. We need to be vigilant for red flags. Oh, yes, I will be reading Nat’s blog all the time; she is a godsend!
Ah yes! The lazy communicator, AC, non commit, piece of crap! DONE! I’ve said it before, many-many times! This time—-DONE! For good, O-V-E-R!! I feel like singing the song from the Jefferson’s…Movin’ on UP! Because I can’t get any lower than this past “relationship”, there is only UP from here! I’m not shooting for the clouds, or the sky…I’m shooting up to the upper atmosphere! ….3—–2——1—–TAKE OFF!
I like texting but it is ofcourse a tad concerning when text and email is 90 % of the communication device. I’ve said more than once I want a boyfriend not a penfriend! My current suspected eum is a big fan of it, but it’s not obvious it’s only when he wants to hook up/ need ego stroke. It’s a lot and constant and mostly initiated by him. In fact come to think of it in four years we have probably only spoken on phone twenty times. We aren’t in a committed relationship (obviously)….although I’d like to be. We are very close, despite the lazy communication, albeit lazy it’s mostly thoughtful and at times cheeky. Am I building sandcastles in the sky or are we both shite at verbal/intimate conversations? I play it very cool and think we are both guilty of sending mixed messages, hence land of ambiguity….
Maree
Not in a committed relationship/but you want a committed relationship/very close/ ego strokes/ hook ups/ lazy/thoughtful/ suspected EUM.
Ambiguity usually equals EU (yours or his or likely both).
You could lay your cards on the table and assess the response. I mean really assess the response, not just interpret it according to your own desires.
Maree,
I say this with the benefit of hindsight and a year long intensive BR course in getting the pumpkin seeds out of my head!…
1) If you are not in a committed relationship after four years and you’d like to be, then what ARE you in exactly? You may want to start calling it something – give it a name.
2) If you want commitment and a bona fide relationship why are you spending years of your time on a guy who isn’t offering you that?
3) That you think you are playing it cool is a big red flag. Have you been “playing it cool” for four years hoping you’ll get to stop doing that and have a real relationship at some point from this guy? Beware of believing, erroneously, that he too thinks you are “playing it cool”. Most likely he wonders why you’re still putting up with this after four years. Maybe he thinks he can do better than this – than a woman who thinks that’s all she’s worth. Most likely he’s quite happy for you to “play it cool” cos he gets everything on his terms. Beware of confusing “playing it cool” with actually being treated as an option and a fallback girl.
Good luck.
My EUM ex was all about the texting. He liked to text or to answer the phone when we were hanging out, which is just plain rude (and yet not uncommon: I’ll be sat with some friends at a restaurant, and they all start texting?!) I once had a 2 hour phone call with my EUM: the next day, when we were hanging out, he randomly had a go at me and said I had “bullied and cajoled” him into staying on the phone for so long. What the hell? And this is the same man who proudly said once that he was of the generation (he was born in 83) who would call round to a friend’s house because texting didn’t exist. As if I didn’t do that too… We broke up in Sept ’10, he found out I was moving to Austria a couple of months ago and suddenly he didn’t need to be forced to pick up the phone. I haven’t returned any of his calls. Sucka!
I was “managed by text” last year. Also, he was so busy that I’d ask for permission to call, texting “hey, are you free?” Wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong. I shouldn’t need to ask for permission to CALL MY BOYFRIEND.
One of the many, many things wrong with that relationship. Thanks for the eye opener, as usual.
Absolutely right Betty, I had the same thing. They trained and managed us well ! if you texted a friend to ask if they can take your call, they would think you are barking mad! After 3 months of NC all I can think of, how did I let him treat me this way….
If I get real with myself ,which I am at this time it’s not just crumbs.It’s also mental and emotional ABUSE these lying selfish EUM dish out. It does take longer to tap out a LONG sms or email than to say the same words via the phone or in person. These A’holes think it is ok to play with another persons felings then do a runner. All seem to have the same pattern ,when they want something to benefit themselves..They turn on the charm and attention.They lie and do whatever it takes to get what THEY want.Then they will treat you ,like you didn’t mean anything too them or you took there intentions in the wrong manner.They deliberately turn the tables to make you question yourself and what part you played in the situation. The most hurtful and disgusting manuover they practice is the one of gaining your trust.Once they achieve this , they then have free
range and you ( mostly unwittingly) become the target of their abuse.Even though they may not be physically abuseive the damage and hurt they inflict on your heart , to your mind and soul is still the same,you just don’t visibly see the bruises. I’m still reeeling eleven days after from my own last personal experience of emotional abuse. Sleeping with me , then a lousy nine hours later emailing ..he doesn’t want to hurt me, and he shouldn’t be in a relationship “At the moment “. In other words what he meant was ” I’m just pressing the reset button here”, I’ve done it before so I’ll do it again you poor misguided SUCKER. I’ll con you into staying friends, for the next time I need you to fall back on. These men all behave in the same way although the acts of emotional and mental abuse they commit may differ. .What I can see and have learned from the posts on here, there is many of these “RATS” on the loose and operating quite successfully.Well ( after seven yrs of off and on) I’m sad and ashamed to admit that ..he has had so many bites of this cherry, when it comes to him there’s nothing but the stone left. I’m only grateful that I can recognise and learn from this .There are good men out there, and the next man I decide to be involved with, will be one of those .Especially now that I’m forearmed with the knowledge I’ve learnt about EUM’s .
Pam,
Yes, it is really appalling. Obviously we have to explore our own part in our own downfall and stop acting like Nero: playing the fiddle while Rome burns. But I think, in the main, these guys are quite wilfully ‘playing us’, fooling and controlling us – mine was a passive controller which is very insidious; I know he lied his ass off, particularly in the beginning when he just plain lied to keep me hanging. On the other hand, we are not really fooling anyone but ourselves, which is why we are so crushed and devastated when the denial bubble explodes because we have been fooled from all directions. That’s my feeling of my experience anyway.
@Pam.. couldn’t have put it better myself
AGAIN….I think I was dating your EUM/AC ‘s creepy twin brother . Are they being bred in some clone laboratory somewhere that we don’t know of ? Some freaky genetic experiment like Planet of the Apes ….but now its Planet of the A holes .
@Fearless ,yes I’m sure this one is Passive Agressive too.
@Fitnessfreak…….love your sense of humour.Planet of the A- Holes how succintly you put it…lol . Thank you for making me laugh 🙂 maintaining the humour…we must be all be careful aware….so as to avoid the latest strain of AIDS.It’s been named “hearing AIDS” and is contracted by listening to A-holes.
Generally I have disliked reliance on texting (my own & his) as it makes emotional subterfuge so much easier. The other party can’t pick up cues from eyes and voice and body language.
For that reason texting also makes it easier to lie.
Fearless and Grace; Valid points, I was about to add how it’s complicated but again probably a red flag to get real about this ‘relationship’ ha and stop the justification. In the short time i’ve followed BR i always enjoy your comments, footnotes and honest experienced opinions:) in truth the only healthy way to address this is to lay it on the line and assess it for what it is as u say Grace. The issue I have is the damage is done, too much water under the bridge, that comment you made fearless about he is not waiting for me to pipe up but only wondering why on earth I have stuck in it and been his ‘option’ without too much of a fuss ….well….eek yes I guess the tone has been set, much like accepting the texting, emails i guess. If I could hit the reset button I would. Good point on easing off the assumptions and over analyzing ladies. What’s meant to be will be but I’m not prepared to wait anymore. I’ve had half my friends get married , buy houses and pop out kids in the last four years and apart from a few other false starts my eu
And I are basically still on pause and replay swimming around and around the same fish bowl. Bloody madness! X
Hi Nat,
Sometimes crumbs are all you get , because the EUM has another relationship that he is keeping hidden from you and the other party. On that note , hope this isn’t going off topic, and excuse my ignorance in this regard 🙂 but is there a previous Blog/post on Baggage Reclaim where postees have conveyed how they think or have managed this scenario when they have discovered another party is involved and is also being kept in the dark too. ? ie: Letting the other woman kept in the dark know what’s going on ? etc etc.
If there isn’t already a Blog , could I be so bold as to suggest this topic as an up and coming future Blog/post.
Thanks 🙂
I’ve just got to share my new text story. Through a Meetup.com function, I met a kinda interesting guy. The folks at our table all exchnaged cell numbers. Kinda interesting guy texted me randomly for the last few days. Mostly I didn’t respond because, well, it’s just a text and I don’t know the guy and I hate cypberspace. Based on this post, “If they haven’t the time to pick up the phone, they haven’t the time for a relationship”, I suggested,via text, that he could call me this morning and we could chat. No call this morning. However, I get a text this evening “What’s up?” Now, I know better than to play the text game and I know now about a “booty call” but I responded just to see if my instincts were right. Oh shit, were my instincts right. After a few short texts about what I liked to do such as hiking, running and such, he responded that he liked sex and women. Now you just gotta howl at the irony. Texting this sorry sad sack saved me so much time and grief. I simply responded “good luck with women and sex but he could count me out”. I couldn’t help but point out that since he was texting me (and we only met last week) on a Sunday night, he probably had neither, sex or women. Haven’t gotten another text from him. Oh Natalie, you are soooo good. I’m going to bed laughing out loud. Ladies, if they can’t pick up the phone…big clue! Wow, sex and women, that’s it for some dudes?
I’m trying to wrap my mind around how a guy like that differentiates between “sex” and “women”! Probably just to make it sound like he has two interests instead of one.
Oh, runnergirl, the dating adventures!
I wish that Recognizing the Assclown Approach was taught in high school. Now situations like the one you describe sound “textbook” after almost a year in Baggage Reclaim 101.