Anyway… I digress…
So, we walk along the strip. After checking out a few places, we stop at this club with a plasma screen outside. It’s playing what we thought was live footage of the jam-packed club inside. The guy was doing a hard sell, and to be fair, the footage was pretty compelling. OK, and he made out like he doing us a special deal. You can guess what happened next… We got inside to discover that we were two of about eight people in the bloody place! We were fuming!
Hindsight suggests that we could have asked if the video was live footage of what was going on inside. That, and actually, it was quite obvious that he was doing a hard sell.
Now, the thing is, I see this whole inviting-plasma-TV-outside-a-club scenario all the time in dating and relationships.
When we’ve just met someone, or we’re in the early stages of dating, or we’re setting out on our new relationship, we sometimes get what we think is a dazzling preview of the amazingness to come.
They’re so full-on! They paint this picture of being The Perfect Potential Boyfriend/Girlfriend TM or The Perfect Potential Spouse! And we reason that this is what we can expect in the future.
Days (yes, really), weeks or months down the line, they seem to do a complete U-turn on who they presented as or what they promised. We’re then baffled, wounded and stuck on this notion that we just need to get things to go back to how they were ‘in the beginning’.
This spot of what I call Future Faking (building up and faking a future so they can get what they want in the present) and Fast-Forwarding (being emotionally, physically etc., intense to speed you through the early stages of dating), messes with our heads.
The people pleaser in us cannot help but blame it on us having done something to scare them away. It’s as if character and intentions leave a person as quickly as they can drop their drawers to the ground. We try to overcompensate for what will undoubtedly evolve into an unfulfilling partnering. This leaves us getting increasingly diminishing returns in a relationship where it used to be so “easy”.
The whole experience can erode our confidence and cause us to be skittish about subsequent involvements. We become prone to settling for less than what we need.
It’s as if we reason that lowering our expectations is safer than going high and getting disappointed. Lowering our expectations into crumb territory, however, not only disappoints but wounds us even more.
Jaysus, how much lower do I have to go to get some love up in here?
Expectations are our strong beliefs about what we think will and should happen.
We believe that we have experience of them meeting our expectations so we don’t understand why they can’t go back to how it was ‘back then’. The thing is, they weren’t meeting our expectations in the beginning. It was a brand new involvement where we did not know them.
They didn’t change; you just got to know them.
In the early days, they could pretty much tell us anything. Basically, as long as it was positive and fitted our picture of how things should and could be, we went along with it.
They also go so hard at it in trying to woo us and win us over that instead of wondering why they have to be so frickin’ OTT, we allow ourselves to create unrealistic expectations. We kid ourselves that someone could blow in on the wind and make a bunch of inferences and promises without having really got to know us. And that they’ll deliver it from now until, well, forever.
Of course, that’s why we feel so wounded. In the beginning, they didn’t know us so ipso facto, it must be knowing us that caused their U-turn.
But, like the guy outside the club displaying a plasma screen of dated footage that probably didn’t even take place in his own club while doing a hard sell on getting us in there, isn’t it time that we acknowledge that actually, it’s a fundamental lack of integrity and maturity?
That, and yes, we can stand to ask more questions. Or to quite simply know our pace and what we want so that someone can’t bulldoze us into going at a pace that doesn’t match our values.
Dodgy club guy knew that he was pulling a fast one.
And, I hate to break it to you, but people who go all super intense on you at the beginning and try to speed through the getting to know, have form for their behaviour. It’s not the first time they’ve behaved this way. They’re stuck in their own getting-high-on-romance Groundhog Day while avoiding the true intimacy of taking one’s time.
If you’ve been in this situation, you have to acknowledge a fundamental truth: that you don’t like what you got to know or that it’s certainly not what you want(ed).
Sure, you can take responsibility for allowing you to get swept up in their shenanigans. You can also acknowledge anything that influenced those choices. But what you must stop doing is blaming your worth or something you said/did on their lack of integrity and maturity.
Even if my friend and I had asked whether the footage that was being shown on the screen was live, it wouldn’t change the fact that he was trying to screw us over in the first place.
Your thoughts?
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Natalie…This was spot on!!!
This totally rings true to my current ‘relationship’. It was a whirlwind romance to begin with – promises of undying love, passion, marriage, babies – the whole package from a handsome, charming man. We window shopped for engagement rings in January this year but there has been a gradual and dwindling availability of physical intimacy. We haven’t had any physical intimacy now for coming on to 8 months. I’ve tried to discuss it – initially it was he wasn’t feeling well and he’s too tired and stressed at work and I do acknowledge he is in a very stressful job. He still hugs me and holds my hand and is affectionate. I have told him that sexual intimacy is important to me as it is a way of bonding and it builds trust but it is still a no go. I have wracked my brain about what this all means for months and it’s driven me insane. Needless to say there has been no engagement etc. Are these the hallmarks of an emotionally unavailable man? Was he creating an illusion to suck me in and this is just who he is in a relationship? Is this the reason he has a long track record of long distance relationships which haven’t worked? He is an outwardly successful, handsome, charming, kind man so why have none of his relationships worked?
I’d be interested to hear anyone else’s take on this.
Cheers
Your ex sounds exactly like mine. Cut your losses, it’s not going to get any better. Trust me, you’ll feel so much better when you do.
Wow, I’m im the same boat!! Had the greatest year with the most successful, charming, attentive man alive .. and then a million excuses to not be with me.
Yet, when I tried to breakup a million times, he literally cried and begged me to reconsider, to give him another chance.
I even saw a therapist 6 times to figure out what is wrong with ME.
There’s nothing wrong with us, these are insecure cowards that we finally got to know better.
I just hope I can be strong enough to not get pulled back into the mess again and again.
Thank you for the amazing blogs, podcasts, and for all those sharing their experiences!
Ugh, Lexi. I had the same thing. I’d break up with this guy who clearly couldn’t give me what I wanted, and he’d come back around, begging, pleading, and literally, crying. One time he had snot running down his nose. I’d think “Oh okay. If he’s acting like this, I guess he’s changed.” NOPE. Don’t spin on this hamster wheel for five years like I did. He’s now married with a kid, and I’m 40-something, still single, still meeting tons of unavailables. Please don’t waste your time.
I feel like the lack of being intimate is a big red flag, I felt a bit like that sometimes with my ex boyfriend we moved in together after only 4 months of being together he was so different in the beginning and as soon as we moved in things changed I saw the real him, he’s a 36 year old man that still plays video games all day, smokes, and acts like he’s still a teen, I’m having a hard time moving on as we just cut communication recently oh not to mention he has 3 kids and 2 baby moms. Drama. You deserve better. I moved out in July we tried to stay “friends” after but it was hard we got in a argument a few days ago and he blocked me off of everything I guess it worked out in my favor I think no contact will help me! Good luck to you!
I’ve been following your blog and podcast for a few months and really appreciate the work you do. This was exactly what I need to hear today! Thank you for this post!
Yes!!! To ALL of this. I think I have a tendency to blame myself when in reality if a man is intent on trying to deceive me it’s not my fault for being deceived.
Yep…I’ve been down this road a few times than I care to remember..but knowing better comes from experience. Great post!
Hi Natalie, love your work, and always read your email before any others in my inbox. Have learned so much from you. re today’s post……I think it’s trickier than that. I believe in the mirror principle in relationships, that you are the very thing you attract. In my case, and this is in hindsight, I wasn’t consciously aware of what I was doing at the time……..I allowed them to deceive me so that I could deceive them. I didn’t want them to realise how overwhelmed and down i can get, so I stayed happy happy long enough and then fast-tracked a commitment. In the meantime, they were my mirror… not wanting me to realise how sullen or alcoholic or shut down or violent or argumentative or women-hating or neurotic or unfaithful (this is a list from three different men) they could be, so stayed happy happy and not displaying any of these traits long enough and then allowed the fast-tracking to commitment. Of course, the very first , second and third obstacles that came along triggered us both in to our awful shit behaviour which led us both to feelings of being ripped off and deceived… “hey wait a minute, why didn’t I know, why didn’t you tell me, why didn’t anyone in your life like your friends and family tell me you were like that ??!!” And in my case I felt intense shame that I wasn’t clever enough or clairvoyant enough to have known. The fact is though, I was just as deceptive in my own way. This happened three times !!! before I realised it wasn’t bad luck but a pattern. I’ve been 17 years single now, long enough to work through all the issues one by one, painful but work that had to be done. Anyone else honest enough to own this for their own past ?
This is me, personified. I deny the amber and red flags in the woman I pursue, and yet, fail to correct some of the long-standing maladaptive and deceitful behaviors and amber and red flags within me. I know every week that I must clean up my life and become the charactered man I would be proud to show my daughter, but I do good for awhile and then fall back to the smuck I am. But I keep trying to improve. Life is a journey. (I am in counseling)
hi Martin and All
Great. First steps for me were reading Natalie’s posts and one of her books… and seeing that I wasn’t alone….. then seeing the uncomfortable truth that the common person in all my relationship drama was me…. and then starting to recognise my own patterns, admitting them –
and that was hard to do – and then working to understand why I had them, which required me to unpick my whole life, Ive journalled every day for 17 years, had some psychotherapy, endured Post Traumatic stress episodes through memories being jolted back into conscious awareness, forgiving and letting go, regularly burning stacks of journals.
One side-effect of all this (for me) is I now have a new problem… the world of smuckness is everywhere and slowly but surely I became so hyper sensitive to it and hyper aware, I recognise it in everyone — and now I am oh so lonely. Im a fit young ‘in my 60s woman’ now, and easy to meet people where I live, but every time I meet someone new I can see right through to their smuck , whereas once I would have just seen “a nice guy”, now I see their potential, their patterns, the surface behaviours that lead to the smuckness underneath. I walk away. I can’t go back because I can’t become unaware once I am aware. And this lonely hell is as bad as the hell of bad romances and relationships ! Plus, another thing is I have a creeping feeling that the mutual smuckness is where the sexy in us lives. So be aware fellow Baggage Reclaimers, for this wonderful divine work we are all doing is, or has to be the way, but it does have lasting side effects. And thoughts anyone ?
When one is judgmental about others the odds are high that you are judgmental about yourself. I also see the ‘smuckness’ in others. I see it more as that I see through others b.s. and no longer take much at face value. For most relationships this is actually healthy. It also allows me to maintain boundaries and not be triggered. Eg if I hear someone ranting about something which technically might make me stressed as well (eg officr gossip which really reflects their stress about salaries – hence they are bs-ing ) I try to distance myself. I don’t write the person off. I recognize that they have some weaknesses but they also have some good points. I don’t just see the b.s. tendencies in others, I also see that some of this bs comes from their insecurities and fears. And I see that they have some good in them, or at least are good for some company sometimes. So I meet them on those terms – I manage our interactions when they are stressed so it doesn’t trigger stress in me, and then I enjoy our time when they are relaxed and can be present and friendly. My good friends don’t do this as they are secure around me and will just tell me the truth of how they feel.
Everyone has a lot of bs in them. I do. You do. The difference is some people are aware of this and don’t want to pile it on to others. They don’t want to bring others down. The energy people give off is your indication of whether they are just deceiving themselves or they have recognized that they are human and others are human.
That said, I do think this tendency makes it harder to find an intimate partner. And maybe that’s not such a bad thing.
Once again….a SPOT ON assessment of this all too common and painful experience!!!
Thank you so much! This has really helped to shed a lot of light on my situation one month post breakup.
The article has helped me too. I now understand why I feel cheated somehow by the future faking. Also I feel angry because initially I was only looking for a casual thing, so there was absolutely no need for him to have future faked me to get me to stick around in the first place! I had been planning on sticking around without any promises of anything! But he kept spinning me this web of dreams and after 6 months of consistently saying the same thing to me, I starts to think he must really mean it. I starts to think, I wasn’t looking for commitment but its a lovely dream he’s spinning, so why not go with it? And I’m suckered in and I commit to him, like he keeps saying he does to me, and it no longer feels like a casual thing. Then as time moved on and nothing changes, I gradually lose faith that the dream will ever become reality, so I feel cheated out of the future I thought we’d have. I think, what did I do to deserve this? He didn’t have to play me like this! I wasn’t even looking for promises! Now I see its about him “getting high on romance” as Natalie says, and that’s why he did it (still does it, except I no longer believe). He used me to make himself feel better, with no regard for my own feelings or how he has hurt me. That’s why I’m angry. It’s not a very nice thing to do and so my opinion of him lowers. So sad. x
Exactly what I needed to hear today! Just got out of my “relationship” with an EU-MM, which lasted for about two months, but the drama kept dragging on for almost 9 months after all was over.. I suddenly realized that I have been trying for months to recreate “the most amazing time/ the time in heaven” as he himself used to call it, I wasn’t aware of that all this past time bit once I was, I just felt a complete shut-down.. Now I have been NC for almost 7 weeks, but I keep seeing the asshole at work and he of course tries all the tricks in the books, from blowing hot and cold to ignoring me to flirting with other women in front of me, but it’s just nothing.. I feel like a zip was just drawn and I became completely ‘closed’ and immune towards his tricks.. By the way, this article sheds a new light on the whole thing, I mean I knew he caused me a lot of hurt in some way, but I never thought about it this way.. I never realized that actually the whole thing was a con from the very beginning and THAT is how he hurt me.. I also agree with “17 years single”‘s comment and that I must have been trying to hide something about me and avoid intimacy myself to get drawn into this kind of dynamic.. Anyway, I thank God I got rid of my feelings for him and finally got to see him for who he really is, and got the courage to cut him off ..
You’ve been inside my head, Natalie. This is an amazing post and explains everything that I experience in the toxic marriage I was in until the a-hole of an ex-husband decided he wasn’t going to stay around any longer, having put me through misery with his selfishness and arrested development. Well, the woman he went to – within a month! – who was love-bombing him on FB (she knew about me) will have surely found out by now that he’s a fake and a liar, and that he hasn’t a responsible bone in his whole body. The only reason he’s stayed with her are for the financial benefits and because he too lazy to start again by being on his own for a while.
Hello,
I just wanted to say thank you for opening my eyes to everything. I have been struggling with bad relationships my whole life thinking that I was doomed to never be happy. I am currently going through a no contact period with a “Mr. Unavailable “ right now and I am hurting so bad. But 1 of the major points you bring up in your pod casts etc is, is that we go in to this “fairy tale” mode thinking that things might change or be better or whatever that may be. I have literally stopped myself 4 times this morning alone in this mode. Telling myself this is all in your imagination so STOP and move on. It’s a hard reality but its so true, also to your point even if this person did reach out to you what would REALLY come out of it? An ego stroke and then things will revert right back to the way they were. No way can someone change who they are or their thoughts towards you permanently in a few weeks.
So thank you! xoxox
I just ended things on early Saturday morning with the guy I have been seeing exclusively for the past 3 months. I’ve known him for almost a year. He was one of my coaches at a gym I went to for crossfit. We would speak daily and get together on the weekends. I started feeling him pull away, so I leaned back- which worked for a short period of time. He told me he had been married before (me too) and that he cheated towards the end. My marriage ended due to lack of trust from cheating. When he moved to my state from California two years ago he was in a long distance relationship. Last month, I went to a friend’s birthday party and he was in a crossfit competition. He placed 2nd and showed me the pictures- he never invited me to come watch, but I had plans that day anyways. He mentioned that another girl from the gym (who I know) went as a group and took his photos. This felt weird to me as I looked at his photos while he sat next to me. I didn’t act on my feeling. Later that week, I couldn’t take it anymore and asked if he had invited her to go to the comp- he said no, she asked to go. I asked if they rode together to the comp- he said no. He asked if I was angry with him. I replied no, he is allowed to have friends and I understand he is a coach. I knew that they were friends too. She is single and joined the gym 7 months ago. Fast forward- Last Thursday I mentioned the possibility of spending some time together soon. He stated he had to work a double on Friday. I said that’s ok just let me know when is good and we can make it work..I would love to see you. I couldn’t sleep and woke up early Saturday morning. I checked all of my social media outlooks until I could fall back asleep. I got on snapchat (which I never use) and started looking at unopened messages. I noticed there was a map feature on one of the messages, so I clicked on it. This feature allows you to see where anyone is that is using the app if the location is enabled. There was my beau…at this girl’s house last checked in at 12AM and it was now 4AM. I thought maybe they were all just hanging out and that was the last time he checked the app. I couldn’t sleep afterwards. It’s now 5:00 AM- I checked again and it stated he was active 5 min ago at her apartment- he obviously stayed the night. I texted him good morning and asked him to call me after work or whenever he’s not busy (my daughter had a soccer game early that day anyways)- that it would only take a few minutes and to have a good day. He called me..I missed it..got coffee..then returned his call. I told him I couldn’t do this anymore and about what I saw. He was thrown off, said they’re just friends and he slept on the couch. I told him I just can’t..he said he didn’t know what to say. We texted a twice later that day then I finally replied back to him on Wednesday with no response from him. I didn’t really expect one. I feel bummed..but I know things will improve. I really liked him which is a big step for me since my divorce. I’m just glad I knew the signs. Thank you, Natalie…for all of your postings…you really have no idea how much you have helped me since stumbling upon your site in 2013.
I was in a friendship/fuzzy blurred lines relationship with a EU Narcassist for almost 8 years. This was my thinking so sooo long. When he would disappear and do things I was not used to, or somehow hurt my feelings I would always say “Well he never used to be like that, he has changed!!”. I would try to defend his actions to friends and family. I lost many friends because of him. They told me he was no good for me, and that he was selfish but I never listened. My heart was bigger than my brain. I felt as though I could change this man, and that things would work out but they didn’t. After he did not return a text during a very bad time in my life when I needed him most, I saw that red flag loud and clear. I saw him for who he was and who he COULDNT be. This man is a coward. He moved away months ago, and I do miss the good times we had. The man he used to be when I met him was just a dream because he was showing me what he thought would rope me in. It certainly did. By the time all was said and done, I had seen him – the raw side of him and it made me sick that I stuck with him for so long and accepted his behavior. He still tries to text me for ego boosts and I am guilty of answering at times because I think he will be different. He isn’t. He disappears on me feeling gutted. I am working very hard to let him go fully…he will never be who I thought he was and the ugly side of him is who he really is and I wish others would see that. Save yourself.
Exactly the same, down to the fuzzy “was it even a relationship / did it actually happen/was anything real?”
Went on over a year, 1 year NC just passed and I still feel just as hurt and betrayed and confused and humiliated.
Over a year of dragging me around and using me emotionally, then he didn’t even want to use me in the physical sense. What was the point? Did I ever even exist to him?
Even though I’m with someone so much better, I just can’t get rid of the hurt and anger and resentment and find myself holding him at arms length. I’m terrified of losing 10, 20 years of my life to a compulsive liar or cheat etc the next time.
He’s not even sorry for the way he treated me, no remorse or regret at all.
Not sure I’ll ever get past it.
@Lila – I’m sure you did mean something to him but these men are soooo narcissistic . The one I spoke of randomly texted me yesteday. He wanted something. The only time he replies now is if he wants something. It was quite funny because in his conversation he mentioned how selfish he can be. You think? This man cares so much about friends and feels bad when things happen but I feel invisible – what about me? What about what we had? You aren’t alone. Please do yourself a favor and realize that it wasn’t you it was him. I know that it’s a struggle now and will be for awhile but you desrve better !!
I was in a relationship with an extremely charming, brilliant guy, who, now that I look back, is probably on the sociopathic scale somewhere. He had no genuine empathy.
When his behavior toward me changed and became extremely (psychologically) abusive, i blamed myself for a long time, thinking that he had changed his behavior toward me because he had gotten to know me better and hadn’t liked what he’d seen. Now it’s obvious to me that that was just who he was from the get-go.
In hindsight, I should have listened to his ex, who told me all about how terrible he was shortly after things had gotten serious between me and him. At the time, I thought she was just jealous. Now I realize she simply knew him much better than I did… Live and learn.
By the way, this happened almost a decade ago, and I am happy to say that I’m now in a mutual, loving, and respectful relationship. 🙂 The sooner you get rid of the person who isn’t right for you, the sooner you free yourself to find the one who can actually make you happy!
Ugh, this all just happened to me. After a terrible on/off five year relationship, I dated around for five years but was still extremely wary and nothing stuck. Over the summer, I met a guy through friends. He came on very strong, and having read all the posts about “fast forwarding,” etc., I was cautious, but his actions were matching his words. We only knew each other about a month but went out several times and did group things with friends and also went on a short vacation together, during which we got along famously. I began to allow myself to hope that his flowery compliments which did often sound over the top were “just his way” and he was a genuinely good guy.
All of a sudden he lied about another woman coming to visit him, and I broke it off. A couple of weeks of back and forth, in which I finally agreed to meet to talk. Then he started the pull back. My friends suggested I offer one more time. I did and he did some kind of “Maybe I can meet but I might be sick” kind of thing. Lots of talk of being “busy busy” at work. (Before this he had all the time in the world for me.)
Anyway, it wasn’t a long relationship but it’s still a letdown. At this point, the mourning has gone on longer than the actual relationship! He set up such high expectations that didn’t need to be set up. I guess he did it because he’s immature or for his own ego or to fast forward to what he wanted (though, oddly, he never pressed sex on me). Maybe he lives in a fantasy world and when things started getting real, he couldn’t deal. Who knows.
Just kind of depressed tonight. A part of me keeps asking what happened, how did this go from a guy thinking I was the greatest thing since sliced bread (and telling me this daily) to him not even bothering to return messages, not wanting to work on things, etc.
You’re right. He didn’t “change.” Just who he really was came out. Luckily he showed it fast. Bummer though.
Your story resonates so well with me, this guy sound like a copy of the guy I went out with and now recovering from.. From my experience, you’re right in marking him as ‘immature’, they are both clearly are, plus I think that because of his immaturity, he isn’t really looking for something serious, this type of guys just looks to get high on ‘romance’ and drama, but that’s it no future plan.. Also, from the sound of it, he sounds like a bit Narcissist.. It could be really useful to read Nat’s post about 20 mindsets about Narcissists, it surely helped me a LOT.
Thanks, Recoverer. Yeah, now that I have a bit more distance, it’s all kind of amusing. He tried soooooo hard to make me fall for him, and when I kind of did a little bit, he was all “Whoops! I didn’t mean that.” I just feel sorry for more naive women who fall into his trap. Oh well, onwards…
I wish l had all this wisdom and knowledge years ago. I learnt the hard way and now making a calm and peaceful life for myself . Every single man l have ever met has let me down, and l let myself down by allowing them into my life in the first place. The relationship l have with myself is now my priority. No longer looking for approval from anyone else. I appreciate there must be some kind decent men out there, rare for me to find one who isnt full of shit. Its actually quite liberating living life on your own terms, wild and free. I’ m in no rush to change it now. I think relationships are very overrated.
Agreed. If a good man falls in my lap, great. But I’ve long since lost my luster for trying to find one. You’d have better luck finding a needle in a haystack. Life is too short. I have lots of things I want to accomplish, and when I look back on my life, I don’t want to say “I went on 30,000 mediocre dates with mediocre dudes who acted like I should be honored they’re giving me the time of day.” I’m sure there’s some good ones out there, but by my age (early 40s) they’ve been snapped up. And even the horrible ones always manage to find someone. At least in my town!
I am planning to do the exact same thing! Get back to being me and live life on my own terms. I have also begun to think that maybe humans were never designed to be in long term monogamous relationships, maybe that’s why so many relationships go wrong? Its just a thought, I don’t know if its true. x
Monogamy is actually a fairly new concept & and it used to be a given that both parties would mess around, at least in the upper echelons of society. Women, of course, took a much much bigger risk when they did this. Pregnancy, reputation, etc. These days, we not only live longer than ever, we expect monogamy more than ever. Seems like kind of a recipe for disaster, though some manage it. My great-grandparents did for 60 years. At least, so far as I know. Then again, they didn’t have the internet… haha.
I am on the same page. Heard so many tales of bad apples in men that it has put me off dating completely. Having been on my own with no serious relationship for nearly 7 years there are times I do miss company and friendship. At the moment I am going through a tough time and am not in the position to consider a man even if a good one fell in my lap.
Two of my female friends have backed off when I need them. One is waiting on eye surgery and wouldn’t arrange a day for coffee at her place. I even suggested putting something in our diaries and if she got her op date we could cancel and she just wanted to leave it. But she can go to a Zumba class and other events but not see me! So I’ve got the hint and won’t be contacting her again in a hurry.
She also distanced herself at a recent social event when she could have kept a seat for me and didn’t. It seems to me that I am better on my own as all that happens is people I make friends with just let me down and then you feel even lonelier. You’d think in their 50s or older people would value friendships but no that isn’t the case.
I am tired of putting myself out there and being friendly to people then being let down. I’d rather do things on my own terms now and be EU as then there is no hurt. So these situations don’t just apply to men they apply in all walks of life. I learnt a long time ago that there is no point giving CPR to something that is beyond resuscitating and I can take a hint.
Great post, awesome comments. Learning to love and accept ourselves is a big step forward. Self love and self care are also key for a healthy and happy today – and tomorrow. Self compassion, vulnerability, being honest with ourselves, all good stuff. A close friend likes to say that if we are not honest with ourselves, we can’t be honest with anyone else.
It all starts with ourselves, and how we treat and view our own beautiful selves.
What a great article. This has made me feel so much better. Thanks Natalie
This is a fabulous post. This happened to me three weeks ago. Almost word for word. He fast forwarded and I didn’t know what hit me. But silly man. He did something which totally crossed a boundary for me and that was it. I am so glad we have someone like Natalie who talks absolute sense. Thank you.
I am a late bloomer, 75 years old. Finally, I am beginning to realize that fast forwarding a relationship cannot end favorably, well, unless both parties are mature enough to discuss everything and decide they still want to continue working on the relationship. Also, there is a lot more to consider once one has reached the seventies and working on a future with an almost 80-year old.
This is exactly what happend to me, it took me months of wondering why did he change, why couldn’t he stay the man he was at the beginning, what had I done to change him, until it dawned on me that’s who he is. Whether he was with me, or the woman he left me to go back to, he was still the same with her as he was with me. Nine months on I know it wasn’t me and reading posts like this one remind me of that.
I am 53 dating a 42 old young lady it’s 7 weeks into the relationship and she is on a emonitional trip.
What can I do to help her.Been over sensitive .
I’m looking for some insight and advice on my crazy situation. My rational side knows what I need to do, but my heart is breaking over this man and I’m so devastated and just don’t know how to get through this. Thanks to anyone in advance who reads this long post and gets through the whole thing.
First I’d like to just give a quick background of myself and the situation that led me to meet the man I’m currently involved with. I’m a busy 45 year old woman living in the northeast, recently divorced only 4 months ago. I work a demanding full time job and have two young children (10 and 5) with my ex-husband. I was with my ex-husband for over 20 years. Over the course of our marriage I saw him to be the narcissistic and judgmental man he really was. Our marriage lacked love and affection. I was afraid to truly be myself or speak my mind with him because I always felt that I would be judged, criticized, or overruled. My love for him had faded away even before we got married, but I “settled” because by that time we were in our 30s, I wanted to have children, and I wasn’t mentally or emotionally prepared to walk away and start over. I thought having a family would solidify our relationship. After having children we grew further apart. He has a very bad temper and was frequently very harsh on the children, saying cruel things to them, especially my older son. I filed for divorce in September of 2016, and the divorce judgment was finalized in June 2017. It was an absolutely terrible divorce. In November of 2016, he hired a private investigator to hack into my phone and access all my texts and emails. He had someone follow me at one time. There were recording devices in my bedroom and in my car. I located the recordings that my ex had tried to hide on his iphone and discovered that he had installed a tiny recorder under the hood of my car to record all my conversations. My cell phone was wiretapped and he listened to all my phone calls. He remotely accessed the video recorder on my cell phone to trigger it to take video and audio recordings of me when I was with other people. He constantly confronted me with the information he “discovered” by these means, with printouts of texts and emails and questions about phone conversations I had. He made up outrageous stories of my friends scheming against me and posting disparaging things about me on websites and social media. On top of this, he also hacked into the cell phone of a work colleague I had been having casual lunch dates with and confronted me with private information about him. I describe all of this to give you an idea of the awful terror and intimidation I was feeling at that time. This was all happening with us still living under the same roof because my ex refused to move out of the house until the courts basically forced him to.
This brings me to April 2017, six months ago. I was feeling terrible stress over the harassment from my ex that had now been ongoing constantly for 5 months. So April of 2017 I was feeling particularly stressed and lonely and found myself browsing the “Casual Encounters” section of Craigslist, something I don’t normally do and had never done before. I thought that having a casual fling would be a fun distraction from my troubles and that maybe it would be nice to feel wanted by a man. I found a man we’ll call “B”, 13 years younger than me, who had posted an add looking for a friend with benefits. The details of his ad said that he was a Boston-area professional who travels often for work and is looking for a fwb to have fun with when he’s in town. I answered his ad and by the next day we were texting each other. I learned at this time that he had just recently come out of a 3 year relationship that had its share of troubles, and that he had a history of meeting people on Craigslist for one-time encounters and short-term sexual affairs (both women, and couples). We met for lunch a week after I responded to his ad. During this lunch he told me that his extensive travel schedule prevents him from having a relationship, and that’s why he’s trying to find someone with which to just have a casual fwb situation. After lunch we had sex at a nearby apartment where he often house sits. After this encounter I wasn’t sure that I wanted to see this man again, but over the next couple of weeks my mind kept drifting to him. One day I was out with a couple of friends, and they both told me that I shouldn’t get involved with him because of his history of casual flings and because he’s only looking for a fwb, and because of my vulnerability I might end up falling for him and getting hurt. That same night he texted me to see if I wanted to get together the next day. I put him off for about another week, unsure of whether I wanted to pursue anything with him. We did eventually meet up for sex, and after that we started seeing each other about once a week. It was always just for mid-day sex. We live about 50 miles apart but work near each other when he’s in the Boston area and not traveling, so meeting up at the apartment was the most convenient option. The sex was very intense and so different and more enjoyable than anything I had ever experienced. Although the first few sessions were somewhat impersonal, they became more and more intimate over time and he was very affectionate toward me. Our sessions would last hours sometimes, and end with us laying naked together in bed, kissing, with his arms around me, talking about all kinds of things, including our feelings and the “relationship.” He made me feel special and wanted and respected. He said I was smart and amazing and beautiful. I also found him to be an attractive, smart, intelligent, and interesting man. I quickly developed feelings for him, and I made him aware of that when he pointed out one day that it seemed like I was getting attached. At that time he admitted he also had feelings for me, but that our “situations” prevented us from having any kind of traditional relationship. About two months into our relationship, we spent the night together at a hotel. We had many intimate moments that night and I felt very close to him, but as I was lying there in his arms he brought up our feelings for each other and once again stated that we were prevented from moving forward because of our situations (which he clarified as me having just coming out of a difficult marriage, and him just getting out of a long term relationship which had its own problems). At this time he also shared with me that he was disillusioned by traditional relationships and had been reading a lot about polyamory as something he might want to explore. During this conversation he also told me that now that I’m getting divorced I’m “free” and should be going out on dates and getting love and attention from men like I deserve to, and be pursued by many suitors. Needless to say, I was a bit put off by this since I was feeling so close to him that night and I had made clear to him by this point what my feelings were for him.
So to give a little history on B. As I mentioned he’s 32. He’s never been married, no children. He works in international real estate and travels extensively for work. He often works weekends entertaining clients. His parents were both abusive alcoholics and died young. His father killed himself and his mother died of natural causes. He has a brother on Long Island who is married with two kids who he is not close to. As far as I’m aware he has no other close family members. He lives with a roommate who is a childhood friend and also happens to be the brother of the ex-girlfriend he recently split up with. While he was in graduate school, he had a 2 year relationship with a woman. When they met, she told him that she could never marry a white man because her family was traditional and expected her to marry within her race. Despite that they spent 2 years together. He described her as very sexual and they had many experiences with other people, including threesomes with women and men, swinging with other couples, and group sex. After 2 years he asked her to marry him and she turned him down, reminding him that she had to marry someone of her race. He was devastated by this and I suspect from things he has told me and the way he speaks about her that he’s not fully over her and is still carrying baggage from that break up. He also told me that he tried to reach out to her at some point recently but she didn’t respond.
I have never been able to locate B online or on any social media with the name he gave me. I asked him if he had given me his real name when we met and he said yes. A family friend is a private investigator and I asked him to look him up, and he told me that he could not find anyone with this man’s name or date of birth in any of his databases. I never knew the name of where he worked. I never saw a business card or his drivers license. He always paid cash when we went out for lunch.
In mid-June, over lunch one day, he told me that there was a chance he may be moving to the west coast for his job. By this time I still had never been invited to his apartment, and he told me that it was because his roommate was the brother of his recent ex, and she thought they were getting back together. He said that he saw his move out west partly as a way for him to “escape” that situation.
Another month or so went by with us in status quo, meeting around every week or so for sex. In between the sex we would text each other. Some of the text conversations were more involved than others. He blew hot and cold. Sometimes I would just get a single text saying “thinking of you” in a 24 hour period and it would be like this for days. Other times he would actually engage with me and we’d have nice conversations. Sometimes he would even open up a little and tell me how close he feels to me and share his feelings for me. His walls rarely came down but when they did it just melted me. We never spoke on the phone. One day I casually mentioned this to him, the fact that we never have phone conversations, and told him that it would be nice to hear his voice once in a while. He responded with something like, “Eh, I talk on the phone all day for work and I just can’t do it when I’m not working. I’m not a big phone talker.”
A lot of our text exchanges involved me asking for more in the relationship, wanting reassurances from him, and trying to find out where he sees things headed (all mistakes I made, I realize now!) We would always come away from these conversations in the same place. He would tell me that he doesn’t know what’s in the future for us but that our current situations prevent a traditional relationship, and a committed relationship right now would be a mistake for both of us. He would tell me over and over how much he cares for me and that he has feelings for me, that I’m an amazing and beautiful woman. But he would reiterate his position that he thinks I should be spending time with other men, although at the same time telling me that he was conflicted and wanted me all to himself. He exhibited jealousy sometimes. I was never seeing any other men at this time, and I don’t believe he was seeing any other women either. We both agreed that if either of us did or planned to, we would let each other know.
Three months into this arrangement, I fully realized that I was falling in love with this man and that I was not getting my wants and needs met. The longing was getting to be too much to bear, and I knew the situation wasn’t sustainable. I wrote him an email explaining to him that I had been thinking about my needs, and that in order to be true to myself, I had to at least tell him what they were. I told him how much I liked him and enjoyed spending time with him. I told him that I wanted to see him more, and to do things together like go out for dinner or maybe see a movie, or go places together (up to this point sex was our only activity apart from going to lunch a couple of times). I also explained to him that I realized that this was never meant to be more than a physical relationship, so if he felt he couldn’t meet those needs I would understand. We ended up having a long talk the next day. He said he would love to see me more and do things together, but that he was worried about “what comes next.” He said he was afraid of getting hurt and was trying to protect his heart. He said that he was afraid that I wasn’t ready for a traditional relationship just having gotten divorced, and that maybe I thought I wanted a relationship but really don’t. However, we did in the end agree to give it three months. We would spend more time together and do things together, and after the three months we would revisit the conversation and assess what we both want. I also agreed that in those three months I wouldn’t bring up the “where is this relationship headed” topic. During this conversation he asked me if I’d like to go to a baseball game with him. He suggested when he travels down to NYC for work I could come down and spend a couple of days with him. He made some other very nice suggestions for ways we could spend time together. During this lunch, he also said that he’d love to meet my kids. When we parted ways that day, we made plans to meet for dinner the following Monday night, and for him to come down to my area the following weekend to go out and do things together. I drove home that day feeling conflicted. Part of me was on cloud nine because, for at least the next three months, I was going to get to see him more and spend more time with this man I was falling in love with. The other part of me was worried because of the ambivalence he had expressed, which I know was a reflection of the feelings he expressed to me early on – not wanting a commitment, wanting to explore polyamory, and disillusioned by traditional relationships. The bubble quickly burst, because a couple of days after this conversation, I got a text from him saying that he had to travel to the west coast for work for four days. So our Monday dinner was cancelled. After this he was very quiet, barely texting me, until the day he was supposed to come back to Boston, he sent me a text saying that his trip was being extended and he was going to be gone for two weeks. During those two weeks I barely heard from him. I would get an occasional sext, or “I miss you”, with total silence in between. The day after he came home he asked me to come see him. When I arrived he said we needed to talk and asked me to go for a walk. He told me that it was now a sure thing – he was moving to the west coast. The move would be happening soon, within the next six weeks. I was devastated, crying. He tried to console me and we ended up having sex at the apartment. It was sad and pathetic sex – we stopped a couple of times because I started crying. He told me he’d still be back in Boston at least once a month because his job would still be based here and he’d have to come to the office when not traveling on the west coast. I ended up texting him later that day telling him I needed space because I had to think about all of this. He continued reaching out to me and one week later we met again for sex. That day when we were lying together he asked me if I’d come visit him on the west coast, to which I said of course, I’d love to. He said that he’d make a point to see me every time he’s back in Boston.
The rest of August he traveled almost the entire month. And there was more of the same hot and cold, with days of silence or near-silence broken up occasionally by more engaged conversations. One day when I was missing him a lot I asked him to send me a picture of himself so I could see his face. He didn’t, and gave me an excuse about how his phone is used for work, and all his photos are downloaded to his work server because he’s supposed to be taking photos of properties for his job. So no selfies or personal photos are allowed on his phone, apparently. In this same conversation we got on the topic of what my friends think of him (even though he’s never met them). I asked him if he’s told any of his friends about me and he said no, that he doesn’t discuss his personal life with his friends. I got very upset at this point and he asked me what was wrong. I told him that I hate being a secret, I hate never being able to go to his apartment, I hate that he won’t send me a picture of himself, I hate that he’s moving away… all of it. He got a little defensive and a small argument followed, but we ended with him telling me that he would love to meet my friends, and maybe we could do it that week. So the next day we made plans for him to come down and go out with me and two of my friends. Surprise surprise, the day before we were supposed to go out he texted me and told me he had to fly down to NYC for work.
Near the end of August, during one of his increasingly frequent cold spells, he randomly texted me and told me that he would be hiking in Alaska that week and would be “off the grid” for a while. I got upset about the fact that he never told me about this until just before leaving, but I just wished him a good time and left it at that. He told me he would be back the following week and wanted to see me. Later that night, he sent me a text saying that he wanted to explore sexually with me – three ways and sex with another couple. We had talked about trying this earlier on in our relationship but it never really went anywhere and he let it go. This new suggestion came out of nowhere and we had not talked about it in at least 2 months. And the timing was very odd. I was very upset that he was now bringing it up again with the recent news that he was moving, and also in the middle of one of his “coldest” spells ever (I was rarely hearing from him at this point). I told him I was upset and it turned into a text argument that went all night. Finally in the morning he admitted that he was having a difficult time dealing with his emotions around moving away from me, and that he was trying to adjust. But at the same time he told me that it seems like a “good time” for me to expand my boundaries sexually.
We did end up seeing each other when he got back from Alaska. We had sex and cuddled afterwards as usual. During the cuddle session he told me about a woman that was in his hiking group who climbed into his tent in the middle of the night. He said that I was the reason he didn’t have sex with her. During this same conversation he once again told me that I should be out dating other men and exploring all my options, but that he would always want to see me every time he’s in Boston.
A few days later, feeling overwhelmed and upset and confused, and knowing that his move was coming, I told him I needed a break. My plan was to not be in contact with him for at least a month to try to let my emotions cool off and to disentangle from him. We ended up talking and arguing over text over many things. During this time I told him that I was upset that he never shared with me until last minute that he was going away to Alaska and would be unreachable. He told me that I was the only person he told, and to him that was being close to me and sharing, and that he feels closest to me than anyone else in his life right now. I told him that I was in love with him. He said he knew it and had known for a long time and that he loved me too. But at the same time, it was in this particular conversation where he was the clearest about not making a commitment to me. I asked him if, after his move, he could at least commit to being in more frequent contact with me, if we could talk on the phone occasionally, and if we could commit to not seeing any other people. He basically said he couldn’t do that. He said “love doesn’t conquer all.” He said the silence when he goes distant is his defense mechanism against getting too close. He told me that he’s afraid to get too close to me, and afraid of me getting too close to him. He’s afraid of me having expectations that he can’t meet. He said he wouldn’t be able to handle the distance. He said that he would hate to promise me these things when he doesn’t think he can keep those promises, and we’d end up having to have an even more difficult conversation later on. He said he’s done with traditional relationships because they always end up with lying, cheating, and big dramatic breakups. An analogy he used was that I’m looking for sustenance from him as you would get from full meals, but that we really need to keep what we have as ice cream – an occasional sinful treat. I did tell him that I understood his feelings, but that this was all very difficult for me and that I needed the time apart to heal and try to move on from my feelings for him. He was very understanding and supportive, but did continue reaching out by text. He was traveling and suggested getting together the following week, but changes in his travel schedule and weather problems kept him away. He was again very distant during this time, except for one or two exchanges. In one of those exchanges he again brought up me seeing other men. He said he didn’t want to think of me as being a “sad and lonely camel” waiting for him to come into town as my oasis to get love and attention and affection. He suggested that I join a dating site to go on dates with men to get attention and feel desired but not have sex with them, and also post a Craigslist ad, and that would be just to meet people for sex to have those needs filled when he’s not around. I told him that I wasn’t interested in dating any men right now and needed to take time to focus on myself.
Feeling upset over all of this, I did end up joining a dating site as a distraction from B, and I went out on a date with a man. B and I had always had the agreement that if we dated or had sex with other people, we would let each other know. I sent him a text the following day and told him about the date. He acted casual and interested, and asked me how it went. I was reluctant to give too many details because I just didn’t feel comfortable having this conversation with the man I loved. He asked to see my dating profile and I showed him the screen shot with my photos. He made a comment about how I looked really sexy and must be getting lots of attention. I was giving one word answers and he said something about how I wasn’t giving him many details. After that he suddenly went silent for almost two days. I tried texting him a couple of times and he didn’t reply. I took this as a sign that he was upset or angry. When he finally responded to me, he gave me a story that he had left his phone in an Uber and had just gotten it back. The next day I told him that when I was out with the other guy, all I could think of was him. I told him that I was having a really hard time dealing with our recent conversation where he told me he could not make any commitment to me. I told him that in my past experiences, when a conversation like that happens, you make a clean break and move on. At that point he told me that maybe that was the best, that we make a clean break. I knew in my heart this was probably for the best but I was devastated. The next day he asked me to come see him that week, but I said no. He got upset by that and started acting cold and distant. He turned from sweet and understanding to mean, overnight. I told him that I had changed my mind and wanted to see him, but he now refused, saying my initial instincts on taking a break were correct. He told me I needed to explore other people more broadly, so that I can learn how to not rely on any one person for sex or love or affection or companionship. He practically demanded that I draft a Craigslist ad to send to him, and he’d help me edit it. I’m so desperate to please this man that I even went so far as to snap some sexy photos of myself that I was planning to use for this Craigslist ad, and sent them to him to look at. I emailed them to him, asking what he thought, with a little winky face, and he replied coldly, I like the other ones you sent me before better. He told me that I was obsessed with him and that it was unhealthy, and that I ruminate on everything and it sucks away from my happiness. He said he wanted to see me again and get back to “having fun,” but that he needed to see that I was “making progress.” All of this was being delivered in a very cold and somewhat angry tone. He was no longer the sweet and caring B that I knew. One night, he sent me a text asking me what my goals were before the end of the year. I gave it a lot of thought and listed out some things I’d like to accomplish, like meditate daily, be comfortable spending time alone, sign up for another long-distance triathlon, things like that. I even included a goal about how I’d like to try to get closer to some of my cousins because I don’t have any close family of my own. I included a heartfelt story about how one of my ex-husband’s sisters was like a sister to me, but now that the divorce has happened, I’ve had to let go of that relationship and I miss her. And his blunt response to all of this was, “Ha ha ha, all the goals except your ‘sexploration’”.
The following day was our last text exchange. I told him that going on dates and having sex with men I find on Craigslist was not the answer for me, and that I’d be spending this time focusing on myself. He made some odd statements like, “Of all the places I thought I’d leave you, I never thought you revert so easily.” And, “It bothers me that even after all the fun we had, you’re going to take those learnings and relegate them to some corner of your mind.” He said that he feared I would just fall into another traditional relationship because it’s the pattern I know, and that I see him as just a fling and didn’t really learn anything from it. He said we need to take this break in order for me to have the chance to explore other people, have different sexual experiences, and discover myself so that we can start “having fun” again. He also told me that he experienced many people via Craigslist after his breakup with the girl who wouldn’t marry him, and it helped make him the person he is. At that point I admitted to him that I had answered a few Craigslist ads to meet men (I did, but realized it was a bad idea and didn’t follow through on them). After telling him that, the texting went silent. A few hours went by, and I texted him that maybe he’s right, maybe I do need to go out and explore and find myself. He didn’t reply to that text either.
So that was over two weeks ago. I didn’t reach out to him again and he didn’t contact me either. I had planned on just letting him go. Three days ago I was feeling really down and sent him a text, telling him that I was thinking about him, and that I miss him and wish things could go back to the way they were. I immediately got an automatic response that said, “This number is not in service.” So he’s obviously blocked me or changed his number. Either way he doesn’t want to hear from me. I just could not believe that he could just disappear like that. He told me he loved me, that he felt closer to me than anyone else in his life. So why would he just cut me out? As a last resort to reach out to him, I sent him an email that was a way to say that it was nice to know him, I always enjoyed his company, I loved him, and wished him the best. I got no response for two days. This is where the story gets really bizarre.
I tried to email him again yesterday. I got an automated reply that appeared to be written by his brother. In the email the news was shared that B was hit by a truck and killed on October 4th in Vancouver. It said that his ashes will be scattered on a beach near his childhood home and that a memorial service will be held on October 14th (no place or time given), on what would have been their mom’s 65th birthday. The email appeared to be signed by his brother, sister in law, and niece.
I tried looking this incident up on google and couldn’t find anything. When a pedestrian is hit and killed it makes
the local news. I searched and searched every way I could and came up with nothing.
I wrote back to James’s email saying that I’m a friend of his, and asking that if anyone is monitoring his email, if I could please get information on his memorial services. I don’t know any of his friends or family so I have nobody I can call to get any information. That was almost a day ago and I have not gotten a reply.
I don’t know what to believe or which end is up right now. If it’s true that he is dead I am absolutely devastated. But almost as devastating is the possibility that he might be fabricating this in order to disappear and get rid of me. I just cannot believe that he would be capable of hurting me so deeply.
I miss him so much and I’m just so devastated. I think about all the intimate moments we shared and the heartfelt conversations. I remember how much care and support and concern he showed me when I was going through the worst of my time with the harassment and the restraining order against my ex-husband. I remember looking at his eyes once when he told me he thinks about me all the time and wants to be with me every day. Not even a month ago he told me he loved me and asked me to please trust him and not say goodbye. I just don’t know what happened to bring us to this point where he turned so cold at the end and now could potentially be going to the extreme of faking his death to get rid of me. I never did anything even remotely crazy to justify this kind of reaction. I am just so crushed, I can’t eat, can barely focus on my work or my children. I am consumed by thoughts of him. I can’t sleep. Every time I drift off I wake up again and wonder for a few seconds if this is all a bad dream. I feel so much regret. I keep thinking if I hadn’t pressured him so hard, hadn’t pushed him for a commitment, he’d still be here in my life. I think about those last couple of weeks before he disappeared and question whether I should have told him about dating the other man and wonder if that’s what ultimately drove him away. I think about things I did and things I said over the course of our relationship that I wish I could take back. I do realize it’s not all on me. I believe he is a wounded man with emotional issues of his own. I don’t know a lot about his childhood but he did grow up with two abusive alcoholic parents, and he spent a lot of his time as a kid retreating and escaping. He also doesn’t seem to have a positive history with romantic relationships. I know I can’t fix him or change him, and I can’t make him want me or love me. It just hurts so much because I had so many hopes and expectations, against my better judgement. I fantasized about going to those baseball games and those visits to the west coast to see him and thought they might be stepping stones to a real relationship. I saw the glimmers of what he could have offered if only he would let the walls down. I learned a lesson in that nobody has the power to take down anyone else’s walls. I could have been the most amazing woman in the world in his eyes, but it wouldn’t have mattered. He became my world in a way, and that was the problem.
And now on top of all this is the added awful confusion around whether he really died. My fear is that I will never know the answers to any of my questions.
Thank you everyone for reading this very long story and any advice you can offer.
For the love of God woman!.. What the hell are you doing to yourself??!.. Whether he really is dead or not is completely irrelevant, it is so apparent that this guy is just bad news from the get-go.. This is not ‘love’ that you feel, that is pathological attachment to a psychopath that is stemming from your own issues, made more blurred with some good shagging, that’s all it was..
Steer clear from this mess!.. I mean for Christ’s sake, the guy might have pretended to be dead to get rid of you, what more of a ‘hint’ do you need to run in the opposite direction?!.. Make hid disinterest in a committed relationship with you your ‘closure’ and yank yourself out of this.. And I recommend you get some professional help figuring out what issues from your past had got you attached to such a scum.. Good luck.
My first thought is that, regardless of whether or not he’s dead, being in a situation with someone where you don’t know for sure is pretty awful. It’s pretty much a pre-requisite for any working relationship that they can be reasonably assumed to have dead if they’re dead (or not if they’re not).
My second thought – because I’ve been caught by this one before – is that you heard he was a womaniser and assumed that, knowing this, it’d be a bit safer to get involved because it would be a very straightforward situation because he’d be honest and consistent about keeping the relationship casual. This then meant that, when he became emotional about your relationship, you were taken by surprise and assumed that he must mean it.
It’s taken me a long time to learn this, but womanizers don’t go around displaying no emotions and forming no attachments. They’re womanizers because they do display emotions and form attachments, but then they’re really inconsistent and amoral about the damage that they’re doing when they then use them to mess with your head.
My third thought is that he’s constantly goaded/enticed you into stating your feelings, and into a state of uncertainty and anxiety about the state of the relationship, then slapped you down for stating your feelings and being uncertain and anxious. Don’t feel bad about it.
My fourth is that it must be really difficult dealing with all of this with everything else that you have going on, not least caring for two young children. I can’t imagine it’s been easy trying to find the extra brainspace for all this mind-boggling.
Anyway, whichever which way, you don’t have to worry about it anymore. Either his unhappy confused life has ended early (somewhat predictably) or else he’s too evil to talk to again and you can focus on other things that might actually make you properly happy, and people who aren’t Schroedinger’s Cat.
Good luck xx
Exactly, Yoghurt. Successful womanizers are successful precisely because they know they have to make the woman feel loved and cherished or she won’t stick around for long. Woman need more than just wham bam thank you mamam. So soon they’re into the ‘you’re so special’ ‘I think about you all the time’ etc etc. Ooooh, but you’re so special but I can’t make you my girlfriend! Cause I’m soooooo damaged. Blah blah blah…. you know the drill.
Um, he’s faking this. He already told you you were stalking him. He’s desperately trying to rid himself of you. He wanted FWB, which you agreed to. Within weeks you were desperately trying to change the situation. You are clearly obsessed with him and he can’t give you what he wants. Of course he’s kissing and cuddling. He’s EUM and he can do that so long as the situation is “casual.”
Look, women can’t do FWB the way men can. Sex makes hormones bombard your brain and convince yourself you’re in love. Why on earth else would we risk pregnancy/death for a screw? Men don’t have this problem.
You were lonely and horny and tried to do FWB. It didn’t work. Now you know. Don’t try it again, it’s not for you. No shame in that. It’s not for most women.
Don’t date. You are traumatized from your crazy ex. Get into therapy. Make friends. Do things you enjoy. And most of all read every single post on Baggage Reclaim and pick up a copy of “Men Who Can’t Love.”
btw, this guy sounds very married to me.
Good luck, we’ve all been there.
Thank you everyone. I need these validations and wake up calls to make me see what this situation really was.
Another thing I didn’t mention is that early on in my relationship with B, I was presented with information that B was meeting women on Craigslist, taking them back to the apartment, and videotaping them without their knowledge. The videos were then loaded to “amateur cam” web sites and also distributed to other people. I was told that I was one of the women videotaped. I completely dismissed this at the time because it was my ex husband who told me this, and he was full of lies and constantly trying to intimidate and harass me. Now I’m wondering if maybe it was true. He wanted me for some amateur cam content but once I got too close he bailed.
I just don’t know what to think. It hurts so much because I really believed him and trusted him when I said he cared for me and loved me. I hate myself for that.
Don’t hate yourself. I did something similar after a very traumatic break-up. We want so badly to make our pain go away that we give ourselves a major distraction. It works, until THAT thing becomes painful too. You can’t switch one pain for another. Stay off CL and stop all this casual sex stuff. It’s not for you and not going to help you.
He may have loved, cared…. just NOT in the way you wanted, which was a real relationship. You are EU right now too or you wouldn’t have fallen for a guy like this. You ONLY fell for him because he was good in the sack and he/you were both EU. That’s it. You have nothing else to go on. This doesn’t make a healthy relationship.
At least you don’t have to go NC, as he’s “dead.” He’s doing it for you. If you REALLY want to know, call the Coroner’s office in Vancouver.
FWB is not like the movies. I’ve never once heard it leading to a real relationship IRL. Only pain, the vast majority of the time for the woman. Chemistry is different for us. As soon as bonding chemicals are released during sex, you’d think Hitler was awesome.
Please try to do all the things you told him you were going to do, but really only said to get his goat. Mourn him, or the him you knew – hey, at least he distracted you from your ex for awhile. Concentrate on yourself and your kids.
This will be a funny story one day, trust me. Good luck!
After all this and you still cannot see the writings on the wall? You allowed yourself to be a convenience to him and you let him get what he needed without the companionship that you needed. Get counseling. Until you are able to love, cherish, respect and appreciate yourself, the hope of finding someone who will is unlikely. No one should place their happiness in the hand of someone else. His brother didn’t write the email. He did and signed their names. Come on? How convenient that you could not reach him through his phone and then all of a sudden an auto reply from a ‘family’ member. If he died, I am sure the last thing the family thought about was canceling his phone service immediately. May you find peace in your heart to move on.
Oh you won’t find him through the Coroner because it sounds like he’s given you a fake name. This guy is certainly an operator. Sounds like he’s done this many times, and his “death” is usually his out, if he feels a “move” to the west coast or Alaska or wherever won’t work. So you won’t find evidence of his “death.” (Try to look up his relatives’ names on the auto-email. Find them? Likely not.)
In my personal opinion, here’s the lowdown: This guy is married, probably with kids. He likely travels for work, and he has a different woman in each place he travels to. When one gets to be too much of a pain in the derriere, or he just tires of her, he fakes a “move” or a death by truck or an avalanche or whatever. (btw, you can email/text from Alaska. It’s not “off the grid.”) He has numerous cell phones and uses one for each woman. He cuts off the cell (or blocks you) and sets up an auto email for your email. (He wasn’t giving you a picture so you couldn’t do an image search on Google and find his real identity.)
If you weren’t using condoms, please get yourself checked for SDTs. If he wasn’t using them with you, he won’t be using them elsewhere.
If you really want to go nuts (and I wouldn’t recommend this necessarily), keep an eye on Boston CL ads for awhile. He will use a different name, but likely a similarly-worded ad.
I’m a reporter and a natural detective, so I’d probably waste a few months trying to track this dude down too, but it’s a waste of mental energy.
And don’t be surprised if he one day comes back from the “dead” with some cockamamie story that one of his women got ahold of his email/phone and did all this while he was tied up in the closet…. 🙂
Seriously, this must be causing you some pain. I’m sorry for that. Whether he’s dead or alive, this guy was just going to cause WAY more damage. Trust me on that one.
Sorry to keep emailing, the detective in me is fascinated by this scenario. So many things I could point out here to prove this is a hoax, but here is one major one: His parents are dead (this is very likely not true, and something psychopaths often say), he has one brother in Long Island whom he’s “not close to” and no other real relatives. Yet his relatives are close enough to him to be able to get into his email to set up an auto-email about his death? They’d have to know the password. Now, why would they know that? Nor would they have been able to cut off his phone without a password to his account. My grandmother died and it took me months grappling with the phone company to get her phone disconnected. Yet his relatives he wasn’t close to somehow managed it?
Kelly, he’s faking. Take some solace that he’s not dead. He’s a major major operator. Sorry.
Kelly, if you want to test my theory, send him an email from a different address. If you don’t get back an auto-email, then he set it up specifically for your address. This should tell you conclusively what is happening as my guess is that he won’t set up an auto ‘dead’ email for all his contacts if he’s alive. Let us know what happens.
Diane, thank you for putting a smile on my face for literally the first time since learning of his “death”! I really needed that. I’m sitting here at the shore right now trying to get my head straight. Everything you say all fits the picture, and honestly these are all things that my friends have been pointing to for months that made him seem really shady. The funny thing is that when I sent another email asking for details of the memorial service and yet another sad email last night (I won’t be doing that again), I did not get any auto reply. Nothing. So somebody is messing around in his email account turning that auto reply on and off (likely him I suppose).
And yes I did attempt to google search the “relatives” that signed the email auto reply and came up with nothing.
One time early on in our relationship I sort of jokingly asked him if he had given me his real last name and if he was really traveling to California as he said he was. He said give me your address and I’ll send you a postcard to prove it. And when I get back I’ll show you my boarding pass. Neither of those things ever materialized.
It would be interesting to see whether he does pop up on Craigslist again, but why waste my mental energy. I need to focus on healing and breaking the bonds I had formed to this guy.
Thank you for the support!
Hi Kelly, yes, sounds like you have the right idea. Let this phantom go and work on yourself. That’s two narcs in a row and if you don’t work hard, you will get a third.
His relatives wouldn’t be in his email turning auto-reply on and off. It’s him. And he is absolutely loving your sad emails. It’s narc supply. He’s giggling over them. Don’t give him any more fuel.
I have lots of friends in RE. You do most of your work online, nor do you “entertain” clients. He’s made up some scenario where he travels all of the time. He probably just lives with his wife and kids.
Lie down with dogs and you’re going to catch fleas and CL casual encounters is a kennel.
I’m fascinated by this scenario but we shouldn’t hijack the thread, there are rules about that. If you want to keep me appraised I’m at [email removed].
Best wishes to you. Read ALL of BR and also head over to Love Fraud. Good luck!
I find that I forget what a selfish man he was when he texts and smooth talks me. I remember very quickly when I text him first asking him something and he doesn’t bother to reply. He can be very focused on helping someone because of a death in the family, or they are having a rough time but I never came 1st. When I needed him the most, he ignored my texts from the ambulance ride to the hospital. The final straw was many things- but him texting asking if I knew details about a mutual friend who had passed away, and then not answering me when I asked if he would be coming to town…. it set me off. He uses me for ego strokes if I text back. Ignores “real” texts. All I want is to see him in person to tell him how much damage he has done and agree with him – yes you are selfish and you are brilliant at hurting me. I have seen your true self and hope no one else does.
I recently walked a away from such a selfish and emotionally immature man. I met him a few years ago on vacation. I live in Canada and he in Belgium. We met several times a year for the last 2 years. He was always extremely sweet to me when he was with me but when we’re back home he ignored me and took days to respond to my emails. He told me he didn’t want a relationship and I was fine with it due to the distance. However, I expected him to be more emotionally supportive after everything we were going through. I finally opened my eyes to what was happening – whether what we had was real or a masquerade, it doesn’t matter anymore. I removed myself from his life by letting him know that I’ll be going on a long hiatus without an explanation or good bye. I hope he’ll respect it and leave me the f**k alone. He’s obviously scared $h*tless to have a relationship. We need to loose those shackles and set ourselves from men sitting on the fence. They’re robbing us of our time and our love.
I can understand all of your frustrations! Mine told me he loved me and had feelings but we couldn’t have a relationship – he has issues with commitment. He wouldn’t even commit to coming over to visit once he moved out of town. His schedule was tight and he would only be in town for short stints so stopping by would be difficult – yet he had no problem texting me on his terms and flirting up a storm. As soon as I asked him when he would be over , he would disappear. I know him so well and know how he does this – it doesn’t hurt any less. I have a lot to this man, and I got hardly anything back. I figured if I waited he would change, and everything would be dreamy, and perfect. Such bull. It angers me to know that he realizes he is selfish and he just figures I will take what little he gives me and it’s all good. Karma will come back around, and in the meantime I’m doing my best to ignore his texts and move on. Who knew a man could be like a drug…. he was everything I wanted except for the wolf in sheeps clothing.
You need to distance yourself from this guy. You are wasting your time. I hate to be blunt. He treats you like a doormat because you allow it. Please do not tell him how he has hurt you. It will give him more control. He obviously does not care, otherwise, he would have been more caring and considerate of your feelings – act like a real man or let you go. Instead he is stringing you along because he knows he has you wrapped around his little fingers. The final straw for me would have been when you texted him from an ambulance on the way to the hospital and got no response! You are only act this callus to someone you do not care or RESPECT.
What has helped me is reading the posts here and articles on self empowerment. Until we are able to love, cherish, respect and appreciate ourselves, it is unlikely we will find someone who will. Like you, I was hoping my guy would change. He told me he didn’t want a relationship and I was okay with it. I didn’t have high expectations when we met in person. As soon as we met he was addicted to me and even I was struggling for breathing room. He treated me like I was the only person that mattered. He had a nickname for me. He was protective and extremely caring and loving but as soon as we are home, everything stopped. He switched off. This went on for a few times (we met) and this last time is the final straw for me. Based on the two extremes I can’t tell what was real and what wasn’t. The few wonderful weeks together is not warranted for months (until we meet again) of misery and confusion. Why overwhelmed the h*ll out of me then leave me cold?? I get that maybe he’s scared. So am I. I couldn’t ever imagine going weeks without contact with the person I care about. How could someone impose that kind of pain on themselves (repress the love they feel for someone) instead of sharing the love with the people they love. It makes no sense to me. It’s not my job to help him figure his feelings out. Or he was a damn good actor. I’m out!!! I hope you find the courage to free yourself of him. Change your # and unshackle yourself from this selfish man!
It’s interesting that you mentioned how you didn’t know what was real and what was not. I have asked myself that a lot with him. To even consider that what he put me through was fake just so he could get what he wanted pisses me off. I can also relate to the breathing room- he would blow soooo hot and text me constantly, or ask if I wanted to meet at his place for drinks. After a few years that slowed down. It was almost as if he realized he had me, and he knew he had control over me so he didn’t chase as much. In any event, he showed his true colors right before he left, and the fact that he only texts when he wants something now, shows his cold heart. If I don’t text back I get s guilt trip string of texts. It’s tiring. Thank you for your words, I really appreciate the encouragement. It is not easy to let go of these men.
I understand it is easy for us to blame them for not giving us what we wanted. We also need to remember that we were also active participants in the relationships. Men are fairly simple when it comes to theirs needs and wants. Often time women don’t listen or pay attention to their actions and hope that we can change them. Timing could be wrong or we were looking for different things. They did warn us and shown us with their actions that they didn’t want a relationship. It was us that chose to give them the benefit of the doubt and hoped that they would change. We had the choices to walk away if we felt that our needs were not met. It took us 2 to 3 years to wake up and realize that this is the best that it is ever going to be. We can choose to stay and get crumbs or walk away. I am choosing to walk away. I will no longer sit on the fence. It price is too costly. I do not have 2 or 3 more years of life to waste.
https://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/sitting-on-the-fence-the-position-you-adopt-when-you-fear-making-mistakes-by-committing-to-decisions/
This totally rings true to my current ‘relationship’. It was a whirlwind romance to begin with – promises of undying love, passion, marriage, babies – the whole package from a handsome, charming man. We window shopped for engagement rings in January this year but there has been a gradual and dwindling availability of physical intimacy. We haven’t had any physical intimacy now for coming on to 8 months. I’ve tried to discuss it – initially it was he wasn’t feeling well and he’s too tired and stressed at work and I do acknowledge he is in a very stressful job. He still hugs me and holds my hand and is affectionate. I have told him that sexual intimacy is important to me as it is a way of bonding and it builds trust but it is still a no go. I have wracked my brain about what this all means for months and it’s driven me insane. Needless to say there has been no engagement etc. Are these the hallmarks of an emotionally unavailable man? Was he creating an illusion to suck me in and this is just who he is in a relationship? Is this the reason he has a long track record of long distance relationships which haven’t worked? He is an outwardly successful, handsome, charming, kind man so why have none of his relationships worked?
I’d be interested to hear anyone else’s take on this.
Cheers
My ex and I went 8 months without sex. He turned out to be gay. I’m not kidding. Be careful. At the time, I’d had a death in the family that was quite shocking (young girl) and he had some things going on, and we’d been together for 10 years, so I sort of overlooked the length of time. In retrospect, that was a big overlook. He was also affectionate, and emotionally open and available. Just…. didn’t want sex!
Thanks for your response. That’s interesting. How did you find out and what happened since?
One night, after ten years together, he told me he was “fantasizing” about men. He wanted to explore this. We went back and forth all night. In the morning, having a gut feeling that men don’t just “fantasize” I went into his computer. I’d had the password forever. There were emails, videos, etc. He’d been cheating on me with men for a few years. We broke up. That’s the short version.
That’s a terrible way to find out and after such a long time.
I found some porn in his internet history which was outdoor, gang bang kind of rough hetero… But I could only access one of his computers and haven’t been able to access his phone. This was only one episode over a few months of internet history so maybe he’s using his other devices or he’s just asexual? Who knows…I think I’ll have to try and access his other devices.
When/where had your partner been cheating on you? Did you not wonder where he was?
He was always with me. Apparently he’d meet up with guys during lunch break. No way for me to know this as we didn’t work at the same company. He was home every night, we spent every weekend together, etc. He was always available by phone/email. I was going under the age-old impression that if a guy was cheating he’d come home with lipstick on his collar (ha!), or there would be hang up calls or he’d be emotionally distant, etc. I saw none of this so thought he had low testosterone or something. He also looked at hetero porn occasionally. At any rate, I’m not sure it even matters what his deal is, you want a sex life and he can’t give you one. That’s all that really matters.
Hmmmm…. Sounds familiar! I’m gradually coming round to the fact that it doesn’t really matter what his deal is and that I need to move on either way. Thank you!
Is he traditional? Maybe he wants to wait to have s*x after marriage? It could be that he is suffering from ED, gay or has STDs? If he is not super religious, this behavior is very odd. Most men I dated (for a long time) were very attracted to me and it did not take them long to seduce me. The last guy I was with I met while on vacation. We shared a bed but did not have s*x because he didn’t know me and couldn’t get it up. But once he got to me in subsequent trips he was all over me. The better he got to know me the excited he got. He couldn’t keep his hands off me. It was not about s*x of course because he treated me great when we were physically together. He had one LDR before me and one gf (2 years) and they never spent the wknds together because he was too busy living his life. I found this odd! It explains why my ex fears commitment but not intimacy – at least not with me. The LD relationships could be sign that he is afraid of commitment and/or intimacy. LD allows him to minimize it or avoid it altogether. What does your guts tell you? Intimacy helps couples bond and if you can’t have that, you will be frustrated like you are now. I would talk to him about it and if you don’t get the adequate info you need I would move away from this one.
I met him through mutual friends add he had this reputation of being a bit of a ladies man so I was surprised when he was Luke warm with me in bed. I’ve had quite a few previous relationships and most men have been pretty quick to get me into bed – I’m not unattractive and I’m pretty sexual myself and I’m not shy, so initially I thought maybe I had come on too strong and perhaps it’s was overwhelming. Then I thought maybe he just needed more time to get to know me. I mean the sex has never been like ripping eachother’s clothes off passionate like you would expect if you’ve not seen eachother for some weeks but at least it was there. When we did do it, he was never really really hard and rarely finished which was odd to me too. He never let go and looked like he was really enjoying it so maybe he is gay or just asexual.
I know that there’s something that’s just not right. He is planning to move to be with me and things are in the pipeline with his work to transfer him over and he promises things will be different when we’re together but my feeling is that they will be just the same. He’s told his family about me and they always ask about me and when we’re getting engaged etc and I wonder whether he’s just keeping me hanging on so that it looks like he’s ‘normal’ to outsiders. I’ve tried to talk to him about all above and even begged him to please not do something like keeping me around for external appearances but he assures me it’s not the case. I’ve even asked him if he’s gay and he got offended and was upset that I’d gotten him to question his sexuality. This is really new territory to me as, like you say, most men can’t wait to seduce you. I have asked him countless times for physical intimacy and for us to schedule time to see eachother – we only live an hour’s plane ride away from Eachother but I feel that he’s making excuses. He’s not having an affair as far as I know. He loves his job and often uses it as a reason why we can’t see eachother. He will video chat with me every night for at least half an hour and message me during the day.
Recently I put my foot down and told him I could no longer do this relationship on his terms where my needs are not being met and tried to break it off with him but he cried and begged me not to leave him but then promptly got on a plane back to work – he told me he could make love to me right then and there, but he didn’t.
I do really love him and think we’re compatible in all other ways, but I know that without the physical intimacy, I will never be happy. I’ve asked him for and action plan with time line so that we can move forward. If I don’t see concrete action, I’m going to have to move on as I’ve been losing my sanity with there being no explanation for his behaviour. At the moment, I’m working through the fear of being without him and the loss of a future as I really thought this guy would be the father of my children.
Any thoughts?
MG I would say you need to get the hell out and now. Lack of sexual intimacy is the death knell to any relationship and I know as this was how my marriage became. But…… he couldn’t do it with me but could get it up for other women! He is a future faker who cannot deliver, is blowing hot and cold, resetting the relationship to his status quo. He has clearly done enough to make you think that there is something there but isn’t taking things to the next level. When a man isn’t interested sexually it erodes your sex appeal and confidence like nothing else except maybe adultery. Being luke warm in bed is with holding, playing mind games. and it will not get any better. You deserve better and for your own sanity please get out. This might not be what you want to hear but you did ask for our thoughts. I work on 2 strikes and out unless strike 1 is so bad. You have given him more than his share if chances and there is no future unless you want your self esteem broken and your heart ripped which could make you EU.
Thanks for your honesty.
I completely agree – I have gone from being a very sexually confident person to my self esteem being in tatters on the floor wearing my Bridget Jones knickers!
I’m gradually coming to terms with it and can see me being able to get out and regain my confidence in the next couple of weeks.
MG,
I was exactly where you are at over 19 months ago. I was always very self confident and self assured sexually. Cue EU/Narcistically-inclined ex. I didn’t think my self esteem could get any lower, but it did. His sexual dysfunction issues became my faut. At first, we would be able to have open discussions regarding his ED issues (him saying he was nervous around me, i.e. His “nice” way of blaming me). But as his mask started to drop and his true self started to show, he started using sex as a form of control over me and it became a game. It was obvious his ED took a toll on me and I started to become extremely insecure. He saw my weakness and utilized it as a power play. He would withhold sex from me to punish me if I “stepped out of line.” The more I would initiate sex as a way to “win” him, the more he would withhold. It became this sick, toxic cycle. I tell you my story because your relationship may head down this very path if he does move near you. He is showing you who is and what he is not capable of-having an intimate relationship with you.
You have already stated your self-esteem is in tatters on the floor. That is a glowing, neon, RED FLAG banner with blinking lights!!!! Please listen and pay attention to your feelings. I wish I would have ran the other direction at the first signal there were sexual dysfunction issues. Friends also asked if the ex was gay. It doesn’t matter if the person is gay, straight, has a preference for brunettes over blondes, likes a lot of junk in the trunk, what matters is how this situation is making you feel. And by your own admission, you feel awful about yourself. Put the focus back on you and not him or his issues. Is this how you envision being in a committed, loving relationship? Do you really feel this a is a mutually, copiloted relationship where mutual goals are met? Do you feel like an equal partner?
To be honest, the hardest part in getting over the relationship has been gaining my self confidence back in term of being sexually intimate with someone. I have not dated, let alone been intimate with someone in 19/20 months. I am facing my fear of having to vulnerable if I desire a heathy, sexual relationship. It’s not easy. But I know I am worth it. And so are you!
I wish you the best of luck.
Thanks for your comments – agree – I’ve thought about how I will feel when I get out of this relationship and have every belief I’ll become a dog lady! I’m not sure how I’ll cope with intimacy with someone else. This is a long way off from the person who used to enjoy a good healthy sex life. It is becoming clear that hanging around in this relationship is just becoming more and more damaging and it’s time to cut loose.
After being with my gay sex, I didn’t quite even realize how my self esteem had plummeted, and immediately got involved with a guy who basically wanted only sex. And he wanted a lot of it! It really soothed my ego and of course it’s a natural thing to want. But that just sped me into a relationship that was not right for different reasons. If only I could have combined the two men 😉 But I agree, you unfortunately need to cut him loose before you get to the point where you will judge the next man based solely on how much sex he wants. It’s tough, because I know what it is to be with someone who is compatible in every other way, esp. when there are so few committed and nice types out there. But the lack of sex will take its toll in many insidious ways. You sound strong. Let us know how it goes.
I meant gay “ex.” LOL. No edit button.
Thanks a lot Diane….I am strong most of the times, but I think it’s something about my age and my work/family situation that is making me feel so sick to my stomach about being alone – I work and live away from my mum, bro and to be honest, they’re not very supportive and I’m not that close to them. I’m 35 and am now coming to terms with probability I’m not going to be able to have a family of my own, so I’m trying to work through a lot right now and at times, I’m taken to dark places.
I hope you don’t mind me asking, did your ex give you any explanation as to why he was with you for all of those years? Did he feel bad that he’d made you live a lie for 10 years? How was it for you coming out of that? How did you get back into seeing/trusting men again?
Hi MG,
Well, first off, I wouldn’t immediately come to the conclusion that your guy is gay. That’s one possibility, but there could be others. Sorry I sounded so certain, but that tends to be where my mind goes, with good reason, ha. I don’t want to take up this thread with my “gay issues” lol, but feel free to email me at [email removed]. Would love to hear from you.
MG,
It is easy to fall into the trap of believing that because our own position is reasonable and just that the other person is somehow obligated to come over to our side. Your desire for a more robust sex life is natural and healthy and you have done the right thing by expressing your needs to him. However, it is a mistake to assume that any reasonable person “should” or “would” change to meet those perfectly reasonable needs. Any time you are expecting another person to change in order to make a relationship work you are setting yourself up for disappointment. It is unrealistic and unfair to expect someone else to change in order to make you happy. People can and do change, but they need to be the one driving that change.
Again… Excellent points. I think the thing is that he keeps on saying he’s tired or stressed or that something is wrong between us emotionally and that’s why he can’t perform and that he will be able to perform when we’re together in the same country. If he said ‘I’m just not that sexual’ or ‘i don’t find you sexually attractive’, then I would agree that he doesn’t have to change for me or for anyone but what is not acceptable is the lack of honesty and keeping me hanging on to suit his own agenda.
If he is being dishonest, asking him to cut it out is the same as asking him to change. It may be a reasonable request, but, in the context of a relationship,, it is not a practical one.
He may not have an agenda. He may be deep in denial. He may very well have convinced himself that things will be great once you are living together, he is under less stress, etc. This may be part of the reason why he has been able to keep you hanging on so long. He is so convincing because he isn’t consciously lying. A lot of men struggle to acknowledge their sexual shortcomings.
Instead of striving to understand the source of his lack of drive you would be better off directing your energy towards moving on. It doesn’t matter why he is the way he is. What matters is that you are not satisfied. You’ve given him several chances. You don’t need to keep giving him more. You don’t need to understand him in order to leave the relationship.
Thanks Stephanie… I’m realising that I may never know why things are the way they are as he maybe working though his own sexuality issues himself – even though he’s 37, I guess there are plenty of married men who come out in their 50s,60s or never at all. Whatever the case, things will not miraculously change even if he believes that will. I agree that I’d be better off using the energy moving on… And will! Thanks for your insights!
Mine was 36. My friend’s ex came out after they’d had four kids and the youngest was 2. So, yeah… can happen any time. And this may not be what it is, but whatever it is, it’s not making you happy or secure.
MG you are allowing him to keep you hanging on. I can honestly say that being in a marriage where sex once a year if that was horrendous and then finding out he could have mistresses and function. My self esteem and sexuality was in tatters when I finally got out. To date I haven’t had another relationship because of trust and the fear that my judgement was so off with the ex. But then he could hide things as he worked away 5 days a week and despite picking up signs he lied and would then “make up” as he saw it with a meal out or flowers in other words enough to ease my concerns. Believe me divorcing at 50 isn’t easy and getting out of a long term marriage takes guts but as soon as I got the chance I was out. You have no commitments with him and what is happening to toxic for you.
MG, take it from me, this doesn’t change, and won’t change. As a guy gets older, it will only get worse. My guess is that when he was younger he was able to perform fine, but now he’s getting a bit older, and his orientation is becoming more fixed. I think he’s gay. If you can get into his emails, get into them. My ex pulled allllll the same stuff on me. If I complained about our sex life, he had a billion excuses, and often would put it back on me, saying it was my fault because I didn’t initiate enough (uh, because I’ve given up!). Even if it’s as simple as ED, then any man would want to fix that, and go get a prescription for Viagra or something. Trust me this is not going to get better…. you’ve given it a lot of time to change and it hasn’t. Don’t let the tears and begging sway you. You need to see ACTION. But careful, a Viagra might mask what’s really going on. Maybe hire a PI to follow him? Can you get into his cell phone records? And yes they will deny they’re gay. My ex and I even went to therapy for years over our sex life and did he ever once admit to the therapist in private that he was gay? of course not. He lives with his bf now, by the way. While I’m still single. ha!
“Promises things will be different when we’re together” – oh good lord, he’s not promising his d**k will suddenly work if you marry him, is he??? Ugh, please no. The ONLY thing that saved me was that I wasn’t married to this dude and could kick him out pronto when I found out the truth. Marriage never cures a thing.
If you feel something is not right, then something probably isn’t. Always trust your gut instinct. Chemistry is extremely important and this has little to do with ‘looks’. You could be very beautiful and well endowed but if he doesn’t find you or women attractive, there is nothing you can do to change that. Maybe he’s using this relationship to hide his real sexual preference (s). His words and actions do not match. I’m not sure how often he travels but I would be suspicious of his activities elsewhere.
I’ve been reading the posts here for sometime and I feel like I can relate to everyone’s stories. Mine is complicated just as all of yours are. Scroll through my book and you see a chapter on “Finally Meeting THE ONE”. Another chapter on “He lies he isn’t single”. Then fast forward to the end where we find me mentally tortured by my “knight in shining armor” who has been my best friend for many years. I have been trying to close the book completely but he is the one that still contacts me – even after moving 3 states away. He says he loves me and always has and that he will be in town a couple of times a month. He is always flirting in the phone and wants to have sex with me – he and I have never hooked up. Apparently he is miserable with his GF and I can see why… anyways this book has been going on and on and he always says he will come over. Never answers a text and doesn’t show up. It just depresses me. He acts like it’s no big deal, and what absolutely upsets me is that I know he is about 10 miles away when he is in town. To everyone that knows him and has met him he is out going , charming, will help anyone – well I have known him long enough that anytime he talks to me now he s being selfish. I know his true personality and know he just wants to get off knowing a younger woman wants him. This week he will be in town and I guarantee he won’t show up. I honestly don’t even care to sleep with him, I would rather focus my energy on talking to him and telling him what a selfish EU he is! If he treats all of his “best friends” like this I shudder to think what he does with others. I also feel that he knows I understand him and how messed up he is. He’s comfortable with me. So the chapter continues….
Why does the chapter continue? He’s EU with anti-social personality disorder tendencies. Close the book and toss it out the window.
Honestly… I don’t know. I think I feel like I just need to see him.. to end it and I’m so used to him and his ways. I just feel comfortable around him. Sadly I torment myself waiting for him because let’s fsce it … will he really show up when he says he will? Will he text me back telling me if he will show up? I bet he won’t. Because it’s all about him and what he wants to do. I recognize that but something in my heart won’t let him go and I don’t know how to deal with this. I’m literally split in half . I know I should walk away….. but can’t ! I get excited and look forward to knowing I maybsee him finally in a few days but quickly know – it probably won’t happen. But if it does…. how do you all deal with this ? Do u confront them or walk away?
P.s. I’ve never heard of anti social personality disorder. Does it mimic being selfish and an introvert? Orrrrr as the Eu likes to call himself, “a loaner”.
Dragon, I think maybe you should concentrate on why you are settling for this – a man who lives 3 states away, has a girlfriend, never comes to see you, and with whom you have never “hooked up.” It sounds like you have some issues with emotional intimacy. That’s common, most of here have them in one form or another. But forget what makes this guy tick, focus on what is making you addicted to this nothingness. Read all of BR and Nat’s book “Dreamer and the Fallback Girl”
Sorry but you are addicted to this relationship crack and I suspect are afraid to be on your own. You have to get out and soon before you become someone you don’t want to be.
Dragon,
Read Natalie’s post called:
LETTING GO OF A RELATIONSHIP…THAT DOESN’T EXIST
I had an epiphany as I was reading it. I printed it out and read and re-read it to help me stay strong. To get to the post, click The Blog, scroll down the right hand side bar. The last time I posted a link my post was flagged for moderation and it was never posted. Good luck.
Dragon,
The problem is not him but you accepting that it is okay to be throw the crumbs. That is what is you are getting from him and you are ok with because you are ‘waiting’ for him. It is better to have crumbs than nothing at all. You know this and you accept it. Until you are truly ready to move on, it does not matter what we tell you. You will continue down this path until you have had enough. First you have to accept that it’s over. You have to make that choice because no one can make this decision for you.
One thing I learned from my LD fling is men are simple. They often tell us what they want. Often we women don’t want to believe what they tell us and we stay in hope that we can change them and we end up disappointed. My fling did tell me he didn’t want a relationship and has been telling me that for the last 2.5 years. I didn’t listen and lived the moment and got burned (fell in love). He treated me like a princess when we traveled together but as soon as we went back to our countries he switched off and treated me like an acquaintance. Instead of getting upset or confronted him about it, I also acted like an acquaintance and stopped contacting him. We didn’t have a relationship, therefore, I didn’t owe him an explanation. I simply told him that I’m taking a long hiatus. It’s has been a month of no contact and I feel stronger day by day and think of him less and less. Every time I feel a little sympathetic I remind myself that I need to love and honor myself first. It feels great and empowering to be unstuck.
This can relate to friendships as well. I have just ended my membership of a social group that wasn’t meeting my needs. I am looking for friends like I had in my 30s when I laughed a lot, socialised and enjoyed life. This social group arranged events but I found it to be populated by shallow people who were not interested in making friends. I suspect most of the women aside from me were there to meet a man. I had been thinking it was time to leave and then made this decision because at the last event I was thinking why am I here? That told me something I could not ignore and if I’m honest I don’t enjoy socialising with strangers many of whom don’t have anything in common plus don’t get when you have health problems and cannot work. So I called it and left.
The one “friend” I did make from this social group started a slow fade out last year that few men could match! I was unwell and she then distanced herself at an event we were both at having not told me she was going either. This from speaking regularly and meeting twice a month plus sharing lifts at joint events. She didn’t change at Nat said I just got to know her and I think we have had 2 phone calls this year! I’m not keeping in touch and am going NC with her. I also noticed that she stopped picking up my calls and if she did ring it was on her terms. I suspected she was EU but this behaviour proved it. So I prefer being on my own than being let down by people or trying to fit in to a situation that didn’t serve my needs. In that respect I am being true to myself and treating myself with trust and respect to maintain my integrity. I cannot be someone I am not and won’t someone else just to fit in. I have realised that society as it is now, is shallow, misogynistic and judgemental of those less fortunate. Fortunes change in life as mine did and it could happen to anyone at any time.
I’ve read all the posts with interest. I was with ex 10 years. Married for 7. We separated 2 years ago after he told me he could no longer be in the marriage as my behaviour towards him made him angry.
At the time of the separation we were in the throes of selling our home and moving back to the where I used to live. It would have been closed to my family and work.
I moved back to my parents and now have a beautiful home.
I had counselling and found a brilliant site which helped me enormously with my low self esteem etc.
Five months after we separated he had his first rebound. She dumped him after two months. He started coming to mine. Suggested we went on holiday. I was in a good place emotionally. I had list 3 stone and was content.
Four weeks into reconnecting he told me he felt nothing for me. And started with rebound number 2. He took her on the holiday after only three dates.
We stayed in basic contact mostly initiated by me and met up a cuople of times. In April this year I told him I wanted no contact for two months. I again made emotional progress. He texted me after ten weeks. My stepson had a new baby.
I met him for coffee. The rebound had dumped him after nine months and he was devastated. They had been perfect and he was in shock.
I remained grounded and met him at his level. He would ring me all the time. Come to my house. But he never wanted to date. Told me he wanted to take things slowly.
I then was told by my friend that she had seen him registered in a dating site. He said it was just a laugh.
Told me he was happy when he was with me but when we were not together he had a mental blockage which he could not dismiss that was telling him if we got back together that I might hurt him again.
So he’s now with the third rebound. After three weeks he’s gone in holiday with her and on Facebook their postings are of their happy pictures.
I told him I would not be around for to be a Fall back Girl. Again told me he still has feelings for me but cannot risk getting hurt.
He has totally blocked me on social media and phone. Prior to me he was married and she cheated on him. He moved back to his mother’s. He then lived with someone for two years and that ended and he moved back with his mother. After we separated he moved back with his mother.
I sold my house and moved to the area where he lived. He was a future faker.
Just reading the posts and posting this has been cathartic
Thank you so much for this, it describes my current situation to the T.