When I used to spend my time going out with assclowns and Mr Unavailables (or guys who were both), when things were over or were approaching The End, I’d start to wonder if things could have been different if only I could have let certain things slide, been less assertive, been the one to change etc.
This is a common thought pattern for a lot of women and it arises from the big 3:
Self blame – Assuming the responsibility for things being wrong and hence assuming the possible responsibility of making things right.
Delusion – Seeing yourself in a harsh light but still failing to see him and his actions in a real light.
Failure to see the bigger picture.
I’ve had a lot of emails from readers, especially over the past couple of years and there were a few poignant questions that stuck out at me:
1. Is it because I was really cold with him on the phone why he decided to end the relationship and move on with someone else?
2. If I had been less needy, less, oh I don’t know, kinda controlling at times, do you think things could have been different?
3. Do you think if I had backed off and not asked him to commit to me that we could still be together?
Let me give you the quick answers to these:
1. No. That was just one phone call and the whole relationship with a class A narcissist was doomed. The relationship was going to end anyway. Lesson to be learned – If your relationship has solid foundations, it takes a hell of a lot more than a phone call to end it, or one specific little incident.
2. No. Neediness (that’s if it is neediness) and being controlling are not attractive in any relationship. However…these behaviours will be exacerbated if you hang with Mr Unavailables and assclowns. You may not be needy or controlling and the outcome would still be the same – you might just prolong the agony but potentially burn less energy.
3. No. The fact that your relationship ended because you wanted him to commit to the relationship and put both of his feet in, is actually a good thing. At least you now know where you stand.
Relationships are the sum of both parties and women need to stop acting like they are the only one capable of making or breaking the relationship!
You can’t love for the both of you or do all of the work for the relationship and if you do, you might as well lie on the ground and say, ‘Walk on me and treat me like sh*t’.
If instead of looking at the bigger picture and seeing the relationship in its entirety, you choose to instead isolate your vision of yourself and then pound it with self-blame and coulda, woulda, shoulda, and wistful thinking, you absolve him of any responsibility for the relationship not succeeding, even when he had a huge part to play!
You are also distorting the truth because you’re not seeing him in a real light. If you were you’d see yourself and the relationship in a more realistic light instead of a warped one where his failings are now your failings.
The worst part of this is that the question is redundant and is an opportunity to stall making any real change and making any progress. It’s just another reason to not face things and do something about your situation and instead, it’s languishing in self-blame, daydreaming, and in some cases, obsessing.
The relationship was what it was hence it couldn’t have been different because it wasn’t.
The question you have to ask yourself when you enter into this coulda, woulda, shoulda zone is, ‘If I’m wondering whether my relationship could have been different if I had been different, why am I not asking myself if my relationship could have been different if he had been different?’
If I look back and ask myself whether things could have been different, I know that the simple answer to that is no. It would have been a case of that I could have been quieter, less this, less that, allowed more things to slide and yadda yadda yadda, but the outcome would still have been the same. By the same token, if I’d had more respect for myself and a higher self-esteem, I wouldn’t have touched half of these guys in the first place or opted out much sooner. But it wasn’t different and I can’t change that, so instead I sought to change my present and my future.
I stopped burdening myself with what could have been, forgave myself, and through my awareness of the type of men I had found myself attracting and being attracted to and what my own behaviours were that drove that, I changed my future, which actually, is really all that counts because I’m living a far better, connected life now than I ever was back in la la land.
There comes a point when you have to accept that it is what it is and that analysing the crap out of your relationship or your own behaviour has limited value, especially when you don’t move forward. If you’ve ever watched Quantum Leap, you’ll know that often when he attempted to go back and change the past, the same outcome kept arising. If you don’t look at the bigger picture and focus on you and your relationship patterns and moving forward as opposed to focusing on one guy, you’ll also find that the outcome won’t change either. You’ll go back…but you’ll end up breaking up again, or you’ll kneejerk into a new relationship and the same problems will rear their ugly head again. I know because I’ve been on both sides of the fence.
Don’t focus on whether you can be different for a relationship that is already in the past and instead, look at what you can do now that benefits you and your future.
Your thoughts?
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NML, this is so RIGHT ON, it’s almost scary! 🙂 You have absolutely hit the nail on the head. I keep reading the posts from all of us, and there are a lot of us who still keep wanting to analyze the heck out of our failed relationship with our EUM, and what we should be doing is analyzing the heck out of OURSELVES as to why we are drawn to these man-boys in the first place. And I agree that we are so quick to think it was something WE did in the relationship, when in fact, all we were doing was reacting and responding to being on the emotional rollercoaster and trying to navigate through all of the crap they dish out! Still, I do take some ownership and responsibility but I am certainly not taking 100% of it. And, I also am a firm believer in forgiveness–forgiving yourself AND forgiving your EUM so that you can move on. That’s important and so necessary, or you will be stuck in a really unpleasant place of anger and blame for a long time.
This was me for the past two years. Every time we broke up, which felt like every two weeks, I went back to woulda, coulda, shoulda. I nearly drove myself nuts. He was not thinking like that. He wasn’t thinking about the relationship at all. Well, he didn’t have to, because I made myself responsible for everything. It makes my stomach hurt when I think about the reality of the situation that I am in and how much time keeps ticking by while I keep hanging around. I’m still in, up to my neck, with an emotionally unavailable man.
Occasionally I still catch myself second guessing and wishing that knew then what I know now, and thinking that it would have made a difference. I had no contact for six months now and have been moving on, but there are those days still when I think about it. Today is one of those days and I needed this reminder. You are so right NML, in the end the relationship would not have been any different, no matter what. I would just have walked away sooner.
I have to keep remembering that. Reading this today has helped me-thank you.
wow..joanna….6 months…can’t imagine…i’m moving onto 6weeks and i’m really hurting…..even though i’m the one to end the relationship, it really was his choice by the way he’d been treating me…hot/cold…. level 8….and so to bring me down to level 3 …he’d stop calling for a few days……so, the crumb felt like a loaf….i too look forward to reading this everyday as i helps……
Excellent, simply excellent! This should be a must chapter for any relationship book ever written 🙂
NML,
You’re simply brilliant, woman. Thank goodness I can see every word of what you are saying so clearly now.
You deserve the Nobel peace prize for helping women figure out men.
Singlehandedly, you make all the other self-help books out there useless because you just hit the nail on the head so much more accurately.
When are you going to be on Oprah’s book club and on her show ? Because it seems like the time is right.
You may be getting sick of always hearing me tell you how smart your advice is – and useful, but it is. It really and truly is.
I’ve played the woulda-coulda-shoulda game for years, and it was just a way to keep in that stuck place, and not change my habits or choices or thinking.
That way I could make it all about him, and not me and my issues that needed to be healed; and instead continue with my magical thinking “if I had just…. if only…”
You know what your blog does, NML ? It teaches self-esteem and common sense daily for all of us who never had it before – or never had enough of it before to stop being fallback women and attracting EUM’s.
Loving Annie
NML or anyone else I am hoping you can help me out… I have read the posts and know that for whatever reason I put up with the crap that my EUM dealt me but I am not dating some “nice guys” and I am just not feeling it.
I know from all that I have read on here that I am likely going to feel like this but the thing that confuses me is that my EUM was totally dedicated to me for the first couple weeks… always calling, always wanting to see me, telling me how great I was and I did not get that icky feeling in my stomach. So I can see how I got pulled in once the games and the drama started, but when I first met him I did not know he would be like that.
I am having a hard time thinking that my 6th sense picked up on something. I have even read on here women talking about how they just seem to find these men like they have some internal radar system. Can anyone tell me how this works? Because these new guys are great just like my EUM was but I am not finding myself with butterflies in my stomach like I did for him. Did I in some way know that he was an EUM right away without my really knowing???
Dazed, what are you saying, you are dating a nice guy or you are not dating a nice guy, not sure what the question is?
Talking about butterflies, when I met the EUM years ago, I had NO butterflies in my stomach for the first 2 months.
Hi Dazed and Noelle. I really do recommend that you either buy Mr Unavailable and the Fallback Girl or at least read right from the start of the category on Mr Unavailable because both of the things you are talking about are core things about being a Falback Girl in a relationship with Mr Unavailable.
For Dazed, most Mr Unavailables blow hot initially. Unless they exhibit red flag behaviour (there is a post on this), you may not know in the first 2 weeks. But if he blew hot for 2 weeks and cold or lukewarm for 8, that is how you know that something is very wrong. I use 8 as an example btw. Not everybody can figure out a guy who is putting on a show for the first 2 weeks. He may be very practiced. But you can figure out what he is doing when his behaviour changes.
Noelle, it’s a basic fundamental of being involved with emotionally unavailable men that you are EU too. Like attracts like and if you weren’t emotionally unavailable, you wouldn’t be attracted to him, and when he behaved inappropriately and displayed red flag behaviour, like being on drugs or married, you’d have opted out.
Sorry I am “now” dating a nice guy… the not was a typo.
Dazed, could it be that because we are emotionally unavailable ourselves that we are more attracted to these types of men? I was thinking just this morning that really every serious relationship I have been in has been with an EUM. Even my ex husband was one and exhibited PA behavior. I don’t even think I would know how to act in a *normal* relationship because I have never had one. I’ve lived with a drug addict (I thought I could fix), then had a relationship with a married man and now the one I’m in that is wishy washy and doesn’t know what he wants. I am talking about years worth of anguish! Its just a thought but I think for myself anyway, it all has to do with me and what I seek out. Could this be true?
Here are just some of more than 200 posts:
https://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/introducing-miss-commitment-phobe/
https://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/wanting-mr-unavailables-being-miss-unavailable/
https://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/how-to-spot-emotionally-unavailable-men/
https://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/how-to-attract-emotionally-unavailable-men/
https://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/the-status-quo-a-quick-lesson-in-the-dynamics-of-drama/
https://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/why-do-men-blow-hot-and-cold/
https://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/knowing-when-to-bail-out-red-flags/
https://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/take-the-focus-off-him-and-put-it-back-to-you/
https://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/epiphany-relationships/
https://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/so-what-is-commitment-phobia/
NML I have read every post on here possible I think 🙂 What I am trying to say is usually when a guy blows hot I go running it literally makes my skin crawl EXCEPT when it’s these guys who turn out eventually to be EUMs. So I am trying to figure out why when I meet a nice guy, who calls all the time, etc. it’s like my radar picks something up that it didn’t with the EUM and vice versa. On some level right from the get go with the EUM when he’s exhibiting hot behaviour that normally would make me run I must be picking up on something that makes me comfortable with it vs. the nice guys. Perhaps it’s just a bad boy persona that I see right away, the charm, the flirty nature that makes me “know” what kind of guy this is right off the bat.
Sorry just to follow up… from date 1 with my EUM I could not wait to see him, wanted to plan weekends together wanted to be around him all the time there was “something” that just got me! With these nice guys they are great but I feel zero excitement. And it’s not the loss of drama, etc. because even with my EUM there was no drama. All your posts about the long term drama seeking etc. are absolutely true about me but this is something that starts from day one with me that I must pick up on… because I fall for these EUMs from the moment I meet them and that’s the part I am wondering. Before they can activate my abandonment fears, pull a disappearing act, or anything I’m already hooked and I can’t figure out why.
NML, thank you. I to have read and have most certainly only now and only with the help of this site and your book can at least now see what my problem is. Now its just a matter of doing what I need to do. That is what I am having the problem with at this point.
The amazing thing about every single post that NML leaves here is… it’s covered in her book… NML, i’ve left a post before thanking you for going over this SAME subject with us fallback girls… over and over.. cause for some reason it takes us a LONG time to “get it”. AND. I AM SPEAKING ABOUT MYSELF PRIMARILY!!
it’s so sad that this really is about us not loving ourselves.. and we really are too afraid to begin to learn how to do that now… so we really don’t know where to start…
if we did love ourselves more.. we would not have even gotten to where we have with these EUMs…Sad.
Keri… I find your comment about it being sad interesting. My EUM has left me in this state totally reconsidering my life, the people I have been with and angry that I do not understand how my female friends who are in good relationships ended up such secure women and I did not.
However, and perhaps this is going to sound odd, but even after my EUM I started questioning what life is all about, who I am, what I am doing and this is all part of the journey. Also in talking with other women who are in these “stable” relationships, I find that they lack knowledge about themselves that we have. It’s a tough process delving into who you are and while my relationships have caused great pain, I am a person of great self awareness as it seems all of you are too. I did find it sad but now it’s quite empowering.
My mother always reminds me that I am not the only person with all these faults but I am strong enough to confront them and all of you are here doing that too.
It’s sad that it’s taken us to this point in our lives to figure this out or “get it”.. I dont know about all of you.. but I’ve always had a clue that there was something I wasn’t understanding when it came to relationships. I knew I didn’t understand why I couldn’t find anyone worth while and everyone else did. Being pretty self-aware myself..an open book with all my friends.. trying to understand what it was… but never TRULY understanding that I think the damage had already been done.. like a chameleon.. my dysfunction just blended in with my surroundings to the point that I couldn’t really “see it”… I was really trying to look for it but I was looking too broadly I think…
all I know is I’m 33 years old and it’s SAD that it’s taken me till now to REALLY want to face this.. and only AFTER the EUM broke my heart..(and more than that.. I didn’t love myself enough to respond to the definite Red Flags from the beginning.. I was so desparate for someone to validate that I wasn’t worth it… that he fit the mold) .so it’s a blessing I’m sure.. all that has happened to us.. IF we can see it that way… I know that I WANT to figure this out NOW…. I don’t WANT to bring this forward anymore… I am very very proud of myself for all the hard and emotionally contorting work I’m doing inside.. to face this fear… which ultimately started when I was a little girl with my parents…my FIRST encounters with EU People…which helped to shape the mold to which I interact with my life… so now…I have to sit and face the lost little girl inside… just wanting to be loved.
and that can be scary as you know what… as I’m SURE most of you are already realizing.
I’m proud of every single one of us that’s facing our fear.. even though it hurts like heck…
Dazed and Confused, it really sounds like you are not ready to be dating again yet. If you are comparing the dull Nice Guy with your ex-EUM, I’m pretty sure it means that you are not over ex-EUM. Also you don’t seem to trust your own judgment, which means your internal “radar” is still scrambled by the EUM damage. If you are not feeling anything and still going out with this guy, well why? I hope you don’t lead him on and break his heart because of your own EU issues. Let’s all of us end the cycles of dysfunction here while we can.
Just the idea of going out with someone for me is unthinkable, because I still am missing my ex-EUM and thinking the coulda-woulda stuff (tho I’m pretty clear that it coulda worked if HE had worked and unpacked his baggage before taking up with me). I know for a fact that nobody is going to do it for me, maybe for quite some time.
20 days of NC. I did just finally unfriend him on MySpace. He had still had me on his top friends and himself as “in a relationship.” Now next time he logs in, he will find my pic gone from his friends. Hopefully that will not be a drama. Now I can do stuff like post bulletins and it won’t end up in his “in” box.
Keri, I’m 45, so don’t feel bad. This material is not taught, it is not talked about, we are not stupid that the information is not out there when we need it, and this whole culture is a breeding cesspool of abuse and poor mental health. We really do owe it to Natalie for giving us the language and tools we need…to call and Assclown an Assclown!
@ Dazedandconfused – what do you mean when you say “nice guy”? For some that might be charisma, a good conversation, easy to like.
To me that means a good pickup line. A life-skill at finding and “winning” bed partners. Not someone to consider for a life-mate.
To me, “nice” means a welcoming smile – and honesty and respect in all interactions. Honorable and disciplined, dependable.
And what you might be twigging on with the non-EUM’s might be inexperience, lack of “training” in the craft of recreational dating and hookups and booty calls. That is, someone more likely to be loyal that slick.
Luck!
@ Keri,
I would never call harsh treatment a blessing. Perhaps surviving hard times provides a chance to learn a valuable lesson. But the lesson is all that would have value.
Blessed be!
Regina– I am not ready for a relationship. I have gone on a few dates here and there and have been completely honest. I would never want someone to feel like my EUM made me feel. I am not pretending that I am up for something and then going cold on other days.
Brad, I guess by nice guy they are smart, successful, respectful, NOT charmers (in a good way) they don’t give me these ridiculous lines or stare into my eyes. My first date with my EUM and he was saying how amazing I was. BUT while these “nice” guys are not saying all that stuff, I just pick up the vibe that they are just really like me even though when myEUM actually stated it aloud that didn’t make me uncomfortable but my feelings with the nice guys are well “icky.”
I think with my EUM, somehow I knew that this was a cool flirty guy that would create the drama I was looking for whereas with these new guys there is potential for real commitment and intimacy, which I am truly afraid of.
I am just finding it hard because my EUM was really into me at the start, but there was a different vibe to it or something that I must have felt because it didn’t scare me off the way it does with these other guys who don’t want to play games and are just the type that you know have good solid morals and are very respectful.
I think you are right about these nice guys too they sort of lack a bit of smoothness because they are not game players. I think my EUM appealed because he felt like that guy that gets lots of women and here he is with me… It must be a whole persona that they have.
Either way I don’t per se miss my EUM but I feel so sad knowing that I was more comfortable with a jerk than with guys who want to call me, make plans in advance and are just excited to be around me.
Brilliant….
Thank you for helping me out..you absolutely know what you’re talking about! When i read this i felt like someone can really relate to what i’ve been going through..i really do agree with what i read..it is very inspiring..thank you!
NML — I read ALOT, and always going on self-esteem, confidence, affirmation, dating books, spirituality stuff, etc — and you are really a smart cookie and hit the nail on the head like alot of the other readers have mentioned. It’s like you take the thoughts right out of our heads by validating how we feel and perceive things.
Anyhow with this post, what I have come to the conclusion was:
IF TWO PEOPLE GET TOGETHER WHO ARE UNHEALTHILY BALANCING EACHOTHER OUT for example: A narcissist abuser with a co-dependent woman who has abandonment issues — DO YOU THINK A HAPPY HEALTHY PERSON WOULD BE ATTRACTED TO THE NARCASSIST OR CO-DEPENDENT? If you are a healthy and happy person your DRAMA filled relationships can not exist, therefore should of, could of, would of… (The whole thing is going to have your self-furfilling issue, so there is no reason to look back) Decide to change yourself.
When my father and his ex-girlfriends were in relationships they always wanted him to change (he was a narcissist abuser) but the reality is they never wanted him to change, because if he changed the unhealthy dynamics that brought them together and attracted them in the first place would be missing, therefore the realtionship couldn’t exist without it. If they were healthy they could never put up with a man like that…
I agree Gina it is the same when a married man does leave his wife rarely does the relationship last with the woman he was having an affair with because it was not what she wanted in the first place an open relationship with an available man .