It can be pretty difficult to wrap your head around the idea that the person who you’re in love with and may have spent a great deal of time around, doesn’t want the relationship that you want. It puts you in a quagmire – you love them, you want to be with them, but in the process of doing so, you’re basically compromising yourself because whatever it is that they are offering (if anything), it might be leaving you dissatisfied or even ‘malnourished’. What can be incredibly perplexing and even painful though, is when they stick around (and you let them) but they still won’t cough up the relationship goods, or they go but they keep boomeranging in and out of your life, raising your hopes each time.
This situation will be all too familiar to you if you’ve thought stuff like, What the hell do they want with me? Why, if they know that they can’t give me what I want, are they still hanging around like a blue arsed fly letting me think that it’s a possibility?
One of two things are going to happen: You’re going to end up managing down your expectations until one day it suddenly occurs to you that your needs, wants, and expectations aren’t being met while they’re having a grand ‘ole time on their terms. Or, you end up in one of those awkward, standoff power struggles where you each keep trying to get your own way instead of just walking away.
When you find that you’re at odds with one another on the direction or even existence of the relationship this is really a code red alert that something is very wrong. It’s also a reality check – you need to fully evaluate the situation and rein your feelings in. It doesn’t mean that they’re shady (although they might be) but it does mean that you’re incompatible on what you both want out of the relationship which likely signals a clash of values.
You’ve either got to have an honest conversation and find a healthy compromise (if possible) or for the sake of your own self-preservation, make an exit even though it’s going to hurt.
If they turn around and say that they want to keep it casual when you’re actually looking to move forward into a serious relationship, I wouldn’t go into it because I can guarantee that it will end in big dollopy tears that belong to you. If you’re saying “Let’s move in” and they’re saying that they do want to move in (with you) but not just yet, then you can potentially find a compromise.
Unfortunately what tends to happen is you’ll either 1) dismiss the red flag, 2) blame you for the fact that they don’t want the same things and convince yourself that you’ve done something to jeopardise the relationship, or 3) take up a vocation in trying to change them. You may have a Return On Investment mentality of “I’ve put in X months/years so I cannot exit now because it would be a waste” neglecting to realise that if you ignore what the difference is telling you, you might be like a reader I recently spoke with who clocked up 12 years with someone whose position never changed and she’d known it from a few years in.
The problem is of course that the type of person who would hang around knowing that you want something different (or at least that you profess to) or who would keep a foothold in your life and be pretty damn disruptive while still coming back with the same paltry offering that you didn’t want or even less, is actually the type of person that you need to ensure that you do right by you because… they are really only thinking about things from their perspective and what makes them comfortable without really giving a great deal of thought to your comfort levels. In fact they may have an “I’m comfortable so they must be comfortable” attitude.
Keep in mind as well that they may outwardly claim that they’ve changed and are on board but the will passive aggressively do things that contradict this and undermine your relationship.
You may feel like you’re being ‘toyed’ with, especially if you’ve broken up a number of times and tried your best to move on, only for them to swoop in with big promises and short-term changes in their behaviour that soon roll back to their old ways. They can have a dog in a manger attitude – they don’t want you but they’re hogging up the proverbial manger and blocking access to you just in case they happen to change their mind.
I also know from personal experience how easy it is to be blinded by our feelings / libido / ego, but, you are giving off mixed messages. You’re thinking “Why the hell are they still here when they know I want ________” and they’re thinking, even if it’s on a subconscious level “Well they can’t really want it that much if they keep being with me and they know I’m not interested in that.”
You’re thinking that you’re showing your love and commitment to them and they think you’ve signed on to their terms and conditions.
You may also be thinking that their continued presence or their inability to leave you alone is a sign of their deep feelings and them gradually coming over to your way of thinking – unfortunately I’ve heard enough tales to know that actually, it’s not that they don’t care or love you but their commitment issues and differing values mean that they hold onto you because they’re afraid of losing you and so do their best to stall you until you run out of patience and chances.
Once someone says that they can’t give you what you want, take ’em at their word.
Some people don’t know they’re born, they don’t know what they want, and they’re greedy. They want you without the responsibilities and commitment that come with. They value you when you tell ’em to get lost and dry up the charm when you’re expecting them to deliver. Cut ’em loose!
Once you see that they’re all talk and little or no action, take the big hint and do for the both of you what they’re not able to do – end it because you mean what you say and say what you mean and have the follow through in action to go with it.
Don’t allow someone to keep pulling the same con on you numerous times because there’s ‘hopeful’ and then there’s relationship crack.
It’s also important not to just focus on the fact that they keep coming back – they keep bullshitting their way in and leaving too. Or don’t just focus on the fact that they’re ‘there’ – it’s the quality of the ‘there’ that matters. You don’t need someone doing the equivalent of squatting on your property but being unwilling to actually contribute and move forward.
Unless they’re Future Faking and Fast Forwarding, you also have to stop creating possibilities out of sheer presence – possibilities come from consistent action over time and experiences. If you’re on a permanent date with someone because they do things that affect the consistency, balance, progression, intimacy and commitment of the relationship, you’re seeing possibilities where you shouldn’t and being blinded by the good times and potential.
Whether they’re coasting in a relationship on their terms or they keep popping back in your life, both of these things tell you that you need to decide what you need and want and act upon them instead of waiting for them to ‘do the right thing’ when from their perspective, they’re happy because things are on their terms. They’re just not that special that you should manage your expectations into crumbs for the ‘benefit’ of having them in your life. Remember that they can’t stay or keep returning if you’re no longer there.
Your thoughts?
Are you ready to stop silencing and hiding yourself in an attempt to ‘please’ or protect yourself from others? My book, The Joy of Saying No: A Simple Plan to Stop People Pleasing, Reclaim Boundaries, and Say Yes to the Life You Want (Harper Horizon), is out now.
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Yep, this is where I’ve been. I guess I thought because my ex had proposed marriage at some point (five months into our relationship) that he was emotionally available. He told me (and I believed) that the relationship had had so many fits and starts was because I broke off the engagement (due to his lies and untrustworthiness). He told me he wouldn’t have broken up with me as many times as he did if I hadn’t have initially broken off the engagement. I didn’t break off the relationship, but I knew I needed to reduce my level of commitment until trust could be restored. That trust never was restored. He never made any real effort. The efforts he did make he resented and threw up in my face. I can understand that, though.
Sometimes I struggle with the thought that maybe he would have given me the relationship that I wanted. He did want to marry me at one point. He did keep coming back. Was I too needy? Did I put too much pressure on him? Was it unrealistic to expect that he could treat me with the same level of affection and care as he did at the beginning of the relationship?
I was reading one of Natalie’s earlier posts. In it she writes, : “At the end of the day, there is no point trying to rationalise the irrationality of why someone put in some effort – you should be concerning yourself with where you are now with him…which is nowhere…” I’ve been trying so desperately to understand my role and his role in the demise of the relationship and why everything turned out the way it did. I do believe that one day I will have more perspective. Today is not that day. But I read that line in the post and thought, “You know it’s okay that I don’t see everything clearly right now. I have all the information that I need to know at this point: he’s not available for the kind of relationship that I want right now.
There’s no point in reminiscing over the times when I felt he was, or fantasizing about where he might be some day. I don’t have to analyze him, me or this relationship to death. I’m giving myself permission to let this go and embrace the reality of what I do know for a fact.
Good work Laurie. I am so sorry that you had to go through what sounds like a nightmare with this man. He sounds like he has hurt you very much, and, that he cannot and will not give you or be what you want. And that is all you need to know.
I know that it is very painful breaking away from your hopes of what it could have been. I spent five years with a guy like your man, who at points was a dream, who put in effort and talked about us marrying one day, and then at other points withdrew, let me down, treated me like I was nothing in his life.
It sounds like you’ve hit the nail on the head. Keep going along this path and you will, with time, feel less confounded the whole thing. I hope you can find some peace with yourself.
xx
I think an action that requires head over heart — logic over emotion — reason over passion — is one of life’s most difficult manoeuvres. And I also think it’s totally unachievable until or unless your ‘logical brain’ receives lots and lots and lots of ammunition to counterbalance the ’emotional heart’.
It’s one of those ‘switch off the life support’ decisions. You just can’t. Not when you’re in love. The idea of touching that button, no less pressing it down, hearing it clack, and watching all the lights go out and the bleeps stop, is nauseating and repellant. It’s not quite as simple as just shrugging and knowing it’s for the best. This is why people go on for years.
I think it takes time and painful effort for properly emotionally engaged women to feed their logical brains enough ammunition to make the switch-off bearable and possible. EUMs however can reach over at any moment and switch it off without feeling a goddamn thing. And switch it on again. And off. And on. And off and on. And off one final time just for laughs.
Perfectly put, Grizelda. It would be so simple if it were simply a logical choice. Maybe the fact that one can’t ‘flip the switch’ means that one isn’t as EU as some would say. At least not completely.
I’ve picked up on your comment because I was that person who hung on for years. The ex husband would dump me, get back together with me, dump me etc. After a year of NC after he dumped me for the upteenth time, he proposed (dumb) and I accepted (dumber). Another man (the playa) jerked me around for a whole year. I then obsessed about him for three. Is that love? Did they love me? Did I love them? With the benefit of hindsight, no.
I know your situation is not the same as mine. In their own way all our EU relationships are unique but underlying it is a wrong way(not wrong as in drownng puppies but wrong as in incorrect – quote from The Good Wife) of viewing relationships.
These things are not love:
fantasy, fear of rejection, florencing, co-dependency, longing, romance, charm, sex,hormones, idealising him/her, false hope, fear of being alone, waiting for it all to be better, wanting them to change, letting your boundaries get busted.if we stripped that stuff out, how much genuine love would there be? Maybe not as much as we think.
“properly emotionally engaged women”. There was certainly a lot going on with me when I had these relationships but emotional engagement was not it. It’s impossible to engage with someone who just isn’t there, spiritually and physically. That’s why the sex takes on mythical importance. It’s the only connection there is. not only was i not engaged with them i wasn’t engaged with myself. For all the crying, longing, heartache, analysis, I was pretty oblivious to what was going on with me. Took several years, a no BS counsellor and Nat for me to get it. It won’t take you so long. You found BR early in this process!
I have the added benefit of being in a mutual relationship so I can see how very different a genuine emotional connection is from what I had in the past. For those who aren’t there yet (and you wlll be), you think it would be a better version of what you had before, or the good bits without the bad bits. It’s actually completely different. I can’t quite put my finger on it but it’s … easy? (thanks Magnolia for that observation).
Finally, someone who keeps coming back at you flicking the lightswitch has a serious issue with commitment and probably a character flaw. It’s just not decent behaviour. I did it myself and what drove it had nothing to do with love. I was validation, courting popularity, having someone around of the opposite sex, an option in case things didn’t work out, attention, an ego boost. Still, when I realised how much I was hurting them I cut them loose. Not so much for their benefit I’m afraid, I just felt guilty. I don’t suppose they liked it but I hope they moved on. If they didn’t, at least it wasn’t because I was messing them about.
If they won’t do it for you, do it for yourself. Cut them off.
No it’s not simple, but worth it and you can.
Grace,
“It’s impossible to engage with someone who just isn’t there, spiritually and physically. That’s why the sex takes on mythical importance. It’s the only connection there is. not only was i not engaged with them i wasn’t engaged with myself”
Thank you for this – it helps me to see why, even when we keep trying to change them with our “love”, to show them we are going to be the “first”
person to ever show them proper love – it’s pointless!
I am enjoying reading about your relationship with your now-boyfriend. it is wonderful to have an example of a healthy man (who values you for things other than sex) on BR!
Well put, Grizelda.
Thanks Nat for another insightful post. It made me once again confirm and validate my position on staying No Contact. For me any slight opening of the door will have him trying to weasel back into my life but only on his terms.
You once wrote you have to own what you’ve done to facilitate this type behavior but his behavior is his and I’m not responsible for his. So true So true.
Thank You for that reminder
wow! this is exactly what I’ve been going thru. I’m so glad i came across this email today 🙂 thank you!
After I out-right told my EUM bluntly (more then once) to “LEAVE ME ALONE – I don’t want to have nothing to do with you” – for 2 years he keeps coming up with some “excuse” to get in touch with me… to tell me or ask me something. Why are they so hard-headed? And How do I REALLY get him to Stop contacting me? Even if I ignore him – 4 months later, here is is emailing me again. Is it also possible – it’s hard for his ego to accept that someone doesn’t like him or want to be his friend?
This is a very relevant post. I fear that one of my friends is in this situation. Her boyfriend is older than her by 23 years. She says that he says he won’t pursue further commitment until they’ve both found better jobs. I have read about other situations where a woman is in a relationship and wants further commitment (i.e. marriage and children) and the man delays making a decision about it. I hate reading about it because I can’t believe how selfish some people can be having someone else as a place holder and not caring about them enough to become a permanent fixture in their future.
Been there. Just got out of the relationship with him. Over and over again I would tell him that I needed more and he would promise me the world. Every vibe that I got from him was that I was just “there”, not a priority and not someone he truly cared about but when I voiced my concerns he would tell me that I was ridiculous and of COURSE he love me. I started living on crumbs convinced that if he was staying around then THAT was the sign that he loved me despite not showing me one bit that he actually did love me. We broke up twice and got back together because he promised that this time he could give me what I needed and within weeks it was clear it was all talk but I was still questioning why he was with me if he didn’t want to treat me right. This article really hit home. Thank you so much.
This was so me until Saturday night when (I know I shouldn’t have but hell of glad I did) went into his cellphone when he was sleeping. I had been back and forth in a go nowhere relationship with this person for years and then seeing (sleeping with) him a couple years after breaking up, I just couldn’t let go. Well that cellphone showed me the truth, he was seeing tons, I mean tons, of girls and lying to me all along. A woman’s intuition is a powerful thing. I knew something wasn’t adding up but I doubted myself and believed his lies. All the years waisted with that assclown. If a guy is not showing up for you there is good reason behind it. Don’t doubt yourself women. Look past the lies and look at the behavior. Thank you Natalie for you wisdom and sharing it with us.
OMG – I did the same thing with my assclown – who knows, maybe the same person! I would get up in the middle of the night, check his txt msgs – I couldn’t believe what I was reading – and I stayed for 3 months after that – I think I was ‘addicted’ to the drama and was acting like a crazy person! This ass had been floating in and out of my life for 16 years! This past January I ended it, but by April he was back telling me all the things I wanted to hear. Finally, in the last few months, I’ve been able to end it and put it all behind me. I’ve learned certain truths – I don’t need to go into all the specifics, because Baggage Reclaim spells it all out and it is all true! I am so thankful that I’ve deleted this man from my life. It’s been difficult, but ultimately, the best gift I’ve ever given myself. I’m happier today then I have been in years! And, I’ve opened myself up for something better. Good Luck to everyone out there – take heart, be strong – it does get better.
done gone,
“All the years waisted with that assclown. If a guy is not showing up for you there is good reason behind it. Don’t doubt yourself women”
I would like to second that! It amazes me how many guys who are showing EU behaviour are involved with multiple women. Whenever I read a story on BR now about men not communicating for days at a time, a little flag goes up in my brain – “I bet he’s sleeping around”. I know there are other reasons for guys blowing hot and cold, but after my own experience discovering the exMM’s harem, I feel I can’t trust any man to be faithful (not that I should have trusted a cheating MM in the first place! Oy). It’s not a very reassuring place to be, is it? Sorry to hear you had to go through this rude awakening too, and hoping the truth will set you free.
Yes the hot and cold thing is def when they are seeing other women. I got to see this close up because my EUM worked with me, and he couldn’t hide the guilt from his face. Bizarrely the guilt made me feel better – that he must care about me to feel guilty. And the fact that he kept coming back to me during that four year period, and that the cold spells got shorter and shorter filled me with hope. It culminated in him giving it a proper go with me for a few months and I was ecstatic. Then suddenly the signs were there again, and it hurt more than ever because I felt I was *this* close to having a proper loving relationship with him. I want to believe that they aren’t happy – that they’re empty inside. It’s the only way I can handle it.
This is such a painful scenario because you think they must be attracted *enough* to keep coming back, so there’s definitely something there, and maybe in time *they* will be the one who runs out of options and realise what a good thing they have with you, and finally fall properly in love with you. I truly believed it was all down to love – that there’s no such thing as commitment phobic – they just haven’t found the right person yet. You look for signs of them getting emotionally closer, you try to play a careful game so they don’t feel hemmed in, and yet still they blow hot and cold. And the good times are so good that you convince yourself it’s worth all the pain. I don’t think I have ever experienced heartbreak like it in my entire life. I’m still in love with him, even though I question what it is I actually love about him, and it’s all about deep feelings and memories. He’s my kryptonite. Some people just touch your soul and stir something up inside, and you can’t dismiss it as just their commitment issues. It’s like they opened a floodgate and all this pent up love flowed out of you, and when it’s over you feel more empty than you’ve ever felt in your life.
I feel you crazybaby. Yes I totally get the kryptonite thing. I’m still there, right now. And what Done Gone just wrote about looking at the cell phone, yikes, that gives me shivers because I’m sure that’s the case with the AC who effed me up. I don’t even want to think of how many he is sexting.
I actually did the checking his phone thing, and it turned out he was desperately chasing after a number of women, using the EXACT same lines he used on me. It was fascinating to see how girls with self esteem responded to his lazy texting style – I wish I’d retorted the same way. The minor ‘comfort’ I got when I checked his phone a second time was that he clearly had been unsuccessful with them. It makes me wonder if their self esteem is pretty crap too – that they have to keep chasing women to boost their ego, and resent the girls like us who are there for them, full of love and care and a warm bed, because they don’t honestly believe they deserve it.
I my I think you wrote this article about me! I have continued to go in/out of my relationship for 8 yrs and he is no closer to commitment than in the beginning & I always blame myself for something I’m doing wrong but he seems happy. Go figure. After our 2nd break up a couple weeks ago I hope I have the courage not to go back to what I’m used to with him.
Good article Natalie, I need to bookmark it and read it every day.
So true! I am no longer there because I have now been NC for 6 weeks and it works. I feel so much better about myself. I did it on my terms and I went NC after a hot pursuit initiated by me. Take that, Assclown! On the first day of NC, he couldn’t stand it any longer because I didn’t so much as acknowledge his presence, that he came up to me and asked what he did wrong THIS time. I just shrugged and said nothing and let him walk away. Nice to leave him perplexed for a change! Six weeks later still NC and he STILL doesn’t know why! Thank you Natalie and all the women on this site! I am free!
Thank you for this article. I need these posts to read and get a clue and to continue to remind myself over and over of why I am no longer seeing AC. Just as I was telling a friend tonight how desperately I want to break contact so bad…he was messaging me on a site we met on. This doesn’t make it any easier. I miss him terribly. The last few days I was ok but then today I had one of those bad days of constant imagery. Two steps forward, one step back. I think of him constantly. The logic Nat brings is there in my head but not in my heart. I sometimes wonder if I will ever be free…
JR, yes you will be free of him! Because as time goes on and you maintain NC, you will feel so much better that you won´t even want to think about him.
Sign up for Natalie´s NC emails, those help a lot, and plan your NC – what you are going to do with your time now that the AC is not there. I´ve found it helps a lot to clean out closets, find new hobbies, try new recipes, make a vegetable garden, knit… things you do with your hands that make your mind calm down.
Hang in there, it gets better!
Lilia, thank you! How do I sign up for the NC emails? I don’t see anything on the site anywhere to sign up for those. I will definitely need that!
Ooh, I can´t find it on the site anymore either. Perhaps it´s the same as the NC course?
Another great post, Natalie!
I think when you allow someone to come in and out of your life like that, that says a lot more about YOU than them! Just by ALLOWING them to do so, you’re not creating healthy boundaries for yourself on how you want to be treated.
Just the act of letting come back the 2nd or 3rd time, you are essentially telling them “YES, YOU CAN TREAT ME THIS WAY.”
Your comment is SO TRUE!Everyone we meet in our life are important! EUM and AC teach us things about ourselves!I am in coming to ditch my EUM/AC..just need a tex from him not to reply to! I was happy before I met him 18months ago..now I am only a shadow of that person! Do we actually attract each other in our misery? I love him to the moon and back but and feel sorry for him but for my own sanity I can not go like this! He just recently changed the conditions to our relationship so that was the last straw..After a month NC he tex me to say sorry(we have not been intimate since then) but he said lets take it slow and see where we end up! Lol that pretty much says NOWHERE to me…he makes me ill
For a six month stretch I had this guy popping in and out of my life. We were acquaintances who had make the foolish mistake of having a drunken one night stand, that didn’t amount to anything else. We didn’t end up dating or being involved at all after that, only interacting on a regular basis as sort-of-friends. But it was the most frustrating experience for me, because like you say he didn’t want me, but didn’t seem to want anybody else to have me either. His behaviour ran so hot and cold it confused me, I never knew what I was going to get when I ran into him. I had few expectations of him after that night, only that we’d be friends, yet he would ignore me, rejected my facebook friend request, yet continued to pop in now and then with compliments and flirtation. I know of one time when another guy had been interested in me, suddenly he was attentive and interested too, and because I was blinded by my attraction to him I thought it meant he had been jealous of the new guy and was finally ready to date me. Of course as soon as the other guy was out of the picture the idiot was gone too. And then last month I had started seeing a friend of his, and things were going well, until he suddenly disappeared on me. I then found out that the previous guy had discovered we’d been seeing each other, so putting it all together I suspect he said something to chase his friend off. At least the original idiot has moved away since then, and I no longer have to deal with him. But being jerked around in that way was one of the most frustrating experiences I’ve had. I can now at least recognize this kind of behaviour and nip it in the bud before it makes me crazy.
You’ve just described the last two year of my life. I have decided to walk away no run away because this type of foolishness is blocking a real relationship from coming in. Thanks so much for this post and your ‘keep it real’ writing style!
-J
It seems like it has taken me a lifetime to get the fact that the exMM was a greedy, lying no good cheat. Maybe it’s taken a lifetime because I tolerated it? In the beginning of my faux NC, I really did think that when he rang me up, texted, and emailed, it was because he realized “he couldn’t live without me”. I loved the what I’m thinking vs what he is thinking. Yup, you nailed it. I really was thinking this dude couldn’t still be pursuing me like a cockroach after a nuclear bomb unless there was something there. Although it is tough to admit, it was simply the dog in the manager. He wanted me without any attendant commitment and/or responsibilities as he had that with his wife. Greedy bastard comes to mind. It never dawned on me, until BR, that he was perfectly happy, having his cake and eating it too. I was the one in pain. According to him, he was doing the right thing as his needs were met, a wife and family with commitment/responsibility and ton of fun on the side…me! According to me, it hurt like hell. I’m absolutely certain he interpreted my still being there, despite the hurt, anger, and pain which I expressed repeatedly and angrily, as I was signing up on his terms. I just never imagined that anybody could do that because I couldn’t…lesson number 1002, we were different people! And bet your bottom dollar, when the “goal” rolled around he beat feet down the field, only to come simpering back with the same shit on offer. At one point, way back when I broke NC, I actually asked, do you have anything more to offer and his answer was no. So was mine.
Runner, did you really mean the “dog in the manager,” because I pictured someone with mid-level work responsibility and the food-and-sex ethics of a womanhound! The picture of the panting guy in the tie made me laugh!!
That MM totally came sniffing around and there was a point when it interested you and it has been a loooong time since then.
Don’t know about you, but I can’t even imagine being attracted to someone who “couldn’t live without me.” What the heck did they do before I came along, then?
Opps, I’m not sure if that was a Freudian slip. Now I’ll always picture the dog in the manger as a panting guy manager in a tie. Maybe the present version of the dog in the manger is a dog as a manager? Isn’t spelling and semantics wonderful?
Runnergirl,
“It never dawned on me, until BR, that he was perfectly happy, having his cake and eating it too. I was the one in pain” YES! I feel you on this realization. They stuck around NOT because they were in love and couldn’t live without us, but because they enjoyed the benefits despite seeing clearly the pain it caused US. I told “mine” about the anguish I was experiencing too, and I only ever got “well, I don’t want to hurt you. I do love you, but I don’t know where it will lead. I would love to be with you in the future but know know how to make that happen” What selfish, greedy creeps! The exMM I was stupid enough to get involved with was so greedy he was having his cake and eating cake, cupcakes, and probably butter tarts too! All the while allowing each “desset” to feel like she was his favourite. Pah! So glad our “final answer” to them was NO.
oops – DON’T know how to make that happen…sorry
Another timely article by Natalie. My ex assclown just attempted to pop back into my life after 5 months of nc. I got the usual I think about you often and really Miss our phone conversations. In the past I would fall for this crap but this time I ripped him a new one. He was so stunned that his response email was full of back peddling saying he just wanted to say hi and see how I was. I responded with…now that you know I am happy and healthy your curiosity must be satisfied. So…goodbye.
Ha! Ex-EUM Lover, that was FABULOUS!!! Though some might argue that you should have NC-ed his a**, I think your response was brilliant!!!
“Back-peddling” indeed! I swear, they’re all BMX-ers. They have the tricks down, but can’t seem to peddle their a**es home.
Ex-EUM Lover,
!!! High five Lady! loving that and good for you, well done for taking control of your own happiness and keeping this guy out of your life. Bet he got the shock of his life hahaha!!! xxx
Thanks Ladies. It felt so good to do that. Sometimes it is ok to break nc when you are doing something that makes you feel better.
Love the bmx comment. Lolol
Ha, says it all when they’re telling you they miss the *phone conversations*… well, whoopee doo.
There is nothing like a potion of Nat’s humour to set the controls for a positive day! So fitting a comparisson: those blue-arsed flies buzzing around! Let’s not sign off our power to them, ladies!
Wow, that a great post, thank you Natalie. Loved it. Exactly my situation! I and AC decided to meet up next Monday, I did not mention to him that it will be our last “take it or leave it” conversation. IF he is not ready to show me commitment, I will drop him like a hot potato.
After two months of NC, it will be easy to do it, as I used to being alone:-)
Little Star! What you have practiced the last 2 months is not NC if you’re going to go have a conversation with the guy and the topic is “take it or leave it.” There should be no opportunity to “take it” with you anymore!
The abusive AC I was with for four years used to come round to my house after I told him I wanted out, knocking on my doors and windows for hours pleading, then threatening, then sitting outside on my patio chain smoking for hours while I hid inside in the dark, until I let him in ‘to talk’. I asked so many times, why won’t you just leave me alone if you can’t stop hurting me, He always said “You know why I keep coming back.” I guess I was supposed to infer that he loved me? That he knew he messed up? It was left open for me to fill in the blanks. He would never clarify why in his own words. I don’t even think he knew himself why. It was like he hated me and he loved me, resented me because I knew the truth about him (he was abusive). I threatened to leave, and did leave so many times but caved in enough that it lost any meaning what so ever. He knew just how far down I would go with him. It was the hate I developed for him that made me leave eventually. Not self love or self respect but hate for him. I can see now how messed up I was, how twisted things had become in my mind. Two years later, looking back is like watching a made for tv movie where you want to smack some sense into the main character. I’ve come a long way, that’s why I can almost laugh at my own foolishness and bad choices during those four years, but I fully accept the lesson that came out of it. Which is as Natalie so clearly puts it…. “Don’t allow someone to keep pulling the same con on you numerous times because there’s ‘hopeful’ and then there’s relationship crack.”
A very awakening article! And the replies are Fab too! I will have to keep reading all of these and realise that what you are all saying is TRUE. I cannot believe that he wants to be with me on his terms when he knows very well that I want more? Very confusing and hurtful. Good luck everyone. x
Oh my God, this is exactly what happened to me!!! For the last two years, I’ve literally been on an emotional roller coaster, or more precisely, through hell, because of someone I had spent five and a half years with, hoping he would finally commit (and change I guess)!! Reading through all Natalie’s posts, I now see I’ve been living in a la-la land, fantasizing that he would finally see how great I am for him and come back to me (he was the one that dumped me — he finally went on a trip and cheated on me there,for me to finally realize he wanted out!! — talking about red flags, eh?:)). I was totally blind, had a very low self esteem and he was using that against me, or better, to his own benefit. He’s now happy with someone else, and I’m still here, struggling with everything, trying to finally pull myself together again 🙁
Natalie, your posts have been such an eye opener for me!! I wish I had read this two years ago because it would0ve definitely helped me a lot. Especially after the breakup, when he continued to keep me in limbo (and yes, I let that).
Anyway, I’d really like to ask you guys something. Namely, after the breakup his family and friends have consistently wanted to keep in touch with me. And I’m kind of having problems with that. I was really close to his family and that was also one of the reasons why it hurt so much (and it still does). We live in the same small town and of course I keep running into someone … His cousin keeps inviting me to visit her and all and we’ve been in contact ever since the split. They’re really good people and I don’t want to lose them too. Or do you think that’s just an excuse for me not moving on? Because I do fell good when I see someone “from the past” and see that they still love me (and everyone keeps telling me to move on and find someone better, because he’s not worth obsessing over), but on the other hand, it does pull me back into the past … Can anyone offer some insight into this, please? I’d be extremely grateful.
I am working on myself a lot, my self esteem, I’m traveling a lot, hanging out with friends, etc. So I can’t say things haven’t improved. At first I just couldn’t bare being alone in a room, for instance, but now I’ve finally got used to being by myself and enjoying things WITHOUT him:)
Sunshine,
GOOD for you for getting away from that user. Glad you feel better.
About his family approaching you, why not be gently honest? Could you say “Oh I’d love to go for a coffee with you, Jane, and we must go sometime. May I call you in future? It’s just that, right now, the memories of X are still quite difficult for me. Would it be alright if I called you (next month, after the holidays, etc)?”
That way, you’re not giving them the brush off, but you’re giving them a perfectly reasonable answer to why you’d like to set up a chat with them in future, not right now.
Grizelda, thanks for your input:)The thing is that I kind of am gently honest with them already:) It’s just that I find it so damn hard to make this division in my head (or heart, for that matter) — namely, that they have nothing to do with all this and that he’s the bad one here, or in short: they’re still OK, whereas he’s the assclown:) Of course it doesn’t help me knowing that he’s now with someone else and this new woman is now spending time with them. I mean I can’t blame them for that, because they must accept whoever he brings home, but it’s just plain …. weird for me to see this … Am I making any sense here at all?:))) I’m still having lots of trouble seeing him with someone else, just getting my head around to these “new” circumstances. I think I’ll always feel a pang inside whenever I see him 🙁 Sorry for being so damn pessimistic, but am still struggling with all this:)
Sunshine
Maybe I’m hard hearted but I would walk away from all of it. You’re gonna end up invited to his wedding at this rate.
Hehehehe, no, they’re all very cautios not to mention him in my presence and all … They understand how I feel. They keep saying everything’s going to be just fine when I meat Mr. Right:)) Now it’s just me that needs to start working on it:) and for instance, his cousin was actually telling me I was wasting my time with him etc.mSo she did give me some good advice, but I was too blind to listen to her 🙁 I don’t know …. Will see how things go and then decide what to do. Thanks for your thoughts anyway:)) xxxx
Sunshine
If you like these people then be friends, provided your boundaries are intact. In my world cousins aren’t that close anyway.
Part of having healthy boundaries is that in your mind you’re not constantly worrying about it. You say to yourself, I am friends with x, it’s got nothing to with him. And you believe it rather than needling yourself and creating a problem where there isn’t one.
For me, I have to be quite clear with myself on what I believe and my decisions, otherwise it bleeds into doubt and fear. I’m not saying blindly pursue destructive paths but you can take a measured approach and stick to it. And change it if you need to. Hope that makes sense.
There is that option, as Grace says, of leaving them behind for the sake of simplicity. If it’s awkward, you can say “I’ll call you after the holidays” and then not call them if you don’t feel up to it. You didn’t say which holidays! They will be sensitive enough to know you gave them the gentle brush-off.
Sunshine,
Keeping in contact with them won’t help you heal properly. You need some distance first. It’s hard to do that in a small town, where you keep running into people and have to be “nice”. Is there a way for you to move elsewhere, even temporarily? Maybe you could go on a long holiday (at least 3 months), do some volunteering abroad, etc.
Well, actually the cousin doesn’t live in the same town, she actually lives on the other side of my country (I’m from Slovenia, by the way:))), so she’s not really a problem:) We keep in touch on the phone though. She’s just had a baby and wants me to come and stay with her for a couple of days. I’ve done that before since our split-up and it was fine (a bit weird the first time, going there on my own without him because I had never done that, but then the second time I actually found out I can have fun there even if he’s not there because it’s me they want to see and not him!!). Anyway, I also moved to the capital two years ago — I live in a small countryside town and I just needed to go away and change the environment. But I do go back a lot because I don’t know, I just don’t fancy cities that much:) And yeah, to make things worse, immediately after the split-up, we were both elected into the local council, where we need to work together!!! What an irony, really!! Well, we only see each other at meetings, and thank God we haven’t had that many lately!!!
But things are getting better. Now I can actually stay at the apartment alone and feel OK (I have three roomies otherwise). And yes, I try to avoid all the social events and stuff like that, where I could run into his mum and other family members. So I am keeping my distance.
As grace said, I just need to have clear boundaries: I’d like to stay friends with the cousin and her family, but that’s it. He’s in another world, separate from them. Does that make sense?:)
I kind of was in the same situation with my ex husband and ex in laws. I had to really minimize the interactions and even changed churches. I told them it wasn’t about them but I needed to take care of Me (Allie). Now after 5 years of the divorce, we are back hanging out more and going to some family gatherings. If they love you they will understand your need of NC.
Thanks, Allie:) Yes, you’re right. And most of them do understand already about NC. Especially his mom (we were very close) — she just told me to call whenever I feel ready and she said she won’t force herself onto me.
Eh, my main problem still is my lack of self-esteem and maybe fear that I’ll never find someone new or the right one for me after having been so hurt:( he was my only true big love (although I’m already in my early thirties). I know the solution is to work on myself … So, working on it:)))
Thanks guys for all the advice. It does help, not to mention Natalie’s posts. They’ve become like my Bible now:))) xxxx
I nearly wobbled today had the text all prepared , but didnt send it hurts this man does not even care . But i didnt send somthing keeps holding me back, the sinking in i was a ego troke a fall back girl , he fell back big time 6 odd months and used me for 5 till ow came back i just couldnt seeit . Because under the illusion he cared because he never went away . Here i am counting the nc days is he i doubt it very much , i can see him laughing , joking every one thinking the sun shines out his bum , but there is one less ego stroke , maybe he down to two maybe three. why o why cant they get the kick in the guts instead of us girls ??
and yes i let him piss me about and treat me badly for 5 odd years and i could see it and did nothing
Hang in there Tired, hang in there.
Have a look through Natalie’s previous posts about EUMs and MMs and ACs and NC. Read the comments. You will see that you and your situation are well understood here. This will give you more strength.
Remember, talk is cheap and disposable — doesn’t matter what you try to say. Silence on the other hand is strong and cannot be ignored. Your silence will speak VOLUMES. It will make you look strong and determined, and it will build day by day.
If you’re in a mind to think of it this way, if there is a future for you two, there’s no way you’re just going to slip into a better relationship from the old one. You have to endure NC first. NC gives you the strength and courage to renegotiate terms in future, if you’re both of a mind to do so. It also turns down your own emotional level. This puts you in a much better position mentally. Like the ladies here say, give it a few weeks without breaking NC and you will not believe how much better you feel then compared to now. But if you break NC, you will be re-entering that burning house of emotional horrors. Don’t do it — save yourself first. What comes next, in several weeks or a few months time, will be more clear to you then.
Tired,
What Grizelda said about silence is spot on. The old saying I can show you better than I can tell you is so true!
I thought I couldn’t go one day without contacting my ex AC “fantasy”. I am now on the 120 day mark. In the beginning it was very hard not to reach out! I stayed strong and made myself not reach out to someone that caused me so much pain & turned the focus onto me and the healing process.
You will get there!!! I wish I had found this site 2.5 yrs ago!!! It seems women go through all the heartbreak. Stay strong!!!
I agree that NC is a great tool, leads to healing and says a lot. Silence is indeed powerful. However, I would like to mention that it can be empowering too to say what you have been wanting to say for a long time, get it out and then go NC. I finally gave AC a piece of my mind after a booty call text. I told him I was much more than a shag and left it at that. I could have just not responded but I have never really spoke up for myself to him and thought it was time to do so. Now comes the NC.
We support you, JR.
I too got the chance to purge myself verbally in a cool, calm, low-voiced, rational way by phone across about 40 minutes. He was lost for words. He asked me if he sent me an email would I respond to it — I said I would, he did send an apologetic email of a few lines about 30 mins later, but I did not respond and I won’t respond. I want that phone call to stand as the piece of verbal architecture that ‘amazed’ him (his word) and left him to ‘reassess everything’. To repeat it or graffiti all over it with further comments would weaken it, so I refuse to do that.
NC is like arm wrestling with yourself, isn’t it? Your heart has one hand, your head the other. It’s an enormous struggle and a lot of self-inflicted pain. And you are the only winner or loser in this match.
My biggest, absolute biggest regret in my most recent breakup was that I never got to have a “final say” before going NC. I was too stunned at the time, then too “dignified” to let him have it – and then by the time I realized that I needed to speak up for myself (not to influence him but just for my own self-respect) it was too late.
I too have designed a magnificent tower of verbal architecture that I would love to build – but alas, it will probably forever be just a blueprint on paper. I’m sorry now it never became a shining monument of self-empowerment. But I know better for next time.
You’re right not to “ruin” the effect by continuing to break NC with further comments. NC is absolutely necessary. But in some cases, I think having a final say is too.
This is still something that puzzles me Natalie. My ex EUM would make 6 hour round trips to see me, with no sex on offer (his choice, not mine) but I never felt like a priority, he wouldn’t commit to making future plans with me, stopped telling me he missed me or was looking forward to seeing me. When I told him I couldn’t understand why he bothered to travel so far to see me he insisted he still wanted me and wanted a relationship with me. I still cannot see what he was getting out of it other than the ego strokes and the “normalising” effect of having a girlfriend. Would a man really go to such lengths to get their ego boosted? It just seems so strange to me. He was rejected by his mother from an early age. Was I just a mum replacement? Maybe that is why the sex stopped? UGH!!!
Victorious
Driving six hours is not a big deal. Lots of men like driving. And even if six hours was a big deal to him, yes, men will do that for an ego boost.
The boyfriend used to get into the most awful fights when he was younger. When I asked him why he said “I wanted victory!”
Men.
maybe it wasn’t a big deal driving for that long – exactly. On occasion my ex-AC would happily get up, after spending the eve with me, at 4am to travel across country to get to work at 9am. At the time I liked to think it was a sign he was making effort in the relationship, but in reality I think he just happened to be okay doing that. I was just projecting my ideals onto him – for me, it would mean something (I wouldn’t do that for someone I wasn’t serious for). I think he knew he had to give a little somewhere to keep me hanging on, and this was the easiest option for him.
I’d agree it was a bit odd. There was obviously loyalty there, and comfort. He wouldn’t have done it if he didn’t want to, somehow. But just for occasional companionship? It’s as if he were just going through the motions of having a girlfriend somewhere. Did he have a low sex drive? Was he unwavering in his orientation? I don’t mean to offend, but a friend of my mother’s who had a similar relationship (flying 3 hours down to FL once a month to see her) eventually came out as gay about a year after their relationship ended.
Thanks guys. He wasn’t driving – getting various trains, three or four connections. It is probably futile to try to understand why these men do what they do. His sex drive was off the richter scale for first three months, then he flicked a switch and didn’t want to do it at all for final month. Wouldn’t/couldn’t explain it. He doesn’t seem remotely camp to me and has had a lot of relationships with women but I guess you never really know if someone is closet gay. yes -it was as if he was just going through the motions of having a girlfriend somewhere. | think it was really important to him and he was always talking about us being “partners” and having a “relationship” but when someone isn’t grabbing my arse and calling me sexy from time to time it just isn’t working for me!!
Thanks for all your support ladies.
Maybe it was a power thing – withholding sex / not talking about it. Who knows. You can speculate until the cows come home, but will never know for sure. I dread to think the hours i’ve amassed, trying to turn my brain inside out, wondering why an AC was doing/not doing something. It never got me anywhere. From now on Im going to try and focus on me.
I have had two attempts at contact from him. A text and then a lovely card saying he wants to talk. I haven’t responded. He probably doesn’t want to talk about “us” Probably just misses having me around as a lavishly appreciative audience to his daily woes and triumphs. Not happening. I cannot be his friend as long as the mere thought of him with another woman makes me feel sick.
The MM used to spend hundreds of pounds on airfares and expensive hotels in order to see me. I found it bizarre, the only explanation I could think of was that he was really crazy about me, because he was attractive, very, so what else could it be? But yet, he wasn’t crazy about me. Just wasn’t. Never really paid compliments or anything, seemed to look down on me. I can only think that the display of spending was meant to impress with his power, and he could afford it.
Ah yes the well-heeled MM who makes the big effort yet can’t afford to spend a single compliment. I recognise this one. If compliments were carried around and handed out like money, he would have forgotten his wallet every single time.
Perhaps these guys are really treating themselves — not their girlfriends — to their grand gestures. They like to think of themselves as men who… blah blah blah flights blah blah boutique hotels blah blah Michelin Star restaurants blah blah mistresses. Oh, and they’re not the kind of guys who ever say words like sorry or you look so beautiful because they weirdly think giving compliments diminishes them.
These guys do tend to be serial cheaters. And serial cheaters do tend to be psychopaths with narcissistic tendencies. I know how dramatic that sounds, but google the term and check out their common traits.
Griselda
I think you’re right.
I have wondered about the narcissism thing. He used to pay HIMSELF compliments, here are some examples;
“I have been looking through some of my writing and think I am quite talented”(I did lol when I got that email)
“I have been going to the gym and playing lots of sports, I will be buff and athletic when I next see you”
“I have a lot of fans who love my work!”
And (on a facbook page for people with his surname) “We *surname*s
are a very good-looking bunch!”
You could be right about the serial cheating; his explanation of why his wife chucked him out (career envy!) just didn’t make sense.
“Career envy”!!!!!! From his wife!
Ha!!
That just made me laugh out loud in the airport.
Career envy is what made me STAY with a douche exactly like the ones you describe above (though I was, I believe, the ‘primary’ gf).
I remember after one weekend getaway where we flew to a resort etc etc we came back and one of his colleagues had texted him: Hope you enjoyed your weekend of wine and woman!
You know the phrase: wine, women, and song? I think it’s the executive-class version of sex, drugs and rock ‘n’ roll. They are entirely treating *themselves*. We’re just something you bring along, like the dog, (my ex even said as much once) when you’re going out on the pleasure boat.
I would have to agree Magnolia, wine, woman, and song is analogous to sex, drugs, and rock’n’roll.
And ladies, wine, woman, song, sex, drugs, and rock’n’roll can happen in a 5 star resort hotel or in your backyard. It happened in mine. They can treat themselves as long as we agree. So perfect Mags: “We’re just something you bring along, like the dog,” Thank so much for that visual. Pleasure boat, 5 star hotel or the backyard, it’s all the same to them if they’ve got their ego stroke by their side, no matter the type of mammal.
Magnolia
If you rephrase that as “narcissism fatigue” it might be slightly more credible. The constant me myself I might have become a bit of a drag after a few years.
Seriously though thinking about him “treating himself” is making me feel queasy. When I think what I did it was the opposite of the discovery phase. It was the bury your head so deep in the sand that only your feet are sticking out. Too frightened to ask any questions because you know he will probably lie, and if he doesn’t, the answer will hurt.
It seems to have taken me a long time to really understand this, on an emotional as well as an intellectual level. Am I
particularly thick or what? For a long time I have secretly still felt that he was an okay guy, in some ways, and maybe we might be together some day. 🙁
You and I are on the same page, Mymble.
Mine has an exceptionally high intellect, and that was one of the main things that attracted me. I kept a diary, and even then I’d occasionally refer to him as The Great I AM. I did come away from suppers out with him feeling empty and frustrated, the way he always glorified himself and managed to weave into conversations some comments about his past sexual/emotional conquests. When that happened, I tugged hard on his reins. Said “Look, why are you telling me about that? I’m not one of the guys. I’m not someone who wants to hear details of your past exploits”. His response “Ah ok, fair enough, fair enough,” and then would change the subject. Next time, a few months later, he referred to it as “the topic I’m not supposed to bring up with you” and tried to talk about it obliquely. The topic? An intense three month fling he once had several years earlier (yeah, whoop-de-do). He seemed to want to tout this tale as ‘proof’ that he can get totally wrapped up in someone… someone that, obviously, wasn’t me. We were together five years.
Such things are calculated to hurt. Because wherever EUM/narcissists can’t continually pump up themselves, they need to puncture you so that they seem even bigger in comparison.
Oh yes they’re very into self-aggrandisement, very into complimenting themselves casually. And the reason why they’re cheating is always the wives’ fault — their marital problems are never anything to do with their cheating of course, but for a spurious reason or a reason they pretend not to comprehend.
They’re also very much into ‘control’ of the situation and of other people. Often, they have a very high work ethic and project a moral superiority which builds them a great community/workplace reputation. Quite unemotional, they approach situations with logic and rationale at all times.
If you want to feel like you’re nothing more than a cardboard cut-out, try to form a relationship with one of these.
Griselda
That portrait is 100% accurate.
Good work ethic, moral superiority, (associated himself with a particular controversial, high profile, political and moral issue) and high public profile, cold and
rational.
He did show signs of being a vulnerable human being from time to time, but the prevailing mode was as you describe.
oh, god, mymble, i laughed out loud at his compliments to himself! whatatool!!!
Victorious,
My ex travelled long distances to see me, too (3 hour round trip driving, although we often met half way and more often I did the whole trip). Sometimes we would be physical, sometimes not. He once told me he would travel for days just to see the look in my eyes when I gazed at him, even for five minutes. He wasn’t travelling to see me, he was travelling to see the reflection of himself in my eyes. To see the admiration there for an ego boost. Narcissus (?sp) personified!
Wow! That makes a lot of sense. I probably did look at him adoringly and was always trying to bolster his ego. He was always saying he had never had anyone in his life that was as kind and nice to him as I was (Mum abandoned him as kid, dad went off with OW) So maybe that really was it. It just doesn’t make sense to me but obviously it does to them!! Thanks.
This was literally my story of the man with whom I had my epiphany relationship.Two and a half years of thinking he was the most wonderful man (ha ha ha ha) I’d ever met (totally ignoring the reams and reams of red flag bunting), only to be told that I was just a ‘casual’ thing and he couldn’t give me what I wanted. Funny how he managed to get what HE wanted. To say I was hurt was understatement of the century. Who knew Mr Wonderful was actually such a cold man who used me for all he could get.
I licked my wounds, tried to hold my head up – as a few days (yes, days!!!) later he once again crawled back into my life and heart (and I let him!!) with sweet talk. He was a LDR (which was controlled by him) so I didn’t get to see him as often as I would have liked and he told me he was separated. Massive luminous, SCARLET flags, which I was oblivious to – BR ladies please, step away from any LDR and/or separated man – you will never see the real man until it is too late. How I wish I had the knowledge that I have now – Natalie, you should be so proud of what you have taught us all.
Cut a long, very painful story short, he came for the last time to surprise me for my birthday, last year. Unfortunately, the surprise wasn’t a nice one, for me, anyway. My family, friends and I all thought it was the most romantic gesture ever (guess we ALL need a BR reality check) as he REALLY wanted to be with me. WRONG. WRONG. WRONG. He wanted the ego boost of being welcomed by all my family and friends, yet HIS F&F didn’t know I existed. He wanted a distraction from what was going on at home. And he kept me at arm’s length, as far away from his real life as possible (which hurt me so much – what I thought was excitement was actually my spidey senses kicking in and I ignored them. SOB!).
*hangs head in shame at how stupid could I have been?*
I’ll spare all the gory details, but I eventually plucked up to courage to ask him what I should have asked a loooooong time before – “WHAT is going on and why did things go wrong before?” His answer?? “Don’t ask questions you don’t want to know the answer to”. I then dared to push it a bit more and he said “Don’t make me sorry I came over.” WTF?
At that moment a HUGE lightbulb came on, showing him in all his true colours. It was like a BR version of the Emperor’s New Clothes, except he was wearing a suit made from the biggest red flags ever – and I could FINALLY see it. My rose tinted glasses were smashed as my fur coat of denial spontaneously combusted and guess what?? He knew he’d been busted. GAME OVER.
A few feeble emails between us followed and then I went totally NC. It was the most painful relationship to get over as I questioned everything he had said/done/written. Nine months of NO contact whatsoever and I feel better every single day.
I would never had believed I would get over him, as he was the first man I had let into my life after a very painful divorce years before. But I did it.
Thankyou Natalie for all your fantastic advice and to all you wonderful BR ladies for sharing your stories. I’ve literally laughed and cried at some of the things you wrote, but to all those ladies just starting out on the NC route………hold your head up high and you WILL get there.
I just want to say a massive THANK YOU to you Natalie, for keeping me on the right path and helping me find my long lost self-esteem. I couldn’t have done it without you. (((BIG HUG))) XXX
P.S. I LOVE the photo of your youngest daughter, with your glasses on – makes me smile every time I see it 🙂
keepcalmandcarryon,
Thank you for sharing your encouraging story with us. I know how painful it can be when you are not part of their daily lives and feel like you are “in the shadows”. I am 3 months NC today, and although starting to feel a bit better,I still think of him constantly, it seems. It is great to feel, at 9 months NC, that your daily improvement continues. hugs to you
Thanks, Learner. 3 months? Well done for getting this far and BIG hugs to you.Hang on in there!! NC is the way to go. Some days it feels like you’re never going to get over him, or the relationshit (LOVE that expression!). Trust me, NO CONTACT works!! At first there are no good days and you yearn to go back to the original’Mr Wonderful’ (not his hurtful alter ego). Stick with it. Sit on your hands. Step away from your laptop (apart from BR, of course). See friends. Have a laugh. Do anything that doesn’t involve thinking about him. Just keep busy. Then one day, as if by BR Magic, the clouds begin to lift and soon there are good days as well as the (not so) bad. Eventually,the sun comes out (complete with Natalie’s smiling face) and you realise….I’M OVER HIM. All that crap that you allowed has totally gone, freeing yourself up for the next chapter in your life. I didn’t realise that I could actually take back control of my own life!! That’s the spell these blokes have over us. The bonus is, of course, that you now know what you didn’t know before…..you can spot an Assclown from a mile off. It’s brilliant 🙂
For all the more mature BR girls, remember the old ‘I Spy’ books, when we were kids, where you could tick off things as you spied them (ie: shells on the beach etc). How innocent our childhood was in the olden days, eh? Ha ha 🙂 Wonder if Natalie could make us a BR version? I SPY AN ASSCLOWN. Tick off all the different types of EUMs, including all their cheesy chat up lines/FF’ing/switch & bait etc.
I can spot them now in the pub, on the telly, in songs…everywhere. It’s so easy when you know how!
keepcalm,
Thanks – I am looking forward to the “BR magic” day you described, when I am over him, and when I, myself, have become a better and more grounded person. And yes, it’s much easier to “spy” an assclown now!!!
Keepcalm, thank you for sharing your story. Well done you for 9 months of NC, hopefully you will meet a Real Mr Wonderful. YOU are inspiration!
I also happy that I discovered BR (thanks to HS), and very grateful to Natalie and BR ladies. I just wish all NML’s posts would sink into my head and I will stop making mistake with men!
“What can be incredibly perplexing and even painful though, is when they stick around (and you let them) but they still won’t cough up the relationship goods, or they go but they keep boomeranging in and out of your life, raising your hopes each time”
This is pretty much my life for nigh on 3 yrs – as soon as my ex started to feel obligated or responsible for my happiness he would just disappear, refuse to take my calls and when I finally pinned him down would get angry and say he was endng it because I was pushing him and ‘forcing’ him to, which would leave me guilt ridden and self loathing. The situation at the moment is that he has done something which I will ‘hate him for’ – he wouldn’t tell me what it was so I went N/C – I made it to about 2 wks then he txt me saying ‘sorry’ but still refuses to specify when he has done
You just described the last 35 years of my life. Hung in there, worked my ass off, stood by my man, made excuses for him and thought he must love me because he wasn’t leaving. He totally failed me in the end. Taking risks that were putting me and my children in harms way. He wanted an exciting life. Tried to break my spirit. Wouldn’t meet me halfway and in the end said he respected me for kicking him out.
This is the first time someone wrote something that made me understand what actually happened. I was trying to let him learn and grow and was in fact letting him get away with tons and tons of shit. Thanks for the insight. There’s a great lesson here. Pity I learned it so late….
Carmen (divorced, NC for 5 months and feeling a lot better)
Thank goodness for Grace!
I can’t remember who the posters were that were talking about soul mates and love flowing for their (presumably) erstwhile ex or current partner but I do remember the feeling I had reading the posts. They gave me the heebie jeebies.
We aren’t Julia Roberts in Pretty Woman; we aren’t characters in the latest cheesie rom com. Get your head out of the clouds (or the popcorn!). If you are prepared to tie yourself to an awful love experience and then romanticise it, you need your head read. Am I being harsh? Probably. But we need to get that romantic CRAP out of our heads. It isn’t love; it doesn’t help us. At best that type of love is a 90 minute movie. It’s not built to last. It’s built to magic money out of our purses by fooling us into believing that our lives are humdrum, boring existences.
I’ll take boring any day of the week. Boring means my bills are paid; boring means I can focus on my work; boring means I am always laughing with my friends and sleeping well.
I can’t wait to find a boring partner and live a perfectly ordinary life!
“I’ll take boring any day of the week. Boring means my bills are paid; boring means I can focus on my work; boring means I am always laughing with my friends and sleeping well.”
PREACH it, Getting it!
word
This couldn’t have come at a better time. Met a guy in 2004 and then moved, wound up meeting up again and truly thinking it was meant to be…A complete year of back and forth, “I love you but” almost every two weeks then a complete breakup. He dated someone else, so did I but he would continue to text once a month, “how u?” I was so stupid thinking that he missed me just because he said he did. He broke up with his gf, I ended mine and then there he was. He said he wasn’t going to come straight back to me, that we could talk about getting really back together in 6 mos. He used the excuse of past relationships and how they “dated” for so long before they committed. He wants to hang in bars, party, then come home text me and chat, even hang out every now and then. He once said I was the only one that would put up with his BS! He would tell me he loved me and didn’t want to lose me but knew he couldn’t keep me forever this way. He would say I will love you till the day you die, you are the third woman I’ve ever loved!! YACK He would get drunk and text me why do you love me? I’m a loser, etc. After one night knowing he was out at a bar, I cracked, lost it and went off on him. He told me I needed to grow up and now he couldnt ever be with me after that because I showed my true colors. For 7 weeks no contact. I had blocked his number and then last night stupid me broke my own rule and contacted him. He last text was “it was good to hear from you”. What an idiot! He gave me crumbs for over a year, had me thinking if I just played it cool, he would come around because he had been hurt before and just needed time and reassurance. Now today I’m so mad at myself and hating myself for giving him the stupid time of day. I hate that he thinks I’m still around and he can check in on me whenever he wants. I broke no contact and I am sick!
Finally,
I just about had my head in my hands by the time I arrived at the end of your post! Aaargh, broken NC!
I’m going to take a stab in the dark and say that you probably broke NC out of boredom and temptation rather than anything really intense? At risk of sounding a bit crazy — have you thought about getting a new man in your life sooner rather than later? I know the general philosophy here is ‘stay away from other men til you’ve [healed, recovered, resolved, turned 85, etc]’. But I believe that in many cases the solution should be a woman needs a new man to divert her thoughts and actions away from the EU/MM/AC old man. Provided of course she isn’t still stinging and in a zombie fug from her last enconter, which would be unfair. But provided that you’re actually doing alright otherwise… why not? Otherwise it’s a bit like when you’re been sacked from a job and you’re still obsessing in an overattached way about the people there, the role, the daily problems, the bosses, the drinks after hours, etc — until you get your new job, and that’s when you move on completely.
i think you are right on Grizelda. comments are all spot on. plan to update my own saga toot sweet. i think we break up allright … but it’s when they come barging back in that it continues. then it’s right back to square one. and maybe that cycle continues because it’s a death and that is hard to face. so a replacement for the “love void” can move the whole thing along.
Finally, in the beginning I slipped off the NC wagon more times than I was on. Eventually I stayed the course by getting on a steady no BS diet and a five times a day BR diet. Yeah I was mad as hell at myself and felt like shit too. I brushed myself off, bandaged my wounds, and started again and again and again. Finally (pun intended), it stuck. Listen to what this guy is saying, he’s a self-admitted loser, and his actions are matching his words, he’s a loser. On the other hand, there is hope for you! You aren’t a loser. Although there may be a temptation to get back out there and get involved with another guy, that route didn’t work for me. I just got involved with another guy same package. It takes some time to get over an ex, even if he was a loser. Take some time to focus on you. Take some time to develop boundaries and values. Write them down…that was a hugely interesting exercise for me. Take some time to know you and know you can trust yourself. Any one of us can have a guy in our life pretty quickly. But is it the same guy, different package? If so, the cycle starts again. You can break that cycle. Take a break.
One more thing Finally,
I’m 53, married three times by the time I was 42 and divorced. Then a couple of boyfriends, including a few MM’s. All were the same guy. In fact, some of them got along quite famously. The getting over one guy by getting under the next was a recipe for disaster for me. It may be different for you but I was so worn out that Natalie’s simple suggestion of taking a break seemed the only logical path since the over under route wasn’t working for me. Just my 3 cents.
runner
Yep. In my case the boyfriends got WORSE not better until I finally had a relationship break. Okay, my break WAS too long (six years) but I don’t regret it. The second half of it was great fun. The last year of it was lovely. Then I met the boyfriend.
What helps me with this relationship and keeps me grounded is knowing that if it doesn’t work out I can be happy single. I’m not afraid. Well, I have my moments but I’m not jelly.
finally!!!
everyone here has great advice. whatever you do, here’s what i want you to do as well:
chant to yourself iamnobody’sfallbackgirl,
iamnobody’sfallbackgirl,
iamnobody’sfallbackgirl,
iamnobody’sfallbackgirl
until you BELIEVE it.
probably you broke NC because, yes, you needed a little digital hug, a virtual ego boost. whatever. who cares what he thinks. you’re nobody’s fallback girl.
I feel I am gaining strength from reading this web site. I find myself learning more and more each day, and yet I still asked myself – is AC “J” someone I should spend time with? Do I not love myself enough to want more for myself?
14 years ago, I dated this man. We were both young and hot and in love. I was not an available woman at the time, and don’t think I have been for many years – even through 2 marriages. From what I’ve been told, I broke up with him for no reason and broke his heart.
Over the 14 years, we have drifted in and out of each other’s lives, specifically after my first failed marriage I reached out to him because I thought I threw away a treasure.
Seems as though he has taken delight in punishing me for that “mistake” which it probably wasn’t…
He is genuinely a nice hearted guy, but he also disappears every time we get close again. No phone calls, no emails, nothing. He has major issues with attachment, and has left our reconnects usually telling me I am “too clingy” (As I am writing this I am starting to get an even better picture of this EUM!) and at age 39, still lives with his mom!
So why do I care that he is in my life again, on this 7th trip of our 14 year cycle. Why do I care if he says “this time we’re not having sex until we have a chance to date each other”. It all seems dreamy, but Natalie’s web site has totally punched me in the face and said, WAKE the F*&% up!
I thought he was my “Soul Mate” and that I screwed everything up and I had to suffer my consequences. This article, today, has hit me in a way I needed to be hit again.
Especially this part,
What can be incredibly perplexing and even painful though, is when they stick around (and you let them) but they still won’t cough up the relationship goods, or they go but they keep boomeranging in and out of your life, raising your hopes each time.
I will take this to heart, Natalie. I will not long for a past that I cannot change. I will commit to healing myself and not trying to save him. Thank you for what you have brought to my life, and obviously many others.
What angers me about this schenario is the irresponsibility of these guys towards the woman they´re treating like this!
Don´t they ever feel mediocre, at the least?
Don´t they ever bother to think about what the other party is going through?
Having been in this situation myself recently, I am now letting the anger flow out. Yes, I know I should´ve protected myself better and done NC much sooner, but don´t these guys have any decency?
I so wished I´d told the EUM Shame on you! (something old fashioned my grandma would´ve said but still).
Lilia I too would love the answers to the questions you pose.
Men who just literally haven’t developed any complex feelings beyond the basic survival kit ones everyone is born with (fear, contentment, anger) or the self-aware toddler stage ones (embarrassment, sadness, jealousy, resentment, greed, joy, impatience, etc) coupled with hormonally driven adolescent ones (desire, lust) — don’t they hark back to some serious cognitive developmental issues? Why are their range of emotions stuck in the 1-4 range of a dial which is normally 1-10? Is this why they seem to behave as if other people (especially women, who have something they want) are just cardboard cut-outs like themselves rather than real people who experience sophisticated emotions? Are there any psychiatrists in the house?
Grizelda,
Love the 1-4 vs 1-10 idea. I think my ex had a 1-3 scale! He came right out and told me he didn’t know what love was. I was determined to show him, fool that I was. When I asked how he felt, it was either “exhausted, comfortable, or happy” those were his 3 feelings. I don’t think he had a clue about the wide range of feelings I had as a result of our involvement. Oh, to be so blissfully ignorant. No wonder they can sleep at night despite dispicable behaviour!
I think there definitely is a disconnect between many men and their feelings, which results in a truly impoverished emotional range. I’m not sure exactly why this is but there is a lot of literature out there on how western culture has failed men by eliminating necessary, and psychologically healthy, initiation rites. This was the process in almost all cultures before the modern West that turned boys into MEN. So many of these EUMs are just boy-men, stuck in perpetual narcissistic adolescence because they’ve never made this transition. It’s a tragedy, really.
I’m struck by comments on this and other blogs that many men are truly stunned and surprised when confronted about their behavior. I think that response is probably genuine in many cases. We’re outraged by their behavior (“surely they know what they’re doing!”) and it IS outrageous, but is it possible in some cases (or maybe most) that these men are not really cruel, predatory assholes, but merely clueless, emotionally stunted ones?
This is not to say they aren’t responsible for their behavior, but understanding this might help US to move on from our own anger and bitterness. Just something to think about.
Sadder but Wiser, I would like very much to see things this way, but no, the ex MM was a cruel, predatory, clueless, emotionally stunted asshole.
Yep, that about sums it up, Lilly.
Yes, I’m sure there are plenty of those out there too! 🙂
Im so sorry i let you all down but most of all i let myself down i text him , a hello how ya doing even tho i know hes mm and got a ow , he replied not good hope you okay , so i adked what up and he said usuall , i had said i miss the laughing and he replied he missed that to , i sent couple of texts to which i got i know reply soon as at work but nothing , i nearly text message received loud and clear but i dont want to make a bigger fecking arse of myself today than i already have , its quite clear he does not give a shit and im replaced , i feel so pathetic and crap and alll my own fault he wants me gone . I feel so utter utter stupid and i was doing so well 🙁
Tired, honey.
Let’s stick with the facts: He’s a MM who didn’t treat you well. You were NC. Out of missing him/starting your period/seeing a movie where one of the background actors looked like him/WHATEVER….you broke NC. You say, I miss laughing with you. He says, I miss it too. Then nothing from him. End credits.
It stings, yes. But HOW does this 5-minute text session DEFINE you? It doesn’t. You made a mistake. I myself make them by the minute. So the only question that should be in your mind is: what am I going to do NEXT?
You’ve learned your lesson. Continue NC. I know it hurts, but don’t take it as some sign from God or the universe or whatever that you’re not worthy. It’s just a couple of texts. I’m sure he’s not thinking about it. Get on with your life. We’re all still here for you.
Tired
focus on you. Ultimately it doesn’t and won’t matter what he thinks of your texts or of you or of your breaking NC cos he’s not in your future anyway – he can think what he likes. Forget what he thinks – it’s not important. A couple of texts are not going to make any difference to you in the long term. That’s the way I dealt with my slips off NC – they really don’t matter unless they prevent you from getting to where you want/need to be. You’ll get there anyway – texts or no texts. Back on the wagon… just moving and looking ahead, not back.
Tired,
Adding my agreement to all who have responded. You do NOT want to sign up again to be the OW to the OW. Been there, done that, still hurting like hell. We deserve so much better. Forgive yourself, keep clam and carry on with NC!
Tired,do not feel stupid.
What you have done in the scheme of things is just a hiccup. Nothing more nothing less. His present other woman will also be replaced and he also wont give a shit.You are now out of that cycle, and that`s a major achievement.
Sticking your hand in a fire is painful, I do it every few months by checking his online profile, because he sends me a ” I still love you” text, or sometimes because he doesnt and I panic he found someone new and will be wonderful in new relationship now. But I wouldnt have him back. Each time my hand goes in the fire I find a further confirmation what a shit he is and I then beat myself over the head for being my own worst enemy, because even though I got rid of him so he cant hurt me anymore I`m hurting myself by myself. It is taking me ages to chew over this break up because I`m dealing with my entire baggage at the same time. This NC feels like trying to give up smoking- you know you ought to but there is a reward in there somewhere.I think I`m addicted to feeling bad about myself and being treated badly feels normal.Undoing that is a lot of work and I progressed so much in my relationships with people that with whatever is actually current and happening for real in life I act like someone who loves and respects herself.Which feels amazing and people actually look up to me. So, a bit more work and the hiccups will be a history. The big picure is you and I are going forwards and that`s all that counts, chin up!
thankyou so much for your responses , i been for a pamper with a good friend and councilling, my councellor is trying to stop me ananylising him to deathand focus on me . i say i get thoughts at 5 in morning ill never see him againhell never climb stairs in my house , she said i got to replace negative thought with hell never climb stairs in my house caz i shut the door in his lying face . its hard to finally see what somebody really is , i think hell treat this ow better . No he wont she just flavour of month coz she blind sided and ego stroking me i sussed him out and he knew it , i binned him as hed have carried on . I loved him and now i got to deal with it and move on and its me staying stuck with a big fat balding loser thats doing it theres a whole world out theere and when m ready to trust again i will but this time any red flags i walk and dont look back x Thankyou you gave me the strength to start a change to tired the doormat to tired the lion .lol
This was so needed today! I’ve been grappling with getting back with an ex that was so wonderful in the beginning and we’ve broken up multiple times for a number of reasons. My head feels clear again after reading this! Thank you!!
Who can you blame when he tells you from the start that he’s a player, and you think you can handle that? That you don’t want commitment either. Then you fall in love with him. I don’t mean “in lust” with him. I mean honest and truly in love. Love like you’ve never ever felt before. And it’s not your first rodeo. Who can you blame then? What can you do? It’s been 7 years now, going on 8. I dug my own grave I’m afraid. I don’t think he is able to commit. He isn’t even as they say “good looking”, but he’s got what ever it is to make you fall in love with him. I’m not just talking about sex either. I haven’t seen him in almost 2 1/2 years now. Talk every now and then. And I still love him. I couldn’t even see anyone else. But I have met someone. Not sure how it will turn out or if I can even get involved with him. I feel like I would be betraying my heart/soul if I did. That’s how much I love this guy.
Sharon
I think Nat’s dreamer book can help you here. I feel your pain, i have been there. The pain is real but the relationship is not. You’ve not seen him in over two years. It’s a fantasy. I get that it makes for great literature and poetry but it sucks to live it. Leave it to the writers and poets. The rest of us need a living man in the real world.
I “loved” a player too. They create an illusion but theres nothing substantial there. Real love is better. It satisfies.
Yea I guess if someone texts you every single day “I have a Boner” that should also land in the same catagory of a “psychotic psychopath”. Beware because they are definitely out there.
Yeah Awakened,
He definitely gets a place in the Assclown hall of fame and a special mention in the Olympic “delayed puberty; mesmerised by his own dick” event.
hahahahahahaha!!!
one could call him a “below- the- navel gazer”…
I already have this girl scout badge. The boomeranging and all, it used to be flattering that a guy ‘just couldn’t stay away’….now I know better and won’t be a part of this again. I truly didn’t know it was eu behavior until I started reading BR. Now when a friend is going thru the same thing it turns my stomach.
Tired. Don’t beg for torture when they’re happy to give it freely.
Can someone get me to think clearly. My EUM was like this above. I broke up with him for the third (and for good) time recently. My gut was telling me something was wrong but I didn’t want to listen. He acted overly “independant” like I was just on the side of his life. Showed no emotion and was no support for me if I was upset about the smallest thing there was no support. He did not do nice things like buy flowers or do cute gestures. There was zero intimacy and sex was very cold. Yet I thought I was the problem, that there was something that I could just do better and he would treat me better. First break up lasted 1 week – he showed emotion(!) and I took him back. Second breakup because I felt alone and like a “think” lasted 2 months. I healed in that time, got my self esteem and confidence back and life was great! He crawled back and we got back together for another 3 months and despite promises he was worse this time and added passive aggression to everything else.
Looking back I don’t feel i loved him, how could I? So why am I so upset that he has an online dating account aleady after 1 month? I feel like he is going to treat the next girl like gold and that I was treated bad because I didn’t deserve it. Why am I so hung up on someone who gave me NOTHING??
Jeni91 – Listen to your gut. If you feel something hinky, it’s because he’s doing something hinky. EUM are all about themselves. REPEAT: All. About. Themselves.
You did NOT regain sufficient self esteem and confidence while you were on a break, or you wouldn’t have taken him back again (believe me, I know).
As Nat says, think back on it. Were there really that many good times or were you projecting what you wanted and hoped the relationship would be? Take off the rose colored glasses and look at him. Is he really that great? Are you in love with him, or the potential him? The *him* he showed you for the short time he was blowing hot and wanted to impress you. Remember, actions speak louder than words.
Don’t put in wasted years like I did. It’s more important that you work on you (highly responsive, great potential) than him (he’s not going to change, not even for YOU). Hang in there and keep reading BR.
Oh, and one more thing…
He will not magically have a great relationship with the next woman – or probably any woman. Everything he brought to your relationship (which was nothing), he’ll take to the next one. She’s won’t change his ways or be happy with him either. What a relief, huh? If he’s an EUM, it’s HIM, not you!
I have to back Carol here —
Do NOT think for one minute he’s treating anyone like gold. Not now, not ever. Because he can’t. EUMs don’t change. They just change women. He’s just putting someone else through what you’ve been through.
Put it this way. Think about how you’ve acted with different boyfriends. Were you a totally different person when you were in a relationship with one guy compared to another? No, of course not. You were you. EUMs don’t even have the complete range of emotions you do — and that range of emotions doesn’t change.
Mine too reacted stiffly and robotically if I was ever upset about something that happened (only twice in five years). The vibe was “um, so, do I put my arm around your shoulder at this point I guess?”. The man did not even cry when his father got sick and died of cancer three years ago. He texted me to let me know it happened. I cried for an hour over that text and I had never even met the father, but I felt bad and because I have a human range of emotions. The man did not cry or pray or respond in any way except with logical rationale when his disabled son had an incident and went into near-fatal fits last Christmas. He sees himself as strong, and I did too. I now see him as deeply and irreparably flawed in so many ways it’d take me all day to unpack them here.
Recently I ‘friended’ a guy who I dated a few years back. I did it in a joking way, he accepted, we spent a while e-mailing back and forth and went out for dinner one night. Years back we went out for a few months, then he disappeared on me. Then he came back a few weeks later, wining and dining me with ‘heartfelt’ promises that he would NEVER do that to me again. Cut to two months later, he takes me as his date to a big business function, we make plans for the next night as well and…he disappeared again. Strike two meant I then went on the rebound with an EUM/AC for the next year and and half. Anyway…
About a week and a half ago, I was trolling on an on line site, changed my search criteria a bit and who comes up as a 97% match? Yes, The Disappearing Man. I emailed him, laughing about hit, he emails me back talking about his problems doing on-line dating (all funny), and finishes his email with “and at the end, I realize, you are the only one for me.” What the…? He asks me out, no specific date/time because at that moment he had his kids. Well, that was a week ago (crickets chirping). I can still see he’s ‘shopping’ on line. I don’t know what the hell this guy wants, it sure as hell ain’t me, and I’m pretty darned sure that he’ll come lurking around again when he strikes out some more on on-line dating. FLUSH.
Thanks revolution and sunshine , up i climb on the nc horse again , i got a fb message saying he is having a shit time at home , work and in general , and i thought yehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhj right , still least i know the ow is prob coping the same treTment that i got. I must admit laughing in my evening class that he decorating at home coz the wife threatened to kill him , fresh start tomoz the fobbster can fobster others now , i realised he aont gonna change for anyone its always about him him him . As you said i gotta get on with my life and thats a decent nights kip x thanks for your comments and support ill kick my butt into shape !
I strongly believe we all have to believe
that there is nothing fundamentally wrong with us girls but them EUM/MM/AC men, they turn us the way we feel about ourselves, we do not start off like that, we would not feel like that with EA man?..what bothers me is how and if we should tell them right to their faces what we think of them! That they should get help unless their behavior is well practiced and they are actually happy screwing the womens lives up in purpose!That would be pure evil!
Marimari,
I think we show up with our own set of issues. Being with EU people can magnify and make worse the things we already thought about ourselves. I didn’t get this until the long process of healing started for me after a series of dysfunctional, abusive and unavailable men came into my life. Thing is, they never would of got a foothold in my life if I had more respect for myself. I thought I had self respect because I was very aware of how shitty I was being treated and was very vocal about the injustices. I believed I was standing up for myself. But I kept signing up for the shit treatment, all the while ‘telling them’ how shitty they were being, but still standing right there waiting for the next sucker punch. I wasn’t even conscience of my own complicity until the last couple of years. I am a good person, I always have been, and the behavior and beliefs of these men didn’t mean I was less than, or that I was part of the evil. Of course I didn’t deserve it. They can be evil, but it is up to me to allow or not who comes into my life. We have choices about this. Just today driving around in my car, it occurred to me that I still harbor some of these low beliefs about myself even now with a whole pile of new self respect. I saw a guy I know walking down the street who just got married. He’s a really good man. His wife is lucky. THEN, I caught myself thinking, ‘A man like that would never see me as good enough, I’m the kind of woman he wouldn’t look twice at, as if I’m wearing a scarlet letter.’ Ouch..it was an automatic thought. BUT I caught it. I have to explore that in myself. With that kind of subconscious I’m sure to land me another toad if I’m not careful. That is where the self respect comes in. It’s not MY fault they are a toad, but it’s my fault I give them any room in my life. I argued that the abusive jerk I dated gave me no warnings. Wrong, he did. But I was feeling so lucky anyone at all wanted me that I shoved those warnings and red flags right under the rug. There is something fundamentally wrong with us when we give these creeps space. It’s just a different kind of wrong than them. It took me a long time to see this.
Just reading my own comment made me want to cry. How can I still think such shitty things about myself? Like someone said in the last post, it’s like cutting through the layers of an onion. This is feeling like an emotional little epiphany at the moment, like my progress was just put on graph. Not there yet, but getting closer.
@ Selkie
Your comments really struck me… yeah, how can you (and me, and many others) still think these shitty things about ourselves? I’m so glad you caught that thought though, i do think that’s half of it- before, many of these thoughts/ stories were just there as kind of the ‘air’ or atmosphere we breathed and moved in; when you start to catch the thoughts you can challenge them gently and give yourself some friendliness and compassion when you do.
This is what I have been finding- sometimes insights I have into myself are immediately followed by ‘you complete and utter idiot, why the HELL have you been doing that?’… but slowly I’m trying to remind myself that insight requires compassion.
We are doing our very best, and we cannot heap accusation and self-blame on ourselves in those ‘ouch’ moments where we suddenly see something clealry about how we work (especially when its a ‘bad’ thing).
In a way, when we do berate ourselves, we are doing the same the abusive men were doing- instead of letting us off so-called ‘flaws’ and ‘mistakes’ and going ‘hey, you’re human!’, they would hone in on those feelings of unworthiness and often make it worse.
But those buttons were there to be pushed, they were in us; however, we are learning and that starts with not beating ourselves down when we realise some of the unhelpful things we do!
Anyway- hope this makes sense!
Selkie, if there was something fundamentally wrong with you, you wouldn`t be spending time on this website, working on yourself and you would not be aware of and protesting about how they treated you. Men treated me badly but I treated myself far worse by being my harshest critic ever. The chapter on fathers in Natalies book was a revelation…..my dad always critisised, I was not allowed to have an opinion, therefore denied my own feelings- my intro to the EU world. Well, …recently I started giving myself credit for trying and just sort of accepted I will never be perfect. What a relief! This had an effect in that I feel good enough as I am ( most of the time, anyway)You should be proud of who you are , you sound like such a great, intelligent and insightful person.
ok, I got it from the horse’s mouth, and it confirms what Natalie says and what we all know, but I’m passing it on because, frankly, I couldn’t believe it.
so, I participate on the journals on one if the online dating sites in which I have a profile. and this woman posted a transcript if a text conversation in which an ex of hers made contact, said he had just had a breakup, and, an hour after she gave him very blasé, disinterested replies, asked her if she wanted to come I over. key fact: the time in that invitation was … wait for it … 10pm.
is it expected, she asked the journal-osphere, that a sex-door, once opened, is always expected to remain so?
and this unusually self-aware guy commented words to the effect that he has sometimes texted an ex after breakups because he wanted to touch base with someone who still felt there was good in him to get (wait for it) an EGO BOOST – literally used those words – so he could feel like he was worth something. and that he had told his ex that she should just hang up on him if he ever started actually talking about getting back together.
some other guy posted that one should never be flattered by ex-texting because the guy might have run down a list of 15 women before he got to her.
now – can you imagine if the journaler in question had accepted his invitation?
straight from the horse’s mouth.
cc
See, that’s one thing I do like about men. They really can cut through the BS, while we women are clutching our heads, crying “What does it all mean?!!”
Not as much as we want it to.
gracie-
right.
and i was amazed by the unusually self-aware guy’s description of how his ex handled it. she was patient and kind with him, though she kept the door firmly closed. i’m not sure i could be that magnanimous. then again, he isn’t your run of the mill purely ego-driven guy. he at least sees her side, and tries to protect her from him … while he’s still texting her for an ego boost…
i guess that’s the point: quality. we have to choose quality. we must not compromise on that point. that’s the only way we can keep ourselves from clutching our heads over some jerk who doesn’t fit with us or treat us right.
@Mymble Exactly! AC hall of fame and Olympic delayed puberty… He won that one.
Natalie,
” it’s not that they don’t care or love you but their commitment issues and differing values mean that they hold onto you because they’re afraid of losing you and so do their best to stall you until you run out of patience and chances.”
The ex cheating cheater kept me hanging on, one year at a time, by giving me these talks about how he needed to take baby steps before finally making the decision to leave his wife. Year one went by, then year 2. Then he didn’t want to disappoint his dad by getting a divorce – it would be too stressful for his dad, apparently. Then his dad died and he gave me hope we could be together. And all this time, he was just THERE, and he seemed to be getting better and better at communicating and expressing his feelings. Little did I know until the end of year 3,that he had the setup of a longterm OW, plus me. Were my needs being met? NO. Were his wife or OOW’s needs being met? Probably not. Were HIS needs being met? It kinda looks like they are, and it doesn’t seem fair. Can he possibly be happy living like this? Would he not feel guilty as hell using all these women – leading them all on while having everything on HIS terms? He seems to be grooming another OOW based on his praise of a female colleague’s work in his emails to our work group, and her praising him in return. It’s sickening!
At the 3 month NC point, I feel better in some ways but these questions and concerns still come up. I can NOT seem to get over how disrespectful and selfish he is, and what a big liar he is. I usually have positive regard for people, no matter how much they screw up, but I really think I may hate this guy. Is that normal at month 3? It helps to read BR, but sometimes it just makes me angrier that I see there are so many jerks out there, and angry that the exMM didn’t just leave the “relationship” when he knew we wanted different things and had no intention of giving me what I wanted.
OK, I am done ranting now. I know I must focus on me, and continue to heal and improve my self-esteem. I just need to get this new, unfamiliar feeling of hatred out of my system so that I can get on with feeling love for myself. I need to stop thinking about HIM! Thanks for this post – it contains great wisdom!
Learner
he’s just a user. We can blame and be angry with the user all we want (I’ve done that bit) but ultimately we knew they were not giving us the relationship we wanted or deserved; it was up to us to walk away. Your MM (and my EUM) did know they couldn’t give and weren’t giving us what we (thought?) we wanted but, really, we knew this as well (we simply did the same as him – we chose to ignore it. There’s nothing more unavailable than a married man (‘cept my EUM!) and we still hung around. Just be glad you’re not the next OW (or OOW!) and that you have stepped into reality. don’t give him the time of day. He’s a sham and chancer.
Hi Learner,
I think Natalie’s topic sentence and first paragraph sums up what I felt. It was difficult to wrap my head around the fact that what I thought I wanted and what he said and did didn’t match. It was even more difficult to wrap my head around the fact I was a mistress. Then, I had to wrap my head around the fact that when he kept boomeranging in and out of my life hanging around like a “blue arsed fly” (cos I let him), it was because he was only thinking about HIMSELF, even though each time I got my hopes up. Then, I had to wrap my head around the issue of fairness. At first, I was focused on how unfair it was to me. Then, I had to wrap my head around how unfair it was to his WIFE and kids. I’m not sure precisely what fairness is but I know his wife and kids were treated hugely unfairly and I was complicit. That ends my rant because wrapping my head around all this makes my head hurt! Hang tight Learner. You are doing great. Be grateful he has left the building and so have you!
Natalie’s writing is so wonderful and every sentence is chock full of meaning. Natalie states: “…they are really only thinking about things from their perspective and what makes them comfortable without really giving a great deal of thought to your comfort levels. In fact they may have an “I’m comfortable so they must be comfortable” attitude”. If you flip that statement, it becomes I’m uncomfortable being an option/doormat/FBG so he must realize I’m uncomfortable, particularly since I told him repeatedly. I’m totally seeing how important it is to recognize that people think very differently. There is no doubt, he was thinking she’s signed on to my terms and conditions, hell she’s cooking a great dinner which will be waiting when I walk through the door and we’ll have great sex. While I was thinking I was showing my love and commitment. For me, a former word, thinking person, I am now focused on actions. Of course, certain words like “I’m married” or “I’m not ready for a relationship” portend actions. But it is actions that is a dead give away. Thanks Natalie. By the same token, my words have to match my actions!
Runner,
Yes, so much to wrap our aching heads around! We can’t imagine disregarding another person’s perspective because we wouldn’t be that dismissive of another person ourselves (especially when they revealed their resultant pain to us). Thanks for reassuring me that i am doing great – sometimes I fear people must be sick of hearing about the excheating cheater MM, but it does so help to “get it all out” and hear the opinions of others. Yes, here’s to having our OWN actions match our words 🙂 xo
Fearless,
Yes, you are right as usual! They are EU, and we are evolving to become EA. I really *am* glad not to be his OW or OOW. I don’t give him the time of day directly any more (through contact), and must extend that to not giving him the time of brainpower! Thanks for replying as I struggle to get to the point of indifference with this chancer.
After getting home from a long day of work, I found myself pondering on why meeting and getting to know someone is so hard these days.
We get so caught up on looks, status, etc, that we forget that WE all want the same things…love. shelter. acceptance. employment. food. connection with others…
Yes, we have our preferences on what we want and don’t want, but I find that we are “too good” to give someone a chance or we are afraid to risk and
step away from these social standards and fantasies of what real women and real men should look like, be like, sound like, etc. So much pressure!
I am as imperfect as they come. I am thicker and no I have a body that resembles Kim Khardasian, but I do have a mind that works, which is my best asset.
To be honest, I’m tired of the silly games, shenanigans, and bullshit spoon fed to me by men and being around mean men who feel they are so entitled to act like an ass, because they
have money, status, or looks that society deems as “hot” or “good looking.” I could care less about those things when the person is a straight dick wad. And to those men
who love the game of mind fuckery, where I find myself putting out so much effort to read between the lines or jump through hoops for a man that doesn’t care to call but rather text and have
a barely there relationship, but who trickles out just enough effort to drive a woman mad, because it isn’t enough for her heart that requires more, I say, fuck you and your Mom for doing a horrible job of showing you how to treat women.
I am sure, after reading this, you’re thinking, “damn, this woman is bitter,” when in fact I might be…add to that, jaded, numb, and frustrated.
How beautiful would it be for two people to meet up, they smile, maybe realize that the person might not be their “ideal” person, but they hang out, vibes happen, the conversation is wild and intense, stimulating, and all of a sudden the two people get comfy and realize that the other person they are connecting with is just what they were looking for…
@Starr
Amen!
Starr, Your are in my head girl! I often ponder the same thing! When I was in my 20s, I think that it was a lot easier than it is now that I am 50. So many people have been hurt, abused, and mistreated that they bring there dysfunctional issues to each new relationship that they enter. Those of us who have/are doing the work to make ourselves better human beings get sick and tired of dealing with people who have not, or will not do the work to make themselves better. My mom used to say that there was somebody for everybody. I believe that wholeheartedly, but the question I have is: “Will I ever find that person?”
Mari. I agree the EUM/AC/MM’s contribute to our low self-esteem, leaving us worse off than we were before meeting them. But, it is already there in us to a greater or lesser degree or we wouldn’t be involved in the first place. They are only magnifying our propensity for masochism (speaking only for myself). I came to the conclusion tonight that my relationshit with the MM was severely damaging for me. I went from a situation that was the best, my marriage, to a situation that was the worst possible thing I could do to myself.He was the first man to come after me since my husband had passed. Even though I was strong enough to get out after only 6 months, go NC and stick to it without falling off the horse at all, I still carry the wounds and have never been the same, and it’s been over for more than a year.
I have successfully discontinued online and my profile is deleted. This means I have no access to the site (Hooray!!!) I also gently told the latest guy who has been married three times, that until such time that we meet, if ever, we can keep the lines of communication open but that is all for now. I am so deeply hurt from the past and so afraid of experiencing more pain. I just can’t take any chances. Crying now as I type this. Fortunately, he has accepted my decision and will not force the situation. I’m not ready and really don’t think I ever will be again. I feel permanently eff’d up, and this is why I have tears more than the fact that I’m pulling away from him.
@MariMari: you’re missing the point. These men don’t ‘turn us’ nice girls into anything. Don’t play the victim. If you do that you are just abdicating your personal responsibility in these situations.
No doubt some of these men are not very nice at all and probably a larger number of them are completely lacking in self awareness. But recognizing this (and working out which category your ex falls into) doesn’t explain why YOU let yourself participate in the relationship. In addition it kind of disempowers you: will you just sit back and wait for the nice, emotionally available man to pick you and make it all better? The nice emotionally available men don’t want that responsibility!
Come on, girl! You can do better for yourself. In fact, you kinda have to.
Well how I see my situation.. He come after me like a prince on a white horse lol with a big cake! he let me look and admire and belive the cake was the best cake ever! I felt like a princess from the first minute..Then suddenly he started to take pieces away from that cake..I did wonder why but bc he was a MM I found him excuses, obviously. Over the time of 1,5 years he has taken the whole cake back, bit by bit..leaving me desperately holding on to, needing, wanting whatever I have left, now and then throwing few crumbs I gobble up lol. I have turned from a Princess to Cinderella!!! And him from The Prince to a Frog.. He played this game masterfully, managing my expectations slowly down to nothing and now I do feel I do not expect anything from him which is exactly what he wants..
Marimari i have often though and have said to mm in my mate status eith him told him what i thought , it changes nothing they dont care, i believe because they have no consciousness , they thus believe they doing no wrong,. My mm on his second go at me when ot came to end said i told you id hurt you again. , thus exscussing all his shady behaviour coz he told he would . In my low esteem since finding owt there is ow as well ive tried to come across adult ( lol) and i removed myself and said we will be friends only , hes not bothered as has ow to strokr hid ego so im just making it ten times worsr for my self , yday i broke nc and got ignored and fobbed of when i told him his behaviout was shitty i got a fb mess saying not sorry well one thrown in but a wor is me im having a shit timr , life work and at home. This is to elicit sympathy its all bout him and thats how they get away with treating hirls out there badly extremely selfish and its alll anout them all the time they dont considered anyones feelings , he doesnt vare for his wifes he would nt have seen me or now this ow , weak no will power so why woould he give a flying fuck bout me , the ow , his mates ( seen him do it to bloke mates ) or future ow .the only reason i started to fight back is this site made me see the truth not the fantasy in my head x
Tired, they get away with it because we let them. You don’t need to tell him his behaviour is shitty – he already knows, but more to the point, you already know. He’s married already. He’s not looking for a wife/a committed relationship. He has one of those. You know this too. He’s a married man with shitty behaviour. You have all the facts you need; it’s up to you to act accordingly. He can’t be blamed for your behaviour, and it’s your behaviour that needs to change in order for you to be available for something better than married man with shitty behaviour.
MariMari
One of the most effective ways to hide (even from oursevles) our own fear of commitment, our own doubt about relationships, our own low self-esteem, our own lack of direction is to get involved with people who cannot give commitment. Sometimes it’s obvious (he’s married) or not so obvious (single, monogamous, but blows hot and cold/disappears and reappears). That way you can tell yourself it’s all his fault. You’re trying so hard, you’re still there, you’re patient, you’re doing all the loving. You’re suffering so much. It’s him! Him! It’s him who presses the reset button, it’s him who is future faking, it’s him who cheats.
I first came across the idea on BR that it might be me. It went over my head, then I took it on board. It was consolidated when I read Mr U and the FBG. These unavailable men cannot do what they are doing without a willing partner (us). That’s not to say you deserve it, it’s not to say you are “wrong”, it’s not to say you don’t love him (though I think we don’t love him quite as much as we think we do). It’s not to excuse his behaviour. But … if it keeps happening to you, look at the common denominator. It might be you.
“we should tell them right to their faces what we think of them!” Well, a man who booty calls you, who doesn’t show up when he says he will, who ignores you, who makes you feel like an inconvience, who has sex with other women, who breezes into your life on a whim is telling you what he thinks of you (that you have no limits and he can do as he likes). Trouble is, we don’t listen to him so why would he listen to us? If you’re still there you’re telling him “I’m okay with this”. He gets the message when you’re gone.
Sure, he may like you, enjoy your company, like sex with you, flirt with you, talk with you. All those things are fun. Relationships aren’t just about fun. You’re not a fairground ride.
Excellent post, Mari! You described my ex EUM – and me – to a T.
Regarding, NC, a reader said something like “Your silence is shouting!”, which made me feel great!(Hear that phone NOT ringing? It’s ME!)After all these years, I don’t need to go through a list of his bad deeds with him. He knows what he did. If he has an ounce of decency, he does. If he doesn’t, then my telling him is not going to make a difference.
I used to always wonder, is he thinking of me? WHAT is he thinking? With sudden NC, I hope he’s thinking I’ve finally seen the light, know what he’s up to, and I’m not willing to play anymore. Or he’s just confused – which doesn’t begin to make up for the times he left me wondering WTH just happened here? Either way, he’s FLUSHED and I’m outta here.
This forum is a Godsend. Any of you women who have not also read Natalie’s books should start with Mr. Unavailable and the FBG. That book puts it all into perspective so you know who you’re dealing with, repeats things so they sink in, and supports you through all this. Again, I am so thankful I found Nat and you women. Thanks for all your help!
He is my first EU MM..I have no previous experience with men behaving so bad. He is the first I have let get this far. Before I have left a man who has not given me what I hoped or wanted but bc he is a MM I gave him excuses..wife, children, commitments… Maybe I just felt good I thought someone loved me, but don’t we all? Since our relationship has deteriorated a lot over the last 6 mnths I started to google reasons for why.. and come across BR. This site opened my eyes to him.. But now I am in quite deep so it is hard to let go in a day..
Question:
My ex and I have been broken up for 3 months.I cut contact for one month, but like a dummy opened the door for friendship again.
The friendship was extremely platonic with him not trying to sweet talk me or anything, but we both knew there were feelings there.
He took me out, but then didn’t contact me for 2 weeks. Then contacted me a lot one week and the next two weeks only once a week. Oh and his contact was a mixture of calls and IM’s, mainly IM’s. I would never contact him. He always initiated and I would accept.
I thought maybe this was his way of slowly coming around, but I started to think that if he really truly wanted me back, he would not go a month without seeing me and would contact me more at least oh and of course communicate his feelings.
Because of this ambiguity, without any explanation from me, I began to ignore him and he all of a sudden called like crazy which I ignored them all. He contacted me more within a few days than he had since he broke up with me.
My question is: Did I overreact since his behavior was actually exhibiting friendship (platonic) or was I right in getting rid of him for not expressing his intentions?
I did what I did because it felt like he was playing games with me under the guise of “friends” and I didn’t want to hang around to be treated like an option.
Appreciate the comments.
Oh and background: He wanted to marry me, then broke up with me saying he was not ready to be in a relationship.
god, mya-
you’ve been through a lot.
um… ok. to answer your question, i think whatever you did was fine. because i actually think it doesn’t matter what his intentions are now, he’s already said what his intentions aren’t, and you needed to go NC anyway.
something is up with this guy that made him really let you down because he couldn’t hack a relationship after talking marriage. at least he came clean about that. still. wuss.
but now, even if he were exhibiting purely platonic behavior, you can’t really be platonic friends with him just as you would with another platonic friend for whom you never had more serious feelings. you wouldn’t be tracking his contact if you could. you wouldn’t care so much what he did or didn’t do.
if you can’t be honestly blasé and relaxed with him, then its not a good idea to be in contact with him. any attention he gives you now, and probably for a long time to come, is going to mean more to you than he can live up to. you shouldn’t subject yourself to that, its not fair to YOU.
please be careful now. i think its good you cut him off, but you were perhaps really close to messing with your own head in trying to be friends at all. its too much, and you need to heal. he had his chance. he fucked it up. i know it hurts, and i don’t mean this callously, but go heal and next!
Girls,
Having a crap morning. A mixture of feeling like the bad guys (ego-boosted narcissists) are winning and moving on to oceans of willing females, while we good women (a sweeping generalization, I know) end up the walking wounded. Also wondering if there are, indeed, any really good guys out there. Not just wolves in sheep’s clothing.
Selkie, your comments made me cry. I understand the “scarlet letter” feeling. Even though I didn’t sleep with my ex-EU, I still feel cheapened by my (probably obvious) wide-eyed infatuation of him. Makes me sick. I just want to curl up in bed today and cry. I haven’t done anything to deserve this treatment. I have never cheated on or betrayed any friends or boyfriends. I’m just sad today and finding it hard to feel like I deserve a good guy, if he even exists. I’m probably PMSing, lol.
I really did think the ex-EU cared about me. Now he’s with another woman and, though he’s made some half-hearted attempts to remain friends with me, I’m sure it’s “out of sight, out of mind” for him. And I’m left feeling like a fool. Do these men have hearts? Do they ever get their “just desserts”? I do believe in “you reap what you sow,” but sometimes it’s a long time coming, and their paunch seems to get fatter and fatter with women, while I suffer from malnutrition. Ugh. I’m not in a happy place today. Don’t worry–not gonna break NC (not even tempted to, it would just embarrass me more than I’ve already embarrassed myself). Just feeling kinda weepy today.
To clarify some things in my last comment: I don’t think that ANYONE deserves this type of treatment, no matter what they’ve done.
Also, I know I’m probably buying into the “victim thinking.” I take responsibility for my part in this little AC drama. It just hurts today, that’s all.
revolution honey bunny-
yes, there are good guys out there. and yes, there are bad women out there. and, yes, there are bad women who cotton on to bad guys. and, yes, men shut their hearts off, compartmentalize and move on to the next, whereas we are essentially incapable of doing that.
so, don’t think about it all right now. you’re not going to figure it out or see a bright side at the moment. you’re just going to make yourself more upset, applying what feels like “logic” but really isn’t.
just feel it and don’t analyze it. don’t try to look at the “big picture”. you’re hurting and you’re grieving – just hurt and grieve. turn your brain off. its not helping you right now.
eat every three hours. take some ibuprofen if you’re not allergic to it or tylenol if you are. drink a lot of water. and put your fuzzies on, pull up a blanket, and pout. just pout. no thinking, just pouting. pout hard and pout well.
if i were there, i’d take you out for french fries and ice cream.
and you’ll feel better, and things will seem lighter, when you get your period.
and it will all pass. and you will be ok.
(((Hugs))) cc!! Honey, thanks a million. I could just *feel* the warmth and comfort coming off of your comment.
*Sigh* You’re right. About everything. I’m gonna have a freakin’ POUTFEST ’cause I deserve it, dammit! I guess I just feel off my rocker for going through this at the 5-month mark of NC. I guess we all get there in time, though, don’t we?
You’re right about the logical brain not working, lol. Gotta shut that puppy down and just FEEL. These feelings pass quicker without us making mini-Lifetime movies about them, don’t they? Lol.
I’m gonna go eat my fries and ice cream and think of you, fondly, cc. 🙂
Then I might watch an old Lifetime movie (preferably starring Meridith Baxter-Burney) where the woman kicks the crap out of some a**hole. Ah, then my PMS-interlude will have reached completion.;)
You’re a star, cc. Honestly.
thanks, revs, ya sweetie.
Revolution
It is probably PMS and one should never think profound thoughts questioning realities that one cannot see, while PMSING.
Have a little wine, cheese and chocolate. Perferably in Tweetie Bird slippers and flannel pajamas.Put on some lovely smelling hand lotion and nap a bit.
You are not playing the victim you are just hormonal and feeling a bit thin-skinned right now:) hugs!
Ha! SO RIGHT, Dancingqueen! Thank you so much!*averting thoughts that question realities* It’s the same PMS insanity that makes us go, “I have 5lbs. of excess water weight….how ’bout I go shopping!” and then we find ourselves crying in fitting rooms…..wait…..or is that just me? 🙂
How nice Dancingqueen, since I’m menopausing kinda, although I am also PMSING (caught in the middle at flipping 53), I’ll take your advice to Revolution and not think profound thoughts. I think your suggestions work either way: Wine, cheese, and chocolate in Tweetie Bird slippers and flannel PJ’s, lovely smelling hand lotion and to bed for me. Thank you. Sweet dreams.
Revolution, I have your thoughts exactly. I remember my ex AC, who I met before current AC. He used to contact me a lot, but since May 2012 and he never made any attempt to get back to me. I am sitting and wondering from time to time, he probably met his Right woman, to whom he wants to be committed, to whom he wants to invest his time etc. and not me ( his booty call girl)…I agree with you Revolution that sometimes I think no good man left for me, but yet again when I read Grace’s story, I feel that it is possible, but we need to be physically and mentally ready…I need a break from men for at least 6 months or a year!
Revolution,
Sweetie, I’m sorry I made you cry. I know how you feel right now though, I’m going through a bit of a yucky phase too. Three days ago I was feeling great. ( almost 8 months out of being dumped by an EUM) This happens though, and I think it’s normal. Each time I start to feel blue again, it’s shorter and less draining with time and the good moods, well, they get a bit longer. I believe this is a sign of healing. I’m setting up my nest tonight of pajamas, hot tea, fuzzy blanket and snacks with a movie at home. I have a lot to be thankful for really. I did a writing exercise listing 50 things that made me happy. Any things, like flowers, ice cream, the smell of new rain, etc. It helped just writing it out, to remind me there is so much more out there than this temporary pain I feel. Give it a try. Don’t give it (the blues) permission to linger once you’ve taken a moment to acknowledged it, cry it out if you need to. For me this means distractions like a Disney movie or something very benign….no romances ( except the ones with Meredith Baxter Birney is kicking ass, of course.) Hugs to you.
Okay, still not sure how exactly to reply correctly to multiple people, so please bear with me, girls. (By the way, Natalie: what a stellar group of women you have here! Including yourself!)
Little Star, let’s start with you, darling. I’m sorry you had to go through this horrible experience with your ex-AC. I do agree with you that Grace’s new beau gives us all hope. (No pressure, Grace. :)) Thank you for sending some care my way. That alone shows you have kindness in your heart, and your AC sounded like he couldn’t take a lick off your boots.
Selkie, honey. When I read your comment to me, I said out loud, “Nooooo….” in a soft voice. As in, you didn’t make me cry in a bad way. I guess it was just that fellow feeling that gets all jumbled up, where you feel for someone else especially when you know where that person is coming from. That’s what made me cry, which wasn’t a bad thing. And I, too, just had a male friend, who is a GOOD GUY, get married. I am SO happy for him and his wife. It gives me hope. But I felt the same way you did about the scarlet letter feeling that no good guy would ever want me. What utter baloney for the both of us, though. I think of how, if my best friend were to express these sentiments to me, I would be broken-hearted at the sheer INACCURACY of her assessment of herself, do you know what I mean? And that would make me talk to her ’til I was BLUE in the face to have her understand that she is not only WORTHY of a good guy, but that she is kind and good and strong. We need to have that same discussion with ourselves, I think.
I LOVE your plan for tonight. I think you’ve got a good, positive head on your shoulders. I like the list idea. I’m already holding my head in shame as I am SO blessed in SO MANY WAYS in my life, so many ways that more than make up for this bad relationship. Thanks for the reminder. And I was kidding about those Lifetime movies, hee hee. They kinda heebie-jeeb me out, actually. I like to focus on the good and not the bad. Even if I get a little feisty in the process. 🙂
You girls make me tear up with all your care. Thanks for the hearty words of encouragement. It brought me such a lift today. Wishing you all peace.
rEVOLuniton, Love is in the middle of your name, just spelled backwards, coming back towards you.
omg Selkie I made a list like that years ago, whilst drinking brokenheartedly; do you know, several years later, I had found it and accidently done many goals on my list? Ex; bought house in New Orleans, rode camel, worked abroad. Lists like those are brill, they really help open up your dream-tap; keep writing them:)
“I found it”
YAY! serendipity.
Grace spot on my mm enjoyed my company i thought wow wee , i bet he enjoys the company of anyone he likes to act single the adoration of peeps blowing smoke up his bum and one day that sad fat bald man wont be in a band and will be a normal joe bloggs and me ill had move on and be awesome .
I am someone who likes a return on their investment.
I look back now and think how miserable I would have been if I had married the AC and I probably would have stayed married still hoping for a good return.
I hung on far too long with the ex eum thinking of all I had done and given and where is my return?
Recently I was told that I have been cheated on but it is me he wants I’m not flattered nor I am thinking cool now I will finally get a good return for my investment. This site has taught me I won’t I will get more of the same.
As Grace says above he is showing me what he thinks of me via his behaviour though his words are saying otherwise that he thinks very highly of me etc.
If I stay it shows a tolerance for this behaviour even though I don’t deserve it.
Yes I ignored red flags in the beginning but this is the first time I know I don’t have to hang on in there looking for a good return because I know there isn’t one coming my way. Slow progress but progress is progress.
I absolutely agree. I also ignored the red flags, and I keep asking myself “what do I hope to win?” Some lying, cheating AC who will never give me what I want? I’m realizing it’s silly to keep investing in a bad investment and I don’t understand why it’s been so hard to let it go, and why I even want to hear the bs he tells me when I know it’s bs.
Ps i know I will get more of the same because he wants to remain friends with the woman he just won’t have sex with her anymore.
Yeah, they all say that! It is amazing how far these guys can take us down the road of total self-abuse and disrespect when they have us wound around their fingers. The only way is to stand and stay strong and reject them from our lives – END OF STORY!
Mya. What is the status of the relationship now? He broke up with you, so why is he sniffing around and why are you letting him? He’s blowing hot and cold, and you’re playing “option” whether you are intending to or not. Flush him and go NC. And stick to it. Forget the “friends” BS. You’re just giving yourself unnecessary headache. He’s not that special.
Yep! The ONLY way to get past these types of relationship is to fully and totally just CUT THE NERVE. It’s amazing how great life can be without them.
Tired. Please use the term ” the ex-mm” not “my mm”. He was never yours.
As usual awesome post and so many great comments from the community here! I learn so much from all of you. I have to say that the last 2 days have been better than I could have expected. AC is not taking up real estate in my brain. In fact, I think the stupid crush for this cockroach has finally run its course. He showed his true colors yet again with a very arrogant and derogatory text (which I did not nor will not respond to) only this time I didn’t take it as flattery that he was actually taking time out to send me a message like I have in the past. No. I’m getting a sick feeling about him entirely. I very much doubt I will look at him in any positive light again. This is it, I’m finally on the road to recovery and freedom.
These posts have been a Godsend for me. My long-distance boyfriend has lied, cheated, manipulated me and did everything else that has pretty much destroyed my self esteem, and yet I still cling to the hope that he can be the person I fell for(before he had a baby with his stepson’s baby’s mother, then lied about it consistently). I want to believe his words, that he’s sorry and he loves me and doesn’t want to lose me, but his actions have NEVER backed up his words. He makes no other effort besides offering empty promises, and then gets annoyed when I ask too many questions or don’t believe his answers. I feel ashamed at what I’ve been willing to accept. I don’t know why I want to believe him so bad or why I continue to engage in this charade of a relationship. Those are the answers I seek, and it probably has more to do with me than him, but this site has been immensely helpful in seeing things for what they are rather than what I want them to be, and atleast I know I’m not alone in falling for the manipulations of an assclown. Thanks, Natalie.
The reason we make such fools of ourselves for men is because we (naturally) need love from them. Trouble is, there are many who hook in to taking advantage of this very willingly, and the fact is, they certainly do not deserve the love we give them. It just comes down to doing what is healthy and right for yourself. The alternative is only going to bring more pain and confusion and weakness. All is not lost just because we lose the losers in life!
Oh yeah……I remember this one…. I did this with my ASS-CLOWN for five years.. When I broke off contact (been in NC for 7 years) :-), and with Nat’s sound advice, I realized why he kept coming back… Sex and an ego stroke. No more convoluted delusions, or trying to mind read. Sex, and an ego stroke. After being happily married for over 2.5 years now, I think about how my priorities have changed. I might not have that “instant sizzle” with my husband (sexual chemistry IS NOT love), but I have a best friend, a loving and supportive partner who treats me like a queen (not to mention great sex).
Mazel tov on your wedding Nat!!! You deserve all the happiness in the world 🙂
Big Hug!
Res, just want to thank you for your definite statement “sexual chemistry IS NOT love”!! I think we need to hear this over and over to really let it sink it! Thanks again.
That’s a tough lesson to learn 🙂 But when I finally started thinking with my head (looking at behavior- pushing myself to discover- before investing), rather than other parts of my body- I developed the relationship that I DESERVE. Chemistry is just that…it doesn’t equate to love, and more so, chemistry without a developing bond wears off too, and it did with me and my EUM. Chemistry can be very confusing though, but remember, it’s not love, and it definitely IS NOT enough to make a successful and lasting relationship! BEST!!!
I just want to say that I wish I found your book and blog months or even a few years ago. I FINALLY ended a connection with a man I was with for 2-1/2 yrs. He drove me nuts saying he cared and would step up for a day or two, to only fall back to his old ways saying his life was a mess, he had issues, he wasn’t comfortable in me meeting his family…blah…blah. I have never had anyone play this yo-yo of emotions, and me being 48 and thinking I will never meet anyone again or that it will be years before I meet anyone again, I “SETTLED” for these crumbs of affection and time and it drove me nearly insane. Right now I am dealing with the thoughts of why I think I am less than if I don’t have a man in my life or that I am too damaged for anyone to love me. I guess I still have a long road ahead of me, but I sleep better these days not thinking about the EX.
WOW Stella this really hits home. I have been in a 3 yr relationship with this man that I loved with all my heart and soul,I gave up my house and family time for him and moved in with him because thats what he wanted..About 3 months ago we broke up(which this had happened about 4-5 times throughout our relationship. I got my own place again and he and i ended up together again.He was upset that i wouldnt give my place up and move in with himJust a week ago we had a little disagreement and that nite he went with his 24 yr old son (whom which lives with him now) to the bar and he meet another girl and never even had the guts to tell me. I had to find out through his sister. I still have not talked to him so am dealing with it as best as i can.
Funny that I should read this today. I’ve been trying to untangle myself from just such a connection with a MM. We were sexually involved for a year and a half, until the day that he decided he needed to make amends with his wife. Over the last ten months, we’ve been off-and-on “friends” while he claims to try to repair that relationship, despite there being problems in his marriage. Its easy to see that he has leaned on me to be his ego-stroke. Its never felt great. Over the last month or so, I have really felt tired. Really tired. I see that our internet-friendship (yes, its all over e-mail now. You don’t need to tell me, “fantasy relationship”. I get it) gives me nothing. It only gives me something if I make compromises, or if I hold onto the stupid belief that one day, there will be more.
I think that my patience with scenario#2 is drying up. I am going on my first blind-date tonight since the beginning of the New Year, which was the last time I had courage to consider other possibilities. I know that the man I am seeing tonight will unlikely replace the space that the UAM/MM has taken, but it’s the motion that counts. I am getting back out there.
Oh, and in all of this time, I have had plenty of time to be with myself. I’ve worked hard on myself, on my confidence, and on building up the rest of my life. I don’t need another person to fill the voice… so, by going out on a date, I don’t think that I am just jumping off one horse to get on another. (Just entering the crazy world of dating again… sigh, give me strength!)
Tinkerbell – status with him now is that I went NC on him and it has been a week. As soon as I did this, he blew up my phone for a few days. More than the past three months since we’ve been broken up.
I straight up ignored him and he texted twice wanting to know why I wasn’t talking to him. Called a lot too.
See what confused me is that we were friends since the breakup a few months ago and it was strictly platonic. I still had feelings and I’m sure he did too.
My concern was if he was playing games under the guise of friendship?
Just because he would blow hot and cold with communication with me. Took me to the movies (platonic) but then wouldn’t call me for two weeks huh?.
He knew I had feelings and I think he was taking advantage of that fact.
mya-
please go back to the previous page and read my reply and read tinkerbell’s – hers is better than mine.
to reiterate and extend – particularly from your follow-up reply it is clear that your head is jumbled over him. maybe he is capable of a purely platonic relationship, but YOU’RE NOT. if you were, you wouldn’t wonder if he was taking advantage of you, you wouldn’t care! and his past and present hot/cold behavior probably does mean that YES he’s still crumb-ing you. and really, how much of an insult is it that he could so easily go from wanting to marry you to being capable of being platonic – EJECT! his loss!
so, even if the process of logic that led you to NC was flawed, its still good you went NC.
but now you have to straighten out the logic – whatever feelings you have for him, he is a poor choice for you because he is unsuitable for a relationship, even a platonic one. even though he is capable of being honest about it (and THIS is how my exEUM got me, he was self-aware, so i jumped to the conclusion that he would become EA – WRONG! he was just GREAT at making excuses for himself and really didn’t have any interest in growth if it meant he actually had to change) he’s spectacularly EU and therefore cannot treat you with l/c/t/r. why would you want a boyfriend like that? why would you want a platonic friend like that?
no. you must give to and expect more for yourself. you must treat yourself with l/c/t/r. and that starts with maintaining NC, realizing that it doesn’t matter if he was trying to be “friends”, realizing that you didn’t make some mistake by cutting him off, you didn’t lose an opportunity. what you did was prevent yourself from being a FBG.
now, you stick to your guns.
This is a very painful post for me. Very, very painful. But also, very, very neccessary. And I DID finally stand my ground. You all know what happened next so I wont go over it. Everything seems so FINAL. I wonder if I’d still be standing my ground if he gadn’t died? I like to think so, but maybe it doesn’t matter. I stood it long enough to no longer be an issue. Nothing was left unsaid. He came up in conversation with my psychologist a few days ago. She had met him, & had dinner with us. I asked her, do she think everything he said & promised was all really just BS (because he could never follow through). It was one of the very rare times I ever allow myself to think about him. She didn’t think so. Rather, she thought that he really believed what he was saying & promising at time when he was here with
me but that when he would return interstate his ‘issues’ would take control & all bets were off. I don’t know what I think. As I say, I rarely allow myself to think of him at all. I did break this on/off pattern though (far more off than on). Thank goodness I did because he was destroying me.
I am not surprised to hear story straight from the horses mouth Cc. Not one bit. Sad but true.
I finally feel, that on this one post I have gained my BR diploma & passed at something! Another ex (still very much alive), contacted me by text a few weeks ago.
We broke up a few years back, and after 12-18 mths of NC attempted platonic friendship which didn’t go so well, after he made an appaling unwarrented comment, & treated me unkindly & disespectfully. At the time, I pointed this out in.no uncertain terms, called him a choice expletetive befitting his BS & promptly sent him packing. He made no attempt whatsever to atone for his wrongdoing (which spoke volumes, lol) & that was that.
Recently, he texts an apology, claimimg to want to be my friend & to be willing to do ‘whatever it takes to make it up to me’. Having had more than enough of this jerk by now, & noting this lame ass TEXT of an apology is A YEAR TOO LATE, I text back, & remind him of EXACTLY what he did & said which caused me to delete him from my life. He offers another LAME apology & now CRAPS on about how he ‘can’t forget how great I looked in my high heels & skirt that time he took me out to movies’ (we went dutch btw, oh I forgot to mention, he’s a terrible TIGHTARSE, with $, including on dates!) & now proceeds to suggest we go out for dinner sometime!
You all can just IMAGINE what I am thinking by this stage! Yep. 1. Who’s paying? & 2. not if you were the last guy standing buddy boy?! LMAO. Still, I reply, if you are reply, if you are GENUINELY sorry, instead of inviting me out for dinner why don’t you offer to do something to help me out to actually PROVE it ie he knows I’m ill & trying to maintain my home & car on very little $ & that there would be a mryiad of small tasks around the place I could really use his handyman skills to help with. THIS (funnily enough) gets NO REPLY.
The following morning I text to say don’t worry about it as I have more than enough REAL FRIENDS who WILL HAPPILY help & the that likes of him are frankly neither a friend nor welcome. I further explain that I cannot be ‘friends’ with someone who insults me & then takes a WHOLE YEAR before bothering to apologise. Then, when they DO apologise, it’s not even genuine!
The TRUE COLORS then shone through & I was called a ‘bitch’. I replied that at least I was an independent ‘bitch who owns her own home & not still living with my Mother at 40.yo having.never moved out of home, like himself & that although he thinks such a thing is quite normal he is sadly mistaken!
Now I was told to ‘fuck off’ & a whole other nine yards which I ignored & no longer replied to. Dare say he wont be back! No to-ing & fro-ing with that one! The old flusharoo worked just fine!! Amen to BR!! I got my diploma! Yay!!
You go, girl! This is the strength we women all need to find, no matter how much it hurts at the time. The end results to our own lives can be truly fantastic if we will just give it times. P.S. I’m praying your life situation improves – and do keep those great friends!
@Starr you are far from bitter….like RKelly say. When a woman’s fed UP there ain’t ” Nothing” you can do about it. Sick of the shenanigans and all of the mind fuckery. Stay strong. You are not alone.
Mya, sweetie. If you go NC, it’s supposed to be permanent and FINAL. You don’t continue on a platonic level because it’s not going to be platonic for either one of you once you’ve had an intimate relationship. You can’t have it both ways. NC doesn’t mean a thing if you’re still wanting to give him opportunities to talk to you and twist around your emotions. This is how end up back in bed with the loser. Remember, when you act like you don’t know what you want, and if you go back to him he will treat you progressively worse, because he feels you have no SELF-RESPECT so why should he. Trust me Mya, this is one situation I KNOW very well. It was sheer hell. I wouldn’t wish it on my worse enemy – soul destroying. Please, move on. Don’t give yourself excuses to engage with him. Nada, finito, punto final!!! NO DISCUSSIONS about it.
Excellent comment!
I have to concur. I have been living this nightmare for the past 4 years. Once they think you forget about things they start to come around and text you and be all nice, and then they hook you. It was an addiction for me. I am going through withdrawal now, but this time it is for good. I blocked his cell number so he has no way of contacting me. The unfortunate part of it all is I work with him, but have set up boundaries for him. This time there is NO going back. AMEN.
great articles, I’ve just come across them in my search to figure out this crazy (non)relationship that I’ve found myself clinging to. We’ve been seeing each other on again off again for a bit over 3 years. I adore him and sooo enjoy when we’re together. But then he backs off and I’m left wondering did I say or do something wrong, I “know” I didn’t, but it feels like it, then when he contacts me, I fall again. I’m a wicked lonely person and can’t seem to go NC, because I tell my self just maybe…
Stella. Don’t think you are too old to find anyone. It can happen at any age. One of my dearest friends got remarried at the ripe age of 62, having been divorced for 28 years. I asked her the other day if she had any regrets? No, after 10 years they are still going strong. It happens.
when you go NC it not only rescues you from a terrible situation … it gives you the power in the relationship. for so long, he had the power and when he called, i came. then when i would cut contact, he became unglued losing the control and power over “it” and me.
now that i went NC (well again because the last time he moved in so hard) i retained my self respect because 1) i did the right thing for myself and 2) because now i have the power once again.
i have read lots of horrible stories about what the men were doing, the ones who pulled these disappearing acts and usually it’s other women.
so when you say a big, fat NO to all that … that is EMPOWERMENT. and with empowerment comes higher self-esteem which is really something you can lean on in these described above tough times.
being treated badly means you don’t think enough of yourself to stop it and that’s crippling. but saying enough is enough and doing NC means you are free to be your full self once again and not go around feeling bad all of the time.
It’s not bitterness – it’s having a memory. Well done! I received a text from IT yesterday. He tried and miserably failed to make it look accidental “Hey Jen, have (big list of apparel for sale) let me know bruv”. How many bruvs do you know called Jen? Idiot! My reply “wrong number, please remove me from this mailing list”. There is only one reason for repeatedly pulling the flush handle. Now on to eject, reject and jettison. 🙂
🙂
Newjd,
“But then he backs off and I’m left wondering did I say or do something wrong, I “know” I didn’t, but it feels like it, then when he contacts me, I fall again. I’m a wicked lonely person and can’t seem to go NC, because I tell my self just maybe…”
There is no maybe there will be a happy ending with these guys – they just repeat the same s****y behaviour as long as we allow them to. If you really want confirmation of whether there is a maybe or not then you need to apply boundaries, you can’t just let him keep you hanging on under these circumstances.
I had the same with AC, he thought it was fine to play Houdini too until I finally realised it was all excuses and applied boundaries – then funnily enough I was accused of having issues! There was my answer = assclown.
A thought, maybe you are lonely because he is keeping you that way? In behaving as he is, he is not allowing you to move on and damaging your self esteem to boot. You know you’ve doing nothing wrong when he disappears, HE is the wicked one for treating you like that.
I won’t lie it hurts to let go, but not as much as it will hurts again and again if we allow them to keep coming back (and therefore leave). The only real maybe concerns what you might find if you free yourself from this cycle and meet someone who IS worthy of you because you know you are worthy of being treated decently! Stay strong 🙂 x
I am really glad I found this site because I am in a world of hurt this morning. I have only been seeing him for 5 months but I fell hard and fast. I wish I had never gotten to know him. Now he says he is going back to his wife and then she calls me. I wanted to die. I wanted to tell her your husband seeked me out ran me down and did not give up until I went I with him and that she needs to talk to him instead I just hung up the phone. It is going to be soo hard for me to get over this. ps he works where I live and his wife lives in another state.
Star, I feel I have to be completely honest here – the only time I have ever had another woman contact me regarding a man is when I have been involved with an AC! He fed me the sob story and fed the next (ex on off) girl the same – she called me. Red flag – it’s not a normal thing to do her calling, if she felt secure with him she wouldn’t have called you. He’s going back yet she does not feel secure, why not? You’ve known him 5 months, she has known him a lot longer and has evidently normalised his behaviour. Would you want to be her taking him back? Forgive yourself and flush – she’s been taken in again (her decision), you have had a lucky escape and it will get easier and better x
Star, please hold tight. Read Natalie’s myriad articles on Being the Other Woman, EU men, Breakups, No Contact, and so on — they’re a big help. Read them and re-read them until you start to understand your situation.
From reading lots of people’s comments, I think five to seven weeks No Contact is usually the start of damaged girls feeling so much more stable (maybe even happyish?!), so much more in control and so much better equipped to deal with whatever happens next.
It’s not easy. It hurts. And when you’re hurting, you’d do anything for it to stop. We all understand this here, so please keep coming back and talking with us.
Tink & CC – thanks so much gals!!
I seriously printed out your comments lol to remind me if why I’m doing what I’m doing.
You guys are so right!
Been a week NC so far and I think I’m more addicted to the power I have back now than needing him in my life. I dare won’t break it because this is the most I’ve ignored him and I don’t want to create this cycle in his head where he feels this is normal.
He broke up with me in May and have only been off and on in regards to being friends. He hasn’t tried to actually get back with me at all. Well, HELL, I guess he didn’t have to cuz I was around.
I guess even though it was platonic, he was getting an ego stroke just in the fact that I would talk to his ass huh after finding me worthy to marry then umm not?
Uughh…thx gals. He doesn’t deserve the time of day. Oh just to prepare me, since I’m new to this. What if he comes stronger and wants to talk or shows up at my house or something?
I guess it comes down to motive.
Afraid of losing me or power?
Forget him and push yourself to move on with your own life. You’re ruining your chances of finding someone truly worthwhile if you don’t. One woman here spent 20 years coping with this confusion and hurt – just SO NOT worth it!
i found this online … women who dated men with addictions. your men are probably not addicts but they may share the same meanness inside.
below is an insight into some of the thinking of men the women they are using. if we women REALLY knew how these men thought, we might go NC or dump them a lot faster. if i may:
==================================================
“traveller u forgot to mention another contradiction in the OPs thread: she says she loves him and that he’s the ONE, but then she says he gets nasty to her just because she doesnt hook him up with more ‘spice’.
i dont know about u, but if i ever were to get nasty to my GF just because she doesn’t give me (spice), i don’t love her. i’ll pretend to love her since she’s in love with me (my, what a girl will do for me if she’s in love with me! a real gold mine right there! plus, i get easy vagina whenever i want it, and always get what i want.
when the hotty comes along and the true love of my life, i’m dumping my GF like a sack of bricks………….’
==================================================
end of nasty story. the idea being that this lowlife and other men may have the same viewpoint of women that they don’t love. and if we heard more of this honesty, we might not walk around with such rose colored glasses. just an idea.
Lynne,
It’s very vulgar, but yes you are right, for many men this may be the reality of their thought process, and if we actually properly understood this for the slap in the face it is we would have much less difficulty in letting go emotionally.
many men want to have a clear conscience so when you read them the riot act or dump them, they feel guilty which they hate. so they string you along to avoid feeling bad. they always want to consider themselves : good guys:
Insightful and true comment! Men seem to get it all, don’t they?
I have to throw my two cents in, I had someone in my life for well over 20 years and thank God that relationship is over; but basically, he kept the door open by eluding that he never loved anyone like me and couldn’t validate the relationship because he was in the military- Away- and the promise was also when I get out… never mind that he kept re-enlisting and when he did have time – he didn’t spend it with me nor was he interested in my life or assisting me in anyway – it was always about him and his needs….my last relationship-we will call him a future faker- I must admit it was mostly sexual and I wanted more…and his thing was…just wait until I retire and then I will have more time for a relationship (he was working a job and had his own business) so that we could spend more time together and date …well, it didn’t seem like such a horrible thing at the time his retirement was in a year…so we dated and I allowed him the time that he could scrounge for me – usually late at night (he did security at night) slept in the day and did his personal business during day hours…his off days he spent with his Mother (Sundays) and free time in the day with his son…because the excuse was – I worked in the day. Well, when I got tired of the booty calls and his retirement date finally arrived – He didn’t retire – extended it and said – IF I retire I will get another job, etc… so we broke up…He is still calling but he is saying that I will change – we will go out – I will take off work, etc. but ALL conversations elude to “can I just come over tonight” or “Can you come over to my house” Always with the “Booty call” attached. Thank God it didn’t take me 20 years like before-
Ok, well, I have had a wonderful couple days of enlightenment where the light bulb goes off.
Anyway, As I’ve been processing my own feelings about the relationship, I’ve concluded the following:
The truth is why do I want a man in my life in any capacity, who treated me like his #1, but then easily can treat me like an option overnight? Oh and doesn’t even value me enough to see that maybe this shitty behavior deserves an apology of some sorts?
This is the big picture!
So everything else in the middle – that being friends bit I was so hung up on – doesn’t even matter because I was honest that I only went the friends route due to being hurt and emotional over the breakup and rejection rather than immediately recognize his crappy behavior and making the best decision for myself.
So when I “woke up” is when I left the situation swiftly with no announcement from me = me ignoring him then continuing to ignore him when he got frantic because I was gone.
So being friends doesn’t really matter in light of the big picture.
There you have it – my moment of breakthrough!
Today is 12 days of NC for me!!! 🙂
Hi all!!! Just wanted to say my MM tex me this morning early saying really nothing why he has been silent for about 12 days. I did delay my reply almost 10h since I have not asked for NC. Few hours later, i tex again to ask my key back since i see n no point him having it and i feel like the U2 song One…I have not heard from him for 4h..just wondering what is going on in his head and that any decent person would say atleast ok!
in his head,since the key was symbolc
Who cares what he is thinking?
You need to be clear in yourself that you aren’t asking for your key back as a way to bait him into engaging further with you.
Hell – I’d just change my locks and be done with it.
Yes, it sure took a long time to see through the clouds! But when you really love someone and have that powerful connection with them, you unfortunately, unless you have superhuman strength, can let it become your guide! And that connection can happen so quickly! It is sad and unfortunate that it can waste a person’s life almost totally, as it almost did to you. I’ve just had to let go of such a connection, fortunately at a far earlier stage, but at least I have control over my own life again – but there’s still that awful fear that he may come knocking again!
I came across this blog by accident and OMG it’s amazing! I feel like I’m reading all about me and my ‘relationship’. The weird thing is I have just made the commitment to myself to get out of it, and this blog has just confirmed I’m doing the right thing. Thank you soooo much xxx
Mya. You may not see this because a few post have come out since. But you asked wjat do you do if he comes to your door? Do you really think he would do that? If he would and did I would say in a very controlled firm manner, “You are trespassing. Shall I call the cops to have you removed?” I doubt you;d get any argument. You don’t need to have had a restraining order. That’s stalking!
Hey Tink.
No, I see your comment. Nope, I don’t think he would…honestly. Especially now that it is going on 2 weeks of NC. Sure in the beginning once I initially ignored him, he called/texted/IM’d like crazy, but has not since put forth concerted effort.
So, my analysis was right in that he was not afraid of losing me, but rather control and that was what he was trying to regain – control…not me.
Hi all. I have been with an MM/EUM for the past 4 years. In the 4 years we had broken off from time-to-time, but always seemed to get back together. The rose colored glasses are off now, and I am moving on with my life. He never treated me the way I should have been treated, but ladies I put up with it. Just one example, but a big eye opener was for my Birthday this past August. My Birthday came and all he did was send me a text saying “Happy Birthday, I hope you have a good day”. Might I add, I took the day off from work, and he knew I was home alone and never even said to me can I take you to breakfast, lunch or dinner. GF’s when I say OUCH – I mean OUCH that slap really hurt! Imagine 4 years and all I got was text, OMG, I think I am still in shock as I type this. His excuse was he is going through a divorce and things are very overwhelming for him. While I get that, but he always said how happy I made him. Is this how you acknowledge someone who makes you happy? Had I asked him if he wanted to come over to my place which we all know would lead to sex, he would have dropped everything to come over. After a big blow-out (I sent his best friend an e-mail telling him what he didn’t do and basically told him his friend is a selfish loser) did he finally do something for me and which of course led us back together. He always plays the nice card for a few weeks, but always went back to his selfish way. His soon to be ex-wife told him recently he is not capable of loving someone. Sad, but true! Its been 4 weeks and I am moving on, but I am emotionally distraught and mad at myself for allowing this person to be in my life and to treat me the way he did. Also, ladies throughout the 4 years nobody knew I was involved with him so I had nobody to talk to. Had I told someone I bet it wouldn’t have gone on as long as it did.
You will be happy to know, I just started therapy and am working on getting myself back to a good place.
Its nice to see that I am not alone.
Hi All! For those that know my story.
I initiated NC (w/no explanation) with my ex a month ago and haven’t heard a peep from him after he tried a few times to contact me – which i ignored all of them!
Well…surprise surprise – his sister decides to contact me for advice on her relationship issues??
Ummm…huh? #1 her and I are not friends – #2 the last time I walked away from him is when she showed up wanting to hang out.
I believe her motives are so so wrong…