Often, when I read stories of exes coming back, proclaiming that they’re sorry and that they want to get back together/can’t live without you, only for them to end up causing you even more pain, often moving onto someone else quickly (or even having them in the background already), I get the distinct impression that aside from checking in with their ‘backup plan’, that you’re a confidence booster.
You see, when someone’s been told that they’ve been, done, or even are something, it can make them feel a tad unsure of themselves, especially when you’ve traditionally pumped them up, so that the both of you start to believe that they’re more special than they actually are.
Suddenly, you’re not taking their calls, ‘sorry’ isn’t good enough, the old formula doesn’t work, and you’re essentially no longer jumping to the beat they’ve predicted. Maybe you told them all about themselves, itemising everything that’s pissed you off. Or…maybe it’s a simple case of their conscience ticking.
Most people are uncomfortable with knowing that someone is hurting as a result of them…even if they actually have a hand in causing the pain by saying and doing things that busted your boundaries and had them treating you without love, care, trust, and respect.
Just like when commitment resisters get panicked and almost have a fever trying to exit the relationship or lessen the commitment by any means necessary, the ex who isn’t feeling too assured of themselves and even feels like there’s ‘evidence’ out there that contradicts a current image that they hold of themselves, or more importantly that they’re portraying, will have an overwhelming urge to ‘reconcile’ it with the image you hold of them.
It may even feel a bit ‘Sopranos’ style, when they feel like there’s evidence of their assholery out there so then it’s like buttering up the witness…
If you return their contact, profess your feelings, accept their apology even if you’re not ready to or don’t think they’re sincere, or even take them back, it’s a confidence boost – they feel safe in preserving the image they have of themselves.
It’s like you give them a launchpad into their next relationships where they may even feel safe to press the Reset Button and give themselves a fresh start elsewhere. Even though they’re going to be in trouble with you again, in their eyes, it’s only for a ‘recent misunderstanding’ as opposed to issues stretching back in your relationship because they perceive you as having ‘forgiven’ them, or you may even have taken more responsibility than necessary, or even absorbed the blame.
Of course this whole ‘confidence boosting’ via a ‘surrogate’ extends beyond ex’s returning.
If you’ve ever been the Other Woman/Man, you’re like an upper and a painkiller, letting them feel more confident about areas that are their ‘weak spots’ in their main relationship and helping them to avoid painful and uncomfortable feelings and issues in their life, which by self-soothing themselves on you, they feel more confident in general. I know my confidence would get a boost if I had you turning down the possibility of being with someone in an available relationship, for me and my crumbs.
I’ve come across so many people who after a breakup, embark on dating someone to not only avoid grieving the loss of the breakup, but also to boost their confidence. They’re passing time, often not that fussed about whoever they’re involved with, and the person they’re dating becomes like a ‘symbol’ that they’ve still ‘got it’, or even a mascot or comforter.
Let us also not forget those who ‘florence’ and ‘renovate’ people who they deem need fixing, healing, and helping, only to end up giving the person the impression that “Hmmm, maybe I can do better?” and next thing they’re preening like a peacock and confident in ‘braving’ it elsewhere.
Also, if you’ve got that friend or family member that seems to thrive when you’re down and almost revels in you having problems, you’re being used as a confidence booster there too.
Of course there’s a lesson in all of this: Don’t allow anyone to use you as a rainy day, backup option to fall back on, and certainly don’t allow yourself to be an emotional airbag come upper come painkiller to help people avoid themselves, their feelings, and their problems. Certainly don’t allow someone to drain you out so they can make themselves feel better – like stealing your frickin’ life source!
Stop pumping them up, especially when your own resources of love, care, trust, and respect are already seriously depleted.
These experiences are draining and demoralising, sapping you of the very energy you need to regain your confidence in yourself.
The reality is that if you’re in reality, you won’t create the cocoon of bubbles, clouds, and illusions that has you being an emotional airbag in the first place. You’re better than being an option but you’re also better than being used as some sort of ‘prop’ in someone’s life like a medal, certificate or social proof that they’re better than what they themselves think or know themselves to be.
When someone is able to present themselves with their code amber and red problems, excuses, and even bullshit, or they’re able to swan in and out of your life while screwing you over repeatedly, it’s like giving them a certificate with a clean bill of relationship health that is in contradiction with reality.
The best confidence boost you can give yourself is to start treating you like a valuable entity day after day after day and distance yourself from anything and anyone who isn’t reflective of this. Instead of boosting their confidence, boost them out of your life so you can be free to focus your energy where it’s most deserving – on you.
Your thoughts?
Are you ready to stop silencing and hiding yourself in an attempt to “please” or protect yourself from others? My new book, The Joy of Saying No: A Simple Plan to Stop People Pleasing, Reclaim Boundaries, and Say Yes to the Life You Want (HarperCollins/Harper Horizon), is out now.
Check out my book and ebook Mr Unavailable and the Fallback Girl in my bookshop.
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Spot on Natalie!
My oh my oh my ~ this exact thing just happened to me, after nearly 4 months of no contact the AC/EUM finally wormed his way back into my life, I travelled right down the country to see him, poured my heart out to him when all along he had someone else lined up and less than a week after I left his place he was making the relationship ‘official’ which I found out today meant he asked her to marry him!!!! So, after another 7 weeks NC he’s at it again ~ trying to worm his way back into my affections/life ~ lol, I’m too wise to it now, the other lady must of had too much self esteem and told him to do one or something but he’ll get no ego boost from me this time, he’s going to have to make do with the ex who was before me who he fell back on when he got no joy before me in the first couple of months NC, she was
there for him but as soon as she turned to him
for support he ignored her calls and slagged her
off to me. I am so so glad I was introduced to
this site as I might still be falling for his shitty
bullshit, his text messages are so crap, he’s
even asking me to do stuff for him, give him the
phone number of the doctors ~ use the phone
book like everyone else!!! No, it is soooo over,
no matter how hard that might be on some days, the days are getting better and I’m getting stronger than ever
NML, that is the most hilarious image of a rocket!
Too bad the rocket-fuel being burned up on launch is your self-esteem and self-confidence!
And it is so common – when I was out of my non-relationship and hurting, people said ‘oh, just go and find someone else’ like really?!
I had one run in with someone who went super ambiguous and when I asked what this was as it was stringing out “oh, I had no idea that you wanted that. And now that I’ve gone back to my ex…”
This person wasn’t habitually EU, but was EU after their break up…
Bottom line – you have got to ask questions. Questions I’ll now ask during dating (once off the dating ban) will include:
1. So how long has it been since your last LTR?
2. Do you still have contact with your ex/exes?
3. When was the last time you had contact with them?
4. So, are you over your ex?
And rules for dealing with Mr Unavailables and Assclowns are:
1. Identify them
2. Don’t let them in
3. If they get in, cut off their benefits and turf them out
4. If you turf them out, make sure they stay out.
Tired_of_assanova:
I LOVE you lists and going to write them down, put in some more of my requirements…
It really does come down that we have to protect ourselves and look out and obtain that which is for our own best interest.
Dating & Love is not a simple thing of …the heart.
You are assuming ofcourse that they will answer the questions truthfully!
Policies to live by.
Thank you Charity – I asked ALL those questions plus more – and he lied about them all!!! I even asked if he was still friends w/ women he had slept with – there was only one according to him. But guess what – by the end, I counted 5 – for every rat you see, there are 50 you don’t!!
Lovingme, nice tag btw 🙂 easier said than done so we find. I’m so tired of hearing about how everything i read on this site is so true, sorry Natalie, I just am, because it sickens me that there are so many wonderful women being shat on by guys that we believe and give credit for the wonderful imaginations we have of hopes within the relationships we hold whilst with these turnips, no Swede, no cabbages, no wrong breed, parameciums yep… them. scum suckers.
I don’t get it either how we end up trying to fix it and work it out like a puzzle, when we know that they are and then that aww, yet he was so like this lovely pillow that time we watched a movie and he did all that right he’ll do that again and he knows he can yes he can be nice, we know that yet it takes him 3 weeks to build up the capability to be nice for a while and we’re all nice all the time and get told its us that are at fault for the NIL relationship not working to his satisfaction by demanding too much from a relationship which doesn’t exist,,, they know it cause they are playing it… SCUM…
With or without children these men don’t deserve there title of MEN because they really are not that, and for this pining over not contacting our drug…. this scum sucker, what the heck is all that about?
I’ve gone through so many emotions of wanting to kill him to wrapping my arms around the scum after just saying i wanted to kill him to myself and how yuck he is…. Cause he really is, its like trying to avoid the obvious reality that it is scum, yes you loved scum…. yes that does mean your right about not needing that in your life, yes you know you need to move on and don’t need scums permission to do so or to make your self feel better by interacting or talking to SCUM.
SCUM IS SCUM. Let him find more pond life whilst I swim out to sea and all these other beautiful fishes trying to get them selves off of this HOOK.
NO CONTACT FOR A MINIMUM NOW OF 6MONTHS. No more Heroin, No more crack, No more Smack, see the scum like that, it really is just as damaging to your health. xxx
wow Crystal, thank you for being so honest, really got to me. I’ve been reading everything here lately, and have so much to write in response. I keep starting, but can’t finish, having a difficult time editing things down, so I’ve just been letting everyone else’s comments wash over me instead. I guess I’m mostly absorbing and observing. I feel pretty empty, after a year and half of not being able to stop hurting over a breakup.
I too, feel ill about all the women going through all this pain. yes, I know there are men also, but personally haven’t known many to suffer through these types of EU/AC experiences. Been thinking about the decades of trying, just doing the best I could, being true to myself and my heart — how many times I’ve had to recover from traumatic heartbreaks, the lengths I’ve gone to heal myself, change every unhealthy pattern, the countless hours in therapy, reading self help books… and here I am, dealing with it all again. and at the end of that train of thought, is the worst kind of feeling of failure, for not overcoming whatever my flaws are which prevented me from finding the right partner, having a happy family of my own. this time seems so much worse than all the others.
with the latest one, there’s no more contact. that’s all over with, I see how futile it’s all been. I know there’s no way I can ever healthily interact with that man. I accept he is not the person I thought he was. and even, that he did not love me, which he claimed to very much. that in fact, I was just a painkiller, a confidence booster for him. I do have some pride left, I cannot continue participating in a charade. of course he’s going to meet someone else at some point. I wish I could say the same for myself. I really am hoping for the best, that all the self-love/care really is going to pay off.
Anoosh, I really empathise with the year recovering over a break up. I had absolutely no idea that i would watch myself break boundary after boundary in accommodating the father of my daughter, we broke up in 2010 firstly and repetitively went back and forth, me always hoping for the darn ring and signature that said the pain is over you can relax now and enjoy your life, yes i do love you and am sorry… (BS) Didn’t happen and this christmas this new year was just enough is enough, seen myself begging and at the time when i did i recalled my mother doing that with my dad when i was a child…. WAKE UP CALL.
Then I poured my heart out to him, and seen him walk away all over my guts like i wasn’t even visible and still cared for him when he was ill remotely on the phone, by now i had a few tools with me though like saying with eyes shut. I choose to enjoy this moment (try these they work). Followed with i can feel the air flowing in and out of my nose.
Basically paying attention to myself and not JUDGING. Allowing yourself to f up make mistakes lovingly… Non judgemental. You are only doing what you think is right based on the early ingrained beliefs and that inner child / girl doesn’t need angry adult judgments when she didn’t have tools and only learnt from her environment.
Self help books can become a bit of an addiction as can therapy, yet one thing is as certain as the sun rises and that is the power of choice.
You can choose every moment to enjoy it. Enjoy the tears and pay attention to your own experience makes you come to peace with it and is the fasted catalyst to move you to a better place faster than a light switch.
Because once you become consciously aware of where the pain is and how in all of its parts the whole of you…. Guess what with minimal effort your beautiful self will not put you in the line of fire believing it is rain… It just won’t.
You can call it your soul, god, a higher mind, a hidden strength a light. All i do know is that it is exceptionally compassionate and very able to transform with alchemy the worst feeling and circumstance into a world where your in flow with everything.
You can not change your past, and you won’t want to in years to come either despite all of this pain, you can ask Natalie or just see the success that has come from her experiences and what she is now able to give others a massive light which radiates for all of us to see.
Your flaws are what make you perfect. …. You are the only one that knows how to be you. Your allowed to be insecure, your a woman, you are supposed to be. So no therapy needed for that…. Just acceptance that ITS OK.
Your allowed to want a man and to feel a deep connection. – Thats natural – again no therapy needed. Your a woman.
You are allowed to make mistakes its how you grow, your even allowed to keep making them, just choose to do it with your EYES OPEN… XXX xxx Those mistakes will be your strengths, as will your weaknesses, flaws and uniqueness with kind loving eyes that starts with you.
Just choose to enjoy the moment and i mean every one of them even the most crap ones, the most judgemental ones. Hand it all over and be ok with not getting it, not wanting to do anything, be ok with being savage, be ok with being angry, be ok with being hard on yourself and others, be ok with your insecurities, be ok loving your self in all of its glory, the good, the bad and the ugly even just for the contrast of the overall beautiful person you are.
Feel it and know it and you won’t be attracting the same lesson, because you ‘ve learnt it. No therapy required xxx Just acceptance, no judgment xxx I choose to enjoy this moment.
One day i won’t be here, we won’t have the pain, the experience and we would yearn for just a second to feel it… So enjoy it. xxx.
Chrystal – those are very encouraging words to us all. Thank you
There are women who do the same thing to men. And these men allow these women to do it, just like we have. Its not pretty to watch or to hear about. Knowing men (dating a few) who have been in these situations have actually put things into perspective for me and forced me to look at myself and what I have permitted/set up with these guys that I have been with. That’s not pretty either. Yuck.
Lo J my nieces own mother does this to them. My mom takes care of them and she shows up twice per year to visit them. She has never once even invited them to her home. I’ve wondered why she does this and thanks to Natalie and BR, I figured it out this past Christmas. She shows up baring gifts for B’days and Christmas, the most she stays is about an hour and thats all (she doesnt pay for their keep). My nieces act like she is a rockstar, they are beyond excited for her to give them a crumb of attention. She stays just long enough to soak up all the adulation and then bolts. She is getting her ego stroked by these children acting like she has descended from heaven. It is damaging to them, I mean if these women here on BR could see this EU in action and the damage done to these girls after she leaves, they would understand why as adults we have a choice not to allow this behavior into our lives.
Crystal…….can I join you on the scumbag shout….I’ve been shouting that since last night.
I found myself back at his yesterday after two months of no see and only small amounts of contact.
Half of me wishes I’d not replied; the other half is so pleased I did after what I discovered, I now have the wake up call I needed to finally get him out of my head and my life.
I saw a christmas card from his girlfriend I knew nothing about; it was so gushing; about what a wonderful boyfriend he has been over the last seven months, I nearly threw up; she has no idea what a scumbag he is. He finished with the previous girl only a couple of months before! And all the time he has been in contact with me, asking to see me…..I’ve been trying so hard to flush for months and months, and after this I know I can now do it.
I feel sorry for the girl, he has clearly pulled the wool over her eyes.
True to form, when it all goes wrong he’ll be back…..but this time I have the knowledge and strength that Nat and people on this website have given me.
SCUMBAG….SCUMBAG….SCUMBAG……
Sometimes we need the final *bang* to crystallise our gains. When I saw my AC in the nightclub in on the morning of January 1st 2012 with someone else, and they saw straight through me as if I didn’t exist, I knew.
It has been 3 years since they have had a bonafide LTR (and that was an open one as well, (seems everyone I know is doing “open” – perfect invitation to become an OM or OW!). Bottom line – this person is chronic EU, and it is totally not my fault.
Great post Natalie. However, I really doubt if such people give a rats whether they cause/caused you hurt or not. Anyone so focused on getting their poor lil egos pumped up again, so they do not have to truly look at their behavior and prove somehow that they still “for it” is thinking of themselves and only themselves. Getting such folks to think beyond themselves is kinda like expecting them to understand quantum physics. Happy trails
Sad thing is that they don’t care and really, but we don’t need them to care either. We should be caring for ourselves and our future.
Thanks, Natalie.
I just went through the most excruciating round of this. I was NC for 2 months. (the longest in 13.5 years of this saga). I wouldn’t say I was doing well; it was more like I was frozen. I couldn’t even unpack from the disastrous trip we had just taken. (During which he gave me the slip several times to *buy gifts for another woman*.) It was impossible for me to delude myself anymore. And a new form of self-protection I didn’t know I had kicked in; my brain, in what felt like a *physical* effort, pushed away my normal ruminations. I never went on facebook, twitter, and checked new email only on my phone so I would not look at old emails or see if he was online.
Then I get the hang-up call. The anonymous text from an unknown number… The invitation to dinner. I am so wary, so distant. He’s crying, he’s distraught, can’t concentrate… I ask all the right questions. I get the right answers. I let down my guard and say I love him and want to be with him. At my doorway, he drops the bomb. He wants to have a child this year and “wants me to still have that chance, too.”
I went from thinking he was saying we would be the family I waited for, to understanding he was saying *he was planning to have a child with another woman* in about 5 seconds. I felt like I had been broadsided in the head. I can’t even remember the next few minutes. I had to take the day off from work and was vomiting. Possibly the worst moment of so many bad moments that if i remember them it seems impossible I’m still alive.
He actually wanted, I think, my permission and forgiveness. I remember getting really cold and saying, “Fine, go have a child, be happy.” And he said, ‘If that’s what you really want, but don’t be angry.”
He looked me in the eye and said “This is win/lose for you but lose/lose for me.” He should be in the manipulation hall of fame.
ixnay
what a crybaby. Where does he live? I’ll give him something to cry about. But he’d probably end up making ME feeling sorry for HIM.
Have nothing more to do with him, he’s a mind* in the extreme.
Keep up NC and one day you really won’t care, I promise.
Grace, do your thing. I’ll follow behind, get you out of there, kick him while he’s down, and not feel one bit of remorse. He’s a butthead!
Ixnay, this man is worse than a cockroach. Not a man to have a child with, I think you had a lucky escape. He is now going to go and dump on someone else. Keep strong, hug xx
Do you know it is ‘ lose/lose for him’…he has lost you and will no doubt lose his other woman as well, he’s dyed in the wool nasty.
Be thankful to be free of him. Thinking of you tonight.
Ixnay
I have seen this played out before, he didn’t ‘plan’ anything. Either she got sloppy or did it on purpose. He’s a coward, scumbag and every other name under the sun. Trust me, he did not want a family, he got played out by his own game.
I’m afraid the child will be an even bigger loser, unless the mother sees the light sooner or later.
Ixnay, I hope for you you’ll have a child with a better man!
thank you, you guys
it is so great to have people who understand
I really don’t know who I am anymore or what happened to all that time or what my life is supposed to look like now
Nat, you really hit the nail on the head here! I know the last time I took my ex back he got in touch saying, among other jibber-jabber, that he, “wanted to right some of the wrongs of his past.” Hmmmm, now instead of focusing on how much he said he missed me, I should have honed right in on that statement. I have no idea if he launched himself into another relationship, but I do know he was attempting to launch himself into various vaginas while I was in the picture. It’s pretty funny, because whenever he pesters me via text, it’s like, “I’m not Sister/Rabbi Natasha. I cannot pronounce you a Good Guy.” There have been times that I’ve been tempted to say, “Fine! Ok! I don’t think you suck!”, because I suspect that would be enough and he’d never bother me again, but I have to respect my boundaries and just hit the Drama Free Delete Button. In any event, I agree that we should save the launchpads for the space program and fire up our own lives!
Ha ha ha!!! “Launch himself into various vaginas!” I wish there was a like button on here.
…So Funny, I agree… launch your rocket….. My X, now that he is aware his credit isn’t good enough to buy a house – which he was so confident about getting one last summer –
Is now LAUNCHING himself to the ‘new’ woman to move into HER HOUSE. Can’t get one legit, will take one with his penis.
Just Launch yourself way far away from me.
“Just Launch yourself way far away from me.” Love!! I wonder, what kind of mortgage rates do penises get…adjustable? fixed? BALLOON?!
There was just no better way to put it haha! Last I checked, I don’t live in Cape Canaveral 😉
“I have no idea if he launched himself into another relationship, but I do know he was attempting to launch himself into various vaginas while I was in the picture. It’s pretty funny, because whenever he pesters me via text, it’s like, “I’m not Sister/Rabbi Natasha. I cannot pronounce you a Good Guy.”
—- LMAO! Hilarous and true. I won’t even reiterate my whole story as it is so similar to most of you ladies’ stories. My former Assclown ex too would resurface and say he missed me and say some half-hearted apology and each time I would slowly let him back in, then it would all last for no more than 2 weeks. By week 2 I would start to let my guard down and then initiate calling or texting him (as I thought he was proving himself when he made all the contact) and there would be NO answer…then I’d find out he was in a new relationship! This happened about 3 times and now it makes perfect sense smh….
Oh MissE, what a fool your ex is. I wonder why none of his relationships seem to work out?! 😉 That may be one of the most egregious examples of Reset Button usage I’ve ever heard. My ex’s classic lines are, “I feel bad about what happened/I feel bad about the way things ended/I feel bad about any bad feelings between us/I just wanted to say hi”, so I feel you. There is no better way to say “Bitch please.” to these guys than no response haha!
OMG! I am so thankful I found this site. My AC is contacting me after 5 months NC and after he told me he was sick of the rollercoaster ride I was giving him-what a joke. Not replying back and won’t, thanks to BaggageReclaim – ride closed, no tickets left. In the past, I would have been all over him, blowing smoke up his butt, inflating that big AC ego. He must be wondering what is going on. No more-learned my lesson the hard way after 3 years of hell and completely losing myself. Had to laugh-he sent me an email saying he wanted to see me as a friend, no kissing, touching, clothes on (this is after I accused him of using me for sex, yes, I was definitely a booty call). Guess that is suppose to make me think he changed. Not stupid anymore. Once an AC always an AC. Don’t need him for sex or anything else (I’ll just whip out my vibrator-much more satisfying). Thank you Natallie
Definitely a great lesson for anyone going through a difficult break up!
I’ll admit that in the past I used to be “ready and willing” for my ex while she went out on adventures with other guys.
It can be difficult to embrace it, but you really do owe yourself better than to be someone else’s “Plan B.”
Thanks for the reminder 🙂
Absolutely, we all need to be” the one” option, nothing else will do.
I’m sorry but I am perplexed as to why anyone would do this. I have never needed an ego boost so bad that I called up an ex, whom I didnt want anyway, just to get them to stroke my ego. I do know that one guy I dated did this to me. All I can say is that this dude’s self esteem was further in the gutter than mine has ever been.
Well, I am in my second full month of NC: cut him out of my Facebook list, deleted his contacts from my cellphone, I don’t know if he’s dead or alive and I gather he doesn’t know anything about me as well.
I so hope things will go on like this and he’ll let me live my merry life, as he’s living his. He really fucked me up, about the loss of my job and his rubber band games.
Nat,I am Guilty as charged!
I find myself with so much time on my hands,and so I have been getting back on the dating site nonsense again.
I think honesty,I want the admiration,the Nice comments yadda yadda yadda…
I have even met a few of them,Nothing but a Waste of a Good Hairdo and Makeup…
I am going to try really hard in feeding my spirit with Praise and compliments…
Thanks for always making things seem so much clearer for me..
Nat Btw…Mom ordered Your book for me for xmas,and Amazon is out of stock:(Is that the only place I can get it…Im from Canada…..
Brenda
“I saw you shopping at the mall Saturday, I wanted to say hello but I was with Janelle”. “I like your new short hair cut, really looks good”. “If you ever get to a place where you think we can talk please get in touch with me”. That’s the BS email I got today from my ex, Janelle is the woman he left me for.
If I ever get to a place where we can talk, OH PLEASE BITE ME. I’m sure he’s waiting for my response but like Lovingme he’s not going to get an ego boost from me. These guys take even a negative response as some kind of validation but he won’t be getting that satisfaction from me.
The only thing he did get right was my short hair does look good.
I bet your haircut looks great MaryC!
One thing this reminded me of is the difference between these EUM’s and emotionally available guys. When you split up with the latter it’s recognised there is incompatibility, things just didn’t work out…there’s no need for the ‘Certification of Good Guy’ presentation.
You both just move on, hope each other the best.
With EUM’s there is all this palaver,the earnest compliments, the drama….as you say ultimately the validation of a final Ego Boost.
I am with you and Loving Me, I seek no revenge…but there is no way I will stick a gold star on his forehead!!
Shut. The. Front. Door. I totally agree with not even dignifying him with a reply, but I can’t lie, “If you ever get to a place where you think you should kiss my ass….” would be a nice way to kick one off 😉 Enjoy rocking the new ‘do lady!
I think there is s time to contact an ex evil EUM and that is when you are totally back and together in your own life just to simply tell them that your life moved on, it didn’t stop for their sorry asses and you did well for yourself!..You won’t get a reply because you are not pumping their ego however I got a kick out of saying how great my life was and I’m getting married this year to a really great man! That door is totally shut and the dumb ass texts and apologies I am sure will vanish now the door is closed, However my ex was persistant in chasing down old exs that he mis treated..one girl from thirty years ago who is happily married! Some people just can not take the fact that someone somewhere thinks they are an evil weasel! Sad but true.
“However my ex was persistant in chasing down old exs that he mis treated..one girl from thirty years ago who is happily married!”
That just made me burst out laughing! Like she gives a sh*t about him. Congratulations on your upcoming wedding! 🙂
Hey Natasha,
thanks for the congratulations! Big party next New Years Eve..so a year to plan the big day! Soooooo excited!
When I look back on the escapade with the evil ex I was besotted with an image of a man who was not there. He was the only man I knew with hidden shallows!
This ex he chased for thirty years never replied to him once until last year whereupon she was very cool said she loved him and forgave him, but also said that although she was flattered she was happily married! (he married someone else instead of her!)..he then promptly said “I win!”..no shit I saw the facebook conversation..to which this lady said “no YOU loose!” and she promptly blocked him on facebook!
Now that is the lengths some asses go to proove a point that they are the great big deal they want to think they are instead of the weasel women come to know them to be…his last comment was..”Now I know you will reply I will wait!”….what for another reply in thirty years what a bloody moron!
That ladies is how an idiot EUM rolls! Goodness as I write that down, I am so happy he is someone else’s problem, some other woman is being kept in the dark as he trawls through his life back story for any women still waiting to stroke his ego and his whatsit! I sure am not that woman any more! Yippee!
Bee, I went to a wedding on New Year’s Eve a few years ago and it was literally the best wedding I’ve ever been to 🙂 So much fun and such a lovely way to kick off the new year!! On the subject of the less-than-lovely…sweet Jesus, your ex is a tool. “I win!”?! Errrrrrrrr, no son you don’t. This is an excellent example of how trying to be the “bigger person” when contacted by an ex-AC is a waste of time and no response is the best response.
On a much, much happier note, thank you for sharing your story and being a prime example of how not being “that woman” pays off in spades 🙂 Congratulations again!!
OMG MaryC! Wow, his words send chills down my spine, I can FEEL the AC BS just by reading that, heard that kind of crap too many times! Good for you on keeping NC, LOVE “OH PLEASE BITE ME!” PERFECT!
Don’t you just love how he makes himself out to sound like, “oh, how difficult it was for me not to say hello…if only I hadn’t been with ol’ what’s her name…oh that’s right, the woman I screwed you over for. Contact me so you validate the feelings I had when I saw you.” He makes her sound like a barrier, like he didn’t already make his AC choice and should be respectable to you BOTH and not even have pulled this crap! Just PROVES nothing is about anyone but HIMSELF! You’re just supposed to pick up where you left off right and everything is just fine? We ALL know what it feels like to be treated like that! ICK!!
Nat, your posts are so timely its a bit unsettling. I cannot allow mysself to be an air pump, inflating his deflated ego destroying me in the process. I must remember he is not that special as you say. Go outside the box and trust myself this year , I can do this.
Wow! Just by reading the headline, I realized that is what my ex AC is doing to me! Can’t believe I didn’t see it.
“I know my confidence would get a boost if I had you turning down the possibility of being with someone in an available relationship, for me and my crumbs.” This sentence spoke volumes to me!!!!
That is exactly what my ex had me thinking about doing. I’ve been dating a nice available guy and had NC with ex. When he noticed I wasn’t communicating with him, he tried to get me back to settling for his crumbs! Making all sorts of promises if I would just be patient. Can’t believe I even thought about considering that for a few days. So glad I saw this post!
I can’t believe the horrible behavior displayed by these type of people. Selfishness never ceases to infuriate me. I love this post, Nat…the more you post, the more others will realize the damage done by these jerks and will act accordingly.
Yup, I’d say this post says it just how it was for me with my epiphany relationship. My lying, multiple-cheating, two-faced, deceptive, tantruming, using, no job, no home, no scruples, no morals, no love trust or care, ex MM fits this bill totally. He enjoyed me for three years (more fool me), finally left his main relationship (me with smiling open arms) and shamlessly dodged me for another fallback who was waving and wanting from the distance. I have no doubt now, with the benefit of the vision that 18 months NC gives, that he used me for comfort and pain-relief and I was the launch pad who confidence-boosted him into his next relationship.
It was so so so awful, draining, and hurtful BUT I am soooo ooo oo o not that woman anymore. BR has been my launch pad to rocket me away from these shady flaky damaging relationships and love me back into health. Brilliant post Nat. I love the last line to be ”free to focus your energy where it’s most deserving – on you”.
HALLE L UJAH
Oh Natalie, thank you so much for always saying the things I need to hear. Ever since my ex discovered he could e-mail me at work he was pestering me with ever more mournful messages: ‘I miss you baby’ / ‘I only remember the best things about us’ / ‘I need to know you are doing ok’ … it was upsetting and exhausting me and I had to put my foot down and remind him I would ONLY communicate with him about work matters.
He followed this up with ‘but I need someone to talk to’ and ‘I just need a friend’ Notice how quickly it reverted back to being ALL about him? I gave him such a firm NO that he’s disappeared again.
I have no sense of a need for retribution, but I do like the idea that I will not allow my actions to give him a ‘get out of jail free’ card: I will not be his salve against the need to take a long-hard look at himself. Doubtless someone else will, or is already. But I am not that woman.
OMG….story of my life…every person felt like Brad Pitt with me … do not ask how I felt….each of them gained confidence and immediately married someone after me…never ever again…never!!!!!!!
I used to always wonder why this would happen after a break up. This one guy would disappear and return like clockwork, and it was always around a time where I thought that I was getting over him and tried to move on. It got to the point where I was almost waiting for him to return, and sure enough he would. But I would always be stupid enough to let him get close enough to me to expose the doubt that was in my mind, the new guy would be old news, and before we could actually rekindle anything he would go ghost on me once again. I think that even without knowing why he continued to do this, I realized that I didn’t actually want what he had to offer. I’m a little embarrassed to say it now, but I think a part of me just liked the drama of it all. But I really wanted something more, and it finally sunk in that in all the time that I knew him that he had never changed, and I could never get what I wanted from him. I wrote him a long goodbye letter, that under normal circumstances I would have regretted sending. But it somehow gave me peace that time around, and it made me realize that I was no longer angry. Somehow allowing myself to be that vulnerable gave me the closure that I needed. It was definitely a lesson learned and I sincerely hope that I won’t slip back to a place where I’ll get a refresher course.
Great post!
Lia
I know what you mean about “liking drama”. I overheard two women talking about a mutual friend who got dumped shortly before her wedding day. They were LOVING it. I’m sure they felt sorry for her but they were really enjoying the analysis, the scandal, the “how could he?” And I enjoyed eavesdropping.
Yeah, drama is compelling but let’s just stick to watching it on tv/ reading about it in books.
You story is eerily like my own Lia. At the time I thought his returning like clockwork and me predicting it was a soulmate connection..LMAOOOO! I long realized it wasn’t, as we’ve been done for over 3 years and I’m over it but thinking back now I see exactly what it was smh.
He too would show up, woo me for 2 weeks and once I started believing he would go ghost as well. Then end up in a relationship the next week! I can’t believe I had romanticized it and put up with that.
I too realize I must have a drama addiction and I want to kick it!
Miss E, my ex was on two week timer also, only two weeks was his limit on making an effort after I wanted to bolt. As far as relationships go that`s attention span of a flea…And I mistook the drama for the intensity of a relationship. Now I`m not in this relationship physically, but my head still in the drama, just thinking about it. Too long I think.
Pause to think……. I’d never have fathomed it from this perspective, and looking back, it makes so much sense. There is very clear evidence in my past relations where I’d be so unceromiously and abruptly single just days after the “let’s try again” serenades.
Natalie brilliant post 🙂 the song Jar of Hearts comes to mind!
Suzanne,
That song…i listened to it in my last AC break up and now this one, and that is sad because the song is not that old! Too many AC relationships after another!
I listed to DUFFY ROCKFERRY on repeat right now! If you like her, those songs all speak to being lied to and treated poorly, yet our heartbreaks don’t heal instantly and match up with our heads, but that ultimetely, we know who we are and what we deserve. “Stepping Stone” that one is so spot on. Relates to this post as well. ” I will never be your stepping stone, take it all, or leave me alone. I’m standing upright, on my own.”
NCC totally agree ….stepping stone was another one that i listened to also the lyrics are sooo apt as you say..Adelle has some also that ring true…set fire to the rain speaks volumes…but i will say that the most woman empowering song is `I will survive`although a bit cheesy is so true because we.. all women on this site and out there will do and become stronger…and the EUM`S and ASSCLOWNS of this world will never be happy and possibly end up alone! Check out the video on youtube of Jar of Hearts..there is a bit where he appears to be sucking the very energy out of these women…says it all!! Nat am sooo glad i found your site after years of therapy that did nothing to help..you`re site was like a breath of fresh air..bless you it has given me so much strength.
NCC
Also what made me chuckle to myself is the fact that the EUM/AC i was involved with actually said that he sings `Jar of hearts` on karaoke!! Goes to show how these jerks are just not aware of who and what they really are!!??! lol
NML
This is an insightful post.I’ve cut all exes out of my life (except the first one who has been all right). I wasn’t 100% sure of WHY I did it, but reading this post I think – yes, that’s why. I don’t want them to use me and, just as importantly, I don’t want to use them as a bouncy castle. I no longer want any of that ego-stroking or validation to be a part of my life. it’s very unhealthy. I don’t need a coterie of male admirers.
Let’s all sort out our own issues and move into the future unencumbered.
No-one (not even us) is that special that an ex can’t function without our blessing.
I used to want to apologise to one ex in particular. I was googling him for contact details and suddenly thought “Who the hell do I think I am? I’ve done enough damage. Leave him alone!”
Oftentimes the respectful, decent thing to do is to leave people alone. If you have abandonment issues, it can seem very cruel but it’s actually appropriate and KIND. rather than to keep popping up and messing with their heads.
Amen Grace. Whenever I hear, “Oh he’s texted me! What if he’s changed?!” I think, “Girl, if he’d actually changed, he wouldn’t be texting you.” It’s also incredibly true that we don’t need a group of male admirers if we admire ourselves!
So true Natasha. Last I heard from the MM AC was a week ago through text. “Oh btw I never meant to hurt you”-or something equally as lame and nonchalant sounding as that. The old me would have jumped all over it, justifying how I was the one who had been wrong and demanded too much from him and how he was sincerely feeling bad that he hurt me and having a completely disproportionate response to that text. The new me, who sees reality, knows he’s just an asshole and it takes NO EFFORT on his part to send something as insincere as a pathetic text like that. One second after receiving it, I DELETED IT and haven’t broke NC yet.
Good for you! I don’t know what it is with assclowns and “I never meant to hurt you.”. Classic cop-out line! Keep doing what you’re doing, it’s so worth it – I promise 🙂
Limerace, Natasha,
I think when EUM exs say “I never meant to hurt you”, they do mean it. HOWEVER, that’s because they were NEVER EVER thinking about you at all. You were not on their agenda. It is all about what works for them. Once you internalise how insignificant you really are to their lives, you can just stop giving these asses any air time. Think about it as not being personal. This is why they are so shocked that you get upset, they never ever considered you in the first place! Just my assessment from my own experience.
So the fact that we ignore their pathetic attempt at an ego boost means that they move on anyway? They think we are nasty for not replying and I guess this helps them too.
It’s reassuring to know that they might feel guilty for their actions though. Surely even the most narcissistic manipulative ass must have some shame?
Shinestar,
It certainly would be nice wouldn’t it? But I don’t even know if they actually feel bad for the right reasons, or not for the reason you would think. If anything, I think that it’s a case in which their egos get bruised when we don’t respond and they’re licking their wounds in response, not that they actually care that someone has been hurt by them. It would be nice if they actually cared and admitted it though, it would certainly quickly validate the feelings a woman gets after she’s been jerked around. But through having a mother who never apologized for any wrongdoing, and rarely respected my boundaries, I learned that some people just don’t care and never will. But irregardless of whether or not a person feels bad for what they’ve done, the negativity that is experienced by another person is still valid, that pain was/is real. Is there probably a small piece of me that hopes that they will one day understand? I wouldn’t be an undercover eternal optimist if there wasn’t. But what goes on in another person’s brain and heart is no one’s concern but their own. If a man doesn’t think twice before hurting you once, twice, or however many times, I think it’s safe to say that he’s not really all that concerned with either of yours. I think that one of the hardest things to do in these situations is to stop caring about how a jackass perceives you and your actions. Just going off of his track record, how much could anyone ever really trust his perception of reality? It’s probably always going to be skewed in his favor, at least in his mind. I say let these men think that we’re witches, or angry/bitter, or any of those other choice words that are used as triggers for women. If he refuses to see what actually happened then he’s a fool, and I don’t think any of us should waste our time trying to save unworthy men from themselves or their little warped brains. I say let them be fools with someone else while we actually get what we want and need from someone who can actually deliver.
Actually – who cares what they think!!!
I actually am not so sure that they have any guilt as they are so focused on themselves and so lacking in empathy.It is more like it does dawn on them and rings the bell somewhere that they might not be as wonderful as they`ve been pumped up to be, after all if they were we`d still be their doormats. I have been a launchpad once….not a good feeling, never again.
I KNOW the MM AC I was “with” doesn’t feel bad or guilty. He never felt bad for what he was doing to his wife and he would go into details about their fights and he was downright CRUEL to her. BIG RED FLAGS there that eventually led to me waking up from my fog/illusion. When he and I first started, I was SO jealous of her, then after awhile I just felt SO BAD for her. He treated me like shit the second time we “got back together” (if a relationship of texts and shagging in his car counts as being together…which is really doesn’t in my outlook now on life). I feel worse for his wife than he ever did and I have to live with my part in the entire mess. So no, I KNOW he doesn’t feel even a inkling of bad or guilt about how he treated me. Some of these men are just cruel.
Limerace,
people who cheat on their spouses make excuses for their behaviour so they don’t have to face their bad behaviour to their wife or girlfriend..he’s some my ex EUM used on me:
1. I tell my fiancee I love her, I never tell you, so you don’t count. I am not being unfaithful;
2. I’m not married just engaged so it doesn’t count;
3. She doesn’t know about it, so it can’t hurt her and doesn’t matter anyhows,
4. I’m not being unfaithful if we only have x,y,z sort of sex!
5. She’s not very good in bed, I have to get my needs met by other women. It’s only natural.
Feeling sorry for their partner’s is about right, however feel sorry and move on for ourselves. Who needs this sort of utter disrespect!
Oh my goodness yes. This figures.
The MM said to me more than once “I don’t have much confidence with women”. Even at the time that made me uneasy, it made me wonder if he was “practising” on me for “the real thing”, i.e. a woman he really was interested in. (The comment about “pain relief” figures too – pain relief from his problems with his wife, I think.) I could never understand why he was going to such a lot of trouble and expense (flights, hotels etc) to see me – when we were together he was actually pretty cold, I always felt he was going through the motions, being polite, doing activities, having meals, etc, but no warmth. He never did the “I love you” etc., although there was future faking about trips overseas. He also told me that he wasn’t really that bothered about the sex. So what was he there for, then? I often felt so puzzled as to why he continued to pursue it, but clearly it was a self esteem/ego boost thing for him.
I can’t really feel too indignant about it all though, because what was I doing there myself.
Very spot on. I have been suspecting that this AC has been using me as a confidence booster. Background on the ac: we hooked up had a roller-coaster relationship filled with red, amber and all sorts of flags but i was too in love to see. I would go on NC and the A clown would worm himself back into my life with promises from here to Timbuktu and everytime it would end up in the same way. This one time he comes declaring Love and BoY had i been dreaming of the day he would say those words. His Actions, well not did not match anything he had said. First Forward to a few weeks of NC he calls asking if we can do a movie and get this: cancels 45 mins to screening apparently his GF is Bringing issued….at that point it hit me….Confidence Booster / Ego stroker is all i am to him. Nothing more nothing Less.
This Article NAT is what i needed to see clearly. NC starts Now.
My goodness me, this sounds like the guy I was dating – almost identical. Do you think there is a factory somewhere that churns out men like this? All cloned with an instruction book to follow. Find the factory someone and close it off please!!!!!
Again a article which gave me so much clarity today.
I am living through this situation now,(he made contact again, Christmas,declarations of love? after I truly had disengaged)thankfully I’ve started to recognise why he’s after the ‘ Good Guy Medal’ and why there has been such a desperate attempt to rewrite the relationship, minimising the continual disrespect he showed me and the layers of lies with dating sites and ex girlfriends .As follows;
1. His self concept absolutely demands that he sees himself as’a gentleman’
This is the very soul of his modus operandi, the image he projects at the beginning. He gets off on it for the first few months.It’s his bait.
2.I have a history within the relationship of enabling him to do this. I continued seeing him, listened to excuses for 18 months. He sees me as his latest Self esteem crutch…wants me to sign the certificate.
3. He has a history of this, I now know this is his pattern of behaviour at the end of many of his relationships. He must reduce his shame.
4. For months now, I have not changed my opinion or lessened my boundaries about the reality of the relationship. He was /is EUM. He wants me to change my opinion of him so he can feel better.
I laughed at the mention of Tony Soprano in the article. Then shuddered,the ex is becoming increasingly deluded and nasty in his comments. Yesterday I received an e mail’Who murdered Love’…basically listing my faults, denigrating me. He is insisting giving me back items from his house that I do not want.
All this from a man who met up with three ex girlfriends or more whilst he was with me and continued to pour over dating sites whilst asking me to’move in’,’lets create a future’….shocking stuff.
I have written out a truly outrageous lie he told me about an ex and pinned it to the fridge and am about to change my e mail account(again, sigh!)
I am in no danger of re-engaging and will just wear the audacity of the man for a little while longer.The sad thing is that he had absolutely no insight into the behaviour he’s been repeating for years and years. I used to feel pain at the years of loneliness for him to come, now I just feel sick for the next woman. Thanks Nat for the article today, it brought together the confusing jigsaw pieces of the last few weeks for me and helped a lot.
Lynda, he wants attention, any attention. From my experience, brace yourself or block him if you can because they can get very angry and hurtful when met with stony silence, they don`t like feeling powerless and out of control. Re-engaging , even to say leave me alone is out of the question for me too, been there already, no joy. Decided to pay up and change the phone provider if I can find one that will block his number for me, I have had enough, it rattles me , puts me back, I have had enough of jumping whenever I hear a text come in.
Lynda
Doggedly ignore him.
I’m also thinking “restraining order”.
Thanks Grace/Sushi. Yes, will completely and utterly ignore,affecting my confidence a tad but trying to faze out the drama/inflammatory words, am doing work things.
Another big e mail came in tonight.. I scanned it, full of justifications or imagined justifications for his actions…then wholly deluded statements about my ex husband saying he ‘hopes we will be very happy together'( I have been apart from my ex husband for a decade???)
The manner is horrible. He actually says ‘ I am very very very very angry with you….’
It’s a salutory lesson for me, do not even open the door a crack.
Yet another Sim card/new phone!
Lynda,
Please take the necessary precautions to block all his communications. He sounds increasingly dangerous. I’m leaning with Grace. Is it time to involve authorities?
Blueberry,
Thanks, have done that now and think this will be it closed. My son is living with me just now, he’s 21 so I do not even need to go to door if he turns up..it’s true that his last communication by e mail did rattle me because it was so extreme, but by keeping completely NC it seems the situation has de-escalated.
How totally devaluing when you know that they are fishing around and hooking up with other people. My AC was shocked that I only date one person at a time. “So, only one at a time? I think it is OK to date multiple people if there has been no conversation about a committed relationship.”
Of course, you know how far and deep in the poo you get before you get to that?! From now on, DTRs are mandatory and from date #1 I will be setting my boundary. No launching from my pad!
Thanks Natalie for this. You just confirmed what I have believed all along!
When my ex-husband contacted me recently by email, after the Court had sent him the final divorce papers. He wrote: “Just a few words to tell you that I well received the divorce confirmation’s letter from the court. I wanted to wish you all the best in your life, personal and professional, may all your dreams come through (sic). This may sound ‘bullshit’ but I really think it.”
He was the perfect example of an EUM and was emotionally abusive in the extreme during our relationship and very short lived marriage but ever desperate to think he was the ‘good guy’ and a victim of anyone’s behaviour except his own. When I received this, I was initially conflicted. For a moment, I thought the “right thing to do” might be to write back and say thank you or something along those lines and to even dig deeper and wish him the very best. However, the truth and the pain that I would feel in contacting him held me back : I do not wish him well (even if I do not wish him any harm either)- I have not progressed that far and don’t know if I ever will because of his utterly selfish and highly damaging behaviour towards me which, even though I had a part to play in it all, I have not forgiven him. Similarly, I felt (and still do feel) that this whole stupid exercise had nothing to do with me and everything to do with him. Here he was looking for confirmation that he played absolutely no part in the breakdown of our marriage and here he was, yet again, looking to me to make him feel good about the abuse he meted out to me.
Perhaps I am just selfish but I thought I did so much sucking up and putting my own feelings and wellbeing to one side during our marriage that at least one of the benefits of divorcing the a&& should be that I no longer have to have contact with him or consider his feelings.
Would be interested to see how anyone would interpret this or whether they would be nobler than me in simply taking the email at face value and replying with ‘also wish you well’ message.
Should probably state, regardless, I have no intention of ever contacting him again. Truly enjoying the peace still without him and am grateful for the clarity that I gained from that negative experience. I think he has cured me from my need to fix anything or anyone!
Hi Bermiegirl,
I think the name of the game is to be true to ourselves and to treat ourselves well. Your relationship is finished and you have no moral obligation to engage in any contact with him, he treated you badly and you don`t think he is sincere. It`s just something you don`t wish to do and he can`t make you. Whatever he will choose to think about it is his problem. I get a birthday card from one ex who treated me badly every year, I never send him one. Whatever. I`m no longer interested and I don`t feel the need to be polite.
Thank you!
Bermie
Ignore him. I long ago realised that the emotionally abusive and manipulative can’t be given even a quarter of a quarter of an inch or they take a mile.
What good does it do you to respond? He’s not your husband anymore, he’s a nothing to you.
If you respond and he says nothing, you’ll think “gah, why did I respond”. If he does respond you’re into email correspondence with your ex husband. Waste of time.
And, yes, it does sound like BS.
Thank you! Glad you think it’s BS too!
Hi Bermiegirl,
I think it’s just important to be authentic to what you feel each day and not put a time limit on these things. You may still feel anger,disgust at him for his behaviour and as I’m sure you know it’s part of grieving. This is about you and what’s best for you.
You are not a bad person for not forgiving and you no longer have to contact him.
If he had expectations that you would also wish him well, that’s his feeling not yours, you have no responsibility to own it.
Thanks Lynda for reminding me I’m still grieving. I think I’m over it all and then something blindsides me. Thank you also for reminding me that I am not a horrible person for not having managed to reach the level of forgiveness yet. I guess, if the truth be told, I still haven’t quite forgiven myself for having put up with so much of his BS. It’s amazing how much we can let one person destroy our sense of self and confidence. At least I now know that I will never let someone do that again.
I see no reason for you to wish someone well after a divorce who didn’t have the decency to treat you well while you were with him. Particularly since you’re NOT feelin’ it. He doesn’t want to face the harsh reality of his lousy behavior, so this is his way of saying, “Forgive me for being an ass to you, so I can feel better about my sorry self.” Even though he doesn’t actually apologize, I think this post of Nat’s is still relevant here…
https://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/sometimes-sorry-means-hurry-the-hell-up-accept-my-apology-so-i-can-stop-feeling-bad-about-it/
Thanks for the link. I will definitely read that.
Sounds like it is spot on!
Bermie
“I thought […] that at least one of the benefits of divorcing the a&& should be that I no longer have to have contact with him or consider his feelings.”
You thought right. It’s not ‘should be one of the benefits’ – it IS one of the benefits. So enjoy!
Thanks for that! lol
It’s just so easy to get caught up with wanting to be the bigger person, to be the ‘grown-up’ in the situation and to do the right thing no matter what.
It’s definitely the right time to do the right thing by me for a change. It’s amazing how sometimes one simple change in how we live snowballs into something so much greater. Since separating from him and refusing to take any more of his BS, I quit the corporate world (equally abusive and creepy parallels with my personal life at the time), and have started working for myself. Even on a really difficult or stressful day, it is better than it ever was before. It might sound strange but my life felt as if it needed a major overhaul on all fronts and that is what I have set out to do: from losing excess baggage (2 legged and professional) to losing weight and to reclaiming my peace and joy. Hopefully over the next year, I will manage to truly let go of the last of this. Really hope so as it’s long overdue.
Bermie
“It’s just so easy to get caught up with wanting to be the bigger person, to be the ‘grown-up’ in the situation and to do the right thing no matter what.”
I get that. I have been ‘guilty’ of that too – to my own detriment! The thing is that there now is NO situation to have to be the grown up in – not anymore. Yay. So you don’t have to be the ‘bigger’ person – it’s not a competition, and by the sounds of this guy, to be the bigger person all you pretty much have to do is to live and breathe! There is no situation and there is nothing to be ‘bigger’ than. That’s the benefit you get from dumping the tosser.
Agreed that there’s no use in trying to be the bigger person with these guys. I tried it so many times with the EU–trying to be reasonable, waiting for him to get over his tantrum, apologizing to make things better and getting no apology in return (despite the fact that he had been a total ass****). Not worth it….it’s not like dealing with a normal/decent human being, these jerks will just keep on taking as much as they can.
Thanks Fearless. You’re absolutely right, of course.
Thanks A as well.
It’s true that you can’t give an inch with the EUMS. Boundaries are an alien concept for them as are other people’s feelings. It’s the all-about-them show and the best you can ever hope for is to be acknowledged as a passing cameo role. Sad but true.
You’re right A when you say “it’s not like dealing with normal/decent human being”. It never was like dealing with someone normal/decent so why it should it suddenly change after you’re done and dusted? It won’t.
My ex tried to test the waters by breaking NC and contacting me via email a couple of times. I would only respond briefly, not giving much detail, and in a very aloof manner to let him know that I was/am doing very well without him in my life–thank you very much! I then proceeded to block him from being able to contact me in the future. I now have a new boyfriend who blows him out of the water– both in how he treats me and how he looks (dude is super cute and has a nicely toned body) and have moved on. Since the new boyfriend lives near the stomping ground of the old one, I would not be surprised if I ran into knuckle head one day. If we end up talking, I am going to give him a big hug, grin from ear to ear, and thank him. LOL!!
Natalie, You are so Smart!!!
“The best confidence boost you can give yourself is to start treating you like a valuable entity day after day after day and distance yourself from anything and anyone who isn’t reflective of this. Instead of boosting their confidence, boost them out of your life so you can be free to focus your energy where it’s most deserving – on you.”
You are so right about us boosting their confidence and egos, and especially when they don’t deserve it at all and we don’t get any confidence boosting or anything but trouble in return.
….On my own self-progress: I went to gym again at 5:30am before work today & LOVE it!! I am socializing with my good friends, and taking all-around good care of myself. I have patience, and I have hope. Thanks Nat!
fantastic post natalie!
oh ixnay, i am so sorry for your pain. what a HORRIBLE man. i had a similar experience. i think this twisted type likes to see you in pain. chin up & be glad this toad is no longer in your life. this other woman is not getting a prize – you are…. You are free of his nonsense! you don’t know it yet, but, with time you will. take care of yourself~
thanks, stella
i did get this weird feeling that the emotion i displayed at my doorway was the whole point of the evening. I had been aloof and watchful and then loving, but not effusive or physical. I think he wanted to see me break down. I was almost incoherent, and he was finally in control of the situation. he bought himself a pie on the way home and told me how delicious it was.
Ixnay,
Unbelievable. This man is disgusting–I’m sorry that you’ve had to deal with this.
If one party is getting the confidence boost then the other is getting something as well. Otherwise why would we do it? Maybe it does feel good. Short term it is rewarding us too.
I came across a book yesterday on attachment styles. “Avoidant attachment” people will withdraw from intimacy but when they get lonely they are drawn back. So they are drawn back to something they will feel compelled to pull back from again. Unless the “relationship” is so distant and vague that that feeling of intimacy and belonging/commitment which they dread can’t be felt. Both parties then know this could end at any second so the avoidant type feels relaxed enough to stay.
Horribly I read that people with anxious attachment often form long but unhappy relationships with avoidant attachment types because anxiety triggers an instinct to cling to the mate and an urge to go to the mate for reassurance immediately when they feel anxious. Even if their mate is the one that causes the anxiety! I feel this still occasionally almost four months after leaving my ex. “Feeling anxious=see ex=feel good” is written into my hard drive somewhere. Even if it’s see ex to give out to him it’s still somehow an impulse.
Anxiety also releases chemicals that also make it more difficult to think rationally and long term. (Think of stock market panic from intelligent highly educated adults experienced in their job making terrible decisions in a crisis.) Making the right decision in this situation is fighting our psychology and our biology.
The challenge it seems to me may be also about finding new solutions to anxiety at that moment when it arises, right then , that very second, other than embracing the man. To build a new habit/impulse.
But when we know that a sure way to feel instant relief is to get affection from this creature and nothing else that makes us feel calm then we are choosing anxiety and pain for an indefinite period over instant calm/pleasure and periodic anxiety. Difficult choices if those are the only ones we think that we have.
What can we do in that moment that would give us relief from whatever anxiety is causing us to look for affection from these men? I guess I’m looking for an on the spot meditation/ anxiety relief. Any ideas?
Into touch/
It is so interesting what you say, and believe you me,attachment styles/reactive attachment disorder was the first port of call I went to when I got caught up in analysing my ex’s behaviour. I had spent years looking at my familial relationships through this perpective too! As a result I began analysing mine as well,phew….lot of analysing going on.
In some ways I had to face up to the fact that looking to provide reasons why EUM’s behave the way they do is ultimately a waste of my time and a distraction from getting on with my life.
Sure it’s great to understand what’s happening so you can stop repeating it but for me the most important factor was believing I was worth more. I began to think, then know, that I was capable of distancing myself from the anxiety, drama fix.
I think it might be counter-productive to think that these responses are wired into ‘your hard-drive’.
It’s almost like filling your boots with cement before you go for a jog.
I get your question about not responding ‘in the moment’…it isn’t easy but again we have self control as adult intelligent women. We can analyse our impulses to death( I did) or we can see them for what they are and choose another behaviour.
It is for me about filling the moment with something else, a more productive action, playing some music,reminding myself of the consequences of going back,talking it through with someone.
You ask for a ready ‘fix’ and although there isn’t one cure for all ills, there is in my opinion a very good starting block to find yourself on..You need to believe that you come first, stop handing the power over to these guys. You control you.
I agree Lynda. I’ve changed a lot of things in my life for the better. Eating habits, poor behavior, totally mind changing ways of thinking about things etc… It is a choice to stop being with these EU types and stop being one yourself. For me it really all boiled down to the destructive need for instant gratification no matter if it damaged me in the long run. This is a learned behavior and it can become unlearned. Like realizing that someone is using you for an ego boost, its probably been done many times to me but I didnt recognize it until the last AC. I didnt recognize a lot of things til him, and then I started reading BR, what a life changer it has been. I am the happiest I have ever been. And not just surface happy either, I am truly happy in my soul with the feeling that nothing can change it.
Yeah, SM, I get you on the need for instant gratification, for me as a Florence it was feedback that I seemed to be needed.. and we know how twisted that can turn out.
For me it’s been
facing up to the fact that I am enough for me, for the moment.
I actually think I may have become allergic to turning into a pretzel for anyone these days. Friends, family… I’m starting to regularly ask ‘what does this mean for me’ and am evaluating lots of my relationships at the moment. The EUM will fade, is fading , despite the recent flurry of drama from him.
In terms of ‘trying to understand why EUMs act the way they do’…
I have been EUW and have been messed around by EUMs.
When I was at the height of my emotional unavailability (on account of childhood trauma, alcohol and drug related problems etc.)- I can safely say that I was a nightmare to deal with. All my actions were based on one thing and one thing only: pure selfishness. Not that it was ever my intent to hurt anyone-I just never thought that hard about anyone else because I lived on ‘Planet Me’. I never actually felt anything to be *wrong* with any of the people I have hurt- it was never about them. I just preferred being anesthetized to my inner turmoil too much give a damn about how they felt about my systematic self-destruction.
Now I am years older I look back at that period of my life with great regret. Luckily, I have made amends with anyone burnt by me during that period out of genuine remorse- I keep my distance from the ex-lovers out of respect. I want them to find happiness.
I have also been severely damaged by EUMs. The last one in particular.
I’m working hard with a therapist in an attempt to finally resolve my issues. I want to become a suitable partner for an emotionally available man and am gradually emerging from emotional unavailability.
When I get carried away with trying to analyse ‘why he ( THE exEUM) did what he did’ I take myself back to that period -‘Planet Me’ times and look at their behavior from that perceptive.
People can be rendered emotionally unavailable by innumerable factors and each case manifests itself in a variety of ways. However, in my view- it all amounts to the same thing: ‘Planet Me’. It really is that simple.
Maybe they (like me) might one day gain enough insight to feel sorry for their actions- desire and work for change. Some never do unfortunately.
Hi there Intotouch. I hear you about the anxiety. I experienced ruminations that flipped me back into situations in my memory like the break up moment, the hit in the stomach feeling as what they have just said dawns on you….anyway what I have found helpful is to use the EFT tapping technique. I guess its not for everyone, but I can tell you my body completely responded to this technique and the anxiety has got smaller and smaller. You become your own best friend and reliable security blanket. So you can try that? There are quite a few free you tube videos explaining it. One appears in a google search for Faster EFT by Robert G Smith about 9.22 minutes long. Look for others too that give a more detailed explanation. Once you are familiar with the technique its very handy and an instant tool. Oddly, sometimes I get flash backs when I am driving and you can even do it then! We certainly need a few survival tools at the ready while the bigger picture of sustained recovery and self-esteem takes hold permanently. Good luck. You can do it.
Thanks for mentioning the attachment styles/disorders Intotouch.
I did some reading up on that in the past year or so and it answered a lot of questions for me. My upbringing conditioned me to run back to the source of my abuse. A trait I carried too long into adulthood. I think the term is repetition compulsion i.e. this time you think you can win their love. Also, it’s all you ever knew, you didn’t know what they were doing was not, in fact, love. But finally, this past experience forced me to learn a lot and change a lot and I see it paying off. I would have been one of those women gushing, fantasizing, over-reacting over a freaking text if I did not have this site and done the work I needed to. I enjoyed ignoring his lame, nonchalant efforts!
The guy I was seeing 6 months ago casually (we were friends for a little while before we became romantic) is doing this exact thing to another girl. She is this young little nightclub girl who likes to party and dresses the part. She is such a far cry from what he usually goes for. All his ex girlfriends were girl next door types with some substance. He has been on and off with her over the past 6 months. I went NC as soon as he pulled the “hot/cold” thing on me twice 6 months ago. I still have limited contact due to mutual friends and he has made lame attempts to contact me and has tried to flaunt other girls in front of me, not just this club girl. She just is the one that always keeps popping up. She appears to be a fallback girl. Whenever I am around them, which has only been twice, he has totally ignored her and tried to talk with me. He has even posted songs he wrote about me on FB and his band’s website..he is a musician and in band with three mutual friends whom he also happens to live with. The last song was just a couple weeks ago. I called it the “Ode to NC” (even though that is not the actual name of the song) because the lyrics were as follows: “It seems the silence is treating you well, wish I could say the same, it’s not that I’m standing still, but there’s something missing”…hahaha. Proof that NC drives them insane. This is the most recent song (3 weeks old). Its 6 months later and he is writing this stuff still. He is so blatantly obvious about these songs being about our situation. It is so lame. I almost feel bad for this girl because he clearly is not looking at her seriously. Although, the way she presents herself is such that it does not seem like she wants to be taken seriously, or she just does not understand what guys tend to take seriously (she is 10 years younger than us). She clearly does not like me based on how she is around me, however, I do not blame her. He hasn’t acted like someone who is into her when I’m around and usually ignores her and tries to talk with me and I am sure she knows these songs he writes are not about her. I’m glad I got out before things got serious with this clown.
Hi peeps,
so my ex-EUM said, “Merry X-mas” on my FB page (after x-mas was over) a couple of weeks ago after NC for about 4 months. I’m barely ever on FB; I deactivate it & am on maybe once a month. I stopped talking to him, but really? he stopped talking to me. So I took the bait & had a quick FB convo with him. Then I saw this post. Yep, we are mutually using each other as a confidence boost. This is sad & pathetic to me. But the good news is that it was his birthday yesterday & for the first time in 3 years I did not contact him and fall all over myself to wish him a happy birthday. I know you all understand it is a small victory , but a victory nonetheless. This post solidifies my decision not to wish him a happy birthday as that would send a message that “he’s great!”, and I’m just around to be a confidence hit.
PS> I’ve been taking the day to read back through Natalie’s recent posts & I realize that in that little convo I had with the ex-EUM that we were BOTH “future faking” each other!
Even though I didn’t realize it WHILE I was having the convo, I am present to it now. I will count that as a victory as well in recognizing it AT ALL! YAY!!!!!
“If you return their contact, profess your feelings, accept their apology even if you’re not ready to or don’t think they’re sincere, or even take them back, it’s a confidence boost – they feel safe in preserving the image they have of themselves. Even though they’re going to be in trouble with you again, in their eyes, it’s only for a ‘recent misunderstanding’ as opposed to issues stretching back in your relationship because they perceive you as having ‘forgiven’ them”
I know this is said a lot, but damn if it isn’t SPOT ON Natalie (no surprise there though!) of the incident before I officially stuck to NC (I think I hit a month today?) I professed my interest in NC to him, he finally obliged. Then he contacted me, I took the bait, got burned, stopped contacting. I took the bait ONCE again, responding to his “hey how are you, I’m sorry about what happened (fill in lame, lie filled excuse here), oh sorry I’ll leave you alone you are probably with someone (such a manipulating statement, also his attempt to take responsibility of my pain off of himself).” I took the bait hook line and sinker. He came over, and I bent over backwards, agreeing not to argue (those were his terms to come over) as I was in so much pain over his absence at that time. By the end of our “visit” he had reassured himself of the following, thanks to my actions. 1) I still desired and loved him. 2) He could move on without guilt. (He told me, “oh you don’t want to get involved with me, I’m so messed up.”) What a cop out, we were ALREADY involved buddy and you were messed up then too! And as I’m hearing this, my alarm bell is on HIGH, but I let him get away with it. He said more…”we’re friends now, no the new girl doesn’t matter to me, or I wouldn’t be here…” Neither statements true. Basically he came over to have a big parade in his own honor!!! So….by the time later that night, when my fallback girl tendencies took over, guess what? He didn’t want to talk to me, he didn’t want to see me. He hung up on me. THE END. MY END.
It kills me now to think that I only reassured him, and I’m still grieving and his little last stunt left him with just enough boost to move on thinking he made good with me, and then I acted like the needy girl who won’t go away. So he has justification to have treated me so. Ok self-esteem, time for some POSITIVE self talk and action! Boy do you need it!!!
NCC, don`t beat yourself over it. You deserve to forgive yourself for making a mistake and falling for his manipulation, and you are fixing it by doing NC. It`s a lesson in the scheme of things. I`ve been there too so understand the feeling, but we really do need to be kind to ourselves first. Take care.
Hi NCC
You gave him ‘one bite of the apple’. He will never get another. Nothing more. They only” seem” to benefit from our kindness. We project and treat them the way we would like to be treated i.e. the way ‘healthy’ people treat one another. He is on a lower evolutionary scale then you, he would be incapable of extending kindness to another human being. It is not in their DNA. At least that is what I tell myself and it seems to help put it in perspective. It
just takes time, and fortunately, that is not in short supply.
*slightly off topic, I just needed a safe place to vent as opposed to doing something stupid*
My douche of an ex stood up in front of all our mutual friends and said he was leaving because I was coming in a while and seeing as he hadn’t seen me since the break up “anything could happen”.
1. I am not the girl who shouts at people in public
2. I was raised right so if I did see him (despite my no contact) I would have been polite.
3. I wasn’t even going to that event, he just had a rumour and went with it
4.could he not have made an excuse and left instead of making a scene that took our break up from being something our friends are aware of to being something they have to actively deal with.
5. It is not a coincidence that he hasn’t seen me since the break up but I don’t feel the need to stand up in public and make announcements about not wanting to see him.
He is such a coward. If I ever saw him somewhere he would be weird despite everyone around us until I made the effort to be super nice and reassure him that all is well. ERM hello, you treated me badly, why is it that you are acting like a child.
Hi Jane, I was reading some earlier posts about folks loving drama and your ex is not an exception; he should be on stage. Sounds as if he wanted to amp the drama quotient with your friends by stirring the pot. “Ooo, anything could happen.”
Umm, could he be worried *he* might be the one to lose it in your presence?
Disregard the drama ~ you know that you would act with grace and dignity and that’s the important part, right? The anything turned out to be nothing (Curtains close).
Wow how ridiculous of him. I’m sure he only made himself seem very foolish for that. Sickening. Sounds like my ex, in terms of needing to feel like someone is so concerned and focused on them, even when they have been given ZERO indication of that being the case smh. My ex would send me messages assuming I knew things about his life, when I hadn’t spoken to him for months and when I didn’t know he would say “Well it was on Facebook”….excuse me?? As if I were tuned into his FB..which was what he expected, that I was glued to it. Or once he sent me some msg and I said we couldn’t be friends or something and he responded with “I know it’s always hard to get over your first love”…UM what???? You were NOT my first love and that is NOT why we can’t be friends…you are an asshole, that’s why! Or worse yet, when he tried to ask me for a 3some closer to when we first broke up, withg his EX WIFE no less…and I said no and he retorted that “She still wants me back too, even more than you do yet she doesn’t have a problem with it”. WOWW! Really??!
Yepss…these ACs are completely self-absorbed and truly think your world revolves around them, even when you have shown no sign of that. When you think about such arrogance, keeping up NC is easier-if only so as not to give these narcissistic jerks the satisfaction of feeling like your sun rises and sets around them.
Well now, doesn’t that just make you glad that one’s out of your life?
Talk about narcissism – all about him, him, him.
NC NC NC NC NC NC and be sure when mutual friends mention him, to laugh a little and say, ‘oh what garbage’ and then CHANGE THE SUBJECT.
A nice change of subject could be: Fabulous You and All The Fun You Having and Really Enjoying Life Again Now That You’re Free …
As I read this post, I thought about my past relationships. I totally agree that men play the friend card to make themselves feel better. When I was younger, it used to pain me to think about I will never talk to this person again. Now, it does not pain me to accept that I will never speak to this person again, it pains me to accept that I keep choosing the wrong type of man, I have wasted many years with this behavior. However, this time, I feel so much stronger and content. I am not seeing anyone at all. I have cut off all contact from men. Most of these men I would just chat up just to past the time away. I guess that was a form of validation. I dont want anybody propping me up. I dont need that anymore. Most importantly, I am concentrating on controlling my thoughts, learning to think more positively about me, others and life in general. This is my most important goal.
After reading some of the posts on this site, some of these women are really and I mean really trying to improve their lives with therapy, self-help books, hobbies, etc and still keep experiencing the same type of problems. It really saddens me to watch myself and others suffer with this type of BS. And it really is BS, when you really think about some of the stories.
On the other hand, you have some women who seem to be so lucky in love and life.
For example, in the states the media is making a really big deal over the birth of Beyonces first baby. Her husband paid 1.3 million dollars to rent a complete ward of a hospital to protect his wife and child from the media. Now, this woman is successful in her own right, so I guess that is very attractive to a man. But in addition to her own success, but to also have man who take such measures for her and their new baby. I mean wow! I could not help but wonder what is would be like to walk in her shoes for one day.
I am certainly not looking anymore, but I still would love to be a part of a couple, but I just can not invest anymore more mental and physical energy into it. Every now and then, a thought would creep in mind that says “no man is going to come knocking on your door, you need to do something”. Now, I just recognize that as the voice of desperation trying sneak in and immediately shut the door on that thought.
Back to the question….what is the difference between the women on this site who are really trying to improve their lives with no luck and women like Beyonce who seem to have hit the jackpot in life..
That’s so funny because I was saying to my sister earlier that Jay-Z worships the ground Beyonce walks on and you can tell. I also have an aunt who is a real life example of a woman with a husband who loves her endlessly and is dedicated to her; and after 14 years of marriage they STILL go on dates and he brings her flowers and does all the stuff a man does when he is courting a woman. Their love is palpable.
I have hope and believe I will get that but some women do seem to be fortunate, in that they didn’t have to kiss tens of EUMs and ACs to find the one.
I too have decided that I am not going to go searching for any man but focus on me and hope I attract the circumstances to meet a good man. I do want to be a part of a couple too but have no more energy for the “just kidding moment” and deflation of realizing he is an EUM or AC in disguise.
Aboutme…I read your post with great interest. I think of celebrities as very hard-working people with talent, beauty, marketability, connections, etc. who have sacrificed “normal” lives to be entertainers. Yes, I read about Jay-Z’s renting the hospital floor, but honestly, I believe he did it more for privacy than love for Beyonce. And because he can financially.
Did you also read about the song he wrote for the new baby that reveals that Bey had a miscarriage before this baby? I’m lucky to have never had that heartbreak.
There appears to be incredible pressure and demands along with celebrities’ success and many more “unlucky” stars have succumbed (Amy Winehouse and Heath Ledger come to mind) to the lifestyle. On a smaller scale, I can look around my small town & pinpoint those with more money, better looks, stronger relationships but it’s a choice not to…there will always be “luckier” people. It’s a perspective, really, for me to look at MY life and be appreciative of the good things I have, as trite as that sounds.
I sense the conflict in your posts. You seem to want to be in a relationship but “have cut off all contact with men.” Keep yourself centered; maybe you’re not looking for a relationship right now but stay open to one. Most of all, embrace your new-found strength and contentment. We might not read about it in People magazine, but it’s still a spectacular achievement.
I read something somewhere – maybe here! – that we should never compare our insides with someone else’s outsides. I think reading about celebrity fairy tales is along the same lines.
I had a man in my life who thought that as long as he provided all that money could buy, we were doing okay. While material things sure were nice, he was one of the most distant, emotionally remote people I’ve ever known. Not an AC; he was fundamentally a very good person. Just extremely disconnected with emotion.
Natalie, I really need to read about some more success stories about women, who put the work in and have really turned their lives around.
I often think about you and how you turned your life around without the support of your mother, which is really remarkable. I also recall reading about a story on this blog about one woman success story. But it just seems like these type of success stories are far and few in between.
I could say that success and happiness is not defined by having a man in your life and I do believe that. But at some point, I think that most people want a partner to share this journey with. So yes I understand that you dont need a man to be happy…. but that special partner can make this journey just a little bit easier.
aboutme
I’ve turned it round.
Ove a 20 year period (I’m 47 this month) I’ve seen a psychiatrist, four counsellors, tried three churches, got married, divorced, abusive man, playa man, five years of celibacy (and counting) and I am now very happy, peaceful and content with no man. (Though I have recently met one I like. I’m too scared to find out how old he is in case he’s 25).
It’s not over until they’re throwing the earth on your coffin.
Grace, thank you for your comments. I needed to be reminded that it is not over until they are throwing dirt over your coffin. At 45 and having to accept that I will never have children and have never been married, it is a big pill to swallow.
I am the friend in my circle, that people call when they want to feel better about themselves. They get a chance to say, “at least I married, even if it is a bad one, its still better than the BS that Aboutme is going through”. Now, that I realize that, I dont discuss my issues with my friends any longer. If I cant work it out, I will seek a therapist. I wont be that girl any longer. Funny, life is giving me situations to work my issues out not only with men but with girlfriends. Which is a lot easier than dealing with men….Interesting
As far as Beyonce is concerned, I know that I am just on the outside looking in, but from this view, it really does look pretty good. I am sure that she and other people like her have their concerns and problems but I guess that the reason she is able to overcome or rise above them, is because she is obviously doing something different. Her thinking has to be different. Yes, there will always be people more successful, and I can accept that. but I am interested in learning what is the key to success for people like Beyonce. Nobody escapes this life without experiencing a few bumps along the way. But how is that some people continue to move forward and accomplish amazing things in their career and personal life even while experiencing difficulties and other just get stuck doing the same thing awful things for many many years. Even after realizing their problem, seeking help, prayers, etc and still remain stuck. The only answer that I can come up with is, it has to be a function of a negative mind. i dont believe that it is the fate for some people, my christian values wont allow me to think like that….Just really thinking about these issues from a different level. Please share your thoughts.
Yes, I am content, I do believe that I am open to meeting a man, just not right now. At the end of my day, I examine some of the thoughts that i had throughout the day, and I am still fighting negative thoughts. So, no not right now, I believe that it is best not to date right now.
NML, I am sorry if I am off topic, but after a while, a lot of these stories sound the same. You can almost predict the outcome. Same story, different details and people but nonetheless, same BS. It is a forum to discuss these types of issues and I have learned a lot. But women over 45 share your success stories of transformation….I think that we all could benefit from your successes also.
I’ll be writing about this subject but I wanted to say a couple of things:
I don’t believe in worshipping false idols. I like Beyonce and own all of her albums but celebrities present what they feel like presenting and live under different circumstances, rules etc. I don’t envy her her life or what she has with Jay-Z – there’s plenty of normal, non celeb people who are happy. I’m a big Jay-Z fan but it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to also spot some parallels between him and her father…
I also don’t think it’s a big deal about the ward. They’re rich! They could probably rent out the entire hospital if they felt like it!
Too many of us normal folk get dazzled by these big gestures – it’s unrealistic.
I have nothing against celebrities – quite the opposite – but I just don’t take *that* level of interest in their lives and I don’t think that they are representations of what we must aspire to. In fact I had this conversation with friends last night – there are many famous people I like but I’m not a worshipper and when asked a few months ago by a magazine about which celebs inspire my style, my mind went blank.
As for the success stories – there are plenty of readers who are now happy and are off living their lives. Some pop in to comment, most go and get on with their lives. That’s not to say that all readers who comment are unhappy – there are some amazing people who share their growth here every day.
I constantly see women over forty, fifty and sixty find love, get happy, do what they want with their lives. It’s not unnatural to have pessimistic outlooks periodically but the truth is that in a world full of near 7 billion people, where people of all ages no matter their background find happiness and love, just like people of all ages *don’t*, you are only bullshitting yourself by basically saying that women over 45 are essentially like the walking dead. That is fundamentally untrue especially then when you get a woman in her 20s or 30s saying the same thing.
So who are all of these people having relationships? Aliens?
Your frustrations are real but your perception of the universe and what your life can be from here on in, is unrealistic. Sometimes we need to think that life is a heap of shite before we start to appreciate the life we have and own ourselves.
I should add – one family member was in exactly the same situation as you. She was regarded as one of the most beautiful women in her town and she thought (along with everyone else) that she’d have settled and had kids. Instead it was one Mr Unavailable after another. Thankfully as she heads into her 50s, she may be childless but she is infinitely happier than she’s been for many years with the guy she met in her mid 40s when she thought she’d be an old maid – she appreciates this. She would have loved kids and it devastated her that she didn’t, but she stopped focusing on it and has a couple of lovely step kids now.
Oh and I’m not sure how it got into this subject but as it’s spiralling, if this subject can be saved for when it’s written about so that comments go back to being completely on topic please.
Just a v quick rejoinder: Here’s how interested I am in what celebrities are doing: Who is Jay-Z? Never heard of him – ha! Seriously.
I apologize, did not mean to take the discussion off subject. i guess, I was just expressing random thoughts. At no point was I attempting to offend the women on this blog.
Aboutme, I think you need to get to the root of why you feel the way you do. Speaking personally, I turned 30 recently and got it into my head that it was all over for me and I’d never find anyone. Obviously, this is patently ridiculous (and shout out to Grace for calling me out on it – still makes me giggle!). I couldn’t shake it, so I had to start thinking about WHY I felt that way. I’m surrounded by examples of people my age and twenty/thirty years older finding love so it’s not like I didn’t have any external evidence that is DOES happen. What it came down to for me was some comments my mother had made when I was in my twenties about women who were getting married later in life. She didn’t say any of it to be nasty, she was just sort of stuck in 1954 when it comes to these matters. Recently, I brought it up to her and she said, “I said that?! What a stupid thing to say.” If you’re carrying around a belief that’s making you miserable, it’s more than worth it to get to the bottom of it.
As far as success stories go, I truly believe that success takes time and effort. I’m not unhappy by any stretch of the imagination, but I’m still a work in progress. Once, for lack of a better term, I 100% have my sh*t together, then I can put myself out there to find a relationship. I have a good friend that had even worse dating habits than I did, and she took the time out, addressed her issues and is marrying a wonderful man this spring. It absolutely can happen, but there are no shortcuts. Hope this helps!
Natasha, You make an interesting point, I too have a mother who planted outdated thoughts in my head. This is something that I need to examine.
Aha! In my case, my mother is very wise, but she’s also human and being human sometimes means talking out of one’s ass on occasion. Our mothers are from a whole different generation and, yes, things were different in “Their Day”. 😉 The thing to remember here is you KNOW it’s an outdated way of thinking!
grace is right (as usual! lol!):
keep moving and facing down this stuff til the clock stops.
if everyone has read closely what Natalie writes, what it is going to take is:
-interrupting your patterns (once you’ve identified them)
-challenging negative self talk (the voices inside can be LOUD & persuasive)
-NC and riding out the withdrawal
-accepting that it will be uncomfortable to change your unhealthy love habits
Is THIS the “topline data”, Natalie? I really love that…I am constantly trying to drown myself in the detail…..
aboutme,
I’ve had my share of all kinds of bad relationships, but I refuse to believe that I’m doomed to repeat my old relationship patterns the rest of my life. I’ve spent the entire last year getting over heartbreak, purging my life of people and beliefs that don’t benefit me, and strengthening my relationship with both myself and my higher power. I’ve gotten a lot happier with my life and myself and I’m now emotionally healthier than I’ve ever been.
Just a few months ago, the universe conspired to put a decent guy into my life and its going really well so far. I do not for a minute think that this would have have happened had I not put in an enormous amount of time, effort, and plain hard work into addressing my old relationship habits and really learning to love and accept myself unconditionally.
Wishing you the best on your journey.
aboutme,
I have turned it around. I was on this site much more last year so many long time readers knew my story. Narcissist, cheating father, self consumed mother, long term marriage that looked more like partners than love, lost a child to cancer (threw me WAY into EU myself for a long time as I became very afraid of loss, I used some men badly myself during this time), and then the returning college boyfriend now MM who put me through the ringer. This time last year I was so depressed I could hardly get out of bed. So, like Grace, back into therapy and read this blog several times a day. Both Natalie’s post and everyone’s responses, over and over. I found out I am not the only one going through this. So I kept reading and going to therapy, realized my MM was the reincarnation of my father, down to his profession, and once you identify it, you can fix it. I still have my issues but now I own them. And I am in a great 5 month relationship right now with a man who loves me and I love him. Will it last? Maybe, but maybe not. Will I survive it if it doesn’t? Hell yes! Will I ever accept AC or EUM behavior again? Hell NO! Why? Because I recognize it now, as simple as that! We are healed when we 1) recognize the hot stove 2) know beyond a shadow of a doubt it will burn us and 3) we run from it. Period. You can’t get burned if you don’t touch it. Keep reading and fixing yourself. It just sort of sinks in over time. But you must make up your mind that you WANT to be healed, and I think that is the difference. Like quitting smoking or losing weight, only YOU can make that decision. Yes, it can and does happen, and it will for you too, if YOU decide it will!!
This post could of been written for me. I was the emotional/financial airbag for my returning childhood sweetheart ex. His fiancee kicked him out so he tracked me down for some serious ego stroking. I fell for it and whilst using me he was also lining up another girl whom he also future faked and fast forwarded. Needless to say the story did not end well. I found out, kicked him out and he moved in with her and within 7 months had married her. Be careful what you wish for springs to mind. It has taken me almost a year to feel happy in my own skin again and i can honestly say that i wouldn’t take him back if his A**hole was lined with diamonds. I may be alone but i am not lonely and everything happens for a reason. Karma will happen eventually and the next time he does this i won’t be involved.
I’ve been separated from my common-law assclown for 6 months. I’m pretty certain he was screwing around with his “now girlfriend” before I joined him. He was moved out of province here in Canada for a job promotion in Feb. of 2010. My daughter and I arrived at the end of June. He was cold distant, drunk all the time and never home. Here I was in the beautiful new home we bought without a husband, missing in action, so to speak. Gone for many nights, or arriving very late and completely loaded. I put 2 and 2 together. So…my daughter and I drove home – back to where we had lived for many years. Moved in with my mother (we’re still there 6 months later) and did the NC thing unless it had to do with finances. Well, this past weekend I get a late night call from him, telling me that he’s sorry, he can’t live like this anymore, he wants his family back, we were meant to be. He then proceeds to tell me that he has left his girlfriend, that he never loved her and that it was all about the sex and could I please hop on a plane and come back to him and fix this whole thing. I listened to him rant on and on. He continued to call me through the night, continuing to profess hisso called “undying love” for me. And this continued on into Saturday. He was drinking the whole time, I might add. All of a sudden Saturday evening the calls just stop. I don’t hear from him on Monday. Tuesday I get a frigging text saying “sorry for all that, its hard enough with whats going on right now”. I couldn’t believe it. So I call him and lace into him. I find out that he had just gotten int a fight with the new girlfriend and that she had come over to the house Saturday night (when the calls stopped) to make sure he was OK. Jerk! He didn’t even have the decency to call me and apologize for the drunk dialing and cheap talk. I get a lousy text the following day instead. I made sure to tell him what I thought of him.
I really believe this was the icing on the cake for me. For years, I have felt sorry for this emotionally screwed up man, who came from such a f’d up family. but enough is enough. I have put up with years of alcoholic verbal abuse and infidelity (which I forgave several times). I thin my heart has finally hardened to him and for once I can say, I feel bad for me, not you.
What will these AC’s do once they are in their twilight years? Harrass the living daylights out of every female in their NH/Village? he he. Yuck. If I hadn’t found this site I’d still be giving into my AC’s behaviour, still accepting crumbs, still making excuses. Now thankfully I can see the behaviour is all ego driven, it’s not about me, it’s all about HIM. I moved away to a different state and he magically decided to get a job here… only for me to allow him to reel me back in… only for me to tell him to eff off as the behaviour started up again…. He then gloats to me weeks later he’s ‘found a new girl he wants to settle down with’ . On a dating site mind you. I suspect she was probably there all along. Life is not a ‘sitcom’ This is not “My Name is Earl’…where you are on some mission to ‘undo your wrongs of the past for your ego’ pfft. .I do not want to hear you are “sorry, lonely, bored blah blah blah’ Door Shut. Funny thing is I have tried everything from being nice wishing him well, to telling him to shove it, to being indifferent..to calling him out on his behaviour…. nothing works and I suspect they thrive on the abuse/drama. He often used to say to me anyway that it would be awesome to be married but live in seperate houses….ugh…. Gross. This is also a ‘man’ that used to boast when out “Show me a hot girl, and I’ll show you a guy that’s tired of f***ing her”.
Northern girl, is there any reason why you can not change your phone number and stop his contact forever? Seriously, he’s not bothered about messing with your head and your life. You have to be bothered! He can not do these mind games if he can not get to you!
Ah yeah , the sorrow of the Sorbet relationship or that of the side dish.
Sorbet is what they used to serve in between courses to cleanse the palate in posh places.
Usually you are the last to know you are that kind of dish.
Empowerment happens when you can suss out the menu reader early own and give him a taste of his own medecine.
Natalie, thank you so much for sharing your wisdom with the world. I’m grateful to a friend who tipped me off to this blog as I have never read something that is so insightful, accurate and inspiring. It is comforting (I suppose) to read something that resonates so well. This post is especially timely for me because I’ve been out of a 5 year toxic relationship now for just over a year. However, he has contacted me several times since, claiming he wants me back, blah blah, but I didn’t feel he was truly sincere; beyond a few emails and conversations he didn’t put in the effort or take the actions that were necessary to make reconciliation viable. I now realize exactly what he was doing: feeling guilty and wanting me to absolve him of his guilt and discomfort. His carefully manicured image of himself had a big crack in it because I thrust a mirror onto his truth and he probably feared others would see it too. Most recently he emailed me before Christmas, probably because as you say, he felt uncomfortable knowing he had hurt me and because he feels that “I hate him” – he NEEDS to be liked, to believe that he’s a good person and needed his conscience soothed. I was briefly pulled back into the vortex of anger, sadness and even ‘missing the good times’, but I’m SO GLAD that I didn’t give in as that would have been adding insult to injury. It’s been tough but I needed – and need – to be tougher. We all do.
Pathetically, I kept hoping over the past year that he would soon realize how important I was to him and ‘do the right thing’ but what I know now is that, like any other addict, the ‘drug’ is the most important thing. (He is an undiagnosed sex addict who lied/cheated on me numerous times/ways throughout our relationship – I know this because I found out later it runs in the family). He just wants to continue to avoid reality, self-soothe and take the ‘easy road’ by avoiding the ‘work’ of self-improvement. In this case, I know he has a problem that’s beyond just bad behaviour – and what made it so hard to believe was that he seems so nice, ‘normal’ and intelligent from the outside. But the advice still applies nonetheless.
Ladies, a man who truly loves you will hopefully not hurt you to begin with, but will DO WHATEVER IT TAKES to make it right, make it up to you and change. And the bar for making it up to you has to be set high…
ixnay….i about fell off my chair with the pie comment. twisted. twisted. twisted. you are in despair & he is eating pie. here’s to a happy new year – don’t take his calls – you don’t care about his pie!
You, my dear – are a GENIUS !
i swear you are watching my life. these emails are popping up just as related events are happening, with the last guy i dated (who is now NC) and my ex who’s decided that we should give it another go…after he cheated on me. i can’t thank you enough. your blog keeps me right in the middle of reality as i tend to romanticize stuff and get lost in the clouds, which has gotten me into all of this trouble in the first place. carry on! 🙂
Bee, my husband is a narcissist, and if you read up on these people you are not contacted for months on end or years and then all of a sudden they are looking for their ‘narcissitic supply’ from you, just as Nathalie said, they want an ego boost to stroke their vragile screwed up personalities. Ane this is what he did to me. I rarely hear from him unless its about financial matters regarding the separation. When he calledme so late, I naively thought something was wrong and answered his call that late evening. My mistake was I listened to all his bull shit. Only to be ignored again the next day when he made up with his girlfriend. I can guarantee you I will never be the fool again. I have decided I will not take his calls under any circumstances from now on. I ‘ve had it.
Northern Girl,
I hear you about narcissists, I really do..but as I said to you, if you don’t want to hear from someone again AND you are serious about cutting off the drama forever YOU change your number. You ask your legal advisor to advice them that any contact with you about a separation is through them….beleive you me YOU only get these bullshit calls if you allow it. Ask yourself WHY you allow it and when you know the answer then take some action to close the door instead of moaning about him and his narcissistic personality.
I’ve been reading this blog for months, and sending all my drama-addicted friends to read it too. Thank you Natalie. I only wish I found it earlier! Some of my past attempts at relationships make so much sense in retrospect, in light of all this information.
This song made me think of this blog (and it’s a gorgeous cover, which helps). To me, it kind of encapsulates the way you feel about an EU AC when you finally move on. This is what healing feels like to me. Acknowledging that you’ve been treated poorly, but no longer attaching any emotions or importance to those past facts. “Now you’re just somebody that I used to know” is something I could say to each and every one of my past AC’s if I ever had to speak to any of them again. It feels really good. 🙂 Hang in there, ladies (and gents)! We are all wired to heal, if we just follow good advice and let the healing happen.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d9NF2edxy-M
MMB ~ Thanks for sharing. LOVED the song!
I think MM/AC is sniffing around, looking for his confidence boost from me. Got a text today. “Sorry to bother you”-LOL YEAH RIGHT. This guy NEVER felt bad about making me cry or making me feel terrible or whenever I was hurt or devastated by his actions, but now he’s sorry to bother me. Then he went on asking about a package that’s supposed to arrive for him (I bought him something before Christmas but due to delays it still hasn’t gotten shipped and frankly I don’t give a frick about it now and I can’t be arsed to find out what’s going on with it). He needed to know when it was arriving so he could “get it without being seen.” (from his wife).
Either he’s a( sniffing around and trying to see if I’m truly NC or if I can be roused back into contact with him or b( he really is worried about the package arising suspicion for his wife (it’s not like it’s addressed to me or anything). EITHER option makes him out to be a selfish ASSHOLE so I don’t know WHY I would ever respond. I’m not giving up my NC for something THAT stupid. The old me would have either a( had a disproportionate response that this meant he really wanted contact with me or b( felt bad for him and sent him all the information on the package I could find so I didn’t make his life hard because it’s the “nice” thing to do.
What a selfish jackass these men are. I can’t believe I ever thought I loved him and wanted him in my life. Each day I’m NC (no texting, no looking at his online profiles, NOTHING) I give myself a big purple heart on my calendar so I can SEE the progress I’ve made. Some days its a lot harder to earn those purple hearts than others, but damn it, I’m PROUD of my purple hearts. I never could have done it without this site.
I’m 48, he’s 48, both divorced, he 2 adult children, me, 2 preteens, been dating since March, 2011. I iniated the concersation, he agreed, relationship went strong from day one, no sex, celibacy rule. I have not visited his apartment. I live with mom. He’s workng, I’m inbetween, nothing stable. Showered with outings, dinners, compliments, exploded during summer about ex-wife. I did Dr. Phil, he appeared to lose all thosee feelings for ex. Blow-out these last 3 months, gets upset, when I am not available. However, I feel he is just not ready. Wanted to go on a date, this week, I didn’t commit, believe that he needs to know what it feels like, when I want to do things and he doesn’t. Didn’t buy XMAS or we didn’t talk. Reports he had XMAs alone, son visited. He called, his self, SELFISH, maybe he’s noticing, I am not much into him anymore. No one has ever been this elusive.
Aw sorry, Too old to be confused…sounds like you’ve had a year of run around but this guy sounds like a EUM to me. Some of the actions and withdrawing from social activities you describe make it sound like he has Aspergers?
Think about yourself and your kids, New Year, new start with someone who reciprocates your feeling and wants. This guy is way too elusive, don’t waste any more time fathoming his motives, think about what’s best for you as a priority asap.
Toooldto be confused,
Do you really need this angst? If you are not into him then cease bothering and move on.
I cannot tell if my ex is using me as a confidence booster, or backup plan. When we first broke up, about 6 months ago (*he pursued me for almost a year and then we dated for a year), he wanted to continue to talk and be friends. After reading multiple posts on Baggage Reclaim I said no to this and told him if to not contact me again unless he decided he wanted to get back together. Since that time he gets in contact about every 3-5 weeks. It started out that he wanted to be friends text, I refused, then he “HAD” to see me, but he wanted to take things slow, I refused. He upped his desires each time he called. I finally had enough and told him I was done with the relationship- he sent me a long saga of a text saying he would wait for me and I was the “love of his life”. I never responded. The holidays go by, I don’t hear anything and then out of the blue he calls (I don’t respond) and he wants to take me to lunch. I say no but I meet with him for 10 minutes while running a word errand, he proclaims his love and then tells me he even wants to come to counseling with me. He shows up at my counselor (who I began seeing after our breakup) that day and tells her all the same things. In my mind I think, why would a guy go through all this trouble if I was just a backup plan? But at the same time, I feel like if I had never stood up for myself in the first place, he would still be using me to this day with the “friend card”. Thoughts?
Dazed, I think you may very well be right to cut him off. The fact that he tried to worm in with “friends” and is now claiming he MUST HAVE YOU (I swear, some of these guys sound like they are straight out of a Lifetime Movie) is setting off alarm bells for me (ladies, correct me if I’m wrong). He sounds like the type that says whatever he thinks you want to hear. How did the breakup happen? Is he the type that gets off on the chase and then bails? I’m a little biased, because I’ve been in a situation where I’ve cut a guy off and had him come back promising the world, but it was just a line to slither back in with. Take the whole relationship in context, with the actions, not the words being the focus. If you do this with a clear head and a no bs attitude, you’ll know everything you need to know.
Let me start by saying, my ex and I went on one date to begin. I decided I did not want to date him at that point- just didn’t see mutual interests, etc. I explicitly told him I would not date him, but we could maintain a friendship. He agreed, but then kept pursuing. At that point I said please leave me alone. He is a musician and went on tour and began to write me letters, since I refused to communicate with him. I would get letters from all over the country. Then he flew to my house from tour to tell me that he loved me. *Remember we had only been on one date.* Time went on and I eventually gave in. It was great for a while, then I became less and less of a priority. Music/studio/artists/work would always come first. I don’t pretend I had no responsibility for the demise of the relationship, but I was very distraught that this guy who had poured so much attention into the relationship, when I really wanted nothing to do with it, would now be so indifferent to me. I cried and told him I wouldn’t be around much longer. He said he didn’t want me to feel like I wasn’t a priority, but things never really changed. He maintained that I was “selfish” because after he had been playing shows or working all the time, I wouldn’t help him clean his house, and if I wanted to spend time with him, I should be able to help with those things. I don’t mind helping someone do their chores, but I would also like a little quality time with the guy who proclaims to love me. So the bitterness and frustration built up on both ends, and then there was the final dramatic fight. I didn’t hear from him for a while until he sent me a text from the road saying “he loved me but wasn’t sure what type of love it was”- I cut him off at that point, and now here we are 6 months later…me dumbfounded as I listen to him tell my counselor everything I wanted to hear a few months ago. I question- why now? Why after I say this is it does he come back? As a note, the one or two times he said this stuff (I want to marry you etc) before the very next day he would say he wanted to take it really slow and stay in the shallow end. Hence why after his long saga of a text upon my ending it, I never responded. What do you think?
Dazed and Confused, you are surely living up to your name. Drop this man as fast as you can and stop participating in the cat and mouse game. This man is a pisstaker and is effing with your head. He’s a grand gesture followed by farts of hot air. Mark my words, if you continue with this, he will back out again. All he’s doing is upping the ante because like the typical commitment resister, he feels that he associates feeling out of control with desiring you, hence the win back campaign starts. You clearly like to be pursued a lot – you are a Future Faking dipsticks dream because you are taken in with inappropriate grand gestures that aren’t really that grand. If you hadn’t actually found him attractive, you’d be calling him another name – stalker. Flush!
Just read your description of the relationship and Nat’s reply. NC all the way…the crucial decision Q. is how much more time are you are prepared to waste of your life?
Dazed
I am unimpressed. I feel more certain of my diagnosis now you’ve shared the details. Get rid.
I’ve noticed this a lot, it’s not just you. Woman poses a question, we think it’s a dodgy situation. Woman gives examples of the amazing things he’s done – but these only confirm he’s a clown.
For him to do all this on the basis of one date doesn’t prove that he’s madly in love with you, it just proves that he’s mad.
It’s all still just crumbs. It’s hard to see when you’re in the middle of it, which is why you must nuke them (not literally).
You did well to break up with him. Now see it through to the finish.
Thank you all for the words of wisdom- although I have known this all from the start, it is nice to feel supported. After he showed up at my counselor and spoke with her a bit, she told me she thinks he may be a narcissist or has narcissistic tendencies. That, in and of itself, scares me. The thing that just really gets under my skin is that EVERYONE (with the exception of my girlfriends who know about our relationship) thinks he is the sweetest, most charming, nicest, gentleman. It’s hard to think I’m not the crazy one, when these other people sing his praises for being such a great guy.
Now that I am laying it all out there, can I please just mention, when we first started dating his mother would call him at 2-3am. I thought it was weird at first but he convinced me that his family is just closer than mine, and my family was cold. Then I found out he had a teddy bear he would take with him on the road, he told me it reminded him of home. I told him to take that bear home and leave it there. He told me he did. One day I’m going through his luggage for a shirt and low and behold- there is the bear…He then told me he was just more sentimental than me, and that I was cold. I literally spent time on Google seeing if other men did this and if I was being “mean”. Over time I was convinced that I was cold, insensitive, and selfish.
The kicker comes during one of his reappearing acts, I told him I wasn’t playing these games of being in the “shallow end” after he proclaims to want to marry me the day before, he says he wants to go to dinner with his parents to discuss what we should do in our relationship. I baulk at that idea, refuse, and he replies “well why don’t you like my parents…”
Girls, this is a grown man with a house and a job…
Thoughts?
Dazed
Counsellor has redeemed herself (not that she needs my approval)
Teddy bear – minor issue. But I think giving someone a hard time over a soft toy possibly says more about you than him.
Mother? Bit much
But, really, how many more thoughts do you need? The flip-flapping is ENOUGH to call time on this “relationship”. The rest is just “stuff” which, no doubt you will want to work through, but it doesn’t change the topline information that you need to cut him off.
Dazed: I agree with Grace re the stuffed animal. I have a few too, and when my childhood memories get to vivid, I sometimes need them to smile at me and to cuddle them. If a guy told me to get rid of them, that would be a red flag to me.
I agree I might not be ready for a relationship, but getting rid of my toys wouldn’t change a thing. They are a symptom (and maybe part of the cure), but they definitely aren’t the problem. Maybe the teddy bear made you feel queasy because you sensed his issues that lay behind it, but I’m afraid whatever it was was out of your control.
As Grace has said, you have all the topline information already. I totally agree with her.
Dazed
I need to clarify that the teddy thing doesn’t mean you’re selfish or heartless, but it does indicate that you may have issues around control and florence-ing. Instead of seeing a guy as he is, you may be fixating on the potential. I’m revisiting this because I think you’re turning this around in your head trying to make it about you, and what you can do or be to make it better. I’d hate for you to be thinking “if I hadn’t mentioned the toy, we would still be together”. Yeah, I’ve been there myself with the fruitless “what ifs”.
Here’s the thing – many, many men and women are authentic and consistent from Day 1. You shouldn’t have to wait, cajole, take away their teddy bears, argue. fight, go to counselling, wait some more, sex them up, play NC games, wait some more just to get someone to do what they say they will do. When (healthy-minded) people say relationships take work, this isn’t what they mean. It’s work to get on with their family when they hate you, it’s work when you’re in financial dire straits because one of you lost your job, it’s work when your kids fall in with the wrong crowd. This is work you do TOGETHER. You shouldn’t be working to fix their flip-flapping, disappearing acts and indifference.
Sure, people change, absolutely, but for themselves and largely by themselves (with appropriate support, which doesn’t include exes). It’s taken me over 20 years to overcome my ambivalence around relationships, and it only started to fall into place when I was single with no confidence boosters lurking about. And I am STILL not quite there yet.
Don’t wait for him, think about yourself first.
Oh, and the ex who choked me until I blacked out was very much thought of as a “nice guy”. You know what you know. A million of his fans can’t take that away from you.
Wow, can see why you are Dazed and confused…!
Why did you break up with him in the first place, can I ask? Was it because he professed love and promised the world but the actual concrete actions didn’t happen…? The reason I ask is that I’ve been through what you are experiencing with my Ex(he recently got a bit nasty) and in the end it was down to him ‘having to be right’and maintaining some sort of good guy status despite pretty shady actions and never manning up to relationship progression.
Your guy seems extra, extra keen on the talking, even to the extent that he went to the counsellor with you but where is the action? A guy who wants you above all things doesn’t use texting to tell you that you are the’ Love of his Life’. He makes plans, he sees you, you agree joint action, you work through the issues.
One thing, if you want to take him back then do it. Stick to your decision and try and make it work but don’t flip flap either, because sorry but it sounds like there is a bit of that going on from both sides. I’ve done the dance of the EUM/W’s too and it is exhausting. You have to commit to be together and get on with it big time or you have to part. Good Luck.
Dazed
I think if he wins you over he’ll disappear again, counselling or no counselling
Some guys (and women) just love the chase, the fight, the wooing but can’t bear day-to-day intimacy. To be fair, though, they don’t know that there is such a thing as intimacy. They just think steady relationships must be boring.
You’ve known him 2.5 years, you’ve enough information to go on. I would add that people have met, got engaged, married and had their first child in that timeframe.
And what’s he actually done – sent some texts, ignored you, blown hot and cold and pulled a dramalama attention-seeking stunt with your counsellor (which is highly inappropriate). It’s really NOT a lot of effort. If you think that’s effort, cut him off and continue to see the counsellor and learn to place more value on yourself (though I wonder why she didn’t just kick him out).
Nah, childman comes to mind. I’d stick with the counsellor for yourself(if any good?), I’d pass on this guy. You do need to act on this tho’, you’re in danger of enabling if it continues?
Thank you all for the sound advice!
@grace- thank you for revisiting your statement because just as you suspected I was turning things around in my head thinking, “maybe I shouldn’t have mentioned the toy..”
@Ellyb “They are a symptom (and maybe part of the cure), but they definitely aren’t the problem. Maybe the teddy bear made you feel queasy because you sensed his issues that lay behind it, but I’m afraid whatever it was was out of your control. ” that is so true! I agree with you!
xo
Dazed I’m sorry but a grown man carrying a teddy bear around like a ‘blankie’, that is just not sexy!
I’ve heard of a man and his dog, but a man and his teddy? Brideshead Revisited? mmm… on its own it could be seen as a lucky charm/mascot/harmless wee thing that this guy just likes… but add in everything else about him and the teddy takes on a symbolic/greater significance – mummy’s boy?
You are so right, Grace, about the what ifs… and the shouldn’t be that kind of work. It’s like having to run a never ending marathon just trying to get to the starting line – every(healthy)one else is already there – that’s where they start from. With these guys (and with yourself) you never get to the ‘right, let’s now begin this relationship for real’ point. Neither of you are capable of meeting each other there. I am getting that part of all this now!
So I have an update for you all, and would love to hear your advice. Today I am driving in my RENTAL car, and I see my ex in his car on a major highway in my LARGE city. I figured since I wasn’t in my car, there is no way he would recognize me. Of course I was wrong, he pulls up beside me. I don’t even glance over, figuring he won’t recognize me. Nope, he calls me, then texts me saying “Did I just pass you?”. I don’t respond to either and then he sends me a text that says “Come on. For real. I’ve done nothing to you. Why won’t you even respond to my texts.” And I feel bad because I don’t ignore people- I am not a rude person, in fact I haven’t had a problem like this with any ex. Help! Thoughts?
I heard a song yesterday, and I think the band’s name was ‘gautier’?
Anyway, it was the guy lamenting how cruel and mean it was for his ex to have nothing to do with him and not want to accept the friend card!! Can ya believe?
Wow. I can relate. I just wasted almost 2 years with a man that used me to boost his ego and then moved on. Did I mention i fell head over heels in love with this assclown and I work with him. I had just ended a 26 year marriage when we met and he had just gotten divorced after 30 years. I am 48 and he is 56. He has now moved on to a cuter and younger woman. He treated me like an option and disappeared for months at a time. I never knew where I stood with him. I made every excuse in the book for him, but realize now that I was one of many women he used. I took him back more times than I can count. I did finally end it 4 months ago and just cut off contact. I am now dealing with the hurt and rejection, which is overwhelming. I have not contacted him personally in 4 months. We do work together but not everyday. I am so mad at myself for falling for this man and for allowing him to hurt me. Of course he still tries to flirt. He likes to test the waters and make sure he can have me back if the others don’t work out. My self esteem has taken a hit because of him and he took advantage of me when i was vulnerable. He is very calculated. Thank god for this site. It has gotten me through many nights when I would have otherwise called him. I’m trying to find a way to move on from this ass.
I can relate. I was vulnerable, separated from my husband of 20 years and befriended a younger guy. He was so willing to console me and told me how much he appreciated older women. I fell for this BS and starting confiding and we became close – although it was definitely my confiding in him and never the other way around. He chased me feverishly and would try to meet me whenever possible. Would always tell me how beautiful I am and how I could have so many guys. As soon as I started to get emotionally attached, he’d totally withdrawal. Wouldn’t answer emails or texts. It was strange to me. When I would ask him straight out, he’d actually get mad. So then I’d play it cool and it would be fine and then once I started wanting more – again he’d get mad and withdrawal. This was going on for 8 months. The last time we talked (again I started the where is this going talk) after a great night together he said I was just a hook up and that he doesn’t think about me. I’m an idiot. I was vulnerable and took the bait. Yes he is younger than I am (he is lower 30’s) but seriously, I was married 5 yrs at his age. He knew exactly what he was doing and used me. I’m sure I was a good ego boost for him. I’m in the NC phase for 1 month and it’s hard. I fell for him because he was so much fun, always on the go and we were very compatible in all areas. We’d always laugh and be affectionate to each other. He is moving up fast where he works. His charm convinces everyone he is this upstanding man. He’s just an immature child. I know this but I still feel so rejected, used and humiliated.
Just when you think you’re over the AC/EUM you do something stupid like look them up on Facebook…because you’re “over it”, right? Ladies, don’t do this to yourselves. I did this this morning only to find a picture of him with his newest victim. I definitely gave him the confidence he needed to move on; made him think he was such a nice guy by being friends with him. The last time we saw each other he took the opportunity to sleep with me knowing I still had feeling for him – a week later he sent me an email saying he started seeing someone and didn’t think we should hang out anymore because he had a hard time “setting boundaries with me.” I just never even bothered to respond to him – it was last June. But now I’m reeling in raw emotion and pain; of my own doing. So, when Natalie says NC is the best avenue, that means not looking them up FB too. Its really hard when you know that the person you need to forgive most is yourself. Oh how I wish I had a time machine.
Sounds familiar. Mine always ran when things got too close or as he put it, “there were expectations put on him.” So what did I do, I expected nothing and therefore i got nothing. Big mistake. Actually what I got was ignored and rejected until he needed an ego boost. I don’t think decency is expecting too much. My god, hes 56 years old not a kid. I’m trying to be strong but have those bad days that hurt like hell. I’ve done the facebook and internet search and what a mistake. It’s always hurtfu information. Don’t do it!
Marie…{{hug}}. Block him on Facebook and that way you can’t look him up without going through the trouble of unblocking him and hopefully you’ll come to your senses before that. I will NEVER look mine up again. Feeling much better now that I’m past it.
I am soooo with you here. After nine month of no contact, he contacts me on NY Eve… and guess what… I fell for it. I just spend 4 days with him… wonderful, glorious days… Then, only for him to shut me out this last weekend. He was with friends, cousins, etc… had a LIFE SHIFTING change…and guess what… I’ve not heard from him. I called him.. nothing…
Why did I put myself back in this hurt? Sigh… I need to re-read SO many of these. It helped me 9 months ago. I need to kick myself in the ass for believing things could be diff. He’s as selfish now as he was then…. And I am blaming myself for not being strong enough to resist him.
RML
I did the same thing and had to see all the pictures of him and his new girlfriend. It was a setback for me as well. Even though I know what an ass he is. It still hurt. Ladies trust me it only holds you back by looking at their Facebook.